Have at it, Beavos.
My stance is we need to see DJ win the job, and we need to stop having corporations ruin NCAA sports. What is interesting is many fans view giant corporations as the saviors for their conference, and this allows their destruction to continue. When the enemy is the savior that’s going to be the outcome every time. What the PAC should do is charge for and stream all games on their own app ala carte, then charge Apple, YouTube, et al a royalty free to pick up and stream games. That’s the way to go.
Also: On the 1st day ’til fall camp, my true love said aw shucks, “let’s go hunting for some Ducks!”
Noooo, last thread was sooo close to 1k, but ike Georgie Porgie, the rug has been pulled out from under us. Boo!
It didn’t happen organically. You can’t force an issue.
The 1k thread is coming when the PAC-12 media deal is: soon.
The old thread is still accumulating responses, too. It might hit.
1k hit on the old thread, but NiceBeaver cheated. He must be a Duck or something.
If you aint cheetin, you aint tryin
Only POS cheat!
Kliakoff is being too passively manipulated into a beggars mentality by the corporate media. He needs to be publicly aggressive and try to expose and bust up the collusion among these network corporations.
Or he may be complicit in the whole scheme with his ties to Las Vegas: maybe his motives aren’t totally true to PAC12 continuity or survival but he is the Fox in the henhouse also accelerating the conference demise from the inside. He is done plenty of PR damage by just delaying and misrepresentation of discussions for this media deal.
I’d say the presidents should fire the whole lot of these negotiators/GK and start fresh with a new approach.
Infuse a bunch of cash into the PAC12 network for production value but make it a distribution opportunity for rights fees is a good idea. Turn the tables on the networks and force them to say no we don’t want to buy the rights to air USC vs UW… and reveal the actual problem and why they’ve all dismissed the PAC12 for a
Decade. They are trying to consolidate into a super conference format.
It already sounds like the fix was in with FOX invested in b!g and bspn with sec, it’s not in their best interests to bid against themselves
The Big10 a few days ago: “We’re not currently looking to expand”
The Big10 today: “…Big Ten presidents has begun exploratory discussions about expanding membership by two or four teams. Schools under consideration: Oregon, Washington, Cal and Stanford… ”
https://twitter.com/NicoleAuerbach/status/1686799577603600387
for some reason i’m hearing the theme from jaws
I wish the Big Ten would just take all the remaining PAC teams and form the Rose Bowl conference. They could play the conference championship game at the Rose Bowl every year.
Devil’s in the details. The newcomers would be second-class citizens and wouldn’t get as much of the media deal as other schools.
We need to come to grips with reality. OSU’s 29 year losing streak has overwhelmed anything redeeming about the school in other sports and even current trends. OSU is a ruined brand and will be relegated to MWC status as a result. We could have been Rutgers or Iowa St if the geography wasn’t so far NW.
Big12 is the hopeful end for this mystery journey for Beavs.
It is a huge financial hit to drop to the MWC, and the purpose of weeding out teams/conferences is for the reduction of automatic bids to playoffs. I don’t think it is a coincidence that PAC12 is targeted for either dissolution or relegation the year before playoff expansion happens.
I’d say this is the true fix of the system. SEC and BIG10 ADs/Presidents joined with ESPN and FOX to manipulate how to continue a controlled product, and maintain access to the big bags of money related to the new playoff system.
The Beavs have great facilities, great town, great staff, great culture for football and may have a good chance to go into MWC and win a lot for a few years but recruiting and money will become unavoidable problems eventually. Unless the school endowment underwrites additional athletic costs and keeps coaches salaries at current or better levels for a long term goal of success…who am I kidding?
OSU athletics was dealt a death low by George Kliakoff yesterday and it is obvious to see.
welcome to reality land
vote with your dollar and don’t watch any ESPN/FOX college games, no matter how enticing the matchup looks
I’d recommend SportsUrge for bootleg streams if you really feel the need to watch one of their games.
This is the most comparable model that Apple has going right now. I forgot they have deals with the MLS and MLB.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MLS_Season_Pass
The biggest difference is the fan base of the PAC12. I feel like this would work in the SEC and BIG10 due to their more involved fan bases. PAC12 fans are not as engaged and there are just less of them and even fewer willing to pay. Would need several million subscribers to get to the numbers of the BIG12 per school after netting out production costs.
MLS did work out a tv agreement with Fox, which the PAC12 could do with ESPN. ESPN will still need west coast games to fill in the late night slots. the BIG10 can’t fill it with USC or UCLA since the BIG10 is going to Fox, CBS and NBC.
https://youtu.be/uMyCa35_mOg
What’s really sad is that if we do move the MW we probably would be toward the bottom ina couple years. One of our major selling points to recruits is that we are their best (or only) P5 offer. If we lose that, than what do we really have to offer?
Facility upgrades none of the other schools have or will be able to afford.
Big fish/Little pond
I’m not a usual poster. And let’s face it this is standing in front of a tidal wave but we have to get everyone we know to watch and stream every game. We don’t mismatch to the big12. We are actually a + team in their conference as it stands. Idk. We are coming out of a downturn (I think) and our brand is on the rise. We need TV numbers.
Waiting is the hardest part: https://youtu.be/uMyCa35_mOg
So… how about that Collaborative Innovation Center?
One of the most powerful supercomputers in the world isn’t bad.
I personally think it’s pretty cool that I can get a cup at the Bean and know I’m within steps of the future.
Then again, I understand people have read a lot of Heinlein and Dick, and they’ve interpreted it differently than I have, the latter being that it’s fiction.
Boy, if you thought Pac12 network production value and Pac12 reffing was bad in the past, wait till the 2023 season…
The PTN production value was pretty good, if we minus the on-air talent selection and artsy part of the equation. Analysts stayed on topic, and filming was better than what ESPN puts out on a regular basis. It would have been cool to see what Aplle would have done with it, seeing what they did to MLS.
For MLS, they worked with them to interview all the top analysts and color commentators and all the talking heads, as well as looking for ways to make their referees as uniform in playcall as possible. Using Apple’s strengths to our advantage would have been nice.
What is crazy is how ASU is always looked at as the sleeping giant but never deliver anything. The Phoenix market has nothing to do with ASU and will never follow them in large numbers. Phoenix is full of transplant residents and the loyalties for most are from other regions, generally BIG10 country.
Frustrating that ASU is included simply because of their location. Beavs are excluded simply because of location. Beavs seem to be a better fit for Big12 in multiple sports but become easy to dismiss due to location, although they have West Virginia out on an island in the east coast time zone…
I’m fairly certain that Barnes is doing nothing and will not surprise us with anything. Somehow I imagine him passively watching his entire sports department dismantle in a matter of weeks/months. OSU sports will be relegated to even lower forms of irrelevance after all the chairs are filled in the Big12 and Big10.
Same with Utah, they will win the Big12 soon enough. UA won’t win anything, and their men’s basketball will take a step back without all of the patsies they faced in the PAC12.
Feeling kind of sour grapes towards the whole thing…The Monty Show is correct after all. PAC12 is a dead conference and OSU has nowhere to go. There were some rumblings that the Beavs have other options but they needed to jump with Colorado if they were going to jump at all. Too late for that now and they sat on their hands without a plan B, waiting for Kliakoff to finally show his cards. Terribly disappointed in GK and Barnes/OSU President.
ASU-OSU contrast is not just because of location. ASU is a much bigger school with an AD that is top 25 in the country in revenue.
Oddly enough, in terms of national footprint/buzz, they are about on par with OSU in Google Trends.
The upside to the conference dissolving is that a lot of Pac12 refs will be unemployed and no other conferences will consider hiring them…
Mountain West here we come!
New rivalries with Nevada and Boise State
On the plus side, road trips to Vegas and Hawaii every other year.
Who needs bowl games?
People like Las Vegas? Couldn’t get me out of that place fast enough.
Agreed Angry. Not a place I care to visit again.
I love visiting Vegas for a weekend
Agreed. Shithole.
Sounds like you’ve never been to the museum and the garden.
I should be more clear, because I now realize the Bellagio also has a garden, which is pretty much what you would think a casino would do to a garden.
I’m talking about the Springs, the place that gave water to the meadows, or las vegas. And there are a couple other pretty good botanical gardens and preserves in the area. The Museum of Natural History is excellent, and there are a bunch of museums in the city, some indy, some non-profit, some cliche.
One could go to Vegas and spend several days exploring all these places, without taking part in the rat race, beyond being in a city.
It’s either that, or I head up into the mountains or out in the desert to play. But I don’t recommend this time of year.
Hate to see the P12 dissolve but given the conference leadership and the shitty ass presidents of the schools that allowed the mismanagement to happen, what can one expect? Maybe our men’s basketball can somewhat compete with being relegated to a lower conference but truly does suck that we likely won’t see our football program hit the heights it deserves under JS. Hopefully baseball can continue to remain relevant as it seems not as dependent on being part of a P5 conference as football or baseball are.
Baseball coaches admitted NIL is having a big impact on their sport, too. College sports west of the Mississippi and north of the Missouri River are done for.
Yeah, NIL definitely an issue for sure. Just seems like there are more “lesser” conferences that have programs be viable in baseball that isn’t necessarily based solely on the “prestige” of being a power 5. Of course, I could be wrong
Time to install some orange turf.
Ha!
Fan on twitter had a good point about UW/UO going to the Big10.
The logistics of a late season road game on the East coast would be a nighmare. The equipment truck would need the weather gods on their side.
I guess they could be strategic about scheduling those cross country games for earlier in the season, but you still have the chance for division/conference championship games requiring that extra travel.
Oh well, not our problem
I think I read somewhere that two planes will be required for when either UCLA or USC play in one of the far-off games in their new kingdom.
FSU looking for an out in the ACC due to the disparity in revenue to the SEC and BIG10. Maybe that give the BIG10 pause in adding west coast schools. BIG10 would likely raid the ACC if schools found an out of their media deal instead of the PAC12. They would get a foothold on the east coast and down into Florida.
But that seems very unlikely at this point
Problem for FSU is that they are not a very good school academically.
It’s not a problem anymore. FSU ranks #55 in the school rankings. Tied with Rutgers, Maryland, UW and Miami
UW’s sank that low? Yikes
Which rankings are these?
Not that unlikely. Clemson is looking to jump ship, too. And you think Miami would stay put if FSU and Clemson left?
Anything is possible with the right buyout arrangement.
OT: Eggers up with another nice piece. Catching up with Gary Andersen, talks PAC-9, and a mention of Pat Casey and Miiitch at the birthday party for Jess Lewis.
Andersen, 59, is a six time grandpa and none of his family is now in coaching. He volunteers as director of the Utah State NIL collective. Of him, Eggers says, “I consider him a decent guy who had some quirks with neurotic tendencies that seemed to overcome him when things went bad his third year at the OSU helm.”
https://www.kerryeggers.com/stories/on-gary-andersen-the-pac-9-jess-lewis-sis-power-list-and-justin-herberts-contract
Oh goddamn, my dad has told me that story a million times about the OSU wrestler that caught OJ by the ankle in the Giant Killers game, I had no idea it was Jess Lewis. My dad had classes with him.
fwiw (not much, I guess)…I was classmate with Lewis in grades 1-3 in Aumsville, then my family moved to Salem. I was in Navigation School while in the Navy and watch the Giant Killer game on TV in the base rec room.
https://sports.usatoday.com/ncaa/finances
If you look at these rankings (which only show public schools, so USC and UCLA aren’t included), PAC-12 is the clear #3 conference in terms of revenue. Well ahead of the Big 12 with Texas and Oklahoma leaving. It’s a shame how badly the PAC-12 leadership has screwed up their national footprint and future prospects.
UCLA is a public achool
Been prepping for a gig this weekend. What happened? We’re in the Mountain West!!? We always belonged there, but I never thought it would actually happen.
How long’s it take to load your shit in the truck? You a drummer now or something?
I haven’t heard any definitive announcement on anything related to more schools actually signing with other conferences. As far as I know, the Pac still has 10 schools. If they already know the details of the media deal, then they’re either cool with it, or they haven’t received a better offer.
9. Colorado left last week
I do wonder how ticket prices would be affected if we jumped to the MWC. Qualify of opponent falls off so I would expect ticket prices to fall. However, Beavs need all the $$ it can get. Can’t expect season ticket holders like me to pay $2k a year to watch teams like Utah St, Hawaii and New Mexico.
So once OSU gets demoted to MWC, should we expect about a 4-5 year window of advantage through our current recruiting until the regression to the mean of MWC? If such is the case, JS has about a 4 year window to go undefeated and somehow get into the playoffs, that is if MWC and any other non P5/(P3?) SEC/BiG10/Big12 teams are allowed to participate.
try one or two. Best players will transfer fast
JS will leave also. He’ll stay long enough to get the program as high as they can get (probably Boise State level) then he’ll leave.
Just in time for Mike Riley to ride in to the rescue…
Oh god.
Storybook ending
purgatory
[?p?r???tôr?]
noun
1. the state of forever trying to find your identity
Well ESPN and FOX figured out how to implode the PAC12, next on the agenda is to force ACC to let FSU, Miami and Clemson depart for the sake of all college football. The dust hasn’t even settled from Kliakoff’s debacle of a presentation and they are already ramping up pressure on ACC to let them get out of the GOR. Every story has a nod to the GOR but a follow up of how badly the 3 schools want out of it. Along these lines of thinking: “No one is held to a contract anymore, how can you expect that they would know all of this was going to happen? Let them go…to the SEC”
Notre Dame will be on the outside looking in and Big10/SEC will essentially freeze them out until they capitulate and join one or the other. Big12 is like JV after all of it and will never be viewed as equal, even TCU was simply a nice little story, too bad they couldn’t beat Georgia.
One thing that’s been clear is the SEC, Big Ten and their television partners conspired to tank the PAC-12 to remove any real opponents to a super conference in the next wave of realignment. Now they have their little media members carrying water for them to get UW and UO to panic and jump to the Big Ten and get much less money to join than USC and UCLA did cause they’re terrified of being left behind. This is obviously foolish cause the next wave will leave them behind. What’s truly sad is the 2023 PAC-12 conference will be the best it has been since maybe 2000 and several of its schools are chasing the money that will dry up soon when they become irrelevant in the super league era.
GK has gotten killed for the lack of a media deal but it seems like collusion from ESPN and FOX to not even discuss a legitimate deal cause the PAC-12 would have nowhere else to turn but a streaming service that wouldn’t have the financial benefits that PAC-12 presidents were looking for in the short term and UO/UW/AZ would bolt and the league would essentially fold. Long term all 12 members of the conference should have stuck together. It was the only shot for members in the conference to consistently have a shot at the playoff for years to come and to keep their programs from becoming irrelevant a decade from now. Presidents and ADs got played for fools with the top SEC and Big Ten teams being the ones who will benefit. Duck fans will celebrate Oregon State getting screwed but they’ll be next and are too delusional to see it coming.
Since we know the PAC-12 is done, Beavs might as well go out on a bang and win this conference and run up the score every chance they get.
I wonder if the players will be too dis-spirited to play to the potential we expected or if the situation will be fuel to prove their worth.
My concern too, that the perceived lack of a future is a conference.
Would be great if Beavs won it in the last year.
My bro and i are talking about trying to get to the Utah and UW games in case this is the last PAC season..
*perceived lack of a “conference future” is a “distraction,” not a conference…
Brilliant piece by Forde:
“It would be massively damaging to college athletics to have no prominent West Coast conference. If an entire region of the country sells out its athletes and fans for a long-distance partnership that in all likelihood would produce fewer victories, greater academic hardship, less tradition and harder travel—all in the name of revenue—the entire enterprise is diminished. More revenue leads to bigger staffs and buildings, makes rich coaches richer, and gives administrators a cushion for financial mismanagement in making hires and rewarding contracts. Those things do nothing for the average fan who wants to win, enjoy local rivalries and maybe make an easy road trip to an away game.
They’ve been conned into rooting for revenue, believing that simply being “big time” is some kind of intrinsic reward.”
https://www.si.com/college/2023/08/02/college-sports-soulless-spiral
Good commentary; pretty much what folks here at your very own AB has been saying, for years.
The edge of the abyss is near, OSU about to catch the anvil like wiley coyote and :::poof:::
These last few years were a fun ride, fellas, time to wind down the party, last one out remember to turn out the lights.
Can the Pac just rebrand itself with the remaining ugly step children and then adding CSU, Nevada, Boise St, SDSU, etc?
Seems like they’d get a lot of recruits who don’t want to go play in the Midwest ever. Weather and local/family would be the only real selling point. I’m not sure you can build a conference around that. But I’d rather it be called the PAC and the Mt West schools join us than the other way around.
That’s going to be what they try to sell, but the interest won’t be there, revenue will fall off, competitiveness will off, etc. Quality will be halfway between current MWC and current PAC. Probably something like current AAC level (or AAC before the better members were raided). The longer NIL and transfers go unchecked, the faster that quality will decline.
I think it could work just because a lot of top recruits are going to want to stay on the West Coast. Any school in the rebranded PAC would have an advantage with them. Also, I think all of these schools would have a huge chip on their shoulder for being left out. And weather. I think those 3 things would be the selling points. The problem is, it might take ten years for it to play out and build up to a level that competes with other conferences. Time is the problem. I think having a handful of core PAC teams remaining is a good thing. Glad it wouldn’t just be OSU. That would be brutal.
Could the PAC sue the Big12 for financial loses? Seems another angle to pursue to nix the deal from happening all together. Definitely material loses here that might play in court and get the Big12 to back off.
I love that Big12 fans are now arguing against a Power2 structure where SEC/BIG10 are the 2 main power conferences and everybody else is on the outside looking in. arguing that it would only lead to anti-trust legal battles and that the Big12 needs to be included in a Power3 structure instead.
So Power5 was ok. and Power 4, no prob. Power3 would be ideal. But Power2??? Now you’ve taken things too far!
https://twitter.com/coog57/status/1687113908878966784
wtf?
What was the question?
It’s been proven for many years, the top west coast recruits do not stay home. SEC and BIG10 just have too much money to offer.
Top 2 QBs in the 2023 NFL draft, both from Southern California. Both went east to play college.
Other examples
DJU – Top west coast recruit. Went east to play ball first.
Gebbia too – Went to Nebraska first to play
The new PAC12 will have to fight for the scraps that fall out of the big programs.
Well I didn’t literally mean the top ranked 2 QB recruits. Just really good recruits.
Steven Jackson made this same argument when the USC/UCLA news broke
I’m not sure if it’s a great argument given the pay for play stuff. But it’s possible. I think college football might finally be over, but if I’m thinking positively, the above is the only way it’s a positive outcome for west coast teams. I also think Smith is going to bolt after this year when someone offers him a lot more money to be in a bigger, merged conference. I can’t see him wanting to compete in the MWC light edition. He’s too competitive for that. If they hire Riley in that situation, it would be a fitting and hilarious ending to Beaver football.
This is all awful. I feared this years ago when CU and Utah entered the PAC. I could see what the big corps were trying to do, and they finally did it a decade later.
These decision also massively impacts other sports programs besides football that may be successful.
What infrastructure that is already in place, their community culture, their traditional rivalries, etc are affected.
And you don’t think the interest and revenue will fall off if Arizona were to be swallowed up into whatever conglomerate they were to go into?
It doesn’t matter if the revenues fall for a period.
What matters is it’s a fuck you to the schools who don’t want to be in the conference, and a windfall for those who always did, who then get to turn around and flip the bird.
It also prevents them from coming back after their own future relegations and claiming it for themselves, after they abandoned it.
Also, there’s the question of the Pac 12 Network.
If all the schools leave, I’m sure they’ll just vote to sell it, having whatever majority they need to do so.
But what if there are enough schools left to nix the deal, and those who leave also leave the PTN behind?
Hear, hear
Just a thought: a few programs have cashed in on one good season due to recency bias (UCF, Cincinnati). If the Beavs really can win the conference, make the CFP, etc. they materially improve their chances of getting an invite from another conference. National media attention WILL increase. DJU is already boosting that. Our AD revenue is high enough (#55 in the country) to be considered equal or better to many of the existing teams in the Big 12, Big 10, etc.
This is probably the highest stakes season in Beaver football history.
A reinforced PAC/MWC with the left over programs could still be pretty good football and still attract good quality athletes. The next step is already out of the bag though with Paul Finebaum already beating the drum to downgrade whatever is left of the PAC12 as inferior and not deserving to be part of the upcoming playoff structure.
High stakes season with a lot to ply for and a lot of attention should be coming OsUs way if they can run the table and crash the party.
Go Beavs! Get to as many games as possible Beavernation. Make Reser legendary this year. New side and great new home field advantage.
The PAC has likely 4 teams living inside the top 15 for most of this season…maybe 5….
Irrelevant, but Paul Finebaum looks like he lives under a rock.
Future PAC 12 North
Beavs
ucks
WSU
UW
Boise St
Nevada
Future PAC 12 south
Cal
Stanford
San Jose St
Fresno St
San Diego St
UNLV
The south would be a cake walk. Thank God the division part is gone.
I thought they were taking Washington, Ducks, and Stanford?
Nothing’s set in stone at this point, but reports are the Big10 is doing their due diligence regarding adding those teams .
I guess there are some sticking points, like USC doesn’t want Oregon or any other west coast teams to join them in the Big10.
And Oregon/Washington supposedly don’t help the conference financially, so they would be getting smaller cuts than existing members.
In a way, i’d love to see oregon take a pay cut compared to other conference team, to play way off in the eastern time zone while also having more road blocks to earning a playoff spot.
Just not at the expense of OSU getting shoved down to the MW conference.
“And Oregon/Washington supposedly don’t help the conference financially, so they would be getting smaller cuts than existing members.
In a way, i’d love to see oregon take a pay cut compared to other conference team, to play way off in the eastern time zone while also having more road blocks to earning a playoff spot.”
Yeah, they don’t reside in major markets. UO had “brand” recognition because of Nike and ESPN… but not major tv market.
Would love to see UO get fucked that way too.
I’m generally for sportsmanship, but any chance Beavs have to run up the score while protecting starters’ health, they probably should in conference games this season.z
If we have to form another conference with Wazzu, I propose we invite all the schools in the western US that end in State.
Stanford? I think I recall even when Stanford had the great David Shaw teams, the attendance wasn’t very large. Stanford fans will travel to the midwest, or wherever?
Hah. No. They’re probably inviting them for academics. The Big12 is pretty stupid.
Is the fact the PAC is likely gone after this season going to result in any of you going to more conference games than you might have otherwise?
Not necessarily I’ll still go once a year like always. But I will only watch beaver football from here on out. I enjoy college football so I’d usually watch or listen to a game or two outside of OSU every weekend. I have no desire to line pockets that are actively ruining college sports.
I still have cable but only because it’s packaged with my internet. Probably time to cancel that and not be so hypocritical.
I’d like to see a “Friday Night Beatdown” of Utah, UW, and maybe Stanfiord…may go to @ WSU…
Gone after the this season? How about it is gone after tomorrow; UofA, ASU and Utah look to be jumping the Big12 and UofW has an ’emergency meeting tonight at 9 – guessing they will likely accept the invitation to the BIG10. You know who isn’t being talked about, the Beavs and the Cougs and who knows where they will end up. There are some days that the fact that money rules all just pisses me off….
No Civil War is like the most depressing thing ever. The Ducks should have demanded any move requires the Beavs. All the schools should demand their rivalry game. Would give mad respect to them if they did that. Total sellouts, which isn’t surprising. Really disgusting all around.
Wonder if they’d dare risk it as a non-conference game…probably not, as a B10 travel schedule is likely going to cost them probably 2 losses per year as is…
On the flip side, they also have a certain level of hubris which would inform their egos enough to stay and be the big fish in a little pond, convincing the Bay Area schools to stick around for prestige… and maybe that dog team too.
If Ducks go to Big 10 no way they ever play in Reser again. They will demand all games in Autzen and give Beavers chump change. Other sports no problem but football they will take a Michigan and Ohio State superiority complex that they are to big to travel to little OSU.
I’m glad we renovated the stadium just in time for nobody to show up. Better stress the multi-use portion of that plan.
They skated to where the puck is going by decreasing capacity
It really is just par for the course as an OSU fan.
Wait forever to renovate, then finally get your shit together and renovate, only to see the sport go away.
