27.Jul.2017 Why is This Staff so Bad at Managing QBs?

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I understand GA is a defensive coach, but you’d think being around football for 40 years you’d be able to at least somewhat understand offense and what makes a good QB. If not GA, then his offensive staff, who also continually botch the QB position. Why is this?

My theory is they want to force their will on the position. They get hung up on potential rather than results. For example, if Collins had maxed out potential he’d be the guy they envisioned, yet it was pretty obvious he was never going to do that. They’re doing the same with Luton. Sprague, Machado, etc are saying Luton is the starter. Why? What did Luton do to earn that job? Well, he is big, tall, reportedly has a big arm, etc. So once again they are in love with potential rather than results. Luton could be an absolute disaster game 1 vs CoSt and cost a win. Why not go with results — the guy who has done it? Because he’s smaller, a “game manager” reputation, etc. It’s not sexy. They fall for sexy/potential every time, and it’s why they can’t figure out the QB situation. You know who else does this? Bad pro franchises. It’s actually the #1 reason they’re horrible and stuck as perpetual bottom feeders.

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  • angry angry says:
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    Also, why incorporate Air Raid when:

    a. Bad weather favors a strong run game.
    b. You have a strong run game with potentially 3 NFL RBs on the roster.

    • Nicebeaver Nicebeaver says:
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      I think we’re going to see more of a run and shoot offense as opposed to Beavair Raid. GA mentioned on the radio yesterday that he wants to run something like 60-65% of the time, but have the ability to throw quickly when needed to help keep the defense on their heels.
      Air raid would have a much more pass heavy ratio and just wouldn’t make sense for our current team makeup.

      • angry angry says:
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        I hope so. Granted, the people talking about Air Raid are generally clueless talk show hosts who I happened to catch.

        GA did say last year he was intrigued by Washington State’s air raid, though. Hopefully not too intrigued.

        • Bill says:
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          Probably extremely intrigued since Luke Falk and the air raid offense has torn up the Beavs the last three years.

          Falk stat line vs OSU – 116/157, 73.8% Comp rate, 1,293 yards, 16 TDs, 2 INTs, and 3 Wins

          • angry angry says:
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            Yeah but name one other Luke Faulk in Ncaa history…
            You can’t sit around waiting 100 years for the next one.

          • Bill says:
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            GA might be adjusting the offense for the QB coming in next year Petras. He’s going to be a good one but is better suited for a more passing offense since he’s not much of a running threat.

          • whiskey soaked napkins whiskey soaked napkins says:
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            “Yeah but name one other Luke Faulk in Ncaa history…
            You can’t sit around waiting 100 years for the next one.”

            The dude before him. Connor Halliday.

          • angry angry says:
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            Halliday wasn’t a walk-on. 3-star scholarship recruit.

      • Jack Jack says:
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        The run and shoot? This isn’t Mouse Davis country!

        And where are we going to find four capable receivers who can play that system?

        • Nicebeaver Nicebeaver says:
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          Exactly. Coach Phillips played under the run and shoot at Houston and coached under June Jones at SMU. It’s what he does.

          The receiver position will take time to evolve. Or not, if GA changes his mind again next offseason

  • orangejulius orangejulius says:
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    Washington’s Petersen on his QB Browning…
    “For the most part, we always look at the skill set,” Petersen said. “It’s the first thing that gets us in the door and then most importantly after that it’s the mentality of the quarterback position. The physical parts of the quarterback position are completely overrated, so we felt really good about certainly how he threw the ball, but we were more excited about how he thought about the game and processed the game.

    “Height and arm strength and foot speed, it’s overrated. It’s important, but it’s overrated. That’s what everybody gets so excited about, but the best of the best are accurate throwers, great decision-makers and awesome in the pocket, tight spaces.”

    From https://oregonstate.rivals.com/news/gorney-s-takeaways-pac-12-media-days-wednesday

    Riley always focused on measurables, Petersen apparently not… still not sure what GA is looking for at QB. He uses the word juice a lot though. So I guess the juiciest QB gets the nod.

    • angry angry says:
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      Bingo, that’s exactly how I analyze a QB.
      And Peterson recruited Browning, but also the best college QB (possibly ever) in Kellen Moore.

      He clearly gets it, whereas GA clearly doesn’t get it. Cool, juice at QB. Hey, OJ was just released…

      • Nicebeaver Nicebeaver says:
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        In that dam podcast yesterday, one of them mentioned how GA seems to have shifted his focus towards more pro-style pocket passers vs the dual threat he was so fond of, because he has had trouble getting a top quality dual threat guy vs finding a pocket passer who is more of a competent game manager. (I’m paraphrasing)
        That makes sense to me, in the sense that he may have wanted one thing when he arrived at OSU (chuckie keaton 2.0), but learned that it would be easier to compete with a change in philosophy, because CK2.0 is rare and isn’t coming through that door.

        I still think McM is the guy, but he needs to speed up his decision making if theyre going run and shoot. I need to go back and watch some colt brennan film from Hawaii. I’m picturing our offense trending that way (although we really need to bolster the line)

        • Nicebeaver Nicebeaver says:
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          Here’s a link to OSU vs Hawaii. (Moore vs Brennan)
          I haven’t seen this since that day, but I remember it being a pretty entertaining game.

          https://youtu.be/0R1SlZ18jHg

          Also, when I say thay i think OSU is trending this way, by no means do I think McGiven can orchestrate this offense as effectively as June Jones. I just think we’re headed this direction, slowly.

        • orangejulius orangejulius says:
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          That’s what I meant by ‘not sure what GA wants in a QB.’

          I like your interpretation of his approach.

          If he’s merely being a pragmatist, going with what is available and workable, and not trying to be chip kelly hoping for a mariota to fall in his lap, I’m OK with it.

      • Jack Jack says:
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        To be fair, Browning would be a Beav if Riley, Langs and Banker weren’t so focused on Gelakoska and Kuli the year Moore camped at OSU.

  • youngorst says:
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    So in other words your opinion of who should start is the right answer?

    I like MM but that doesn’t mean Luton won’t be better.

    • angry angry says:
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      Luton might be better, and he might be worse. So what’s your point? We know we have a solid QB and you can’t risk the W vs CoSt by starting the wrong guy.

      • youngorst says:
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        You play the best QB, if that is Luton you start him. That is the point.

        Every choice involves risk and they can lose to CSU with MM too. What you can’t do is be afraid of taking risks. That guarantees you never achieve your goals.

        Its simple, you start the best QB. And that is what you should always do.

        • angry angry says:
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          Right, and if it’s MM (as it has been the past few years) you start him, which they didn’t.

          • youngorst says:
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            I agree but that doesn’t mean MM is the best in 2017. IMO Luton is a better QB prospect than the others they started over MM so I am willing to give them the benefit of the doubt.

            If they are wrong, then I will be critical. But you seem to be starting from the point that they are wrong.

            Like it or not, they had logical reasons for the choices they made at the QB positions both years:

            2015: Rebuilding the roster, start a young guy that fits what you plan to do on offense
            2016: Start they guy that understands the system you want to run and has experience in it
            2017: Maybe I can’t run that system like I thought, go out and get a guy that fits what we are changing too.

            In each case their is logic behind the decision even if it wasn’t the best decision. I am hopeful on Luton because to me it shows that Andersen is willing to grow as a coach. He seemed to have realized that what he wanted to do originally wasn’t gonna work and you see this change not only with Luton but with both QBs they plan to bring into the 2018 class.

            I feel like Luton is a qualified fit for what they want. Collins was a massive gamble at taking a shot at the duel threat guy (I’d argue justified at the time) and Garrettson was a stopgap.

            I am gonna give Luton a chance if that is the choice they make.

          • angry angry says:
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            I’m not starting from the point they’re wrong…just taking a big gamble when the safe route makes more sense. If it were year 1 a big gamble makes sense. Year 3 when you can make a bowl, a big gamble doesn’t make sense. The safe bet is going with Mcm and if he fails go to Luton. If they lose to CoSt with Luton at the helm it’s going to be really bad. And for the record, I have nothing against Luton. Seems fine, etc. I just have an issue with how this staff handles QBs and their inability to ever get it right. They’re 0-2 in picking who the best QB is, and not only were they off, but they were way off. So there’s no reason to believe in them.

          • Sparkyd73 says:
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            I’m still not that high on MM. I see him as a game manager. He is not going to win or lose games, but manage through games. He makes slow reads and doesnt want to make mistakes.

            GA has been clear that they want some big plays this year, MM is not that guy. You have to throw the deep ball to keep the d honest with a great running game.

  • Angry@angry says:
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    Angry’s on a roll today… It could take 100 years to ever see someone as good as Luke Falk, and Kellen Moore is possibly the best College QB ever…

    WOW

    • angry angry says:
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      Yeah, Moore only has the 4th best QB efficiency in history and the 2nd most TDs, finished top 8 in the Heisman every year he started…and he constantly carved up Pac-12 and SEC defenses. Pretty sure you will find him on every credible list of top NCAA QBs ever. You’re such an idiot.

      Regarding Falk, I was alluding to him being a walk-on putting up those numbers and the rarity of it. Name a walk-on QB who’s ever been as good as Luke Falk. That’s a once per century player.

      • Angry@angry says:
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        Colt Brennan. Any other brain busters?

        • angry angry says:
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          What part of possibly ever didn’t you understand? To me that’s obvious it means it’s open for some debate, but not debate that doesn’t include him in the discussion.

          A@a and another misunderstanding. You’re like the personification of a 3’s Company episode.

          • Angry@angry says:
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            You said name a walk on who was ever as good as Falk. I did.

          • angry angry says:
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            Except he wasn’t a walk on, per below. He turned down an offer from San Jose State to go to Hawaii. I did more research, and it turns out he had an offer to CO as well.

            “In 2002, Colt accepted a scholarship to the University of Colorado where he was red shirted. After a night of drinking, he allegedly entered the dorm room of a female student uninvited and was later arrested and charged.”

    • Jack Jack says:
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      No. Negative. False start.

      Brennan wasn’t a walk-on out of HS. He was only a walk-on at UH because he became a felon while using his first scholarship.

      • Nicebeaver Nicebeaver says:
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        I read Brennan was a walkon at Colorado, then the legal trouble, then the JC stint, before moving on to UH.

        Was he better than Falk?
        Debatable. He played in the WAC and didnt perform well against Georgia in the Sugar Bowl. Played his worst in his biggest game.
        Falk still has a senior year to play.

        • Jack Jack says:
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          I could have sworn he was a commit out of Mater Dei. Regardless, it wasn’t a part of his legend… probably because he didn’t want to talk about his time at CU. He was certainly a known quantity in the JUCO ranks. He probably still holds several single season records. He had a couple offers despite the felony (I think one was pulled). But he would have been offered by a ton of programs after that JUCO year if not for his past.

