So Draft Kings has Trump winning (i.e. their gamblers picking him) in 49 of 50 States. Only one they’re not doing that is…Colorado! Biden with something up on his site saying internal data shows him down in MI, FL, and AZ.
Liberals are going to go nuts tomorrow when the night closes with Trump in the lead (it will just due to in-person votes). And if Biden wins, they are going to go nuts when Trump uses his rigged court to win it. It truly feels like a “heads I win, tails you lose” moment. Evil genius for the win. The long-term consequences of this are going to be insane.
My base case is Trump closes tomorrow with a lead, Biden picks up steam over the next few days and maybe takes the lead, and then Trump wins it in the courts.
Do you know if this means a greater number of betters pick Trump, or a greater amount of money played lands on Trump? Would be curious to see how those numbers compare.
Like if you had 1000 people putting $10 each on Trump and 500 people putting $100 each on Biden, the overall map would look red if they’re counting bettors, but money played might be a better indicator. Seems like a marketing stunt for Draft Kings and it’s working.
Oh, nevermind. It’s a free to play draft pool. No money to wager, no risk.
I don’t know this means anything other than more Trump leaning users flooded draft kings contest. Like an unscientific poll.
Trump landslide is coming, Dems will shout “don’t believe the tally” until they can try to catch up with ballot harvesting in selected precincts.
Electoral college landslide and popular vote 55% or better will erase all Dem arguments.
Prepare for 4 more years of Trump.
Brace for the leftist/marxist riots, hopefully Trump invokes the Insurrection Act to stop it.
Draining the Swamp isn’t pretty or easily done, but Trump is up to the task.
I say this as someone who 100% believes the Federal government is too big: Draining the Swamp is a populist pipe dream. The government is too big to drain the swamp without causing serious dysfunction. Government is basically a sector of the economy.
Imagine any given industry–tech, auto, O&G–saying “we’re going to remove all our most experienced people and start fresh with outsiders.” It would be a train wreck.
‘Electoral college landslide and popular vote 55% or better will erase all Dem arguments.’ As of November 5, mid-day, Biden + 3 million in the popular vote. I repeat: Tell me again why the electoral college is a good thing?
Lot of prediction streaks about to be broken tomorrow or in the next week. I can’t say how many articles I’ve seen about a person or region or model having picked the election winner since 1952 or whenever. Basically they are split.
I think that poll you found above, something is off. I’ve been watching the gambling lines and they seem to favor Biden about 2x over.
I currently see the odds at
-185 Biden (takes 185$ to win $100)
+155 trump ($100 bet wins you $155)
Remember, if Trump loses, he can run again in 2024.
Democrats made a huge mistake going with Harris as VP, for this reason. I highly doubt Biden will last four years in office. They should have gone with Gabbard. Had they done that, the Democrats would not lose another general election.
Go look at demographics and political affiliation. It’s more likely the democrats split up into a socialist and moderate party than the GpP gets a president in the next 20 years.
Or it might more liklely be his son. Don can still tweet while he wets his pants and sharts, his son can play to the Trump fanbase with more energy and a younger model/wife.
You’re dead on RE Dems playing a four year schedule. Rs have played the long game and cultivated a Supreme Court and built on decades of manufacturing doubt so that even the most ridiculous hyperbole dominates mindshare.
Pretty sure the democrats are at a true shift point if they want to stay one party. Their biggest voting blocks are millennials and Zoomers. Capitalism in its current iteration doesn’t work for shit for those generations. In millennials the US has created a highly educated, extremely disenfranchised and overwhelming disadvantaged generation. Millennials are 20% of the population and hold less than 5% of the wealth.
Millennials priorities are overwhelmingly environment, civil rights, equity (people having equal services and opportunities). The current system has utterly failed millennials and then blamed them for it because we are eating avocado toast. The DNC needs to significantly shift to millennial and Zoomers policy concerns in the next 8 years or there is going to be a socialist party.
You guys are way too bullish on trump. He needs to get 5-10 million more vote than 2016. He’s lost about 2 million to deaths and he’s completely lost the center and parts of the GoP. Where are these votes coming from to make up for the loses and close the demographic changes? Every indication of voter turnout shows a drastic uptick, that isn’t due to trump voters.
Nuc, I grew up in Trump country (east) and he was going bankrupt every few years. Concluded he’s not very good at business. But he is good at manipulation and presenting an image. He’s also good at speaking in a way that makes you believe him as he’s lying. These things are evil genius. Pretending he’s not will do nothing to negate the reality that he is.
On a side note, my buddy in Georgia who has been swearing he’d vote Biden for a year now told me last night he held his nose and voted Trump. When I asked why, he said he didn’t want to send any more $ to the Federal Govt. So, he’s afraid of tax increases…at least it’s somewhat valid. Though I tried to point out the inflation tax under Trump is the highest since the 70s.
As far as I can tell he’s good at attracting self serving sycophants, ignoring norms/laws and lying. Sure people believe him but never a majority, for most he’s a bludgeon to get things they want and they just hope the damage isn’t to bad. Children scream and cry and it works to get what they want when they wear down parents. I just feel like labeling him a genius is wrong. He’s just a petulant child with a billion dollar stick. Manipulation is easy when you can offer the world even if he never delivers. When I consider evil genuis In current times I think of people like McConnel, Putin or even Hillary.
Trump’s image of a successful, wealthy man is complete bullshit. If he’s successful and wealthy, why is he never happy? Why can’t he even handle a white house press room when so many other presidents have?
I think what Trump implicitly sales is “The rules and law don’t have to apply to you. They don’t apply to me. We’ll get the courts, my sycophants will benefit.” He says the laws don’t apply to him (“i could shoot someone in the street, and nothing would happen to me,”) and when a 17-year old who shoots a few people in the head says “he was defending himself.” He doesn’t pay taxes, treats women like shit, hell, what’s not to like? Are you telling me we can all do that? “Proud boys, stand by!” Its funny when he campaigns on law and order, because he disdains law and cultivates disorder. And that’s what’s coming to America if/when he wins.
Mostly poor, white, under-educated people, are going to keep a man in power who cares NOTHING for them, aided by a very few very wealthy people. The poor people are getting played. This has happened throughout history.
Voting the R line because “taxes will otherwise increase” is short sighted, when socialist spending, massive deficits, national civility and democracy are the trade-offs.
The Rs played the long game (supreme court, sell your soul now for decades of power), the Dems play the short game – identity politics and Biden for four years as the anti-trump….The Rs love identity politics: “Fight amongst yourselves over your identity(ies), discourage your selves from voting, lack a vision for your party. Great!”
A young country will hopefully grow up and grow through this, but i doubt it. Its likely we’ve peaked and are on the down slope of democracy.
It strikes me that liking Trump for “winning” is like liking a win-at-all-costs sports program, who even though they cheat with recruiting violations and alumni cash call themselves winners and champions. Trump would be a Duck…
This is what Dems do. They try to rationalize and intellectualize it. As if they’re going to convince or illuminate the hypocrisy. YoungOrSt did this for months, and it was painful to watch. Trump is a cult, but if I know one thing about cults, it’s that they end of their own accord not by telling the people in the cult they’re in a cult. I mean if it were that easy there wouldn’t be cults…
Trump doesn’t even align with his voters (many don’t like him, “hold their nose and vote”, are poor and he hates the poor, are old and he wants to end SS, etc)…but they still put more weight on the fear of the other guy, and at that point the cult can get in deeper and exploit that. It’s a lot like malware.
Trump’s image of a successful, wealthy man is complete bullshit. If he’s successful and wealthy, why is he never happy?
Sort of. He’s gone bankrupt a ton, but he has money. Nobody knows how much. He’s not happy because money doesn’t = happy. His dad was a stern, miserable person and he got no love. His mom was even worse. That’s why he’s miserable (and why he has narcissism, which is a fake reality to create love).
Was my first thought when the same day I read Biden is predicted as heavily favored in Wisconsin, the GOP campaign in Wisconsin suddenly announces $2.3m disappeared from theor campaign finance funds because of “hackers”. I think the story is “hackers” got in and changed the names and accounts on invoices which caused the funds to get routed where they didn’t belong.
Hmmm….
I’ve made the observation that anything they accuse Dems of they’re doing. Trump started this, and now they all do it. If you see Trump accusing someone of X, he’s doing X.
whatever happened to YoungOrst? His ad hominem attacks on other posters were getting Jack-esque when I checked out from the site over summer. was he banned or re-brand under some other moniker?
A proxy candidate with early-onset dementia and a raging delusional narcissist, both in the mid to late 70’s. 300 million fucking people and this is the best two people we can put forth? I’m not sure what that says about our country, but I’m thinking it’s not good!
I’m actually not very political, I don’t really feel my life it that affected by who is in the White House. I may have to deal with plus or minus a few tax dollars depending on the Dem or Republican, but otherwise, I just keep plugging away at life. Be nice when the pandemic is over though.
Right? That’s exactly what I’ve said. Since the 60s its been dominated by a few families; Kennedys, Bushes, Clintons, next up Trumps.
I do think more than a few tax dollars are at stake. The Senate doesn’t work any more, just waits for executive orders. Democracy and American civilty are on the line. People who are talking “civil war” I think actually want it. Terrible.
For years people have said “They’re coming to take our guns.” And I’ve thought: “Explain to me how this works: A bill passes the house AND senate. Gets signed by a president. Law enforcement: federal? State? County? You tell me. Come and take our guns. Really? HOW LIKELY IS THAT?” But they’ll take our votes and those same people don’t seem to care so much.
I own several guns, and don’t fear they’ll be taken away. I do fear a supreme court will take our vote away. Ha! Gotcha! You weren’t watching!
For the lawyers here (where’s Jack?), how does a judge in WA order MI what to do? Is this because he’s a Federal judge and it’s a Federal agency, or is some of the MI mail routed through WA? I’m not getting how he has authority in this matter.
Was just looking at the early voting statistics. Just under 100 million votes were cast before election day this year. The total for 2016 was 136 million. That’s wild.
My arguement is that his base is too small to matter after this election. It will only continue to get smaller. People who build up themselves on identity politics following a false prophet usually are not great about loyalty when winning stops.
Not really worth arguing about it. We will have 8 weeks of watching it.
Man, I think you’re missing what’s going on with the Right. Read ZeroHedge sometime. Millions of young people love the current “alt-Right” and fascism.
You’re wrongly assuming his base is just old white people.
The Trump Trains and all that stuff are made up of younger people, not retirees. The most recent estimate I saw said Trump will win 25-30% of African Americans.
Another portion of his base was created over the years by the condescending attitude of Democrats. That’s not going to change under a Biden/Harris administration and will continue to fuel opposition.
I never said old people. My arguement is that young people are 60% democrats/socialist. The 18-35 demographic that runs that way will make up the majority of all voters in 2024. The world is changing. Even 30 million people under 35 on zerohedge or whatever is a drop in the bucket of you are talking election margins. The condescending attitude of the democrats that people associate with SJW and identity politics is what young people support. The norms for the last century are gone.
The 18-35 demographic that runs that way will make up the majority of all voters in 2024. The world is changing.
Young people are always socialist/democrat. It’s when they starting working, earn money, etc that they flip. This is a tale as old as time. The better question is how many of those 18-35s will flip once they earning a living. A bad economy also tends to make people lean socialist, and we’ve had a bad, debt-fueled economy for 12 years. If we actually invest in infrastructure and the future and get the economy rolling, people will change quickly (e.g. all the “occupy wall st” people gave up and got jobs).
No it’s a myth as old as time. Millennials are all working. In majority we can’t afford a house or have kids without serious financial risk. We have shit healthcare and more debt than wealth. What does a conservative platform have to offer us? Nothing. I’m a millennial and I’m 31 and I have been working since I was 5. I’m lucky and to be a home owner and to have 3 kids. Most of my friends do not and I run in crowds with multiple degrees and good jobs. If you really think we are changing you need to realize how old this generation really is and how shitty we have it.
You mention infrastructure but that isn’t even a conservative policy. They haven’t done shit for infrastructure, their priority was milking the goat to death. The economy has been on a record growth path for a decade, our lot is still shit. Your assumptions about past generations do not apply to this one. We are more like the people who grew up in the depression and voted for socialist platforms into the 60s than boomers or genx.
Well I never said any of that. You’re talking about Gen Z with the 18-23 year olds, and my point is those people will change if the economy is better and/or they gain wealth. You then overlap it with the 24-35 year olds, which are millennials. So these are two different generations. Gen Z is way less jaded, and could easily flip stances with (a) age and (b) a flip in the economic situation. Political ideology isn’t determined at those ages. It’s cemented way later in life.
I never said infrastructure is a conservative policy, either. I said if we actually use the debt we’re accumulating on something productive, like infrastructure (instead of financial assets), the economy would boom, and people who want socialism would likely change as they accumulate wealth. Once you have wealth, the focus becomes on protecting it, which is why they shift to (R) policies. When you have no wealth, you lean (D), because stealing some other guy’s wealth is very attractive.
Again, a tale as old as time. There’s nothing different about this generation other than they haven’t yet experienced a decent economy. I think with renewable energy and technology they could, if we invested in the right areas. So the idea these people are cemented as (D) is completely wrong.
That would require significant policy redo by the GOP. Zoomera are the most inclusive generation in history. Their number one concern isn’t the economy or getting rich, it’s having a planet to live on where you can still breathe.
If Trump loses the (R) will have to shift. Though, the alt-right is growing. Weird situation. Likely ends in some type of violence in the streets (weird how Charlottesville and running the Biden bus off the road are all (R) policies, yet Trump accuses Dems of being an angry mob). This fits my thesis above that anything Trump accuses others of is what he’s doing.
Overall satisfaction with the country was at a 15-year high before COVID. If you look at the categories, “Very Satisfied” and “Very Dissatisfied” were at an all-time high and 13-year low, respectively, as of this January. I’d be curious to hear why you think that’s the case if it wasn’t due to economic factors.
Also, unemployment is negatively correlated with age, so the younger you are, the more likely you are to be unemployed. So Millennials are not “all working.” I think you’re encountering sample size issues.
I’m also 31 and within my social sphere, there’s a strong correlation between socioeconomic status and political leanings. The people that are better off are more likely to be liberal because they’re comfortable enough to prioritize progressive issues and they’ve never experienced losing a chunk of their income to tax increases (quite the opposite, actually). The ones who make less are moderate or lean conservative because they see the Left as having nothing to offer from an economic standpoint and that’s what they’re most concerned about.
I would look hard at the methodology Gallup used. They tend to go with phone surveys which suck at capturing young people opinions. I don’t have time to but a satisfaction by age and socioeconomic would be more telling of the picture. Through my arthritis group I know about 1500 millenials from all over the socioeconomic breakdown, I only know of one in the group that is conservative at all and he is more just moderate/fiscal than ideological. That said the group is highly stilted since we all get first hand experience with the healthcare system.
Wealth gap is due to the FED. Refuse to let assets like homes, stocks, etc drop.
I read a lot of the Reddit finance/millenial pages…they’re definitely jaded. Rightfully so they came of age into the 2008 crisis and the FED disallowing them an opportunity to save banks.
No argument with the wealth gap. I will note that your Pew link shows Millennials as the group with the highest number identifying as Independents. I agree strongly with this from my own observation.
When that’s the case, it makes individual candidates and issues that much more important and it makes it harder to lump the whole generation into one group.
The calming factor here: God will always be there with unconditional love. A lot of this is out of our hands, out of our control. Have a good rest of the week everyone.
I think Biden wins. I think the silent Trump supporter argument in 2016 was BS. IMO what happened was the undecideds swung hard to Trump in 2016 combined with the pollsters failing to factor in college education. Clinton still won every state she polled over 50% in. If Biden wins every state he is polling over 50% in he takes the election. Of course it is possible some new polling errors that wasn’t accounted for exists but I think that is highly unlikely.
I think Trump leads on election night and declares victory. As mail in votes come in, Biden wins. Then I think Trump refuses to leave and later steals it in the courts. What’s funny is if this is not decided by inauguration day Pelosi becomes president.
Yeah but those are mostly mail-in votes in States that count them early (e.g. PA doesn’t start counting mail ins until 7pm tonight). Once (R)s get to the polls later today that will change.
That’s not true. The majority were dropped directly in boxes or early in person votes. 22 states allow processing of votes but only a few actually count early. Off the top of my head Arizona is only one I can think of.
Isn’t it in their constitution that all citizens must take pride in voter suppression? I was born in Atlanta and I’m pretty sure the Georgia baby handbook has a section on it.
Who here actually votes on election day in person.
I’ve actually never had to do it because we can vote early and drop our ballots off in oregon. I’m curious what the experience is like. The time it takes, the environment. I don’t understand why people do it if they have the option to vote early? Understanding not everybody has that option, of course.
I’ve done it in the past. It didn’t take too long…maybe 20 minutes. I’m not sure why I did it…I was young so maybe I didn’t know about the other options, or maybe I wanted the certainty of handing someone the ballot and seeing it go in the bin.
Went with my folks to the church down the street when I was a kid. Never have had the option to vote in person. I love Oregon’s system, it is so easy and you never hear about fraud.
I’ve always voted in person because I like the experience of taking part in the process out in the community. It’s one of the few political things you can still do with other people. It’s a good reminder not to hate on people that disagree with you because they’re still people.
If you go at the right time of day, it usually only takes 20 minutes or so. The mood has always been very neutral and respectful where I’ve voted, but I’m sure that depends on location.
Who is to say it would be a breach? They may have the option to call in debt in the contract. Generally when no one else wants to loan someone money the bank can set themselves pretty favorable terms.
Probably on topic, Wisconsin canceled their game vs Purdue this weekend. That’s now two games canceled and on the brink of not being able to compete for a BIG10 title even ranked in the top 10. Wonder how this will affect the voting today in Wisconsin.
Man, this guy just sounds either exhausted, defeated, or both. He doesn’t sound well at all. Clip from Trump interview this AM on Fox and Friends. Almost sounds like the drunk guy at the bar, slurring his speech, but he doesn’t drink so I don’t think that’s it. Also doesn’t sound like a guy who wants to make good on his claim of declaring an early victory. Almost humbled?
Lots of clips in this thread. (The source is a very left leaning account that cherry picks media clips, so take it for what it’s worth)
I really do not like Trump but I hate the direction of the democrats even more. 2016 was less about a vote for Trump and more about civil unrest over our defaulting political system. With that said Trump not being part of the good ol boy club has made it really rough for him in office. My biggest worry though is what is happening behind the scenes. Our Federal law enforcement is corrupt. So now there is no checks and balance. Go check documentaries: “The Plot Against the President” – https://www.amazon.com/gp/video/detail/B08LMJ93LL/ref=atv_dp_share_cu_r and “The Swamp” – https://www.amazon.com/gp/video/detail/B08F3V3KPC/ref=atv_dp_share_cu_r . And then the last documentary I suggest is HBO’s “The Perfect Weapon” – https://www.hbo.com/documentaries/the-perfect-weapon and you will see we are all ponds in a game played by those in power.
This election is a no win for any United States citizen.
there were some very good guys back in that day; RFK, or, my favorite, Frank Church, both guys, by the way who never put a dime’s worth of credit into what the FBI and CIA had to say, unlike the modern party.
Looks like MI should go blue. They’re saying Detroit is out in droves, and four years ago they didn’t get out at all (Trump barely won). 18,000 people registered in Detroit today alone.
I am happy that VA is flipping. Looking at the Newport News/Hampton/Norfolk region (a traditional Democrat stronghold), it’s lean Democrat, which is traditionally a Democrat stronghold. I am happy that these working class people are starting to wake up and realize that the Democrats are gutting the region.
I’ve tried that and its still not working for me. Its the texture and flavor. Its like it can’t decide what it wants to be. Fries? Ok eat with burgers. Baked w/ brown sugar and marshmallow cream on them? Ok that’s dessert. And the same basic flavor is there in both.
That’s what’s great about them. They’re versatile.
Fries with some kind of sauce with a bit of kick (like chipotle mayo)
Baked with butter, salt, and cinnamon (optional pecans)
Baked and topped with pulled pork and BBQ sauce
Frank Luntz talked about it. and other pollsters said how hard it is to get people to answer surveys. They said it was about a 2% response rate which means it’s hard to get a good representative sample of likely voters. Especially at the state levels.
From what I saw they under sampled and also didn’t categorize people into categories like “actually a registered voter”…many of the polls are sub 800 people, and you need about 15,000 to get a statistically significant sample. But they take 800 then extrapolate. Really poor methodology.
Yeah, some pundits just said Trump tripled his margin of victory in Florida over 2016. WTF? Wasn’t it a Biden lean just a couple of days ago?
The polling industry may need to go away forever.
I was surveyed by Pew Research earlier this summer. It was a mail survey, necessarily, since I don’t answer the phone. Just to give you an idea of the dynamic, I caught up with the mailman who delivered it to see if everyone in the neighborhood got that mailer, or just me. My point: I was immediately suspicious that if everyone got one it was some kind was a scam of some sort. Even then, I thought long and hard before filling it out.
As anyone heard of this Trafalgar polling group? Supposedly their methods are somewhat of a mystery, but they predicted the first Trump victory and they are adamant he is going to win tonight. I guess one of their theories is that Trump voters won’t admit to pollsters that they are voting for him and Trafalgar ask the right questions to account for this? In 2016 they got the electoral count exactly right (though a couple of states were off). Hard to know what they are doing if they won’t show their methodology.
Not saying it looks good for Biden, but also don’t think the maps are accurate. Like all around Cleveland is only 74% counted. Toledo 55% counted. Dayton 81%. So Ohio looks bad, but the high density areas have a ton of votes left. Same issues in MI and WI.
Some huge metro areas still not counted. This might be the “red mirage”? Not sure. But this will definitely get closer. AZ a big flip if official (the math in the AZ rural counties looks bad for Trump – not much meat on the bones given what he’s down, so I get why Fox called it).
Might come down to PA as everyone thought. If that happens, I think Biden gets PA.
One pundit is saying PA won’t matter if Trump wins IA, Mich, Wisc, Georgia, and NC, which he is apparently leading in all. I don’t know the math off the top of my head, but supposedly that gets him over 270. Vegas books have Trump 60-40. The day started with Biden 65-35.
That’s probably true, but all of those States have huge urban centers not yet counted. IA I think is Trump. Georgia likely Trump. The rest are going to get closer before decided, I think.
Just looking at some basic math, Biden has lost PA. About 40% left to count in metro areas, but those population centers are about 1.8 million people total. That comes to about 700k, and Trump has a 700k lead. Just not seeing it.
I’m more pissed about CO raising property tax. Might have to move.
Also, with respect to PA, Trump is doing very well in Bucks and Chester. He is also closing the gap in Allegheny, which is big because that county has 1.2 million. If he can get to 45% in Allegheny, and maintain margins in Philly suburbs, I think he’ll get PA.
Looking like a Biden victory with remaining votes being mail-ins, but it will be very close. Trump’s remaining hope is to do better than expected on absentee ballots in PA or MI+WI.
Yeah, what do you handicap it at… I’m thinking Biden +150 right now. Wonder if that banker that put down the 5 mil on Trump hedged? Could have bought similar odds on Biden last night.
If Biden does win, Trump is going to try to steal it in the courts. (Remember, he accused people of stealing the election, which means that’s what he plans to do. Anything Trump accuses others is what’s on his evil genius mind).
My mom wrote me upset this morning…convinced we just got socialism, and said everyone who lived through socialism voted Trump. I was like, didn’t everyone who lived through Fascism vote Biden? Plus if (R) get the Senate there’s no chance of socialism. It’s sad we’re voting for these two extremes and these two incompetent people. Everyone loses in all scenarios.
I’d like to move out of the U.S., if anyone has some good ideas where to start looking. Looking for low taxes and great music.
Italy is pretty debt riddled aren’t they? Yeah interesting how Venezuelans and Cubans vote right and Central Americans vote left. Also interesting how the Republicans have carved out special exceptions for Cubans and really catered to them. Solid political maneuvering. I think Trump did well to sell the election as a referendum on Socialism even though he himself is one.
Italy is debt ridden, yes.
I remember looking into those $1 homes at one point, and I think they had huge property tax associated and other conditions like you have to fix them up (many needed like 200k of work). Just from memory but I think it’s something like that that’s the issue.
Why would the Senate approve stimulus in that scenario?
Georgia is going to have a run off vote for Senate, so that has to be factored in, too, especially if Collins loses main. Senate will be on the line.
This is all uber bearish for the next two months.
I mean if Trump is president Republicans will fall in line. If Biden is president maybe stimulus becomes trickier but I think they could probably still pick off a R or two in the Senate with a classic piece of DC pork. Spending money will never go out of fashion. Plus the only real difference from where the negotiations left off was like 200 billion for state and local government, right?
Not especially. I mean it is so tough to know because by all metrics stuff is crazy overvalued but there is a lot of risk in holding cash because of the potential for future inflation.
Wait so as I see it Biden gets 270 if he wins Nevada, Michigan and Wisconsin which are all leaning that way. Seems like the +150 might have been an underestimation
That’s correct. Pennsyvania/NC/GA would be moot if those 3 states hold through their remaining counting.
Mich amd Wisconsin are about 95% complete and Nevada has a ways to go. Arizona is taking forever to get their final push counted too.
Hard to believe how this race may come down to those small congressional districts in Maine/Nebraska.
Yeah if the totals right now hold, Biden wins at 270 and likely +3-4M in popular vote. Georgia looks to be extremely close. Similar situation to WI, MI and PA. Large vote totals still coming in from the big metro areas. ATL going big for Biden.
I think Maine is split 3 Biden/1 Trump, which is causing the 270 scenario to come up. But i could be wrong. Still a ways to go with these late counts and then of course the ensuing court challenges.
Worst case scenario for the country was not having a landslide for either candidate. Now we get to be rolled through the muck for days/weeks.
Wish the media and candidates were a calming presence.
He needs Maine and AZ, too. Best path. He can loose PA and everything else with that scenario. Looks likely given the remaining votes are mail in/metro areas.
For AZ, I think only ABC hasn’t called it yet. ABC has been extra cautious calling races. But Fox called AZ super early and got a lot of heat from the Trump campaign.
Stocks are up because it’s looking more clearly like a Biden victory rather than the “contested election” scenario. Vote counts aren’t going to take as long as some feared, and no one is taking Trump seriously about contesting the election.
I have to say, as a moderate I like where things are headed. If Biden wins, we can have some peace, quite, and diplomacy at the top, and then I’d hope the Republicans hold the senate to keep Biden in check. Could be good. If somehow Trump pulls it out, need the Senate to go blue to keep him in check.