Right? Coaching, talent, depth, teamwork, entertainment value, and stadium all improve, PAC goes away…
The ultimate Charlie Brown meets Lucy
But somehow we always survive and keep coming back
We wasted a lot of time with Riley. I stressed time being a factor during the Riley tenure. Mostly mentioning people die, never get to see the team win, etc, but I also mentioned that as the conference changed (i.e. expansion in 2012) that being the laggard would bite us with each passing day. If we had hired someone good when Riley was shot after the 2009 bowl game, we wouldn’t be in this position today. A lot of wasted time, and we’re paying for it. Our fans basically said that mediocrity was okay as the landscape was changing before our eyes. What big time conference would want that? It makes sense it played out this way for OSU and WSU especially.
Beavs will have the best facilities in the Mountain West
Florida State saying they can’t afford to stay in ACC, ACC may start losing teams too…
Possible that FSU is trying to get a bigger slice of the ACC pie than the other schools. Not sure how they’d get out of that contract they’re in anyway.
There’s always ways out of contracts. The most obvious one would be to pay the exit fee. If the net money after paying an exit fee is greater than the dollars they’d get from the ACC, they’ll break the deal for sure.
As it stands now
BIG10 – 60M per school
SEC – 50M per school
ACC – 40M per school
BIG12 – 31M per school
PAC12 – 20M?
Didn’t Scott sell a portion of conference revenues to VC a few years ago? Is that impacting the value of these deals or does it make the actual cash flow to schools smaller?
He tried, didn’t work if I recall. The plan back then was to get more exposure into Asia.
Damn I wouldn’t think the Viet Cong would have that kind of budget.
20M with escalators if they hit certain tiers of subscription numbers.
So every Pac12 fan should go add and cancel an apple subscription multiple times, similar to how people stack votes for post season awards.
Let’s get the Pac to $70M!
So stupid question here but when should we expect an actual certified deal? The stress this week…
Seems like the schools heard the offer, didn’t like it, now they’re shopping around with other conferences before agreeing to something.
Ha! Its closing time! Last call for alcohol! Everyone rushing, trying to find someone to go home with!
It truly is. The writing is on the wall at ESPN that rights deals will never be the same. Now is their chance to make the big money.
There may not be enough teams left to accept ‘the deal’ by my reckoning. Teams are already voting for the ‘deal’ with their feet and it looks like a majority don’t like it, or at least half. Predicting that tomorrow will be a bad day in the PAC 12. Larry Scott was the worst; the entire concept that the PAC 12 needed their own network was a bad one to begin with. We should have cut a deal with ESPN when the opportunity was there. How many here even watch the PAC 12 network outside of September through December? Sure, I’ll catch a few men’s BB games and baseball, if it gets aired – but I have no need to watch Stanford men’s water polo or beach volleyball from SC or the continuous reruns of football games past (except the Stanford-Cal game; I can’t get enough of the tuba guy getting decked in the end zone by the Cal player).
Well the lineup is always shitty, there can be live games going that have implications for post season in any range of sports and the dumbbells at the pac network show a replay of a game from some other season. It really has been a horrendous clusterfuck
Out of curiosity, do the individual state legislatures have any say in any of this? USC is a private school so they could always do what they want. The Oregon and Washington schools are public. Can they still just do whatever they want, or is there some kind of oversight to making these kinds of decisions?
There was some legislative push to make sure the state schools stayed together, but it may have just been theatre.
It was brought up by a few Oregon legislators, but it did not get enough support to make it to a vote. I think that was last year.
It should definitely be a rebranded pac instead of dropping to MWC. The Beavs could be the dominant team and be getting into the expanded CFP on a regular basis. Smith is off the Peterson tree that did it with Boise. I don’t see any reason why it wouldn’t work with OSU. If OSU can be a team that regularly goes to big time bowl games they could still get the same level of recruits they’re getting now. Could really make hole jealous of them dominating while the sux become irrelevant in a big 10. The OSU brand could become big brand because of this and players might like their chances of going to the playoffs better than other schools. It might take a little time but the travel might start to turn kids off of some of those west coast schools that bailed. Perhaps see a lot of transfers from those schools.
The big thing will being able to keep and pay the coaches that have got them to the level they’re at now. Need to retain smith and coach M.
Agree, it kinda sucks that shit rolls downhill if the PAC ends up raiding the MWC for their better schools but that’s apparently how it goes.
Wonder how much Apple really wants into college football. If they really do want in, they’d raise their offer to be at least in line with the BIG12 to keep the conference together.
Best case scenario for the Beavs might be the conference does breakup but the apple deal is still in place. Instead of going to the $4M per year the MW gets, they still get the $20M a year from Apple.
They don’t care that much. Right now they see they can get a good deal because Fox and ESPN won’t get anywhere close to it.
In other news, Beavers edge reporting that DJ looked super comfortable today and was much more accurate than during the spring camp. Rolling out of pocket and making some deep throws. Chiles still looked good but they did mention it seemed like he wasn’t as sharp. Thought he put on 10lbs or so which is good. Said JS called out noble Thomas as somebody pushing for playing time.
So who’s the best teams in mountain west to poach? Boise, Fresno, come to mind.
The Mountain West isn’t a death sentence, look at the success Utah had and even Boise St was able to get national recognition. Honestly, with USC out of the Pac,
the only national team left is Oregon. Once Oregon leaves, there will be no interest nationally in the Pac12.
I agree that a rebrand, is necessary. Is it possible to create an SEC like atmosphere with passionate fanbases in Pac12 country? I believe it is, look at Oregon. They did it with excellent marketing, etc. They have a loud, obnoxious fanbase that the majority of Beaver fans hate. But do we hate them because we’re jealous?Probably…
In my younger years, I recall going to a Beaver football game(on old side) and having fans tell me to sit down. That same year I attended a game at Oregon and had a fan tell me to sit down. The difference between the 2 experiences. At OSU, I ended up in an altercation and was assaulted.
At Oregon, the entire section, told that person that “We stand here” Keep in mind that I was wearing a Beaver hat at the Oregon game and they still defended me and my friends that were standing.
If I was an unbiased fan, I can tell you which place I’d rather go watch a game…
Anyway, I always dreamed of an SEC like atmosphere at Reser but eventually gave up on that idea.
What do y’all think? Could poaching MW teams be a good thing? Should we start passing out free booze at games to get some rowdy crowds? : )
LOL. Oregon Ducks are no more a “national” brand than Stanford or Cal.
And the game day atmosphere was quite different in contrast maybe 15+ years ago, but OSU games are quite fun nowadays….you should go to a game this year, way different than the “sit-down” days!
What are you talking about? Like it or not, the national brand Hole has created for the last 15 or so years is undeniable, and they were likely the team that got the ball rolling nationally with things like fancy locker rooms/facilities and flashy uniforms. They have t-shirt fans all over.
They have had nearly 30 college game day appearances, hosting on many occasions. How is that not a national brand?
So what! I wear my Beaver gear and people off the street wherever I go, stop me to talk about the baseball team and what not….PAC12 schools are recognized all over nowadays. It’s not all about the Ducks like you want to believe.
I see East coast kids wearing Stanford/Cal t-shirts I assume for the academics….most P5 teams are “national” in some form.
Boise and Fresneck have historically been strong programs. Even the small PAC media payday would have to be a pretty hefty increase in their budgets.
I’m not sold on SMU.
San Diego State seems an obvious choice.
I don’t think modern West Coast fans will ever rival SEC fans.
Was unhappy hour at 3 today?
Nobody cares about these anecdotes. And yes, there are several African children growing up believing that the Ducks won the 2015 Natty.
What’s the point?
Is Jack back on the Daniels?
Everything is Trump’s fault!
It’s Bush’s fault and you’re a racist.
Well that’s the general fall-back position for any issue, except replace ‘Bush’ with ‘Trump’ and you might have something
You haven’t been here long enough haha.
I could make a case that the neoliberals are a root cause for what’s happening now.
Trump’s the open racist, and supporting him is supporting open racism.
Trump’s fault!
Jack’s the open retard, and reading his posts is open retardation.
Trump is just a moron born on home plate that ran to first and claims he hit a triple.
He doesn’t have the capacity to not admit breaking the law, in public, he’s so dumb.
Trump’s fault!
I did go to an OSU game last season when they played in Tempe! That was a blast, just wish Colleto was healthy enough to play that game.
I’m not trying to debate politics or reality. Just curious to see what happens with the conference. The way things are pointing, I see WSU and OSU in Mountain West. OREGON AND UW to BIG 10. California schools could close down for all I care. UTAH and others prob big 12 or big 10.
It’s really looking like there were two cliques among the Presidents.
I would guess that USC had CU in the bag, and probably Arizona. That’s enough to kill any votes. And it would make sense they are the ones who leave first. They suddenly saw they didn’t have the numbers to do that, so they bailed or will finish the process soon.
There was a rumor back when SDSU was facing their deadline that UO blocked any expansion for some kind of distribution reason that really didn’t make sense, because a bigger audience theoretically means more money, or at least a bump, if a nice media market comes into play.
I’m not sure what messaging Kliavkoff was supposed to convey, if this was the case. It turns out the longer they waited, most of the Pac 12 got better deals.
Trump’s fault?
Smith media comments
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z8lHj8KgGck
End times…..
https://www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/38130567/sources-arizona-deal-big-12-expected-finalized-soon
I wonder if Crow stays, if forced to go against his long term plans for the school.
Stanford needs a new President.
Trump’s fault!
3 years later, and you’re still captured?
The only one talking about this shit is you. Take your fucking diaper off you twat
Your fault!
I have sympathy for the fans, but the commissioner and school presidents have had a year to figure things out and they haven’t. Absolute negligence to protect the brand, the schools and the athletes. All the presidents should be shown the door.
I would much rather see the pac add teams then to see OSU drop to the MWC. Just so they’ll be considered a P5 and not the perceived smaller conference and group of 5. Could totally see OSU being the big fish in a small pond and be like a Boise st. Was under Peterson. The big thing will be still making enough money to pay our coaches competitively.
What makes you think by adding some MWC teams that the Pac would maintain P5 status?
Honestly I’m not sure how it works but for at least perception purposes even though it would be entirely different conference. I think it would be better than having the MWC name. Possibly have a whole new conference name.
Really the whole thing sucks and is happening right as we’re starting fall camp on what could be a really special season. If OSU can win the conference it will only help their position wherever they end up.
No, it won’t.
Keep dreaming. OSU is small potatoes in the TV eyeballs.
OSU’s only hope of remaining P5 is the Big 12 throwing them a lifeline.
Might be time to at least TRY and cut bait before the remaining dominoes fall.
Otherwise it’s Mountain West
Well the big12 added Houston, Cincinnati, central Florida and now Colorado. Only Colorado was P5. And I’m sure Boise, Fresno and SDSU could all beat Colorado.
If the pac8 can keep oregon and Washington the add those 3 plus another why wouldn’t they stay P5? And who fucking decides they are or they aren’t?
So if / when we move to the Mt West or they add G5 teams to the “PAC12” what happens to OSU when the TV money is cut in half from where we are today? We just finished the stadium and used debt to build it along with still trying to fund the athletic department. I would assume budgets would have to be slashed leading to some sports being cut along with good coaches leaving, facilities not being updated going forward, etc. This is not a situation I see OSU ever rising from the ashes. This is bad. Somebody talk me off the ledge.
OSU admin had to factor in the impact of conference realignment in the planning phase for the new stadium. If the Beavs can dominate whatever new conference they end up in they’ll be fine. Just have to do whatever it takes to keep paying Smith the salary he deserves. May need to get creative and yes, its possible some other sports get cut. I truly believe this could be a blessing in disguise though, especially with the expanded playoff. Dominating a weak league is basically an automatic ticket to the playoffs. Hell, the ACC was absolute shit for most of the time that Clemson was crushing. They basically had to win one tough game per season to get to the CFP. Someone said this earlier, but ironically this could lead to the Beavs being more nationally relevant than the Ducks if the Ducks become Big 10 also-rans and aren’t able to make the playoffs.
You sure about that?
Beavs would basically have to run tbe table to make the CFP. With not as good of athletes as they have now.
I think you’re looking for a silver lining and that is a serious reach.
Definitely not sure about anything but there’s no reason to believe the level of athlete will drop off if Smith can be retained. If he can’t, then of course, all bets are off. But from a recruiting perspective, you have a coach who has a proven scheme and has proven himself in player development. Players see that and now they’ll also see the program situated in a way where it has a very accessible path to the college football playoffs. If anything I would expect the level of athlete the Beavs get to continue to increase.
I’d be okay hiring Lindgren to replace JS. They seem pretty similar to me.
Dikkart actually said what most Pac coaches should be saying.
https://www.si.com/college/2023/08/03/pac-12-coach-bemoans-conference-amid-realignment-big-ten-big-12
He’s astute to realize it’s TV money destroying the game. What’s fascinating is many fans think getting bigger and chasing more TV money is the solution. Rejecting them is the only solution. I guess we’ll see who has the balls to do it.
He’s not wrong
“the rest of the conference is left on shaky ground”…meaning the remaining 2 teams.
“But at the end of the day, we’ll look back at college football in 20 years and be like, ‘What are we doing?’
No need to wait 20 years, I think a lot of folks have already been there or been pushed there with this latest round of tom foolery
No shit.
In this new playoff system, who votes for the rankings that are tied to the 12 teams being admitted to the playoff. Is there some back door control from the SEC or Bigs? They can only get in one champion, but they could get in 3 or four in the second 6. If the Beavers land in the MWC they will have to be ranked and a champion. There are currently no non-power 5 teams in the top 25 ( ESPN )?? If there are only 4 or 5 ranked champions what happens to the 6th spot. Or does the ranking of the playoff go to 50 or 100? One of the best things about Beaver fandom is beating the unbeatable. In I think 08 the sportscasters were saying USC had the best team in the history of the sport and we beat them. It would be shame if we don’t get anymore “unwinnable games in the future. Hopefully all the positive vibes on Angry will translate into something positive on the field.
Yes, the Beavs will have to win the conference in most seasons if they want to make the playoffs. But here’s the thing……They will have a great chance to win the new “UberMWC” every season! Let’s imagine a world where none of this realignment happened. It’s still the Pac-12 with USC and UCLA in the fold…..Well, in that scenario, the Beavs would also usually need to win the conference to make the playoff. How many times have the Beavs ever won the Pac-12 or even finished 2nd? If the Pac12 stayed together the Beavs could probably expect a “chance” at a playoff berth maybe once or twice a decade. In the MWC scenario they have a chance every year and could easily make it 3 to 4 times per decade.
Just win the CFP this year, fold the program, and enjoy the eternal suffering of Oregon and Washington fans as they complain about having no shot in the B1G.
That’s only if whoever decides what does and doesn’t constitute a P5 conference allow G5 teams to make it. Imagine them going back on the 12 team championship bracket and staying with 4 because there are only 3 P5 conferences left. The 3 champions and 1 at large bid. That scenario would never allow g5 school for the at large bid.
That’s all she wrote for the pac12.
https://www.oregonlive.com/ducks/2023/08/if-offered-oregon-ducks-will-accept-big-ten-invite-source-says.html
Help me understand how in the last few years BYU, Houston, UFC and Rutgers get to be Power 5 Teams and we don’t. Barnes should have be proactive along with WSU to be the first to jump ship. He had to have had intel for the last year there was never a real media deal. Unbelievable a train wreck of Colorado gets soft landing. Sanders has hype and will be there 2-3 then either jump to SEC or be next Taggart.
Because they’re all in major metropolitan areas.
Multiple sources are now reporting this morning that the PAC-12 is having a meeting today and are expected to stay together and sign a GOR. Conzono also saying the same thing which tells me it probably will mot happen.
But the big question is…which schools?
All 9 is the new report. Many people reporting the same thing on twitter. It looks like we will know what is the truth soon. The deal Apple has on the table expires today.
What is with the short time frame by Apple? Obviously trying to force the pac’s hand. All this chicanery may serve the media companies today but they’re going to flush any goodwill they may have and a further shrinking eyeball market when actual college fans quit watching en masse; they’ll be left with cfp for casuals and that’s about it.
Still hoping for the core of Stanford, Cal, WSU, and OSU to try and salvage the Pac.
Would be awesome to convince at least ASU and/or Utah to stay, but seems like a long shot.
If they can bring in SDSU, SMU, UNLV, Tulane, Boise St, and Colorado State, it might be able to stay alive.
But, man, it feels like we need a Flutie-like hail mary.
Arizona reportedly wants to leave, but the Board of Regents wants to keep the two AZ schools together and there isn’t enough momentum for both to jump ship. Resentment for the conference is still building, and there’s still a possibility those two leave in the future.
Also, this is winning a battle in a losing war. There’s too much money pouring into other leagues relative to the PAC-12. If the NCAA doesn’t rein in NIL and the transfer portal (and it won’t), this is just going to make it a slow decline. For reference, the old PAC media deal was around $30M per school. We’re losing $10M, which is about 12% of our annual revenue. OSU and WSU will be hit the hardest by this as the lowest revenue PAC-12 schools. Will big donors step up with another $10M? Highly likely some sports get cut.
The current pac12 deal is $21 Million per school.
https://frontofficesports.com/espn-unlikely-to-re-sign-with-the-pac-12/
The supposed offers to WA and UO are 30-40 M but WA is stating the cost for increased travel is ~10M extra.
So net could be about the same as Apple offer
Thamel is reporting it too, and he’s been the closest to on top of things of anybody.
Gotta think it means Apple got cold feet and decided to sweeten the deal in the 11th hour.
Money is the only carrot that seems to work for anybody.
Still gonna be alot of mixed thoughts on Arizona.
On the one hand, fuck them, they were out the door and celebrating.
On the other hand, that could have been the catalyst that negotiations needed.
Still not over by any stretch.
https://twitter.com/PeteThamel/status/1687477096346521600?t=IabBvd7l7SoSJTBIySM6SA&s=19
Or they all could be using this as an opportunity to squeeze a few more dollara out of their new conferences and then will rub it in OSU/WSU’s faces.
It’s a shitty feeling being OSU/WSU and stuck with no options other than to be a passenger in all this.
Could this be the beginning of the APC (Atlantic Pacific Conference)? Could a merger mean we get to jump into the ACC’s TV deal, or combine it with the Apple TV deal?
Reportedly FSU, Clemson and Miami want out of the ACC…PAc won’t be the only conference torn asunder
AD revenue rankings of potential targets. I’ve subtracted every school’s university allocation (to show pure athletics revenue generation) and I’ve subtracted $10M from OSU and WSU to reflect the new media deal for reference. It’s not unthinkable that SMU and UNLV, maybe SDSU, could be higher revenue programs in a few years if they join the conference.
OSU $62M (under new media deal)
WSU $60M (under new media deal)
SMU ~$50M
UNLV $40M
SDSU $37M
BSU $34M
CSU $33M
Again the current pac12 media deal is $21 Million
https://frontofficesports.com/espn-unlikely-to-re-sign-with-the-pac-12/
Latest “tweets” (or whatever they’re called on “X” now) says the deal is dead and we’re back to the demise of the conference. I can’t keep up…
I think just assume corporate money will ruin the sport further, and you’ll be on the right track and close to the final outcome.
Oregon and Washington’s exit from the Pac-12 to the Big Ten appears to have lost momentum overnight, sources briefed on the discussions tell The Athletic. This is a turning of the tides after Big Ten presidents authorized commissioner Tony Petitti to pursue expansion on Thursday.
Additionally, the Pac-12 has a meeting scheduled for Friday at 10 a.m. ET, and there is renewed optimism around it.
This is old news now. Big Ten meeting as I type this to discuss adding UO and UW again. Pac 12 is back on life support.
Replying to Self: That aged well.
Today feels like the NFL draft with teams (media corps and conferences) picking players (college teams). Hopefully Beavos don’t go undrafted
Things seem to be setting up for Nike U to determine the fate of the conference. Just when you thought you couldn’t hate them more…
Unless they are the force that actually keeps the threadbare conference together.
https://twitter.com/angrybeavs/status/1687483743798513664
Ducks are all about the money and sucking corporate dick, so of course they will go wherever that leads them.
University presidents have to be smart enough to see the handwriting on the wall here – USC, UCLA, UO, UW, Colorado, Arizona are gone. ASU and Utah likely.
Gotta try and use the brand name to convince the lower tier schools to join them, and sign the Apple TV deal before the end of the day, rather than holding to some elite ideal and watching the whole thing crumble when school leave and the TV deal is gone.
Washington State
Oregon State
Cal
Stanford
Boise State
San Diego State
UNLV
SMU
Fresno State
Colorado State
That group is slightly above the level of the current Mountain West, and includes some decent sized TV markets and fan bases that might actually buy the streaming subscriptions to trigger the incentives in the contract. Heck, maybe adding some of these teams even convinces ASU and/or Utah to stick around.
With all the conflicting reports this morning, it sounds like the schools without a new possible home are trying to lock in the deal while UW/UO are trying to squeeze a more favorable deal toward themselves by threatening to leave
I agree. I saw that the Big 10 is not going to pay either the zeros or the dogs as much as some of other schools. May be rumor but its for sure both schools consider themselves to be on par with any other school and will expect to be paid as much as anyone. So them trying to squeeze more from the pac12 makes sense. What a cluster.
Basically, Canzano’s sources come from WSU/OSU and PAC-12 officials. Most of the other reports are sources from UO and UW. Oregon is doing this purely for money and I think the fact that they’d receive a significantly less share for joining than USC has them upset and they’re trying to squeeze every last cent possible. No doubt the constant back and forth with the big ten is coming straight from them. They’ll end up going there by the end of the day I think
The interesting element here is if it really is UW/UO pushing to leave, those are the states that could potentially keep them from leaving by tying them to WSU/OSU
How? Are you saying via legal means? I’m curious about that angle.
There was talk in both state legislations about moving to require the schools to stay together. It could just be political theatre, but there was actual discussion about it, at least.
I believe it involved state funding.
There’s no legal way to keep the schools in the same athletic conference
Are you a lawyer? No disrespect, just curious what the legal argument for or against
If they did make a law saying they have to be in the same athletic conference, Oregon could easily sue by saying they would be harmed by attaching OSU to them. It would limit the deals they could make to improve the financial standing of the athletic department. A court would agree with them
Hmm, yeah that makes sense.
Seems too like you could make the argument that both are under the purview of the state/state funding and harm to OSU etc etc.
But yeah, not happening
It’s more of an indirect harm to OSU so that’s not a viable legal path, tying them together would be direct harm to one or both schools.
I doubt any law the legislatures pass would not get overturned by a federal court.
Anti trust laws? Seems the media/conference shenanigans skating on thin ice. All it would take is some pissed off booster congressional douche to hold up what’s going on
Sherman’s antitrust law would be used to support Oregon’s move. Antitrust also applies to governments.
Seems like UO/UW to B1G is official: https://sports.yahoo.com/sources-big-ten-adding-oregon-and-washington-leaving-pac-12-with-uncertain-future-163742534.html
Oregon State beating Oregon in Autzen in the final game to secure their spot in the PAC-12 title game would be very sweet. Would hope they’d plant the Beaver flag at midfield too. 7-5 seasons in the B1G await them
Oregon and Washington certainly aren’t better than Iowa.
Well, that’s a kick in the nuts!
Civil War is likely finished. Can’t risk a game with a BIG10 league schedule esp if they go to a 9 game schedule.
Beavs will have to take on body bag games again. Traveling to far off opponents for a payday.
Leaving it as the rivalry game kind of killed it off. Sure the saltiness is still there but it’s definitely not as fun as a fan to not have any reference to the Civil War. For whatever reason, a proper name adds that bit of intrigue. Iron bowl, red river shootout, etc.
Just call it the Civil War because that’s what it is.
Bookmark this link so you can watch Beaver football in ’25: https://themw.com/watch/
Mountain West would need to move UNLV or Nevada to the “Mountain” division and add WSU and OSU to the “West” division. Let’s say UNLV moves bc they’re further east.
Mountain: Air Force, Boise State, Colorado State, New Mexico, UNLV, Utah State, and Wyoming.
West: Fresno State, Hawaii, Nevada, Oregon State, San Diego State, San Jose State, and Washington State.
Kinda would wish they split WSU and OSU into opposite divisions so the old Pac teams could win the division each year and play for conf. championship….
Maybe Wazzu in the Mountain?
LOL, I’m so bummed.
Think Cal and Stanford will just quit sports?
Some rumors about them going Independent, which I wouldn’t put past them.
This all seems like some dystopian nightmare – everything we have joked about (“the best stadium in the MWC”, etc.) for years is seemingly coming true! I can literally see the Beavs spiraling down to a lower tier MWC team after a couple of years in the MWC – none of the teams listed above have anything to fear from OSU – in fact quite a few of them have beaten the Beavs whether at home or on the road. OSU was Boise State’s first PAC10 win in fact. Can’t hardly believe this is happening.