      • angry angry says:
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        Brennan turned down a scholarship from San Jose State to walk on at Hawaii. Also bleacher report has a story about his path and says he accepted a scholarship to CO.

        Funny that Brennan, Falk, Moore were all so lightly recruited and will go down as 3 of the best.

        Dan LeFevour was also great and in that discussion. Not sure if he was highly recruited but he wound up at Central Michigan so probably not. He was great, though.

        • GoBeavs88 says:
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          Long time reader of the blog. Rarely post. I Enjoy all the different perspectives here though. As it happens, my brother-in-law was a starter and one of the team captains for WSU last year and we happened to be talking about why Falk was recruited so lightly this past weekend. He told me that the story is that Falk had quite a few big time offers as a freshman and sophomore, but transferred to one of the bigger California programs as a junior and ended up losing the starting job and sitting that season. As a result, ALL of those programs who offered him moved on. He had some smaller schools and D-II scholarships as a senior, but decided that he wanted to play Power 5 football instead and walked on at WSU. He proceeded to beat out the 4 star they had recruited that same year and the rest is history…

          This will probably get lost in all the comments, but figured it was too coincidental a conversation not to pass on here. My in law also had MANY things to say about Leach and not much, if any of it, was positive. As for the Beavs, this former player could see us doing what Colorado did last year in the next year or two. So, take all this for what it’s worth…. (Admittedly just off hand conversation over beers)

          • NiceBeaver NiceBeaver says:
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            “this former player”

            Did you play for the Beavs? Or just meaning you played football?

            I’d love to hear some Mike Leach stories if you have any.

          • GoBeavs88 says:
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            I can’t reply to you below NiceBeavs, so I’ll just put it here for now…

            By “This former player”, I was again referring to my Coug in-law. Poor wording on my part. I only played through high school in Portland a good long decade at all.

            As far as Leach goes, I’m not totally comfortable sharing specifics, but basically Leach is very fortunate to have VERY, VERY good assistant coaches. Leach has absolutely no ability to relate or inspire the players and even worse a solid majority have absolutely no respect for him. While I always knew he was not likable, to hear this about a team coming of 9 or 10 wins, or whatever it was last year, was pretty surprising. It also probably explains why they have a couple of absolute stinkers every year.

          • GoBeavs88 says:
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            Apologies for the typos. I’m on my phone and don’t have an account to go back and edit.

  • gobeavers92 says:
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    The fact is GA has not had a true D1 QB on the roster (I’m not convinced Luton is a true D1 QB either time will tell). You can’t blame GA for trying to find the right guy to take this team to the next level. Last year the Beavs ranked 110th in passing offense so obviously there is room for improvement. Also you don’t bring in a JUCO QB unless you know he is going to compete for the starting job.

    MM had 2 decent games at home against arguably the 2 worst defenses in PAC 12 history (UA & UO). So saying MM is the clear #1 might be streching it a bit. In the Stanford and UCLA games on the road the 2 games prior he was not very good. I am not saying MM should not get a fair shot because he should but he has not done anything up to this point to be considered “The Guy”

    • angry angry says:
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      Why’d you leave his good game Washington State off your list and his impressive work vs Utah?
      http://www.espn.com/college-football/player/gamelog/_/id/3127332/marcus-mcmaryion

      He was also decent vs UCLA (Pierce ran in two short scores, which cut into any TD chances, but efficient game passing). His only bad games were vs Stanford and Washington..probably the two best defenses in the conference. He also won our first Civil War in almost a decade. But yeah, he’s done nothing to earn the job.

      Your analysis of what makes a good Pac-12 QB is poor.

      • gobeavers92 says:
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        SEASON CMP ATT YDS CMP% YPA LNG TD INT SACK RAT RAW QBR ADJ QBR
        2016 101 170 1286 59.4 7.57 75 10 5 7 136.5 52.4 61.2

        My analysis is the data not thoughts and feelings. These are OK numbers not numbers that scream #1 guy.

        Again he should get a shot at the job but he is not the clear cut #1.

        • angry angry says:
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          Again, if it’s the data why did you leave off Washington State and Utah, claiming he only had two good games?

      • Sparkyd73 says:
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        The running backs won the civil war game.

    • Brian Clubb says:
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      I think Luton has to be the guy this season. MM has improved, but with a young, inexperienced line, he scares me. DG can’t seem to recapture his play from when he was st Utah St.

      I kind of agree with Angry about the QB position. There is a lot riding on Luton. Unfortunately, the more I look at how this season will shape up, the more I see struggles on both lines…..just a lot of questions on both sides, and a meat grinder schedule in front of em.

      • angry angry says:
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        Speaking of schedules, I’m so tired of these early season games. Ohio State next year…why?
        I’m sure we’ll be better by then and maybe that’s an exciting game, but you have to follow the SEC model and play cupcakes. Or at least mid tier teams.

        These future schedules are awful: http://www.fbschedules.com/ncaa/pac-10/oregon-state-beavers.php

        • youngorst says:
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          We are seeing what is left over of BDC scheduling practices. They seem to have changed the way they schedule now but still have contracts to fulfill.

          • youngorst says:
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            1 Schedule thing that does bug me is that they are going to Hawaii in 2019 but not taking advantage of having the ability to add another game. They should be adding another low level (even a 2nd FCS) opponent to that home schedule.

          • AKBeaver AKBeaver says:
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            Is there something saying they won’t do that?

          • whiskey soaked napkins whiskey soaked napkins says:
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            “1 Schedule thing that does bug me is that they are going to Hawaii in 2019 but not taking advantage of having the ability to add another game”

            They pulled this same shit in 2013 or 2014 when the Beavs last played at Hawaii. I asked the SAME question then. Why screw yourself out of an opportunity to earn more revenue by having an extra home game??? I didn’t understand the thought process then and I still don’t understand it now.

          • Nicebeaver Nicebeaver says:
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            The extra game in the Hawaii travel year would need to be a D1 game if they want it to count in their win total for bowl eligibility. If they played and beat say Portland State and Sac State that year, only one of those games would count in the win total. The 2nd game would only bemefit them from the revenue perspective amd could cost them a bye week if they don’t schedule it in week 0.
            There are pros and cons. My preference would be to put a D1 game in week 0 like we are this year, as the extra game.

        • Nicebeaver Nicebeaver says:
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          The 2018 schedule is terrible. You can blame Bob Decarolis for that one

          Travel to Ohio State to start the season? Paycheck game. Bad timing. Year 4 for GA’s team, which would likely be their best year to date under GA, given depth at several key positions next year being really solid and only graduating 15 seniors this year. Basically sacrificing the first game of what could be a really good season.

          Home against Southern Utah- makes sense

          Travel to Reno, NV? Why would we schedule this? No recruiting base out in Reno. Smaller stadium in Reno than Reser. No return game at Reser for Nevada? This one doesn’t make any sense.

          • beavergopher beavergopher says:
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            The game in the “Shoe” is to pay off CR. FWIW, the whole experience of a football Saturday there is unbelievable. That is an awesome venue.

          • orangejulius orangejulius says:
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            Better than Reser?! Pffft!

          • Sparkyd73 says:
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            I’m excited about the Ohio State game as i will be able to drive the 3 hrs for a game.

        • Nicebeaver Nicebeaver says:
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          looks like we just added a home/home with San Diego State in 2023(Home) and 2026(Away)

          I like this type of scheduling much better. Gets us down in SoCal for recruiting and we actually get a return game.

          http://www.osubeavers.com/news/2017/7/26/beavers-and-aztecs-renew-football-series.aspx

    • Nicebeaver Nicebeaver says:
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      UA and UofO were the only 2 games where they allowed McM to use his legs to make plays. Lack of QB depth kept him in protection mode for most of the games he played. Remember the UCLA game, where he had an easy 5-10 yards on the ground right in front of him but he didnt run? That wasn’t because he didn’t know how to run.
      I didnt watch the UW game, but dont remember hearing any run plays for him in that game on the radio.

      • Jack Jack says:
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        Allowed?

        • beavergopher beavergopher says:
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          Allow
          verb
          give (someone) permission to do something.
          past tense: allowed; past participle: allowed
          “the dissident was allowed to leave the country”
          synonyms: permit, let, authorize, give permission for, give authorization for, sanction, license, enable, entitle; More

          If I can be of further assistance please don’t hesitate to ask.

          • Jack Jack says:
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            You don’t recall McGiven telling MM that next time he’s going to run the damn ball?

            Anyone want to know my offensive philosophy?

    • Jack Jack says:
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      I don’t care about rank in passing offense. Give me ranks in aspects pertaining to passing efficiency… and there will still obviously be room for improvement.

      Anyhoo… run the damn ball!

  • Beavlover69 says:
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    3 sure things in life: Death, taxes, and Angry throwing a temper tantrum about the QB situation before camp starts

    • gobeavers92 says:
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      Being irrational makes for a great blog.

    • helmsley says:
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      Used to be 4 things – but it’s not Beaver baseball season and Jake Thompson now pitches for the Lowell Spinners – except he hasn’t yet – now sure why.

      • jacksAnass says:
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        It is still four things. Number 4 is: Jack will always and forever be ……wait for it…..An Ass,

        • Jack Jack says:
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          I see your true colors:

          Scared, white and blue… printed on a weenie wrapper… and already used.

  • ohiobeav says:
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    GA sounds like he came in with the expectation to land a great dual threat QB. The context was leaving behind a Wiscy offense that ran 85% of the time. His prior experience was a mid tier level when the dual threat offense was working against the power 5 teams. As 2 1/2 years pass while he is at Wiscy, everybody has adjusted to what Keaton was able to do at Utah St.
    GA changes venue to PAC12 and he hopes/expects the Keaton model will plug right in, but Rich Rod/Chip had already done it in the PAc12 and GA is late to the party. Everybody has adjusted to the dual threat qb.
    However, he was the anti-Riley with a “new fast paced offense” and needed to give it a shot and went with his guy STG. STG was too green and it backfired.
    Plan B was to Garretson and a mix, with some Utah St mentality along with it. DG gets hurt because of too much pressure on him and he is out of sorts from game 1.
    Plan C was MCM as a return to the Riley style which wasn’t probably expected early on. MCM has shown a tendency to be slow on reads and little late on delivery. He looked good when runnign in the civil war and passing against Arizona, but both were very bad defenses.
    Now the goal may be to go towards an offense that loads up on running plays and mixes in quick passing plays with little time for decisions/reading the defense during the play to eliminate the DG injury. And take away MCM’s need to decide where the ball needs to go.
    I think Luton has a lot of potential because we haven’t seen him in game action yet. He is the classic “give us the back-up qb”. MCM is a known quantity, albeit an improving qb.

    We have 2 qbs and 1 wr on the roster who have won 2 games each for us in the last 2 years. None is above another at this point, and Luton is coming out of a JC program that was running the offense that GA is talking about. I think Lutopn is the guy and MCM is a good solid back-up option if things go awry.

