Home Football Washington State Post-Game Discussion

Washington State Post-Game Discussion

117

My takeaways from the prior thread, with a little more meat added to the bones.

1. Gebbia is legit. The slow start was concerning, but he looked like himself onward. People seem to think he played poorly. Definitely started slow, but it’s the start of a new season – these things happen. He was on fire 2nd half and looked like himself. I see the cause for concern, though. He was lobbing the ball too much. Also was throwing too much on the run without the ability to get his shoulders turned. Wound up with great numbers, and this with a weak receiving corp who couldn’t break away and also added a handful of drops.

2. Smith is a huge in-game liability. He has no concept of basic probabilities, order of operations, or personnel. Excuse he gave in his presser was they decided before the game they were going for 2 in this game, so they did it then. That is literally an insane way to coach. Beyond reckless. Just nuts. He’s officially a mad man who will continue to cost us games. We’re getting far into this regime, and the reality is starting to show itself. Smith might be better off as an assistant. He has ability recruiting and scheming, but he has no idea how to manage a game. If it weren’t for this major flaw, I’d be very bullish on Smith, but I’ve gone from bullish to neutral given this major flaw.

3. Nice to see some old names back on AB. NVBeav stood out. He was laying down some nice beats.

4. Do we know yet why ~half the roster didn’t play? Why was Colleto in ahead of beasts like Hughes-Murray, et al? Smith’s personnel decisions also very questionable. My theory, unless there was a Covid outbreak or some health issue to a majority of the team, is Smith will play short guys and walk-ons because he was a short walk-on. Bias. I hope it was something explainable and not that.

5. Penalties. Showed a lack of focus and discipline. Killed drives that likely would have made this a different game. Again on the coaches.

That’s all I’ve got for now.

117 COMMENTS

  1. 10
    3

    This last year has put many things in perspective, and OSU football is one of them.

    Taking just the football aspect, let’s be real: This is a bad program in a bad conference. A conference that doesn’t even care about football, except for UO. Every other Power 5 conference looked for a way to play a season. The Pac-12 did not. If anything, we looked for reasons to NOT play a season. We can argue about coronavirus and if it’s good to be playing or not, but the biggest indictment against the Pac-12 is that when the season was cancelled originally, hardly anyone even cared. There was barely any “I understand it for safety reasons, but DAMN this sucks!” No… it was pretty much “Yeah… oh well. Whatever.” I used to defend the conference and its fanbase, but I have to concede that the SEC and other Power 5 conferences have been right all along – we don’t take football seriously, and it just means more over there. By FAR. That’s why the Pac has absorbed loss after out-of-conference loss and become the laughingstock of the major college football world. That’s why revenue is lagging and our athletic departments are in serious trouble.

    Going beyond football, recreation is supposed to be enjoyable. Continuing to root for an awful program that is overmatched in resources and competence is not enjoyable. You can call me a fair-weather fan or whatever else, but I’d argue there is no such thing as “fair weather” when it constantly rains day after day, year after year. Hell, I wouldn’t even consider myself a fan anymore, if I’m being completely frank. I listened to about 10 minutes of the radiocast, checked some scores, and that was enough for me. Identifying with and tying part of oneself to a bastion of failure is psychologically unhealthy. It’s like a crappy version of angry’s favorite BIRGing concept (WIRFing? Wallowing In Reflected Failure?) There has to be some payoff for one’s fandom. Being a fan is pointless without it.

    Dealing with chronic futility of this magnitude should be reserved for coaches, players, and their families – people with skin in the game. As for me, there are so many better ways to spend time. Nothing against anyone who can find something worthwhile here, though.

    Take care, everyone. I hope you’re staying safe and finding whatever joys you can buried in this bad year.

    P.S. – Screw Riley and Anderpants.

  2. 4
    1

    Some of my thoughts ..

    1. out of shape
    2. not enough football sense
    3. no discipline
    4. again blown out by Freshman QB
    5. Offensive/defensive lines cannot push open a wet paper bag
    6. 9 months to get ready – what where they doing besides signing people who where not eligible.