I hope the Senate approves judicial nominations assuming they are apolitical types with solid backgrounds. Holding seats open for judges that are consistently rated on the far right of the spectrum is bad for all Americans… well maybe not attorneys.
I think people get caught up in their bubble. They see the signs in their hood and the enthusiasm on the sites they visit. Creates confirmation bias. Haven’t heard from my (R) friend who said red wave, yet. That guy has become absolutely nuts lately on FB, but I made a “no delete friends over politics” policy. Maybe I can justify deleting him because he’s now nuts…
It’s better than Twitter as a gauge of what’s going on out there. At least when I see people on FB saying political stuff, they’re people I know and I’m reminded that they’re still people and deserve respect, even if political stuff makes them a little nuts.
Twitter is just bots and ridiculous people hiding behind anonymity.
Anyone watch Trump’s speech last night claiming the election is a fraud, he has already won, and states need to stop counting votes? So predictable. I’m not a huge fan of Biden, but Trump is causing serious damage to this country’s democratic process. It’s going to take a long time to heal, but it will heal a lot faster without Trump. I fear if he wins, his ego will become so yuuge it’s going to suck the life out of this country like a black hole.
Yeah these were the real problems. It’s unfortunate because if he were sane and not carrying the ego issues he could have been decent. It’s a chicken and egg thing, though, because if he weren’t this way he might not have appealed to that base.
I feel exactly the same as you about Biden. Last night when I saw him take the lead in WI and MI I actually got nervous…lol. Like, “Do I really want this guy???”, and then I remembered the Senate will keep him in check.
Nuc, I’m curious what you think of what’s going on. You said Trump’s base got smaller. I replied with, “I think you’re missing what’s going on with the Right. Read ZeroHedge sometime. Millions of young people love the current “alt-Right” and fascism.”
It appears his base got much larger. Looks like he gained 4 million (and counting) more votes.
Sorry missed this one. Stress has done a number on my health the last 24 hours. Honest answer is I have no clue. I would love to see demographic breakdowns on this race cause it makes no sense based on polling of any kind. Even the most conservative sources like Trafalgar group don’t come up with data that explains this. It looks like the popular vote difference is 3.5 million or so which is only 500k more than Hilliary. If you told me the amount of votes went up 12 million I would expect something like an 8 million popular vote lead for Biden.
Exit polling is showing big rises in Latino, Asian and Indian voting for Trump and it hints to socialism scare tactics mostly. Data is wrong, I was wrong, I am confused.
So I think I spoke too soon about not having much to worry about regarding contested votes. WI is just about done counting and will definitely have a recount. MI and PA could be heading there, as well. Those were the three most pivotal states.
Recounts are always messy because the fact is, our voting process always has issues, they just don’t matter unless the results are close.
The funny thing is, a candidate, he represented exactly what he did as a coach: an unexciting, safe choice. The R’s didn’t need anyone dynamic to beat Jones, just someone that wasn’t Roy Moore-levels of crazy.
AZ is definitely not a done deal. Not sure why several sites called it so early. Still at 86% counted.
Trump would need about 58+% of the remaining votes to get back to a tie or take the lead. I have no idea what areas are remaining to be counted, but if they’re rural it will trend that direction.
Curious why they were able to make so much progress counting yesterday, and then today it seems to be sticking at about 86%?
I think they’re stuck because the rest are mail in/absentee ballots, though I’m not sure. Also overseas and veteran ballots can come in through next week.
AZ has a lot of blue areas left with an average of low 80%s in, and the red areas left are not as populated. Likely why it was called.
Sounds like Trumps team is more confident in their numbers than the polling reports for AZ. Trump is going to be such a sore loser (I voted for him so I can say that). No matter who ends up being named president, this is going to be controversial for a long, long time. Good thing PAC12 football will be back! (Heard Wilner on the radio this morning picking the trees over the quacks).
Narcissism…plus Republicans are more “disagreeable” people on all psychological scales. It’s why I think Trump wins in the courts. Dems will be derp derp derp and try to intellectualize it.
Move Oregon Border measure passes in Union and Jefferson counties. That would be something if that happened. Two counties that don’t physically border Idaho are now part of Idaho. States within other states!
Looks like AP has called Wisconsin for Biden now, but it’s likely to land in recount territory when all is said and done, which could lead into November.
GA I’m calculating that Trump needs to maintain about 42% of the remaining votes to stay tied or better.
AZ he would need a much higher percentage, around 58%
Michigan has about 96% counted with Biden leading by about 0.86% and growing.
In PA, Trump will need about 43% of the remaining vote to maintain a tie or better.
Trends are favoring Biden at this point, but we’re talking about potential recounts in AZ, MI, WI, GA, PA. (I dont know the recount rules for each state)
GA will likely not go to a recount because it has to be within .5% Trump has a pretty strong margin there.
PA has to be within .5%, which looks possible based on where things currently sit and which votes have yet to be counted. Voters can also petition for a recount if they have evidence of fraud to support the request.
WI has to be within 1%, so a recount is likely. The recount in 2016 only changed ~100 votes.
If counting stopped at this moment, Biden would be at 270 and win. So Trump’s only path to winning the electoral vote would be to keep counting and hope for a reversal in trends and/or pursue recounts wherever possible and hope for some court battles to rule in his favor. The whole “stop counting” argument hurts him at this point. And it isn’t within state laws anyway.
Didn’t he try the stop counting argument last night when he was winning Michigan and Wisconsin? I’m sure he wants them to keep counting though in AZ and NV.
His whole rant last night was desperate and contradictory. He said the election is a fraud, but he already won. So he’s saying he won a fraudulent election, with millions of votes yet to be counted, but he wants the counting to stop even though he was behind at that point. Huh?
I can’t say I blame him for attempting to pursue every possible avenue he can. Margins are pretty small and there’s alot at stake.
Math isn’t on his side, but the courts are the wildcard
I agree to an extent, but how is it strategic to try to win an election by claiming it’s fraudulent? It would call into question the entire system including votes for himself. Unless of course he’s claiming that only votes for Biden are fraudulent.
It’s a weak argument. Biden should file some counter-suits claiming similar things against Republicans so the courts have to consider both. Dems are never cut throat enough, though, to do something like this.
Apparently he wants to stop counts until they have access to see the count process then the count would continue … He’s says by law that is required… I don’t know if any of that is true, if it is, he has a point… on the other hand, I don’t feel comfortable with them “watching” seems odd… I don’t trust any part of this election for any side
I thought I read these facilities are already under surveilance by campaign officials as well as video surveilance. Does he want to personally see the counting efforts?
I guess Jeffrey Epstein’s prison cell was under surveilance too, and we all know how that worked out for him, sortof.
I guess they are letting them observe from 25ft away and no closer… Which with a paper ballot would be hard to monitor from that distance… who knows, this was a s#!% show from the beginning… I don’t really care who wins at this point… so much money spent on two people who are rich and make decisions that they don’t have to live by
Stopping “counts” is very different than stopping “recounts.” I thought when Gore wanted a FLA recount, it was stopped because he only wanted certain areas re-counted where he thought D ballots might be lost/misplaced, etc. rather than re-counting the whole state. Stopping a recount of that nature is appropriate in my view. But stopping vote counts?!? That’s not democratic.
“… but how is it strategic to try to win an election by claiming it’s fraudulent?” Spot on and Classic Trump.
Democrats lost big time in this election cycle. They spent close to $200 million to flip the McConnell, Graham and Tillis Senate seats. They lost the first two seats by a combined 35%. The Senate is very likely to stay in GOP control, and the GOP gained seats in the House. This does not bode well for the policy proposals the Biden campaign has been pushing for. Even worst, it is now apparent that the DNC represents the interests of the academic elite and Wall Street.
The DNC will have a very tough showing in 2022 because donors will be reluctant to give to ActBlue.
Tough to disagree but without Trump in power can the GOP get the non-Republican Trump cultists to show up? Trump by all evidence has helped the GOP a ton down ballot… possible at the expense of future races.
Trump will just run in 2024. Likely after he starts a Trump [fake] news network that riles up people even more. He is charismatic and manipulative enough to have success with this route. The big question is if people will fall for it harder or wake up to his game in those four years. My guess is the former and he’d be tough in ’24.
The GOP can learn from their brief marriage to Trump. They don’t have to stray too far from the Trump policy playbook, and can probably win in 2024 with the same message, different spokesman. Unless you think the QAnon/Proud Boys group are really a substantial voting bloc…
I don’t think they are super substantial but I feel like core Republicans are gonna vote no matter what and Trump was so successful based on turning out people that wouldn’t usually vote. I don’t claim to know how the next 4 years will go though.
Conservative democrats and non-Trump republicans can’t stand Nancy Pelosi (especially) and Charles Schumer – they represent the ‘coastal ellites.’ The repubs favorite tactic in Montana is pasting Schumer/Pelosi labels on all democrat candidates. In this election cycle, two splendid candidates were tainted first thing with being Pelosi/Schumer puppets (nothing could have been more untrue). They lost.
To Chuck the mouth:
“I guess they are letting them observe from 25ft away and no closer.” Not as bad as DT saying observers had to stay outside and peer through the windows. However, if the news report on this is true – the court-ordered rule for observers went to 6 feet away, down from 8 feet. I forget which state.
I have watched more of CNN than I want to and have concluded that its female journalists are big-time consumers of false eyelashes.
And now they’re calling it. So Nevada is the biggest question mark with most remaining counting happening in Clark County which leans heavily towards Biden
The polling is insane. Beav in OH has touch on it but there are states that are 8-20% off any poll. Ohio was one of the most polled states in October and the most red poll was +4% and the final is +8% Trump? Collins hasn’t been better than +2% since September and she wins by +9%? Ernst wins by +8% despite polls having her +/- 2 for months. Is it just an impossible trump factor? The 2018 polls were pretty solid. If you had told me turnout is 141 million the data says trump loses in a landslide and senate goes 52-48 blue.
Why bother making polls If your error bars are 10%. You do that on a research paper and you never get funding again.
Yeah be interesting to see how much is the Trump effect and how much is just the sampling methodology. I think there will always be a need and desire for polls but people will just take them with a larger grain of salt going forward.
Polls will be used for confirmation bias. That’s it.
Two big issues with the polls. Getting a good sample and weighting it accurately. If one or the other is off, the poll will be off a good margin. The Trump campaign did a good job in throwing off the weighting by getting new and non regular voters to turn out disproportionately. The sample issue is more of a societal thing vs a Trump thing. People are harder to contact, people don’t have the attention span to do a poll and are a little more private with their opinions.
The polls seemed to be pretty good up until Trump came along. There has to be something to a Trump factor, but these guys are getting senate races wrong left and right.
It’s what I tried explaining above….read a site like Zerohedge and you see rabid young people. For whatever reason they’re not showing up in the polls. A lot of Mexicans like Trump, too…especially ones who came legally. They HATE illegals, even if they’re also Mexicans. I don’t think things like that are factored into polls. Many polls are using a sample size of sub 1k, and you need about 15k sample to get a statistically meaningful sample.
The polls in 2016 genuinely missed at being able to effectuate a reconstruction of public opinion. But for 2020 the polls served a different function; they weren’t intended to reflect public opinion but shape it.
And in two years he will be stepping down for health reasons! I find it fascinating that everyone is ignoring his cognitive decline. These aren’t just Uncle Joe “gaffes”. I think I’m fairly qualified to make the observation having been an Alzheimer’s caregiver for eight years. Is everyone going to act surprised when that announcement comes and Harris takes over? Or does anybody care? I get that Trump is exhausting and needs to go, but this feels sort of conspiratorial too.
Maybe they can drag it out the four full years? It’s just weird, there have to be doctors who are seeing this, but it seems to be a taboo subject. Reagan had it too and sort of beat the clock, but if a steeper decline had hit a couple of years earlier I wonder what would have happened? Much different times.
My guess is that he won’t be part of any high-level discussions in the near future. When his access to the press starts declining then the speculation will start. If he has Alzhemeier’s the chaos of press conferences will be overwhelming for him and it will show in his speech and mannerisms. It’s already popped up on occasion with his odd responses and behavior to off the cuff type questions during the campaign.
You honestly think you’re the only one who seed this? The Dems haven’t pulled the wool over the eyes of 72 million people. Of course they see the same thing you see, but that shows you how desperate this country is. We would rather have a senile old man as President than a narcissistic fascist.
Is narcissism a mental health condition? If so Trump seems to be the poster boy. Biden, unfortunately, is likely in the beginning stages of a disease that will take his life. I think dementia mortality clocks in at around 250k per year in the US.
This is a stupid take. Almost every Trump supporter I know voted for him because they know Biden is a warmonger, and Trump’s tax plans resulted in larger refunds from the IRS. About half of these supporters I know are OSU students right now.
If that’s racist and xenophobic, America is more screwed than any of us can comprehend. We’re finished as a country.
Wow, hadn’t checked in on the GA race in awhile. Now it’s a closer race percentage wise than NV. Margin is only 23k(0.5%) with about 5% of the vote count remaining. With that rate of gain, Biden could potentially take the lead and even get past the margin for a recount in that state, especially if the majority of remaining count comes from Cobb and Dekalb counties and are mail in ballots.
If this is happening then stopping the counting is not a bad idea. Surely not a “fascist” move as someone here has stated. This should and will be going to the courts to get cleaned up, as it should be. If Biden wins fairly, so be it. But if this is true, and it does look like a coordinated effort, then clean it up and lets count all the ballots that are truely cast by citizens. https://amgreatness.com/2020/11/04/game-on-for-the-coup/
Markets have declared Biden the winner. Green energy going crazy. Don’t think there is any chance of a carbon tax in the next 2 years though but I suppose there is stuff the executive branch can do to boost the sector somewhat.
I think it is the future personally and am big on it. My only real concern is energy is not typically a real big growth sector. These green energy companies are kind of half tech half traditional energy though so we’ll see.
I think the ones that do the best will be the ones that integrate home services and solar (Install solar, electrical, HVAC in one package) and the commercial companies that also work on grid stability initiatives.
Trump’s spiritual advisor claims “angelic reinforcement” has been dispatched from Africa and South America to insure Trump wins.
Is “The Wall“ high enough to keep the South American ones out? Are those from Africa not aware of “Birthers,” many of whom are likely armed? Perhaps policy exceptions are warranted in short term.
This further enforces the “bad take” from David Pakman above, regarding the Right relying on mythical and mystical thinking. I mostly see that on alt-right sites, but it does trickle into the acting, mainstream (R)s.
Correct, but AZ and NV both are up in the air still. Without those he needs GA.
This is still not a lock as everyone is making it out to be. The assumption is the metro votes will go Biden’s way, but who knows.
Exactly how I view it. I don’t trust AZ being called so early. Fox/NPR/AP all called it over 24 hours ago, but since that time the margin has been shrinking towards T’s direction. There’s a reason other sites didnt feel comfortable calling it early.
Biden needs some combination of:
PA
or
Any 2 of AZ/NV/GA.
Outside of that, I dont think he has a path.
I’m not considering NC being in play, but I guess technically it is.
NV just announced their counting will take days to complete. We should get a better picture in NV tomorrow morning at 10:00.
If trump Somehow wins getting to 270, it seems like since he is the current president he can more easily wade through and fend off the recounts and legal events. Maybe I’m off on that.
I think it will be harder for Biden since he doesn’t get all of that power until January.
I don’t follow politics closely in the US let alone internationally. Are the most messed up country in terms of elections or is it worst or about the same in another more developed countries?
Which candidate do people think Jo Jorgenson pulled votes from? Seeing how she grabbed a little over 1% of the total vote in GA. Without her, this race would be over unless you think she pulled voted from both candidates 50/50
Which is hilarious because this was the weakest Lib campaign effort in years. Johnson at least had some experience and name recognition and they pushed really hard on the 5% debate threshold as a target in 2016.
This year? Almost no national attention and a ridiculous no-name ticket. In a year where the major party options were Trump and Biden.
Neither party wanted third party options so it makes sense. Most years third party is going to be pushed by one party or the other and they will get mysterious funding to that effect.
Biden is going to win. Trump was such a shitty president that he lost to Biden. Fucking Biden. Dude is barely alive and struggles to talk. One term Trump loses to Biden! He couldn’t get out of his own way in last few weeks and it cost him. I was on fence until 2 days to election despite really despising a lot of what Trump stands for because Biden is crap. Ultimately voted for Biden but voted R on rest of the ballot. Trump has only himself to blame but will never own up to it. I hope he goes to jail soon and pray Biden doesn’t fuck up too bad.
Biden should be in jail for simply standing there as Obama intentionally blew up 16 year old American citizen Abdulrahman al-Awlaki with a drone strike in October 2010.
That comparison makes no sense. US soldiers coordinate with rebels in Syria to take out Russian forces. We have been doing that since the end of WW2, particularly in Kosovo. They do the same thing. That’s the nature of war.
Second, you’re completely ignoring the fact that a 16 year old innocent American was killed for absolutely no reason at the orders of the Obama Administration. There was nothing suggesting that Abdulrahman had any ties to his father’s organization. The fact that the government can deliberately kill an innocent child without due process is sickening.
Those percentages are expected vote via AP not actual ballot counts. Its almost impossible in georgia to source how many votes are left unless the secretary of state bothers. When the gap was 14.5k there was 47k votes left. Biden would need 77% of the remaining votes so the margin will probably end up Trump by 3-5k votes
Gap is now around 9.5k, but no clue what count remains. Crazy close. They already are looking at 2 separate senate runoff elections in GA. Such a perfectly divided state
This is a great time to be a conspiracy theorist. Money to be made out there.
Seen people confused about vote totals updating and that magically Biden takes the lead.
Sharpie-gate in Arizona.
Liberals saw Trump was going to win so they got in hundreds of thousand ballots to offset.
It’s not just domestic either. I have a bunch of Aussie relatives. They’re totally into that stuff and are following the US election really closely. They care about US politics more than Aussie. It’s bizarre
Another interesting Tidbit. If Georgia candidate doesn’t get 50% of the vote they go to runoff. Right now its 49.9-47.7 and the trend line is away from Perdue. It looks like Georgia will stay the eye of the storm as they will be having a double run off vote which could determine owernship of the Senate.
Do you approve of large scale and organized voter fraud in multiple states by Democrats and democrat city precincts in order to defeat Trump?
Is anyone ok with illegal votes being counted as part of this election? Why is Trump the bad guy when he was warning about this large scale fraud all summer as one state after another changed their voting rules to make fraud easier?
I would be happy to disapprove if someone could describe the “large scale fraud” or “illegal votes” as they apply to this election and provide proof. I mean, we have members of OECD from around the world who are watching our vote counting and vouch that there has been no fraudulent activity. I guess they could be part of the conspiracy also. So that essentially means everyone in the world except for Trump supporters are in on it. That’s next level shit, like better than Blacklist.
Both parties likely cheat I mean this was in the watergate depositions. It’s a tale old as time. I find it hilarious the implication the republicans ran a clean race.
Never mind, just keep reading NY Times and watching CNN for your democratic propaganda.
Don’t give me the Foxnews response because Fox was part of this charade and led the optics that Trump was never leading even though he was in the process of large margin victories in many swing states.
Never mind, I guess having more ballots than registered voters isn’t fraud. NC and multiple areas in WI
No reason to be concerned about 23,500 ballots all for Biden in one block of votes.
No concern for dead people voting in every major city.
Project Veritas has undercover video of a democrat operative explaining how they harvest ballots in MN and pay people for their votes. Dems filed 200 lawsuits throughout the summer to affect voting rules to shift advantages, through judges.
Are fraudulent polls voter suppression?
Are all ballots legitimate or only those who are registered?
State legislatures are in charge of state election laws but the PA supreme court changed the laws in late summer, preparing for the very fraud that is happening.
I think you guys are as guilty of confirmation bias as you accuse others of doing. Trump has had the entire media, political establishment, and Republican leadership arrayed against him for 4 years and now that the fix is in, you say he is a whiner? Trump is a street fighter and has no quit, he will continue to fight relentlessly. I know you guys are all pretty much in the same camp on this and just like to dismiss obvious concerns that truly threaten our entire system.
Just saying “..everybody does it” doesn’t. make cheating ok. If you are consistent, you would simply agree that legal votes should be counted and all invalid votes rejected. Don’t sidestep and claim Trump has been cheating without any proof. Democrats have been maneuvering for 4 years to attempt this. Do you know why observers are being kicked out of heavy democrat precincts in most of the battleground cities? To cover up the honest counting?
Dismissing any objection as internet conspiracy theories is cute but doesn’t actually speak to the real concern. Answer the original question. Do you approve of widespread organized voter fraud efforts? Is it ok to you for illegal votes to be counted?
Why is Biden ready to proclaim himself the victor when you say that is what Trump will do?
Beat part of your whole response is this. I’m not a internet troll person, rarely respond to anything I see but this is funny.
Don’t sidestep and claim Trump has been cheating without any proof. Democrats have been maneuvering for 4 years to attempt this. (Where’s your proof?).
Without evidence you are just chasing conspiracy to get the result you want. Here I’ll play.
How did texas end up with 15% fewer votes than expected despite record levels of registration and enthusiasm? People near the poll stations have reported vans full of shredded ballots being taken to nearby buildings with smoking chimneys and smoke stacks.
How did iowa come out 14% different than polling? Reports of militia calling people and intimidating them not to vote. Is it coincidence that a state fully controlled by the GoP and polled to be a close race was a blow out? I think not!
Then there’s ohio! A state that polled as high as 14% Biden and never more than 4% Trump went 9% trump? The counties that didn’t meet turnout expectations are ALL democrat and over 20 republican counties were over expectation. Sounds like ballot stuffing in the podunk shit fields and dumpsters full of biden votes in Cinicinatti and Cleveland! Why wasn’t there a mail in ballot surge in ohio but there was in all its neighbors? GOP controlled state corrupt to the core.
See it’s easy to make shit up that sounds convincing. I don’t believe any of that shit cause there is no evidence. The truth is not your emotions or something you saw other people say. Best of luck on your journey back to reality, I truly hope you find rationality and peace.
So my parents are registered Republicans and they both got two ballots. This is literally the only hard proof I’ve ever seen of two. They sent me the photos. What’s amazing is they took this as proof the Democrats are rigging the election.
What’s great is blockchain is about to solve this issue, probably by next election.
Electronic voting through block chain may be the reasonable response to clear this election up in about a month. Who would howl the loudest at a true clean election with voter ID as the fundamental basis? It seems to em quite consistent that the dems would object vociferously because they are the side pushing for mail-in, motor voter, no signatures, no post-marks, no deadlines, early voting, earlier voting.
I think the further away from election day, ID matched registered voter, the more fraud can happen easily.And I’m pretty certain that dems don’t mind the opportunities afforded them to cheat.
We are seeing a breakdown of societal structure because integrity is no longer an American value.
I think I’m seeing it live in your posts. You don’t have a clue what democrats want. Democrats have been pushing for a system like Oregon’s for years. It offers no barriers for citizens who can get an ID, can fill out a ballot and sign the same way twice. What’s wrong with that?
Vote early and vote often I guess?
There are democrats embracing leftist/marxist ideology and there are democrats who don’t know they have been taken over by marxists. Which democrats are you speaking about? I know what the leftist democrats want because AOC has been screeching it for a few years and Pelosi is directing the ship that way: soft marxism and one party rule
Joe Biden is an empty suit and Harris is the most progressive member of the Senate, more left than Sanders. Biden agreed to a Sanders platform and Harris will be the one implementing it.
Whatever dude, when Republicans stop gerrymandering, suppressing votes, voter intimidation, moving voting booths at the last minute, running buses off the road, and the worst (Jeb Bush handing his brother the election), you can start to act like it’s the party of saints. As they stand, you’re/they’re mystical hypocrites who can’t see your shit stinks. Sorry. One could make a good argument, going back to Watergate, that Dems had to play dirty to combat Republican tactics. Dems play dirty now, and it’s from what I’ve seen a reaction function. I’m assuming it’s at the point where both sides’ cheating evens out. I’m not naive enough to think one side isn’t cheating. Both cheat.
Again, blockchain in 2024 will show how the country really feels about all issues.
Just watched your Paula White video. I had seen this mashup earlier today but didn’t have the context of where it came from. She actually keeps a beat decently.
Also, did you ever watch that Wild, Wild, Country doc about Rajneeshpuram? It’s pretty fascinating and there are quite a few similarities. Setting is 1980’s north/central Oregon. Several UofO alum played key roles in that saga.
Some more votes in. It looks like Biden is going to win PA, GA, AZ, and NV. Blowout. Good. I don’t like Harris, but Biden seems meh/fine/peace and quite for a few years. Seemed Presidential when speaking, which was super refreshing. Could help us from being an embarrassment. Personally would like to see the parties splitting their extreme left and right factions to form a more moderate center + blockchain voting. Let the lunatics cannibalize one another as the center/reasonable people decide policy.
The problem is that I don’t see Biden lasting too long and you said years. As I’ve said before, the nation is voting for Kamala Harris whether they understand it or not. It’s not like every family in the nation are dementia caregivers, so there seems to be a casual attitude about Joe. Those who have experienced it understand what we are seeing. It’s good days and bad days with Alzheimer’s and maybe Presidents get some kick-ass drugs we don’t know about! Look if Biden as a figurehead can calm down the nation that’s great, but I’m not on board with Harris. Probably doesn’t matter as we are most likely getting gridlock again anyway.
I find it interesting that the major networks are working hard to maintain a charade that there is no fraud anywhere, yet you say Trump has been cheating all along too, since both parties do this every election…
When did I deny anything? Both sides cheat and have for a long time. As I said, for me both sides cheat, and since both sides have smart people cheating, I assume the cheating evens out and you get the will of the people in the end. No manual system is going to be perfect or cheat proof. Except…
As I said earlier, for me the “purity” is in blockchain. You can’t have fraud with a blockchain voting system.
I can only speak for myself, but I fully accepted the election. Hillary sucked.
The whole Russia Russia Russia thing wasn’t to say he isn’t a legit president. Russia used social media to push the independents his way…. does that mean he didn’t win, no. Is it healthy to have foreign governments help shift the future of our “free” country. No. It happened, but it doesn’t mean you can take it back. You learn and move forward. He has been for 4 years.
I accepted the last election also. The outcome did not surprise me, because, as Chris said, Hillary sucked. I didn’t suspect any fraud from Republicans (btw, I am a registered Republican). It was obvious people were fed up with Dems. Now, after the last 4 years, people are fed up with Trump, so the current state of the election is not surprising either.
