Like all of you, I'm excited for Saturday's opener. It affords an opportunity to step away from this miserable football season. I'm just wondering how long that excitement will last. I mean, last year I was excited, too…for about an hour.
My gut says this year's team will be better.
– Calvin Haynes, Lathan Wallace, Omari Johnson = a better team.
We'll figure out once and for all if the past three years were a talent or coaching issue. Is Craig Robinson going to continue his undisciplined schoolyard style? Will he insist on zone defense? Will the current players be able to play zone more effectively? Most importantly, will there be any inside presence, both scoring and rebounding?
Craig Robinson is officially on the hot seat, which in the absurd world of OSU athletics, means he will probably be extended through 2030 before tip off.
The team should be decent. Moreland reminds me a bit of Omari Johnson but I see way more upside with Moreland. I like the look of Challe Barton even though he didn’t do much in the exhibition, he looks polished for a freshman and I think he will be a steady presence. I am beginning to wonder about Nelson, he seems to have a lot of mid-range skills but is never in a position to use them. I am not a fan of him constantly shooting pro 3’s. I think that coach Rob needs to find a way to get him involved in a way in which his skill set is utilized. I still wish we had a solid big man defender. Brandt shows some fight and will be improved but we could use more help on the blocks. Not sure if Gomis or Brown have it in them or what their health status is.
I think our defense is going to be solid from a coaching standpoint. The zones should be solid and playing a man base D with the ability to flash different looks should work well from a schematic stand point.
The thing I worry most about is the offense. It seems to be predicated on guys breaking down their defenders off the dribble. I think it can yield points when executed successfully but feel we have the talent to throw out other looks. I would like to see some pick and rolls with Burton or some pick and pops with Brandt. I think coach Rob has a thing against picks. Also I would like to see more off the ball movement.
Interesting comparison with Moreland and O. Johnson. I don’t get that at all. I would see Moreland as a skinny Mustafa Hoff type player. Agressive defensively, serviceable offense. Johnson always seemed like he wanted to play outside.
yeah the thing that reminds me of Omari is his long body that looks out of control. Of course I guess it doesn’t matter what it looks like if he is making shots and altering shot on the other end.
I can see that, awkward looking body for sure. Their game does seem different though, I’m excited about Moreland. I never was a huge Omari fan.
Pretty different. I was never huge on Omari either but remember a brief stretch last year where I thought he would be decent. I think Moreland’s upside is much greater. Also I am excited about Rhys Murphy… he looks a little lost out there but once he finds some rhythm he could be a contributor.
Won’t we know pretty quickly if anything has changed? They should get 9 wins minimum in the non-conference and you have to have those to get to the NIT or NCAA. Another 6 win non-con and I am done.
the non conference losses have been the biggest problem, and the biggest sign of the ineptitude leading oregon state basketball for a long time now. robinsons conference record doesent so much bother me, its the losses to teams like howard, sacramento state, texas a and m chorpus christi, utah valley, george washington, montana, seattle and such. i often wonder how different the perception of him would be if all but maybe one of those games were Ws, and all things being the same as far as in conference play. i feel like it would be much harder to deny that progress is being made. hopefully with better athletes less mediocre mid majors will sneak up and beat them. who is the first game against again?
Agreed, the non-con has been brutal. I can’t understand how no-name schools in no-name conferences recruit players who destroy a top 20 all-time win university that recently had a top 25 recruiting class. Just doesn’t make sense.
Except for Montana, it is a poor list of losses.
And thinking about the talent vs.coaching issue, I think the Beavs are picked 8th, so despite a top 25 recruiting class, the pundits aren’t that impressed by either at this point.
I don’t think our talent level is that of a top 25 team. One year getting ranked in the top 25 does not equal top 25 talent. When you take in 5 kids in a class it is tough to judge verse a team that got just 2 really good players. Talent wise the Beavers are a bubble tournament team.