      • Part 2
        1. Time to stop praying and start playing.
        2. Where were the All league linebackers?
        3. Who says you cannot fire position coaches in season if the team is not not playing?
        4. Real football players will not come to Corvallis unless they are convinced the Coaches can/want to win.
        5. Leadership is from the top down not the bottom up.

  3. Next weekend’s game vs. Washington will decide how the rest of the season will go. Washington is going to be physical on both lines.

    I see the Beavs getting blown out in Seattle because they will not be able to pass the ball effectively, and won’t be able to generate a pass rush. It appears as though Hamilcar and Trevon are not the leaders the team desperately needs based on how they acted last night, and I can see the team imploding as they did in 2017.

  4. Does no one think that WSU’s freshman QB made some Russell Wilson type plays? There were times that we made good plays but he just extended them… Now there is no doubt this was amateur hour with the play. However, I thought to only lose by 10 after playing shitty, opponent QB extending plays, and poor officiating bodes well for them. I will hold off on saying it’s coaching because there were plays when the Beavs were doing the right thing… Hence part of it could the players execution… Now the game management by JS, oh boy, whole different worrisome story there

  5. Why do people keep saying guys weren’t playing? Murray played a ton and so did mccartan, Robert’s, and speights. Morris played and gave up a 50 yd td run.

        • 1
          1

          Well maybe the theory is unfounded (notice the word theory not fact).

          I thought Colletto was a walk on.

          The bottom line is I saw Colletto talkle a guy with his head last night, and milliseconds later his arms came out to make the tackle, as the guy was past him. At that point he should have been taken off the field because it suggests (a) slow reactions (b) lack of coordination.

  6. 5
    2

    I pretty much agree with your take on things, Angry. As to the most controversial point: If Smith said they went for two the first time because they committed to doing it at some point in the game, it may or may not be nuts or reckless but it does display a certain hubris. Chip Kelly used to go for two after his first touchdown if the Ducks scored first, and there was a bit of swagger and intimidation intended. More often that not it worked. But just for the hell of it sometime in a game–well, that is NOT in the same category as going for it on 4th in Pullman last year. The analytics charts said to do that. (I don’t know if anyone saw it, but in today’s Seattle/Buffalo game Brock Huard was saying the same chart said the Bills should go for it on 4th on their side of the 50! Buffalo punted, and got the subsequent turnover, but the analytical point stands.)

    I think the more interesting question is WHY Smith comports himself this way. Let us remember that Smith would have been a not so disinterested observer of the way the late-Riley regime played out. By that, I mean the excuse making, rationalizations, and a LOT of latitude when things don’t go well. In a phrase, he knows he’s on a long leash and may be a little full of himself. The important thing is for the media, or what’s left of it, to keep probing on such questions. The ironic thing is that the one time Oregon media dug into an Oregon State University sports coaching issue (Luke Heimlich) they took the wrong angle.

  7. (I don’t know if anyone saw it, but in today’s Seattle/Buffalo game Brock Huard was saying the same chart said the Bills should go for it on 4th on their side of the 50! Buffalo punted, and got the subsequent turnover, but the analytical point stands.)

    Huard went on to say that McDermott has said he consults analytics but goes with his gut.

    • indeed, Huard said that, though he also offered something along the lines about the risks associated with turning the ball over to the guy on the other side (Wilson).

      I think we can safely deduce that McDermott went with his gut and punted; a year ago in Pullman, Smith went with his gut and tried to convert on 4th. I consider both of those a different species of decision-making than Smith this past Saturday (at some point we decided to try for two) (which was not at all analytical)

  8. To item 4: this is my greatest worry. Are guys just super out of shape? The roster weight changes were pretty weird on the DL and LB levels. Are guys sitting out for covid? The WR core was definitely not right at all.

    • No one is probably reading this post due to the new one but a parent of a player told me his son had a hard time putting any weight on because of the COVID. The team couldn’t have the food tables and such out like they wanted to. I’m guessing that applies to all players then. He also mentioned the lack of leadership. You could see that in the game. Grant made a big play but that was really it on the defensive side. Gebbia started manning up the second half with some gutsy throws.