    • gobeavers92 says:
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      An honest logical assessment like this usually means “Your analysis of what makes a good Pac-12 QB is poor”

  • Nicebeaver Nicebeaver says:
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    Funny, I threw together a sloppy cut/paste photo edit of GA as the GareBear last night while BBQing some burgers and they used it on CSN Northwest. Wonder if they’ll put it on the t-shirt next?

    https://twitter.com/CSNNW/status/890646724590526464

  • angry angry says:
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    Canzano piece that I accidentally clicked on, not realizing it was him…

    “Around the country the Pac-12 Networks are seen as a massive failure,” Schroeder said. “The other leagues are way ahead of the Pac-12 and will be further ahead as a result of the money they receive from the TV deals.”

    How are other league’s TV deals way ahead? I thought ours was pretty good at the time. Haven’t followed it since.

    • Jack Jack says:
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      They used ours to make better deals afterward.

      It’s as if even linear thought escapes him (and to whom he refers to as “around the country”… often code for “I’m just spit-balling here”).

      • beavergopher beavergopher says:
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        The B1G and SEC make significantly more coin from their TV deals, so from that standpoint it has been a failure. PAC is a step behind. They almost caught up and then got leapfrogged.

        • Jack Jack says:
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          They surpassed all before, just as the next deal did to us, just as the next deal did to them, just as the SEC deal did to them.

          Linear.

          Yes, ours sucks now when speaking relatively and counting only money as capital. If we look at the actual capital, the PTN is building now for the tech of the future. This is why they parked their HQ where they did. It’s also why they retained ownership of all secondary (and some primary) content. They are poised for the future better than any of the other network deals simply because they are a network in and of itself.

          I haven’t really looked at the Longhorn Network other than to know ESPN did the deal in a rush to keep UT from going to the Pac. They’re losing so much money on that deal, they had to fire a bunch of people a couple months back. But I’m guessing ESPN owns the content as well as all the tech. They just overpaid.

  • ohiobeav says:
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    GA sounds like he came in with the expectation to land a great dual threat QB. The context was leaving behind a Wiscy offense that ran 85% of the time. His prior experience was a mid tier level when the dual threat offense was working against the power 5 teams. As 2 1/2 years pass while he is at Wiscy, everybody has adjusted to what Keaton was able to do at Utah St.
    GA changes venue to PAC12 and he hopes/expects the Keaton model will plug right in, but Rich Rod/Chip had already done it in the PAc12 and GA is late to the party. Everybody has adjusted to the dual threat qb.
    However, he was the anti-Riley with a “new fast paced offense” and needed to give it a shot and went with his guy STG. STG was too green and it backfired.
    Plan B was to Garretson and a mix, with some Utah St mentality along with it. DG gets hurt because of too much pressure on him and he is out of sorts from game 1.
    Plan C was MCM as a return to the Riley style which wasn’t probably expected early on. MCM has shown a tendency to be slow on reads and little late on delivery. He looked good when runnign in the civil war and passing against Arizona, but both were very bad defenses.
    Now the goal may be to go towards an offense that loads up on running plays and mixes in quick passing plays with little time for decisions/reading the defense during the play to eliminate the DG injury. And take away MCM’s need to decide where the ball needs to go.
    I think Luton has a lot of potential because we haven’t seen him in game action yet. He is the classic “give us the back-up qb”. MCM is a known quantity, albeit an improving qb.

    We have 2 qbs and 1 wr on the roster who have won 2 games each for us in the last 2 years. None is above another at this point, and Luton is coming out of a JC program that was running the offense that GA is talking about. I think Luton is the guy and MCM is a good solid back-up option if things go awry.

    It’s not like they are going to win 10 games with MCM anyway, right?

  • Nicebeaver Nicebeaver says:
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    Bruce Judson still not enrolled or on the oregon roster. Academic issues, apparently.
    I’m shocked

    • angry angry says:
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      That dude was trouble all along. He will wind up at Last Chance U.

      • issaquahbeav says:
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        Big time douchebag that trolled Beav fans at the end of his commitment

        • Nicebeaver Nicebeaver says:
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          I don’t know that he’s 100% out yet. Still has summer online archery course to pass. That final can be a bitch though

          • beavergopher beavergopher says:
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            Has to spit an apple off Taggart’s head to pass the final.

          • orangejulius orangejulius says:
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            “spit”?

          • beavergopher beavergopher says:
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            Yes LOL. With a big friggin lugee. Damn/Dam autocorrect.

  • angry angry says:
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    Speaking of Last Chance U, I finished it up last night.

    I’m surprised Buddy Stevens hasn’t been sued. He’s clearly abusing the players and forcing them to play injured, jeopardizing their careers. That guy is not at all about his players. Just into setting the JUCO win record (as if anyone cares about this) and bullying. A full grown man bullying teenagers. There’s nothing sadder than Buddy Stevens.

  • Beavlover69 says:
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    “Yeah but name one other Luke Falk in NCAA History”

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baker_Mayfield

    Crazy that 2 “once in a century” QBs are playing in the same year. I know it’s annoying to research your wild theories Angry but maybe see if you can do it sometime lol

    • angry angry says:
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      Yeah he looks pretty good. I don’t watch that crappy conference.
      So do the math: it will be 200 years before we see players like this walking on.

    • orangejulius orangejulius says:
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      Someone should pass onto GA that he need not recruit any future QBs. Obviously walk ons capable of starting for P5 teams, and playing well, are available in every town in America.

  • BlackBandits BlackBandits says:
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    What kind eligibility does Tyner have?

    • Nicebeaver Nicebeaver says:
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      Most likely just this year, but could potentially apply for a medical hardship. Hard to say if that would happen and I wouldn’t count on it.

  • beavergopher beavergopher says:
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    I’m with Angry on the QB issue. This is a make or break season for GA. He has to get to a bowl this year to get some recruiting traction. MM has stuck with it through demotions and been the consummate team guy. I have to believe he is well respected by his teammates for that. A loss to open the season will be a real momentum killer. MM is the better bet to start against CSU. If he sucks, put in Luton. This still going to be a run heavy team and he knows the offense better than the other guys. He has paid his dues and earned the right give it a go as a starter.

    • angry angry says:
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      Yeah.
      The only reason I can see being infatuated with Luton is the thrill of the unknown. Like maybe he’s the next Aaron Rodgers. Yeah, maybe. And if that’s the case he’ll get a chance to prove it at some point when McM goes down for some plays/games. No QB plays every snap and Luton would get a shot at some point, it just shouldn’t be to start the season. If McM isn’t getting it done against CSU it would also be appropriate to go to Luton at the half as a spark type move. But starting him game one is just too risky. This team is coming off two wins and a CW victory. They have momentum and positive energy with McM. Luton is only popular because of his size and arm. He’s done nothing to earn the job. People continually fall for the person who looks the part and conversely underrate result driven players. I thought Beaver fans would see this by now since it’s year 3 of the same thing…

  • mexibeav mexibeav says:
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    http://www.oregonlive.com/beavers/index.ssf/2017/07/best_quotes_from_pac-12_media.html

    Oregon State coach Gary Andersen on the Beavers’ quarterback situation:

    “I’ve had the game managed for the first years in this conference, and I know if you have a game manager at quarterback, you’re going to be an average football team. The league is too good to just have a game manager at the quarterback position. You have to have somebody that can be a great player.”

    • angry angry says:
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      A guy who has struck out in QB analysis 3 straight years dating back to WI and who clearly knows nothing about analyzing QBs implying Luton is a great player. Not a good sign.
      If I were McM and read that I’d transfer immediately.

  • Beav2000 says:
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    What GA is saying is, we are not Alabama……we need a special QB to make up for our lack of talent as compared to the top tier Pac 12 teams. I mean he’s trying. He’s getting into big boy recruiting battles, but let’s be honest, it’s tough to recruit to Corvallis.

    • Jack Jack says:
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      We’ll see how tough it is when we’re winning.

      I wonder why that sentiment sticks. A place is a place. Things are things. Players go to school to learn stuff and play football. I thought they were too busy not getting paid for their job-not-jobs to worry about distractions like how different one place is from another.

      Or maybe it was that a certain staff spent a decade repeating a mantra until it stuck.

  • ohiobeav says:
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    Maybe GA sees McM like Angry viewed Jake Thompson. He’s seen enough and won’t be impressed no matter the results because in the end McM won’t get you over the top of the hill you’ve been climbing.

    • angry angry says:
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      Except McM won the biggest game of the year. Thompson collapsed in the biggest games.

      • Sparkyd73 says:
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        Again, the offensive line and running backs won, MM took the snap.

  • ohiobeav says:
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    No argument with you, but maybe GA sees bigger games ahead and the civil war was just a game against a last place conference team. GA says show me more than that, waiting for someone to step up and wondering if McM may implode in bigger games. I thought the bigger game was Washington St. Up by 3 touchdowns and don’t score enough in the second half to hold on.
    Civil War was a big win and McM played great, I agree. Just pondering how to put GA’s statements all together into a coherent viewpoint. He mentioned the qb has only 2.5 sec to get it out of his hand “in this league”. My guess is he underestimated the type of pass rush and defensive pressure that is present in the Pac12 and sees McM’s tendency to hesitate as a flaw that can’t be overcome, so he brings in Phillips to help with quick routes, Luton to throw it.

  • Nicebeaver Nicebeaver says:
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    Sedge has a write up after tonight’s practice

    https://oregonstate.rivals.com/news/5-things-we-learned-from-osu-s-2nd-practice

    Slaughter thinks Luton has the slight edge to be named starter after bend week

  • ohiobeav says:
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    It also occurs to me that Bolden will no longer be the “go-to guy” for 3rd and long, which will be better for any qb on the roster. Much less predictable and other players stay involved.

    • beavergopher beavergopher says:
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      Plus they won’t run backwards after getting the first down.

  • mckalk mckalk says:
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    I’ve kind of given up on this, McM is never going to be GA’s guy, so here we go with “Mach 2” for GA’s own QB’s, he struck out with Collins who he preordained, so I guess all we can do is wait and see with Luton. I personally think that McM is ideal for a run heavy offense (kind of a 21st century Bob Griese) which is what OSU should be, but it does not look like that is going to happen. I’m starting to think McM is getting the blame for Villamin’s flame out last year?

    • angry angry says:
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      This should be a good season. I feel like Luton/GA could sabotage it…

      Starting McM all season I’d think we get at least 6 wins and make a bowl. Start Luton, could be 9 wins or 2. Imagine Luton starts game 1 just because GA wants “his guy” and we lose? Then what? First it destroys all last years momentum/building, and then he has to turn to McM yet again? So embarrassing.