The exodus of players from OSU/WSU hitting the portal after this season to get off of the sinking ship is going to be so painful. Do players like Chiles want to stay at OSU in the MWC when they can cash in a big NIL payday and move to one of the new B1G/B12 additions without even having to change time zones?
Chiles should go – he has so much to play for. DJ has the one year, can shine and be drafted. Luck of da beavs has never been so sadly true.
PAC 12 should just dissolve. Beavs should just go independent. We did it from 1959 to 1963 and actually had good schedules.
If all four schools went independent, the Beavs would need to schedule six more games for 2024. It’s not impossible if UW and Oregon are willing to schedule games, but getting four more FBS opponents would be difficult.
Any chance we get into Big12?
So we do we start losing recruits like our young talented QB?
When do we. So upset can’t type.
I know – the pain of today could totally impact this season, couldn’t it? Couldn’t guys just jump into the transfer portal tomorrow after the Pac-12 falls apart and go looking to get into the pipelines for these other teams that will actually be in major conferences in ’24?
Portal window is closed for now unless they are grad transfers. Window opens up after conf champ games.
How many phone calls has Scott Barnes made this week that have not been returned? He probably feels like one of those kids who never gets picked for the game at recess.
Does JS have the guts to say Chiles will be starting qb?
Is it to panic?
When will Barnes make a public statement about his failing commish and no plan B?
Where is the OSU president?
Pledging Loyalty to a sinking ship with all levers of power arrayed against your conference and all they can do is be silent.
“Where is the OSU president?” I have a feeling she isn’t too involved in this sportsball stuff
There was an article (somewhere) about the school presidents and how recent a few of them are. Said she professed to have learned to like sports when she was at UCLA but the writer doubted she was capable of any real input/output/whatever.
She and her wife are probably vacationing right now…. (yes, I said it)
Yes, you said it. Do lesbians and gays scare you? WTF does sexual orientation have to do with the topic being discussed?
No, hardly. “What does sexual orientation have to do with the topic at hand?” – probably more than you are willing to admit or concede. With acess to capital for insitutions and corporations being more and more dependent on their “DEI” score (how woke an entitiy is), it makes it a relevant factor to be brought up for discussion whether you like it or not. More and more hiring is being done today based on how many boxes an individual checks over experience and ability to really perform the job at hand.
On what I would consider one of the most imporatant days in the institutions history, where the future of the main revenue generator for the entire athlectic department is at stake, you would have thought the school president would have stood up with Barnes in solidarity and offered some reasurances to the university community; didn’t happen as far as I could see.
This shows either disinterest in what has happened or a complete lack of understanding of how dire the situation really is. This appears to be a real lack of leadership on her part, but the important point is, OSU is a ‘progressive’ univeristy now. (incidentally, when the Oregon State did their feature on the president they did mention ‘the wife’ so they must have felt that it was an important aspect to this individual and wanted everyone to know about it)
So flail away homeboy-
Too bad F. King was canned. He at least cared about sports.
Beavs have no leverage in this situation and never had any
If some form of the PAC12 survives. It’s primed for a spot in the CFP every year. In the new agreement, the top 6 conf champs get auto bids. And the conf champs get to host in the first round.
With the PAC12’s demise, it means two non power 4 conf champs will get in.
Remaining PAC12 members should look to form a conference with some Mountain West members and take the Apple deal. Keep the PAC12 name.
Canzano (gosh he’s terrible, isn’t he) now reporting that remaining Pac schools are going to meet for a second time today. Seems unlikely, but perhaps a small glimmer of hope that your scenario actually plays out?
Hopefully Apple hasn’t run away yet
Too bad with their bazillions of everything, they didn’t offer something spectacular and futuristic. Streaming is the wave of the future. Cable is waning. I know people who don’t have it but watch the major networks with tv antennas they buy at the hardware store.
Unless remaining schools means 6 or 4
My thoughts exactly. Keep the PACwhatever name and P5 status by adding whoever you have to and take the “prestigious academics” stick out of your butt in the name of survival.
Apple deal expires after today. Too many mountains to move in that short of time.
Perhaps another deal could still be made at a later time.
Then the issue shit show just shifts further down the ladder to the MW conference which would then be in the same spot the Pac is in now.
There really just isn’t a good answer to all of this other than OSU playing as a G5, which at least would put them on par with their competition market wise.
I have to think there are going to be some lawsuits coming out of all this. There is some serious financial damage being done to several college athletic departments.
I wonder about that, as well. Do the athletic departments get ALL their money from the media? Excepting hole, we know where they get their money and reportedly PK has been working on realignment for over a year.
Any chance if B12 wants that west coast presence they mentioned before they add Cal/OSU? Unlikely but with 4 corners that puts them at 18.
After 2025, SEC/B1G will try and change the automatic berths to the playoff so that at least 4 of their teams make it every year, maybe even 5. ACC is the next conference that is going to be raided and they’ll lose Clemson, FSU and Miami. Teams from the PAC and ACC should merge. It’s really the only chance teams from these leagues will have any hope of having a shot at the playoff. Away from each other they’ll be left for dead.
ASU
BC
Cal
Duke
Georgia Tech
Louisville
North Carolina
NC State
Oregon State
Pittsburgh
Virginia
Virginia Tech
Stanford
Syracuse
Wake Forest
Wazzu
Travel would be hell but it’s really the only chance either conference. Mountain west and Pac-12 together would have zero shot at having a shot at the playoff after 2025
What happens to the ACC media deal with those departures? Would those teams be content with the inevitably huge exit fees?
I actually think this is going to bad for Oregon/Washington. For one, a lot of those Big 10 teams will manhandle them. But there are other issues. For one, travel. Few fans from Oregon or Washington are going to want to travel to all these remote destinations. Then their team travel: their players are going to be exhausted from that type of travel (take this to the extreme and imagine the joined the ACC…and that travel. So, okay, slightly better, but not good). Recruits from the West won’t want to go play in those shitty backwater towns, and my guess is Washington/Oregon are banking on offsetting that by gaining recruits in the midwest. But I’m not sure it will work like that. Why would a dude from Oklahoma want to play in Oregon? There are cultural problems, for one, but second their family will never see them, and there are a lot tighter family bonds in the midwest. Gonna be a hard sell. I think both of these programs will be very mediocre now that they’re small fish in big ponds. It wouldn’t surprise me if they want to rejoin/reform some version of the PAC in ten years when they realize what a disaster this is for them.
It’s a disaster for OSU, too. Obviously. But I don’t think this was very well thought out. They saw the money and sold out, without thinking what it all means.
Oregon hasn’t made the playoff for a decade while their competition was mediocre for much of that time with USC being mostly down. Now they gotta try and earn a spot against competition like Ohio State/Michigan/Penn State/USC back to being a top 15 team and UW that just beat them and that’s not even mentioning traveling for 9 am PT kickoffs against the Iowas and Wisconsins. They took the money to be mediocre
But they no longer have to face OSU….Path just got easier
I hope they both enjoy Wisconsin, Michigan and Ohio in late November. I wonder how this will impact WBB and Baseball for us?
The Big 12, or the Big 10?
Both teams will get manhandled by Iowa and Minnesota.
Oops, 10.
This is a disaster for everyone. I literally can’t find a winner here. I don’t even think TV ratings will improve with this for the big corps. My friends are texting me really upset and saying they’re done watching, and they’re ACC/SEC guys.
This is actually one of the more interesting elements to me. IMO, sports as a whole have already peaked and we are heading into an era where the traditional sports are not as culturally relevant as they used to be. GenZ doesn’t care nearly as much as prior generations. Times change. 100 years ago the top 2 sports were boxing and horse racing. Eventually Baseball, Football and Basketball became the big 3 but they didn’t become all consuming in society until ESPN was born in 1979. That unleashed explosive growth that was bound to have diminishing returns eventually. You can’t grow exponentially forever.
The only winners are those who get paid salaries at the institutions that are getting the bigger share.
Increased the size of their pie slices, but the overall size of the pie is smaller.
In really good news, Bazzanna won the batting league title in the Cape Cod league. He’s putting himself into a top 5 pick. If he shows he can hit for plus power next year, he’s looking at the #1 overall. He might have to show he can play another position though as a 2B has never been picked #1.
“The Pac-12 can’t just add Mountain West programs to the league in 2024, as there is a $32 million exit fee per Mountain West school to leave before the start of the 2025 football season”
The PAC is dead. Finished. Done. It’s over. Turn the lights off in November 2024.
https://www.espn.com/college-sports/story/_/id/38134021/big-ten-set-send-invites-oregon-washington-sources-say
That’s why you get added TO the mountain west. In the end even if they call it the PACwhatever it’s not the PAC and at this point it doesn’t matter.
Yeah, I think that’s the logical next step. Some type of merger between those conferences but trying to keep that “Power 5” designation, even though we all really know it’s a G5+ conference.
I think they would merge and rename it. Renegotiate the media deal whenever the current one ends for the MW.
Anyone know what the MWC media deal is worth?
very little
https://www.sportspromedia.com/news/mountain-west-conference-tv-rights-cbs-fox-sports/
Oof. No wonder they play SEC schools for the payout.
how did they negotiate a $34M buyout for such a small overall deal?
Maybe the MW should manage the new Pac/MW entity.
With that little of money how are we going to pay for coaches and team travel going forward? It’s almost like a death sentence for OSU athletics.
Who in the MWC voted for that exit fee? That’s pretty ridiculous.
It would probably be better in terms of money and recruiting for the Beavs to go independent. Wait for the new members of the Big10 to realize they made a huge mistake, and reform the PAC in ten years or whenever that deal expires. Probably the best path. I’d probably continue to watch. I’m not sure I’ll watch the Beavs in the Mountain West.
Best to watch the current commits. They’ll likely start dropping out quick
How about just sign the apple deal, play a couple years as the 4-PAC, take the $20 mil per year, let the dust settle and then add in some more schools as they become available?
The conference still has all its bowl tie ins right?
I imagine the Apple deal was contingent on there being a full conference worth of teams.
Fuck Apple. Just more of the same problems signing up with the big corps. Go indie, Beavs.
Most likely.
This is actually really similar to what happened in the music industry. Big labels keep consolidating and eventually controlled everything, controlled the narrative, and a lot of smaller (but better) artists fell through the cracks. Then technology (spotify, youtube, etc) made it easy for small acts to find large followings. Going indie was the move there. It’s the move here, too. Beavs should just say fuck it to all these large corps and go out on their own. Make their own schedule, play who they want to play, interesting games for the fans, etc. Second best option would be keeping the remaining pac in tact and adding a few teams like Air Force, CSU. This Tulane shit is nonsense. I’d never watch an OSU/Tulane game. Give me a break. Joining the Mountain West is equally unappealing. Indie or add a few teams. Short of that, the Beavs are toast even for hardcore fans. The intrigue and interest and tradition just aren’t there with these shit teams and conferences being mentioned.
Filling out a schedule as independent would be tough. For the sake of argument, say that Stanford, Cal and WSU all did the same. Those schools could all schedule each other so that’s 3 games. Then you have have whatever 3 non-conference games you had in the first place. How do you find 6 more games? The rest of the league’s don’t really schedule non-conference games mid-season except for like what the SEC does scheduling late season patsies. Basically no good team wants to add OSU mid season to their already difficult league schedule. Beavs would be lucky to find 6 more games to play and they would likely all be shitty mountain west type teams anyway.
USC UCLA UW Arizona and the quacks will be looking for non-conference opponents as well
Why help them? If they need a hand, they can pay dollaz!!
Why would any of those schools need non-conference opponents? Maybe the rivalry game would remain but other than that those other schools are all set up.
Nah, I’m at the point where I’m saying fuck the Civil War and the Apple Cup.
Oregon and Washington want to bail out for a paycheck and crater the PAC then they can piss off.
https://twitter.com/HedbergJake/status/1687548275749175297
JS seems pretty pissed off lol.
“We find the longer we wait for the media deal, the better the options we get,” Kliavkoff said.
Prescient President of Pac, shits bed
Not enough attention has been paid to him. He may have been in an impossible position but never the less he failed miserably. If the writing really was on the wall he should have stepped up for all of the non traitor schools and talked publicly about what UO and UW were doing. Put the pressure on them morally. It probably wouldn’t have worked but at least it would have been honest. Instead he spent his time lying about how great of a position the conference was in and how much value it would bring to a new media partner. Every public appearance by that man has been an absolute farce from day 1.
You have to wonder if that guy will ever find another job. Pretty tough to have “Lead the implosion of a Power 5 college athletics conference” on your resume.
I honestly feel a little bad for the guy. He probably did the best he could to sell a middle tier product for a top tier price. Once USC and UCLA left, he had a whole lot less to work with. If they would have stayed he could’ve gotten a lot better media deal. Those two schools fucked up this whole thing.
Or was it all a ruse to force the remnants of the PAC to raise UNLV and the MWC up to the “Power 5”.
I don’t see Utah sticking around…they’d be smart to move as well. Stanford will have options, despite not being great in football you’d think most any large conference would like the Stanford name regardless of what they truly bring to the table from a viewership perspective. Gotta think ASU will follow suit with UA. Begs the question then, what benefit is there for mountain west teams to defect to the table scraps of the Pac? I guess a full merger could be in order but would that really be worthy of a Power 5 conference moniker? I’d say not and especially if big media is driving all of this, they’d much rather have the 4 “remaining” conferences have the seat at the table. Hell, from a views perspective, it would make more sense for them to have a 4th or 5th place UW from the big10 in a meaningful game than it does the winner of the misfits conference of whatever is left of the Pac and MT West.
If a Zombie Pac – MW merger happened the new conference wouldn’t be a Power conference but would likely be the best Non-Power conference. Whoever won that league would probably get in to the expanded playoff most years unless they had like 3 losses. The expanded playoff is really the only good thing that has come of conference realignment. The non-power teams really do have a better chance to reach the post-season now. I guess if they always get destroyed when they get there it doesn’t matter that much though.
Scalps. Fire GK symbolically today. President Dr. Jayathi Y. Murthy tomorrow. AD Barnes brought football back from the dead, pulled the stadium completion through. I’d be willing to bet he knew what needed to be done early.
Barnes always reminded me of Riley. Remember, all the coaches thought so much of the nice guy. Did Barnes ever shake up or demand anything? Or just act liKe he was glad to be a lesser member of the club?
I hear where you are coming from, but I suppose I’m giving big credit to coach Smith hiring and getting Reser to construction phase seemingly overnight. Take a hit with the Tinkle extension….if it turns out he sat on his hands, and it wasn’t the bureaucrats above poo pooing any early moves out of the conference, fire them all.
He built the new side of Reser.
He hired Smith.
Not sure what leverage you think he had at the table
trustees@oregonstate.edu
https://leadership.oregonstate.edu/webform/contact-presidents-office
Scott Barnes contact email Assistant Athletic Director & Chief Of Staff jess.coppolino@oregonstate.edu
Rumor is he has been on the phone with the BIG12 for months trying to get them interested in us. Not sure what else he could have done.
Bummer is he might be out of a job as a result of the assumedly significant budget cuts that are coming unless someone from the B1G, B12, or ACC throws us a lifeline…
And, having no inside knowledge at all, that is what I would be willing to bet he was trying to do. I’ll take another complete guess – lack of support or sense of urgency from the trustees or university President. Again, total assumption and we know how those work…but I’m so damn upset for our University right now what can I say. Athletics AND Academics.
Brandon Kamerman
@B_Kamerman
BREAKING: The Oregon state legislature is getting involved. Rep. Shelly Boshart Davis (R-Albany) is calling for a legislative panel to look at the “unintended consequences” of UO leaving for the Big Ten.
“We need to have all the information before a decision is made.”
“CONT: “There are many unanswered questions about what these moves mean for Oregonians beyond just the ending of one of the nation’s longest-running rivalry football games…”
If one of our major universities is going to make a unilateral decision that could impact Oregon’s budget, we should at least understand the full impacts.”
Feels like a longshot. Politicians always make things worse.
For profit sports and public institutions just aren’t compatible. This has always been a novelty of the U.S. and was bound to collapse under the weight of itself eventually. On to Professional Club-Academy model…..
She’s an oregon state grad, from Albany. She’ll say what she has to say to keep her base happy, but she doesn’t have the power to do anything about it
Exactly, there was some proposal last year that never made it to a vote.
Rumor out there now is BIG12 considering taking Utah/ASU/WSU/OSU having a total of 18 teams in the conference. All 4 teams would come in at a reduced rate for the remaining TV contact (I believe though 2025) then would be full share members with new TV deal.
Big if true. This would really be the best thing OSU can hope for at this point.
That better then the mountain west for sure.
For the love of all things holy please be true.
Zero chance they leave Arizona out and take OSU and WSU…. Wish it wasn’t so but we are toast.
Arizona already in that makes 14 for them. The other 4 make 18.
AZ is already done. That makes 14. Add the other 4 it’s then 18. Not sure how true it is.
Yeah I forgot to say it’s most likely BS. Luck “o”da beavs will prevail on this rumor.
OSU
WSU
Stanford
Cal
CSU
SDSU
UNLV
Gonzaga – 539k county population. No hometown team (close to Pullman). Spokane would be all over a football team.
San Jose State
BSU
Fresno State
Air Force
Sadly, this doesn’t scream power 5 conference. Not sure the Pac could retain the seat at the table with that line-up. Zags basketball would be the headliner of all that.
Yup, I hear that. I think the case could be made but lean your way. Only thing I could think of if the newest rumors aren’t true for B12. Assumes Stanford doesn’t just go independent which they probably should.
Swap BSU with Utah State.
Anyone follow this guy?
MHver3
@MHver3
·
1h
Hearing now there is a possibility B12 could go to 18 and bring in ASU/Utah/WSU/ORSU all at reduced shares for the remainder of the new contract and give them full membership at the next contract. Developing now so stay tuned.
He’s been pretty on top of all the other happenings so far.
I feel like it would make sense strategically for the Big 12 to add OSU and WSU. Especially since they can get them now at a discounted rate for a handful of years. When looking at the media markets, most Cougs and Beavs are in Seattle and Portland so the calculus is pretty similar as it was with UW and Oregon in terms of “number of humans in their area”. Of course the UW and UO brands set them apart but WSU and OSU are pretty solid adds compared to most of the teams already in the Big 12.
He’s a douche nozzle, but he does happen to be correct on predicting multiple Big12 moves so far, and he had the details of the Apple deal before anybody else.
As Beaver fans, would we prefer to move to the Big12 with the 4 corners schools, or stay out west with a cobbeled together Pac12/MidWest Frankenstein conference, for survival of the program?
We are losing media money both ways. Probably losing more in the Pac/MW scenario
But travel would suck that much more with the Big12, which would have to factor into things
Not ideal but the BIG12 could form east/west divisions that would reduce much of the travel. Though non rev sports would be in tough spots.
Another idea would be to have football/basketball only conferences and all non rev sports form geographically located conferences. There is precedent for it with conferences having non affiliated members to fill out non rev sports like wrestling.
You have to go Big12 at that point.
Really hope that’s true. If that were to happen and Kliavkoff doesn’t have a pathway to raid the MWC, I want the Fancy Pants Conference.
Norte Dame
Stanford
CAL
Army
Navy
Air Force
Wake Forest
Duke
UConn
Vandy
The more you think about this the more it makes sense.
Beavs and WSU are desperate so they can be had for a cut rate. More than the initial money the next couple of years you have to stay relevant. Going to Mt West automatically makes you irrelevant and probably will never be able to recover to current status. BIG12 knows this and in the 11th hour they swoop in to pick up the redheaded stepchildren at a discount. Big 12 gets their coast to coast footprint they are looking for and OSU and WSU are just happy to be there. Not saying this will happen but thinking about it logically would not be surprising. Probably why Barnes could never get any traction with the big 12 over the past few months. They knew eventually they could get OSU at half the price.
Yeah. The one caveat though is that price might not matter that much since it’s only short term for the duration of the current media deal. WSU and OSU would get full shares on the next deal so it only makes sense to the Big 12 if they think it will be advantageous to have them as fully equal partners eventually. I hope the case is that they would be a value to the Big12 but not sure.
Michael Gretler unloading on Larry Scott on Twixxer.
https://twitter.com/Gretzz_10/status/1687515072032391168?t=iXQ1Ck251bGUYS69eKqDMg&s=19
When UCLA decided to leave, I remember that the move would hurt Cal and that UCLA would have to compensate Cal on a yearly basis. Did that actually happen?
Who’d a thunk it, Prime says it straight:
“I don’t care what conference, who we’re playing against; we’re trying to win,” Sanders said. “All this is about money. You know that. It’s about a bag. Everybody’s chasing the bag. Then you get mad at the players when they chase it. How’s that? How do the grownups get mad at the players when they chase it when the colleges are chasing it?”
Didn’t think I’d ever read a quote from that knucklehead and nod in agreement
Same guy just posted ESPN is not happy that FOX got Oregon and UW and ESPN now needs more West Coast inventory. They have asked the big 12 to throw a life raft to a couple of more West Coast teams.
Hopefully we’re worth saving with that life line
This scenario could possibly give the university the political cover it needs to pressure the city/local community that has long been opposed to upgrading the Corvallis Airport? The hour it takes to get to Eugene for a chartered flight now makes a big difference.
UCF is the only coast-to-coast opponent, which is a 5 hour flight from Eugene. It’s not the WORST travel footprint. It sucks a lot more for all the other sports that maybe don’t have the resources to travel via charter. The now super rich af B12 should definitely help all the other sports at member schools to “find” those resources but we know how that goes.
Big12 West:
Arizona
Arizona State
Utah
BYU
Colorado
Washington State
Oregon State
Texas Tech
TCU
Big12 East:
Iowa State
Kansas
Kansas State
Oklahoma State
Houston
Baylor
Cincinnati
West Virginia
UCF
CAL and Stanford go Independent.
Best case-scenario for the Beavs. Fingers crossed.
It is the best case but dang, when you lay it out like that……Don’t care for it all that much more than the Mountain West.
Except we get 4 million a year in tv rights with the mountain west instead of the 30 million we had in the pac12 or possibly the big12.
We only currently get 21 million.
Oops, I meant to put 20.
In that scenario, if Smith and staff stick around, looks like their toughest opponent PROGRAMS would be Utah and TCU in the west, Okie State and Baylor would in the east?
I don’t think Sanders stays very long at Colorado, and whatever he quickly builds will likely quickly fall apart.
And how long until Wittingham retires?
If you add one more team to each division you’d have a nine game divisional schedule and there’s no need to travel to UCF.
I wonder what will happen to the payouts conferences receive from the NCAA for deep tourney runs in basketball. If I recall the Beavs Elite 8 run made a lot of money for the conference. Does that money just go away? Or can the Beavs claim it for themselves if the conference dissolves?
That money was spent before they got back from the tournament.
Just a sad day. But as much as the Beavs mean to us, they just don’t move the TV needle outside of Oregon. OSU probably benefited more (in image and dollars) than any other school by being associated with the conference. But they did not take advantage of this opportunity to turn the Beavs into a brand the TV networks or other conferences would see as an asset. Guys like JS, DE and Ralph Miller proved it could be done, but there just wasn’t enough of it. We’ll probably end up in the MW or hybrid Pac, but maybe if NCAAF continues to evolve into something like a 32 team super conference, we can hook up with the discarded teams.
Unfortunate that a special team and season are overshadowed by conference realignment. So tired of all the speculation being more of a story than the gsmew.
Barnes comments. I hope he has a magical rabbit up his ass he can pull out.
https://www.oregonlive.com/beavers/2023/08/oregon-state-ad-scott-barnes-livid-about-pac-12-defections-puts-this-university-in-harms-way.html
He doesn’t. Beavs will go to the highest bidder because they need the money to survive.
And the highest bid will still be at a significant discount, because nobody besides the Big12 has the means to make a decent bid, and they’ll have zero competition.
Smith: team will try to avoid distraction
https://www.oregonlive.com/beavers/2023/08/oregon-state-coach-jonathan-smith-insists-pac-12-turmoil-will-not-distract-beavers-upcoming-season.html
Oh, and please run up the score on UCLA, UW, and UO…
Run up the score on all of them. Utah, Arizona, Colorado. Screw them all.
Crazy scenario I’m going to throw out there. Beavs have a magical 2023 season and win the PAC 12. Get tons of press. Big 10 or 12 sees the value and makes a decent offer. Could happen right?
First half yes, second half no.