    • What about his first pass? 73 yard bomb. I guess he just needed NFL wide receivers to catch those over thrown balls. Or he was just alway tuned into the NFL and couldn’t meter his throws for college receivers. Either way good for him.

      • I was listening to the game on satellite and the Jag announcers were going on and on about Luton’s next level arm strength. Even made comments about how Minshew’s is not even close.

    • 3
      1

      That was a crazy and super clutch run. Where was that Luton at OSU??

      He had his moments as a passer with us…but breaking two NFL tackles on a 13 yd TD run??? Wild

  9. 7
    1

    I’m with Scotty. There’s no payoff here. It’s a major sacrifice for me to even watch games when they always start at 10:30 PM.

    In past years, the hoops I had to jump through to watch games on the P12 Network were ridiculous. It’s easier to watch my FCS alma mater.

    We just lost our most winnable game at home. That doesn’t bode well for the rest of the year. What happens next year once the rebuild story has been derailed? It will be very difficult for JS to win players, staff and donors back again. Then we’ll be looking at another coaching change with an underwhelming list of candidates shortly afterward.

    This year has put a lot of things in my life in perspective. More and more, I think the OSU part of my life is just a waste of time and emotional energy better spent elsewhere. We’ve talked before here about how college football is dying anyway, as the big programs widen the gap between them and everyone else, attendance drops, enrollment drops, debt skyrockets, and now the very nature of college is being threatened by COVID. I’m finding it hard to believe this program will taste success before the whole thing collapses.

    • The only payoff is a sunny fall day, 2 ish kickoff and tailgating with friends. A win would be nice but those are the good parts of Beaver football.

  10. 1
    2

    The state of Utah just ordered a mask mandate today due to rising cases. But college football is ok because there is enough testing. Beavs travel to Utah in one month and Utah already canceled their first game due to cases on the team. Doesn’t look good for that game.

  11. It’s being implied that the WSU HC knew he had a Covid outbreak on the team, and instead of reporting it, he didn’t bring those 32 players. That’s how I’m reading it at least.

  12. Well in hindsight delaying the season for Covid was the right call. Saved me from wasting all those nice weekends in September and October watching bad football.

  13. Tough question: would you rather watch this shitty team play the rest of the season, or they cancel the season and we get a reboot next year?

    • I’d rather they get a chance to play. They may suck as a collective but a lot of individuals have worked hard to get to where they are at and deserve a chance to showcase their talents. Hope they can come together as a team. Not that WSU is the class of the P12 but it is not like they were any more talented than OSU just better coached and more cohesive.

    • I’m not sure I’ll be watching any games, I’ve invested in other interests outside of sports since april. I didnt even know the NBA played a championship until last week. All the sports guys at work haven’t been talking sports at all. This season seems like a shitty consultation prize that i have very little interest in. So to answer your question. I couldn’t care less if they keep going or cancel im assuming I won’t watch a game this season. I will check scores and follow game threads here for update every so often.

      • What interests?
        I’ve hardly watched any NFL, and I haven’t watch the NBA since Keith Van Horn and Jason Kidd were at their prime, whenever that was.

        • Hiking is one. Did about 180 miles combined this summer and fall. Most of it is scouting new hunting areas, but the views were spectacular. I plan on getting my 8 years olds out next summer to hike also.

          I’m pretty much done with pro sports. This was the first year I can ever remember not watch the world series. I just didn’t care.

    • I think canceling would be the best move for the program at this point. Preserve the rebuild narrative for JS and hope they can figure some things out with the extra time.

      Why end up with a 0-3 record in an incomplete season that just leaves everyone feeling deflated? That’s not going to help anyone except maybe one or two guys that help their NFL Draft stock.

    • This team is dogshit. I appreciate everyone’s analytical takes and trying to find a glitter speck of hope, but that first half was putrid and the second half was marginally better (aka less putrid). If we didn’t have Jefferson I believe the game would have been embarrassingly out of hand. Gebbia got better, but he has a stable of jello handed receivers that can’t get off the line without being manhandled.
      This one is on the coaching staff for not having players ready to play, not having a cohesive game plan, and not being able to adjust the plan to be competitive the whole first half. These coaches likely were watching Golden Girls reruns instead of game film based on how the game script was set up.
      One word describes this game…YUCK!