      Also, who was the last good Juco QB in the PAC? Rodgers obviously…anyone since? It seems pretty rare for a Juco QB to step in and win big anywhere, but honestly I don’t follow much outside the Beavs so maybe it’s not as rare as I think.

      • Alex says:
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        I mean, he’s no Aaron Rodgers but the obvious JUCO QB that comes to mind is Matt Moore. Also Moevao, who was solid if not spectacular.

        • beavergopher beavergopher says:
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          Moore is not a good example. He was a huge recruit out of HS and didn’t even play football at the JC after he left fUCLA.

          • angry angry says:
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            Moore was also pretty awful his first year, despite being a 4-star stud for UCLA who had played in the PAC before. He didn’t become good until game 6 of his senior year.

      • oneoldbeav oneoldbeav says:
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        The argument that the importance of the Colo State game dictates starting McM, the known quantity, makes a lot of sense to me.

        And a loss there, if Luton starts, won’t necessarily mean a quick move to McM, I believe it will take more than one loss for GA to “admit” that his first pick isn’t “the guy”.

        • angry angry says:
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          And a loss there, if Luton starts, won’t necessarily mean a quick move to McM, I believe it will take more than one loss for GA to “admit” that his first pick isn’t “the guy”.

          Yeah probably right that it would take more than 1 loss for him to admit it, so the season would be over very early and set this rebuild back another year. It’s risky, and I can’t see a good reason for taking such a risk unless this guy had proven he’s great at this level. GA is reckless.

    • oneoldbeav oneoldbeav says:
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      Two pretty good points there, mckalk. Beavs should be a run heavy offense, and McM seems ideal for that. BTW didn’t GA recently indicate a target of about 2/3 run vs pass?

      With Chuckie K. on staff though, I gotta believe GA is hearing a lot of support for Luton being the guy, again appearances not results (at least D1 results) seem likely to be the factor.

      And, I agree that Villamin’s flame out may affect the perception of McM.

      • angry angry says:
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        I personally think that McM is ideal for a run heavy offense
        Two pretty good points there, mckalk. Beavs should be a run heavy offense

        Yes. We don’t need a gunslinger. We actually need a game manager (that’s what teams that have good ground games and D need at QB), and GA is bashing that. So odd. I think Phillips, Keaton, McGiven are all getting in GA’s ear, and he’s going to trust them and make the wrong call.

        This is a textbook example of “A Bird in the hand is worth two in the bush…”

        • mckalk mckalk says:
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          When I read that quote from GA regarding team’s with game manager’s never excelling or whatever it was, I was thinking, maybe the college game, but in the pros, there are examples. Trent Dilfer has SB ring because he spent a season not fucking up!

          • angry angry says:
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            Alex Smith.
            Peyton Manning was a game manger by his final season. There are many many more. GA doesn’t know what he’s talking about (at least he admits it), to be as frank as possible. He’s being a meathead and acting like throwing a ball 70 yards means anything.

            He also makes the faulty assumption that McM is only a game manager. His stats and progression through the years suggest otherwise.

      • Jack Jack says:
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        Even if MM has finally learned the system and reduced his wind-up by four seconds (about half of it), he still doesn’t have the arm to make the sideline passes. He can drop it in the bucket better than anyone else we’ve had on the roster for the past couple years. And his inside throws have become more efficient.

        These are all pluses, btw, when talking about how well our O staff is doing to develop QBs. They got one of the group of three we had in 2015 to a C+/B- level of play in the Pac 12. Who knows where we’d be if we had to watch one year (and one first down the next year?) of LDR followed by the next recruit?

  • angry angry says:
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    In the spring scrimmage, Luton looked only so so. Threw some bad INTs. Had a few good throws. Just seemed so hit and miss. I mean maybe he’s progressed since, but in general, if a QB forces throws/makes bad decisions they rarely change.

    I’m convinced this is once again GA wanting to force his will, gamble big, and hope to hit a HR on a guy who has the tools and looks the part. Hope is not a strategy, as we learned under Riley. And also, how many years in a row can GA do this? New QB every year.

    All that being said, I hope Luton is Rodgers 2.0 and dominates the league. I’d put the odds of that around 20%. It’s not like I am rooting against the guy. He seems like a good guy in the interviews. I want a good season (at least 6 wins), and just think this guy will have a bigger learning curve than people think. A lot of bad INTs vs good competition. I feel like McM has worked a lot of that out and could have a really nice, efficient season (65% completion, 20TDs, 8int type season with some nice rushing stats).

  • angry angry says:
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    Continuing with the thought above, I’d say McM is a safe bet (i.e. his floor) for stats like these:

    65% completion, 20TD. 8 INT. 450 rushing yards. 6 rush TDs.
    So that’s 26 TDs total. With the RBs on this roster that’s a nice compliment at QB.

    And that’s his floor — based on last season extrapolated and being a year older. He’s probably mastered the playbook at this point. His ceiling could be higher.

    How much better than that will Luton be?
    Luton going to score over 35 total TDs with fewer INTs?

    Just seems like a huge gamble for little payoff.

    • beavergopher beavergopher says:
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      This^^^^^

    • bendbeaver bendbeaver says:
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      We don’t have much info on Luton, so it’s perceived as a bigger gamble than maybe it actually is to us fans. I’d be open to gathering more on Luton and how he looks in August before deciding Anderson is making a mistake. I’m also reading that it’s still a QB battle.

      • oneoldbeav oneoldbeav says:
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        I’m … reading that it’s still a QB battle.”
        I hope what you are reading is correct, an honest battle with results judged by a capable staff should yield the best choice. But do we have that?

        Angry has made a decent case for the thought that this staff isn’t especially capable in this area. And as for an honest/fair battle, it is hard to tell from the outside.

        One thing strikes me though, if it is still a QB battle, is that simply a way of giving one candidate more time to prove his worth? Seems to me, of the two, Luton is the one who has the most to prove and benefits the longer the battle goes on. McM has had, what, three years? At this level, with this team, in actual games.

        So, again, it’s the known vs the unknown. It is worth noting that, because of Luton’s ill health in the Spring, more time for the battle to play out isn’t, necessarily, proof that the staff is trying to rig this thing.

      • Doozeldorf says:
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        Let’s face it, this is going to be decided in game 1. If we lose then GA is a failure and we might as well write off the season. If we win then GA is a genius and a bowling we will go.

        • beavergopher beavergopher says:
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          Excellent!

        • Ripper says:
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          Gopher — which alternative is “excellent”? 🙂

        • Sparkyd73 says:
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          Exactly my problem with this topic, making this team be summed up by the qb is a bad logical footing. If Luton starts and Beavers win it doesn’t mean that GA made the right choice. And that was the same argument philosophy that Angry used with Thompson all year. There are always multiple factors in a team game and a person can always use those to say “see, I was right.

          At the end of the day GA has made it clear that he wants an excitement factor to the offense. I really like the sentiment, better have a bit of a gambler mentality if you want to compete with a small market team against better positioned teams. Yep, gamblers lose sometimes but they are entertaining always and sometimes hit it big.

          • angry angry says:
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            My point with Thompson was that I didn’t trust him in big games, and sure enough he collapsed in the biggest.

            Also, most gamblers lose. It’s why casinos and stock markets exist. There is a time and place to gamble, yet nobody has made a convincing argument that this is one of them.

    • Jack Jack says:
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      MM could have those stats in his wins, minus five rushing TDs. We have RBs. They can run it in. But he has meltdown games too. He’s not beyond that level yet. So you can add about 4 TDs, 8 INTs and lower the comp% to about 60.

      I think that’s about the benchmark for a 7-5 season. If we get that out of either or both, I’m good.

    • Lancer says:
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      While the quarterback decision process can be criticized, given questions on the offensive line, I feel better knowing /either/ Luton or McMaryion can play, should one of them go down.

      • Nicebeaver Nicebeaver says:
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        There is the possibility that McMaryion could grad transfer somewhere this summer and have 2 years to play 2. I could see a team that is desperate for QB depth being an attractive option for him if Luton indeed is handed the reigns.
        For that reason, I think they will drag this thing out, despite their claims that they wanted a decision on #1 QB to be made early in camp (originally they said Spring ball)

        • Jack Jack says:
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          How early is fair?

          Two days?

          Three?

          I’d give it until the end of the second week before I started mumbling anything about early.

  • beavergopher beavergopher says:
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    GA seems to be trying to jump a year in the normal CFB progression for downtrodden teams.
    Year 1…..Lose big while implementing your system. GA excelled at this LOL.
    Year 2…..Lose close and show progress as your team/ players get better. Check.
    Year 3…..Win close with a tougher team with less mental errors. Recruits developing.
    Year 4…..Win big. You have all your own recruits and the players know the system and have gone through several S and C cycles.

    GA wants to have year 4 in year 3. Luton has the higher ceiling but also the higher probability of TO’s
    due to his lack of PT at this level and inexperience with the offense.
    So what is going on behind the scenes or on the recruiting trail that makes GA want to swing for the fences this year vs play small ball and tack on some wins and get to a bowl game?

  • beavergopher beavergopher says:
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    OT: Called the ticket office yesterday and was told they had almost sold out their allotment for the CSU game. Snagged a couple. Wife and I are driving over. Any of you degenerates going?

  • oneoldbeav oneoldbeav says:
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    OT: Number changes.
    Jim Wilson (who previously tweeted his feeling that, “incumbent Marcus McM is the man to beat at QB”) tweets the following number changes. Perhaps good info for those who will be attending open practices:
    X. Crawford – 5 (was 22)
    B. Ugwoegbu – 1 (47)
    I. Hodgins – 17 (7)
    T. Bradford – 8 (19)
    J. Irvine – 6 (24)
    S. Wilson – 2 (28)

  • Nicebeaver Nicebeaver says:
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    https://youtu.be/m9_zKmyeK8E

    This Clune interview from Sedge yesterday is a little interesting. He doesn’t seem happy that they’ve already staryed fall camp because of the early schedule.
    On the DLine, Garcia, Evans and Aydun are all question marks. He sounds like he anticipates Aydun and Evans to be back but doesn’t disclose the issue for Aydun. Then, with Garcia he deflects the question saying they need to ask the question to someone else (acsdemics still?) but he says that Garcia is at least practicing with the team.

    Anyway, the DLine position group has turned into our biggest question mark for this season. We need all 3 of those guys available.

    • Ryan says:
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      That is concerning for all three guys involved. Hope all three are available by our first game.

    • beavergopher beavergopher says:
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      A lot of coaches are bitching about banning the two a days and Urban Meyer was saying at the B1G media that extending the camps out because of that could lead to MORE injuries.

  • Ryan says:
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    OT: Did anyone else notice The Oregonian didnt run an article about us and the Pac12 media day. If Im wrong please let me know but I didnt see anything by us. Only saw Oregon and Washington. I used my ad blocker too.