We don’t have a large national brand. They would view us more as a roadblock that will no longer be in the way
How about some Beaver football:
“- Huge shoutout to the defensive line today. That group dominated much of the live work, pushing all 3 quarterbacks out of the pocket on nearly every play. Among the group that stood out was Nikko Taylor, John McCartan, Takari Hickle.”
Woo hoo!
Sounds like that unit is getting good pressure up the middle, too.
And then there were four…..
https://www.cbssports.com/college-football/news/arizona-arizona-state-utah-to-join-big-12-programs-set-to-follow-colorado-in-leaving-pac-12/
The lack of NCAA and Conference leadership in all if this is unsurprising but so telling. They lost to the networks long ago…
I keep thinking of the line from Major League when they find out that the team owner wants them to finish last. “Well I guess there is only one thing left to do…win the whole fucking thing.”
I hope Smith and the team have that attitude.
Sports illustrated is the only major media calling it like they see it.
https://www.si.com/.amp/college/2023/08/04/pac-12-death-oregon-washington-big-ten-realignment-conference-expansion
Finally someone speaking the truth. What’s hilarious is people/fans/pundits etc think chasing these TV contracts is the solution. If the Beavs join the ACC or Big12 I would be happier than the Mt West, but that’s about all I can say positive about getting bigger. That it’s slightly better than death. Maybe. I’m not even sure that’s true.
Quick read – not a mention of either the Beavs or th Cougs
Been out with the in-laws all day. What’s the status? Any shot the Big 12 invites the Beavs? I don’t see why they would, but I guess it’s possible.
The Big12 idea is fools gold. Dont see any way they view 2 tiny NW schools as anything worth adding to their umbrella.
There’s talk they may only take on basketball schools like Gonzaga and UCONN, to add with Arizona, Kansas, Baylor and make MBB their identity.
Honestly feels to me like a Pac/MountainWest re-grouping will be the route they will be forced into with WSU, and then who knows where Cal/Stanford would fit, given they probably dont want anything to do with those schools academically.
I’ve been out with the in-laws for a long time now.
We were the PAC 8 at one time.
Perhaps we look for four schools that high scholastics and go with that for a while.
SD State, SMU, Army, ….
I would leave out Boise and Fresno. They have no class.
Academic prestige is meaningless. That viewpoint is why the remaining PAC is where it is at.
Academic prestige isn’t meaningless, and it could be the only way we save ourselves, because it is so undervalued.
The Conference still owns the PTN. The Conference still receives all the NCAA March Madness units earned in the last seven years by all the schools. The Conference still has an auto-bid to the CFP as well as bowl alliances.
Mountain West buyout is tied to the GOR, while the AAC’s is an exit fee. Houston and Cincy paid 18 million each to leave without proper notice, so we have a number that pretty much matches the MW fee.
The only thing we have to entice anyone to pay that fee and join us is to share in all the booty we still have.
SMU, Tulsa, Rice, and Tulane are all rich af academic institutions who could make the move next year. Yes, it wouldn’t be the prettiest conference, but it would be a conference with ironclad contracts protecting several assets. Limiting it to eight schools spreads the wealth a little thicker. Play a seven game slate, and schedule enough patsies for enough teams to get to enough bowls, to max out the payouts.
In 2026, add SDSU, Fresno, Boise, UNM, CSU as full members. Add Hawai’i as football only. Add Gonzaga as Olympic sports. The last part is even more enticing, now, because Wazzu is hung out to dry, so having a travel partner in Spokane makes a lot of sense. Travel partners for the Olympics should be obvious in this grouping. Yeah, we get Boise. But it is what it is.
Call it the Pacific American Conference, or PAC. Keep the logo and branding, just remove the number.
We have a nice balance of all sorts of schools, and nobody gets to claim they’re academically more elite.
I don’t think anyone in the college football landscape wants the Pac to fail, and I think a lot of people woul cheer us on, just because they saw what happened today.
We’ve been gifted national visibility, and our first instinct should not be to run away to the best paycheck someone else is going to offer. The remaining four schools have a lot to work with, and it would really disappoint me if (especially these four schools) they just folded up shop. When I see a pile of lumber in disarray, my first instinct is to stack it.
Revenge of the Nerds conference. That would be kinda funny.
It also has the potential to whack some blue bloods.
SMU has been waiting to be allowed to pay for play. They just need some room to breathe.
As a side note, the LA schools, UO, and UW are all the schools who were caught for pay for play, back in the day. It’s funny that Cal and Oregon State defended different parties–Oregon was snitch, because they were upset they were caught for it a decade earlier. Then they made up some legend about UW voting against their cheaters, making UW a rival of some kind.
Just providing link, as article was very informative for me. Many aspects of this just feels off in general:
“… While private equity funds can now buy passive minority stakes in every major U.S. league except the NFL, college athletic departments would be a new frontier. (In a rare instance, Memphis’ athletic department took out a bank loan in 2020, and college dealmaking giant Learfield is backed by a pair of private equity funds.)
Back in 2019, the Pac-12 hired the Raine Group to explore the possibility of raising money from PE firms by allowing them to invest in the league’s media enterprise. That process, which didn’t ultimately pan out, was motivated by a goal similar to the one currently motivating Florida State—runaway revenue in leagues like the SEC and Big Ten and a desire to narrow that gap…”
https://www.sportico.com/business/finance/2023/florida-state-athletics-jpmorgan-private-equity-funding-acc-1234733152/
We are truly Angrybeavs now
Beaver fans are so schizophrenic right now. We are at the mercy of a bunch of overpaid jackasses who don’t give one fuck about the fans…the people who actually matter the most.
BIG12 voted to “explore” going to 18. Same source MHver3
Cal and Stanford go. We’re left with the cougs to wallow in misery. It might be good if the big10 does take cal and Stanford, the big 12 might get jealous and snag us up. They can’t raid the ACC because the team buy out is close to 500 million and runs through 2036.
I thought fsu said they’d have to raise 120 mil. I’m sure there are many ways to work around this all especially if ESPN or fox has anything to say about it. I use to love ESPN on Saturday mornings. I hope they go bankrupt. They are bleeding money and hire Buck and Aikman. Who cares about Monday night football enough to spend that much on two dudes that talk about the game.
The buyout price is their yearly cut of the profits x years left on the contract.
Can’t find anything to say Cal & Stanford are gone. Maybe wait a day. Do you think Beavs play with a chip on their shoulders and win it all? I could quit watching college football and be satisfied the rest of my life . It would be an interesting scene for the National champs to be joining the Mountain West.
They haven’t yet. I’m making a best case scenario.
Yea I want to believe but I don’t get how B12 passes on CAL/STAN if they are available.
I’m assuming the big10 jumps first. Maybe not.
I’m assuming we’re the last standing with the Bay Area schools, and I would be more proud if they were so by choice, instead of abandoning the Pac.
As it is, I’m proud we didn’t bite on greed. It’s easy to say you are above it. It’s a helluva lot harder to act against it, when panic and/or peer pressure would say otherwise.
The Beavs are the Pluto of football.
I’m guessing not Poe’s cat?
Because that would be bad.
“The day the music died.”
The stupid bastards driving this do not understand what makes college football so special. Just looking at fucking dollar signs..
Facts.
Well put…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xir_ynJWsH8
It seemed that in all the world”s mess there was at least Oregon State with JS, his staff, the players; honesty and goodness but that doesn’t sell, so . . .
The things that could save OSU athletics,
1. A national title in football
2. One of the billionaires decides to save the program (As of June 19, 2023, Huang’s net worth is US$38.3 billion according to the Bloomberg Billionaires Index)
3. Reser’s sell their company and give all the proceeds to OSU
Pretty sure huang hates us and has more important things to do like create quantum chips.
He doesn’t hate the school…
https://www.oregonlive.com/silicon-forest/2022/10/oregon-state-plans-200-million-supercomputer-center-backed-by-50-million-from-nvidia-ceo.html
Dont think he hates OSU. He and his wife(also an OSU alum) just donated $50M for an engineering facility on campus within the last year.
But haven’t seen any sign of him being interested in the athletics programs.
Maybe if we get her interested in football we’ll have an in.
https://today.oregonstate.edu/news/50-million-gift-nvidia-founder-and-spouse-helps-launch-oregon-state-university-research-center
We also don’t know who donated the 50 million for Reser’s renovation…could have been him!
That’s good, I guess. Never heard him say anything about osu. Anyway, throwing money at programs is what got us here. I’m not sure he’s a solution.
supercomputer coming to get you?
those quantum chips will be developed at OSU, across the street from American Pie… you know… because pizza.
damnit. now im hungry for pizza. corvegas with a couple cold ones sounds really good now
What I’d like to know is who is going to watch this crap? Is any fan turned on by this and more into ncaa football today compared to yesterday? I’d like to hear the perspective of that person.
As we speak I am actually thinking to myself why don’t I just check out of college sports all together and find something more productive to do with my time. My 11yo son loves going to games. That would be the only reason as I sit here this evening that would keep me engaged.
I’m not enthused.
I’d never claim that I’m a passionate fan. I’m not a ticket season holder or attended a tailgate every weekend, but I had the opportunity to attend away football games when I was younger, and I attended a home game a couple of times.
My entire connection to OSU is via my father, who is an alumni (‘65 Rose Bowl) and now lives in OR bc of health reasons.
People assume I attended Oregon State when they hear me talk about their football program or the school’s accomplishments in other areas.
…This process doesn’t feel equitable?
The actors involved with arguably the greatest power, don’t seem to be basing their decisions in any desire to strive for parity.
I’ll still remain a fan.
Mostly, this just makes me sad.
College football has turned into the equivalent of listening to a max Martin song. All sheen, no substance. What made it interesting and great is gone. Mlb is doing this, too. There must really low IQ people out there whom this type of product appeals to? I have no idea. I don’t know any. But it seems very lowest common denominator.
The discussion about Oregon seems to come with the implication that this move will deposit them directly into the college playoffs.
And they actually think this is true. They really believe that they can beat Ohio State and Michigan and Ped State every year.
Eventually that 14 spot playoff will be 6 SEC teams, 6 Big10 teams and 2 Big12 teams and that’s it.
Could still lose several conference games and get in
Funny part is that OSU probably would have more realistic shot at making the CFP by winning the MW than any shot Oregon does in the BIG 10.
Ha! You can’t possibly think that would be allowed to happen.
day drinking?
How did that work out for Nebraska?
Jayathi Murphy statement to.the OSU community on Olive.
Obligatory nothing burger.
Did she ask whats football?
Maybe now but apparently people who hired her didn’t bother to ask or care.
Are you helmsey’s drunk grandchild, who is finding all of fascinating, yet you write things completely antithetical to what helmsley would write?
These takes are nothing like the helmsley I know. The next step up in bile is misogyny. After that, we may find out Murthy is from Asia.
Them’s the vibes I’m getting.
The AAC reached out to the 4 remaining teams this evening. That is the AAC not the ACC. Ugh can’t wait for those games with North Texas and Florida Atlantic
Hey, who wants even longer travel with less money to pay for it?
Lol. I’d never watch that. No chance in hell. Worse than the MWC.
Prediction: Stanford will go independent. 9 Mountain West teams are invited and join the PAC-12 and vote to bypass any exit fee. Nevada, SJSU, Hawaii are basically booted. Conference works out a smaller deal with Apple that pays out significantly higher than MW deal.
PAC-12 West:
Washington State
Oregon State
Fresno State
Cal
San Diego State
Boise State
PAC-12 East:
Wyoming
Air Force
UNLV
New Mexico
Colorado State
Utah State
OSU, Cal and WSU know they gotta work fast and joining the MW would be a devastating blow to those programs. MW programs would definitely make the jump to get a lot more money. I’ll say by next weekend this is the new conference in 2024
Prediction: Stanford goes independent and Cal, WSU and OSU remain in the conference and they add 9 MW teams who vote bypass exit fees to join the the new PAC-12. Nevada, SJSU and Hawaii get the boot. They renegotiate a smaller deal with Apple but for much higher than MW deal.
New divisions:
PAC-12 West:
Boise State
Washington State
Oregon State
Cal
Fresno State
San Diego State
PAC-12 East:
Wyoming
UNLV
Air Force
Colorado State
Utah State
New Mexico
Cal, WSU and OSU know they gotta move fast and I think we see an agreement within a week
I don’t think you can just give those 3 schools “the boot” they will need to be compensated and I am sure that would not be cheap. My guess is if the Mt West scenario happens all of the Mt West schools will be involved. Beaver athletics will become irrelevant. Only way to avoid this is to get invited to the BIG12 at a reduced rate and hang on until the next TV contact (2025 I believe)
What’s the point of scheduling an opponent every year, when you make 1/10th the amount of revenue they do?
That’s what’s going to happen if the Beavs join the Mountain West and try to schedule Hole.
Absolutely do not schedule hole if that is the case. Why wd the Beavs do that to themselves?
Because Barnes thinks that we’ll benefit if we feed the cancer cell.
We won’t. We’ll get a multimillion dollar payout to get our asses handed to us, the fan experience will be shit, and few people will turn up.
Why is Barnes still there?
Because most of Beaver Nation wants to feed the cancer cell, too, in their quest to one day compete for a CFP, so they will support Barnes if he lands any TV contract.
I’m increasingly with angry on this one: fuck TV contracts, play competitive opponents, and enhance the fan experience on gamedays. If we lose 90% of our revenue and have to play Washington State or Idaho 17-14 with local one and two star talent, fine, so long as tickets are cheap, food and booze is great, and Reser is electric. Who gives a shit about the CFP when I can watch the NFL?
wtf does Barnes have to do with a tv contract?
I meant OSU admin, not Barnes.
You get the point.
At this point it’s pretty obvious you have to take a reduced revenue Big 12 invitation if it comes.
Whoever was logrolling Canzano this past year did a hell of a job. For a guy as sourced in as he was, he didn’t seem to be aware how little interest there was from media companies for the the Pac-12. His sources have the impression that a deal was “out there” and coming together in the last few months. It was all cotton candy.
Larry Scott was an idiot, but Canzano became overly obsessed with him, seems like half his columns were still about Scott and his expensive tastes. Subsequently, he was infatuated with Kliavkoff because I guess he wasn’t Scott and missed the mark. I stopped reading Canzano when he upped the subscription-only content, it’s not worth any money.
Well what stage of grief are you in this morning?
Just saw a video about what’s left for the final four. Remember a while back when it came out that Comcast was over paying the Pac12 and we had to return several million in revenue? Guess who is on the hook for that….Pac12 members. Apparently that hasn’t been paid back.
I’m assuming everyone will pull out their check book before leaving but what if they dont.
Feels like grief/acceptance. I’m focusing on the positive: I’ll most likely have Saturday’s completely freed up. If we move to the MWC I don’t think I’d watch a single game again ever. If we get a Big12 invite I’d watch, but fully realizing big money will even mess that up at some point down the road and continue to put the sheen on a product that thrived specially because it lacked sheen, and that was the appeal. NIL is a huge problem on top of the TV stuff.
Acceptance. It is what it is and it sucks. But that is the reality when your team/school does very little for the TV markets.
The reality is, with the exception of Wyoming and Air Force the rest of that conference are all teams the Beavs have played in the last 10-20 years. So it’s nothing new we haven’t already seen.
2022 Boise St (W 34-17)
2021 LA Bowl Utah St (L 24-13)
2018 at Nevada (L 37-35)
2021 Hawaii (W 45-27)
(2023 opener) 2015 SJSU (W 35-21)
2014 SDSU (W 28-7)
2017 at CSU (L 58-27)
2009 at UNLV (W 23-21)
2022 at Fresno (W 35-32)
2004 New Mexico (W 17-7)
1994 Wyoming (W 44-31)
I don’t believe OSU has ever played Air Force
The marquee games vs the likes of Boise and Fresno I’d probably watch. Also gives me a reason to go to Reno every other year (less trashier and smaller Vegas). Other than that? Trips to Albuquerque, Logan and Cheyenne in winter? Hard pass.
Does anyone want to give me credit for my “College football is in decline” warnings for the past 10+ years at this point? I saw it with the PAC merger in 2012 and the discussion of NIL picking up at that same time. Coupled with Disney/ESPN jerking off over the SEC 24/7. It was obvious big money wanted to destroy the game. Anyone agree now, in retrospect, that that was obvious???
Apology for another unlinked reference; it seems NIL is not fully functioning as planned. The idea in the title – name, image, likeness. In part,
companies, businesses would pay an athlete to put the literal nil onto some form of association, endorsement, advert. But much of the money is coming in donations with no NIL association. It’s just a payout. The Kerry Eggers article about the the Beavs and Building the Dam collective talked about donors/sponsors.
REST IN PEACE PAC-12. Beaver Nation it was nice knowing you.
-2023
Do you all actually think these mega conferences will stay together? I give it five years before the blue bloods, who routinely win 10 games per year and challenge for a playoff spot, will want a larger piece of the pie. Alabama, Georgia etc… will question why Vandy makes almost as much as they. CFB will be a mini NFL in 10 years with two the top 32 teams. Two conferences with 4 team divisions.
The travel will be insane (especially for minor sports). Many of the match-ups will be boring with zero tradition. It’s about the money, but I think as time goes on the product will become less desirable. Just have Alabama, Georgia, Ohio St, and Michigan join the NFL and call it good.
I get what you’re saying… that the minor sports will have to travel coach and have a tight itenerary, as opposed to what the football team has always received.
I don’t think they care.
Mountain west conference is receptive to a merger with the remaining 4 PAC schools.
I told y’all. Either way you slice it it’s still the MWC and it won’t be long before the PAC loses its P5 status.
https://twitter.com/RossDellenger/status/1687639910230966272
CFP would immediately exclude that new mishmash conference.
That already started. They are saying they might push back the 12 team playoff a year or 2 to reevaluate.
I’m also concerned about what this does to the one truly elite program the Beavs have…Baseball. How will that level be maintained if it even can?
Also, a minor note: Jam Griffin left for a fucking SEC school. Great, he can go be a backup for Ole Miss instead of with The Beavs.
He had a NIL deal wrapped up ala Speights was just waiting to finish up classes so he could grad transfer.
So of course it was about money. Surprised there’s much NIL money for a backup. Ole Miss has an established starting RB.
There are ZERO transparency rules in NIL because of incompetency, but I wouldn’t at all be surprised if SEC schools are making backup transfers of Jam’s caliber into millionaires.
I wonder when Ole Miss first contacted Griffin. His OSU departure was exquisite.
I was told jam wasn’t going to get many Carries. I don’t know if I believe that given his production last year. Maybe Newell just looks amazing.
To be fair, Newell just looks amazing.
He might be from the South, and maybe miss it?
Trying to put a decent take on it, as i was really looking firward to Martinez and Jam as a 1-2 punch…
I think he does have family and a brother playing somewhere over there.
For all we know, it’s mom dying, and he doesn’t want to talk about it.
If he’s out, he’s out.
That locker room must be so goddamn pissed off, as if they needed another “chip on their shoulder”. I don’t how you keep the kids focused and not distracted by the prospect of their individual futures post Pac-12 but it would be some kind of karmic justice for all parties if OSU won the conference and made a run to the CFP.
Smith will do as good a job as possible with the locker room during this fiasco, can ya imagine Smilin’ Mike in this situation?
Rueck and Miiiitch will do OK with their current teams, heck, their rivalries are now LSU, Baylor, etc anyway.
Does anyone know why the P-12 does not have a buyout for teams to leave? Does it have to do with the TV contract expiring? Doesn’t the MWC conference have a 30 million-dollar one or something like that? Be nice for the remaining four to get some bonus dollars.
Also, Quack fans should kneel at the shrine of Phil Knight daily, without him none of this would have been possible for them.
Due to the expiring media deal. Zero penalty for leaving
Timing is everything in life.
MWC buyout is either 32 or 34 million through 2025. Was posted above.
It’s not anything any of those schools can probably afford.
17 million, if given a year’s notice, with a deadline of June 30.
If less than a year’s notice and after June 30, double the fee.
Will Tinkle get another extension if he finishes in the top 4 of the conference?
Hopefully not. Do you think the MBB will fair any better against the MWC with Tinks in charge? They’ll get annihilated by SDSU and Utah St. Maybe they can split with Air Force? Hopefully, the leagues merge so they can still play Cal!
Tinkle could maybe be top 4…..if there’s only 5-6 teams
That’s pretty wishful thinking. This is a bad team. Tinkle’s “offense” will see to that.
After this season we can’t afford his salary and worse we can’t pay his buyout.
Any chance the Saudis can bail us out?
Sweet crude money!
LIV college football? I like it, though I guess the Roman numerals would need to be specific to football.
The Pac 54 makes no sense.
Be nice to have that many teams, but that’s why I said that the numerals would need to be football-specific.
Probably no chance of a miracle P5 invite now. https://247sports.com/Article/big-12-expansion-very-real-chance-league-gets-to-18-with-gonzaga-uconn-as-basketball-only-additions-213734570/Amp/
Not disagreeing, but wouldn’t you want schools with multiple sports that they are competitive in? With the exception on MBB, the majority of both mens and womens sports are pretty competitive.
No. Conference commissioners want money. I mean, they already have a lot of money, more than they will ever need, but they definitely want more of it, so do media conglomerates. There is no value-system beyond the money, certainly not competitive balance. Gonzaga and UCONN make the B12 a lot more money as Basketball only members. Like, a lot more money. SDSU makes the B12 more money than OSU/WSU, because California has a lot more people and therefore that means more money for people in B12 country that already have lots of money.
Wetzel says if you hate all this:
There is one collective action however that all of the aggrieved fans out there can rally around.
Root for Oregon State to win the Pac-12 this season, likely the 108-year-old conference’s last…
It won’t reverse college football’s trajectory. It won’t save the Pac-12 or balance the books.
It might be kind of fun though.
https://www.yahoo.com/sports/if-you-hate-whats-happening-to-college-football-heres-the-team-to-root-for-this-season-185034053.html
Beavs have no shot at such glory because it would expose the fraudulent rationale of these hucksters. Expect worse than ever reffing and blatant bad calls to happen to the Beavs all season. They must be able
To overcome it all and become an angry focused juggernaut that runs roughshod over the entire conference and leave no doubt, anything close and they will get hosed- road or home.
JS should give the guys the rally speech of no one likes us/us against the world literally and get a ticked off locker room full of guys who want to destroy these conference turncoats. No Mercy, nothing soft and beat the crap out of every team, especially the Ducks. I wouldn’t mind seeing a few qbs leave with game ending “bruises”.
I’d have to think the JS and staff aren’t just upset at the conference leaders but they have to be upset at Barnes as well. How do you sit on your hands through all of this?
I was so frustrated yesterday I didn’t really sleep last night. You know the perception but can’t quite believe that is is only about money because there are 15 schools between those 3 conferences that have never had success like OSU in such a variety of sports, and yet they are all cashing in.
You can blame Kliakoff and Barnes, Larry Scott, even Mike Riley, but this all goes back to the 29 year losing streak and the way the country came view OSU as a perennial loser with no value and a complicit school leadership that preferred to let it be that way.
I despise the situation and don’t think it is honorable or decent in any way.
What is most irritating is the fact that ESPN is circling the drain financially but they are determined to take down entire conferences to try to stay afloat.
College football is fun, semi pro organized National grifters football clubs are not fun. The process and speed at which they are manipulating the entire college sporting landscape is only going to alienate casual fans and a lot of diehard fans will just walk away from a lifetime of memories. Football has become too big and will ruin all other sports by these moves.
Maybe the small school atmosphere takes some time to get used to but the Beavs will never get to climb that mountain again. So sad. I’ll root against every former PAC12 school wherever they have ended up. All frauds and cheats as far as I’m concerned.
Win the whole thing this year and walk off into the sunset, all the coaches will move on, players will transfer out and Corvallis will become a sleepy
Little town again like 1971 where no one cares and no one hopes for something better.
“fraudulent rationale”? Their rationale is that OSU doesn’t make them any TV money regardless of whether they win the CPKAPac12 (Conference Previously Known As Pac12). So their rationale is factual.
The rationale is that OSU doesn’t belong in such company as those 5star blue blood programs.
No, it’s that we haven’t spent Daddy Phil’s money marketing ourselve, then living beyond our means, despite that advantage.
Murthy should fire Barnes now. Their joint statement 10 minutes before the conference disintegrated is equalled only by Chamberlain’s ‘peace in our time’ but Murthy probably won’t resign.
My statement from earlier today
“Many of you are seeing the recent news that University of Oregon and University of Washington have announced their decisions that they will leave the Pac-12, making the conference’s futures less certain. This is a serious moment, and given the longstanding traditions among Pac-12 teams, we all feel the loss.