I said this when Hillary lost, I hope the dems realize what happenEd and get a strong candidate together. Then Biden shows up. Again. I hope both sides give us something we want to vote for in 2024.
Pence would have mopped up this year honestly. He was so much better than trump during the debates. He just won’t have that cult following that trump has provided. Engagement would have dropped so far on the left, he would have easily skated to a win.
My theory is based off trump endorsing him this cycle and not running himself… purely hypothetical.
Left is going to have to promote Harris next cycle undoubtably. Not sure if that will be good or bad yet, time will tell
I’d never vote for Harris.
Dems will have a hard time getting my vote next cycle unless it’s Pete B or Beto. Only reason I went with them is Trump is a vile human.
We are essentially a moderate country with huge liberal populations on the coasts. I’m concerned about the extremists on both sides. They are leftist protesters in Portland chanting “fuck Trump and Biden”. Wheeler was re-elected, but he’s not liberal enough and the protesters intimidated a leftist council member at his home for voting down a defund the police package because it didn’t have specifics he wanted to see. It will be interesting to see if the extremists fall away over time with the Biden presidency.
Yeah I’d never vote for Rand Paul. So as a moderate I’d never even consider any of those people, so you’ll have to come up with better candidates for the middle to switch (R).
Romney is a (R) I’d vote for if the (D) was weak. I’ll try to think of more.
I agree completely. Harris at this point I wouldn’t have voted for.
Pete buttigeg is extremely smart and a great speaker.
I would likely vote Romney if he ran again, and undoubtedly I’d vote him over Harris. Pete B vs Romney would be great for the country, therfor we will never see it…
Country needs deprogramming. So nice that I have to keep my family home for a few days since it’s not safe to be in any spaces where they could be shot.
That’s why I think it’s getting close to govt having to classify this as domestic terrorism. We wanted to take a walk last night, and we weren’t sure it was safe. So far people here are behaving well, but we’ll see once this goes final.
Pretty scary. I’m seeing it here and my wife is seeing it on Facebook. Anyone who disagrees with anything they say is labeled an enemy. If you have other opinions then your source is biased. If you are worried about domestic terrprists then you are defending antifa. Everyone but their source is wrong even if their own source is contradictory to previous actions and comments.
Trump loses so it must be fraud. No evidence then it’s a conspiracy to hide it. It’s like being wrong about any subject is an instant death sentence. I can already hear them reading this thinking that I can only say that cause Biden is winning and I’m part of the media conspiracy…weird since I havnt watched any media since the first debate and barely look at the news since it’s all been the same for 2 months. Of course no one can just think about stuff without being told how to think so…conspiracy? I don’t really have a point, it’s just disturbing.
Something nobody talks about is how Trump centric both of these fringe groups are.
Alt-right is passionately pro Trump and Antifa is passionately anti Trump.
Neither group seems to have strong feelings regarding Biden. I never see any pro or anti Biden rallies. I’ve never seen an antifa marching around promoting Biden, nor have I seen alt-right demonstrators marching around yelling anti Biden rhetoric.
So would having Trump out of the picture give both groups less reason to exist, or at least make them less vocal and less exposure?
In other words, do they go back to their day jobs, Trump isn’t able to somehow pull off a win in the electoral college?
NiceBeav, is ANTIFA anti-Trump or anti-fascist? I know there’s overlap, but it’s a distinction with a difference because in the latter case if Trump leaves they wouldn’t. From what I read they’re anti-fascist not anti-trump, though I’m sure seeing his fascist tendency is why they came to be.
Oh, i dont mean to say neither group existed before Trump, but in his tenure they have both been amplified. Sortof tit for tat. One side ratchets things up, then the other responds in this cycle of escalation.
So I guess my question is, does the de-escalation start if Trump isn’t in office? Or do we see more of the same?
Well it went hard Left the other way, where if you didn’t want to call someone a gender-neutral pronoun you were a bigot, etc. I said at the time the Left were going to get their day for trying to mandate people how to think. The problem for me is I didn’t do that, so I get the worst of both worlds. I never got the “joy” of shaming the Right like those people did. Lose-lose for moderates. I’m used to losing at this point being a Beav fan. Good training.
Trump loses so it must be fraud. No evidence then it’s a conspiracy to hide it. It’s like being wrong about any subject is an instant death sentence. I can already hear them reading this thinking that I can only say that cause Biden is winning and I’m part of the media conspiracy…weird since I havnt watched any media since the first debate and barely look at the news since it’s all been the same for 2 months. Of course no one can just think about stuff without being told how to think so…conspiracy? I don’t really have a point, it’s just disturbing.
This is the problem, and how do you get people like that to see reality? I don’t think you can. There is a specific type of brain/chemistry prone to paranoia, conspiracy, etc. I recommend “your deceptive mind”…great series. But it gives me little hope for most of these people, unless they have “introspection” to figure it out. This is why I wonder if they eventually get labeled domestic terrorists. My hunch is they do, and I can’t argue with that, because their rights end the moment they infringe on mine.
Would be interesting to see how long Trump Jr. can do this and how far he can take it without repercussions. They are clearly trying to scare and intimidate people. Cult of Trump.
Trump Jr is a weasel. Hard to believe people listen to that guy. There’s no way he runs with any success, is there? I guess this is why Russians execute the entire family, including kids, when there’s an overthrow of government…lol.
I like this term y’all-qaeda I’m seeing. Pretty accurate. At some point these people have to be considered domestic terrorists rather than citizens and handled accordingly.
Ha, the first time I heard that term was from a buddy of mine on the East Coast talking about the militia that took over the headquarters of the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge.
Oh please. Why aren’t you saying the same about the radical left / ANTIFA (P.S. they actually assassinated a Trump supporter in Portland this summer). There is an ever polarizing radicalization on both sides. Is there an excuse for it? I think no, but I also think this is a minority viewpoint; though growing. Crossing the Rubicon is reserved for very few scenarios of government encroachment or treason – to which we are not even NEARLY close to. Both sides behaving in this manner is disgusting.
Because I don’t know as much about Antifa. I follow the alt-right a lot more than the radical left. If they’re domestic terrorists they should be handled as such, too.
You find it more interest due to implicit bias in favor of the side you lean towards. If you are interested in psychological reasoning this is actually useful feedback for you.
I wish people would realize that violence is the issue not who is.doing it. People resorting to violence is a failure of a system or a failure of personal ethics. It shouldn’t be a rally call for more violence.
I don’t know why I find this so funny. Fox personality Mario Bartiromo got some tweets flagged by twitter because she was posting debunked conspiracy theories, so later she announced she’s leaving twitter to start using Parler instead(another social media platform with less restrictive rules)
But she tagged some account for @parler, which leads to some poor schlub with the same name who doesn’t follow anybody and only tweeted once, back in 2012. Now that guy has gone from zero to several thousand followers in a few hours.
Twitter spam bots are going off the rails this morning. Search for “Castellanos Home” and this same tweet will come up for thousands of accounts all within a few minutes of each other.
In other hard to believe(so i don’t) news, shortly after reports come out that Biden has taken the lead in GA and PA, a report comes out that Vladamir Putin has Parkinson’s and is being pushed by his family to quit at the end of the year.
The Kremlin has since denied these reports, it should be noted.
Interesting. Putin is a master chess player. He’s absolutely destroying the U.S. internally.
Anyone check out that Operation Infektion movie I mentioned? Long history of this, so I think Russia goes on having success with this strategy even without him. It’s “plug and play” for the authoritarians over there at this point.
I’m not sure about internally, because the western world has been internally destroying itself in the Vietnam War era. The USSR’s legacy has been the destruction of western culture by making people question and abandon their traditional norms.
He has made things much more difficult for the US externally, however, within the developing world, specifically Africa and Southeast Asia.
Well my Right friends are posting videos that are known to be made in Russia, using actors who are sitting at a table filling out multiple ballots, and posting them as “fact of voter fraud”….I’d say that’s a Putin win on internal destruction, and straight out of the Operation Infektion playbook.
It’s far more reaching than that. A few ballots don’t amount to much statistically.
What does make a bigger impact is social media and the use of bot accounts on social media. It is so effective that the US adopted this tactic during the Arab Spring in order to help the efforts to overthrow the Egyptian and Tunis governments. The fact that social media has become monetized has helped encourage this practice worldwide. It just so happens that the CCP is a significant stakeholder within many social media platforms (though these platforms are publicly banned), and it helps that they produce most of the world’s smartphones.
There is no question that Russia engages in our internal affairs, but our eyes are set on them as opposed to China.
China is a huge problem on so many fronts. It’s the one thing Trump had right (and criticism of the FED while a candidate). Too bad he’s a vile human being…and too bad he caved on all that. Trump had potential if he could have gotten out of his own way. Narcissism is a hell of a disease.
That’s true to an extent. However, I think he actually does see that the economic health of the country is rooted in its people, more so than the vast majority of Dems and Repubs. Virtually all politicians are extremely arrogant, and most despise normal people (since they are the only reason why politicians might lose their jobs).
Speaking of the FED, did you hear that they are looking at potentially substituting the dollar for a digit currency? If implemented, they (along with the Treasury) could theoretically bypass the Legislative Branch when stimulus packages stall.
I have always thought the FED was only necessary when something like a World War broke out in order to mitigate bank runs. Clearly, that organization has abused its power.
Sounds like even the Beavs are getting political. “Damn Change” emblem on their helmets, something on t-shirts Smith mentioned, “moment of unity” before kickoff, etc, all requested by the players. Smith seems like a conservative to me. Anyone know?
How do conservatives on this site feel about that?
Football coaches tend to be more on the conservative side in general, though this year they have been more vocal in supporting the players social justice messages. Don’t know where Smith leans. Riley was a conservative for sure.
But the acts for social change have been going on since summer so it’s kind of old news. A lot of teams have been doing moments of unity, even in the reddest of states. Clemson did it during their last home game (got booed).
I’m not answering from a conservative standpoint, but I’m glad they went with a non-polarizing message. The Dam Change campaign is to bring awareness to mental health issues and was started by students at OSU to help students who deal with depression and/or suicidal thoughts. Has nothing to do with changing the political climate. Basically building a support network for the campus community.
Ah, gotcha. I heard “damn change” on the Smith presser…the way it was framed seemed in relation to politics, because the reporter asked about social justice, etc.
That’s what I was wondering. I know a lot of people who stopped watching the NFL after Kaepernick….wondering if Beav fans would stop watching due to politics entering da Beavs.
So I’m reading about ANTIFA…confused. Why is it “left-wing”? Isn’t everyone anti-fascist, anti white nationalists, and anti-nazi? It seems those are the main positions. Asked my lady who follows this stuff more, and she said “they’re militant [about it]”…is that true? I am not seeing a ton of violence. What is see is more passive-aggressive shit like Doxing, which is low-life stuff and I believe illegal, but it’s not violent.
I don’t even think its an organized movement like “Proud Boys.” Just a concept and foil that got named, then renamed, “Antifa” and now trump talks as if they are an organized group like hus proud boys.
If Antifa isn’t organized, it’s one hell of a coincidence that they keep running into each other in Portland literally every night since May and wreaking havoc around town, destroying property, lighting occupied buildings on fire on multiple occasions, etc. etc.
Angry, Antifa is a weird one… Basically a blanket term that they use… They can then claim Antifa is “idea” and not organized which is true to extent. This allows them to call out any opposition as racist even if the opposition is upset about the property damage and violence… I think it gets confusing nationwide because some Antifa is peaceful but others like the Portland group are very violent… To me this is nothing new, the Portland group is really the same ol group of Anarchists that have been around forever in Oregon… They are just relabeling themselves as Antifa
I’ve known about that far left faction in Oregon, but yeah, didn’t know it was rebranded as ANTIFA. So the guy who killed someone, was he just an anarchist?
From what i read about him, he was some former Army dude who felt compelled to hang out downtown and provide “security” for people who were clashing with police at the Federal building downtown. If I had to describe him, I think anarchist would be a fitting description. I think he also supported the BLM movement.
There was a day where antifa people were downtown and alt-right people also showed up and one of the alt-right guys was shot and killed by him. He gave some interview while hiding from law enforcement that i think can be found with some searching.
Federal agents tracked him down near Lacey Washington but he ended up being killed by them, so there was never any custody or legal case.
It’s a shame either guy died but also not surprising given how much things were allowed to escalate in this city and people being drawn to it like moths to a flame.
Is it me or does every losing side in politics just eat itself? Turned on the news for the first time this week. (Pro tip – to stay sane, don’t watch any tv news during elections). CNN is just repeating itself since no new results are available, fox is trying it’s best to drum up voter fraud but even the anchors are pushing back, msnbc is the same as cnn. Both cnn and msnbc really want to make the call in nv and az. Fox doing its best not to call nv since they called az already. For once, no one wants to be first in calling the race.
I’m amazed at the restraint the MSM has shown through all this. It’s so obvious Biden is going to win, and yet no one has called it so Trump can’t rail on them for it.
Another pro tip – don’t watch news. Visual media and in person argument (debates) are the most convincing and hijack systems in our brains that make us sympathetic to what we are seeing. The medium that allows the most critical thinking and least emotional transference is the written word. In order of least manipulative to most is written, auditory, visual, in person, in person with a crowd. It all has to do with emotional transference.
I’m using Trump on this one because he’s simple a great example. Watch a trump speech or interview and then read the transcript. On a visual medium he is actually pretty convincing and charismatic. Read the transcript and it’s sometimes hard to figure out what he’s talking about.
Yoda is another good example. If you watch the movies he’s a wise shaman type. If you read the script hes essentially a crackhead.
If they haven’t called NV already, it should happen any time. Clark Cty ballots came in really expanded the lead for Biden. Up to 22k now, which I believe is insurmountable. PA wouldn’t matter in this case as long as AZ is still considered “called”
What I don’t understand is Trump & friends had four years to “expose” voter fraud, and all I can see that they’ve come up with is one offhand Fox article about a cat getting a ballot, and some movies of people filling out several pieces of paper (which we can’t see what’s on them, could be nerds taking the SAT) filmed in Russia. I know more Republicans who have gotten duplicate ballots in my immediate circle. If it exists, show all the proof. If it’s a massive fraud, there should be evidence everywhere. It’s like people who believe in ghosts, aliens, and bigfoot – if they exist, with all the cameras and surveillance we should have footage.
There’s plenty evidence of elections being mismanaged, maybe not outright fraud. Trump’s taking advantage of the natural obfuscation of one to claim the other as an excuse for his own failings.
It usually doesn’t matter, but when the vote is actually close, all the stuff that happens at the margins comes into view.
I just don’t understand all the grandstanding. If there is evidence then surely they can present it in court. Yelling from the rooftops does not create more evidence or make your case any stronger, it only caused chaos and unfounded anger. I know that’s Trump’s strategy, but it’s not beneficial to our society. Just shut the fuck up and do the work to win your case in the judicial system. It’s lazy to try to win a case through influencing public opinion rather than through proper litigation.
If anyone has FB, the lip reading video of Trump and Biden is hilarious. I found it on Stephen Wards page. I wish I could just share a link here but dont’ think FB has that capability.
That was a fantastic example of non-partisan political humor. They did an excellent job of acting out comedic caricatures of the three debate participants. Sadly, it’s a rarity these days.
So apparently the software that was used to tabulate votes in a Michigan county might have had a glitch, forcing the county to recount the 16K+ votes by hand.
The 138K reporting error is probably just that: a reporting error. However, the Trump administration might request a recount in all Michigan counties because all counties use the same software if indeed there were 4K-5K inaccurate ballots.
I think this is further evidence that we need to use 21st Century methods like blockchain. If anybody has kids that want to go into software development, I’d push them towards blockchain tech lol
It also appears as though 47 Michigan counties utilize this software (including Wayne County); 30 states utilize it as well.
A manual recount of all ballots shouldn’t take more than a week across the nation. What would be bad is if counties just ignore a court order, and SCOTUS rules that a states’ electors are invalid. If that happens, and enough electors are invalidated to prevent a winner, the vote goes to the House. Each state has one vote; Republicans currently maintain control of 28 state delegations.
However, I believe something so serious is necessary in order to change the status quo on how we do elections. There are methods to ensure that votes are counted and a winner is declared the morning after Election Day.
I am confused why no one is just calling it. Seems like 3 options.
1- viewership is crazy good so let’s keep it rolling.
2- trump is gonna go crazy so let’s keep punishing him.
3- scared to upset trump?
I’m thinking option 1 is likely. As much as the “news” won’t say it, trump has been huge for news channels. He has kept ratings rolling. That’s 1 thing I personally hate. Always political talk everywhere, because there is always some new crazy ass thing the president does
In wondering if they are scared of domestic terrorism too. There has been bomb threats and evacuations now. There has also been possible shooters crossing state lines that were picked up on tips. It wasn’t that long ago when Charlie hebdo was attacked. I would say the level of anger and threat is just as high or more. The media has to be a major target after the last 4 years of demonization.
No kidding? That is crazy. I am pretty nieve to a lot of the day to day news, as I don’t watch any news source basically ever – am watching some now to check on who our president will be.
I did not realize that was even a possibility.
People are insane. I mean I was for Biden in this one, last one didn’t participate as I thought both were so bad, still think both candidates are bad, but tired about hearing lunatic stuff with current president.
My point is, I go to work everyday, have a kid now at home (almost 14 month old son- future Beaver) and spend time with my family, friends, etc… and in all reality the only real difference the president has made on my personal life, is I have to hear about stuff from friends/family, and everything I hear has annoyed me. And if trump won this one, I would be annoyed because I’d have to hear about political stuff for the next 4 years, but I would go about my own life and in reality not much would change for me. I am not rich or poor… which I guess is a blessing either way. My point is, Life is good in this country no matter the president. Life is short also, so why spend it complaining about something you cannot change. We all get a vote, which I think is important. From that moment on it’s whatever happens, and as I mentioned I feel lucky/blessed/proud to be American. And that wouldn’t change if angry was the president, you were, trump or Biden.
You have a good point but it only works if the people in power don’t noticably affect you and your circle.
Old example but my healthcare through the ACA has gone from 1100 a month to 2100 a month under trump due to policies he chose. They have been using pre existing conditions as a wedge issue for 5 years increasing my daily stress. Without my healthcare I can’t afford my meds. Without my meds I go from a productive member of society and active father to bedridden and unable to walk in a matter of weeks. It’s one example of many but it’s very personal for me.
I’m glad you don’t have to worry about any issues on a national scale.in your daily life. Just offering a different perspective.
Nope, it went up directly due to trump administration actions to weaken the policy. It would be impossible for me to get coverage without the ACA and still be a small business owner. I would have to work for a company. Seems like a shitty system where my choices are to limit my opportunities or die in a bed before 35.
I’m still pissed that the higher tax rates on “bonus income” are still in effect. As I understand, this was put in during the Clinton administration and never overturned. When I get a yearly bonus it’s taxed at almost 45 fucking percent!
I think the domestic terrorism angle is wrong. They are just fine with it seeing how its been going on for months under the moniker of “mostly peaceful protests”.
Well i have to admit some people on either side are capable of that. The media is in large part just a division of the democrat party. I think that is clear given they’re actions the last month.
You know it really doesn’t matter who perpetrates terrorism or sides. The side should be thats wrong. Stop defending a hypothetical attack and blaming it on the hypothetical victim while dismissing it cause they are on the wrong side.
Of course it doesn’t matter who does. Im not defending anyone or anybody but its a givin that people on both sides consider them to be corrupt. I know i do. Some will act on it. Were you bothered by the terrorism of the last few months? Those burning cities, beaten bloody citizens, and harrased cops were not hypotheticals. It unfortunately went on for months and goes on today.
For those who worry about covid just a PSA to check your local numbers. National daily infections are up to 130k today and the curve has gotten pretty severe. Hospitalizations and deaths are also on the rise.
Yeah he completely incited the mexican american war just to land grab texas (already annexed and part of the incitement) , arizona, new mexico and california…just as promised!
His negotiation on Oregon is considered one of the greatest bluffs in international affairs history.
“Both Great Britain and the United States had jointly occupied this region since 1818, and it was clear that Polk wanted the west coast of North America for the United States, possibly even including Mexican-controlled California. In the beginnings of negotiations, Polk bluffed to Britain that he wanted all the territory up to 54°40′. In the end, the President’s shrewd but unseemly bluster earned him a compromise rather than a war with the British. In spite of his own supporters’ more extreme demands, Polk agreed to a boundary at the 49th parallel, giving the United States present-day Oregon, Idaho, and Washington, as well as control of the Columbia River.”
Teddy and Grant for me. Maybe it’s because I’ve read the most books about them. Also, I think people forget how popular Ronnie was. He lost seven TOTAL states in two elections! Walked out of the office with a 69% approval rating, even after doing some weird shit. I always loved the SNL skit with Phil Hartman that portrayed him as a hyper-competent evil genius who was faking being a bumbling fool.
Here’s a cool list that compiles the major historian surveys for each president. The surveys all vary but are generally comprised of people who spend their lives studying US politics and presidents. They are about as informed as it gets. Open the drop menu for survey results and you get a full overview. It’s also easy to click on any of the president’s and go to their wiki page.
I don’t know how good of a pres he was, but do you guys know the story about John Tyler still having a grandson alive? Yes, a grandson. It has to do with men fathering kids in their ’70s with young wives. He had two, but one just died in his 90’s.
I can verify he was a terrible president. Got the job after harrison died in office after a few months. Still cool that such a close decendent is alive 175 years later.
It’s boring but Lincoln, Washington, Jefferson were our best. My next rung would be Teddy and Andrew Jackson. Grant is interesting…he’s ranked lower than he should be on most lists. Jimmy Carter is persecuted, too. He inherited hyperinflation and the subsequent 18% interest rates.
One thing I find funny about the list is there is no standard reference model to judge against, it’s all relative to each other. If you put 42 cats in a best dog competition it doesn’t really tell you who the best dog is.
I mean sure but those top 5 are going to vary wildly. My top 5 best presidents isn’t even the same as my favorite. I know for a fact that my top 5 are different than yours cause we have a different priorities about what policy is important. My favorite to ask people (and most partisan) is best person who has been president. This is a hard one since we don’t know a ton about all of them as people but if you make a list of Carter’s life and leave out the political offices and his name most people would agree he’s a fantastic role model for any child. Tell people it president carter and it all changes. That dude is old as time and still making bird houses with foster kids.
Yeah that’s one reason I said Carter is underrated. He never really got off the ground due to the economic situation he was handed (Biden could have a similar problem), but he was a fantastic human and likely would have made a great president if the economic climate were better.
My late Mom who was a diehard conservative all her life voted for Carter because she said she loved honest, southern gentlemen and thought Ford was an elitist (not sure if that was true). She never voted Democrat again. I think she voted for Trump although I’m not sure she knew who he was at the time!
I think Trump leads on election night and declares victory. As mail in votes come in, Biden wins. Then I think Trump refuses to leave and later steals it in the courts. What’s funny is if this is not decided by inauguration day Pelosi becomes president.
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Just spotted this scrolling through comments. Scarey!!
Pennsyvania votes coming in have hit the tipping point for networks to finally call the race. Have seen NBC/AP/CNN called it for Biden in the last few minutes.
Biden is now anchored. To make a football analogy, the call on the field has to stand unless there’s irrefutable evidence to overturn the call. So far I’ve seen zero evidence…just anecdotes and super shady videos from shady sources.
Fox news has projected it now also. Also made the call for Nevada and they already had called AZ. So basically 2 paths called sinultaneously.
AZ still seemed to be trending toward Trump, so will be interesting to see where that state finally lands.
Trump just needs to concede, so the nation can calm down a little if possible. He was given a golden opportunity and he made the choice to continue to be an ego-driven asshole. The rust belt states were closer in 2016 and Clinton did the right thing, although she may have been in a state of shock!
I’m hearing he’s going to abuse executive order to purposely wield his final power and create more mayhem (probably misery for “libs” if he can). This guy continues to outdo himself in the grace and dignity departments.
At some point doesn’t he have to think about the landscape he leaves for his kids? If they have designs of eventually running for office, having dad leave scorched earth in his wake would be tough to sell.
It will also leave a really bad taste for moderates…personally won’t consider a (R) next cycle if they allow that behavior. Now that he’s gone it’s gotta be damage control for a lot of them.
The only reason to watch the cable news is to see both sides spin themselves in circles. One side claiming a mandate since Biden won over 50% over the vote. Otherside saying Trump increased his raw vote total from 2016 and his has legal challenges still ongoing.
I think the next two years are going to be interesting. I don’t think there has ever been a president who stepped down due to health reasons? I think it’s going to happen unless there’s a cure for Alzheimer’s coming that we don’t know about. Biden will be getting the best healthcare in the world. I remember when everyone was concerned about Reagan being the oldest at 69 and it was most likely affecting him at the end of his second term and his handlers were able to hide it to some degree.
Wonder if the release of todays latest vote counts that lead to the announcement wasnt strategic?
Do it late on a friday night and you’re asking for potential trouble in the streets.
Saving it for Saturday morning when college football is about to kick off, might help reduce some of that stuff as people have other distractions. Just a thought
I don’t know that anyone can make extremists on either side happy. There was some chant going on in Portland last night about “fuck Trump and Biden”. The left-wing Portland politicians who won their local races are apparently not liberal enough for the protesters.
From a Detroit Free Press OP-Ed, a sports metaphor some may enjoy:
“Shortly after 2 a.m. Wednesday, with the election undecided but with his rival leading both the popular vote and the Electoral College tally, the president of the United States claimed victory in his bid for reelection, declared the continuing effort to count ballots cast on or before Election Day a fraud, and vowed to press those absurd claims in the U.S. Supreme Court.
…
It was as if a football team trailing by a field goal had walked off the field with 5 minutes remaining on the clock and insisted that the score, the officiating, and time itself were irrelevant.”
I was scanning various papers around the country looking for indications of violence, thankfully there’s been none. Agree, the timing of releasing results may have been strategic to reduce the potential for violence.
Remember, though, a winner isn’t formally declared until December 14.
If, indeed, there is a case for voter impropriety (not fraud), and certain swing states don’t follow court orders to perform a manual recount, there’s a good chance that that state’s electoral votes could be nullified.
Trump is (or was) apparently golfing today. Probably declaring victory early, counting only those holes he won, demanding recounts on holes where he lost…
I’m trying to think of the term for humiliation of a public figure, or defacing of a statue of a public figure. SAT type word. Slipping my mind. I think it begins with an “E” but I’m not sure. Can anyone help?