Doesn’t matter how bad Robinson and the Beav’s are, BDC could care less about hoops. Look how he handled John and Wagoner. He had to have players and parents threaten him before he took action on the women’s program. When Robinson was hired no one else wanted the job due to his neglect. He let programs with strong histories hit below rock bottom. I don’t think BDC has the balls to fire his worst enemy.
I think we probably will suck at basketball too? When does Baseball start?
I think we probably will suck at basketball too! When does Baseball start?
I’m only going to want to observe 1 (ONE) thing, especially after non-conference games. I will despair if CR does that goofy substitution merry-go-round again. Sorry to say, my favorite game last year was when most of the team was benched and Roberto Nelson did just fine.
yeah that was frustrating. I mean it makes sense to bring in an energy guy like McShane for a few minutes here and there but with the guards and other offensive players you got to give them a long enough run to find some rhythm. Hopefully Rob is not as stubborn as he was last year.
I would say that was one of the more confusing things about the game on Friday. The substitution pattern was wierd. Hard to say if it was normal or part of the exhibition plan. The starters played quite a bit more than I would have expected – especially in the second half. I like McShane’s hustle as much as the next guy, but I was surprised that he was the sub that seemed to play the most.
love McShane’s hustle too but I can’t help but feel like it is a game of 4 on 5 when we have the ball and he is in there.
Call me crazy, but I think this team can win 20 games this year! The non conference schedule is very weak again. And due to the new Pac12 schedule, we only get the AZ schools and So. Cal Schools once this year. But we are playing Utah and Colorado twice. And neither of those two teams are very good. I think its possible for this team to go 10-2 in the non conferene and win 8-9 games in conference and a game or two in the Pac12 tourny.
Its all Robinson’s guys this year and the hold over JJ guys are gone. If everyone stays healthy, this could be a good team.
From the game Saturday(against inferior talent) we made a lot of good inside passes and hit players who were cutting. The offense looked much better than last year; less passing for 30 seconds, more cutting and attacking.
Three players stood out to me: Cunningham, Moreland, and Collier. Once we won the opening tip, Cunningham raced down the court with a defender standing between him and the basket. Unlike past years where Cunningham would have bulldozed the defender for an offensive charge, he attempted a pull up jumper. Despite the miss, it looked silky smooth, and adding a pull up j to his arsenal would be tremendously effective. Oh yeah, and he has the baseline 3 pointer on lock down.
About 2 weeks ago, I dropped by Gill to watch b-ball practice where CR ran an intrasquad scrimmage pitting Team Orange featuring Ahmad, Jared, Devon, Joe, and Angus, versus Team White consisting of Challe, C.J. Mitchell, Rhys, McShane, and Moreland (Nelson out with an ankle tweak). Moreland completely dominated the boards. He outhustled and outjumped Joe and Angus for every loose ball. Against Pacific, he shot 5-5, snatched 6 rebounds, blocked 1 shot, and altered countless others in only 22 minutes. I think Moreland is the Beav’s best interior defender, but definitely needs to add some muscle to his lanky frame.
Collier is the toughest and meanest player on the roster. Although he is our de facto small forward, I think he could provide the much needed inside presence we have been lacking in recent years. He is flat out intimidating on defense, and I don’t know how the box score indicates he only garnered 1 block as I counted at least 3 (including 2 in one possession). He showed impressive footwork and post moves in setting up his shots followed by thunderous dunks. I can see him getting consistently hammered as he battles down low and being sent to the free throw line repeatedly. So, free throw % improvement is a necessity, not only for him but also Angus and Joe.
i love collier, but damn is his free throw stroke ugly. no touch at all
I love it when someone can give us an eyes-on report.
My impression of the first game:
Pro:
– Defense looked much more intense, mostly man-to-man, zero 1-3-1 in that game.
– Cunningham is going to be a beast this year with all of that man-to-man D.
– Overall talent and chemistry looked good.
– New players (including last year injury guys) looked very serviceable.
Con:
– Roberto looks sketchy in man-to-man.
– Offense still does not move away from the ball very well, not much screening. The second half drought was very concerning, especially against such inferior opponents.
– Odd substitution pattern – hard to say if this game will be representative – different pattern than last year, but still odd.