Also, what’s a footie ball?
I get being upset, but this is a horrible take.
She is in no way the aggressor or dupe in all this, and running away to all corners of the country just isn’t worth it.
I would never ask any of those athletes to do what I would think would be detrimental to my own child’s health and well-being–not for all the money in the world.
I keep reading about unhappy ACC teams like FSU and Clemson. Where would they go? SEC?
They want to bolt for the B1G or SEC, but they are locked into their media grant of rights until 2036 (lol). The SEC and B1G don’t NEED to expand any more than they have, so there’s no financial incentive for them to intervene and help those ACC schools out.
Interesting, they’re locked in and pissed off about it! I guess long-term TV deals are one way to keep a conference together.
I’m still so incredibly pissed today. Sucks about the Pac 12 but I don’t know if I care so much about the conference itself the Beavs were in as long as it was a relevant one. I’d be all on board with the Big 12 if it was a realistic option. At least we’d have a chance to be relevant on a meaningful stage. A Pac 4 and Mountain West merger does Jack shit for anything. Sure there might be more money available than the $4 mill they get currently but I can’t imagine it’s a whole hell of a lot more and definitely not in the neighborhood of even the $20 mill that was initially floated with the Apple deal. Beavs will have to drop so many sports and even if they do maintain FB, MBB, WBB and baseball, the funds for coaches, athletic staff, facility upgrades and so much more. Baseball just recently announced the new hitting facility. I wonder if that is put on pause now? Even if the university has the cash to pay for all that right now, is it still the financially prudent thing to do knowing the extreme measure that will need to be taken to get operational costs in line with the new economic reality? Clearly I’m sure the Mountain West is willing to open their conference up, but the truth of the matter is, we actually have 0 dollars to count on after this year. That’s a pretty sobering fact.
At the end of the day, I don’t really know who I’m more pissed at. Failed leadership with the last 2 commissioners? Failed leadership at Oregon State under Ray, murthy and Barnes? The other asshole schools that bailed early? It’s a shame that the arrogance, ineptitude, incompetence and naivety from all these so called “leaders” has led to this situation. How so many incompetent people are making so much money and find themselves in roles of so much influence is truly impressive. I think one thing is clear to me though, at least as far as OSU is concerned, the school itself seems to not give 1 shit about the sports and what they bring to the university and surrounding businesses within the community. If you did, there’s no way you continue to let Larry Scott do what he did. You don’t let GK do fucking nothing and then bring a steaming pile to the table at the midnight hour. You don’t put out boilerplate statements saying we trust the conference and leadership, etc, etc when you are literally one of the last people in the room! Bunch of clowns running the show. I’m not going to stop being a fan even when we’re down in the Mountain West as an extreme poverty school but I don’t have to be a fan of the leadership and quite honestly, perhaps this is blind rage talking, I’m seriously questioning the competency of the university leadership and whether or not there should be any insight into their actions (or lack there of). Perhaps it’s a bit over the top and I’m venting, but I think about how many people are affected by their negligence and it’s extremely frustrating what this “leadership” has done. What do they say, nice guys finish last? We should be done being the fucking nice guys. I’d love to see JS go full nuclear on the field and we run the score on all these assholes any chance we can get. All gas, no breaks. Make a statement…it’s looking like the last ride.
I’m not thinking we need to cut teams, but proposals are put on hold.
I think there’s a lot more to the drama, and you’re just still on anger. I’m on the back end of depression, right now. It’ll probably just take some kind of resolution to get to acceptance.
It’s looking more and more like the LA schools have been sabotaging the conference since at least 2018. When two previously highly talented administrators become nincompoops and do it with a smile, there’s something going on. And the LA schools and their actions against what the rest of the world sees as common sense opportunities missed are the only real constant.
Sorry you can’t hate your school more, but it’ll pass.
It should be mentioned that Ed Ray played an instrumental role in the conference’s destruction by being Larry Scott’s biggest cheerleader
It sounds like Larry Scott got on USC’s bad side, to me.
He may have made some poor decisions. But some of the contradictions he had were a part of the confusion surrounding him. He would say something that all of us would think, “That’s a good idea.” Then a week or so later he would say something to the effect that the idea didn’t gain traction, or something.
Besides what we already know, I’d love to know what damage USC did to the conference, over the years, and who helped them.
I’m guessing this is their revenge for the conference not helping with their belligerent defense of their own cheating.
It hard not to imagine some of this isn’t related to the Pac12 nearly concelling the entire 2020 covid season.
Have to wonder if the tv networks wanted to mitigate the threat of that happening again?
Nope, covid’s not to blame……it’s the money hungry TV outfits, inept conference leadership, and…….UCLA/USC.
I believe USC had a lot of animosity, regarding that decision.
Probably not hard info to find.
I don’t see how teams won’t be cut if media money drops to $4 mill annualy. We literally pay Tinkle more than that. Barnes did say the new edition to Reser will break even based on it’s projected revenue to whats owed so that’s at least positive but it’s a bit naive to think with how much the athletic dept will need to be slashed that these other sports aren’t going to be impacted. Hell, baseball even is operating in the negative if I’m not mistaken so I don’t see how anything beyond fb, basketball and baseball survive a move to the mountain west and $4 mill in media money. And let’s not confuse surviving with thriving either. Beavs struggle as it is to even get the occasional 4* recruit when we are on this “level” playing field. Perhaps I’m overly pessimistic. I hope so but I also am being realistic. There’s a lot of people that don’t seem to fully grasp what this truly means.
That’s why it’s crucial to somehow stay as a P-5 program. If not then the best one can hope for is to become like a Boise St, but even the shine has come off of that to some degree. It’s not like the Broncos have been in any CFP conversations lately. I also think there is a danger that Smith gets a P-5 offer sooner than later if the Beavs are relegated to the MWC. As you are saying, the math just doesn’t add up long-term.
Still waiting for someone to tell us what exactly they were supposed to do? ESPN and Fox colluded to destroy the Pac and create super conferences. They got what they wanted. When the 2 biggest bullies on the block team up, this is what happens. It sucks and it’s sad. I know Kiavkoff is gonna be the fall guy but he literally put the best deal on the table he could get and almost everyone walked
The problem is that nobody in national terms gives two shits what happens to Oregon St except for some diehard fans, students, and alumni, like almost every other non-power five football school.
Hell, we can’t go one fucking national telecast without an announcer still calling Oregon St, Oregon!
If there’s no anti-trust investigation, with all the moving parts that are out in the open, the sport on the college level is dead while the money-grubbers are in it.
There should be. But it won’t happen. Big money wins and the little guy loses. Sound familiar?
No.
Because we have yet to lose.
I think there was a legitimate case with big 12 in the recent past. Or add 1 or 2 members to add strength and possibly leverage more money. Literally anything except the last minute hail Mary. GK is trash too. Every statement was we’re all in this, everyone agrees and meanwhile LA schools bounce. Other rumors swirl. Colorado leaves. Zero comments for months on TV deals so of course schools start looking out for themselves. Beavs should’ve too.
Fuck the Big 12 with an extremely barbed gaffe–or what some of the Big 12 would stupidly call a fork.
We all saw this coming… why couldn’t OSU leadership. There should have been a contingency plan already in place. Now it appears they are just standing there holding the bag.
Just saw a tweet about athletic dept debt by school. #1Cal as of last season 439 million in the hole. Followed by #2 SDSU,#3 ASU, #9 UW #16 colorado and #18 UO. Cal is major league fucked any way you look at it.
I saw one report that UO couldn’t afford the new deal, because they were too leveraged.
Not a surprise, if true.
Their outstanding debt as of 2022 is 181 million.
Fucking losers bet the house and lost.
Heads should roll, but money.
ICYM, here’s Walton back when UCLA made their announcement, still true:
All progress requires change… not all change is progress,
I’m Bill Walton,
I’m a California native, resident, engaged citizen, voter, and taxpayer,
I’m a product of California’s terrific public school systems,
I’m a proud UCLA alum,
I am not in favor of UCLA’s recent announced decision to leave the Pac-12 Conference of Champions,
nor their desire to join the Big 10,
I don’t like this attempted move,
I don’t support it,
I hope it does not happen,
UCLA is a public school that is supposed to serve the interests of the State of California,
UCLA is one of the world’s greatest schools, and brands,
UCLA represents the best of what life has been, and can, could and should be,
UCLA has been as great and as important a part of my life as anything, ever,
I don’t believe that joining the Big 10 is in the best interest of UCLA, its students, its athletes, its alumni, its fans, the rest of the UC system, the State of California, or the world at large,
some of the many reasons why I am opposed to UCLA’s attempted move to the Big 10 are, in no particular order,
• the negative impact on the health, both physical and mental, of UCLA’s student-athletes,
the exponential increase in travel on UCLA’s student-athletes will hurt them physically, mentally, and in their overall lives,
• the negative impact of the excessive travel will extend to families, friends, fans, alumni and everyone else,
• the increased costs of joining the Big 10 will negate the projected increased revenue assumptions of this proposed move,
• this proposed move to the Big 10 is contrary to UCLA’s and the entire UC System’s stated and professed environmental sustainability goals,
• this proposed move to the Big 10 has serious negative implications and ramifications for the University of California, Berkeley,
and flies in the face of the supposed team concept that has always been a part of the California Dream, plan and business model,
• this proposed move to the Big 10, is all about football, and money,
• what about all the other 24 sports and 600+student-athletes at UCLA, who are responsible for 99+% of UCLA’s National Championships,
• how many of these “others” are represented and willing participants in this proposed deal,
I went to UCLA — gladly, willingly, and proudly,
it was my dream,
that dream never included the Big 10,
I have spoken to no one, other than the highest-level directors of athletics at UCLA, who think that this proposed move to the Big 10 is a good idea,
every argument made by these senior AD’s and why they like it, is about money,
these same proponents of moving to the Big 10, are the first people I have ever encountered in my life,
who have claimed economic hardship and limitations in Los Angeles,
and that the solution lies in the Midwest,
I have made my feelings known, privately, to the powers that be in the State of California, including the UC’s Board of Regents,
my hope and dream is that this proposed move by UCLA, my alma mater, will be rescinded,
Bill Walton,
UCLA 1974
I guess he’s ours now.
I’ll take him.
This…
“• the increased costs of joining the Big 10 will negate the projected increased revenue assumptions of this proposed move,”
…should have been saying one of the costs is…
“• this proposed move to the Big 10 has serious negative implications and ramifications for the University of California, Berkeley,
and flies in the face of the supposed team concept that has always been a part of the California Dream, plan and business model,”
…and that the others are at best Calimony, at worst, what we see now.
This is really well written.
Spot on. OSU hierarchy has been so naive.
And on the flip side, it seems like Colorado has at least perceptive leadership. They bailed on the B-12 when things looked dire and were able to now do the same thing to the P-12 about a decade or so later. Either smart or lucky. Still makes me want to see the “Prime experiment” fall flat on its face!
CU’s AD when they jumped to the Pac was Mike Bohn.
They seem to be proficient at well-timed jumps whoever is in charge.
Well, whoever the leader, they seem to know when to get out!
The point is Mike Bohn was USC’s AD when all this went down.
The broader point is that CU is again in a secure P-5 program despite arguably being the worst program over the last five years while the Beavs may end up in the MWC.
That’s not a constant.
https://pac-4.com/
Pretty good troll
Well at least that gave me a good laugh in the middle of my grief
https://www.oregonlive.com/collegefootball/2023/08/arizona-state-president-oregon-washington-no-showed-friday-call-of-pac-12-presidents-and-chancellors-to-sign-grant-of-rights.html
Some interesting insight on what Apple wanted to do with (besides pay):
“There were a lot of forces at work, including the overlords of the media empires that are out there that were driving a lot of this,” Crow said. “The Colorado departure was really an indication of the fact that there was great instability in the media market and it created an unstable moment. … We were offered a media contract by the Apple corporation which was a technological 23rd century Star Trek thing with really unbelievable capability that we were very interested, ASU was very interested in. Digitization of all ASU football games, all men’s basketball games and all women’s basketball games instantly and available anywhere in the world at the touch of a button from any device, anywhere. Digitally then manipulable by the watcher both during the game, in between games, in between multiple games at the same time as well as usable by athletes for recruitment and so forth and so on after the games as an archive of things.
The last quote…
“We thought there was some risk, but huge opportunity. Several of the schools were committed to that, but it created destabilizing moment of traditional versus this modern thing.” So the ones who weren’t for a destabilizing moment with media, destabilized tradition of conferences.
“Digitization of all ASU football games, all men’s basketball games and all women’s basketball games instantly and available anywhere in the world at the touch of a button from any device, anywhere. Digitally then manipulable by the watcher both during the game, in between games, in between multiple games at the same time as well as usable by athletes for recruitment and so forth and so on after the games as an archive of things.”
This sounds friggin awesome.
It’s like sports on crack.
Makes me hopeful that the Pac can somehow still cobble together a MW/PAC alliance and negotiate a deal with Apple.
That whole “think different” motto of Apple’s could actually make the games more interesting and who knows, you could go from a national audience to an international audience if you’re able to make your program more appealing to the international audiences.
I’d imagine a guy like Bazzana would have more than a few Aussie fans tuning into OSU baseball games if he is a 1st round talent playing in his final season.
Zig while the rest of the college football teams zag
I’m trying to drink this copium too.
Oh… this isn’t bargaining.
That was done a while ago, so stop projecting.
This is the future, and the discussion about how some schools are ignoring it, beacuse they like football costumes.
I can watch from .y phone already with the Sling app. What the fuck. Crowe not discovered smart phones?
Sounds like crow was in…the other ludites not so much. What a bunch of chumps, that would have been bad ass. These fools jump for a bigger bag in a sinking technology. They claim to be looking forward while watching a TV with rabbit ears. The ESPN/fox deals are the last of their kind, there will be no further comparable paydays in the next cycle
money
UO is spending way beyond their means, and they couldn’t take a haircut.
The Civil War is dead, because the Ducks gambled on fiscal decisions.
I thought Uncle Phil was financing all their fancy pants, you saying they were running them up on credit cards?
Have you taken five minutes to read any of the things going on down here?
The 200 mil he “gave” wasn’t a gift.
It was a matching gift, minus however much the match was over.
Apparently, there is no over.
Hahaha, honestly no, I have enough on my plate to not read up how the kids in Eugene finance their 5000 unis, but fabulous to learn they were running it like a telethon but using credit cards to get Phil’s bag. Thanks for the insight
We have to live it. I can’t wait to find out years from now how much of my tax dollars went to sports.
In English, please.
Ie it sounds like asu and others were indeed interested in apples streaming proposal, but the ludites in the room, or not in this case, didn’t see the vision, staying instead with the current linear format, a format that will die sooner rather than later. And with the red ink the current media partners are spraying, I doubt there will be a huge/increased payday when these contracts expire.
Better?
okay… I’m guessing at least five beers
But I think the gist is that you understand a number was presented, and that the deal could have been really cutting edge, but some schools didn’t feel comfortable living in the 21st century, because they spent their wad on a barber shop and water features, instead of their athletes.
And we are slowly finding out who those losers are.
Is that what you meant?
Fuck you, it’s only four beers, but yeah pretty close.
Maybe I need that 5th beer :::sigh:::
Are OSU leaders really to blame for poor tv ratings? This is simply a business move. Remove the emotions out of the decision. The numbers don’t lie. From the T.V. POV there’s such little movement on the ratings, it is probably a loss leader for some of these matchups. The beavers missed their chance to be relevant. To us diehard fans that’s a tough pill to swallow. The season after Fiesta bowl there was hype and excitement. The team fell back to earth. That’s a tough sell.
I’m curious with all the “high IQ” talk in this small corner of the internet, what is the real issue? So many excuses over the years…The answer is crystal clear. MONEY. Money means commitment, recruits, facilities. If a large donor (rhymes with owner) would’ve poured money into OSU athletics and sponsored the team, we would not be on the outside looking in.
Equally as important as MONEY is WINNING. 10 win seasons, like all the time. That is the number to get respect. Just win baby.
But Money apparently ruined the sport, but I’d argue that without it, we wouldn’t have a sport.
The saddest part of this tragedy is we as a team/community/fanbase were so close to turning the corner. Completed stadium, young coaching staff that get the program, and getting back to bowl games. Also back to beating the ducks!
I agree with nicebeaver, covid killed the pac12. That’s when I first said the pac12 is dead. SEC/B1G played, the west coast sheltered in place for a lot longer than 2 wks to stop the spread. It exposed so much, it showed who was brave enough to keep living.
Thank goodness we have your clarity and insight….! Now everything makes cents! (pun intended).
The young buck had some good notes that I think we should give some currency.
The hero we didn’t know we needed! Thanks for saving the day, Captain Hindsight!!
I think everyone needs to be given a little slack with comments. Pretty effing traumatic over that past 48 hours for Beav fans.
There is a window, and this falls in it.
which is why I didn’t return the favor
I actually ran into Dr Murthy today doing errands…she looked beat up. I asked her how she was doing and if she was tired from all the nonsense about all she could do was agree. I didn’t get the impression she didn’t give a shit, in fact just the opposite
She’s smarter than all of us combined.
She may not have the creativity some of us have, but we are no match for her numbers game.
While you know nothing about any of the people in this forum.
It is an assumption, but I’m guessing none of us are on the cutting edge of CFD and PCM research.
If that is incorrect, I apologize to those who are.
Then the other 8 presidents must be once-in-a-lifetime savants if they’ve managed to secure their school’s future (at least in the short term) and we’re left looking around like Travolta in Pulp Fiction…”where’d everyone go”? I think this just continues to show the 2 camps…1 side is all in on sports and the revenue it brings and the other camp is concerned about academics only. Now, arguably camp 2 is philosophically correct seeming that these are higher learning institutions. I don’t think you can try and stay neutral in all of this and I kind of feel that this is the Beavs. I read an article from a Denver newspaper (if I’m recalling correctly) and they interviewed a prior commissioner of several conferences, 1 being the big 12, and he said something that I totally agree with. You can’t half-ass the football revenue. You either go all in on that and reap the benefits or you might as well get out of it all together. That’s my feeling with OSU and Murthy and Stanford, Cal and WSU. They’re not proactive about being in camp 1 and just kind of float along riding the coattails of those schools that do prioritize it and that’s where they got played. That’s why they’ve been inept, naive and unprepared. I get that from a ratings perspective we don’t have the biggest bargaining tool but I think they could’ve at least shown some fight. The athletic future of this school is seriously in jeopardy and being a shell of what it is currently and all our leadership does is put out the boilerplate bullshit statements. Push back publicly. Call out these other schools. Show signs of life and that you give a shit.
This is some drama-laden hyperbole.
There are billions on the academic side, while we’re talking about missing by a couple million on the sports side leading to these decisions.
Relax.
Apparently George Kliavkoff is now motivated to do his job.
He’s embarrassed and wants to find a way to not let his 4 remaining teams down.
Good luck, George!
https://twitter.com/MHver3/status/1687984469414694913?t=d0_Ux1lYJCCGosmSXh1wbg&s=19
Exactly. The hubris, incompetence, naivety…it’s astounding. Beavs are soaking it in too. He says he’s really gonna do something this time!
The sad part is whatever deal he failed to accomplish will be what makes the SEC or Big10 $100million 5 years from now. Oh what could have been.
Oh… shut up.
This guy had to schill for a conference that USC shat upon… with a smile.
You think he’s going to say anything thaht was said behind closed doors?
Or do you think he just said what he could say, with the best messaging USC would allow?
I do question all the Presidents for not grouping together to thwart the coup.
But nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition.
shill?
Why am I not surprised these ass hats did this.
https://www.oregonlive.com/collegefootball/2023/08/arizona-state-president-oregon-washington-no-showed-friday-call-of-pac-12-presidents-and-chancellors-to-sign-grant-of-rights.html?outputType=amp
I’m liking this guy more and more.
It also shows that the Big 10 predated, when they said they wouldn’t.
Not that it wasn’t apparent with USC.
But ESPN/Fox was the chaperone and also buying dinner for both of them.
The only bright side is that the playoff is expanding. So in the doomsday scenario where we are a MWC member or if they merge with the PAC we could still make some noise. We seem to recruit the right guys who are a culture fit because if they weren’t they’d have signed for NIL with another school anyway.
Hard to see the positives in this but the big thing to keep an eye on will be how much this musical chair realignment shit show affects recruiting. Also if 9’er stays loyal if we continue to have success and not ask for a raise that our shit new revenue can’t afford.
Maybe we could have a theme for the games where instead of an orange or blackout we just all wear shirts with Jensen Huang’s face on them and signs that say “please help”. /s
So apparently the PAC 4 has a $450 million war chest only available to conference members. That’s something I guess. Could they use that to buffer losses next year then poach whoever they want from the rest of the G5 schools? It’s better then joining the MWC at a 75% cut in income. They could sign an apple deal and be in a better situation.
Where did you find this info?
Everyone’s favorite baldheaded journalist. Yes grain of salt. But with how many times he’s been wrong the law of averages says he must be correct at some point right?
Can we use it to buyout Tinkle?
I thought it was about 60% of that, and the valuation of the PTN was a lot of it.
I wouldn’t be surprised if they had a bit more socked away here and there. If Clownzano is saying it, he probably got it from Wilner, who doesn’t fudge numbers like this.
I could’ve read that article wrong but that war chest still largely belongs to the current members and the money we could be able to get is either from any playoff/bowl money and/or a little bit larger portion of our normal cut for pain and suffering caused by the other members. I also assume that any money in the pot would also need to go to payoff any outstanding debts and liabilities the conference would have when it turns off the lights. It’s unfortunately not as clear cut as splitting that amount of money up 4 ways. Would be nice but that’s not how it happens.
If I understand correctly, the bylaws say we need a three-quarter vote of all schools to dissolve the conference. And that’s not just of the remaining schools. That’s the final meeting with all 12.
So we would need at least 4 holdouts to keep the Pac Conference intact. But we would also need at least 8 football teams to have a viable football conference, according to bowl alliances.
So if the Pac survives, it will be because the four of us stick together. And if we play football as a conference, it will be because they pulled off a miracle.
I always thought the great risk was a stab in the back by Oregon and Washington, and thanks to the ASU President, we now know who as Pac 12 blood on their hands. Query: who called whom Thursday night to coordinate not calling in to the Friday morning conference call. My bet, UO called UW, but it doesn’t really matter.
Having spent a lot of the weekend with Coug friends, there is NO interest on their part in continuing the Apple Cup. I think that’s a bad posture to take, in the short term at least. To transpose to OSU, while UO has blood on its hands, OSU should insist on a big payday for each and every “Civil War” game played, either in Eugene or Corvallis. There will be a of community and political pressure on the Ducks to pay the Beavs “conscience money.” Sorta like what Cal exacted from UCLA.
I like being on offense rather than defense, and if the report above about the AAC is true, I find that more attractive than going on bended knee to the Mountain West. They will always be there as an end result; no need to rush it.
The goal should be to line up the four schools from the AAC that are the best fit for Stanford, and to a lesser extent, Cal. I know, I know, that kind of thinking botched both chances of linking up with the Big 12 but if the PAC brand is to survive, you gotta dance with the few people left to dance with. In the event, the best invitees would be Rice and SMU (former SW Conference members even before the Big 12) (Texas schools, nuff said,) high academic associations (especially Rice Technological Institute), Tulane, another high end academy with a following in a big market (new orleans) (and a former member of the SEC) and, my prize choice: NAVY. With Navy in hand you could draw Air Force from the Mountain West. This would make for a very interesting conference. Coast to coast, high ranking academic institutions with grounding the rich California and Texas recruiting grounds, and a national brand with Navy. If Navy is a reach because of geography, just try to lure Air Force, another top notch academic insitution, bringing the Colorado market into play.
Oregon is an obvious villain but to me I think UW is the one who quick started it. They’ve been very vocal about the deal. More so than Oregon. I’m betting they called Oregon to bail. UW throughout the 80’s and 90’s was dead set on booting Oregon State from the conference and WSU to a lesser extent. They’re very delusional about their status and I have no doubt delivering a devastating blow to Oregon State was something they didn’t mind at all. FTD but I really hope the Beavs run up the score on the Huskies in Corvallis
“there is NO interest on their part in continuing the Apple Cup. I think that’s a bad posture to take, in the short term at least.”
It’s not. It’s also not a bad posture in the long term. UW chose this, not Wazzu. The Apple Cup going bye bye is one of the results that was known before their decision, and even pretending to lament it is disingenuous.