The progressive/socialist branch of the democrats will split off eventually. I see the future as a left, moderate and right government with the middle making coalition votes with the other two on various subjects. I think that would assert some real sanity and effective government someday.
If that happens in the next few years, the progressives will never get anything that they want ever again. Their source of funding will be almost nill.
People are overlooking the fact that the GOP now controls 29 state legislatures. They have the authority to gerrymander and redraw district lines, which will have impacts for the next decade.
This is pretty funny. I guess early this morning before the race was called, Trump tweeted out there was going to be a press conference about voter fraud in Philly this morning at the Four Seasons.
Then he later corrected his tweeted that it was “Four Seasons Landscaping” where the press conference was to be held, not the Four Seasons hotel. So a bunch of media ends up going to this random landscaping company to cover it, but in the meantime the election is called. So most media packs up and leaves, but some remain behind.
This is the scene from that press conference. Rudy Giuliani in a gravel parking lot between a landscaping business and an adult sex toy shop, claiming poll watchers weren’t allowed to stand closer than 6 feet. That’s the evidence of fraud, apparantly.
People like Rudy Guliani(sp?) who lack integrity, always end up losing, and I’m comforted by that somewhat. He looks desperate and pathetic. The problem is though, they tend to drag society or groups of people through a lot of unnecessary, unproductive shit.
All of these people are on the socialist/progressive radar for primary challenges in the future. 2022 and 2024 are going to but nuts internally. If Biden only goes 1 term I expect Kamala will have a brutal primary challenge.
Looks like a lot of high-level politicians are starting to play with house money regarding longevity. We are going to see some “die-offs” in office unless retirements start happening.
And I doubt Harris will be in any primary. She will be running in 2024 as the incumbent.
Unless he dies she won’t be president. Parties and allies will hide presidential health concerns forever. If we do’nt stop electing 70+ year olds we might as well put the white house on the “weekend at Bernies hollywood set tour”.
That’s funny. It’s true, dementia can be hidden with the right support. Glen Campbell kept touring almost to the end with members of his family in his band, but geez I don’t know how you hide a president in this day and age unless there’s at least a little bit of intentional deception going on.
Hard to un-elect them when they are never challenged.. Say what you will about AOC – granted, she had several advantages – looks, energy, a district she knew well, bilingual, democrat district to begin with. However, as I understand it she went door-to-door and held countless meetings. I read also, the guy she ran against, forget his name, another Pelosi buddy, didn’t take her seriously and didn’t campaign much.
The house democrats – right now – could shake up the house leadership but they self-protect. They want to be there until they are 80, as well.
I actually don’t know a ton about AOC, but I remember watching her speech when this happened, and it was an incredible rebuttable of Kavanaugh. Super well-spoken and articulate. Thing is I actually think she’s a socialist, so there’s that….
She basically is. Just listed as a democrat. Like Bernie. But Bernie is not listed as a democrat, so I was always confused why he was able to run for the democratic nomination.
But the thing is, she doesn’t have that much pull in the party. She’s just one of the loudest voices in the room. Fox News put her up on a pedestal and started firing away. She was an easy boogeyman.
But I’d probably not vote for her is the thing, and moderates have to be won.
I have zero belief in socialist as a long-term economic policy. So while it would work short-term, it has that issue, and therefore I just couldn’t. She’s an economically confused, smart woman.
That’s messed up. If true, everyone just needs to watch Network in High School. All news is is selling an ad. That’s all it is. If you know that you know all. We’re lucky to have media that can say anything, but we’re unlucky not everyone understands it’s someone talking to sell an ad.
Olivia Nuzzi confirms Trump team doesn’t understand the math of the votes. Senior advisors intervened to explain which votes should be stopped and why. Didn’t this guy supposedly go to an Ivy League school? I wonder how he got in there…
Also would like to add the AP and Reuters both did a great job with reporting. Everyone has been praising AP, but I think Reuters did the best job. Very conservative and accurate. Still haven’t even called AZ because the math doesn’t eliminate Trump.
Man, so much less agita with Biden and Harris. Civil, decent…yeah, confused on economics, but the former are more important. Can’t take the money with you. Might as well have peace of mind while here.
I figure this thread is about dead but I do meant to throw something in the void and see what comes out. I am a socialist but I don’t think socialism will always hold the best solution. I think any idealogy can come up with good ideas. My hope for the future is the democrats break up to bro a progressive and moderate party so we have 3 ideologies expressed. My guess is that moderates would hold most of the position most of the time and deals/coalitions would need to be made with the two minority parties to get legislation passed.
I wish this because our system is so all or nothing its pointless sometimes. If there was a requirement for working together (like the 60 vote threshold for scotus used to be) then more ideas can be expressed and debate can happen. What do people think of that concept?
The electoral college is what makes us a Republic (vs a Democracy) and gives the minority some power. It was put in place to avoid “tyranny of the masses”…
I think it’s a good thing. It gives some say to a minority vote, like a rural democrat or urban republican.
But that’s the role of the Senate. The Senate protects the minority more than any other institution in government. The Senate checks the Executive Branch by confirming or denying the President’s appointees to various departments.
The EC constrains the election to 10-13 states. Plus, if we’re talking about protecting the “minority”, the EC does not do a great job of preserving the interests of rural people, since the direct democratic vote within each state for the electors really comes down to what the cities decide within those states.
The stock market falls for every vaccine headline. This move probably has more to do with Biden winning/certainty. It’s overdone, IMO. People who shorted thinking chaos now have to cover, which fuels it higher, too. The next two months will be interesting in the stock market. “Santa Claus rally” vs all the court battles. I’m not deploying new money. Hold for me.
That’s an incredibly small sample size that’s only being considered Phase 3 (technically Phase2/3) because of the emergency designation. Most people don’t want to take it, anyway.
I added a few small trades in things that were irrationally whacked and should bounce back once reality sets in.
The fear factor, for many, may actually provide a good test for efficacy and safety that’s a larger test group than normally found on new vax/drug, eg. a small sample will volunteer, and some folks may be required to inoculate (military, health care, possibly those at risk).
Market down today as traders try to pick up the pieces.
Articles starting to trickle out telling us this is brand new technology that’s never been used in a vaccine before, so Pfizer will have to use “utmost caution” before releasing. Oh, but they’ve already pre-sold 700M units.
Chinese vaccine halted in Brazil because of a serious adverse reaction. Didn’t Russia have one they were bragging about?
Esper was the guy that pushed back on the idea of using the military to quell the discord after George Floyd’s death. Now, on the heels of an apparent election loss for the guy who believes in US military might vs US citizens, Esper is fired. Hmmmm…
Thanks for some sanity and truth on a thread lacking in both. Trump is no angel but this continued BS of Obama as some clean as the driven snow leader is a joke. I doubt any or few will read it. Also, this election is far from over. The fraud is to large and in to many areas to be ignored and even though Trump may still not win there is going to be much exposed.
The crux of the post is that all of our recent presidents have done horrible things, arguably worse than Trump. Many of the people involved in those acts are now active voices in “the resistance” who are trying to distract from their own records and frame themselves as Patriotic heroes. Also, Greenwald (the author) is a gay progressive, so it’s not like he’s supporting Trump.
I think it’s more valuable as an attempt to save people’s mental health than anything. Politics are what they are, but I know some people get serious anxiety and very real health issues because they’re so worried about what “the resistance” keeps telling them Trump and his followers are going to do.
I’m actually surprised people think all this “fraud” claiming is new and significant. Trump has claimed the same thing in the last three elections. He claimed Obama didn’t really win, Dems stole that one too. He also claimed he actually won the popular vote against Hillary because there were so many illegal votes for her.
I mean sure, fraud should be investigated under most circumstances, but when it’s an oft repeated and unfounded claim by the same person, when does it become just a huge waste of money for Americans who pay taxes?
“When does it become a huge waste of money for Americans who pay taxes?”
Exactly. It’a already a waste. Attorneys for the Trump Campaign are growing weary about wasting the courts time because they are worried it will affect their license to practice, so instead the strategy is to go to the media and present “evidence” of fraud in the form of stacks of paper and getting tv personalities to clutch their pearls on the air. Can’t win in a court of law? Might as well try to win in the court of public opinion. Unfortunately, audiences aren’t making that distinction.
When the postal worker had to go on record they recanted, because they have no proof. Again, this is Bigfoot. If Bigfoot existed, given there are hundreds of millions of cameras, we’d have seen Bigfoot.
For a live look at a hearing in Michigan about challenges to contitutionality of the vote count of absentee ballots in that state. This is where we start to see the real plan unravel. Challenge the consitutionality, get it kicked up to the supreme court, have the supreme court rule against and then you have a path to flipping results in other states.
This will have pretty major consequences.
It’s like watching a slow, dragged out murder take place in front of you.
This was the plan the entire time. Trump keeps talking about “fraud” but “fraud” is a very specific thing; it’s something to feed the media because “fraud” is absurd. The main thing that they are going after is what decided Bush v Gore: mail-in ballots that are counted in violation of states’ laws is a violation of the 14th Amendment. So now, not only are the results in MI and PA in question, but also WI (which requires mail-in ballots to be signed by a witness, along with the witness’ address), AZ, and NV.
Wanna know something crazier? Biden asked the Bush (Sr) Administration to authorize the FBI to investigate Clarence Thomas about claims of sexual harassment right before his confirmation hearing, even though these claims came up right after Thomas was nominated. Also, Kamala Harris persistently questioned Brett Kavanaugh about claims of sexual assault, which practically ruined his life for a short bit. I think if it came down to a technicality in a SCOTUS ruling, these two would rule against the Biden administration.
Not to mention that Kavanaugh, Barrett, and Chief Justice Roberts were all legal consultants for George Bush in the 2000 election.
So Draft Kings has Trump winning (i.e. their gamblers picking him) in 49 of 50 States. Only one they’re not doing that is…Colorado! Biden with something up on his site saying internal data shows him down in MI, FL, and AZ.
Liberals are going to go nuts tomorrow when the night closes with Trump in the lead (it will just due to in-person votes). And if Biden wins, they are going to go nuts when Trump uses his rigged court to win it. It truly feels like a “heads I win, tails you lose” moment. Evil genius for the win. The long-term consequences of this are going to be insane.
My base case is Trump closes tomorrow with a lead, Biden picks up steam over the next few days and maybe takes the lead, and then Trump wins it in the courts.
Do you know if this means a greater number of betters pick Trump, or a greater amount of money played lands on Trump? Would be curious to see how those numbers compare.
Like if you had 1000 people putting $10 each on Trump and 500 people putting $100 each on Biden, the overall map would look red if they’re counting bettors, but money played might be a better indicator. Seems like a marketing stunt for Draft Kings and it’s working.
Oh, nevermind. It’s a free to play draft pool. No money to wager, no risk.
I don’t know this means anything other than more Trump leaning users flooded draft kings contest. Like an unscientific poll.
It looks like you found the answer, but I was going to say my knowledge is cursory just saw this image trending on my FB:
https://imgur.com/a/4nOSEV9
When optimism and pessimism collide
Looking spot on so far
Is the politics thread where I get to say “wake up, sheeple: the Earth is flat?”
Trump landslide is coming, Dems will shout “don’t believe the tally” until they can try to catch up with ballot harvesting in selected precincts.
Electoral college landslide and popular vote 55% or better will erase all Dem arguments.
Prepare for 4 more years of Trump.
Brace for the leftist/marxist riots, hopefully Trump invokes the Insurrection Act to stop it.
Draining the Swamp isn’t pretty or easily done, but Trump is up to the task.
There’s no way he wins the popular vote.
Whoever down-voted me: $100 wager right now. I’m taking no popular vote.
I say this as someone who 100% believes the Federal government is too big: Draining the Swamp is a populist pipe dream. The government is too big to drain the swamp without causing serious dysfunction. Government is basically a sector of the economy.
Imagine any given industry–tech, auto, O&G–saying “we’re going to remove all our most experienced people and start fresh with outsiders.” It would be a train wreck.
‘Electoral college landslide and popular vote 55% or better will erase all Dem arguments.’ As of November 5, mid-day, Biden + 3 million in the popular vote. I repeat: Tell me again why the electoral college is a good thing?
It keeps us as a Republic (protects rights of the minority) rather than a Democracy (forced will of the masses)?
Lot of prediction streaks about to be broken tomorrow or in the next week. I can’t say how many articles I’ve seen about a person or region or model having picked the election winner since 1952 or whenever. Basically they are split.
I think that poll you found above, something is off. I’ve been watching the gambling lines and they seem to favor Biden about 2x over.
I currently see the odds at
-185 Biden (takes 185$ to win $100)
+155 trump ($100 bet wins you $155)
Based on vegas it’s about 66% Biden, 33% trump
Remember, if Trump loses, he can run again in 2024.
Democrats made a huge mistake going with Harris as VP, for this reason. I highly doubt Biden will last four years in office. They should have gone with Gabbard. Had they done that, the Democrats would not lose another general election.
I dont see joe getting through 1 full year.
Go look at demographics and political affiliation. It’s more likely the democrats split up into a socialist and moderate party than the GpP gets a president in the next 20 years.
Moderate party sounds good.
Indeed. A major party slump and the split of the other is really the only scenerio where the US gets mulitple parties. It would be much preferable.
Or it might more liklely be his son. Don can still tweet while he wets his pants and sharts, his son can play to the Trump fanbase with more energy and a younger model/wife.
You’re dead on RE Dems playing a four year schedule. Rs have played the long game and cultivated a Supreme Court and built on decades of manufacturing doubt so that even the most ridiculous hyperbole dominates mindshare.
Pretty sure the democrats are at a true shift point if they want to stay one party. Their biggest voting blocks are millennials and Zoomers. Capitalism in its current iteration doesn’t work for shit for those generations. In millennials the US has created a highly educated, extremely disenfranchised and overwhelming disadvantaged generation. Millennials are 20% of the population and hold less than 5% of the wealth.
Millennials priorities are overwhelmingly environment, civil rights, equity (people having equal services and opportunities). The current system has utterly failed millennials and then blamed them for it because we are eating avocado toast. The DNC needs to significantly shift to millennial and Zoomers policy concerns in the next 8 years or there is going to be a socialist party.
You guys are way too bullish on trump. He needs to get 5-10 million more vote than 2016. He’s lost about 2 million to deaths and he’s completely lost the center and parts of the GoP. Where are these votes coming from to make up for the loses and close the demographic changes? Every indication of voter turnout shows a drastic uptick, that isn’t due to trump voters.
Evil genius – he will win it in the courts if/when he loses.
Evil doesnt make you a genius. GoP has shot all it’s wads and raided the coffers on their way out.
I didn’t say it does. I said he’s an evil genius, meaning he’s very smart in all the wrong ways.
I disagree. I think hes a self interested moronic NPD person who has had every advantage and still blown it over and over again.
Nuc, I grew up in Trump country (east) and he was going bankrupt every few years. Concluded he’s not very good at business. But he is good at manipulation and presenting an image. He’s also good at speaking in a way that makes you believe him as he’s lying. These things are evil genius. Pretending he’s not will do nothing to negate the reality that he is.
On a side note, my buddy in Georgia who has been swearing he’d vote Biden for a year now told me last night he held his nose and voted Trump. When I asked why, he said he didn’t want to send any more $ to the Federal Govt. So, he’s afraid of tax increases…at least it’s somewhat valid. Though I tried to point out the inflation tax under Trump is the highest since the 70s.
As far as I can tell he’s good at attracting self serving sycophants, ignoring norms/laws and lying. Sure people believe him but never a majority, for most he’s a bludgeon to get things they want and they just hope the damage isn’t to bad. Children scream and cry and it works to get what they want when they wear down parents. I just feel like labeling him a genius is wrong. He’s just a petulant child with a billion dollar stick. Manipulation is easy when you can offer the world even if he never delivers. When I consider evil genuis In current times I think of people like McConnel, Putin or even Hillary.
Trump’s image of a successful, wealthy man is complete bullshit. If he’s successful and wealthy, why is he never happy? Why can’t he even handle a white house press room when so many other presidents have?
I think what Trump implicitly sales is “The rules and law don’t have to apply to you. They don’t apply to me. We’ll get the courts, my sycophants will benefit.” He says the laws don’t apply to him (“i could shoot someone in the street, and nothing would happen to me,”) and when a 17-year old who shoots a few people in the head says “he was defending himself.” He doesn’t pay taxes, treats women like shit, hell, what’s not to like? Are you telling me we can all do that? “Proud boys, stand by!” Its funny when he campaigns on law and order, because he disdains law and cultivates disorder. And that’s what’s coming to America if/when he wins.
Mostly poor, white, under-educated people, are going to keep a man in power who cares NOTHING for them, aided by a very few very wealthy people. The poor people are getting played. This has happened throughout history.
Voting the R line because “taxes will otherwise increase” is short sighted, when socialist spending, massive deficits, national civility and democracy are the trade-offs.
The Rs played the long game (supreme court, sell your soul now for decades of power), the Dems play the short game – identity politics and Biden for four years as the anti-trump….The Rs love identity politics: “Fight amongst yourselves over your identity(ies), discourage your selves from voting, lack a vision for your party. Great!”
A young country will hopefully grow up and grow through this, but i doubt it. Its likely we’ve peaked and are on the down slope of democracy.
It strikes me that liking Trump for “winning” is like liking a win-at-all-costs sports program, who even though they cheat with recruiting violations and alumni cash call themselves winners and champions. Trump would be a Duck…
That’s a great comparison Obj.
This is what Dems do. They try to rationalize and intellectualize it. As if they’re going to convince or illuminate the hypocrisy. YoungOrSt did this for months, and it was painful to watch. Trump is a cult, but if I know one thing about cults, it’s that they end of their own accord not by telling the people in the cult they’re in a cult. I mean if it were that easy there wouldn’t be cults…
Trump doesn’t even align with his voters (many don’t like him, “hold their nose and vote”, are poor and he hates the poor, are old and he wants to end SS, etc)…but they still put more weight on the fear of the other guy, and at that point the cult can get in deeper and exploit that. It’s a lot like malware.
Trump’s image of a successful, wealthy man is complete bullshit. If he’s successful and wealthy, why is he never happy?
Sort of. He’s gone bankrupt a ton, but he has money. Nobody knows how much. He’s not happy because money doesn’t = happy. His dad was a stern, miserable person and he got no love. His mom was even worse. That’s why he’s miserable (and why he has narcissism, which is a fake reality to create love).
Great business man’s economic scorecard per forbes…
https://www.forbes.com/sites/chuckjones/2020/10/29/trumps-re-election-economic-scorecard/?sh=b49b65f41af2
Was my first thought when the same day I read Biden is predicted as heavily favored in Wisconsin, the GOP campaign in Wisconsin suddenly announces $2.3m disappeared from theor campaign finance funds because of “hackers”. I think the story is “hackers” got in and changed the names and accounts on invoices which caused the funds to get routed where they didn’t belong.
Hmmm….
I’ve made the observation that anything they accuse Dems of they’re doing. Trump started this, and now they all do it. If you see Trump accusing someone of X, he’s doing X.
Imagine if you had contributed a substantial sum to the Wisconsin GOP, only to have it magically vanish.
So…don’t think about it or look at data. Just base things off feelings.
YoungOrst did not argue with intellectualism at all. He was emotional and spur of the moment outrage.
whatever happened to YoungOrst? His ad hominem attacks on other posters were getting Jack-esque when I checked out from the site over summer. was he banned or re-brand under some other moniker?
P.S. If I hear, “may you live in interesting times” one more time………..
No shit. I hate that. Most of this is not interesting, its predictable and absurdly bad.
I hope democracy is the victor.
A proxy candidate with early-onset dementia and a raging delusional narcissist, both in the mid to late 70’s. 300 million fucking people and this is the best two people we can put forth? I’m not sure what that says about our country, but I’m thinking it’s not good!
I’m actually not very political, I don’t really feel my life it that affected by who is in the White House. I may have to deal with plus or minus a few tax dollars depending on the Dem or Republican, but otherwise, I just keep plugging away at life. Be nice when the pandemic is over though.
Right? That’s exactly what I’ve said. Since the 60s its been dominated by a few families; Kennedys, Bushes, Clintons, next up Trumps.
I do think more than a few tax dollars are at stake. The Senate doesn’t work any more, just waits for executive orders. Democracy and American civilty are on the line. People who are talking “civil war” I think actually want it. Terrible.
For years people have said “They’re coming to take our guns.” And I’ve thought: “Explain to me how this works: A bill passes the house AND senate. Gets signed by a president. Law enforcement: federal? State? County? You tell me. Come and take our guns. Really? HOW LIKELY IS THAT?” But they’ll take our votes and those same people don’t seem to care so much.
I own several guns, and don’t fear they’ll be taken away. I do fear a supreme court will take our vote away. Ha! Gotcha! You weren’t watching!
I like your approach!
For the lawyers here (where’s Jack?), how does a judge in WA order MI what to do? Is this because he’s a Federal judge and it’s a Federal agency, or is some of the MI mail routed through WA? I’m not getting how he has authority in this matter.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2020/11/02/usps-ballots-court-ruling/
Was just looking at the early voting statistics. Just under 100 million votes were cast before election day this year. The total for 2016 was 136 million. That’s wild.
Even if Biden wins, Trump has set up the argument and the courts to null it. Evil genius to plant the seeds, and now his base is rabid about it.
My arguement is that his base is too small to matter after this election. It will only continue to get smaller. People who build up themselves on identity politics following a false prophet usually are not great about loyalty when winning stops.
Not really worth arguing about it. We will have 8 weeks of watching it.
Man, I think you’re missing what’s going on with the Right. Read ZeroHedge sometime. Millions of young people love the current “alt-Right” and fascism.
You’re wrongly assuming his base is just old white people.
The Trump Trains and all that stuff are made up of younger people, not retirees. The most recent estimate I saw said Trump will win 25-30% of African Americans.
Another portion of his base was created over the years by the condescending attitude of Democrats. That’s not going to change under a Biden/Harris administration and will continue to fuel opposition.
^ That’s what I just said.
Completely wrong to think it’s all white, old people if you read the alt-right sites.
I never said old people. My arguement is that young people are 60% democrats/socialist. The 18-35 demographic that runs that way will make up the majority of all voters in 2024. The world is changing. Even 30 million people under 35 on zerohedge or whatever is a drop in the bucket of you are talking election margins. The condescending attitude of the democrats that people associate with SJW and identity politics is what young people support. The norms for the last century are gone.
The 18-35 demographic that runs that way will make up the majority of all voters in 2024. The world is changing.
Young people are always socialist/democrat. It’s when they starting working, earn money, etc that they flip. This is a tale as old as time. The better question is how many of those 18-35s will flip once they earning a living. A bad economy also tends to make people lean socialist, and we’ve had a bad, debt-fueled economy for 12 years. If we actually invest in infrastructure and the future and get the economy rolling, people will change quickly (e.g. all the “occupy wall st” people gave up and got jobs).
No it’s a myth as old as time. Millennials are all working. In majority we can’t afford a house or have kids without serious financial risk. We have shit healthcare and more debt than wealth. What does a conservative platform have to offer us? Nothing. I’m a millennial and I’m 31 and I have been working since I was 5. I’m lucky and to be a home owner and to have 3 kids. Most of my friends do not and I run in crowds with multiple degrees and good jobs. If you really think we are changing you need to realize how old this generation really is and how shitty we have it.
You mention infrastructure but that isn’t even a conservative policy. They haven’t done shit for infrastructure, their priority was milking the goat to death. The economy has been on a record growth path for a decade, our lot is still shit. Your assumptions about past generations do not apply to this one. We are more like the people who grew up in the depression and voted for socialist platforms into the 60s than boomers or genx.
Well I never said any of that. You’re talking about Gen Z with the 18-23 year olds, and my point is those people will change if the economy is better and/or they gain wealth. You then overlap it with the 24-35 year olds, which are millennials. So these are two different generations. Gen Z is way less jaded, and could easily flip stances with (a) age and (b) a flip in the economic situation. Political ideology isn’t determined at those ages. It’s cemented way later in life.
I never said infrastructure is a conservative policy, either. I said if we actually use the debt we’re accumulating on something productive, like infrastructure (instead of financial assets), the economy would boom, and people who want socialism would likely change as they accumulate wealth. Once you have wealth, the focus becomes on protecting it, which is why they shift to (R) policies. When you have no wealth, you lean (D), because stealing some other guy’s wealth is very attractive.
Again, a tale as old as time. There’s nothing different about this generation other than they haven’t yet experienced a decent economy. I think with renewable energy and technology they could, if we invested in the right areas. So the idea these people are cemented as (D) is completely wrong.
That would require significant policy redo by the GOP. Zoomera are the most inclusive generation in history. Their number one concern isn’t the economy or getting rich, it’s having a planet to live on where you can still breathe.
If Trump loses the (R) will have to shift. Though, the alt-right is growing. Weird situation. Likely ends in some type of violence in the streets (weird how Charlottesville and running the Biden bus off the road are all (R) policies, yet Trump accuses Dems of being an angry mob). This fits my thesis above that anything Trump accuses others of is what he’s doing.
https://news.gallup.com/poll/1669/general-mood-country.aspx
Overall satisfaction with the country was at a 15-year high before COVID. If you look at the categories, “Very Satisfied” and “Very Dissatisfied” were at an all-time high and 13-year low, respectively, as of this January. I’d be curious to hear why you think that’s the case if it wasn’t due to economic factors.
Also, unemployment is negatively correlated with age, so the younger you are, the more likely you are to be unemployed. So Millennials are not “all working.” I think you’re encountering sample size issues.
I’m also 31 and within my social sphere, there’s a strong correlation between socioeconomic status and political leanings. The people that are better off are more likely to be liberal because they’re comfortable enough to prioritize progressive issues and they’ve never experienced losing a chunk of their income to tax increases (quite the opposite, actually). The ones who make less are moderate or lean conservative because they see the Left as having nothing to offer from an economic standpoint and that’s what they’re most concerned about.
I would look hard at the methodology Gallup used. They tend to go with phone surveys which suck at capturing young people opinions. I don’t have time to but a satisfaction by age and socioeconomic would be more telling of the picture. Through my arthritis group I know about 1500 millenials from all over the socioeconomic breakdown, I only know of one in the group that is conservative at all and he is more just moderate/fiscal than ideological. That said the group is highly stilted since we all get first hand experience with the healthcare system.
Wealth gap is pretty stunning.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2019/12/03/precariousness-modern-young-adulthood-one-chart/
https://www.theladders.com/career-advice/the-generation-that-owns-the-least-wealth-in-america
Political Affiliation:
https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2018/03/20/1-trends-in-party-affiliation-among-demographic-groups/
Different Realities:
https://www.goldmansachs.com/insights/archive/millennials/
Wealth gap is due to the FED. Refuse to let assets like homes, stocks, etc drop.