Oh yeah, another big CON is free throw shooting for the entire team. Wow was that bad. That will lose us games this year if it doesn’t get better. I was watching CR for a reaction and he was getting more mad with each shot.
Cunningham and Roberto both make everything look easy, to the point where it looks like they aren’t doing a lot, when they really are.
To me, Roberto plays really smart, but conservative defense, whereas Jared plays very aggressive, more risky defense. So while I don’t think Roberto will have a ton of steals this year, he won’t get torched much, either.
I think the offensive system in general doesn’t utilize players on the weak side very much. No backdoor cuts or anything.
The subs, I hope, were just because of who we were playing. We played something like 13 players. I’d imagine we’ll be down to 10 by the start of the actual season.
It’s going to be a good year. All reports have this team acting like one on and off the court, working hard, saying all the right things, and going 100% while being much more efficient in practices.
Don’t knock Berto too much. He relies on the mid-range game to loosen up the defense. But he was only about a week removed from a high ankle sprain, which limited his mobility. We’ll likely see a different man on the court on Saturday.
Another thing to note is that Coach Rob only ran the vanilla offensive sets in this game. The goal is to get the base offense set in order to add the wrinkles… which should be held in reserve for when they’re needed. The high/low passing was nice, and I was really impressed with the footwork from our bigs. They were moving with a purpose instead of being hesitant. And that purpose didn’t include them being out of control. Collier already knew how to hit the gaps in the zone since his favorite spot is that short corner. but it was awesome to see Burton and Brandt finding the holes without fighting their way to the spot. That’s the kind of movement we sorely lacked over the last two years.
They lost focus toward the end of the first half when they switched to zone. And I think that’s why they came out flat in the second half. It’s hard to come back from a break knowing there’s really nothing more to do for the win. So the actual youth of the team contributed as well. But they picked it up again, so we know those spells are diminished with the possibility of disappearing.
And holy cow is Eric Moreland a big nasty. There’s no Omari comparison in that game. If I were to compare him to anyone, it would be Perry Jones III… with a nasty streak on D. That kid is made of wires… really long wires.
Cunningham will probably go for 20+ ppg this year. And several others will plug in double digits as well.
The best stat of that game was easily the 20 assists on 24 buckets. Play like that, and you have a team that’s hard to beat. Add all the speed and the major hops on the floor, and not even teams who could outrun us in the past get that luxury anymore.
And Coach Rob was all over the right things in the postgame. The beginning of the second half, the FT shooting and the TO’s were front and center as his disappointments. You can bet those issues have been addressed.
I’m looking forward to this year be the year before our 1st NCAA tournament run in decades. This team is set up for success next year since we only lose 1 senior (mcshane) and as long as cunningham doesn’t get to confident and enter the draft. Potential this year is for an NIT invite though.
Agreed. The formula for an NIT bid would be nine or ten wins in non-con, and nine or ten wins in league.
Barring a Pac 12 Tourney win, we’ll likely need 23+ wins for the selection committee to take a look at us. That formula would be a definite 10 non-con wins plus winning league games at home and winning league games we should win on the road.
Don’t forget, we have the requisite bubble team special interest story with the Obama’s brother in law coaching the team. They could hammer that story line to death in the NCAA tourney hoop-la. Would be interesting to see how early in the brackets the pres would have CR making it.
Actually, the selection committee might lean that way for publicity, but I think they would not like the press from politico wonks and the perceived favoritism a selection like that would bring. So while they may quietly decide it would benefit the Tourney with us in it, the better justification would be the one they have used before. They like to give the benefit to bubble teams who have not been to the Tourney in a while. They’ll still look at RPI and SOS and who the team beat where and when. But all things being equal, they tend to look more favorably at the rising team rather than the team who has made it a number of times but put themselves on the bubble.
Do they dare mix in politics in an election year – especially as divisive as 2012? I could see it mid-term, perhaps.
I can’t envision Craig Robinson coaching well enough to get this team into an NIT. Doesn’t mean it won’t happen, but I just can’t see it happening in my mind’s eye.