    • Although I’m sure JJ is sorry he came to OSU, in my book he alone is worth watching. That kids is fun to watch.

      The depressing thing is that not winning hurts recruiting. It is a vicious circle that plays out when not winning. Good players by-pass your program for winning programs therefore you can’t ever seem to put together a winning program. The exception is if you can bring in a known winning coach who attracts players you don’t normally recruit (Dennis Erickson).

    • Week 1 games always suck. Even from 1st half to 2nd half the teams showed some inprovement, at least on offense.

      To me, the issues with this team will keep coming back to both lines. We havent done well recruiting for either compared to other Pac12 schools. We can always hope we get projects and can coach them up, but we’ll always be a step behind. Other teams have as good of or better coaches too, and they don’t have to start from a ball of clay with their molding of players.

  14. My takeaways…
    Gebbia has a weak inaccurate arm and is quick to leave pocket. He ceiling is average Pac12 QB at best.
    Receivers are below average
    OL is work in progress but expect improvements
    TE will also improve
    Jefferson is special
    Play call was bad. Game plan sucked
    Officiating was horrible and went against Beavs on critical times. I could argue it was a 14 point difference aiding 7 points for WSU and taking 7 points off board for OSU. That reversal on targeting was odd and had a huge impact. Chop block was BS. PI in end zone was horrible. That said, not an excuse for poor performance
    D looked uninspired and scheme didn’t leverage our strengths. When DBs can’t cover you have to pressure QB. He had all day
    Special teams was horrible.
    Smith going for 2 made zero sense.
    Originally thought UW not playing was OSU advantage but we showed too many deficiencies. UW will exploit those and I expect to be blown out.
    I do not see a W on the schedule no matter how many games are played

    • 1
      1

      Gebbia has a weak inaccurate arm. Receivers are below average

      This all makes no sense. He completed 71% of passes (and this with 5 drops) for 329 yards, all to receivers you note are below average. So with average receivers, those numbers would be even better? Yet, that is inaccurate passing?

      Look, he started rough, but even that was due to some drops. I saw the happy feet at times and nerves and saw him lob it early on, but it’s his 2nd career start and 1st start of the season. By the 3rd quarter he was zinging it right on the money…over and over and over.

      • Fair enough but many of the completions IMO were a result of WSU keeping everything in front of them. I saw a lot of passes fall short… incomplete or causing receiver to break stride and come back to make catch. Critical and contested throws didn’t connect as result of arm strength or inaccurate passes. He was serviceable but don’t see a high ceiling… just average.

        • He was throwing off of his back foot on almost every short throw, because he was running for his life. The pocket would legit collapse after about 2 seconds. Edge protection was atrocious and sometimes he had untouched backers run straight through the gut.

          Both beaver lines were very bad.

        • At some point the game was on but just background noise at the house.

          Hoping that craptastic first half was jitters/rust.

          This team looks to be going nowhere, at least we’ll know if he’s worth sticking with for a ‘regular season’ next year.

  15. I think it’s as simple as we came out flat with a shitty game plan. Cougs showed up to play, and Smith now has been out coached by Rolovich 2 years in a row (maybe he’s intimidated by the whole recruiting violation fiasco??? idk..)

    Defense: Tiesbar called an awful game. Kept rushing 3 players the majority of the 1st half, force feeding formations we don’t have the personnel for. No real blitzing, stunts, nothing. Let their true freshman QB get comfortable and gain confidence like he was still dominating in high school (he never lost a game.) Tackling was poor (Colletto was especially poor tackler). Looked like year 1: a major coaching regression.

    Offense / Lindgren: Line play was poor, and Lindgren kept calling slow developing pass plays on first down. Gebbia only had like 2 seconds on 3 step drops and the backside rusher would already be in his mug with no open receivers. Starting out every series behind the chains on second down. Jemar was the best player on the field. He should have been calling run plays, have the OL driving to gain confidence instead of being on their heels in pass protect. My main complaint with Lindgren/Smith on offense is being too cute. They were too cute for 3 quarters.