I read a lot of the Reddit finance/millenial pages…they’re definitely jaded. Rightfully so they came of age into the 2008 crisis and the FED disallowing them an opportunity to save banks.
No argument with the wealth gap. I will note that your Pew link shows Millennials as the group with the highest number identifying as Independents. I agree strongly with this from my own observation.
When that’s the case, it makes individual candidates and issues that much more important and it makes it harder to lump the whole generation into one group.
Indeed. They do one of those every 4 years or so, looking forward to see how things have changed.
Wealth gap is Federal Reserve. Interesting to watch Reddit finance because a lot of millennials are waking up to that reality.
The calming factor here: God will always be there with unconditional love. A lot of this is out of our hands, out of our control. Have a good rest of the week everyone.
Thanks, Krol…
I think Biden wins. I think the silent Trump supporter argument in 2016 was BS. IMO what happened was the undecideds swung hard to Trump in 2016 combined with the pollsters failing to factor in college education. Clinton still won every state she polled over 50% in. If Biden wins every state he is polling over 50% in he takes the election. Of course it is possible some new polling errors that wasn’t accounted for exists but I think that is highly unlikely.
I think Trump leads on election night and declares victory. As mail in votes come in, Biden wins. Then I think Trump refuses to leave and later steals it in the courts. What’s funny is if this is not decided by inauguration day Pelosi becomes president.
The early vote tally and known affiliation data suggest Trump will never lead.
Yeah but those are mostly mail-in votes in States that count them early (e.g. PA doesn’t start counting mail ins until 7pm tonight). Once (R)s get to the polls later today that will change.
That’s not true. The majority were dropped directly in boxes or early in person votes. 22 states allow processing of votes but only a few actually count early. Off the top of my head Arizona is only one I can think of.
The general feeling is those were mostly dem votes, and R will come out in force tonight.
Will definitely see a lot of stories about how people who tried to vote today were denied. Especially in states where it’s close.
Georgia among them…..as is tradition.
Isn’t it in their constitution that all citizens must take pride in voter suppression? I was born in Atlanta and I’m pretty sure the Georgia baby handbook has a section on it.
Wierd since they voted majority democrat til 2003. Did they redo there constitution since then?
Well back then the democrats were doing the suppression. It doesn’t matter who does it its just the Georgia way man.
Wrong spot
Who here actually votes on election day in person.
I’ve actually never had to do it because we can vote early and drop our ballots off in oregon. I’m curious what the experience is like. The time it takes, the environment. I don’t understand why people do it if they have the option to vote early? Understanding not everybody has that option, of course.
I’ve done it in the past. It didn’t take too long…maybe 20 minutes. I’m not sure why I did it…I was young so maybe I didn’t know about the other options, or maybe I wanted the certainty of handing someone the ballot and seeing it go in the bin.
Went with my folks to the church down the street when I was a kid. Never have had the option to vote in person. I love Oregon’s system, it is so easy and you never hear about fraud.
Seems so foreign now to vote in person and quite a hassle. I do recall schools gyms being occupied on election day as a kid.
Definitely see more states (smaller) moving toward all mail ballots in the future.
That’s exactly where I did it…an old, smelly gym.
I’ve always voted in person because I like the experience of taking part in the process out in the community. It’s one of the few political things you can still do with other people. It’s a good reminder not to hate on people that disagree with you because they’re still people.
If you go at the right time of day, it usually only takes 20 minutes or so. The mood has always been very neutral and respectful where I’ve voted, but I’m sure that depends on location.
Voted in person for the first time today in AZ. Took 20 minutes and they did a very thorough job checking everything. No sketchy business.
I logged into Fidelity this morning to see what markets are doing, and got this as the top headline. Made me laugh.
Exclusive: Tired of Trump, Deutsche Bank games ways to sever ties with the president
DB, the worst bank in the world, is tired of Trump? Haha
Lol… they are so full of it, as long as his money is green they will keep ties with anyone.
Weird day for them to come out with that, no?
I wonder how much Deutsche Bank would have to pay for breach of contract.
Who is to say it would be a breach? They may have the option to call in debt in the contract. Generally when no one else wants to loan someone money the bank can set themselves pretty favorable terms.
Probably on topic, Wisconsin canceled their game vs Purdue this weekend. That’s now two games canceled and on the brink of not being able to compete for a BIG10 title even ranked in the top 10. Wonder how this will affect the voting today in Wisconsin.
Man, this guy just sounds either exhausted, defeated, or both. He doesn’t sound well at all. Clip from Trump interview this AM on Fox and Friends. Almost sounds like the drunk guy at the bar, slurring his speech, but he doesn’t drink so I don’t think that’s it. Also doesn’t sound like a guy who wants to make good on his claim of declaring an early victory. Almost humbled?
Lots of clips in this thread. (The source is a very left leaning account that cherry picks media clips, so take it for what it’s worth)
https://twitter.com/atrupar/status/1323610271219437569?s=19
I think he did ~6 rallies in the past day…
It was 12-14 in 2 days.
I really do not like Trump but I hate the direction of the democrats even more. 2016 was less about a vote for Trump and more about civil unrest over our defaulting political system. With that said Trump not being part of the good ol boy club has made it really rough for him in office. My biggest worry though is what is happening behind the scenes. Our Federal law enforcement is corrupt. So now there is no checks and balance. Go check documentaries: “The Plot Against the President” – https://www.amazon.com/gp/video/detail/B08LMJ93LL/ref=atv_dp_share_cu_r and “The Swamp” – https://www.amazon.com/gp/video/detail/B08F3V3KPC/ref=atv_dp_share_cu_r . And then the last documentary I suggest is HBO’s “The Perfect Weapon” – https://www.hbo.com/documentaries/the-perfect-weapon and you will see we are all ponds in a game played by those in power.
This election is a no win for any United States citizen.
This election is a no win for any United States citizen.
When was the last one that was? Bobby Kennedy, maybe, and they blew his brains out.
True… but even Bobby was part of the good ol boy club. His problem was he made to many waves trying to clean up the mob.
there were some very good guys back in that day; RFK, or, my favorite, Frank Church, both guys, by the way who never put a dime’s worth of credit into what the FBI and CIA had to say, unlike the modern party.
Hey Angry, check out Colorado On thus list:
https://politics.theonion.com/the-onions-state-by-state-election-guide-1845511152/slides/38
What about it?
Looks like MI should go blue. They’re saying Detroit is out in droves, and four years ago they didn’t get out at all (Trump barely won). 18,000 people registered in Detroit today alone.
Pretty disturbing how many times I’ve heard tonight the US called a Democracy, when we’re a Republic.
So far things are looking good for Trump.
Haven’t heard a good explanation how they’re calling States when mail in votes haven’t/can’t yet be counted.
https://www.ap.org/en-us/topics/politics/elections/how-we-call-races
The AP is going to be pretty cautious this year in calling states that are close.
This is also a fun guide to look at.
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/11/03/us/elections/forecast-president.html?action=click&pgtype=Article&state=default®ion=TOP_BANNER&context=storyline_menu_recirc
Florida was counting from the start of the mail in. Just couldn’t release it until the polls closed.
He’s getting absolutely crushed in Ohio. He can’t afford to lose that state.
Isn’t it like 20% of the vote and all the cities?
Down by 10% in Ohio with 54% reporting.
Down 4% in NC with 74% reporting.
Down 2.3% in TX with 53% reporting.
It doesn’t matter if he flips VA. He is in serious trouble.
Doesn’t matter % but where they’re located. If it’s all city votes…
I am happy that VA is flipping. Looking at the Newport News/Hampton/Norfolk region (a traditional Democrat stronghold), it’s lean Democrat, which is traditionally a Democrat stronghold. I am happy that these working class people are starting to wake up and realize that the Democrats are gutting the region.
Watching the vote totals come in is like watching a game and then you can see the expected chance of winning %.
Polls and 538 showing how biased they are. All the surprises and expected surprises thus far have been in Trump’s favor.
Like what?
Not seeing any surprises yet.
Florida is the big one. Polls also favored Biden in NC.
NYT showing FL, GA, and NC all going Trump.
Weird I had trump winning fl and a toss up in nc. Only surprise for me is MI.
And MI is only 20% in
Come on guys, I expected more arguing!
Parsnips are better than carrots because they’re fancier!
Sweet potatoes are a better source of vitamin A than carrots!
Lol, thems fighting words. I can’t stand sweet potatoes. Never had parsnips though
Sweet potatoes do suck.
What on earth. Sweet potatoes are incredible. Try making baked fries with them. Caramelize and get so good.
I’ve tried that and its still not working for me. Its the texture and flavor. Its like it can’t decide what it wants to be. Fries? Ok eat with burgers. Baked w/ brown sugar and marshmallow cream on them? Ok that’s dessert. And the same basic flavor is there in both.
That’s what’s great about them. They’re versatile.
Fries with some kind of sauce with a bit of kick (like chipotle mayo)
Baked with butter, salt, and cinnamon (optional pecans)
Baked and topped with pulled pork and BBQ sauce
Hickenlooper winning is an exception defeating an incumbent. By and large, the Senate = if you once get elected – it’s a lifetime position.
Wake county NC only 15% of votes in and huge dem area.
I’m just going off the NYT saying Trump’s chance of winning NC is >95%. I trust them to not be biased in his favor :)
Maybe those wake figures are old. Or the nyt methodology sucks
NYT site says Wake is 83% in.
I think NC has to count mail in votes as well…from memory. I’m on my phone hate looking things up on this thing
Graham projected to keep his seat in SC. Dems spent almost 100 million on that race, oof.
trying to take Graham out was a vanity project.
Looks like CO and AZ are going to flip senate seats.
They lose one to…Tommy Tuberville. Lol
I’d have to think the Susan Collins race gets closer. She’s the worst…
If Tommy Tuberville can get elected to the Senate, just imagine the places Gus Malzahn and Luke Fickell could go!
Just think what Gary Anderson could do in Utah.
The polling industry is officially dead.
2016 made them look like morons. This election is on pace to make them look even worse than that.
They over-sample Democrats by 5+% every time to get the results they want in order to influence people’s actions.
When everything gets politicized, we all lose.
Frank Luntz talked about it. and other pollsters said how hard it is to get people to answer surveys. They said it was about a 2% response rate which means it’s hard to get a good representative sample of likely voters. Especially at the state levels.
From what I saw they under sampled and also didn’t categorize people into categories like “actually a registered voter”…many of the polls are sub 800 people, and you need about 15,000 to get a statistically significant sample. But they take 800 then extrapolate. Really poor methodology.
Yeah, some pundits just said Trump tripled his margin of victory in Florida over 2016. WTF? Wasn’t it a Biden lean just a couple of days ago?
The polling industry may need to go away forever.
I was surveyed by Pew Research earlier this summer. It was a mail survey, necessarily, since I don’t answer the phone. Just to give you an idea of the dynamic, I caught up with the mailman who delivered it to see if everyone in the neighborhood got that mailer, or just me. My point: I was immediately suspicious that if everyone got one it was some kind was a scam of some sort. Even then, I thought long and hard before filling it out.
Ohio seems misleading. Many of the rural counties are 90%+ counted, and all the blue counties are only 50 to 70% counted.
LOL the QAnon lady from Georgia is headed to Congress. Not a good sign for Biden. Or America.
As anyone heard of this Trafalgar polling group? Supposedly their methods are somewhat of a mystery, but they predicted the first Trump victory and they are adamant he is going to win tonight. I guess one of their theories is that Trump voters won’t admit to pollsters that they are voting for him and Trafalgar ask the right questions to account for this? In 2016 they got the electoral count exactly right (though a couple of states were off). Hard to know what they are doing if they won’t show their methodology.
They just mentioned that on Fox. Their poll was by far the most accurate to what Florida is at. Seems they are the most trusted.
Not saying it looks good for Biden, but also don’t think the maps are accurate. Like all around Cleveland is only 74% counted. Toledo 55% counted. Dayton 81%. So Ohio looks bad, but the high density areas have a ton of votes left. Same issues in MI and WI.
We won’t get a winner tonight.
It’s going to come down to either PA or WI+MI. Friday is likely the earliest we’ll know, could be longer if it comes down to PA.
Can’t wait for the electoral college tie.
Biden flipped Arizona. Was that predicted? I think you’re right, we are not getting a winner tonight.
Is AZ official?
As I understand yes, 8% lead with 75% of the count in for Arizona.
%s don’t matter unless we know the Counties/populations. Where did you see it as official?
I had to go back through my tabs. Fox of all places, but not AP yet so maybe not official?
I thought Arizona gave a verbal to trump. Kids these days just can’t keep a commitment.
If official yeah big flip.
They retracted it. 900000 votes still to tally.
Shrooms for everyone!!!
Been there, done that 30 some years ago.
There have been enough shrooms for everyone for millennia if you know where to look and what you are looking for.
Some huge metro areas still not counted. This might be the “red mirage”? Not sure. But this will definitely get closer. AZ a big flip if official (the math in the AZ rural counties looks bad for Trump – not much meat on the bones given what he’s down, so I get why Fox called it).
Might come down to PA as everyone thought. If that happens, I think Biden gets PA.
One pundit is saying PA won’t matter if Trump wins IA, Mich, Wisc, Georgia, and NC, which he is apparently leading in all. I don’t know the math off the top of my head, but supposedly that gets him over 270. Vegas books have Trump 60-40. The day started with Biden 65-35.
That’s probably true, but all of those States have huge urban centers not yet counted. IA I think is Trump. Georgia likely Trump. The rest are going to get closer before decided, I think.
Georgia just announced they had a problem with their counts and will be updating them in the morning. But no word on what the problem is. Strange.
“Too many Biden votes from black peoples – we have a problem!”
I think they said Dekalb county which is Atlanta. But don’t hold me to that.
Just making a joke…
Burst pipe at the counting facility, reportedly.
Stock market crash tomorrow?
Futures up.
Nasdaq futures up big.
https://www.bloomberg.com/markets/stocks/futures
Sounds like decriminalizing crack/cocaine/meth/heroine has happened in oregon. That and magic mushrooms are now considered medicinal. Far out…
Good night ABs
We passed raising property tax….
Calirado here we come.
Cali has relatively low property tax.
Virginia just subtracted 100k votes from Biden because of a miscalculation. Thats a big miscalculation.
Just looking at some basic math, Biden has lost PA. About 40% left to count in metro areas, but those population centers are about 1.8 million people total. That comes to about 700k, and Trump has a 700k lead. Just not seeing it.
I’m more pissed about CO raising property tax. Might have to move.
Ever been to Bozeman or Rapid City?
Yeah. Both have blown up recently.
Also, with respect to PA, Trump is doing very well in Bucks and Chester. He is also closing the gap in Allegheny, which is big because that county has 1.2 million. If he can get to 45% in Allegheny, and maintain margins in Philly suburbs, I think he’ll get PA.
Seems like Wisconsin is becoming problematic for Biden. Trump is up over 4% with 90% of the vote in. On the other hand, Georgia is tightening up.
Milwaukee has most of the remaining votes I was thinking that should go Biden.
Greater Idaho measures seem to be passing in the counties where it was on the ballot.
Looking like a Biden victory with remaining votes being mail-ins, but it will be very close. Trump’s remaining hope is to do better than expected on absentee ballots in PA or MI+WI.
Yeah, what do you handicap it at… I’m thinking Biden +150 right now. Wonder if that banker that put down the 5 mil on Trump hedged? Could have bought similar odds on Biden last night.
If Biden does win, Trump is going to try to steal it in the courts. (Remember, he accused people of stealing the election, which means that’s what he plans to do. Anything Trump accuses others is what’s on his evil genius mind).
I wonder how the gambling sites handle that.
Yeah Trump had good foresight on this one in order to lay the groundwork of doubt. Dictator level thinking.
Sow seeds of doubt. Dictator 101 stuff.
My mom wrote me upset this morning…convinced we just got socialism, and said everyone who lived through socialism voted Trump. I was like, didn’t everyone who lived through Fascism vote Biden? Plus if (R) get the Senate there’s no chance of socialism. It’s sad we’re voting for these two extremes and these two incompetent people. Everyone loses in all scenarios.
I’d like to move out of the U.S., if anyone has some good ideas where to start looking. Looking for low taxes and great music.
As of last year, fixer-uppers in remote Italian villas were extremely cheap. Like $1.
Good music, good food, no idea what taxes are like though.
https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/italy-one-euro-homes-roundup/index.html
Italy is pretty debt riddled aren’t they? Yeah interesting how Venezuelans and Cubans vote right and Central Americans vote left. Also interesting how the Republicans have carved out special exceptions for Cubans and really catered to them. Solid political maneuvering. I think Trump did well to sell the election as a referendum on Socialism even though he himself is one.
Italy is debt ridden, yes.
I remember looking into those $1 homes at one point, and I think they had huge property tax associated and other conditions like you have to fix them up (many needed like 200k of work). Just from memory but I think it’s something like that that’s the issue.
Detroit did something similar after 2008.
The Middle East and Latin America are your best bets for low taxes
Why is the stock market up? This is about the nastiest outcome possible.
Only thing that makes sense is shorts covering/technical bounce.
Senate looking slight R, Dems taking house means likely stimulus can get through but unlikely regulation can. My guess at least
Why would the Senate approve stimulus in that scenario?
Georgia is going to have a run off vote for Senate, so that has to be factored in, too, especially if Collins loses main. Senate will be on the line.
This is all uber bearish for the next two months.
I mean if Trump is president Republicans will fall in line. If Biden is president maybe stimulus becomes trickier but I think they could probably still pick off a R or two in the Senate with a classic piece of DC pork. Spending money will never go out of fashion. Plus the only real difference from where the negotiations left off was like 200 billion for state and local government, right?
Do you see a reason, given this will play out months, to go out and buy stocks almost +4% on the Nasdaq?
It’s a great day to sell, and that’s what I’m doing.
Not especially. I mean it is so tough to know because by all metrics stuff is crazy overvalued but there is a lot of risk in holding cash because of the potential for future inflation.
I agree cash is trash, but this seems like the worst time to deploy it.
I guess I will just continue to sell anything I don’t love into the strength.
Wait so as I see it Biden gets 270 if he wins Nevada, Michigan and Wisconsin which are all leaning that way. Seems like the +150 might have been an underestimation
That’s correct. Pennsyvania/NC/GA would be moot if those 3 states hold through their remaining counting.
Mich amd Wisconsin are about 95% complete and Nevada has a ways to go. Arizona is taking forever to get their final push counted too.
Hard to believe how this race may come down to those small congressional districts in Maine/Nebraska.
Yeah if the totals right now hold, Biden wins at 270 and likely +3-4M in popular vote. Georgia looks to be extremely close. Similar situation to WI, MI and PA. Large vote totals still coming in from the big metro areas. ATL going big for Biden.
Think it would be 271 actually.
I think Maine is split 3 Biden/1 Trump, which is causing the 270 scenario to come up. But i could be wrong. Still a ways to go with these late counts and then of course the ensuing court challenges.
Worst case scenario for the country was not having a landslide for either candidate. Now we get to be rolled through the muck for days/weeks.
Wish the media and candidates were a calming presence.
He needs Maine and AZ, too. Best path. He can loose PA and everything else with that scenario. Looks likely given the remaining votes are mail in/metro areas.
Trump may be able to pick off one vote from Maine.
For AZ, I think only ABC hasn’t called it yet. ABC has been extra cautious calling races. But Fox called AZ super early and got a lot of heat from the Trump campaign.
Reuters hasn’t, either, and they’ve been spot on and seem to get the data fastest.
Fox News already called one Maine district and AZ for Biden. Fox News is actually pretty solid on this stuff IMO.
Stocks are up because it’s looking more clearly like a Biden victory rather than the “contested election” scenario. Vote counts aren’t going to take as long as some feared, and no one is taking Trump seriously about contesting the election.
I see. I think Trump is going to contest, use the courts, and demand recounts everywhere he can. But if not then the stock move makes more sense.
I have to say, as a moderate I like where things are headed. If Biden wins, we can have some peace, quite, and diplomacy at the top, and then I’d hope the Republicans hold the senate to keep Biden in check. Could be good. If somehow Trump pulls it out, need the Senate to go blue to keep him in check.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bII8AH5t6zI
That was pretty good!
I hope the Senate approves judicial nominations assuming they are apolitical types with solid backgrounds. Holding seats open for judges that are consistently rated on the far right of the spectrum is bad for all Americans… well maybe not attorneys.
Those 6 people who downvoted me for saying there’s no way he wins the popular vote owe me $100 each! Pay up. Donation button under the menu.
Yeah, that one was a no-brainer. I mean, Hillary Clinton won the popular vote BEFORE we knew everything about Trump.
I think people get caught up in their bubble. They see the signs in their hood and the enthusiasm on the sites they visit. Creates confirmation bias. Haven’t heard from my (R) friend who said red wave, yet. That guy has become absolutely nuts lately on FB, but I made a “no delete friends over politics” policy. Maybe I can justify deleting him because he’s now nuts…
I made a “no friends on FB period” policy. I don’t know how people have time to keep up with that stuff.
I spent ~5 minutes on it just to see what’s up. Morbid curiosity.
It’s better than Twitter as a gauge of what’s going on out there. At least when I see people on FB saying political stuff, they’re people I know and I’m reminded that they’re still people and deserve respect, even if political stuff makes them a little nuts.
Twitter is just bots and ridiculous people hiding behind anonymity.
Anyone watch Trump’s speech last night claiming the election is a fraud, he has already won, and states need to stop counting votes? So predictable. I’m not a huge fan of Biden, but Trump is causing serious damage to this country’s democratic process. It’s going to take a long time to heal, but it will heal a lot faster without Trump. I fear if he wins, his ego will become so yuuge it’s going to suck the life out of this country like a black hole.
Yeah if he wins someone will need to follow up in 4 years and make America great again.
Yeah these were the real problems. It’s unfortunate because if he were sane and not carrying the ego issues he could have been decent. It’s a chicken and egg thing, though, because if he weren’t this way he might not have appealed to that base.
I feel exactly the same as you about Biden. Last night when I saw him take the lead in WI and MI I actually got nervous…lol. Like, “Do I really want this guy???”, and then I remembered the Senate will keep him in check.
Nuc, I’m curious what you think of what’s going on. You said Trump’s base got smaller. I replied with, “I think you’re missing what’s going on with the Right. Read ZeroHedge sometime. Millions of young people love the current “alt-Right” and fascism.”
It appears his base got much larger. Looks like he gained 4 million (and counting) more votes.
Sorry missed this one. Stress has done a number on my health the last 24 hours. Honest answer is I have no clue. I would love to see demographic breakdowns on this race cause it makes no sense based on polling of any kind. Even the most conservative sources like Trafalgar group don’t come up with data that explains this. It looks like the popular vote difference is 3.5 million or so which is only 500k more than Hilliary. If you told me the amount of votes went up 12 million I would expect something like an 8 million popular vote lead for Biden.
Exit polling is showing big rises in Latino, Asian and Indian voting for Trump and it hints to socialism scare tactics mostly. Data is wrong, I was wrong, I am confused.
Cool, thanks.
So I think I spoke too soon about not having much to worry about regarding contested votes. WI is just about done counting and will definitely have a recount. MI and PA could be heading there, as well. Those were the three most pivotal states.
Recounts are always messy because the fact is, our voting process always has issues, they just don’t matter unless the results are close.
Yep. Buy stonks!
Tommy Tuberville should make for some good entertainment… or should this go in the sports thread? Lol
The funny thing is, a candidate, he represented exactly what he did as a coach: an unexciting, safe choice. The R’s didn’t need anyone dynamic to beat Jones, just someone that wasn’t Roy Moore-levels of crazy.
Yeah, Roy Moore was a terrible candidate. But I still think Tuberville will be good for a rah rah senate speech or two.
AZ is definitely not a done deal. Not sure why several sites called it so early. Still at 86% counted.
Trump would need about 58+% of the remaining votes to get back to a tie or take the lead. I have no idea what areas are remaining to be counted, but if they’re rural it will trend that direction.
Curious why they were able to make so much progress counting yesterday, and then today it seems to be sticking at about 86%?
I assume Fox factored in what was counted and what was left to be counted but projections have been wrong in the past.
I think they’re stuck because the rest are mail in/absentee ballots, though I’m not sure. Also overseas and veteran ballots can come in through next week.
AZ has a lot of blue areas left with an average of low 80%s in, and the red areas left are not as populated. Likely why it was called.
Sounds like Trumps team is more confident in their numbers than the polling reports for AZ. Trump is going to be such a sore loser (I voted for him so I can say that). No matter who ends up being named president, this is going to be controversial for a long, long time. Good thing PAC12 football will be back! (Heard Wilner on the radio this morning picking the trees over the quacks).
I picked Stanford in the pool…seems like a good bet.
Trump is going to be such a sore loser
Narcissism…plus Republicans are more “disagreeable” people on all psychological scales. It’s why I think Trump wins in the courts. Dems will be derp derp derp and try to intellectualize it.
Reuters has now taken AZ away.
The whole calling races early thing is so annoying. It doesn’t mean much more than a media site saying “first!”
Is it similar to the crystal ball on 247???
electoral tie still possible!!
Assuming nothing changes in WI, MI and PA. Then if AZ and NV flip to Trump and GA goes to Biden. It’s a tie!
Do you ever get the feeling that we’re all just getting played?
It’s the deep state and qanon working together
This would be kind of cool. We would likely end up with Biden and a Republican VP because the Senate chooses VP.
Move Oregon Border measure passes in Union and Jefferson counties. That would be something if that happened. Two counties that don’t physically border Idaho are now part of Idaho. States within other states!
Too bad it’s not even close to realistic.
It hasn’t held back Swaziland!
How did the corresponding Idaho measures to take receipt of Oregon counties fare?
CNN called WI for Biden.
Looks like AP has called Wisconsin for Biden now, but it’s likely to land in recount territory when all is said and done, which could lead into November.
GA I’m calculating that Trump needs to maintain about 42% of the remaining votes to stay tied or better.
AZ he would need a much higher percentage, around 58%
Michigan has about 96% counted with Biden leading by about 0.86% and growing.
In PA, Trump will need about 43% of the remaining vote to maintain a tie or better.
Trends are favoring Biden at this point, but we’re talking about potential recounts in AZ, MI, WI, GA, PA. (I dont know the recount rules for each state)
What a mess
GA will likely not go to a recount because it has to be within .5% Trump has a pretty strong margin there.