I see us pulling out our hair. That’s about it.
Wish I caught that exhibition game so I could see if/where there’s improvement. I’ve stood up for CR up until this point, mainly because he is a good recruiter, but also because he inherited beaten down dogs. But, I’m ready to turn on him if he continues with the nonsensical substitutions patterns and mismatched defensive schemes. I see some of you guys are questioning his substitutions already. Not a good sign at all.
Most of coaching is gameplan and player development, not minute changes or substitutions. Regarding those, it’s hard to judge Craig, other than looking at the development of his own guys. Jared is a stud, Burton is looking good, Starks looks good. His players seem to develop pretty well.
And now that he has no more bad seniors, hopefully his rotations and substitutions tighten up. If so, I think we’ll be calling him a good coach by the end of the year.
Yeah… it’s hard to have poor substitution patterns when the next guy off the bench actually has skills.
I agree to a point. I think the key to subs this year is riding the hot hands and not killing good momentum.
Angry,
Would you fire CR if he can’t get this team over .500? I really hope that doesn’t happen, I am getting tired of talking about shitty coaching and losing teams.
Even Pomeroy has us most likely above .500 for the season. Of course, that’s without any games for reference, and the assumption that we run the same zone-heavy D format. The man D will be the real difference once play begins.
OT: Riley is officially #5 now on the hottest seat list. These are the worst of the worst.
http://www.coacheshotseat.com/CoachesHotSeatRanking.htm
Relevance?
Relevance is the only interesting post in the thread. Who the f are you to
gotmilk, why are you crying? It’s a simple question. There are a couple threads which this poster has correctly spammed, and there’s this one.
per ESPN today: (Fran Fraschilla)
Last season, more than a few teams experienced that dreaded tailspin as their records failed to meet their expectations. But it’s a fresh start now, and with the talent these six squads will put on the court, I believe these teams are primed for big turnarounds in 2011-12.
Oregon State Beavers
Like Crean at Indiana, Beavers’ coach Craig Robinson now has a roster full of players who he recruited and who now know his system. It should lead to a major step up the Pac-12 ladder in 2011-12.
Jared Cunningham, a 6-4 junior, has made a living on the defensive end, running through passing lanes en route to explosive dunks. He averaged 14 points a season ago. Roberto Nelson, a 6-3 sophomore, started to shake off two years of rust at the end of last season. And 6-7 Joe Burton may have the body of a rhino but has the passing touch of a point guard.
Franschilla is the first to note the talent upgrade. I’ve read some really silly analyses from the Pac 12 rival blogs, and almost to a tee they drone about the same crap about how losing Haynes and the other seniors will just kill the team.
A couple of them actually question whether or not “incoming freshman” Eric Moreland will make any impact… ever… since they had never heard of him before this year.
?
It’s like some of these blog writers only read one or two other blogs then change some of the words around to make it look like they’re doing their own thing, which obviously isn’t a thoughtful analysis.
Take a look at this crap:
http://www.montlakemadness.com/201011-pac-10-previews/oregon-state-beavers/
It’s as if the yutz had never watched the Beavs over the past couple years. He can’t even get the starting lineup correct.
My favorite line re Haynes:
“His speed and experience will be missed by OSU.”
If ever there was a time I would type ROTFLMAO, this would be it. I just have to wonder if all the “experts” out there are thinking the same half-thoughts and just mailing it in with made up shit like this guy did.
Haha, that really is a good one.
“Gomis should be a more impacting player”???? Does he mean Gomis is going to get constipated? This guy is quite the Huskie homer as everything seems to relate to his hometown boys.
Haha. I saw Gomis in an all-star game last year, and he is a HORRIBLE offensive player. He was okay on D, but mostly played tentative. This guy is a work in progress.
He is a project, but the one game I saw him play had him matched up against the youngest Plumlee brother. And he held his own in that game. It’s nice to be watching a team who doesn’t have to rely on a frosh to save the talent level. We can actually sit projects and work them in over the course of a full season to get them a little experience.