I absolutely agree that Apple Cup and Civil War should be done. If Oregon and Big10 are supplying the payday and the tv exposure, their’s no chance in hell they do a home and home type split. I also have zero interest in being a tune-up pre-season game for Oregon to continue to flaunt a much larger gap when they’re earning $50 mill from media and we’re scraping $4 – $5 mill as a merger with mountain west. Get the fuck out of here. UO and UW canceled that rivalry by leaving. It’s not on the Beavs or Cougs to preserve the rivalry and be a punching bag tune-up game. If we need the money that bad, there’s plenty of other opponents in the other major conferences we can schedule to do that. Not to mention that schedules are already built out years and years in advance. So we’d need to cancel our existing games and potentially pay out revenue to those schools we cancel on to keep the rivalry going? Hard pass. This is already putting our current commitments in jeopardy. Read an article where one of recent commitments, the o-lineman David Adjbian, said he’s still committed to the Beavs but that part of his reasoning was to play in a power conference and so he’s obviously keeping an eye on the situation. This is shit happening within a few days much less what does recruiting look like 2 or 3 years from now when we can’t say we’re a power 5 conference? I don’t think people are truly seeing the big picture at what this is doing. “Oh its a little less money but thats not a big deal”. For real?
That’s not really the point.
Even if it’s a home and home, they eventually get paid $10m for their home game, while we get paid $1m for ours.
We’re giving them $4m to continue the rivalry, given there have to be two teams on the field. Buy games would be worse.
So the rumor I heard from a source inside the athletic department is……
Mountain West conference for football only. West Coast Conference for all other sports.
No idea how credible the source is but feel free to discuss……
For just OSU or all 4? A faith based conference doesn’t really vibe to well with Stanford or Cal especially.
Speaking in terms for OSU. No idea what the other 3 would do. Nor does it really matter right now.
Ahh… so we’re not talking the Pac-4.
got it
God this is worse than any other option I have heard so far.
At least the MBB team will get the shit kicked out of them by a true perennial final four team in Gonzaga and not just every day teams like now.
St Mary’s would kick their asses also. We can pencil in four automatic conference losses every season. Looking forward to that rivalry with the Portland Pilots.
Better than watching Zags run off to the Big 12.
Also, watch a bunch of Cali athletes in all the Olympic sports hit the portal, in the next year or two.
The travel for those kids will be brutal, and that’s without haveing to experience delays, which happen much more often on the East Coast. We’re a little spoiled out West with the airlines and scheduling. It’s when you get east of Denver that airlines start fucking with customers.
Also, some of them will end up at a better school, in the end, if they go to the WCC/Pac to play.
Don’t shoot the messenger
Why? The travel for the WCC would be awesome. It sounds like you’ve not visited a lot of those schools.
We still won’t win in hoops, but we will be heavily in the LA market, visible to recruits.
It will also put us in the MW for a couple years, until their deal runs out in 2025-26. At that point, we may have discussed with some of the better brands a new conference with a bunch of football schools and the old WCC. The WCC buyout is $1m, and that’s if we don’t rebrand it.
Missouri football coach doesn’t hold back on conference realignment. Much like WSU coach Dickart….
https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/ncaafb/mizzou-football-coach-blasts-conference-realignment-after-big-ten-big-12-raid-pac-12/ar-AA1eQdi0
Mizzou?
Are they still in the Big 8?
Wow.
I knew people were highly pissed off about this, but I thought it was just our fans and the fans of the other three.
Them’s some pissed off athletes.
It also shows the advantage we have in recruiting those athletes, now.
Stewart Mandell/Athletic have a story up detailing the actual Apple deal. Really doesnt sound that bad, but the timing and coordination was next to impossible with teams already set on exiting the conference. Sounds like they were closer to making this thing happen than we thought.
I dont have an Athletic subscription so I’ just basing this off the replies and comments. I’m sure there’s plent more here if anybody cares to divulge.
https://twitter.com/slmandel/status/1688011940835262464?t=dkDt1eL99WDPQz3X1TdJ6w&s=19
Hi! I’m Jack
I’m so much smarter than the rest of you so I speak in riddles like yoda no one but me understands.
Smart you once were. Boomer you are. Irrelevance you should fuck off in.
Poor cow.
For 13 months, Pac-12 commissioner George Kliavkoff publicly and privately expressed confidence that his league would receive a new media rights deal valuable enough to ensure its members stick together past 2024, the year USC and UCLA debut in the Big Ten.
The morning of Aug. 1, Kliavkoff finally presented the presidents and athletic directors a concrete offer. It was not what they’d been expecting to hear.
go-deeper
GO DEEPER
Oregon, Washington to join Big Ten in 2024 as Pac-12 stumbles
According to three people with knowledge of the terms, Apple offered the members a five-year deal with an annual base rate of $23 million per school (a subsequent counteroffer lifted it to $25 million), with incentives based on projected subscribers to a Pac-12 streaming product akin to Apple’s MLS League Pass.
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At 1.7 million subscribers, the per-school payout would match the $31.7 million average that Big 12 schools will reportedly receive from ESPN and Fox beginning in 2025. But Kliavkoff encouraged the room to think much bigger — at 5 million subscribers, the schools would eclipse $50 million per year, closer to the deep-pocketed SEC and Big Ten than the ACC or Big 12.
The league also had an opt-out clause after three years if the deal didn’t reach a specific revenue target.
But there were no guarantees whether Apple would simulcast certain games on a linear network, as it does with Fox for MLS, in which case conference games would reach a much smaller universe than other major conferences. ESPN currently has 75 million subscribers, far more than the most optimistic projections for a Pac-12 product on Apple+.
Kliavkoff updated the 10 presidents throughout the negotiations, so neither Apple’s involvement or a streaming-heavy deal came as a surprise; the New York Post first reported the possibility in February. However, three participants said they’d been expecting to be presented with a second, more traditional option as well. Just as Kliavkoff and others had told reporters at the league’s Media Day on July 21, they were under the impression a new major player had emerged in the last six weeks.
But that deal, which involved multiple partners, fell apart at the 11th hour, shortly before the presidents’ self-imposed July 31 deadline for bidders to finalize their offers.
“(The Apple deal) was not the deal that we had been discussing just days before, and it was not going to secure (our future),” Washington president Ana Mari Cauce told reporters Saturday. “When you have a deal that people are saying one of the best aspects of it is, ‘you can get out in (three) years,’ that tells you a lot.”
go-deeper
GO DEEPER
Arizona, ASU, Utah leaving Pac-12 for Big 12
Even despite the underwhelming offer, at least several ADs went to bed Thursday believing they had a deal. Though Arizona and Utah had already applied for Big 12 membership, an Arizona board of regents meeting Thursday night ended with ASU president Michael Crow still unwilling to leave, and he and Arizona president Robert Robbins had pledged for their schools to remain together. If they stayed, Utah would, too.
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“We were the stalwarts fighting for the Pac-12 until the last ditch,” Crow told reporters Saturday. He described the Apple deal as “a technological 23rd century Star Trek thing with really unbelievable capability that ASU was very interested in.”
Exiting that Thursday night regents meeting, there was enough uncertainty about the intentions of Arizona and Arizona State that the Big 12 entered Friday morning wondering whether its plan had fallen apart and the Pac-12 would survive, which might’ve forced the conference to move on and explore adding UConn as its 14th member.
“Late Thursday night, we were like, ‘Man, I don’t know if this is going to happen,’” one person familiar with the Big 12’s discussions said. “We went into Friday morning knowing there was a very real possibility that the Pac-12 was going to stay together as is.”
go-deeper
GO DEEPER
Oregon, Washington to the Big Ten? Experts discuss implications of latest realignment move
Meanwhile, the Big Ten, with a boost from media partner Fox, had hastily put together offers Thursday for Oregon and Washington in which they would join at a half share of the other 16 members (including USC and UCLA), at a rate only slightly higher than the Big 12’s $31.7 million. Deep into Thursday night and early Friday morning, Oregon was still torn whether to accept it, according to two people with knowledge of the deliberations. The Athletic reported early Friday that the discussions had lost momentum overnight.
“The mountain schools and Oregon and Washington didn’t want to have to do this,” said a person outside the Pac-12 conference briefed on the schools’ discussions. “They wanted it to be true that they could hit those (Apple) numbers. They wanted to be out west with those travel partners.
“They didn’t want to be in the Big Ten with a bad deal and those crazy travel details. Even at that time (Thursday night), it could have been held together, but that’s a lot to process in a short time. And that $50 million figure they thought they could hit on the high end, that wasn’t realistic.”
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When the presidents reconvened at 7 a.m. PT Friday, Oregon and Washington’s presidents informed the group of their Big Ten intentions, and the rest of the league quickly unraveled from there.
“Once Oregon and Washington decided to go to the Big Ten, the conference was no longer viable,” said Crow, who said he met with the Big 12 for the first time at 10:30 a.m. PT Friday. “You can’t be in a non-viable position for more than a few hours in our minds, so we resolved that.”
The Big Ten officially announced Oregon and Washington at 3:25 p.m. PT. The Big 12 announced Arizona, Arizona State and Utah three hours later. That left Cal, Stanford, Oregon State and Washington State as the only remaining Pac-12 members by night’s end.
“I’m furious,” Oregon State AD Scott Barnes told The Oregonian. “… We were literally hours away from a deal that everybody could embrace.”
— Max Olson contributed reporting
The apple deal doesn’t sound that terrible unless you think you can’t hit that number. Instead teams jumped for a half share and jet lag. Which will be followed by a future linear deal that’s also just pie in the sky. Weird.
The partial share becomes a full share eventually. They’ll have full share in 2032 which will be good for like $70 million annually so the short term money basically doesn’t matter at all in the decision. I find the above reporting about how they were “so close to actually staying” hard to believe. There was simply no offer available anywhere in the same universe as joining the Big 10. What needed to happen from day 1 when Kliavkoff took over was to put significant public pressure on UO and UW not to do the immoral thing and abandon the league. It should have been a preemptive public shaming from all involved. “Don’t even think about doing this…….It’s about more than just you……etc. etc”. Make the clear and obvious moral case. It’s really all that could be done, no amount of 3-Dimensional financial chess was going to save the day.
It’s all short term money, because they’re going to have to sign a dal like the apple one on their next media deal.
Even the linear deals will become all streaming, within a couple years. What we’ll likely see at that time, however, is the escalators will pay out for individual team numbers, and that’s how they’ll cull the schools they don’t want.
Yep
Again , I don’t get how/why everyone assumes the next contracts are automatically a factor x higher. How do you come up with 70M as a number ? Why not 100 or 500 or 40, they’re just as logical.
The networks are upsidedown already, ESPN makes money by being bundled in every cable package. Cable homes are shrinking. The next contracts are more likely to be streaming models and the smaller/less profitable schools/franchises will be culled.
To get nowhere near a playoff appearance.
5 million subscribers would equal 50mil per school. That doesn’t seem like a crazy number at all. All signs point to streaming as the way things are going and those dopes left 50mil on the table. Unbelievable.
5 million subscribers is monumental. How many total people do you think watch Pac-12 games week to week?
Average views per week in 2022 football only.
#10 ASU 316k national rank #71
#9 Colorado 352k. National rank #67
#8 Arizona 506k. National rank #62
#7 beavs 625k. National rank #57
#6 Stanford 846k National rank #47
#5 Cal 846k National rank #46
#4 WSU 906k. National rank #41
#3 Washington 1.15m. National rank #34
#2 Utah 1.16m National rank #33
#1 oregon 2.21m National rank #12
Oh you wanted a total number….. 8.9 million views per week on average. Like I said 5 million doesn’t seem crazy.
Subscribers does not equal fans.
Say your household has 4 ticket buying fans living in it. That’s still 1 subscription.
At least bars and other places of business that show games on tv could help push that number up, but 5 mil is a huge number.
Appletv + worldwide subscription numbers are only around 42-43M currently. And this would be an additional expense on top of a subscription.
https://www.statista.com/statistics/1223830/apple-tv-plus-viewers-us/
“Number of Apple TV Plus viewers in the United States from 2022 to 2026(in millions)”
Not seeing worldwide?
“At 1.7 million subscribers, the per-school payout would match the $31.7 million average that Big 12 schools will reportedly receive from ESPN and Fox beginning in 2025
…
Meanwhile, the Big Ten, with a boost from media partner Fox, had hastily put together offers Thursday for Oregon and Washington in which they would join at a half share of the other 16 members (including USC and UCLA), at a rate only slightly higher than the Big 12’s $31.7 million.”
So w & uo get jet lag and $~30m, or about the same as the apple deal. And I’m not convinced the next fox ESPN media deal will keep escalating, the linear companies are in cost cutting mode already, not to mention streaming is forward thinking and it’s more likely the conferences shrink back their members.
They’re going to get about what they would have in the Pac, after travel costs.
Too bad it isn”t into perpetuity. They deserve to fail.
Just for clarity the above is only schools that would have been moving forward if they signed the Apple deal.
The total views of the whole pac12 including UCLA and USC is 12,568,000 average views per week.
Need to find unique views.
But it’s almost as if nobody realizes we’ve got a lot of free press this year.
Opportunity lost, on their part.
Depends on the cost too. Are you talking $10/month? Is it $100 just for football season? Those top end numbers don’t seem realistic even at $10/month for the Pac 12 package much less if you have even higher costs just for specific sports you pay for individually.
“Oregon was still torn whether to accept it”
Two words: Bull and shit
They were more worried about being seen as ‘less than,’ than money or destroying the conference
I can accept vanity. But they didn’t want to stay.
They knew the money was greener on the other side, Big 12 level offer, or not, and they probably figured they could create the narrative that just because the guarantee was lower, it’s a shit deal, so they had leave.
1.7 million subscribers isn’t that many. 5 million might be a stretch, it might not. But the payouts between 1.7 and 5 are between 32 and 51 million.
It looks like Apple was conscious of the landscape and made the “needs to be as big as the Big 12’s deal” really easy to achieve, but some schools bolted for the guarantees, instead of relying on themselves actually putting a must-watch product on the field.
Maybe the team in Eugene should change their colors from green and yellow, to just yellow. Or they can put a yellow stripe down the back of their unis?
Maybe all this bullshit will lead to some changes in the NCAA policing of schools? Michigan regent on latest turmoil…”Now, lets get to the heart of it: these college leaders, from the Big Ten, to the SEC, to the ACC and beyond, again talking about how the biggest threats to college sports are the transfer portal and NIL, and then go transfer portal a conference in a week in August”
https://twitter.com/JordanAckerMI/status/1688240177536282624?t=ATmC_CyipQZuncDA90o-ng&s=19
I’m probably dreaming here, but what if we could talk Apple into a contract with OSU as a proof of the proposal? Provide to show its workable, etc. to attract others.
https://www.yahoo.com/sports/if-you-hate-whats-happening-to-college-football-heres-the-team-to-root-for-this-season-185034053.html
Best article I have read in a long time.
If we rewind this thing all the way back – USC and UCLA are “still in” the Pac-12. Neither Fox or ESPN are offering as good of a deal to the entireity of the Pac-12 as they would if USC and UCLA jump alone. At that point, the conference was cooked. Schools were faced with the choice of “holding out” for a decent deal, as good as, or better than the Big 12 – and THAT never came.
Unless someone can show me when ESPN or Fox were offering the Pac12 more than the Big 12 (and I’ve never seen this anywhere), of coursse the schools that could get into the Big 10 would go and the teams with a shot at the Big 12 would go.
Correct. The reality is the Pac12 was never as valuable from a market perspective as the other main leagues EVEN WITH USC and UCLA. West coast games are on too late and the fan bases are WAY more casual than the midwest and southeast. It’s just entertainment to us, not a religion.
With the LA market, we get probably about 40.
Without, ESPN offered about the same as apple, with a higher guarantee but much lower upside.
Neither number would keep schools that were overextended on their credit cards from finding a new home.
Oregon needed the same as the Big 12, becaue they’ve blown their wad for several years to come.
Lousy financial decisions by schools who think glam is how to live life meant the conference was vulnerable to USC’s sabotage.
I should say te apple guarantee was not enough, but the upside was there for anyone who thinks they’re a national name.
I guess Oregon isn’t that, or they just didn’t want to do the work to correct their delinquencies.
Paper tiger UO thinks they’re a national brand but afraid/unwilling to bet on themselves
That’s what I see.
I wonder if the Refs will finally be on our side this year.
Lanning wants to continue the rivalry as a home and home.
https://www.oregonlive.com/collegefootball/2023/08/dan-lanning-wants-oregon-ducks-to-continue-rivalry-with-oregon-state-beavers-at-autzen-and-reser-stadium.html
Well no shit. Your team will make more in TV revenue per game than what we can afford to pay our HC annually. Of course you’d love to schedule us because it won’t count as a second FCS game, even though the disparity will almost be the same.
If Barnes has any integrity, he won’t think twice in denying this proposal. It’s absurd.
Lanning can go play Utah.
Counter-offer: $15,000,000/game all to be played in Reser.
Only play them if it’s game 1, where every team has a puncher’s chance.
Later in the season OSU would get rolled every time
Lanning is a dunce cap,a few days ago he was trash talking Colorado for leaving the conference and bam the yucks vail out
It’s time to really outside the box. Time to reach out to the Saudis. Their sports investment fund has been wanting to establish itself in major sports (golf, soccer, etc.). Why not get them to fund a superconference if whoever is remaining and let them start dictating in ways not possible now. It would incredible amounts of money as long you don’t have much of a conscious which is what all the schools that bailed did. Reach out to the Saudis.
It’s time to really outside the box. Time to reach out to the Saudis. Their sports investment fund has been wanting to establish itself in major sports (golf, soccer, etc.). Why not get them to fund a superconference if whoever is remaining and let them start dictating in ways not possible now. It would incredible amounts of money as long you don’t have much of a conscious which is what all the schools that bailed did. Reach out to the Saudis.
Get rid of one bonesaw, add another.
Sounds great.
Or, instead of going into a huge amount of debt to fund sports on the quest to *maybe* compete for a championship, we reevaluate the whole business model and not rely on the taxpayer being a backstop in the end when shit hits the fan.
We’re a world-renowned institution, not a sports franchise. We can still have scholarship sports, but we shouldn’t be slaves to TV contracts (or foreign governments, lol).
So we discuss how awesome this new grant is that we got to research the difference in the salt type of the pacific ocean vs the salt in the Atlantic? Sure would be great to not rely on media other forms of backing but I don’t see how you pay for scholarships and even be remotely competitive solely off concession stand sales.
Competitive for what? A CFP?
By doubling down on a huge TV contract with the Big 12 we effectively think we can beat Georgia and Bama in football, because we go further into debt to satisfy what the conglomerates want us to do to increase their viewership. Students have to pay higher tuition each year to fund this mania, and it’s got to stop.
We will never beat Bama or Georgia in the age of NIL and the transfer portal. The best team Kansas State ever produced got blown out in the Sugar Bowl by a mediocre Bama (by their standards).
CFB will eventually implode and the debt bombs will go off for dozens of programs and they will lose their scholarship athletics. I don’t want OSU being any part of that. If it requires having less talent and playing lesser opponents, fine. If we don’t get to watch the Beavs on TV every week, fine. If we lose our coaching staff, fine. If we lose 80% of our athletic department bureaucracy, fine. But it’s time to do some soul searching and make sound financial decisions to right the ship.
You’re not wrong…
We have been making sound financial decisions. Why do you assume otherwise? We’ve pinched pennies before, and we never really got out of that mindset.
We’re not Cal or Wazzu, who spent based on pre-pandemic seasons.
Yes, Barnes has been a good AD in helping balance our budget the past few years. He’s going to have to navigate this mess.
“Power corrupts; absolute power corrupts absolutely” at some point these media maniacs will want to flex their power and prestige by forcing universities to invest in extremely stupid things when they don’t get that satisfaction of further consolidating the market. It always happens across every culture because it’s human nature.
“So we discuss how awesome this new grant is that we got to research the difference in the salt type of the pacific ocean vs the salt in the Atlantic?”
Are you talking about OSST and satellite-derived ocean salinity data sets they report for all scientists across the world who need the information?
Would the Big12 invite the remaining schools so they get to 18, but offer them only partial share since they don’t bring anything to the table? Seems a logical ending to all this. I guess I’d watch that still. Wouldn’t watch the MWC games for sure. Might watch a rebranded Pac if they add BSU, SDSU, Air Force, CSU, Nevada and find a few others. ACC is interesting. Could be good football, but the travel makes it too much of a leap, literally.
A rebranded Mountain West with Pac teams and AAC teams is a pretty fun and diverse conference. I like several of the G5 teams and many of those teams have spent time in the top 25 from year to year.(Boise, Fresno, SDSU, Tulane)
It’s not a bad group of football teams. Basketball could be decent too, but pretty top heavy
Remember when I harped on how the Beavs should expand into the PDX market? Yeah. That would have made all the difference here. Though, I don’t love chasing and sucking TV dick. But it was obvious we had to do that way back then when I suggested it. Of course we sat on our laurels.
What do you mean? Play the games in Portland?
Yeah or put like an extension/law school up there. Something.
In fairness, they have a small presence:
https://portland.oregonstate.edu/
But nothing like the campus in Bend which is a real investment
They did play the 1 non con game in Portland last year vs Mt State, and it was alot of fun.
But they only did it because of the stadium construction.
I wish they’d play a non con game vs PSU up there every 2-4 years as a neutral site that makes the gate draw worthwhile for both programs(PSU actually plays on a high school field over in Hillsboro now, so any arrangement would be a big bonus for their program)
Sure, it’s a smaller stadium, but it would be a way to minimize travel while still playing the allotted home games at Reser.
While Oregon travels to the east coast, we could be a pretty attractive option for NW athletes whose families could see the majority of their games with a short drive
Chip Kelly thinks there should just be one big league with 60 teams and regional divisions like the NFL to mitigate travel costs. He also said that nobody asked him. I think there are 65 Power 5 schools, so of course the Beavs would be excluded.
You snooze, you lose, and we snoozed. But again, what we lost is sucking TV dick, so I’m mixed about it.
Quote from unknown state legislator. “Oregon Ducks are a sports merchandise operation that’s side job is educating students.”
Uh, yeah.
I’m like 95% sure this is going to happen. I don’t know if it will be the PAC, but they’ll try to revert this move somehow when they experience the reality of it.
https://twitter.com/angrybeavs/status/1688242302299312128
Both will be in so much debt trying hang with Michigan and Ohio State they won’t be able too. They’ll be just more popular Purdue/Northwestern schools at that point.
What are they going to beg to come back to? They’ve burned the bridge, the city, the whole left side of the country. There will be nothing left to “come back to” by then. They certainly won’t beg to get into the MWC.
Saw some rumors, so grain of salt, but sounds like Big 12 is talking to some of the bowl partners of the Pac 4. Lol. Even if we do create some weak ass Pac West conference there’s gonna be shit for bowl games as it only makes sense those sponsors and bowls will want to leverage the power 3 or 4 conferences.
There’s a (small?) chance they’re talking to the bowls in regard to keeping the bowl affiliations if they absorb the PAC4?
You’d have to assume that there’s verbiage in the contracts for what can happen if a conference falls apart.
There trying to trade the holiday and sun for the Alamo and independence bowls.
Nope.
Those contracts are ironclad, as long as we have a conference.
If there’s any truth to this 400mil left behind in the Pac….
Payout the funds to the four schools left behind lump sum or over 4 years.
Negotiate for Big 12 and their media partner to absorb them at cost. Screaming deal for them. Say it’s 5 mil a school. With the Pac funds left over 30 mil a year each school for four years. We get to play in a decent league, takes the sting out of being left behind with the payout, Big 12 and there media partner gets a deal.
WEST
ASU
Arizona
Utah
BYU
OSU
WSU
Stan
Cal
Colorado
TT
EAST
all the rest
Solves the travel issue to. But what do I know.
I’m just waiting to hear who the pac owes money to with some back door agreements. I’m sure they still owe Larry a house or something. I really don’t trust the conference.
Dissolve the conference just to nuke any remaining money owed to Larry Scott
I commented above but I think that money is still payable to all current members. The pac 4 would get a slightly higher cut for pain and suffering. They may also get all, or higher portions, of bowl/playoff money. Regardless, my understanding from canzano article was that it’s def not $400 mill. Split 4 ways. Much, much less than that.
Helping the B12 make a coast-coast conference with regional divisions is the most ideal solution (especially for the Beavs). OSU and WSU fit well on an academic and socio-economic level with the B12 as a whole, they even bring some major strengths on that front.