PA has to be within .5%, which looks possible based on where things currently sit and which votes have yet to be counted. Voters can also petition for a recount if they have evidence of fraud to support the request.
WI has to be within 1%, so a recount is likely. The recount in 2016 only changed ~100 votes.
If counting stopped at this moment, Biden would be at 270 and win. So Trump’s only path to winning the electoral vote would be to keep counting and hope for a reversal in trends and/or pursue recounts wherever possible and hope for some court battles to rule in his favor. The whole “stop counting” argument hurts him at this point. And it isn’t within state laws anyway.
Didn’t he try the stop counting argument last night when he was winning Michigan and Wisconsin? I’m sure he wants them to keep counting though in AZ and NV.
His whole rant last night was desperate and contradictory. He said the election is a fraud, but he already won. So he’s saying he won a fraudulent election, with millions of votes yet to be counted, but he wants the counting to stop even though he was behind at that point. Huh?
I can’t say I blame him for attempting to pursue every possible avenue he can. Margins are pretty small and there’s alot at stake.
Math isn’t on his side, but the courts are the wildcard
I agree to an extent, but how is it strategic to try to win an election by claiming it’s fraudulent? It would call into question the entire system including votes for himself. Unless of course he’s claiming that only votes for Biden are fraudulent.
It’s a weak argument. Biden should file some counter-suits claiming similar things against Republicans so the courts have to consider both. Dems are never cut throat enough, though, to do something like this.
Apparently he wants to stop counts until they have access to see the count process then the count would continue … He’s says by law that is required… I don’t know if any of that is true, if it is, he has a point… on the other hand, I don’t feel comfortable with them “watching” seems odd… I don’t trust any part of this election for any side
I thought I read these facilities are already under surveilance by campaign officials as well as video surveilance. Does he want to personally see the counting efforts?
I guess Jeffrey Epstein’s prison cell was under surveilance too, and we all know how that worked out for him, sortof.
I guess they are letting them observe from 25ft away and no closer… Which with a paper ballot would be hard to monitor from that distance… who knows, this was a s#!% show from the beginning… I don’t really care who wins at this point… so much money spent on two people who are rich and make decisions that they don’t have to live by
Stopping “counts” is very different than stopping “recounts.” I thought when Gore wanted a FLA recount, it was stopped because he only wanted certain areas re-counted where he thought D ballots might be lost/misplaced, etc. rather than re-counting the whole state. Stopping a recount of that nature is appropriate in my view. But stopping vote counts?!? That’s not democratic.
“… but how is it strategic to try to win an election by claiming it’s fraudulent?” Spot on and Classic Trump.
Thats exactly right, obj
Democrats lost big time in this election cycle. They spent close to $200 million to flip the McConnell, Graham and Tillis Senate seats. They lost the first two seats by a combined 35%. The Senate is very likely to stay in GOP control, and the GOP gained seats in the House. This does not bode well for the policy proposals the Biden campaign has been pushing for. Even worst, it is now apparent that the DNC represents the interests of the academic elite and Wall Street.
The DNC will have a very tough showing in 2022 because donors will be reluctant to give to ActBlue.
Tough to disagree but without Trump in power can the GOP get the non-Republican Trump cultists to show up? Trump by all evidence has helped the GOP a ton down ballot… possible at the expense of future races.
Trump will just run in 2024. Likely after he starts a Trump [fake] news network that riles up people even more. He is charismatic and manipulative enough to have success with this route. The big question is if people will fall for it harder or wake up to his game in those four years. My guess is the former and he’d be tough in ’24.
Trump’s cognitive decline by 2024 will prevent him from running.
That and can he stay out of jail without the DOJ protecting him.
The GOP can learn from their brief marriage to Trump. They don’t have to stray too far from the Trump policy playbook, and can probably win in 2024 with the same message, different spokesman. Unless you think the QAnon/Proud Boys group are really a substantial voting bloc…
I don’t think they are super substantial but I feel like core Republicans are gonna vote no matter what and Trump was so successful based on turning out people that wouldn’t usually vote. I don’t claim to know how the next 4 years will go though.
Conservative democrats and non-Trump republicans can’t stand Nancy Pelosi (especially) and Charles Schumer – they represent the ‘coastal ellites.’ The repubs favorite tactic in Montana is pasting Schumer/Pelosi labels on all democrat candidates. In this election cycle, two splendid candidates were tainted first thing with being Pelosi/Schumer puppets (nothing could have been more untrue). They lost.
elites
To Chuck the mouth:
“I guess they are letting them observe from 25ft away and no closer.” Not as bad as DT saying observers had to stay outside and peer through the windows. However, if the news report on this is true – the court-ordered rule for observers went to 6 feet away, down from 8 feet. I forget which state.
I have watched more of CNN than I want to and have concluded that its female journalists are big-time consumers of false eyelashes.
MI has got to be close to being called. Looks like Nevada might be the decider?
Agreed. The difference in Wayne county is way too much for Trump to make up with the remaining votes.
Wonder why they havent called MI. 99% clunted with more than 1% lead
Counted.
And now they’re calling it. So Nevada is the biggest question mark with most remaining counting happening in Clark County which leans heavily towards Biden
At this point NV seems more likely to go Biden than AZ. Think they called AZ too early but certainly a Biden win seems the most probable outcome
The math certainly leans that way.
Trump’s behavior on Twitter…yikes.
Seriously disturbing. Really not helping my head cold with so much all caps.
Can you answer my question to you above?
You know who’s having a bad day?
This guy. One day a police chief and candidate for WA gov and the next an unemployed man.
https://mynorthwest.com/2287165/republic-police-chief-loren-culp-loses-job/
Not even a plaque? I thought Republicans didn’t believe in participation trophies?
The polling is insane. Beav in OH has touch on it but there are states that are 8-20% off any poll. Ohio was one of the most polled states in October and the most red poll was +4% and the final is +8% Trump? Collins hasn’t been better than +2% since September and she wins by +9%? Ernst wins by +8% despite polls having her +/- 2 for months. Is it just an impossible trump factor? The 2018 polls were pretty solid. If you had told me turnout is 141 million the data says trump loses in a landslide and senate goes 52-48 blue.
Why bother making polls If your error bars are 10%. You do that on a research paper and you never get funding again.
Yeah be interesting to see how much is the Trump effect and how much is just the sampling methodology. I think there will always be a need and desire for polls but people will just take them with a larger grain of salt going forward.
Polls will be used for confirmation bias. That’s it.
Two big issues with the polls. Getting a good sample and weighting it accurately. If one or the other is off, the poll will be off a good margin. The Trump campaign did a good job in throwing off the weighting by getting new and non regular voters to turn out disproportionately. The sample issue is more of a societal thing vs a Trump thing. People are harder to contact, people don’t have the attention span to do a poll and are a little more private with their opinions.
The polls seemed to be pretty good up until Trump came along. There has to be something to a Trump factor, but these guys are getting senate races wrong left and right.
It’s what I tried explaining above….read a site like Zerohedge and you see rabid young people. For whatever reason they’re not showing up in the polls. A lot of Mexicans like Trump, too…especially ones who came legally. They HATE illegals, even if they’re also Mexicans. I don’t think things like that are factored into polls. Many polls are using a sample size of sub 1k, and you need about 15k sample to get a statistically meaningful sample.
If you read Zerohedge; what are your thought on sites like Godlike?
I’ve never heard of that site or read it. Might look tonight because now I’m curious.
How were the polls during andrew jacksons years?
The polls in 2016 genuinely missed at being able to effectuate a reconstruction of public opinion. But for 2020 the polls served a different function; they weren’t intended to reflect public opinion but shape it.
Listening to Biden’s speech…he sounds humble, well-balanced, and Presidential.
And in two years he will be stepping down for health reasons! I find it fascinating that everyone is ignoring his cognitive decline. These aren’t just Uncle Joe “gaffes”. I think I’m fairly qualified to make the observation having been an Alzheimer’s caregiver for eight years. Is everyone going to act surprised when that announcement comes and Harris takes over? Or does anybody care? I get that Trump is exhausting and needs to go, but this feels sort of conspiratorial too.
Maybe they can drag it out the four full years? It’s just weird, there have to be doctors who are seeing this, but it seems to be a taboo subject. Reagan had it too and sort of beat the clock, but if a steeper decline had hit a couple of years earlier I wonder what would have happened? Much different times.
My guess is the midterms will determine his next move. If Dems get spanked in the midterms, I think he steps down.
That’s an interesting observation. I think it’s 50/50 that in two years he knows what a mid-term is!
Imagine when Biden has to talk to Putin about negotiating anti-ballistic missile defense, or Xi Jinping about Chinese ships surrounding Taiwan.
Now imagine Kamala Harris doing that.
My guess is that he won’t be part of any high-level discussions in the near future. When his access to the press starts declining then the speculation will start. If he has Alzhemeier’s the chaos of press conferences will be overwhelming for him and it will show in his speech and mannerisms. It’s already popped up on occasion with his odd responses and behavior to off the cuff type questions during the campaign.
He will do exactly what xi wants him to do. If he wins.
Is he applying for Chinese patents, too? Or is it the hotels he’s trying to get approval for in china?
You honestly think you’re the only one who seed this? The Dems haven’t pulled the wool over the eyes of 72 million people. Of course they see the same thing you see, but that shows you how desperate this country is. We would rather have a senile old man as President than a narcissistic fascist.
what has Trump done that proves he is a fascist?
He is literally trying to stop the democratic process because it is not benefiting him.
Stop the count, stop the count …
I was going to write the same thing…thanks, Dooz.
I still think it’s a sad and depressing commentary that this is the best both political parties can come up with, it’s truly reached its nadir.
I find it interesting people are ignoring trumps paranoia.
Is narcissism a mental health condition? If so Trump seems to be the poster boy. Biden, unfortunately, is likely in the beginning stages of a disease that will take his life. I think dementia mortality clocks in at around 250k per year in the US.
and well rested. he’ll have an 8 hour work week once in office.
8 hours per week would still be more work than the current duffer-in-chief puts in on an average 7 days.
If he wins, hope they have a four year plan, he’s not the guy to go for two terms.
Anyone think Trump Jr. will run?
I went for a good hike and did some fishing today. Was a nice break from politics…
That’s time well spent.
He has signaled a few times that he is only seeking one term.
This is a good take. This is what I was trying to describe to Nuc above…to think this is going away is wrong.
This is a stupid take. Almost every Trump supporter I know voted for him because they know Biden is a warmonger, and Trump’s tax plans resulted in larger refunds from the IRS. About half of these supporters I know are OSU students right now.
If that’s racist and xenophobic, America is more screwed than any of us can comprehend. We’re finished as a country.
Read zh and listen to Danny bongino. Then get back to me on that take. Your osu friends aren’t representative of that base.
My daughter is an osu student right now and literally no one she knows supports trump…so where does that leave us?
Wait are you not in Oregon? I don’t know anyone that was helped by the Trump tax plan here, but everyone I know is middle income Oregonians
It’s looking to me that Biden is going to get Georgia and this whole event will be over over after that
Depends how many of those metro votes go blue. He needs about 72% of them. So, still a ways to go.
That’s true, but based on what’s left it looks like the odds are Biden.
Similarly Arizona looks like it’s gonna go trump.
Pennsylvania will be Biden as well.
Where/how does Trump get Arizona?
Just based on the votes left to be counted. I think trump wins the demographics left to be counted by enough to overtake the lead… just a hunch.
Similar situations in Pennsylvania and Georgia. I think Biden wins both of those states based on the locations and ballets left to count
But most of them are in Phoenix, which likely leans blue.
Yikes.
https://twitter.com/search?q=Detroit&src=trend_click&pt=1324086177885003778&vertical=trends
https://twitter.com/BrodyLogan/status/1324099928667291648?s=20
He likes him some BBQ…
The shirt really makes it.
President Camacho is a fan of muscle shirts too
Good grief. Doomed.
Pretty good overview of whats left in counting and where states stand.
https://www.usnews.com/news/top-news/articles/2020-11-04/which-us-states-are-still-counting-votes-and-when-will-they-be-done
Wow, hadn’t checked in on the GA race in awhile. Now it’s a closer race percentage wise than NV. Margin is only 23k(0.5%) with about 5% of the vote count remaining. With that rate of gain, Biden could potentially take the lead and even get past the margin for a recount in that state, especially if the majority of remaining count comes from Cobb and Dekalb counties and are mail in ballots.
If this is happening then stopping the counting is not a bad idea. Surely not a “fascist” move as someone here has stated. This should and will be going to the courts to get cleaned up, as it should be. If Biden wins fairly, so be it. But if this is true, and it does look like a coordinated effort, then clean it up and lets count all the ballots that are truely cast by citizens.
https://amgreatness.com/2020/11/04/game-on-for-the-coup/
This an opinion piece with no sourcing or evidence at all. It’s just some guy throwing a conspiracy theory into the internet void.
Current state of the Trump campaign:
MI and PA-“Stop the count!”
AZ- “Count that vote!”
GA – Stop counting!
NV – Keep counting!
Biden: just count all the votes
This is a cool project. They post a right, center and left story on topics.
http://www.allsides.com
Markets have declared Biden the winner. Green energy going crazy. Don’t think there is any chance of a carbon tax in the next 2 years though but I suppose there is stuff the executive branch can do to boost the sector somewhat.
2022 has some pretty at risk senators so I would expect another market boom 11/22 for green
I think it is the future personally and am big on it. My only real concern is energy is not typically a real big growth sector. These green energy companies are kind of half tech half traditional energy though so we’ll see.
I think the ones that do the best will be the ones that integrate home services and solar (Install solar, electrical, HVAC in one package) and the commercial companies that also work on grid stability initiatives.
Trump’s spiritual advisor claims “angelic reinforcement” has been dispatched from Africa and South America to insure Trump wins.
Is “The Wall“ high enough to keep the South American ones out? Are those from Africa not aware of “Birthers,” many of whom are likely armed? Perhaps policy exceptions are warranted in short term.
This further enforces the “bad take” from David Pakman above, regarding the Right relying on mythical and mystical thinking. I mostly see that on alt-right sites, but it does trickle into the acting, mainstream (R)s.
https://twitter.com/Timdoutre/status/1324299839140605953?s=20
I’m seeing 99% of Georgia in, so Trump held Georgia?
1% is approximately 50K votes remaining, if that figure is accurate.
And the T lead is about 14K. So making up that 14K seems likely, but the margins will be thin regardless of who ends up ahead at the end of counting.
PA is the most likely path to victory for either, but Biden still has a shot without PA if AZ and NV hold. So many thin margins, it’s ridiculous.
If Trump pulls it out though it will be a bigly landslide.
I think NV puts Biden at 270 making GA and PA moot points
Correct, but AZ and NV both are up in the air still. Without those he needs GA.
This is still not a lock as everyone is making it out to be. The assumption is the metro votes will go Biden’s way, but who knows.
It depends “who” found these final ballots.
Exactly how I view it. I don’t trust AZ being called so early. Fox/NPR/AP all called it over 24 hours ago, but since that time the margin has been shrinking towards T’s direction. There’s a reason other sites didnt feel comfortable calling it early.
Biden needs some combination of:
PA
or
Any 2 of AZ/NV/GA.
Outside of that, I dont think he has a path.
I’m not considering NC being in play, but I guess technically it is.
NV just announced their counting will take days to complete. We should get a better picture in NV tomorrow morning at 10:00.
What is all this conspiratorial bs “found”?
Latest “100%” count shows Trump winning GA, but well within the margin for a recount.
If trump Somehow wins getting to 270, it seems like since he is the current president he can more easily wade through and fend off the recounts and legal events. Maybe I’m off on that.
I think it will be harder for Biden since he doesn’t get all of that power until January.
Imagine if Biden wins exactly 270, and there is one faithless elector, which brings Biden down to 269.
I don’t follow politics closely in the US let alone internationally. Are the most messed up country in terms of elections or is it worst or about the same in another more developed countries?
All the countries with authoritarian regimes in charge have similar elections as what we are currently seeing here currently
This is…wait for it…”unprecedented” in an OECD country.
Which candidate do people think Jo Jorgenson pulled votes from? Seeing how she grabbed a little over 1% of the total vote in GA. Without her, this race would be over unless you think she pulled voted from both candidates 50/50
Considering how confused I am by the results I have no clue lol
Trump. I’ve been waiting for him to start railing on un-Patriotic conservatives for voting Libertarian and costing him the election.
I was looking at those Libertarian numbers and thinking the same thing…
That Libertarian is the equivalent of the Dem’s Bernie.
Which is hilarious because this was the weakest Lib campaign effort in years. Johnson at least had some experience and name recognition and they pushed really hard on the 5% debate threshold as a target in 2016.
This year? Almost no national attention and a ridiculous no-name ticket. In a year where the major party options were Trump and Biden.
Neither party wanted third party options so it makes sense. Most years third party is going to be pushed by one party or the other and they will get mysterious funding to that effect.
The Lib VP’s name is Spike Cohen and I can’t tell if he is even a serious candidate. Reads like he’s a Borat clone or something!
Lol I’ve never come across a third party truther. Do you have a source for this?
Here’s his Wikipedia page.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spike_Cohen
I was asking about Nuke’s claim that third parties are bankrolled by the major parties.
Georgia throws out Trump’s lawsuit, calls it “frivolous”, joining Michigan.
Biden is going to win. Trump was such a shitty president that he lost to Biden. Fucking Biden. Dude is barely alive and struggles to talk. One term Trump loses to Biden! He couldn’t get out of his own way in last few weeks and it cost him. I was on fence until 2 days to election despite really despising a lot of what Trump stands for because Biden is crap. Ultimately voted for Biden but voted R on rest of the ballot. Trump has only himself to blame but will never own up to it. I hope he goes to jail soon and pray Biden doesn’t fuck up too bad.
Both candidates need to go to jail.
Trump I get, but why Pence?
Accomplice
Biden should be in jail for simply standing there as Obama intentionally blew up 16 year old American citizen Abdulrahman al-Awlaki with a drone strike in October 2010.
“Guess he should have had a better father!”
Good thing Trump didn’t allow bounties on US soldiers. Of course soldiers are just losers once they die so they don’t really count as citizens.
Which is a lie, but keep repeating it all you want.
That comparison makes no sense. US soldiers coordinate with rebels in Syria to take out Russian forces. We have been doing that since the end of WW2, particularly in Kosovo. They do the same thing. That’s the nature of war.
Second, you’re completely ignoring the fact that a 16 year old innocent American was killed for absolutely no reason at the orders of the Obama Administration. There was nothing suggesting that Abdulrahman had any ties to his father’s organization. The fact that the government can deliberately kill an innocent child without due process is sickening.
Looking at Georgia again, almost all “red counties” have 99% reporting, whereas Savannah and Atlanta are at 87% and 95%.
Those percentages are expected vote via AP not actual ballot counts. Its almost impossible in georgia to source how many votes are left unless the secretary of state bothers. When the gap was 14.5k there was 47k votes left. Biden would need 77% of the remaining votes so the margin will probably end up Trump by 3-5k votes
Gap is now around 9.5k, but no clue what count remains. Crazy close. They already are looking at 2 separate senate runoff elections in GA. Such a perfectly divided state
It’s kind of great though, actually, your vote actually matters
42k remaining
All remaining votes to be counted by abacus, to really drag this thing out
WaPos exit polling. Looks like the under 30 lot had bad turnout AGAIN
https://www.washingtonpost.com/elections/interactive/2020/exit-polls/presidential-election-exit-polls/#fullresults-president
Every election it’s ‘going to be different’ and every election it’s apathy for the under 30s
Guess now that im over 30 I can stop defending the lazy kids!
This is a great time to be a conspiracy theorist. Money to be made out there.
Seen people confused about vote totals updating and that magically Biden takes the lead.
Sharpie-gate in Arizona.
Liberals saw Trump was going to win so they got in hundreds of thousand ballots to offset.
It’s not just domestic either. I have a bunch of Aussie relatives. They’re totally into that stuff and are following the US election really closely. They care about US politics more than Aussie. It’s bizarre
Update on votes that are left.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/elections/2020/11/05/trump-biden-election-live-updates/
Another interesting Tidbit. If Georgia candidate doesn’t get 50% of the vote they go to runoff. Right now its 49.9-47.7 and the trend line is away from Perdue. It looks like Georgia will stay the eye of the storm as they will be having a double run off vote which could determine owernship of the Senate.
I mentioned the senate issue yesterday up above.
Nuc, I approved your IP hopefully you don’t get those Spam checks again.
Thanks haha. NO bother really.
Trump going live. Watch him use executive order to name himself winner.
A desperate DT is concerning
He’s going to get banned from Twitter at the current pace, too. Every Tweet is flagged for misleading information.
The thing is every time he does this stuff he exposes weakness. So there’s that.
Georgia down to .1
Do you approve of large scale and organized voter fraud in multiple states by Democrats and democrat city precincts in order to defeat Trump?
Is anyone ok with illegal votes being counted as part of this election? Why is Trump the bad guy when he was warning about this large scale fraud all summer as one state after another changed their voting rules to make fraud easier?
Where is any evidence of fraud?
Once there is a legitimate source (not some random Twitter person saying it), than you have a point. Until that time you are whining. A
Dems forgot to rig the senate ballots.
Or the 2016 election.
Amazing they only rig states trump loses
There’s that mystical thinking again.
I would be happy to disapprove if someone could describe the “large scale fraud” or “illegal votes” as they apply to this election and provide proof. I mean, we have members of OECD from around the world who are watching our vote counting and vouch that there has been no fraudulent activity. I guess they could be part of the conspiracy also. So that essentially means everyone in the world except for Trump supporters are in on it. That’s next level shit, like better than Blacklist.
Both parties likely cheat I mean this was in the watergate depositions. It’s a tale old as time. I find it hilarious the implication the republicans ran a clean race.
Never mind, just keep reading NY Times and watching CNN for your democratic propaganda.
Don’t give me the Foxnews response because Fox was part of this charade and led the optics that Trump was never leading even though he was in the process of large margin victories in many swing states.
Never mind, I guess having more ballots than registered voters isn’t fraud. NC and multiple areas in WI
No reason to be concerned about 23,500 ballots all for Biden in one block of votes.
No concern for dead people voting in every major city.
Project Veritas has undercover video of a democrat operative explaining how they harvest ballots in MN and pay people for their votes. Dems filed 200 lawsuits throughout the summer to affect voting rules to shift advantages, through judges.
Are fraudulent polls voter suppression?
Are all ballots legitimate or only those who are registered?
State legislatures are in charge of state election laws but the PA supreme court changed the laws in late summer, preparing for the very fraud that is happening.
I think you guys are as guilty of confirmation bias as you accuse others of doing. Trump has had the entire media, political establishment, and Republican leadership arrayed against him for 4 years and now that the fix is in, you say he is a whiner? Trump is a street fighter and has no quit, he will continue to fight relentlessly. I know you guys are all pretty much in the same camp on this and just like to dismiss obvious concerns that truly threaten our entire system.
Just saying “..everybody does it” doesn’t. make cheating ok. If you are consistent, you would simply agree that legal votes should be counted and all invalid votes rejected. Don’t sidestep and claim Trump has been cheating without any proof. Democrats have been maneuvering for 4 years to attempt this. Do you know why observers are being kicked out of heavy democrat precincts in most of the battleground cities? To cover up the honest counting?
Dismissing any objection as internet conspiracy theories is cute but doesn’t actually speak to the real concern. Answer the original question. Do you approve of widespread organized voter fraud efforts? Is it ok to you for illegal votes to be counted?
Why is Biden ready to proclaim himself the victor when you say that is what Trump will do?
Beat part of your whole response is this. I’m not a internet troll person, rarely respond to anything I see but this is funny.
Don’t sidestep and claim Trump has been cheating without any proof. Democrats have been maneuvering for 4 years to attempt this. (Where’s your proof?).
Without evidence you are just chasing conspiracy to get the result you want. Here I’ll play.
How did texas end up with 15% fewer votes than expected despite record levels of registration and enthusiasm? People near the poll stations have reported vans full of shredded ballots being taken to nearby buildings with smoking chimneys and smoke stacks.
How did iowa come out 14% different than polling? Reports of militia calling people and intimidating them not to vote. Is it coincidence that a state fully controlled by the GoP and polled to be a close race was a blow out? I think not!
Then there’s ohio! A state that polled as high as 14% Biden and never more than 4% Trump went 9% trump? The counties that didn’t meet turnout expectations are ALL democrat and over 20 republican counties were over expectation. Sounds like ballot stuffing in the podunk shit fields and dumpsters full of biden votes in Cinicinatti and Cleveland! Why wasn’t there a mail in ballot surge in ohio but there was in all its neighbors? GOP controlled state corrupt to the core.
See it’s easy to make shit up that sounds convincing. I don’t believe any of that shit cause there is no evidence. The truth is not your emotions or something you saw other people say. Best of luck on your journey back to reality, I truly hope you find rationality and peace.
If there wasn’t any cheating then everyone should be ok with verifying every mail in ballot in the swing states correct? You know just to make sure.
Yes
Sure
Every ballot is verified after the fact. That’s not a new thing. Always has and always will
How about Arizona, is that cheating also?
Absolutely
How much proof and to what extent would actually convince you? Seeing that you’ve already dismissed the idea.
Literally any proof would be a place to start
I agree any proof would be a good idea to start.
No evidence dude.
So my parents are registered Republicans and they both got two ballots. This is literally the only hard proof I’ve ever seen of two. They sent me the photos. What’s amazing is they took this as proof the Democrats are rigging the election.
What’s great is blockchain is about to solve this issue, probably by next election.
Electronic voting through block chain may be the reasonable response to clear this election up in about a month. Who would howl the loudest at a true clean election with voter ID as the fundamental basis? It seems to em quite consistent that the dems would object vociferously because they are the side pushing for mail-in, motor voter, no signatures, no post-marks, no deadlines, early voting, earlier voting.
I think the further away from election day, ID matched registered voter, the more fraud can happen easily.And I’m pretty certain that dems don’t mind the opportunities afforded them to cheat.
We are seeing a breakdown of societal structure because integrity is no longer an American value.
I think I’m seeing it live in your posts. You don’t have a clue what democrats want. Democrats have been pushing for a system like Oregon’s for years. It offers no barriers for citizens who can get an ID, can fill out a ballot and sign the same way twice. What’s wrong with that?
Vote early and vote often I guess?