Barton, on the other hand, looks like he’s ready to roll at this level. He’s smooth and intelligent. He’s not going to try to do more than he can while he gets his time. He also benefits from being here before. He gets to manage the game and defer to the older talent until he becomes the older talent himself.
None of our older players had this luxury when they came to town, but that’s how Coach Rob tried to play it over the last couple years. Now they seem more hungry for wins than I can recall in an OSU team in a long time.
any word on if Gomis is coming back this year or redshirting?
Yeah, notice what he says about Collier, who was one point and one rebound away from a double/double in our beat down of UW at home last year.
Ok, I went to my first home game this year. The outcome was to be expected, but the false sense of hope in the first half made the loss a bit more difficult to deal with.
As a side note, something REALLY pissed me off at the game. A bunch of us went over to the alumni center to have some beers at halftime. Inside, there was a middle-aged woman wearing FULL Duck gear head-to-toe. Now, I can understand this when some douchebag 20 year old guy shows up at a Beaver game like this, but a 40 something woman struting like a peacock almost sent me over the edge (my patience has worn thin the past two years). And, to compound the issue, you have three of her Beaver friends with her. I can’t get my head Beaver fans that would allow themselves to be seen with someone like this. Now, if she had a subtle Duck hat on only, I’d get that. But the blantant disrespect and audacity was too much. FTd!
I have never understood why Duck fans will roll around in their full jumpsuits at other sporting events, it is moronic. My favorite is when I see fans at NFL games or Blazer games in their full Duck gear, it doesn’t even make sense.
duck fan are full on douchebags and they want everyone to know it.
OT – sortof. OSU women’s soccer team to host first round of 2011 NCAA tournament!
To get to the Sweet 16, they have to avenge two of their five losses on the year, Portland won in Portland in OT, 2-1. And Florida State won at OSU 1-0 to begin the season.
Wow, the Pilots made it at 9-9-1, Oregonian just ran an article a couple of days ago babbling about how this would be the first tourney miss since 1999. History and strength of schedule must go a long ways with the committee.
The deciding factor was likely a travel decision. It’s like baseball sometimes where regional matches try to limit travel. And many conferences suffered from being top-heavy this year. so there weren’t many middling teams on the board when the selection committee got to bubble teams. And UP started poorly only to finish strong. They won 4 of 6 to end the season, and they had signature wins over Florida State and OSU early.
And consider that they aren’t even in the bottom quartile for seeding. SOS has a lot more to do with these selections than people think.
If the O would have given them the same selection analysis I imagine they give for hoops or baseball, they would have seen this scenario coming as at least a possibility. But I might be giving them more credit than they deserve.
Funny… just read the story lamenting UP missing the Tourney:
http://www.oregonlive.com/pilots/index.ssf/2011/11/pilots_women_finish_disappoint.html
The last comment says it all.
You see the Eagles game?
Need to throw a Hail Mary, throw a 5 yard incompletion to end the game instead. Where did Langsdorf come from????
I for one would like to see the Princeton offense ran correctly this year. I’ve seen other teams run it and see similar sets, but leave thinking “this is how it is suppose to be run”. I still have this feeling the the coach doesn’t push them hard enough in practice and the result is at game time they end up doing whatever. Of course some of the culprits behind that like Calvin Haynes are gone. But I still see some half assed efforts running cuts early in the possesion and then they revert to garbage ball.
Or scrap the princeton if everyone is just going to play zone, but have some kind of idenity that the players can buy into and believe in.
OT… Joe Pa is done.
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/09/sports/ncaafootball/penn-state-said-to-be-planning-paternos-exit.html?_r=2&src=tp
Now we just need the Joe Pa of the West to be done. Yet another mistake by Riley to say he wanted to be just like Paterno. Riley sucks because he has no confidence. It rubs off on the players and saps their natural ability.
Was it Riley or BDC who made the Paterno comment? I was trying to find it out of curiousity with what is going on currently, but struck out. If Riley said it…the poor SOB can’t get anything right!