    • Nicebeaver Nicebeaver says:
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      They’re still running their background checks on Nall and Hungalu. There has to be dirt in there somewhere…

      • helmsley says:
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        They actually did – it’s in the banner when you open the sports/beavers section but I didn’t want to click on the article. The routine background check is crap. Moran had a tip and went from there.

    • blackbug says:
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      I no longer check their articles as I cannot morally support the garbage they spew out.

  • BeaverBill BeaverBill says:
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    Probably not a popular stance here on the QB situation but I think we have to wait and see.
    1) Luton was not 100% physically in Spring game yet held his own.
    2) GA is letting it play out… he doesn’t have to, but he is. (GA is the type that doesn’t give a crap about what others think and he will do what he wants. So letting it play out to me is he wants the best guy who proves it in practices to be the guy).
    3) There has only been 2 friggin practices so far… time will tell.
    4) The reports on how our QB’s are doing are not from GA.but from 3rd party write-ups like Slaughter who should not care who is crowned and they are saying it is a tight race where Luton might have the edge.
    So for me I’m going to keep reading the reports from eye witnesses and just see how it plays out. I’m not going to dog GA unless the reports are showing otherwise.

  • ObjCritic says:
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    OT – Think ‘Tino Allen might return kicks with Tyner? That could be fun to watch.

    • angry angry says:
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      Allen has the ability to start at WR as a freshman, imo.
      Dude is fast with a legit frame. He was a top 20 WR in Florida, which is a big deal.

      • ObjCritic says:
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        I hope Hodgins and Allen get their opportunities then…last year’s WRs for the most part probably don’t scare anyone. Villamin SHOULD be physically imposing, and hopefully will this year…but Hodgins/Allen/Taylor should bring an order of magnitude more talent/ability….

      • alex says:
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        WR will be an interesting position to watch this fall camp. A lot of potential, zero proven starters.

        Villamin needs to shake off whatever was going on last year. Probably has the highest upside of the group for this year, but who knows whether he’s able to step up.
        Collins missed a ton of time with health issues and is still pretty raw and new to the position. Excellent athlete though.
        Bradford – good production in limited time last year. I’m high on him- think he carves out a significant role.
        Hernandez- was servicable as a possession guy last year. Needs to improve or he likely gets buried in the depth chart.
        Bodden – walkon soph and special teams stud who the coaches started talking up late last season. Could be in the mix.
        Newcomers- basically all the new WRs will have a shot to contribute.

        Flemings – maybe the least likely since he’s so small, but I like his attitude. I think he’s got some James Rodgers in him. “I will play this year. Redshirting is not an option.”
        Hodgins – Talented and had the benefit of spring ball and the off season to help prepare. Likely a big factor.
        Taylor – With the team for the offseason, but wasn’t able to practice for spring ball. Good player. Brother is a former NFL player and a GA coach.
        Allen – Solid as noted above.
        Short – Should be in the mix as well.

  • Corliss says:
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    Reports that DEs Liuchan and Isac Garcia are off the roster.

    Garcia was touted, if I remember correctly.

    Liuchan never got on the field, I believe…

    • Corliss says:
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      Wonder if Garcia can fix his issues??

    • Nicebeaver Nicebeaver says:
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      Would be nice to have Joah Robinett still on the team…

    • beavergopher beavergopher says:
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      Garcia was an academic risk. I would assume that is the cause. A lot of effort into that kid with no return if this is true. At the risk of offending Helmsley again, you can’t build a program with this type of, i.e. academic risk, players. More often not they will let you down either by lack of effort or lack of ability. Perhaps with an established team/ culture you can take a flyer an a high risk/reward player, but not when you are essentially starting from scratch like GA. A couple days into camp and our deep defensive front seven is not looking so deep. Can we have any good news?

  • mckalk mckalk says:
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    Doesn’t CSU have a pretty crappy run defense? I hope GA takes that into consideration if he starts Luton. He doesn’t need to do too much. I don’t want to see some crazy first down pass for an interception when Nall can just run up the gut for 8 yards. The final 20 minutes or so of the Ducks game was a thing of beauty last year.

    • beavergopher beavergopher says:
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      They played in Minneapolis last year and my Gophers were able to run on them pretty well with the worlds crappiest QB providing no passing threat. Their run defense was suspect, so Nall and more Nall till they stop him.

  • angry angry says:
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    Per Canzano:

    Oregon State QB Jake Luton @JakeLuton6 has established himself as the early and clear leader in the race, per source. “Looks great.”

    Is the source McGiven who thought StS looked great? Lol.
    But seriously, if Luton is great we’ll win 8 games.

    • ObjCritic says:
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      Though Luton doesn’t have a LONG history of passing – a veer QB in HS, he really didn’t throw a lot until last year – the RB stable should make it a bit easier for him and if the young WR talent can separate, the throws should be pretty simple for him in this offense. I don’t think he’ll have trouble throwing the ball like Collins (awful) or even Garretson (seemed pretty limited).

      Luton willl have the benefit of practicing against a pretty good set of DBs and LBs to help him adjust to PAC-level talent, but that adjustment to D1 speed/ability will result in some TO’s. A better OSU D and a good return game (P, KO) should help ease that pain.

      Also, he’s not immobile. I think with his height his stride and speed are a deceptive and he’ll surprise some people.

    • Nicebeaver Nicebeaver says:
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      On the plus side for Luton, he only played JUCO ball for one season and during that season he set multiple school records amd also led his division in multiple passing categories.
      So….he must be a quick learner

      • WFO WFO says:
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        Yeah, after he committed I kept an eye on him in passing. He kinda looked like shit for the first couple of games, then his improvement was pretty impressive from game to game.

  • Sparkyd73 says:
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    I believe this whole thread is in complete contrast to the argument that this site had with MR. I agreed with the knock on Riley that he always went with the incumbent and didn’t play the best player. Now GA is getting called reckless because he is daring to go with the lesser known commodity. Which is it?
    There is a fine line between critical and contrary.

    • Beavlover69 says:
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      Angry left logical thought behind long ago. The site is still great for news on the team and discussion though

    • Jack Jack says:
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      Are we talking QB? I don’t remember much discussion on that except for the year Mannion was hurt and Vaz started some games, including a bowl game he had no business playing other than spot duty.

      That and the Wisconsin debacle were the only times I recall having discussions about this kind of thing at that position.

      Now… if you want to talk other position groups, we can point to several players who were on the field for some mysteriously unknown practice skills that never translated to the games.

    • angry angry says:
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      Hah.

      Nice one. As mentioned here over and over, the one thing Riley was pretty good at was QB analysis. It was said then and now. That you confuse that somehow with this situation is a you problem.

      It’s also funny that you deduct that by disliking Riley for being too conservative and taking forever to make changes to personnel, it follows we should be reckless and do the opposite.

      Obviously the correct thing to do is start the best player. If Luton is the best then he should start, but he’s going to have to put up some big numbers (35+ total TDs, which is dubious he can do) to be better than McM, who has a high floor even as a “game manager” (not sure it’s a fair tag).

      • Beavlover69 says:
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        He never said it was just about the QB

        • Jack Jack says:
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          Then his data sets are going to conflict with his take more than they will support it.

          What you thought was logic just became less so.

          Everyone has an opinion (or observable trait(s) which can be applied to certain positions which leads them to their opinions) about every position. Some people were fine that Keith Pankey spent most plays hugging a TE and getting credit for assisted tackles because they ended up at his feet after the play… not that he had that many assisted tackles for a LB anyway. Some people were fine with playing a walk-on OL at DT because he was just standing around doing nothing on O. Some people thought Tuimaunei could play S or that Boom could play WR when he was clearly a DE talent coming in.

          So, talking different positions, yeah… replace these people… with anyone… please. QB is a little different. Pick on the “last three years” v. “always” conflation if you like. That fallacy is out there. But you can point to MR’s QB situation once… plus a first half that meant Thomas Tyner would never play for the Beavs.

          • angry angry says:
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            Then his data sets are going to conflict with his take more than they will support it.

            What you thought was logic just became less so.

            Exactly.

      • Sparkyd73 says:
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        Nice deflection, somehow qb makes the argument invalid?

        Also, assuming a benchmark that MM would be at and then using that as the litmus is not reasonable. QB gets way to much blame or praise. Just like saying MM is good be a use OSU won the civil war game or saying that he isn’t because of the Washington game.

        What I will be looking for from Luton is a guy that can take the pressure off Ball by making a team pay for stacking the box. I will also judge him by the ability to make good decisions. TDs can be arbitrary as a passing drive can be capped by a short 3rd run or a rushing drive by a 1 yard pass.

        • angry angry says:
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          Also, assuming a benchmark that MM would be at and then using that as the litmus is not reasonable.

          It’s not an assumption. It’s an extrapolation of last year’s stats, because, you know, he actually played in the Pac-12. So we have the luxury to extrapolate instead of assume (which, ironically, we have to do with Luton).

          Whoever is QB will also have much better WRs this year and should get a bump in numbers because of it.

          You tell me how Luton’s 56.5% and 40/15 TD/INT ratio (vs bad teams no less) translate to the PAC. For reference, Aaron Rodgers had 19 and 24 TDs the two years he played at Cal…

          So go ahead and extrapolate them accurately and show me the upside.

          Nice deflection, somehow qb makes the argument invalid?

          What deflection?
          This conversation is about QBs. It’s GA’s weakness. He usually plays the right guys at other positions; therefore they’re non stories.

          • beavergopher beavergopher says:
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            Getting our TE back will really help who ever gets the QB job.

          • Sparkyd73 says:
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            Deflection by saying QB is different and Riley is QB smart and GA is QB dumb, in the Riley era you used to make that statement regularly about playing the incumbent (I agreed at the time). But, I don’t see a big difference now in what you are saying with MM.

            Using O and UofA last year and extrapolating that is not great science.

          • angry angry says:
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            Using O and UofA last year and extrapolating that is not great science.

            Again, for the 3rd time, also Washington State, Utah, and UCLA.
            Those are the games he played well and played the most, so those are the games one has to use. Obviously I also factored in he did poorly vs Stanford and Washington, and hence the 8Ints. I think defenses of that level will overwhelm him again this year if he plays versus them.

            Riley era you used to make that statement regularly about playing the incumbent

            My point was simply Riley had an eye for QBs. We rarely had questions if we’d have a Pac-12 caliber QB on the roster. It was simply which one. The fact McM was a Riley recruit actually give him the edge in my book because Riley simply has a better eye for QBs than Andersen. That’s his only advantage over GA; might as well admit it.

            GA is superior in every other way. Luton might be great, might be awful, and you’re confusing players with a concept. My entire point here isn’t to bash Luton but rather bash the risk/reward assessment by the staff. I actually like Luton. Great interview, seems like he has skills, etc. Still don’t think he’s the smart choice in terms of risk assessment and management. That’s my issue, not the player.