There are democrats embracing leftist/marxist ideology and there are democrats who don’t know they have been taken over by marxists. Which democrats are you speaking about? I know what the leftist democrats want because AOC has been screeching it for a few years and Pelosi is directing the ship that way: soft marxism and one party rule
Joe Biden is an empty suit and Harris is the most progressive member of the Senate, more left than Sanders. Biden agreed to a Sanders platform and Harris will be the one implementing it.
Not conspiracy, but fact
It’s possible to not stand for AOC or Trump, you know.
So you don’t know the difference between socialism and marxism.
Whatever dude, when Republicans stop gerrymandering, suppressing votes, voter intimidation, moving voting booths at the last minute, running buses off the road, and the worst (Jeb Bush handing his brother the election), you can start to act like it’s the party of saints. As they stand, you’re/they’re mystical hypocrites who can’t see your shit stinks. Sorry. One could make a good argument, going back to Watergate, that Dems had to play dirty to combat Republican tactics. Dems play dirty now, and it’s from what I’ve seen a reaction function. I’m assuming it’s at the point where both sides’ cheating evens out. I’m not naive enough to think one side isn’t cheating. Both cheat.
Again, blockchain in 2024 will show how the country really feels about all issues.
Cheating goes back further than Watergate for both parties, there are a shitload of books about the 1960 election.
Well, Trump did tell his supporters to “Vote twice!”….
Double ballots literally happen all the time. I could post a wall of articles about just from the last few months.
Here’s a good one.
Deceased cat receives ballot
https://apnews.com/fbcec393dc652a9ccdb2cc8aacb15895
Biden’s going to win Georgia.
Dems waiting to commit voter fraud in North Carolina. Guess it’s a backup plan.
Right… guess the dems weren’t smart enough to take back the senate or not lose house seats, but yeah totally committing fraud
How can anyone sane watch this and not see this is a cult? It almost makes me want to lean Democrat….almost.
Batshit crazy. Nothing even meaningfully related to politics or governance there…
Just watched your Paula White video. I had seen this mashup earlier today but didn’t have the context of where it came from. She actually keeps a beat decently.
https://youtu.be/vicHe-5qoYQ
Also, did you ever watch that Wild, Wild, Country doc about Rajneeshpuram? It’s pretty fascinating and there are quite a few similarities. Setting is 1980’s north/central Oregon. Several UofO alum played key roles in that saga.
Some more votes in. It looks like Biden is going to win PA, GA, AZ, and NV. Blowout. Good. I don’t like Harris, but Biden seems meh/fine/peace and quite for a few years. Seemed Presidential when speaking, which was super refreshing. Could help us from being an embarrassment. Personally would like to see the parties splitting their extreme left and right factions to form a more moderate center + blockchain voting. Let the lunatics cannibalize one another as the center/reasonable people decide policy.
The problem is that I don’t see Biden lasting too long and you said years. As I’ve said before, the nation is voting for Kamala Harris whether they understand it or not. It’s not like every family in the nation are dementia caregivers, so there seems to be a casual attitude about Joe. Those who have experienced it understand what we are seeing. It’s good days and bad days with Alzheimer’s and maybe Presidents get some kick-ass drugs we don’t know about! Look if Biden as a figurehead can calm down the nation that’s great, but I’m not on board with Harris. Probably doesn’t matter as we are most likely getting gridlock again anyway.
I find it interesting that the major networks are working hard to maintain a charade that there is no fraud anywhere, yet you say Trump has been cheating all along too, since both parties do this every election…
Every cyclist in the Tour De France is on dope.
Remember when people thought Lance Armstrong was a super human outlier? “He has one ball he’s aerodynamic!”…how’d that end?
Why then deny it? Why is there such an insistence of the purity of the system now yet 4 years ago, Russia, Russia Russia?
They never accepted the results of 2016. How is this election suddenly the most numerous, yet most accurate election in our US History?
When did I deny anything? Both sides cheat and have for a long time. As I said, for me both sides cheat, and since both sides have smart people cheating, I assume the cheating evens out and you get the will of the people in the end. No manual system is going to be perfect or cheat proof. Except…
As I said earlier, for me the “purity” is in blockchain. You can’t have fraud with a blockchain voting system.
I can only speak for myself, but I fully accepted the election. Hillary sucked.
The whole Russia Russia Russia thing wasn’t to say he isn’t a legit president. Russia used social media to push the independents his way…. does that mean he didn’t win, no. Is it healthy to have foreign governments help shift the future of our “free” country. No. It happened, but it doesn’t mean you can take it back. You learn and move forward. He has been for 4 years.
Great post Chris
I accepted the last election also. The outcome did not surprise me, because, as Chris said, Hillary sucked. I didn’t suspect any fraud from Republicans (btw, I am a registered Republican). It was obvious people were fed up with Dems. Now, after the last 4 years, people are fed up with Trump, so the current state of the election is not surprising either.
Angry, how you feeling of my prediction last night that Arizona was going to go trump and penn/Georgia we’re going blue?
I hadn’t seen that posted anywhere when I made that call, just had a strong hunch based on the remaining votes.
Just want to toot my own horn a bit. But you did not disagree, to your credit
I think all are going Biden but NC.
I said this when Hillary lost, I hope the dems realize what happenEd and get a strong candidate together. Then Biden shows up. Again. I hope both sides give us something we want to vote for in 2024.
The GOP seems to have some decent options that wouldn’t fracture the GOP like it did this year with the Dems.
Josh Hawley, Rand Paul, Nikki Haley, Mike Pence, and Ben Sasse is a solid group to choose from.
The candidates have sucked.
Rand Paul sucks, his dad was awesome though.
Pence would have mopped up this year honestly. He was so much better than trump during the debates. He just won’t have that cult following that trump has provided. Engagement would have dropped so far on the left, he would have easily skated to a win.
My theory is based off trump endorsing him this cycle and not running himself… purely hypothetical.
Left is going to have to promote Harris next cycle undoubtably. Not sure if that will be good or bad yet, time will tell
I’d never vote for Harris.
Dems will have a hard time getting my vote next cycle unless it’s Pete B or Beto. Only reason I went with them is Trump is a vile human.
God damn it, Yang, how many times do I have to beat this drum?
#YangGang
We are essentially a moderate country with huge liberal populations on the coasts. I’m concerned about the extremists on both sides. They are leftist protesters in Portland chanting “fuck Trump and Biden”. Wheeler was re-elected, but he’s not liberal enough and the protesters intimidated a leftist council member at his home for voting down a defund the police package because it didn’t have specifics he wanted to see. It will be interesting to see if the extremists fall away over time with the Biden presidency.
Huge alt-right populations in the south/interior that you’re missing.
These are the self-identification numbers:
Conservative 37%
Moderates 35%
Liberal 24%
Yeah I’d never vote for Rand Paul. So as a moderate I’d never even consider any of those people, so you’ll have to come up with better candidates for the middle to switch (R).
Romney is a (R) I’d vote for if the (D) was weak. I’ll try to think of more.
Whatever happened to Paul Ryan?
I used to think he was the up and coming R knight in shining armor, and then he disappeared
I think he retired to go make a fortune consulting. He was a total scumbag.
Wasn’t Paul Ryan a teabagger who sucked on the trump teat until trump dumped the teat sucker?
I agree completely. Harris at this point I wouldn’t have voted for.
Pete buttigeg is extremely smart and a great speaker.
I would likely vote Romney if he ran again, and undoubtedly I’d vote him over Harris. Pete B vs Romney would be great for the country, therfor we will never see it…
Yeah I’d love to see that. Would be a tough vote for all the right reasons.
Okay, Trump Jr calls for war in a Tweet.
https://imgur.com/a/H5FmRJg
And now this guy says, “We’re starting now to see the white in their eyes and we’re getting ready to start shooting.”
https://twitter.com/MeidasTouch/status/1324528644719480834
Again, I will post this great take on the psychology of the alt-right/Trumper, specifically relevant the belief they’re always at war.
Country needs deprogramming. So nice that I have to keep my family home for a few days since it’s not safe to be in any spaces where they could be shot.
That’s why I think it’s getting close to govt having to classify this as domestic terrorism. We wanted to take a walk last night, and we weren’t sure it was safe. So far people here are behaving well, but we’ll see once this goes final.
Pretty scary. I’m seeing it here and my wife is seeing it on Facebook. Anyone who disagrees with anything they say is labeled an enemy. If you have other opinions then your source is biased. If you are worried about domestic terrprists then you are defending antifa. Everyone but their source is wrong even if their own source is contradictory to previous actions and comments.
Trump loses so it must be fraud. No evidence then it’s a conspiracy to hide it. It’s like being wrong about any subject is an instant death sentence. I can already hear them reading this thinking that I can only say that cause Biden is winning and I’m part of the media conspiracy…weird since I havnt watched any media since the first debate and barely look at the news since it’s all been the same for 2 months. Of course no one can just think about stuff without being told how to think so…conspiracy? I don’t really have a point, it’s just disturbing.
Something nobody talks about is how Trump centric both of these fringe groups are.
Alt-right is passionately pro Trump and Antifa is passionately anti Trump.
Neither group seems to have strong feelings regarding Biden. I never see any pro or anti Biden rallies. I’ve never seen an antifa marching around promoting Biden, nor have I seen alt-right demonstrators marching around yelling anti Biden rhetoric.
So would having Trump out of the picture give both groups less reason to exist, or at least make them less vocal and less exposure?
In other words, do they go back to their day jobs, Trump isn’t able to somehow pull off a win in the electoral college?
NiceBeav, is ANTIFA anti-Trump or anti-fascist? I know there’s overlap, but it’s a distinction with a difference because in the latter case if Trump leaves they wouldn’t. From what I read they’re anti-fascist not anti-trump, though I’m sure seeing his fascist tendency is why they came to be.
Oh, i dont mean to say neither group existed before Trump, but in his tenure they have both been amplified. Sortof tit for tat. One side ratchets things up, then the other responds in this cycle of escalation.
So I guess my question is, does the de-escalation start if Trump isn’t in office? Or do we see more of the same?
Nuc,
Well it went hard Left the other way, where if you didn’t want to call someone a gender-neutral pronoun you were a bigot, etc. I said at the time the Left were going to get their day for trying to mandate people how to think. The problem for me is I didn’t do that, so I get the worst of both worlds. I never got the “joy” of shaming the Right like those people did. Lose-lose for moderates. I’m used to losing at this point being a Beav fan. Good training.
Trump loses so it must be fraud. No evidence then it’s a conspiracy to hide it. It’s like being wrong about any subject is an instant death sentence. I can already hear them reading this thinking that I can only say that cause Biden is winning and I’m part of the media conspiracy…weird since I havnt watched any media since the first debate and barely look at the news since it’s all been the same for 2 months. Of course no one can just think about stuff without being told how to think so…conspiracy? I don’t really have a point, it’s just disturbing.
This is the problem, and how do you get people like that to see reality? I don’t think you can. There is a specific type of brain/chemistry prone to paranoia, conspiracy, etc. I recommend “your deceptive mind”…great series. But it gives me little hope for most of these people, unless they have “introspection” to figure it out. This is why I wonder if they eventually get labeled domestic terrorists. My hunch is they do, and I can’t argue with that, because their rights end the moment they infringe on mine.
Would be interesting to see how long Trump Jr. can do this and how far he can take it without repercussions. They are clearly trying to scare and intimidate people. Cult of Trump.
Trump Jr is a weasel. Hard to believe people listen to that guy. There’s no way he runs with any success, is there? I guess this is why Russians execute the entire family, including kids, when there’s an overthrow of government…lol.
I like this term y’all-qaeda I’m seeing. Pretty accurate. At some point these people have to be considered domestic terrorists rather than citizens and handled accordingly.
Ha, the first time I heard that term was from a buddy of mine on the East Coast talking about the militia that took over the headquarters of the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge.
Oh please. Why aren’t you saying the same about the radical left / ANTIFA (P.S. they actually assassinated a Trump supporter in Portland this summer). There is an ever polarizing radicalization on both sides. Is there an excuse for it? I think no, but I also think this is a minority viewpoint; though growing. Crossing the Rubicon is reserved for very few scenarios of government encroachment or treason – to which we are not even NEARLY close to. Both sides behaving in this manner is disgusting.
Because I don’t know as much about Antifa. I follow the alt-right a lot more than the radical left. If they’re domestic terrorists they should be handled as such, too.
Sounds like the result of biased or selective information gathering on your part considering they’ve only been terrorizing cities for months.
I find the alt-right more interesting, psychologically, so that’s where I spend the limited time I have for this stuff.
You find it more interest due to implicit bias in favor of the side you lean towards. If you are interested in psychological reasoning this is actually useful feedback for you.
No I find it more interesting because of paranoia and mythical thinking.
Assassinated? GTFOH
Fuck that pos
Nice to know you approve of murdering people because of differing political beliefs.
What happened?
I think this is the one they are talking about.
https://nypost.com/2020/08/31/man-suspected-in-deadly-portland-shooting-is-100-antifa/
I wish people would realize that violence is the issue not who is.doing it. People resorting to violence is a failure of a system or a failure of personal ethics. It shouldn’t be a rally call for more violence.
Thanks. Will read it later. Need to look into ANTIFA more anyway.
The FBI has a few publications on ANTIFA that are pretty interesting. You have to dig around in their pressers and archives to find them.
I don’t know why I find this so funny. Fox personality Mario Bartiromo got some tweets flagged by twitter because she was posting debunked conspiracy theories, so later she announced she’s leaving twitter to start using Parler instead(another social media platform with less restrictive rules)
But she tagged some account for @parler, which leads to some poor schlub with the same name who doesn’t follow anybody and only tweeted once, back in 2012. Now that guy has gone from zero to several thousand followers in a few hours.
https://twitter.com/MariaBartiromo/status/1324516507188166656?s=19
Hahaha.
Twitter spam bots are going off the rails this morning. Search for “Castellanos Home” and this same tweet will come up for thousands of accounts all within a few minutes of each other.
https://ibb.co/W3g2cQz
In other hard to believe(so i don’t) news, shortly after reports come out that Biden has taken the lead in GA and PA, a report comes out that Vladamir Putin has Parkinson’s and is being pushed by his family to quit at the end of the year.
The Kremlin has since denied these reports, it should be noted.
https://in.news.yahoo.com/vladimir-putin-plans-quit-russian-052622444.html
Interesting. Putin is a master chess player. He’s absolutely destroying the U.S. internally.
Anyone check out that Operation Infektion movie I mentioned? Long history of this, so I think Russia goes on having success with this strategy even without him. It’s “plug and play” for the authoritarians over there at this point.
I’m not sure about internally, because the western world has been internally destroying itself in the Vietnam War era. The USSR’s legacy has been the destruction of western culture by making people question and abandon their traditional norms.
He has made things much more difficult for the US externally, however, within the developing world, specifically Africa and Southeast Asia.
Well my Right friends are posting videos that are known to be made in Russia, using actors who are sitting at a table filling out multiple ballots, and posting them as “fact of voter fraud”….I’d say that’s a Putin win on internal destruction, and straight out of the Operation Infektion playbook.
It’s far more reaching than that. A few ballots don’t amount to much statistically.
What does make a bigger impact is social media and the use of bot accounts on social media. It is so effective that the US adopted this tactic during the Arab Spring in order to help the efforts to overthrow the Egyptian and Tunis governments. The fact that social media has become monetized has helped encourage this practice worldwide. It just so happens that the CCP is a significant stakeholder within many social media platforms (though these platforms are publicly banned), and it helps that they produce most of the world’s smartphones.
There is no question that Russia engages in our internal affairs, but our eyes are set on them as opposed to China.
China is a huge problem on so many fronts. It’s the one thing Trump had right (and criticism of the FED while a candidate). Too bad he’s a vile human being…and too bad he caved on all that. Trump had potential if he could have gotten out of his own way. Narcissism is a hell of a disease.
That’s true to an extent. However, I think he actually does see that the economic health of the country is rooted in its people, more so than the vast majority of Dems and Repubs. Virtually all politicians are extremely arrogant, and most despise normal people (since they are the only reason why politicians might lose their jobs).
Speaking of the FED, did you hear that they are looking at potentially substituting the dollar for a digit currency? If implemented, they (along with the Treasury) could theoretically bypass the Legislative Branch when stimulus packages stall.
I have always thought the FED was only necessary when something like a World War broke out in order to mitigate bank runs. Clearly, that organization has abused its power.
Sounds like even the Beavs are getting political. “Damn Change” emblem on their helmets, something on t-shirts Smith mentioned, “moment of unity” before kickoff, etc, all requested by the players. Smith seems like a conservative to me. Anyone know?
How do conservatives on this site feel about that?
Football coaches tend to be more on the conservative side in general, though this year they have been more vocal in supporting the players social justice messages. Don’t know where Smith leans. Riley was a conservative for sure.
But the acts for social change have been going on since summer so it’s kind of old news. A lot of teams have been doing moments of unity, even in the reddest of states. Clemson did it during their last home game (got booed).
I’m not answering from a conservative standpoint, but I’m glad they went with a non-polarizing message. The Dam Change campaign is to bring awareness to mental health issues and was started by students at OSU to help students who deal with depression and/or suicidal thoughts. Has nothing to do with changing the political climate. Basically building a support network for the campus community.
Ah, gotcha. I heard “damn change” on the Smith presser…the way it was framed seemed in relation to politics, because the reporter asked about social justice, etc.
I take it back. I was confusing Dam Change with Dam Worth It. I dont know what Dam Change is
If you watch that Smith presser in the football thread, it seems in relation to something political.
Or is the dam change thing related to equality, blm type stuff?
That’s what I was wondering. I know a lot of people who stopped watching the NFL after Kaepernick….wondering if Beav fans would stop watching due to politics entering da Beavs.
So I’m reading about ANTIFA…confused. Why is it “left-wing”? Isn’t everyone anti-fascist, anti white nationalists, and anti-nazi? It seems those are the main positions. Asked my lady who follows this stuff more, and she said “they’re militant [about it]”…is that true? I am not seeing a ton of violence. What is see is more passive-aggressive shit like Doxing, which is low-life stuff and I believe illegal, but it’s not violent.
At this point, they’re basically just a foil to the Proud Boys.
The problem with that is Antifa has been around since Occupy Wall Street in 2011. Proud Boys wasn’t formed until around 2016.
I don’t even think its an organized movement like “Proud Boys.” Just a concept and foil that got named, then renamed, “Antifa” and now trump talks as if they are an organized group like hus proud boys.
If Antifa isn’t organized, it’s one hell of a coincidence that they keep running into each other in Portland literally every night since May and wreaking havoc around town, destroying property, lighting occupied buildings on fire on multiple occasions, etc. etc.
Angry, Antifa is a weird one… Basically a blanket term that they use… They can then claim Antifa is “idea” and not organized which is true to extent. This allows them to call out any opposition as racist even if the opposition is upset about the property damage and violence… I think it gets confusing nationwide because some Antifa is peaceful but others like the Portland group are very violent… To me this is nothing new, the Portland group is really the same ol group of Anarchists that have been around forever in Oregon… They are just relabeling themselves as Antifa
The most interesting part about them is they fight fascism with fascism. Go figure! Haha
I’ve known about that far left faction in Oregon, but yeah, didn’t know it was rebranded as ANTIFA. So the guy who killed someone, was he just an anarchist?
From what i read about him, he was some former Army dude who felt compelled to hang out downtown and provide “security” for people who were clashing with police at the Federal building downtown. If I had to describe him, I think anarchist would be a fitting description. I think he also supported the BLM movement.
There was a day where antifa people were downtown and alt-right people also showed up and one of the alt-right guys was shot and killed by him. He gave some interview while hiding from law enforcement that i think can be found with some searching.
Federal agents tracked him down near Lacey Washington but he ended up being killed by them, so there was never any custody or legal case.
It’s a shame either guy died but also not surprising given how much things were allowed to escalate in this city and people being drawn to it like moths to a flame.
Is it me or does every losing side in politics just eat itself? Turned on the news for the first time this week. (Pro tip – to stay sane, don’t watch any tv news during elections). CNN is just repeating itself since no new results are available, fox is trying it’s best to drum up voter fraud but even the anchors are pushing back, msnbc is the same as cnn. Both cnn and msnbc really want to make the call in nv and az. Fox doing its best not to call nv since they called az already. For once, no one wants to be first in calling the race.
I’m amazed at the restraint the MSM has shown through all this. It’s so obvious Biden is going to win, and yet no one has called it so Trump can’t rail on them for it.
Or they are waiting for Fox to call it.
Another pro tip – don’t watch news. Visual media and in person argument (debates) are the most convincing and hijack systems in our brains that make us sympathetic to what we are seeing. The medium that allows the most critical thinking and least emotional transference is the written word. In order of least manipulative to most is written, auditory, visual, in person, in person with a crowd. It all has to do with emotional transference.
I’m using Trump on this one because he’s simple a great example. Watch a trump speech or interview and then read the transcript. On a visual medium he is actually pretty convincing and charismatic. Read the transcript and it’s sometimes hard to figure out what he’s talking about.
Yoda is another good example. If you watch the movies he’s a wise shaman type. If you read the script hes essentially a crackhead.
If they haven’t called NV already, it should happen any time. Clark Cty ballots came in really expanded the lead for Biden. Up to 22k now, which I believe is insurmountable. PA wouldn’t matter in this case as long as AZ is still considered “called”
https://twitter.com/RalstonReports/status/1324752060621840389?s=19
What I don’t understand is Trump & friends had four years to “expose” voter fraud, and all I can see that they’ve come up with is one offhand Fox article about a cat getting a ballot, and some movies of people filling out several pieces of paper (which we can’t see what’s on them, could be nerds taking the SAT) filmed in Russia. I know more Republicans who have gotten duplicate ballots in my immediate circle. If it exists, show all the proof. If it’s a massive fraud, there should be evidence everywhere. It’s like people who believe in ghosts, aliens, and bigfoot – if they exist, with all the cameras and surveillance we should have footage.
There’s plenty evidence of elections being mismanaged, maybe not outright fraud. Trump’s taking advantage of the natural obfuscation of one to claim the other as an excuse for his own failings.
It usually doesn’t matter, but when the vote is actually close, all the stuff that happens at the margins comes into view.
Some history here:
https://greenwald.substack.com/p/the-us-inability-to-count-votes-is
I just don’t understand all the grandstanding. If there is evidence then surely they can present it in court. Yelling from the rooftops does not create more evidence or make your case any stronger, it only caused chaos and unfounded anger. I know that’s Trump’s strategy, but it’s not beneficial to our society. Just shut the fuck up and do the work to win your case in the judicial system. It’s lazy to try to win a case through influencing public opinion rather than through proper litigation.
Because it works. Got him to the presidency.
….and lost him the presidency too?
1 out of 2 isn’t bad.
If anyone has FB, the lip reading video of Trump and Biden is hilarious. I found it on Stephen Wards page. I wish I could just share a link here but dont’ think FB has that capability.
That was a fantastic example of non-partisan political humor. They did an excellent job of acting out comedic caricatures of the three debate participants. Sadly, it’s a rarity these days.
Bad lip reading is chocked full of great ones.on political speeches and debates. The 2016 on with trump and Hillary is hilarious too.
Here’s the youtube link. It’s freakin hilarious.
https://youtu.be/kn-h78tuNiU
Angry — good decision giving us the two threads this week — good stuff on both.
Thanks! I’ve enjoyed both. Good discussions without insanity. Learned more about ANTIFA. Never read up on them.
So apparently the software that was used to tabulate votes in a Michigan county might have had a glitch, forcing the county to recount the 16K+ votes by hand.
https://www1.cbn.com/cbnnews/politics/2020/november/a-mess-in-michigan-computer-glitch-in-program-used-in-32-counties-plus-138-000-sudden-votes-for-biden
The 138K reporting error is probably just that: a reporting error. However, the Trump administration might request a recount in all Michigan counties because all counties use the same software if indeed there were 4K-5K inaccurate ballots.
I think this is further evidence that we need to use 21st Century methods like blockchain. If anybody has kids that want to go into software development, I’d push them towards blockchain tech lol
What the hell source is that?
Fake news.
Is “CBN” still the Christian Broadcasting Network or am I showing my age? Go Tammy Baker!
Detroit Free Press doesn’t seem to be fake news?
https://www.freep.com/story/news/politics/elections/2020/11/06/antrim-county-results-election-2020/6185031002/
The revised count states that Trump actually won the county by 2500 votes as opposed to Biden winning by 3000.
It also appears as though 47 Michigan counties utilize this software (including Wayne County); 30 states utilize it as well.
A manual recount of all ballots shouldn’t take more than a week across the nation. What would be bad is if counties just ignore a court order, and SCOTUS rules that a states’ electors are invalid. If that happens, and enough electors are invalidated to prevent a winner, the vote goes to the House. Each state has one vote; Republicans currently maintain control of 28 state delegations.
So much for “will of the people”, right?
Indeed.
However, I believe something so serious is necessary in order to change the status quo on how we do elections. There are methods to ensure that votes are counted and a winner is declared the morning after Election Day.
I am confused why no one is just calling it. Seems like 3 options.
1- viewership is crazy good so let’s keep it rolling.
2- trump is gonna go crazy so let’s keep punishing him.
3- scared to upset trump?
I’m thinking option 1 is likely. As much as the “news” won’t say it, trump has been huge for news channels. He has kept ratings rolling. That’s 1 thing I personally hate. Always political talk everywhere, because there is always some new crazy ass thing the president does
In wondering if they are scared of domestic terrorism too. There has been bomb threats and evacuations now. There has also been possible shooters crossing state lines that were picked up on tips. It wasn’t that long ago when Charlie hebdo was attacked. I would say the level of anger and threat is just as high or more. The media has to be a major target after the last 4 years of demonization.
No kidding? That is crazy. I am pretty nieve to a lot of the day to day news, as I don’t watch any news source basically ever – am watching some now to check on who our president will be.
I did not realize that was even a possibility.
People are insane. I mean I was for Biden in this one, last one didn’t participate as I thought both were so bad, still think both candidates are bad, but tired about hearing lunatic stuff with current president.
My point is, I go to work everyday, have a kid now at home (almost 14 month old son- future Beaver) and spend time with my family, friends, etc… and in all reality the only real difference the president has made on my personal life, is I have to hear about stuff from friends/family, and everything I hear has annoyed me. And if trump won this one, I would be annoyed because I’d have to hear about political stuff for the next 4 years, but I would go about my own life and in reality not much would change for me. I am not rich or poor… which I guess is a blessing either way. My point is, Life is good in this country no matter the president. Life is short also, so why spend it complaining about something you cannot change. We all get a vote, which I think is important. From that moment on it’s whatever happens, and as I mentioned I feel lucky/blessed/proud to be American. And that wouldn’t change if angry was the president, you were, trump or Biden.