    Other things: Seemed like Hamilcar and others were sick or something. Didn’t look right all game. Our “League best linebacking core” was shaky at best.

    Hope Jaydon Grant is ok. He was our best defender last game until he went down…

    Really could have used a tune up game against a lower tier school, but obviously cannot be an excuse since nobody got one.

    Go beavs?

  16. The big difference in this game was WSU rushing the ball so well and their ability to pressure and get to Gebbia. I think they had 4 sacks and over a 100 more rushing yards. Other than those 2 things Beavs led in just about every other statistical category. Looking over the stats it’s almost surprising they lost. If they had another quarter I think they would’ve won. Just too little too late.

  17. New thread up. We can make this one go general below here.
    ———————————————————————–

    So I was mentioning in the political thread: Trump just hired a new secretary of defense. To me this is a signal he plans to go to war and sacrifice soldiers to stay in power. He’ll declare emergency and remain is how I’m reading it. Would the Trump supporters (here) support this?

      • 3
        1

        Lurking again–Most of us knew that Trump didn’t care about anyone but himself, but taking down the veneer of American democracy is beyond the pale. What skin in the game do his enablers in Congress/Judiciary have? Trumpism will be not a viable alternative down the road.

        Putin could not designed a game plan any better…if ever there was an opportunity to take advantage of America’s vulnerability, now is the time.

        Not said as a “sky is falling” statement, but baffled about the lack of any leadership in this country right now.

        FYI–Wall St. Journal today had an article about a commission of overseas election observers INVITED by the Trump administration. 20 page report came out today saying there were no irregularities and no proof of election fraud. They did mention that the Trump move right now is unexplainable and a detriment to the concept of democracy in general.

        FWIW~

        • 2
          1

          The lawfirm representing Trump is now pondering why they’re doing it. They must see they have zero evidence.
          https://twitter.com/ryanjreilly/status/1325942262476517376

          But, that won’t stop him. The thing is, Trump’s backlash is a direct and inverse relationship of ego damage. If his ego was damaged x by this, he wants to punish x+1 and/or figure out a way to steal the election to avoid damage altogether (he’s still in this state). Your not being “Sky is falling”, but that’s how you’ll be portrayed to be, which is why you’re getting ahead of that and saying your not doing it. This is a manipulative tactic by the Right, just like shaming was a manipulative tactic on the Left.

    • 2
      1

      My MIL excommunicated herself from the rest of the family for the same reason, well facebook in her case, and we’ve all honored her wishes. We, as in the whole family, had already tried the no political talk at family things. That lasted one and a half zoom get togethers before she broke out the Trump and Jesus are the same guy routine. Never seen so many zoom windows close so fast.

      My wife is the only family member who has the stomach to deal with her, and only because she’s a nurse and compassionate for the those who are ailing.

      Good luck, bro

    • Be nice anyway – have a lead line ready – not how’s it going or how are you or they will jump right in. Check up on the weather where they are before you call and lead in with that, perhaps.

      • Thanks. Good advice. That’s mostly what I’ve been doing, but I just saw the Qanon stuff yesterday. I fear they have evil and hatred in their souls, which is a way I never looked at them before this. That’s the main problem for me. It’s also creating a cognitive dissonance because they claim to be catholic. I want to ask them, “This is what Jesus would do” with the Qanon stuff and general hatred they seem to be spewing.

        • 1
          1

          Very interesting. My mother in law, her husband, my wife’s uncle and great aunt, all are down this same evil rabbit hole.

          I personally just avoid politics and if someone voices things I disagree with I just ignore it and move on. I don’t have Facebook, but my wife does. She blocked her aunt and uncle, and had a big talking to with her mother. Basically, you are posting evil stuff, if you like trump you don’t need to think democrats are pedophils and call everyone libtards, etc… we have a young son(just turned 1) and she told her mom she does not want that haterid around our son. So of course we haven’t seen her or heard from her since like February.