  • homefry homefry says:
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    A critical analysis of a “critical view on OSU athletics”

  • angry angry says:
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    For posterity, because the butt hurt crowd is now out:

    I’m not anti-Luton. I have him ranked as a high 3-star. I do think it’s risky to start the season with him. “Bird in the hand is worth two in the bush” sums it up best. McM’s floor is around 20TDs and 6 rushing TDs. Luton’s floor and ceiling are both unknown.

    If we lose momentum by losing early games as Luton figures out the league, it kills the season. I don’t see that happening with McM, so for that reason I think he’s the better guy to start, then let Luton get late game action/injury action. Luton might turn out great and throw 40tds. He might be awful. Nobody knows. It’s not like the Seth situation entirely where it was clear he’d be awful. Luton could actually be good, but personally I think the risk/reward is skewed more toward risk and without a necessary reason given the RBs on this roster.

    My issue here isn’t with any player but the risk/reward analysis.

    • Beaverbill Beaverbill says:
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      May the best player win the spot and he better do good or we shall crucify him. 🙂

    • Gobeavers92 says:
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      McM last season rushed for 75 yards on 29 carries with 1 TD

      Yep his “floor” looks to be 450 yards rushing with 6 TD.

      • angry angry says:
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        Yeah, because they only let him run one game. Hence why everyone was screaming the entire year about it. And the one game he was allowed to run he ran for 80. So 450/6TD is pretty conservative.

        • Gobeavers92 says:
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          Because of course all the defenses we play will be just as bad as UofO last season. You can’t make this stuff up. SMH

          • angry angry says:
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            If all the defenses were that bad his floor would be 960 yards (80yardsx12games). Which is why I said 450, because obviously they won’t all be that bad. Derp. You’re lucky OSU doesn’t have an SAT with those math skills and logic.

            40 yards per game is conservative if they let him run.

  • Finish Reser says:
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    To be haopy about Week 1, I would like to see Oregon State win by atleast 9 points. Something like 30-21 is mininum it would take for me to feel good about the start of the 2017 season and a very likely ending in a bowl.

    Take a win but 8 or less and team isn’t maximizing its Power 5 status and would be suspect amongst fellow P5 peers. Would ideally love to win by around 13 or 14 at CSU which will take a good game in all 3 phases.

    A loss would be a devastating start for the fanbase coming off the momentum of a 10 point Civil War win. Andersen I hope will do what he says of wanting 60-65% of the offense to be the run game this year. With Nall and Tyner and some Pierce there is just too much firepower in the backfield for that not to be somewhere around 64% of the offense.

    The other 36% is some quick throws and some intermediate and 2-3 deeper throws a game beyond 20 yards to stretch the D and keep the runners with lanes to hit. Tyner, Nall and Pierce will keep options open for just enough throws that other Ds won’t be able to just put everything into the run. Giys like Hodgins should ne reliable targets and Collins needs to focus on possessing the ball first then trying for extra yards.

    6-7 wins looks like the odds on favorite for OSU this year. With 60-65% running and what Nall, Tyner and Pierce can do, I am a slight lean towards 7 wins. The QB first does need to be an effective and smart game manager. That is what made Jonathan Smith a good QB.

    If Luton can make some intermediate or longer throws on occasion with other quick strike routes to mix into our attack that is focused on 1st downs, time of possession and keeping the chains moving then it will bode well.

    Key is not being lured into the fallacy of almost completing passes as accomplishing anything. An incomplete is a negative play. Better than an intercept but much worse than 3-4 hard yards earned that put you in far better down and distance.

    • BeaverJuiced says:
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      Whole-heartedly agree with this assessment. Oregon State under Andersen will be on the right track this year for sure and probably in future years with 60-65% running. Stacked at RB this year. Maybe if we land Crocker it can dip a little for a few years but would still want over 55% runs even then. Its a more winning identity that frustrates teams when you line up and they can’t keep you from getting first downs. Also makes you a winner in the time of possession game as you mention. 7 wins this year if Nall, Tyner and Pierce get the pigskin on the regular. Maybe GA’s first Sun Bowl?

  • angry angry says:
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    I’m not sure it’s going to matter who the QB is since the D-line diminishes each day.

    Big news of the day: Defensive ends Isaac Garcia is longer with the football team, per an OSU spokesman. This is massive for the Beavers because they have already lost so much depth on the defensive line. Craig Evans is still in limbo, and the Beavers already lost Kenny Turnier as he transferred. It was unclear on whether or not Garcia would be eligible this season, but if he was, it would have been a much needed body for OSU on the line. And with Liuchan leaving, the depth just continues to diminish. Right now, the Beavs are in a situation where if they lose a few guys to injury, walk ons might be starting on the D-Line.

    They might want to think about converting some players to DEs and fast.

  • Nicebeaver Nicebeaver says:
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    Liuchan is back on the roster. Those reports were bunk.
    As it is, we have something like 7 or 8 DEs still. I’m not worried about that position.
    Adun and Evans are the ones I would want to keep the closest eye on

    • angry angry says:
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      Why is Sedge writing fake reports?
      Is their source Angie, who’s trying to put them out of business? Lol

      • Nicebeaver Nicebeaver says:
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        I think Gina was the one who reported both players were out

        • bleedorange says:
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          They said it was via a spokesperson.

        • oneoldbeav oneoldbeav says:
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          GT reported both players out, maybe Gina and others did as well.
          Since the GT piece was based on “staff reports” and not a particular writer, I’m guessing the original info came from the school.
          He is on the roster today and Garcia is not.

    • alex says:
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      Also, while it’s a bummer for depth, neither Garcia nor Luchian were likely to be big factors this year. Garcia hasn’t played a down, and he’s practiced pretty minimally IIRC. Luchian hasn’t really done anything to date.

      Losing Garcia is a much bigger deal in the longer term outlook- next 2-3 year.

      Agree that Aydun and Evans are the real difference makers for this year.

      • angry angry says:
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        I like Luchian. Think he can play.

        No clue on Garcia, but I’m glad Luchian is on the roster.

        • beavergopher beavergopher says:
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          Didn’t USC pull their offer to Garcia due to academics?

          • BlackBandits BlackBandits says:
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            No he decommited, or at least that’s how it was presented. I assume a pulled offer is most likely the truth.

  • Ryan says:
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    OT: Oregon picks up four commits so far today. Apprently Taggert also brings in the entire family feel when he recurits a player. Plus having Phil Knight facilities, Nike branding at Oregon now, how can we compete against them? How can we have a chance to beat them when they have every advantage in spending and marketing power? Its really disgusting what they are able to do recuriting wise. Their cocky a hole fans are on fire right now. I want to be wrong about this, but this is what I see…

    • angry angry says:
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      Well we did just beat them.

      But yeah, their recruiting is impressive. I’m not sure of their numbers and how they’ll get all these guys in. Seems like a ton of commits for July. I guess he’s selling them on him being the first black coach to win a National Title and somehow masking that with the fake “we’re family” vibe, too. Unfortunate that recruits can’t see through that and see it’s all about him.

      College football is disgusting due to PK types. Probably the worst sport. It’s too bad I’m a Beav.

      • Ryan says:
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        I know we did beat them. I want to see us go into their house and win again this year too.

        • Beav2000 says:
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          Something is fishy in eugene……I mean I get some of the recruiting advantage, but this is ridiculous! Total rebuild with the coaching staff, and it’s not like willie has some crazy pedigree…..I dunno, seems like maybe some of that PK money might be trickling down to recruits.

          • Beav2000 says:
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            Who’s gonna start the investigation?

          • angry angry says:
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            He’s selling the “first black to win a title” thing. It’s so cheap.

          • oneoldbeav oneoldbeav says:
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            I’m not sure money is directly trickling down to recruits. Seems willie is using the “total rebuild” and the carrot of possible immediate playing time at a school which recently was a national title contender to lure in some starry eyed kids.

            How many are swayed by the swoosh swag? How many have be given “promises” of a job with a company they’ve patronized most of their life?

            So far it’s all marketing. Marketing by a staff whose primary credentials are in that area. Marketing which makes kids forget about the early missteps of this new staff and about the chances that willie is offering more than he can deliver.

            A loss to the Beavs, a 4-5 W season, and the loss of Leavitt or Cristobal and we’ll see just how slick willie is.

            GA is too much of a straight shooter for many HS kids, lets hope those who have earned their big boy pants under GA can whip the ucks again this year, in their house and go bowling. A realistic expectation, IMHO, and one which will lead to improved recruiting for the Beavs.

          • Jack Jack says:
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            who

            the fuck

            cares?

            It weakens teams that rely on super-duper highy ranked talent, like UW or USC, not ours.

            A cake made of icing isn’t a cake.

      • beavergopher beavergopher says:
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        GA is behind the curve for this class. Disappointing with the VFC redo coming online.

        • angry angry says:
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          GA is in an interesting spot. If recruiting doesn’t pickup and Luton fails there will be a lot of chatter.

          • beavergopher beavergopher says:
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            I will have spit out the Kool-Aid.
            http://www.x-entertainment.com/pics/kool1.jpg

          • Beav2000 says:
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            Problem is, who would we get that’s better? I still believe in GA, but the recruits willie is lining up…….geez! We just have to pray for some things to go our way…..a lot of things! And that it all blows up in willies face……just because you bring in talent doesnt mean you will win……remember Brady Hoke at michigan?

          • angry angry says:
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            Willie is going to have a nightmare, I think.
            The class looks amazing on paper, but you have a self-centered coach and typical O primadonnas. Bad combo. He did turn some programs around, so maybe I’m wrong, but my gut is that he’s not a good dude and things will happen.

          • WFO WFO says:
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            You have to have talent to win, but good recruiting in no way guarantees success. Look at how bad Texas has been and Tennessee and Georgia and plenty of other teams with perennial top 20 recruiting classes and 6-7 wins year after year.

          • angry angry says:
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            Nebraska under Riley…they’ll be lucky to win 5 games.

          • 88thorangejulius 88thorangejulius says:
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            Speaking of MR, while GA is recruiting similar ‘#stars’ as when MR was here, he is getting much better players, setting a tougher mindset, and making less idiotic in game mistakes. MR lasted a long time at OSU, don’t see any reason GA should worry based on recruiting, anyway.

        • ReverendBeav says:
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          Why do you say GA is behind the curve with this class? It’s been reported that this will be an abnormally small class due to lack of open scholarships.

          http://www.oregonlive.com/recruiting/index.ssf/2017/07/recruiting_oregon_state_beaver_2.html

    • Jack Jack says:
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      You see poorly.

      So what if Nikegon has the power of child slave labor behind them? All the dead children who amassed Phil Knight’s fortune don’t know how to strap on a pair of work boots. They can sew blue collars on their camo jerseys. They can gussy up the dandies all they want. But they can’t make a rich fuck understand anything about hard work, no matter what he says.