You have a good point but it only works if the people in power don’t noticably affect you and your circle.
Old example but my healthcare through the ACA has gone from 1100 a month to 2100 a month under trump due to policies he chose. They have been using pre existing conditions as a wedge issue for 5 years increasing my daily stress. Without my healthcare I can’t afford my meds. Without my meds I go from a productive member of society and active father to bedridden and unable to walk in a matter of weeks. It’s one example of many but it’s very personal for me.
I’m glad you don’t have to worry about any issues on a national scale.in your daily life. Just offering a different perspective.
.
Your insurance went up considerably after ACA was forced upon all of us.
But keep shifting blame where it doesn’t lie.
Nope, it went up directly due to trump administration actions to weaken the policy. It would be impossible for me to get coverage without the ACA and still be a small business owner. I would have to work for a company. Seems like a shitty system where my choices are to limit my opportunities or die in a bed before 35.
I’m still pissed that the higher tax rates on “bonus income” are still in effect. As I understand, this was put in during the Clinton administration and never overturned. When I get a yearly bonus it’s taxed at almost 45 fucking percent!
Yeah that tax is do dumb.
I think the domestic terrorism angle is wrong. They are just fine with it seeing how its been going on for months under the moniker of “mostly peaceful protests”.
I mean literally the reporters and their places of work being attacked not protests.
Well i have to admit some people on either side are capable of that. The media is in large part just a division of the democrat party. I think that is clear given they’re actions the last month.
You know it really doesn’t matter who perpetrates terrorism or sides. The side should be thats wrong. Stop defending a hypothetical attack and blaming it on the hypothetical victim while dismissing it cause they are on the wrong side.
Of course it doesn’t matter who does. Im not defending anyone or anybody but its a givin that people on both sides consider them to be corrupt. I know i do. Some will act on it. Were you bothered by the terrorism of the last few months? Those burning cities, beaten bloody citizens, and harrased cops were not hypotheticals. It unfortunately went on for months and goes on today.
Yes. I was bothered by all the violence not just the stuff on my ‘side’.
For those who worry about covid just a PSA to check your local numbers. National daily infections are up to 130k today and the curve has gotten pretty severe. Hospitalizations and deaths are also on the rise.
Who’s everyone’s favorite President, and why?
I’m throwing out three cause the first two are obvious and boring (washington and lincoln).
Polk: did everything he promised in 4 years the dropped the mic and retired. Can’t say I’m a fan of all his policy but I do admire the accomplishment.
Polk was solid. He’s similar to Coolidge in that they were one term Presidents, but they were effective and decisive.
I’m thinking Mexicans probably consider Polk the worst president! Didn’t he also intimidate the British into giving up the Northwest without a fight?
Yeah he completely incited the mexican american war just to land grab texas (already annexed and part of the incitement) , arizona, new mexico and california…just as promised!
His negotiation on Oregon is considered one of the greatest bluffs in international affairs history.
“Both Great Britain and the United States had jointly occupied this region since 1818, and it was clear that Polk wanted the west coast of North America for the United States, possibly even including Mexican-controlled California. In the beginnings of negotiations, Polk bluffed to Britain that he wanted all the territory up to 54°40′. In the end, the President’s shrewd but unseemly bluster earned him a compromise rather than a war with the British. In spite of his own supporters’ more extreme demands, Polk agreed to a boundary at the 49th parallel, giving the United States present-day Oregon, Idaho, and Washington, as well as control of the Columbia River.”
Teddy Roosevelt.
I like his energy. Youngest president ever, at 42.
Teddy and Grant for me. Maybe it’s because I’ve read the most books about them. Also, I think people forget how popular Ronnie was. He lost seven TOTAL states in two elections! Walked out of the office with a 69% approval rating, even after doing some weird shit. I always loved the SNL skit with Phil Hartman that portrayed him as a hyper-competent evil genius who was faking being a bumbling fool.
The drunk history on him is fantastically funny too.
Yes, I forgot about that one. Nancy was the driving force behind Ronnie!
Here’s a cool list that compiles the major historian surveys for each president. The surveys all vary but are generally comprised of people who spend their lives studying US politics and presidents. They are about as informed as it gets. Open the drop menu for survey results and you get a full overview. It’s also easy to click on any of the president’s and go to their wiki page.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Historical_rankings_of_presidents_of_the_United_States
Woodrow Wilson 6th is a joke. Should be last. Even worse than Trump.
Opinions vary haha
I don’t know how good of a pres he was, but do you guys know the story about John Tyler still having a grandson alive? Yes, a grandson. It has to do with men fathering kids in their ’70s with young wives. He had two, but one just died in his 90’s.
That’s wild! It’s always amazing to compare people who lived long lives to events and the overlaps in history.
I had the pres slightly wrong. Tyler was born in 1790! Here’s a link for the curious.
https://www.mentalfloss.com/article/29842/president-john-tylers-grandsons-are-still-alive
I can verify he was a terrible president. Got the job after harrison died in office after a few months. Still cool that such a close decendent is alive 175 years later.
It’s boring but Lincoln, Washington, Jefferson were our best. My next rung would be Teddy and Andrew Jackson. Grant is interesting…he’s ranked lower than he should be on most lists. Jimmy Carter is persecuted, too. He inherited hyperinflation and the subsequent 18% interest rates.
We haven’t had a good president in a long time.
One thing I find funny about the list is there is no standard reference model to judge against, it’s all relative to each other. If you put 42 cats in a best dog competition it doesn’t really tell you who the best dog is.
Yeah. Most “Best” lists have this problem.
But objectively you can make a top five, I think.
I mean sure but those top 5 are going to vary wildly. My top 5 best presidents isn’t even the same as my favorite. I know for a fact that my top 5 are different than yours cause we have a different priorities about what policy is important. My favorite to ask people (and most partisan) is best person who has been president. This is a hard one since we don’t know a ton about all of them as people but if you make a list of Carter’s life and leave out the political offices and his name most people would agree he’s a fantastic role model for any child. Tell people it president carter and it all changes. That dude is old as time and still making bird houses with foster kids.
Yeah that’s one reason I said Carter is underrated. He never really got off the ground due to the economic situation he was handed (Biden could have a similar problem), but he was a fantastic human and likely would have made a great president if the economic climate were better.
My late Mom who was a diehard conservative all her life voted for Carter because she said she loved honest, southern gentlemen and thought Ford was an elitist (not sure if that was true). She never voted Democrat again. I think she voted for Trump although I’m not sure she knew who he was at the time!
angry November 3, 2020 at 8:31 am
I think Trump leads on election night and declares victory. As mail in votes come in, Biden wins. Then I think Trump refuses to leave and later steals it in the courts. What’s funny is if this is not decided by inauguration day Pelosi becomes president.
_________________________________________________________________________________________________
Just spotted this scrolling through comments. Scarey!!
Fucking Nostradamus.
Preventing Nancy Pelosi from taking the reigns is the one thing that could get Trump to concede.
I hope the dems downgrade Pelosi and Schumer. They are lightening rods for people who want to run as democrats of any stripe.
Hey on a positive note I predicted the Beavs to win the North!
Anderson Cooper called Trump an overweight turtle on its back baking in the sun. That’s incredible.
Pennsyvania votes coming in have hit the tipping point for networks to finally call the race. Have seen NBC/AP/CNN called it for Biden in the last few minutes.
Biden is now anchored. To make a football analogy, the call on the field has to stand unless there’s irrefutable evidence to overturn the call. So far I’ve seen zero evidence…just anecdotes and super shady videos from shady sources.
The hummer guys in PA were trying to deliver fake ballots. Not Biden fans though.
Biden wins.
Time for the turtle baking on its back to start kicking harder.
Fox news has projected it now also. Also made the call for Nevada and they already had called AZ. So basically 2 paths called sinultaneously.
AZ still seemed to be trending toward Trump, so will be interesting to see where that state finally lands.
https://twitter.com/MattGertz/status/1325116458226118658?s=09
Trump just needs to concede, so the nation can calm down a little if possible. He was given a golden opportunity and he made the choice to continue to be an ego-driven asshole. The rust belt states were closer in 2016 and Clinton did the right thing, although she may have been in a state of shock!
I’m hearing he’s going to abuse executive order to purposely wield his final power and create more mayhem (probably misery for “libs” if he can). This guy continues to outdo himself in the grace and dignity departments.
At some point doesn’t he have to think about the landscape he leaves for his kids? If they have designs of eventually running for office, having dad leave scorched earth in his wake would be tough to sell.
You think he thinks about his kids?
True, he may just view them as campaign workers who need to be fired now
Who’s Tiffany?
It will also leave a really bad taste for moderates…personally won’t consider a (R) next cycle if they allow that behavior. Now that he’s gone it’s gotta be damage control for a lot of them.
Yet there are some actually doubling down on his nonsense
I expect that.
I won’t even be surprised if he starts some international conflict to try and make the argument he HAS to stay in power.
I wonder if Biden will be “allowed” to put together a cabinet by the Senate? Or if he’ll have to go the Trump route and do “temporary” appointments?
Depends on the runoffs I expect
I think it’s fascinating Trump is calling Biden “Joe” and “Mr. Biden” now. No more “Sleepy Joe”…wonder if he respects him more now that he has power.
Bullies always punch down, never up
The only reason to watch the cable news is to see both sides spin themselves in circles. One side claiming a mandate since Biden won over 50% over the vote. Otherside saying Trump increased his raw vote total from 2016 and his has legal challenges still ongoing.
Biden got over 4,000,000 more votes than Trump. Either that is an extremely well-executed scam job, or the American people have spoken loud and clear.
I think the next two years are going to be interesting. I don’t think there has ever been a president who stepped down due to health reasons? I think it’s going to happen unless there’s a cure for Alzheimer’s coming that we don’t know about. Biden will be getting the best healthcare in the world. I remember when everyone was concerned about Reagan being the oldest at 69 and it was most likely affecting him at the end of his second term and his handlers were able to hide it to some degree.
Wonder if the release of todays latest vote counts that lead to the announcement wasnt strategic?
Do it late on a friday night and you’re asking for potential trouble in the streets.
Saving it for Saturday morning when college football is about to kick off, might help reduce some of that stuff as people have other distractions. Just a thought
I don’t know that anyone can make extremists on either side happy. There was some chant going on in Portland last night about “fuck Trump and Biden”. The left-wing Portland politicians who won their local races are apparently not liberal enough for the protesters.
From a Detroit Free Press OP-Ed, a sports metaphor some may enjoy:
“Shortly after 2 a.m. Wednesday, with the election undecided but with his rival leading both the popular vote and the Electoral College tally, the president of the United States claimed victory in his bid for reelection, declared the continuing effort to count ballots cast on or before Election Day a fraud, and vowed to press those absurd claims in the U.S. Supreme Court.
…
It was as if a football team trailing by a field goal had walked off the field with 5 minutes remaining on the clock and insisted that the score, the officiating, and time itself were irrelevant.”
I was scanning various papers around the country looking for indications of violence, thankfully there’s been none. Agree, the timing of releasing results may have been strategic to reduce the potential for violence.
Remember, though, a winner isn’t formally declared until December 14.
If, indeed, there is a case for voter impropriety (not fraud), and certain swing states don’t follow court orders to perform a manual recount, there’s a good chance that that state’s electoral votes could be nullified.
If that were to happen, expect MASSIVE riots.
I can’t get over the Anderson Cooper quote. “An obese turtle on his back, flailing in the hot sun.” When I googled it I got this fantastic image.
https://i.imgur.com/L2xlsFI.jpg
Turtle should sue for defamation of character.
Go Beavs! I’m sorry was there other news today?
My behavior on the golf course lately….
https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=trump+tantrum+of+golf+course+gif&id=3CE7044540C437E62392633BD7423ECA9706B738&FORM=IQFRBA
oops–champagne working too good this morning…
https://i.redd.it/jh9k6wh7yaky.gif
Trump is (or was) apparently golfing today. Probably declaring victory early, counting only those holes he won, demanding recounts on holes where he lost…
I’m trying to think of the term for humiliation of a public figure, or defacing of a statue of a public figure. SAT type word. Slipping my mind. I think it begins with an “E” but I’m not sure. Can anyone help?
Effigy. Got it!
There is mounting pressure within the Democratic Party for Pelosi to give up her speakership.
I believe that we’re going to see a lot of fighting within the Party over the next two years.
She won’t lose. But her staying in power is good for GOP. They have basically turned her image into a demon. She’s the easier punching bag than Biden.
They might just fuel the fire within the Democratic Party. Even MSNBC is highlighting the brand crisis.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8924197/Morning-Joe-calls-election-absolute-repudiation-Democrats.html
The progressive/socialist branch of the democrats will split off eventually. I see the future as a left, moderate and right government with the middle making coalition votes with the other two on various subjects. I think that would assert some real sanity and effective government someday.
If that happens in the next few years, the progressives will never get anything that they want ever again. Their source of funding will be almost nill.
People are overlooking the fact that the GOP now controls 29 state legislatures. They have the authority to gerrymander and redraw district lines, which will have impacts for the next decade.
Pretty interesting.
https://www.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/jpswwo/bolsonaro_abandons_friend_%CF%84rump_after_2020/
This is pretty funny. I guess early this morning before the race was called, Trump tweeted out there was going to be a press conference about voter fraud in Philly this morning at the Four Seasons.
Then he later corrected his tweeted that it was “Four Seasons Landscaping” where the press conference was to be held, not the Four Seasons hotel. So a bunch of media ends up going to this random landscaping company to cover it, but in the meantime the election is called. So most media packs up and leaves, but some remain behind.
This is the scene from that press conference. Rudy Giuliani in a gravel parking lot between a landscaping business and an adult sex toy shop, claiming poll watchers weren’t allowed to stand closer than 6 feet. That’s the evidence of fraud, apparantly.
https://twitter.com/_RichardHall/status/1325120101927055360?s=09
Is there video of this press conference?
That area looks straight out of the Sopranos body-chop shop.
Are we 100% Sacha Baron-Cohen didn’t set this up for Borat 3? When you are using Rudi to prove credibility im pretty sure you are in trouble.
This looks to be it.
15:10 he starts talking. Avoid the 2 minutes before that when its just some guy nervously bouncing his junk around with a little dance.
This is, no-hyperbole, the most pathetic thing I’ve ever watched.
This includes finding a former GF in a porno.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6BRhu1n8aSQ
This has to be up there though right?
People like Rudy Guliani(sp?) who lack integrity, always end up losing, and I’m comforted by that somewhat. He looks desperate and pathetic. The problem is though, they tend to drag society or groups of people through a lot of unnecessary, unproductive shit.
Biden, 78; Pelosi, 80; house majority leader Hoyer, 81; whip Clyburn, 80. Hoyer been there for 20 terms. No comment.
All of these people are on the socialist/progressive radar for primary challenges in the future. 2022 and 2024 are going to but nuts internally. If Biden only goes 1 term I expect Kamala will have a brutal primary challenge.
Looks like a lot of high-level politicians are starting to play with house money regarding longevity. We are going to see some “die-offs” in office unless retirements start happening.
And I doubt Harris will be in any primary. She will be running in 2024 as the incumbent.
That’s an auto-loss for Democrats.
I guess they figure it’s worth getting Trump out to sacrifice 2024.
Unless he dies she won’t be president. Parties and allies will hide presidential health concerns forever. If we do’nt stop electing 70+ year olds we might as well put the white house on the “weekend at Bernies hollywood set tour”.
That’s funny. It’s true, dementia can be hidden with the right support. Glen Campbell kept touring almost to the end with members of his family in his band, but geez I don’t know how you hide a president in this day and age unless there’s at least a little bit of intentional deception going on.
Hard to un-elect them when they are never challenged.. Say what you will about AOC – granted, she had several advantages – looks, energy, a district she knew well, bilingual, democrat district to begin with. However, as I understand it she went door-to-door and held countless meetings. I read also, the guy she ran against, forget his name, another Pelosi buddy, didn’t take her seriously and didn’t campaign much.
The house democrats – right now – could shake up the house leadership but they self-protect. They want to be there until they are 80, as well.
I actually don’t know a ton about AOC, but I remember watching her speech when this happened, and it was an incredible rebuttable of Kavanaugh. Super well-spoken and articulate. Thing is I actually think she’s a socialist, so there’s that….
She basically is. Just listed as a democrat. Like Bernie. But Bernie is not listed as a democrat, so I was always confused why he was able to run for the democratic nomination.
But the thing is, she doesn’t have that much pull in the party. She’s just one of the loudest voices in the room. Fox News put her up on a pedestal and started firing away. She was an easy boogeyman.
But I’d probably not vote for her is the thing, and moderates have to be won.
I have zero belief in socialist as a long-term economic policy. So while it would work short-term, it has that issue, and therefore I just couldn’t. She’s an economically confused, smart woman.
Eliminate cable news and everyone will become moderates.
That’s messed up. If true, everyone just needs to watch Network in High School. All news is is selling an ad. That’s all it is. If you know that you know all. We’re lucky to have media that can say anything, but we’re unlucky not everyone understands it’s someone talking to sell an ad.
P.S. Correlation /= causation, but I watch 0 TV.
Watch only football. Not moderate haha.
AOC is a socialist and there is a socialist/progressive caucus. It doubled this election. AOC’s twitter rebuttels are savage.
Angry, who do you think should be in the candidate pool to fix the Fed?
I’m scanning the web for articles on potential cabinet candidates, curious to see who he pursues.
https://www.politico.com/news/2020/11/07/joe-biden-cabinet-picks-possible-choices-433431
https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2020/10/who-biden-is-considering-for-top-jobs-if-he-wins.html
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-election-2020/joe-biden-cabinet-who-kamala-harris-bernie-sanders-b1661688.html
Andrew Jacksons skeleton?
None. The FED needs to disappear.
Hey my guess was pretty close!
Haha. I’d settle for AJ’s skeleton for sure.
Olivia Nuzzi confirms Trump team doesn’t understand the math of the votes. Senior advisors intervened to explain which votes should be stopped and why. Didn’t this guy supposedly go to an Ivy League school? I wonder how he got in there…
Also would like to add the AP and Reuters both did a great job with reporting. Everyone has been praising AP, but I think Reuters did the best job. Very conservative and accurate. Still haven’t even called AZ because the math doesn’t eliminate Trump.
Man, so much less agita with Biden and Harris. Civil, decent…yeah, confused on economics, but the former are more important. Can’t take the money with you. Might as well have peace of mind while here.
I thought Clinton won on “it’s the economy stupid”?
And that’s why we got Clinton…
Nice, Biden quoting the Byrds…oh shit, that was the bible.
Was thinking the same thing when I heard him say those lines….LOL!
I figure this thread is about dead but I do meant to throw something in the void and see what comes out. I am a socialist but I don’t think socialism will always hold the best solution. I think any idealogy can come up with good ideas. My hope for the future is the democrats break up to bro a progressive and moderate party so we have 3 ideologies expressed. My guess is that moderates would hold most of the position most of the time and deals/coalitions would need to be made with the two minority parties to get legislation passed.
I wish this because our system is so all or nothing its pointless sometimes. If there was a requirement for working together (like the 60 vote threshold for scotus used to be) then more ideas can be expressed and debate can happen. What do people think of that concept?
I hope not for all our sake; Republicans crying about AOC is some of the best political entertainment around.
I’m in favor of removing the Electoral College for the Presidential race.
On the other hand, we need to revoke the 17th Amendment such that people do not directly vote for Senators.
The Senate is where negotiations happen. It really needs to be full of smart people that aim to perfect laws that are proposed.
The electoral college is what makes us a Republic (vs a Democracy) and gives the minority some power. It was put in place to avoid “tyranny of the masses”…
I think it’s a good thing. It gives some say to a minority vote, like a rural democrat or urban republican.
But that’s the role of the Senate. The Senate protects the minority more than any other institution in government. The Senate checks the Executive Branch by confirming or denying the President’s appointees to various departments.
The EC constrains the election to 10-13 states. Plus, if we’re talking about protecting the “minority”, the EC does not do a great job of preserving the interests of rural people, since the direct democratic vote within each state for the electors really comes down to what the cities decide within those states.
My favorite president is now firmly Washington. He had a greyhound named freaking Cornwallis. That’s the best middle finger ever.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_presidential_pets
Oh wow, there is some cool information in that wiki. Our presidents have had a lot of interesting pets with some very interesting names!
I like this one:
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10217518327006928&set=p.10217518327006928&type=3
More projections of a highly effective vaccine, and stock market “soaring.”
https://www.bbc.com/news/health-54873105
https://www.bbc.com/news/business-54874108
As I understand it, vaccines are usually about 50% effective. Also, will the people who don’t see the need for masks see the need to get vaccinated?
How will this get played politically? Trump: “We told you we’d have a vaccine. They’ll try to steal the credit just like they stole the election.”
The stock market falls for every vaccine headline. This move probably has more to do with Biden winning/certainty. It’s overdone, IMO. People who shorted thinking chaos now have to cover, which fuels it higher, too. The next two months will be interesting in the stock market. “Santa Claus rally” vs all the court battles. I’m not deploying new money. Hold for me.
That’s an incredibly small sample size that’s only being considered Phase 3 (technically Phase2/3) because of the emergency designation. Most people don’t want to take it, anyway.
I added a few small trades in things that were irrationally whacked and should bounce back once reality sets in.
The fear factor, for many, may actually provide a good test for efficacy and safety that’s a larger test group than normally found on new vax/drug, eg. a small sample will volunteer, and some folks may be required to inoculate (military, health care, possibly those at risk).
Market down today as traders try to pick up the pieces.
Articles starting to trickle out telling us this is brand new technology that’s never been used in a vaccine before, so Pfizer will have to use “utmost caution” before releasing. Oh, but they’ve already pre-sold 700M units.
Chinese vaccine halted in Brazil because of a serious adverse reaction. Didn’t Russia have one they were bragging about?
Trump fires Secretary of Defense. I wouldn’t put it past him to start sacrificing soldiers to stay in power.
Esper was the guy that pushed back on the idea of using the military to quell the discord after George Floyd’s death. Now, on the heels of an apparent election loss for the guy who believes in US military might vs US citizens, Esper is fired. Hmmmm…
Really Angry? What has he done that you can make such a baseless claim?
https://greenwald.substack.com/p/no-matter-the-liberal-metric-chosen
Here’s an excellent refutation of TDS (sadly, far too late).
Thanks for some sanity and truth on a thread lacking in both. Trump is no angel but this continued BS of Obama as some clean as the driven snow leader is a joke. I doubt any or few will read it. Also, this election is far from over. The fraud is to large and in to many areas to be ignored and even though Trump may still not win there is going to be much exposed.
The crux of the post is that all of our recent presidents have done horrible things, arguably worse than Trump. Many of the people involved in those acts are now active voices in “the resistance” who are trying to distract from their own records and frame themselves as Patriotic heroes. Also, Greenwald (the author) is a gay progressive, so it’s not like he’s supporting Trump.
I think it’s more valuable as an attempt to save people’s mental health than anything. Politics are what they are, but I know some people get serious anxiety and very real health issues because they’re so worried about what “the resistance” keeps telling them Trump and his followers are going to do.
You can keep fighting the libtards and media, but what you fear most (losing freedom and rights) is happening quickly in the background.
Well, at least Trump didn’t try to print $150 trillion to buy the world’s debt
I’m actually surprised people think all this “fraud” claiming is new and significant. Trump has claimed the same thing in the last three elections. He claimed Obama didn’t really win, Dems stole that one too. He also claimed he actually won the popular vote against Hillary because there were so many illegal votes for her.
I mean sure, fraud should be investigated under most circumstances, but when it’s an oft repeated and unfounded claim by the same person, when does it become just a huge waste of money for Americans who pay taxes?
BTW, the house of cards is falling:
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.washingtonpost.com/investigations/postal-worker-fabricated-ballot-pennsylvania/2020/11/10/99269a7c-2364-11eb-8599-406466ad1b8e_story.html%3foutputType=amp
“When does it become a huge waste of money for Americans who pay taxes?”
Exactly. It’a already a waste. Attorneys for the Trump Campaign are growing weary about wasting the courts time because they are worried it will affect their license to practice, so instead the strategy is to go to the media and present “evidence” of fraud in the form of stacks of paper and getting tv personalities to clutch their pearls on the air. Can’t win in a court of law? Might as well try to win in the court of public opinion. Unfortunately, audiences aren’t making that distinction.
https://lawandcrime.com/2020-election/lawyers-litigating-for-trump-suddenly-remember-their-licenses-are-on-the-line-if-they-lie-to-a-judge/
the house of cards is falling
When the postal worker had to go on record they recanted, because they have no proof. Again, this is Bigfoot. If Bigfoot existed, given there are hundreds of millions of cameras, we’d have seen Bigfoot.
Pretty interesting: https://www.newsweek.com/according-justice-scalia-trumps-lawyers-should-face-sanctions-litigation-abuse-opinion-1546501?utm_source=Flipboard&utm_medium=App&utm_campaign=Partnerships
He didn’t recant…
Trump doesn’t pay taxes, so it costs him nothing…
For a live look at a hearing in Michigan about challenges to contitutionality of the vote count of absentee ballots in that state. This is where we start to see the real plan unravel. Challenge the consitutionality, get it kicked up to the supreme court, have the supreme court rule against and then you have a path to flipping results in other states.
This will have pretty major consequences.
It’s like watching a slow, dragged out murder take place in front of you.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=emb_err_woyt&v=NsvFqqv7omo
I think the specific complaint today is over observer distance. Like 6 ft vs 10 ft, or something like that.
This was the plan the entire time. Trump keeps talking about “fraud” but “fraud” is a very specific thing; it’s something to feed the media because “fraud” is absurd. The main thing that they are going after is what decided Bush v Gore: mail-in ballots that are counted in violation of states’ laws is a violation of the 14th Amendment. So now, not only are the results in MI and PA in question, but also WI (which requires mail-in ballots to be signed by a witness, along with the witness’ address), AZ, and NV.
Wanna know something crazier? Biden asked the Bush (Sr) Administration to authorize the FBI to investigate Clarence Thomas about claims of sexual harassment right before his confirmation hearing, even though these claims came up right after Thomas was nominated. Also, Kamala Harris persistently questioned Brett Kavanaugh about claims of sexual assault, which practically ruined his life for a short bit. I think if it came down to a technicality in a SCOTUS ruling, these two would rule against the Biden administration.
Not to mention that Kavanaugh, Barrett, and Chief Justice Roberts were all legal consultants for George Bush in the 2000 election.