          The interesting point is, they all claim to be so religious and Christian like your saying your parents are, but spew evil haterid. Literally choosing spewing hate over seeing her only grandkid

          Myself personally though, I just told my wife however she wants to handle her family is her call…. I will support her and let her handle her family in whichever route she chooses. Weird times bro, can’t figure out the mentality besides it’s very cult like

          • Hey thanks for the interesting anecdote. I wonder if losing family will wake these people up.

            There’s a line (paraphrasing) from the Art of War that someone will burn a city down just to rein over its ashes. It’s what Trump is trying to do. And it’s what our families are indirectly doing.

    • I’m in your boat, though not to the same degree: the family member I’ve lost to Biden derangement syndrome was already self-semi-estranged. I’ll lovingly refer to them as “strangest.” They came sailing out of the closet as a trumper with the election. It’s not fox though, it’s FB and their wonderful news curation echo chamber, featuring godlike, etc.. But yeah, one starts looking up how to talk to cult members…

        • Idk who they supported in 2016, if anyone. I’m guessing the trump support is in the last year, but can’t make sense of that unless they missed the first three years somehow. Only the last month or so has been politics. Lots of distortions; all or nothing thinking. Probably depressed but it’s more like rage at this point.

  18. Just finished up a work call with some peers who work out of the Atlanta. I mentioned being glad I’m not living in their state and having to got through these senate runoff campaigns.

    Conversation quickly turned to discussing how votes are counted there vs here in oregon and it became obvious pretty quickly, these people in Atlanta do not have much faith in their system and how votes are counted. Just found it pretty revealing how the seeds of doubt have been planted and depending on what outcome people expected, they will tend to believe what supports their opinions on the outcome of the election they take part in.

    We all came back to “the technology exists to make this more simple and transparent, so why don’t we use it?”

  19. I’m trying to wrap my mind around what exactly voter fraud means?
    Is it voter fraud when you make an accusation via sworn affidavit of somebody else committing voter fraud and then have that story go viral through Project Veritas and the media, only to backtrack as soon as the authorities get involved and start asking questions?

    https://twitter.com/OversightDems/status/1326289047933816836?s=19

    Here’s the original video that went viral.

    https://twitter.com/JamesOKeefeIII/status/1324845160358940673?s=19

  20. 140k cases of corona per day. “One day it will magically go away”…I guess he’s right if everyone dies, and there’s nobody left to infect.

    Meanwhile Trump is posting about conspiracy theories, playing golf, and now accepting “donations” to stage a coup (and using half of all donations to pay off private debt). Whatta guy.

    • Just to plays devil’s advocate. Say the supreme court makes a late ruling that flips the election? Then he’s still talking about defending the constitution rather than a king/tyrant/country/etc.

  21. The problem for Trump is that his entire life he’s been able to manipulate or buy his way out of situations, and this is probably the first time he can’t do that (though he is trying, at the expense of “democracy”). That’s why he’s having an infantile meltdown instead of manning up. Isn’t it republicans who say, “facts don’t care about your feelings”? But they do when it’s a 74 year old infant and their feelings? Come on, man!

    In top form, Trump observed Veterans Day by Tweeting about election conspiracies…the contrast in what Biden said on Veteran’s day and what Trump said says it all.

  22. Nice Senator, Alabama. Not helping their reputation.

    Alabama Senator-elect Tommy Tuberville draws criticism for interview in which he states the three US government branches are ‘the House, the Senate and executive’

    In an interview with Alabama Daily News on Thursday, Republican Senator-elect Tommy Tuberville shared his thoughts on a wide range of political topics, including the 2000 Bush vs. Gore election, World War II and the rules of the Senate. People are questioning his election to the position after he made the statement: “You know, our government wasn’t set up for one group to have all three branches of government. It wasn’t set up that way, our three branches, the House, the Senate and executive.” The three branches of the US government, in fact, are the executive (president, etc.), the judiciary (SCOTUS, etc.) and the legislative (Congress).

LEAVE A REPLY

Please enter your comment!
Please enter your name here