  • scotty says:
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    Answering the twitter question “who will lead the Beavs in sacks?” Jake Luton!

    • Nicebeaver Nicebeaver says:
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      Along those lines, I’ve enlisted help to run the twitter acct, so now it should have more round the clock coverage and a different tone from time to time.

    • angry angry says:
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      True, but here’s to Scotty leading in Beavers’ sacked.

  • BeaverJuiced says:
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    ESPN’s computer gives CSU a 51.1% chance to beat Oregon State in Week 1. Better not happen. Too much good will in Beaver Nation to start 2017 with disappointment.

    Andersen needs to not get too cute in this game. Have hard and consistent platoon running be a key piece of the gameplan. If he sticks with what gives us our best chance we should win by 10 or more. Glad they are training in Bend. Better prepares them for “mountain” schools.

    Beavs MUST get the Week 1 ‘W.’ Team has to be focused and enjoy sticking with and implementing the plan on each down from the 1st possession until the last. Can’t afford a loss to a non P5 program if Oregon State has any hopes of being taken seriously at the national level as a program on the rise.

  • Gobeavfan says:
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    No need to be cute !
    Start 3M and run the ball
    Sounds like a no brainer…

  • AlphieBeaver says:
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    We won’t be able to pound the ball against 9 of our opponents. This is why we need an arm.

  • AlphieBeaver says:
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    3m looked great against Arizona but I just rewatched that game. Arizona had no defense at all. This game was won by the oc being able to run the entire playbook.

    Oregon state wants to run a veer and shoot. Notice how all the receivers line up outside the hashes? This is a big tell. We are a veer and shoot. The problem is 3m can’t throw a 50 50 ball to punish teams that cheat a man into the box. This didn’t matter as much against Oregon and Arizona where we could run against the d even when the box count says throw. But against most teams 3m isn’t going to make the o go.

    I love 3m. I want a team full of guys with his attitude but our team is built now to run something different. I’m with ga. I don’t want an offense that is just ok. I want an offense that goes out and win games. Want to see an awesome ground game? Have a qb that can attack the whole field and watch out rbs shine. Otherwise we might as well not even dress down for the washingtons and uscs of the world.

    • oneoldbeav oneoldbeav says:
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      So, that’s what it’s all about, eh Alfie?, er Alphie.

      I certainly agree that a credible pass weapon is needed to make the run game successful vs most teams. Even with a great arm (which may be Luton) I really hope GA sticks to his stated goal of nearly 2/3 rushing plays.

      If it is working, I’d even be in favor of more than 2/3 rushes. I like the “control the clock” aspect and the way it can wear down the opposing D while resting our own D.

      Many around here are sensitive to any talk of passing, even when promising to emphasize the run game. Burned too many times by smilin’ mike.

      • AlphieBeaver says:
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        Yeah oneoldbeav I agree with what you said. We will still be a run first team. But we have to punish teams that stack the box. 3m just couldn’t punish those teams last year. And the speed he makes decisions probably means he won’t this year either. Ga said in the spring Lutton was pushing 3m to make decisions faster so who knows.

        On a related note I think ga and Baldwin did botch it with del rio. Baldwin was recruiting Seth the year before and I think was excited to pull him to osu. As others have said I think Baldwin and ga wanted the chuckie model again and it failed miserably. That is on them.

        • Jack Jack says:
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          So… didn’t we get LDR numbers out of our QBs? It would have been a different name with the same production, minus any mobility.

          • AlphieBeaver says:
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            Jack I think luke would have struggled mightily year one under ga because we were more of a smash mouth spread without the smash. But would have looked pretty decent last year with the veer and shoot. But perhaps not. I thought darell garretson would have a better deep ball then he turned out to have so…..

  • oneoldbeav oneoldbeav says:
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    Darn that Jim Wilson! He tweets:
    “With loss of DE Isaac Garcia, Beavs lost promise – not production. Expect more eligibility/academic casualties before camp concludes”

    • angry angry says:
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      I’d like to see GA vs Riley in terms of academic casualties.

      • 88thorangejulius 88thorangejulius says:
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        GPA went up when Riley left, and one player that mr couldn’t get qualified, Peko, Andersen did.

  • ObjCritic says:
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    “More promise than production” could be Andersen’s departing tag line year 4 or 5.,,

  • Nicebeaver Nicebeaver says:
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    Sedge GA post practice interview from Bend. I haven’t watched it yet because it’s pretty quiet and I can’t listen in right now.

    https://youtu.be/CU8LD9PueC8

    • BlackBandits BlackBandits says:
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      Worst. Recording. Ever. Tell that guy to stop using an iPhone to record interviews.

      • Nicebeaver Nicebeaver says:
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        Here, Angie Muchado has a better version here. Still haven’t watched either one yet, if anybody is willing to reply with the cliff notes version…

        https://youtu.be/PNtG70U6ajs

        • bleedorange says:
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          Kesi ah hoy, dunn, morris, montibon impressing. Sounds like montibon could be the rt. Thats about it.

          • Nicebeaver Nicebeaver says:
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            Good to hear some of the freshman are already making a good impression.
            Also, not sure if anybody mentioned it, but Elu Aydun is back practicing with the team. He was MIA last week because he showed up to camp overweight, so they extended his conditioning workouts before having him join the team.
            Better tham academics, but also not great when a projected starter doesn’t show up to camp in shape.

    • bendbeaver bendbeaver says:
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      GA said Garcia left under his own volition. I love that they come up here and coach must like the bonding that happens with getting them away and forcing roommate situations. Time to put up the flag on the front porch.

  • Beav2000 says:
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    Unlike some of you, I will not dimiss willies recruiting class……no matter what, it’s impressive……getting the kids in the door is the first step. If he and his staff are competent, they will be putting a good product on the field in coming seasons.

    That said, this is GA, and OSU’s chance……this season is SO important for recruiting and potentially how our trajectory will go……if we fall on our faces, and hole makes strides, we may be in for another Civil War drought……I REALLY hope Luton is the real deal.

    • Jack Jack says:
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      We don’t have to dismiss them.

      Speaking for myself, I don’t give a shit what some sub-.500 coach does in this town except for one game every year. Save your fingernails and worry about something worth worrying about.

      • Beav2000 says:
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        I don’t get too wrapped around the axle, but I am passionate about Beavs sports…….I just don’t get the hole recruiting class, thats all.

        I still think Andersen builds a team in the mold of Furd/Utah…..more smashmouth, tough guy style of football…..that’s his personality……and I get the marketing machine and flash of hole attracts kids, but damn! Have you actually looked at their list of commits? It is somewhat alarming considering where hole was last season……on the surface, it looks like they hit a homerun with the willie hire….obviously time will tell his story…..I don’t know much about him, and I don’t know whether to believe the “he’s about himself” narrative……and it may not matter anyway…..all a college coach has to do is get the most out of their kids for a few years.

        • WFO WFO says:
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          That’s what separates the great coaches like Harbaugh from the hype machines who can’t produce despite having all the talent in the world. Look at what he did with Hoke’s recruits as soon as he got to Michigan. Hoke was a great recruiter but couldn’t do shit with it.

          I’d even put Chris Petersen up there near Harbaugh too, his approach is different in that he goes after specific types of players (OKGs) that fit his program vs offering every kid in the country with a 4 or 5 star next to his name.

          • Jack Jack says:
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            This is correct.

            Besides, it’s July/August. We have four months to see how the “highly rated” group assembled plays out in terms of just signing, let alone playing on the field. If they sign them all, they water down the remainder of our opponents because they’re all stuck on hype too. They have to play those opponents as well. They won’t make any great runs under Taggart, no matter who they have on their roster. Sure, they’ll wreak some havoc and win some games because the talent justifies some of that. But sustaining that while doing what that coach has done to dominate lesser conferences with programs he did not turn around or even build will not turn out to be reality.

          • Nicebeaver Nicebeaver says:
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            “I’d even put Chris Petersen up there near Harbaugh too, his approach is different in that he goes after specific types of players (OKGs) that fit his program vs offering every kid in the country with a 4 or 5 star next to his name.”

            I heard an interview last week with David Shaw on Primetime (Isaac and Suk) last week from media day. He talked on this topic, because Stanford uses the more surgical approach to recruiting. I’ll post it if I can find the podcast. I really came away from the interview liking Shaw’s approach. He doesn’t like how recruiting has made little mini all-stars out of highschool kids and how teams are offering pretty much any kid with stars by their name, regardless of space to actually put those kids on the roster

          • Nicebeaver Nicebeaver says:
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            Shaw interview can be found here, for anyone who has time to kill on such things.

            http://www.podtrac.com/pts/redirect.mp3/1080thefan.hosted.cx/hosting/media/1080thefan/1641870/119999011.mp3

          • helmsley says:
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            From Davis Shaw: ” regardless of space to actually put those kids on the roster.” I thought of Andy Atwood – truly talented baseball player – but ss and 2nd base require only 2 players.

          • orangejulius orangejulius says:
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            See Sarkisian, Steve.

          • WFO WFO says:
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            Sark and Kiffen are both perfect examples too. Great recruiters and probably pretty good assistants. But can’t be the man making the big decisions.

  • Beav2000 says:
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    CSU game is a sellout. Expectations are high in Fort Collins.

    • angry angry says:
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      And for Luton.

      • beavergopher beavergopher says:
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        Let’s hope he is Tom Brady part two.

        • ObjCritic says:
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          You want Luton impregnating super models?!? You want his balls deflated?!? Get it together man! OSU football first!

          • AKBeaver AKBeaver says:
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            I don’t think he’ll be impregnating any models with deflated balls

          • beavergopher beavergopher says:
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            My balls would be terminally deflated if Giselle was walking around the house!

      • Beav2000 says:
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        I cannot wait for this game! This is what college football is all about! Brand new stadium at capacity for CSU…..3rd year for Andersen……are the Beavs gonna keep the trajectory going up? Who’s our guy behind center? Is our O line gonna be able to protect? To open holes for our talented backfield? CSU has a potent offense…..their QB is talented and been the starter for 3 years?? I think…..they have a some good receivers and a deep backfield…..8 returning starters on a defense that wasn’t great, but maybe they improved? No coaching staff turnover…..lots of story lines here folks!

    • beavergopher beavergopher says:
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      New stadium. The old one was right below a dam! That would have made us Beavers feel right at home.

    • ObjCritic says:
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      I think CSU with a new, sold out stadium opener and Minnesota with a new coach are great pre-season tests for OSU. They are winnable and if the Beavers play to their strengths and don’t get distracted they should win both and increase confidence.

      Thinking the Minnesota game on a Saturday night could be fun and may attend that one.

  • ObjCritic says:
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    OT – Sports Illustrated ranks some of the “top” decisions in NCAA football the last ten years…including Oregon’s hiring of Chip Kelly, Utah joining the PAC, and KSU bringing back Snyder.