But the B12 doesn’t give two shits about OSU/WSU and won’t take them if STAN/CAL aren’t in at a massive discount as well, and STAN/CAL don’t want to be in the B12 they want the B1G and are butt hurt they got left out. I think they’d both rather go independent and wait for the next opportunity to B1G.
B12 would rather add MBB powers like Gonzaga and UConn before they take on OSU/WSU without CAL/STAN.
I also just don’t see a solution with STAN/CAL in the same conference as UNLV and New Mexico, unless they strike some super deal with Apple that lifts the whole merged mess up from the bottom with lots of extra $ and new media hi-tech future conference stuff to infuse the the bottom dwellers with both academic and athletic resources (why would they do that?).
It hurts but it’s best to prepare for the worst-case scenario.
CAL/STAN go their own independent ways and the Beavs only option is to join the MWC with WSU for football only and WCC in all the other sports to save as much $ as possible. All things considered, that’s probably the most sensible path both for the University as a whole and for the actual human young-adults that have to do all the “student-athlete” things in such a doomsday scenario.
There will be a mass exodus when the portal opens just in time for Christmas and our recruit ceiling goes down to 2-star guys overnight.
BG stays just cause he’s that kind of guy but Chiles, Martinez, Velling, Newell, Card, Howard, Taylor, Ivy, Chisom, Card etc. are mostly out the door as they can all get NIL opportunities somewhere in the expanded B12 or elsewhere.
WSU, Boise, and Fresno become our biggest “rivals” and every 5-10 years or so we make a run to the MWC title but still don’t make the cut for the expanded playoff because 13-0 isn’t enough when 8-4 Ole Miss is ranked 12th in the CFP poll.
Luck o’ da Beavs.
Backfill Cal/Stand with Zags and Zona. West coast division. Or just do it with 18. Gotta make the B12 a deal they can’t refuse. Or just go indy ourselves instead of the MWC
Sorry zags and sdsu
Why can’t the money be used to buy out the MW teams the Pac 4 teams wd like with them in a conference still called the Pac -number?
BIG PAC (Pacific to Atlantic Conference)
Angry,
Do you still connect with your Stanford buddy? – What can/will Tara Vandeveer do with her truly elite wbb program?
I do, but I don’t talk to him about WBB. We spoke yesterday. He thinks/agrees that Stanford has better options than OSU, but it’s dark days for both.
Our bff @MHver3:
“PAC4 meeting w/MWC tomorrow for merger discussions then immediately meeting with Apple and a few AAC schools to discuss expansion. Again all options are on the table but their preference is to expand and continue on.”
At this point any type of scenario/rumor that sounds like it might be beneficial to OSU I solidly disregard. My sports fan will has been nearly broken by the last 3 days of treachery for greed.
I’d like to have a life raft tossed in the form of bonus surplus conference cash and an invite from the Big12 but I am experienced in the ways of Charlie Brown and football.
Of course Barnes was caught of guard at the last hour. He wasn’t suspicious in the least and had no reason to think he was going to be stabbed in the back by such long time friends as UO and UW. Ridiculously
Naive.
Athletic Directors don’t have a lot of pull in this fight (although some), they work for their respective Universities running the departments. This is mostly ruthless media executives taking advantage of university presidents that haven’t watched Succession.
That doesn’t mean they can’t pound the table. He was just grateful to be there and get along. Pat Casey pounded the table and if refused, went out and did it anyway.
Barnes needs to grow a spine. Tell Oregon right now. On record. CW is done after 2024. Bye Felicia. Go get paid by an SEC team.
Exactly, like some others have hinted at, make Oregon payout big time to continue the CW — like 10 million, then they can make the decision to cancel it, time to get OSU’s due!
Latest rumor from MHver3
Pac4 meeting with Mt West tomorrow about merger then right after that a meeting with Apple to discuss expanding with a few AAC schools. All options are on the table but the preference is to expand and continue on.
He also says Stanford is not onboard with a merger with Mt West. This makes sense add SMC, Rice, Tulane all 3 have been power 5 teams in the past (all be it distant past) and they bring the academic pedigree to match us with the PAC4. These universities are also flush with cash and are located in large metro areas. This probably explains why Apple likes this option better as well. Then wait out the top tier Mt West schools to get to 10/12 teams. PAC keeps all the power 5 benefits and gives up 2 years to shore things up.
What kind of media deal would the conference get with those schools and what’s left though? If there wasn’t a good enough deal with the 9 or 10 how would this be any better? How do you let usc and ucla get away was the start of the end.
Rings of Jack’s Revenge of the Nerds conference. Be fine by me.
I want to be clear on something, the consensus is/wat Larry Scott signed the Pac-12’s death warrant back in the day when he established the Pac-12 Network as an independent outlet instead of it being a parnership with ESPN or Fox. Had that happened, even if the net generated was less – Fox or ESPN would have had a stake in seeing the Pac-12 survive – rather than being indifferent to its survival. Yes?
They aren’t indifferent to it. It makes us a profit. It doesn’t make them one.
Like everyone else, I’ve been going through a variety of emotions thinking about the state of college athletics, conference realignment, and the future of Oregon State in the midst of all of it, and there’s really only one satisfying outcome I can think of:
Jonathan Smith is livid. But he plays it relatively coy during non-conference and doesn’t take it out on the opponents. After all, SJSU, UC Davis, and SDSU bare no fault in the matter. Same for Wazzu, our commiserative brothers in all this. After that, Smith releases the hounds of war. “Screw sportsmanship! Screw mercy! Screw you!” becomes Smith’s battle cry when questioned weekly by every sports journalist about his tactics. “We’ll continue flipping off and curb stomping our opponents into the turf until we’re satisfied! Then, we’ll flip ’em off some more!” They head into Autzen where the winner meets USC in Las Vegas. Nix scrambles for his life all game, getting sacked 10 times for minus 69 yards. Martinez rushes for 250, Fenwick and Newell for 100+ each, and DJ throws for 420 as he smokes all them UofO DBs, adding a rushing score when he trucks over several Duck defenders on way to the endzone. We witness the biggest beatdown in Civil War history, and Oregon is more devastated than OSU during the 2008 “War of the Roses”. The Beavs gather on the midfield “O”, shout “FTD!” at the top of their lungs, and do a panoramic double middle finger salute while JS looks up at the suites and flashes a devilish, prickish grin at Rob Mullens. OSU beats the piss out of USC in the PAC-12 Championship and coasts into the CFP, fittingly, playing in the Rose Bowl. They beat whatever pissant the committee throws at them, and become the final Rose Bowl Champions of the P5 Era. They face probably some SEC arsehole, let’s say, LSU? It’s a close game through the first half, but LSU pulls away a little just before halftime. LSU extends their lead a bit more through the 3rd quarter. Well Beaver fans, it was fun while it lasted, right? No! It’s not over! Smith and Lindgren unleash their most potent strategy….OSU runs it 19 STRAIGHT TIMES, and LSU can’t stop them. The Beavs make a comeback for the ages and win the National Championship! OSU players grab stacks of fake $1 bills and start throwing them at the LSU players and coaches; their boosters look away in shame. The Beavs hoist the trophy and give one more bird-flipping salute to ESPN, Fox, and the deserting PAC members before the censors abruptly end the broadcast.
Cut to the postgame press conference: representatives from ESPN and Fox inform Jonathan Smith that their respective companies are prepared to offer OSU the most lucrative media contract the college sports world has ever seen. Smith and the players on stage stand up as one, do a crotch chop, tell them to “SUCK IT!’, and walk off……
I hate this.
Victories against UW and UO aren’t enough. Only a beatdown that borders on the edge of being an ethical question will suffice.
bodybags. theme song playing in my head for us as we go out in a ball of fire
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S26SnchQJP4
We’ve arrived at the therapeutic fan-fiction phase of grief.
lol
Fair enough :)
Smith will likely be gone. He won’t compete vs inferior opponents IMO. I think he only stays if we wind up in the Big 12.
Decision on that won’t be made until end of the year. Rumor is we are leaders in the clubhouse for on of those 2 spots with UConn but as we know a lot can change in the matter of hours let alone months.
Be nice if true?
Well that was fun.
Smith isn’t going to run the score up on anyone this season in conference because he knows the players and coaches on opposing teams had nothing to do with this decision.
Also, any future OOC games should.not be scheduled against B1G and Big 12 opponents. Fuck them, fuck their schools and fuck their conferences.
They can all eat a giant bowl of donkey cocks
I get the frustration but I compare it to taking a job with a new company. If they are offering better benefits and more stability do you blame schools for going there and conferences for offering programs to join when the current conference was out playing golf five days a week instead of supporting the employees?
100
Let.me also add that no future games will be broadcast in ESPN or Fox. They can eat a sack of shit as well.
You don’t want or need us? Same
From 2011. Things usually take 10 years after you first notice them. In this case, 12.
http://angrybeavs.com/football/4412
From 2022:
“My prediction is everyone but Washington state and OSU join the Big-12. Only hope is Oregon demands we come along…”
So close. Mixture of Big 10 and Big 12.
http://angrybeavs.com/football/16705
For the record, my new prediction is that all of these teams chasing TV are chasing a sinking ship. Streaming/Ala Carte is all that will matter over the next decade. It’s a model that will produce more revenue as cord cutting gets exponential and nobody watches these games or teams. Ducks and Huskies probably max out at 8 or 9 wins in their “great” seasons, and more like 7 becomes their norm. They basically jumped ship to become the Beavs.
Hulio Recardo (not real name) is saying BIG12 is vetting us as we speak and things are looking positive for invite. Goes back to ESPN being pissed they got locked out of the West Coast when UW and hole jumped to BIG10. ESPN has asked BIG12 to and 2 more west coast teams for inventory and they will pay (not sure if it would be a full share) Also ASUs AD is already saying no way ASU is going to Morgantown WVA for anything. Brand new member and already bashing the conference. Just a giant shit show.
He is also saying don’t be shocked if we get an invite and WSU does not. I know the WSU athletic dept is a mess right now with a mountain of dept, pending lawsuit from Rovelich, and the AD has zero credibility with the athletic dept.
Not sure how true any of this is but a lot of it makes sense. God what a mess
Scheer is saying the same, that SDSU and OSU have had preliminary talks with the Big12.
Of course it would be a peasants deal, for less than the rest of the league.
Man, fuck these leagues and the disrespect. OSU gets shit upon for being in the Willamette Valley, but they’d go toe to toe with any team in that league and would likely win the whole conference if they played in the Big12 this year.
https://twitter.com/jasonscheer/status/1688364287008575488?t=FjH_AZ06GvnPjckpiGIDog&s=19
Who cares if it’s a peasant’s deal? It’s the only chance OSU has of continued relevance.
At least in the short term. This is all going to back fire long term.
Sure, but OSU can’t stop the trend. The only chance they have is to try to embrace it.
it isn’t
The word is ESPN will play for a 20 million share. So I would guess the deal would be in the low 20’s (what we get today) plus the extra travel expenses we would have to pay. Still better than the 10 mil if we merge with the Mt West. Probably get more from Apple for the AAC plan but I would guess still nowhere near 20 million. BIG12 is the only way to stay really relevant. Tighten the belt for 2 years and then hopefully get a full share starting in 2025.
There’s some truth to this.
ESPN wants to kill the PAC and its network.
per Beaver 93 and MHver3 (who is that by the way?; one of you smart guys ought to be able to figure that out): IF the goal of the Pac 3 is to keep Stanford in tow, a previous major conference history and/or R-1 status (a gauge of the best research institutions) is the likely formula. Rice and Tulane from the AAC fit that mold, but not SMU, which is R-2 (the next level down). From the MW you get Reno, LV, New Mexico and Utah State. No Boise or Fresno. Stanford has an important tie to Notre DAme, which would be helpful in bolstering the new Pac’s prospects as a so called power conference.
Only chickens shy from elevating associates, especially when they are willing.
Their inferred research esteem is wrong, by a large factor.
elevate these nuts
You elevate the highest performing lower associates one or two at a time, you don’t outnumber yourself with them. That’s a real good way to get your ass handed to you.
Forgot, Colorado State is an R-1, like OSU. Doctorate granting institution with signifcant research metric
I wonder how fast the tune changes for Beaver fans if we get invited to the Big12? “Fuck the Big10 and Big12…oh, we’re in the Big12 now?? Cool, let’s go Big12!”
Fuck the Big 12.
If we end up there, then fuck us.
Jack (or his shade) is definitely back :)
We’re all whores, we’re just pissed we didn’t get invited to the dance.
not
The number of partners on that dance card will be reduced to 32 within a decade.
It doesn’t appear that it must be either or, in this case. Also, I think we are all more pissed at the ncaa and media conglomerates than anyone else. Big 12, Big 10 etc did what they had to do. We tolerated mediocrity both within the Pac 12 and at OSU with Riley…this is what we asked for. Ah shucks
Looks like B12 could be in play for OSU
https://twitter.com/jasonscheer/status/1688364287008575488
This is the college football version of the hunger games. Make alliances to stay alive until more are killed off then eventually you try to kill each other until one is standing. In this case until 16-24 are standing. This is such a fucking mess. The TV networks could obviously care less and most of the universities are too arrogant to understand what is happening.
Oh and if we do end up in the BIG12 EVERY home game will start at 730PM or later. The only reason we would get this lifeline is for late game inventory.
How is that much different than the past decade? It is the main reason the networks crap on OSU as a ratings bust but they have been slotted into a death zone for casual viewership for 90% of games since 2009 at least.
PAC12 network only made those numbers even worse. OSU is no different than Iowa St in a lot of ways but the entire country has had a chance to casually watch Iowa St rise to semi relevant status. No one even realizes how good OSU is going to be, even Vegas oddsmakers don’t want to believe it because they haven’t really watched the Beavs.
Most of the talk about OSU comes down to assumptions from the Riley era and recruiting stars bias, meaning the roster can’t match the talent of the other top schools. Bias and assumptions.
I’d like to see Beavs, Cal, Stanford, and WSU work to rebuild P12. As bad as it seems, there’s a unique opportunity to leverage a national underdog brand, up front cash, innovative TV deal with Apple, NIL to keep existing talent, make CFP over next 2 years, etc. It will require leadership and lots of luck but the upside is worth the risk. With Apple, I think there is huge NIL potential by leveraging I-phones, social media, Formula 1 production format, etc. I don’t blame Ducks for preferring the secure cash but I think it’s short sighted. Eventually they lose the Phil gravy train and over time they will long for the good old days. With risk comes potential reward and sometimes when you play it safe you get passed by. Need to create a buzz with incredibly innovative broadcasts that compel fans to tune in. Secure exclusive deals with national sports bar brands to carry Apple TV for free… potentially pay to have games televised in those establishments. When selling game tickets, add 1 year Apple TV subscription to the cost of ticket. Leverage gambling for additional revenue streams. Push the limits in all phases… bend the rules. Make a 2 year commitment to go all in with P12 marketing campaign. If you can change the narrative in 2 years, the conference could thrive long term. Worst case scenario is they fail and Beavs end up in MWC or something similar but with some luck and vision, this could be a game changer for the better
I can’t disagree with this logic. Long term this is probably the correct strategy but has a lot of risk. BIG12 is safer (for now) but eventually the hunger games aspect comes back and bites us in the ass.
If they offer, take the deal.
This thread could get to a legitimate 1K posts with all the “realignment ” chaos.
It should be called “disalignment” or “unalignment “…
So frustrating when OSU has such a good team…
In 5 days
Clusterfuck. If the end of the world doesn’t happen first and when streaming, pay-to-view is the norm because I don’t care about games in those far-away miserable places like Alabama, this will all seem even more ludicrous than it already is.
Some of the speculators seem to think the ACC is going to implode next and are against the B12 taking any more teams right now but isn’t the ACC buyout huge, and media rights go until 2035? FSU is pissed and saying they will be leaving one way or another. Anyway, Big 12 advocates seem to think there will be better teams to add than OSU, WSU, or SDSU when this implosion happens.
ACC can’t provide pacific time zone teams. That’s what ESPN is looking for. I believe ESPN has the ACC locked up for another 12 years.
Will ESPN be around in 12 years at this rate? I thought Disney/ESPN were having pretty serious financial problems. Would be a form of justice if ESPN were to go under…ha!
They are. They’re CEO basically said ESPN would be going to streaming only some time after 2025.
If they think they can outbid the SEC or the B10 they’re fucking delusional.
And when the next round of consolidation happens, and streaming is the pay model, everyone but the top 30 teams will be cut from the payroll. Anyway you cut it beavs won’t ever be in that tier of teams
““We were literally hours away from a deal that everybody could embrace,” Oregon State athletic director Scott Barnes told The Oregonian. “I’m furious,” he added.”
https://www.sfgate.com/collegesports/article/pac12-hours-away-from-being-saved-18281497.php
This Athletic writer refutes what Scheer said earlier about SDSU/OSU and the Big12.
https://twitter.com/max_olson/status/1688402342087905281?t=DSfs89fQEh8XaeReDfhO4w&s=19
I would not expect any movement on the remaining PAC4 teams until the end of the football season or even basketball season.
That’s gonna suck.
That’s why this season is super important. Winning games may change some minds. That’s basically all we have going for us at this point.
If you look at the viewership numbers I posted above the pac4 schools have a bigger share then 3 of the 4 that left for the big12. And our total viewership is higher overall.
“Conference sources” have been throwing up disinformation for months. That’s why Canzono has been wrong almost at every turn during this whole saga. Why would a school want to confirm what they are doing? For a school like OSU if they have multiple options no way they tip their hand and put 1 in jeopardy.
So much disinformation being thrown out at this point it’s difficult to trust any of these people or their sources. No apologist for clownzano but that dude was trusting his sources and now looks more like the fool than people already gave him credit for. Same could be said for the beavs brain trust…Barnes got caught up in trusting his conference partners, and not palace intrigue, I’m sure his recent medical issues also put him a step behind as well.
Beavs have built a culture of loyalty, hard work, do more with less, and the prima donnas took advantage.
Imagine if you can if Larry had dialed back the hubris a bit and had added Texas and Oklahoma to the PAC12 when the opportunity was there making the league 14 teams. Everything that has transpired would be moot. What could have been!
Who’s to say OU and Texas don’t leave the PAC for SEC money anyways?
Wasn’t usc one of the detractors from the addition of those teams?
I think that’s right.
“Don’t call it conference realignment. Call it college football consolidation. Recent history suggests few are safe from being the next to get squeezed out.
…
The last time college football lost a power conference was right before the Bowl Championship Series was transformed into the College Football Playoff in 2014.
Don’t think it is a coincidence the latest hit came one year before the CFP — and the revenue it creates — expands.
…
It’s interesting that the Big Ten and the SEC have separated themselves, and now it’s the race to who’s going to be third,” said Karl Benson, who oversaw the Western Athletic Conference as it was torn apart by realignment in the late 1990s and 2000s.
The Big 12 was a winner in this round of realignment, but what about next time? It’s already apparent the next match of this survivor series will pit it against the ACC, where Florida State is telling everyone its not happy.”
https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/ncaaf/2023/08/07/column-it-s-not-conference-realignment-it-s-consolidation-and-no-one-is-safe-in-the-dash-for-cash/70540711007/
A hypothetical inside a hypothetical. What if the pac16 would have signed a bigger deal then the SEC? The only truth is that Larry Scott never should have been the commissioner, period.
Some Larry Scott criticisms from very early on.
http://angrybeavs.com/media/8633 (more links in this one)
http://angrybeavs.com/athletics/2771
I think most people were suspicious from the beginning. The guy had zero clout, and came from a tennis background. The only thing that matters is football and they decide to get a tennis guy.
The AD’s are the real losers for hiring people like Scott and GK in the first place and entrusting the future of the conference with them. As the landscape was changing, they brought in guys with old schools skills that didn’t understand how the new media world would work.
This deal is way ahead of its time.
Not sure what you’re looking at. Kids don’t watch TV. But they still watch sports. They just do it on their phones, or they just cast it to their TV.
It’s ridiculously simple, and it’s less expensive to the end consumer, while generating revenue which could be massive, if marketed well. Remember, apple has the rights to this globally. And sports is a generally tolerated product, just about anywhere. apple gifts promotions to international buyers of apple products at about a rolling average of 50 million people and growing.
They were essentially gifting the Pac 12, and they would have revolutionized the industry, before ESPN goes standalone–which will happen as soon as there are less than 50 million cable subscribers. And it looks like they will lean on apple to do that.
Kliavkoff isn’t to blame. Near-sighted money-grubbers are to blame.
It looks like the back-stabbing in the boardroom made the Ides of March look like a petting zoo.
It would be interesting to read the comments to see how people reacted to him. I didn’t get that far. From memory, people thought he’d be good.
I thought he had many great ideas, but I soured on him when none of them came true.
Now that we know what we know, I don’t think it was him.
A few random questions as I adjust to the PAC 4:
How the hell is UCLA relevant? Have tgey been a contender since Troy fucking Aikmen? Do people really tune into watch them because they’re in the LA market? I suppose the idea is people in the LA market will tune in to watch them get trounced by Ohio state?
Multiple “blue bloods” have retained media relevance despite performance: Nebraska, Tenn (only recently performing) UCLA, Texas, as the game is more about media, and advertisers revenue and money than actual competition.
What do viewer demographics mean for the future of college football?
If the NCAA had integrity and valued competition, might there have been something to learn from European soccer leagues, where teams that perform move up a “league” and those that lose move down? I’m not familiar w/soccer, just recall this from a conversation with a friend, so honest question here.
Lanning, he of the one one year tenure, requests to keep a home and home series of one the oldest rivalry games in the country so the Ducks can enjoy a brief respite from their new impending ridiculous travel schedule? Fuck Lanning.
Would loved to see some mocked up social media posts for schools essentially hitting the “transfer portal:” Thanks for the love these past 108 years, that said, the Ducks are taking our talents to the Big10. Peace! -Mullens”
Again, the lack if NCAA and League Commissioner leadership and relevance is astounding. Just out of principle the Beavers ought to sue the NCAA and Scott and the current Commissioner for their incompetence denying OSU opportunity to compete next year. We have seen this coming for at least a decade, how could they not?
This has to be SO distracting for OSU student athletes. Hang in there and focus for one more season and make it a good one.
When i think about it, Smith has actually built a counter-culture culture in his football team. Team first, play together, play your role… guys like Colletto, Martinez..these are not today’s average NCAA football players. Something to be proud of and infuriating that they are being cut out of competitive opportunities.
Go Beavers!
Cade McNown and the year UCLA had to fly all the way across the country after the season, just to play a make up against Miami, and everybody knew they were going to lose, because, duh, travel.
Ucla’s just riding some coattails. It’s all hype, right now. They who beat their chests loudest win. And Ucla doesn’t really care. But they’ll take the money.
Julian is still not practicing.
Ya not good
I forget, is he a corner or safety? Right now Arnold is playing the free safety spot.
Safety
Hmmmmm.
https://syndication.bleacherreport.com/amp/10085372-report-pac-12-pres-asked-if-big-12-could-take-all-of-us-except-oregon-st-wsu.amp.html
Yeah I don’t get that thinking, especially about OSU. I could see WSU and Colorado being targeted, but OSU has been a straight up legit team over the last 20 years.
I’d like to know who it was. Just for reference.
Yeah… it looks like everyone’s on our shit list, except Wazzu?
That doesn’t sound right with the way ASU and Utah were acting.
That is locker room material for every OSU athlete. Barnes ought to be enraged and the presidents should come clean on who that was. Process of elimination would be Cal or ASU. No matter it is all cutthroat and ridiculous to talk at all about unity and loyalty to the conference when such blind backstabbing was happening all along.
Why would Cal or ASU be the ones?
That makes no sense.
The President with the loosest lips and who was known to be in constant contact with the Big 12 was Robbins. He was willing to leave ASU behind, and we don’t know what the result of the meeting was the night before. But Robbins says they were ready to sign on Friday, and then UO and UW happened.
So my list is those three.
Does Kliakof ever go out in public? Just asking for a few pissed off Beavers and Cougs….
If this is, in fact true (and I have no reason to believe that it isn’t), both institutions should be demanding the reasoning behind it-which should also be publicized. How can both these institutions continue to be a part of a conference that would pull a stunt like this??? How can the conference leadership ever again be trusted to do the right thing? I trust none of what is coming out of the PAC12, and now know for certain that whatever they are doing is not benefitting the individual members or the conference itself.
Again, this needs to be addressed publicly by the university leadership, today, and I mean an engaged president along with the AD.
The reasoning is quite clear. That president wanted to make a deal with the Big12, and make the deal more attractive by not including two schools that would be considered extra baggage. Loyalty was not the goal. The goal was to find a stable conference partner at a good price.