I’m going to throw up in my mouth if Paterno is coaching on Saturday, but then again is it really coaching if you don’t actually know that you are coaching? Maybe in honor of Joe Pa, MR can go upstairs and mumble to himself at the Cal game and let Langs and Banks see what they can do.
They both said it. It was Riley’s idea and BDC’s colossal mistake. It will be the downfall of them both.
“Mike’s said he wants to be the Joe Paterno of Oregon State,” DeCarolis said. “So we’ll put something together to make (his contract) a lifetime deal.”
Thanks for finding that…….I could come up with a few sarcastic comments regarding Riley/Paterno comparisons, but let’s just leave it that Mike probably would like to have that comment back!
OT… watching the Nikegon/UW game on Saturday was confusing. I could have sworn that was Wazzu against Navy out there.
http://photos.oregonlive.com/4450/gallery/ducks_win_over_huskies_34-17_photos/index.html
At least now we know why Nike played the uni prank on Wazzu and made them go all ugly.
Here’s hoping Penn State LIKES MR and goes after him.
And PLEASE don’t bring reality into my dream state.
Happy Early Signing Week. Hopefully our 3 verbal commits sent their paperwork early
Morris-Walker and Ostling are in. Reid is expected on Friday, I think.
can we sign another? seems to me we don’t have a spot open.
I seemed to remember Eric Moreland signed a financial aid agreement instead of a LOI, so does that mean we actually have 3 spots?
No a FAA would still count as a scholarship once the player is enrolled in school. The FAA is the same as the LOI except for the fact that it is not binding to the player. As I understand the NCAA rules Jarmel cannot sign an LOI until there is a spot available. Perhaps Coach Rob laid this out there for him and told him if no one left he could grey shirt. Maybe Rob is planning on kicking someone off the team (doubtful)…. I don’t know but I am pretty sure we can’t sign another player to a LOI or FAA until a spot opens up.
thanks for the explanation about LOI and FAA. There were whispers Jared might decide to go pro. But I just read the OSU release on Langston Morris-Walker
“He will have the pressure of being behind Jared, but he will hopefully have the opportunity to play an entire year with him and get some of that work in practice against Jared,” Robinson added. “So that’s going to help him out a lot.”
… so who knows
Yeah Jared might go pro… then again he might not get drafted if he declares depending on how well he does this year. With the impending lockout a lot of highly talented kids decided to come back to school so next years class is deep. Unless Jared has a stellar year he might not have much of a shot in the draft until 2013.
Big fan of Morris-Walker. Tremendously athletic with a soft touch from the perimeter. Plays aggressive and with passion. I envision him getting major PT as a true Freshman. Check it: http://youtu.be/xW4lWdnPUR0
Kids a baller. Soooo underrated it’s ridiculous.
yeah both the kids seem underrated. Ostling looks pretty skilled for his size and age.
6’7″ 225 lbs Jarmal Reid just signed his NLI. His HS won back-2-back state champs the past two years in Georgia. Fav quote from CR: “He’s a winner. He won in his AAU, he won in his high school and that mentality is sort of the same mentality as Devon Collier and Ahmad Starks who have also won a lot.”
Columbia has won four of the last six AAA championships in Georgia. They’re one of the three HS hoops powers in the state. Millers Grove and Milton play each other tonight. They’re all in different classifications, but they play each other for bragging rights.
I’ve seen Columbia rated in the top 10 in one national prep ranking, top 20 in another, and something like 27th in a third. Reid is the star of the team, but he has some nice players with him. His PG is pretty smooth… and young.
I’m watching Arizona for the 3rd time already this season and they do not look nearly like their #16 ranking would indicate. Tonight they’re going into halftime vs Duquense on ESPN at home and they trail by 2. And this with Duquense shooting a horrible 25% from the floor.
I can see Oregon State playing with Arizona this year. After watching the Pacific exhibition last Friday, iliked the sense of urgency I was seeing from our team. They play the game like they actually have a gameplan and they play hard. Really looking forward to Saturday’s game.
The Zonies are really inexperienced. They’ll get better as the season progresses. But we played with them last year, so playing with them this year should be a given.