  • calibeav calibeav says:
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    So Angry you might be on point here as both Mama Machado and the Beavers Edge crew had MCM outplaying Luton and DG again today in what sounds like was a day where the defense dominated. Will be interesting to see where this QB battle goes if this trend keeps up.

    • angry angry says:
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      Good to hear. I can’t read any of those reports. Didn’t both say Luton would be the starter just 3 days ago?

      • Nicebeaver Nicebeaver says:
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        They’re going to string McM along for as long as possible so he won’t transfer and then pull a Lucy van Pelt on him before game 1.

        • angry angry says:
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          Who is they? These are the reporters saying this not GA/staff, right? I don’t think reporters can string him along by saying he played better.

          • Nicebeaver Nicebeaver says:
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            Meaning the staff will hold off on making a decision for as long as possible. Despite who would appear to be the clear cut starter, be it Luton or McM.

            Of course media only sees 20 minutes out of 2+ hours to base their opinions, but I would think those 20 minutes should be considered 4th quarter crunch time and carry some significant weight.

          • angry angry says:
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            Yeah, I mean I think they love McM as a backup because he keeps bailing them out on their gambles. “If Upside_Jock_XYZ doesn’t work out we can always go to McM” type attitude. But, would they ruin a guy’s career? They do seem to be honest in wanting what’s best for players, too, so hopefully they’re being honest with him. That would be really shitty to string him along if they already know they have no intention of starting him.

          • bleedorange says:
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            Thats very presumptuous considering he could be starting game 1.

    • bleedorange says:
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      In every report i read says luton has performed the best so i dont know where u get that he’s outperforming them again.

      • angry angry says:
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        That’s what all the early reports where. I haven’t heard anything the past few days, but apparently the past few days have McM winning it. I’d like to see these reports and what any of them are based on.

        Last year’s reports had Nick Mitchell as the leader…

        I’m not convinced any of these people know how to analyze a QB.

        • Tinact says:
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          Nick Mitchel wasn’t on the team last year, dummy!

        • Cake says:
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          >I haven’t heard anything the past few days, but apparently the past few days have McM winning it.

          That doesn’t make sense.

  • Corliss says:
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    An interesting poll would be:

    who thinks the o line will be better than last yr?

    Who thinks the o line will be worse than last year?

    Who thinks o line will be about the same?

  • calibeav calibeav says:
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    Yea but if the reporters see it then the team does to. At some point I think that will force GA and crew’s hand. Maybe even a new guy like Phillips won’t be afraid to sate the obvious ( if that ends up being the case) that MCM is the better fit from day one.

    The more I get familiar with how GA operates perhaps this whole Luton thing is just a way to push MCM to get better? If you think about it.. in a lot of ways MCM is becoming exactly the guy that GA said he wanted when he first came in. Being that he can beat you with his:

    1. Mind / decision making
    2. Feet
    3. Arm

    Obviously he just needs to refine some things with getting the ball out on time but otherwise he is solid to good in all 3 of those facets. Gonna be interesting to see where this goes.

    • angry angry says:
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      this whole Luton thing is just a way to push MCM to get better?

      I’ve wondered that, too.

      • calibeav calibeav says:
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        Yea.. He seems to REALLY get a kick out of seeing how his guys react to competition. Like it’s almost an obsession.

        • angry angry says:
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          Just like Hitler.

          • Beavlover69 says:
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            That’s why he has 5 national titles and is the highest paid coach in college football….

          • angry angry says:
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            Hitler has won 5 national titles and is the highest paid coach in college football?

            Fascinating.

          • beavlover69 says:
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            joke joke joke
            joke joke joke ANGRY joke joke joke

        • Jack Jack says:
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          Yes… riding the pine has never been a motivational tool used by any coach ever in the history of sport. MM should run away to some other school and from such childish tactics so outside the realm of coaching norms so as to make Woody Hayes look like Mother Theresa.

          Sheesh!

    • Hellobeavers says:
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      Bold claim to say he can beat you three different ways when he only won two fucking games last year.

      His numbers are garbage and he doesn’t pass the eyeball test. Luton has the tools of someone who has a shot at the NFL. If he gives us the best chance at a great season I’d rather risk it than end up with 5 or 6 wins with MCM.

      If Riley was still the coach angry would be all over him for sticking with MCM. We’ve seen what he can do (not a whole lot). We should go with the guy that has more talent.

      • angry angry says:
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        If Riley was still the coach angry would be all over him for sticking with MCM.

        Nope.
        Nice try.

      • gobeavers92 says:
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        I guess you did not get the memo. McM’s “floor” is “65% completion, 20TD. 8 INT. 450 rushing yards. 6 rush TDs”. Of course there is ZERO evidence that he would see this type of improvement in production but if you disagree with this assessment / prediction your evaluation of quarterbacks is “poor”

        Don’t bother looking at actual facts and data.

        • angry angry says:
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          The butt hurt brigade gets their day in the sun. Just like they did under Seth and Garrettson.
          Enjoy it while it lasts.

          • beavergopher beavergopher says:
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            Remember to put sun screen on your butts boys. Ya’ll will really be butt hurt if you don’t.

        • angry angry says:
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          Guy, he threw for 10TD and 5INT in 6 games. Just extrapolate it and adjust for him being a year older. 20TD is actually too low.

          He rushed for 81 the one game he was allowed to run. Adjust for the poor D in that game and lower it.

          Actual facts and data…from Pac-12 competition.

          Give me your facts and data on Luton. I’m all ears.

          • blackbug says:
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            It is oft repeated that McMaryion was not allowed to run. There is no truth to this statement. The coaches allows said he was encourage to run according to the offense and encourage to keep himself from big hits. I personally think it took reps in about 5 games for McMaryion to grasp when to keep the ball on a fake and when to hand it off. This is why we saw it more in the last 2 games, especially the the last game.

  • Nicebeaver Nicebeaver says:
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    Oregonlive reporting Luton has been named starter today

    • angry angry says:
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      Cool we at least have a starter named.
      He better be very good from the get go.

      • Beav11 says:
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        Anything above mediocre will be an improvement.

        • beavergopher beavergopher says:
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          I have a bad feeling Luton will be Mitch Leidner. And that ain’t good.
          Big, tall, and looks the part does not always work out. I pray I am totally wrong.

          • angry angry says:
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            Oh God…Leidner….

          • bleedorange says:
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            Much different skill set.

          • beavergopher beavergopher says:
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            Slow processing = throw late, into double /triple coverage, taking a sack vs throwing it away etc.
            JC vs P5 is a big jump and he has not played a down. Camp performances really can be fake news.
            I guess we will see in Ft. Collins. Hope for the best.

  • Bill says:
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    3 different season opening starters under GA and all are still on the team, that’s unusual.

  • Gobeavfan says:
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    3m will be in game 1 by halftime IMHO

    • angry angry says:
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      I was thinking that but didn’t want to write it because I do think Luton is better than Collins or Garrettson…

  • ObjCritic says:
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    Anybody know anything about CSU’s defense? A quick search of a few articles indicates there’s some a strong need for consistency to build. CSU apparently had some shut-out halves, but were pretty generous to opposing ball carriers.

    “It was an odd year on defense. The Rams ranked in the bottom half of nearly every defensive category, and much of what ailed them stemmed from allowing too many yards on the ground, more than 214 per contest. They didn’t help themselves by allowing teams to convert 49 percent of third down, and there were very few turnovers (14) created.”

    http://www.reporterherald.com/sports/ci_31183615/colorado-state-defense-seeks-right-practice-attitude

    Nall/Pierce/Tyner ought to have pretty good opportunities, simplify the game for Luton and McM. Hope the game is in hand by the end of the 3rd, and in the 4th McM is giving plenty of carriers to Pierce and Tyner.

    Some stadium shots. No offense, but doesn’t look very impressive. Capacity 41K with seating for 36.5K:

    http://www.denverpost.com/2017/07/18/colorado-state-university-on-campus-stadium/

  • calibeav calibeav says:
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    Will be interesting to see how Luton has improved his decision making. To me that is all that’s holding him back from being a legit Pac 12 starter. I posted a while back but for context after we signed Luton I went to watch him play locally here in so cal.

    They played in my hometown against Cerritos college and then again in the Playoffs against Fullerton. These were the last two games of the year and therefore the last two real games he has played.

    Against Cerritos (and Nick Mitchell) Luton looked really good but this was a down year for the Falcons. They usually have a few d1 dudes on both sides of the ball but this year there wasn’t nearly as much talent. He threw for like 470 yards and 5 td’s hitting a lot of slants, and post routes while extending plays and showing nice touch on some deep balls. I left the game pretty pumped about the Luton and still puzzled at how we ever recruited Nick Mitchell to play QB.

    Luton only had a few questionable throws and those were the kind where he was just betting on his guy to win and separate. The type of throws where a good DB either breaks up or picks a few of those passes BUT A good WR makes the play. His guys made those contested catches all night but it was because the ball was in the right place.

    In the Fullerton game which was the playoffs I saw much of the same for the first 3.5 quarters. Big arm and the ability to get the ball in tight windows mixed with some nice touch when needed against a much better opponent. There were a couple of quick hitters off audibles where he lofted balls over the backers to hit his slot or TE up the seam that were really impressive. Togiai could be his favorite target. The 4th quarter started good with Luton leading some big drives to get his team back in the game, but then quickly turned for the worse. Luton made two terrible throws for picks on back to back possessions with the game on the line and then got a little gun shy after that taking 2 or 3 drive killing sacks for holding onto the ball. They ended up losing the game to the eventual state champs and I’m sure there are some throws Jake would like back. Still had a solid line with like 400 yards and i think 5-6 td’s and brought his team back to get in the game but ultimately cost them with two bad picks.

    All in all I see why GA and crew are high on the kid. He has some serious arm talent. The most we’ve had here since probably DA in my opinion. He has a stronger arm than both Moore or Mannion and mixes touch passes with zip balls well based on the route and coverage already. He’s also pretty mobile in pocket traffic from what I saw. He can elude the rush and then pick up right where he was in his progression and then make the right type of throw (with touch) to the open man. In both games I would say 30-40% of his completions were based on this type of play. He also will kill the blitz with the right route combinations. His zip on short throws/ slants and ability to see over the line could make for some big plays against blitz or press coverage.

    The biggest weakness I saw was decision making. Some zone press coverage seemed to confuse him. Where he read man and completely ignored the help underneath for some dangerous throws (both picks were off that look) If coaching, experience at this level and film work can break that trend we should have a nice QB on our hands.

    • angry angry says:
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      Nice writeup. You should post this in the new thread. Would you say my gut feeling that he’s like DA is accurate?

      • Calibeav says:
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        Definitely a strong comparison as DA was also a better Athlete than people realize. He used to wreck shit playing ball at Dixon. Like with DA grasping the mental part of the game will be key. The Arm talent (not just strength) is there.

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