This information should/could be used as the basis of a lawsuit against the PAC12. They have acted in an ‘arbitrary and capricious’ manner and not acted in the best interest and, in fact, to the detriment of especially conference members OSU and WSU, to say the least. Who is the PAC12 thinking they have the right to influence who and who won’t get selected by whatever conference, due to their glaring ineptitude?
This is pretty serious shit as money and livelihoods are at risk here. WSU estimates it could lose +$30 million out of it’s athletic budget due the chaos that has transpired. OSU would have to be a similar amount, I’m guessing. There isn’t going to be enough money to fund coaching positions or fund some programs.
Just chatted with a FB coach’s wife, they are VERY concerned with the future.
This coach not interested in moving and has multiple offers prior to this latest news but was trying to be loyal and hoping to finish out his career with Beavs. NIL, the portal and now this may be too much. Strong recruiting class may be in danger and everything they’ve built now in jeopardy.
Basically everything we’ve been concerned about is on the money.
Not sure how the beavs pull this off. Either we find a reasonable landing spot or we need to cut bait and become the University of Chicago
Feel for them, going to be a stressful season the longer the uncertainty goes on, will help a lot of the Beavs ball out and beat Utah to start 5-0.
The worst case-scenario for coaches/staff is if OSU/WSU gets left out of the shuffle and have to join the MWC outright with the rest of the sports being in the WCC. At that point athletic dept budgets collapse to a fraction of what they were, mass exodus of recruits and coaches will follow, and tons of staff layoffs.
A discounted ticket to the B12 is great as they get to stay at the “Power” level, but at a disadvantage and steep discount to the rest of the league with a lot of extra travel time and at the mercy of ESPN. If I’m a coach I’m looking to move up and out of that situation, even if I’m in love with OSU and staff.
If the P12-MWC-AAC merger scenario plays out, it could be pretty underwhelming from a conference branding standpoint, but in terms of department stability and coaching/staff retention it could be the best solution if Apple can come up with the $ to keep the dept budgets near where they are now with room to grow as at the dust settles with a new conference/brand/media model.
It’s a total crapshoot, and as frustrating as it is for fans, it must absolutely suck for the coaches, players, and their families that are trying to prepare for a season that starts in just three weeks.
Does anyone know if the pac12 network has a say in TV scheduling? If so hopefully they can schedule the pac4 schools in prime slots and make the rest of the schools play the late games.
Can OSU admin decide to dip into general fund endowment billions to keep the coaches in place?
If the Beavs get a Big 12 invite, I’m not even sure if it is worth it. It will be for a very reduced share and they undoubtedly will get buried at 7:30 pm kickoffs for basically all home games and that undoubtedly will hurt tv ratings and they’ll use that as an excuse to boot them later on. I’d rather they add teams from the MWC and AAC if possible and bet on themselves. They would get significantly better time slots and if they’re a top 15 team, people are gonna watch them even on apple when the majority of their games aren’t ending at 11 pm. Beavs are getting a lot of attention now as an underdog and got a chance to really build a brand as a team left for dead by their conference and challenging teams who straight up disrespected them for years. Begging for a Big 12 offer when that league really doesn’t care about them at all and will no doubt not try and promote them just seems like a move that will backfire.
Plus, I’d much rather go to a road game in San Diego and New Orleans than 95% of Big 12 cities
I think you
The reduced Big12 share is probably the same $$ as they get now so they’d at least be able to keep the doors open. Some MWC/Apple mishmash will pay pennies and that would be the end.
As far as late start times, the other teams in the B12 would have those same start times playing at Reser. I don’t think there’s any getting away from it at this point, and the Beavs would have to keep playing at a high level to rise to the top.
The network is not the issue for me personally. I’ll find a way to watch the Beavs where ever they are shown or on wheresoever network is broadcasting them. The issue is keeping coaching, recruiting and keeping the momentum going. Going to a lesser league or even creating a lessor league will open the floodgates to transferring out with lower talent coming in.
I think you take the invite. Money is the only way to stay competitive now. Your going to take a hit anyway you go but at least you have the chance to move up and make more money in the b12.
We can all sit here and say fuck the money but that leads to us being a badminton school instead of a football/baseball/wbb school.
What invite?
If you GET an invite is what I’m saying.
Agree – but Barnes isn’t capable of doing anything innovative or inspiring. Doing something behind closed doors isn’t helpful. It occurs to me that Barnes, with his recent health scare, needs job protection unless he has private insurance. And Murthy – who knows what she’s doing? I love the “idea of betting on themselves,” creating a culture, going w apple streaming, afternoon games with real tailgating. If people want to stream the Beavs, it would be a choice not just waiting for the leftovers. Do SOMETHING! As for GK, he seems once again to have nothing to say. The only thing I can think of for me to do is donate what I can, token though it may be to the NILor athletic dept.
That was in reply to cautiously optimistic
Barnes doesn’t really have much to do with the decision. I’m sure he’s asked for some input on some things, but it’s not his decision.
“Beavs are getting a lot of attention now as an underdog and got a chance to really build a brand as a team left for dead by their conference and challenging teams who straight up disrespected them for years.”
This inadequate narrative to sustain resources. A school needs to be in a decent+ Tv market (UW, 4 corner schools) or have a major donor like Knight or Pickens at Okie State.
I suspect that NVIDIA CEO/OSU alumni could play the mega donor role, but he has other things on his mind besides Beaver sports.
Barnes moment of truth will be terminating the Civil War. Go get paid by an SEC opponent. Barnes keeps that game then he should be the next to go.
Will that be up him?
Get everyone on board to terminate it. Why continue that game? Its a massive favor to UofO
Beavs #18 in the pre-season coaches poll.
Headline: “WCC with first team ever to start season ranked in top 25”
WCC? As in West Coast Conference? Yeah, they do need to get off their asses and add football back. I believe Gonzaga played major college football up until 1941 and St.Mary’s until 1950. Stop resting on your basketball laurels and add something to the chaos!
THIS is their time! They add the pac-4 and they have a top 25 team. Duh?
Well, the Beavs killed the Zags 33-6 in their last meeting back in ’35 (I remember it well).
Updates from @MHver3:
“PAC4 had preliminary talks with MWC about merging. Stanford said they would not be a part of said merger as did Cal. ORST and WSU may be left with all assets and rights of the PAC. Meeting with Apple that was to follow to discuss expansion did not occur.”
“Stanford has declined joining B12. SDSU is next up for vetting and first choice if B12 continues all sports western expansion.”
“ESPN has signaled that they may want B12 to hold tight on decision but could continue to vet schools and come back with a proposal.”
“Meanwhile hearing rumblings that the ACC GOR may indeed be getting its first test as FSU (and possibly Clemson) are indeed close to leaving the conference for the SEC (who isn’t going to sit by and let B10 go to 18 without matching).”
“ACC Midnight is approaching. Start the clock. 10 minutes until ACCMidnight.”
“PAC2 additions may be a pre-fill option by ACC schools to offset losing their two biggest brands.”
If Apple doesn’t want to PAY and bring OSU/WSU, MWC, and AAC together up to the relative universe of the former P12 offer, then just yield and let the ACC die and put all former P5 teams in either the B1G, B12, or SEC. It’s fine, it’ll all fall apart when the linear TV bubble crashes anyway.
Yeah, I just heard some of the ACC expansion discussion on College Sports Radio. ACC is the only P-5 conference at risk, but who knows how far off in the future that will be? In theory not until 2035, but FSU is certainly bitching and moaning right now. As I understand, FSU has until August 15th to file an “intent to leave”, but that doesn’t mean anything if they don’t have the buy-out funds which will supposedly be astronomical.
Doesn’t make a lot of sense to only add OSU and Wazzu to the ACC. Seems like there is enough academic hegemony to attract Cal/Stanford to a west coast pod, but it seems to be one big speculation game right now which makes for ready-made sports talk content.
One thing to keep in mind is this guy has no sources and just is throwing shit against the wall and seeing if it sticks. He makes it just vague enough to claim he wasn’t wrong. ESPN wants west coast teams to fill their late slot and Cal and Stanford appear headed to the ACC and would take that slot: I think that pretty much kills any Oregon State to the Big 12 chances. It’s looking real bleak.
Just passing along the gossip for those that don’t want to be on X (twitter), grains of salt included.
He’s not been 100% but the last 4 days or so he’s been pretty solid.
Any chance the state of Oregon passes something in legislature to keep the sports program funded?
Don’t think the Ducks need to be funded.
181 million in the hole right now. They’re in the top 20 of d1 schools in the red.
How many of the top 20 schools are in the SEC and the B10 (now and in ’24)?
I suspect the number is high?
I think 5 of the 20 are pac12.
I’d have dig the list back, it was actually on a duck sight.
Cal was the highest
None
None
What good is a billion dollar endowment if it
can’t be touched to help the athletics department survive in such an uncharted territory as this has become?
Can’t agree with you more. I lost count of the emails I got from OSU during the plandemic trying to get me to give money so some poor student could continue to attend the university under such trying times, all the while the university is sitting on a billion large. If the university is waiting for a rainy day to spend the money, they won’t have to wait long, as Corvallis gets plenty of rain; it’s a virtual deluge right now!
Ask Harry Reems…
Brett McMurphy also indicating that Stanford/Cal are likely ACC bound. Conflicting reports on whether Big 12 is done expanding but if those 2 go to ACC then it gives ESPN a Westcoast spot which would then make sense that the Big 12 wouldn’t need to absorb any of the Pac 4 to satisfy ESPN west coast problems. It’s very real situation with WSU/OSU as the Pac 2. Lol. What the fuck is going on here.
The 2 teams with the least support from fans, viewers and poor records, not to mention the travel cross country with no other west coast partners?
Good. Hope they do it. Sounds genius.
ASU, Colorado (maybe not now) and Arizona have half the viewership and I’m betting over the last few years haven’t sold out a game.
Colorado sucked for several years before they jumped to the Pac.
So there’s that.
Called it a decade ago. It’s amazing it took this long. OSU sat on their laurels until the Smith era. That was so much lost time.
Might as well go independent and schedule blood baths all over the Country. Could attract competitive recruits, and you’re not tied to big cable (dying, which is why they need to keep absorbing conferences for now; only growth they can find). Could sell your product ala carte on your own site via own production team, etc.
Not a bad idea except putting a schedule together would be a challenge being that most teams already have their non conference schedules already booked a few years out.
2024 would be a problem, but not impossible. We’ve got three games scheduled and three with the outcasts. Some teams looking for games are:
Rutgers
Kansas State
Houston
Army
UConn
UTSA
That’s a solid schedule.
My guess: Barnes doesn’t know that and if he did he wdn’t pursue it.
who are you?
Wait… we had laurels?
A Laurel and Hardy hand shake on the way out the door.
Laurels were a sign of triumph, not sure that applies to this situation
Does that mean that as the 2 remaining PAC12 schools that they get to divide the $400 million conference war chest and call it?
It sounds like the clock is running out on the Beavs and we will soon be swallowing a Mountain West reality.
Aka freed up Saturdays.
I’ll stream it in my iPod.
LOL, just in time to give an opinion on conference realignment.
https://www.si.com/.amp/college/2023/08/07/ncaa-conference-realignment-charlie-baker-statement
This is interesting. It’s my long term thesis for big cable. The problem is it’s going to take a while, probably another 5 to 10 years. Maybe on the shorter side. The desperation and swiftness this latest move says things are really bad for big cable.
https://www.americanbanker.com/news/banks-usually-hungry-for-growth-are-now-looking-to-shrink
Speaking of cable, if you want to send a message cut the cord and call them up to tell them why.
The whole concept of school A located in a big tv market guarantees viewers is about as antiquated as a Model T Ford.
In addition, anyone with a brain and a bit of historical context should expect and realize the cyclical nature of college sports for every school.
Also, rabid fan bases don’t mean victories anymore than passive fanbases.
Recruiting rankings are always subjective and biased based on where the kids sign or who is recruiting him. Hence, team rosters and preseason rankings tend to be based off of roster makeup, also subjunctive. It becomes a circular argument to say any team deserves a high ranking based on great recruiting classes over several years and a rabid fan base. It is all a charade that provides cover for these media corporations to kill amateur sports in order to shield themselves for a little while longer from lying the upper for poor financial decisions and attempting to turn college athletics into another pro league.
I like the idea of OSU
1) claiming their share of the conferences $400 mil as a parting gift,
2) sue the conference administrators, and sue other schools for their backstabbing shenanigans,
3) go independent in football
4) hold the Civil War as a huge bargaining chip to excise some monetary revenge on the Ducks,
5) don’t schedule any former PAC12 schools an easy close non conference game without exacting a huge payout
6)only accept home games for football
7)never play road games at former PAC12 schools again
8) see if Apple would be willing to kick in $15 mil/year to be the test run of their PAC12 presentation as an independent
9) create a mass marketing strategy right now to capitalize on the obvious injustice of the last few weeks, reach new fans who want to see Beavs win and upset the espn/Fox monolith
10) use the billion dollar endowment to float coaches salaries in all sports for 2 years to get to the next wave of realignment
11) solicit NVidia and other deep pocket alums for immediate NIL support to retain current student athletes
12) win the conference and playoffs this year
13) fire Barnes
14) ask Tinkle to leave the money on the table and walk away
15) get creative with how to generate funding apart from tv dollars and guaranteed conference contracts
16) be fiscally responsible now that facilities are elite and in great condition
17) promote OSU rather than apologize for it
18) don’t go begging for a spot from Big12 or Big10
19) don’t link with ACC, AAC, MAC, or any conference east of Mississippi River
20) use the travel load for former PAC2 schools as a weapon, recruit kids who are smart enough to realize what that kind of travel will do to them over 4 years and help them want to avoid it
21) learn to think and plan as an independent program rather than following as part of a group
I’ll probably have some more later but that is a good start.
Align with the WCC for all sports other than football. Better basketball and baseball conference and travel is similar to the original PAC 10.
I like it, especially, 9 and 17. Beavs are a STORY now, and there’s nothing more powerful than a great story. This year could start making us a national brand. If we can survive the next couple years financially, we can up-yours the college football money establishment.
“We play intelligent and relentless team football, and we recruit for that. Come be part of the story.”
#13 – Murthy is too bewildered to know she can fire him. My guess: she’s relying on him.
# 15 Creative?
who are you?
Good article with Chris Peterson and Brock Huard about how this started and the warning signs. Nobody acted, They just let it happen.
https://sports.mynorthwest.com/1763194/brock-huard-chris-petersen-meeting-hinted-fate-pac-12/
Still extremely thankful to the football gods that Oregon passed up on hiring Chris Petersen in 2013.
Incoming football commit tonight, according to BeaverBlitz.
New crystal ball from Huffman today for local guy Eddie Freauff, WR/Ath from Prineville.
We offered him last week
https://247sports.com/Player/eddie-freauff-46140553/
Coach smith bay signal
WSU president said he was “shocked” when UW and UO went to the big ten. Similar to what has come from Oregon State. I’m guessing that Oregon and UW gave their word the night before that they were in and that’s why there was “optimism”. I’m betting Oregon was the one who suggested they all go to the Big 12 except OSU and WSU cause they weren’t sure the Big Ten was gonna offer and Stanford wasn’t gonna go along with it. Feels like UO just wanted to get rid of OSU and WSU at all costs and knew the only way was to leave the conference and then the Big Ten offered and they were out the door. It was a money move but also a way to screw their rival and two teams they felt they were “carrying.” The fact that they backed out at literally the last minute captures how cowardly they were during the whole process. Beavers should 100% never schedule them again in any sport.
eh… we’ll find out who it is
No need to get over our skis about it. We have other issues, at the moment.
Eggers on a roll, pieces on Raegan Beers and the Beavs athletic equipment manager. Good stuff.
This from Beers, “I really liked Baylor with Kim Mulkey,” she says. “I liked Texas and Oklahoma. But in the end, the culture at Oregon State drew me here. And I wanted to go Pac-12, because it’s a great conference.”
Yeah, “it’s a great conference”, sad.
https://www.kerryeggers.com/stories
I know this is thinking corporate money is the answer, but I’m asking it more as a question.
Let’s say a school like OSU goes the independent route and gets bankrolled by a sugar daddy like Jensen Huang/Nvidia.
How much of a bank roll is that asking? Are we talking somewhere in that $30-40M range that makes OSU’s income similar to that of a Big12 media deal?
And how much is that exposure worth to a company like Nvidia if an OSU is consistently being mentioned in the news as this rag tag program that was left for dead, but has independently built itself into a title contender with the NCAA blue bloods?
I’m thinking like how much does Nike benefit from being mentioned as the “Oregon” team?
There has to be some trade off where the donations are also viewed as an investment.
Maybe OSU should become the Oregon State Nvidia Beavers and totally sell out. Win the national title, Jensen Huang gets his company even more exposure and air time every time OSU plays. Like an athiest version of BYU or Notre Dame, where instead of Touchdown Jesus, it’s Touchdown Huang?
It’s decent. At least Nvidia is innovating. Big cable is just absorbing what it can to stay afloat, destroying everything good in its path. It’s this final, massive death that we all have to endure because they don’t know how to innovate and give customers what they actually want. Really pathetic. Nvidia is going to be enormous in not only AI, but quantum computing, etc. These are the good companies, not the dying dinosaurs.
Big difference in the football fans connection to nike vs Nvidia. Name recognition translates to the bottom line much more directly in the case of sneakers.
OT: Sadly, that name recognition does turn into purchases of nike shoes. Putting the buyers in the same camp as those who buy the “green energy” line; in either case no regard for the exploitation of kids and/or slave labor……Asia for sneakers and solar panels vs Africa for the cobalt, etc in batteries/solar panels.
Meant in response to nicebeaver just above.
I kind of disagree with that. Every kid through college student knows Nvidia. It’s in every gaming console, computing device, etc that they use. They actively search for consoles and rigs that use Nvidia chips because they are so cutting edge. It’s way more important than a shoe, in their day to day lives.
Ya gonna stack up the number of college kids who will actually purchase new consoles against the adults/college kids/little kids who will buy multiple sneakers and clothes just for the swoosh?
Yeah it’s a weird comparison due to cost structure of the products. But NVDA is a 1.2 trillion dollar company with obviously huge margins, whereas Nike is a 170 billion dollar company that deals on volume. NVDA is ~10x bigger as a company, and that’s going to double if not triple from here just due to tailwinds in computing. But either way, every kid knows both. Everyone age 15-55 knows both. They all have consoles, computers, etc and actively seek out dedicated Nvidia GPUs. It’s a product way more important and innovative than a shoe.
I don’t think people understood what having the $3 tril entity called apple having their back meant.
It’s unfortunate the people making these decisions are really old and have no concept of technology and where it’s going.
You lookin’ my way?…………lol
How can we run from our AI overlords if we don’t have shoes?
Lol @ both those comments. Nice.
Not only is Nvidia’s product something that is consumed increasingly by the demographic that watches college athletics, but also we know how many degenerate gamblers are fans of college athletics. Imagine the boost $NVDA could get from casual investors who keep hearing that name dropped throughout broadcasts. Not that big investors dont already know about NVDA’s track record, but the bigger pool of casual investors can only help performance.
LULZ…from the tweets
MHver3
@MHver3
There are also fears around certain studios that a lawsuit could emerge. If that happens said studios would like to quietly find a P5 home for the remaining Pac4.
I wouldn’t mind seeing some ligation from the Beavs camp. Have there been other solid/historic Power 5’s who have been demoted against their will through realignment since P-5/Group of 5 became a thing?
Eye-roll. Fans get a bomb dropped on them. The president tells them it is ‘serious’ and the AD says he is ‘furious’.
Furious and Serious – a new franchise. Nothing is going to happen -Kliadumkopf is going to get paid, in part, with OSU money for doing nothing. The athletic department is going to meekly go off to the Mountain West and the civil war game will be played.
who are you?
Commit is WR Eddie Freauff from Prineville. Not many offers, Portland state and Colorado state but local kid, and more importantly, 6’4, 207 lbs per his Twitter handle.
this kid is good
like… savant good
Also from MHver3
“I will say that never have I seen such a steady flow of information coming in from all angles. Sifting though it all is daunting. Things are changing by the hour it seems. This is a dog eat dog 1upsmanship game being played. At some point you would hope some type of regulation happens.”
The NCAA abandoned that duty long ago. This is what happens when TV networks are in charge. The whole thing makes absolutely no sense and it shows how greedy the universities and the TV networks really are. They are going to kill the goose that lays the golden eggs to have 1 nice goose dinner.
sounds like a hacker, at this point
There are a lot of ifs involved with going independent:
If we can schedule good teams/games
If we can continue to build the program and if we can recruit
If we can win
I love my Beavs but we are not Alabama or Ohio State. We are a small fish in the pond now facing a monopoly in college sports. Move on from independent thought. It is suicide.
I still think OSU’s best bet is Big12. They’d still be playing with name brand schools, have access to good recruiting areas, and would probably keep our coaching staff in place because still in the game.
Based on the comments/diagnostics/ideas/information presented on just the past 2 threads, OSU should disband the ADs office, fire Barnes and contract out all major decisions to the angrybeavs collective consciousness association. Angry no longer needs a press pass, he has the mic, podium and pen!
wtf, man?
If the studios fear lawsuits, then by all means begin the paperwork, and don’t let them place you into an unwanted conference like your the unwanted step child and hope it all goes away.
Again, Barnes is silent publicly and begging behind closed doors for someone to throw a life preserver. I’d prefer he have a furious press conference, demand restitution publicly and call out the backstabbed by name and by school. Give a true account of the conversations, lies and treachery for all to see.
As long as everyone declares “we had no choice”, they sound like victims when in reality they have done the deed.
And is Kliakoff even alive? He gives a presentation 6 days ago, within 3 days the conference is destroyed and within 6 days it’s down to 2… and not a word from the conference leadership. A bunch Ogden treacherous snakes or cowards on all sides bowing down to TV execs who will be fired within 3 years too. Cable tv is dying and these tv execs are trying to coverup the real numbers by destroying college football for some high viewership prizes but it won’t last long enough to right the collective ship. Streaming is obviously the future and espn has had its day. The question remains whether Apple is the vehicle into the next tech advancement for viewers to watch sports in general.
And has anyone actually considered the student athletes in any of these insane decisions?
Bravo
I would hope our OSU leadership has already been discussing options with lawyers. At this point there has got to be a lawsuit that would be in our favor. In the business world it is part of doing business. Big media has turned college football into big business so come boyz get down to business!
They are, go Beavs
It’s a trust suit wrapped in a trust suit.
Would OSU attorneys work for tge university but have a link to Oregon DOJ?
Seems like they’d want to protect the state’s interests….
Was the financing and debt payoff plan for Reser upgrade based on some projection of attendance revenue based on playing in PAC league? Seems like it would have been?
Maybe here’s where state elected officials have some power…one from Albany already weighed in maybe she would like to get some face time grilling fuckos from fox and ESPN on how their business model works and how they colluded to devalue a state owned school
1) No, no one is considering student athletes.
2) No, no way Barnes and the new pres will push for legal action; much less risk to themselves personally to play the outraged victim. Sad.
Barnes doesn’t have anything to do with the legalities of this.
Stop that.
I’m seeing the Stanford/Cal to ACC is a trigger to renegotiate the ACC media deal, which would somehow increase the value from $40mil per school up to $70mil per school? I’d say the fix is in everywhere and this is how they get FSU and Clemson into SEC.
So a PAC12 conference that can’t get more than $20 mil per school, but sends 2 of its least followed programs with bottom dweller football (currently) to a conference 3,000 miles east and suddenly those schools bump that conference number by $30 mil per school? I don’t buy the math, or the storyline.
It allows FSU and Clemson to get out of an ironclad GOR, and backfills 3 spots while paying off everyone else to stay put.
So the question then is which presidents and ADs are recently loaded down by big bags of cash to pull this kind of brazen stunt?
That makes no sense.
If putting Cali into the ACC contract triggers escalators that make the ACC payouts as ridiculous as the Big Ten, why in the world would FSU and Clemson leave?
They just got what they wanted.
^ this
Something is seriously fishy.
Anyone else remember the ESPN pac-12 broadcasts that were put together in the last few years that could’ve been done by 4 year olds with only 2 cameras?
Doesn’t take a rocket surgeon to see what’s going on.
The ones where the broadcasters called the games from their basements? Those were especially bad.
JS is now following @MHver3 on X (twitter).
Just sayin, lol.
I think dude’s a hacker.
I hope so. That means his info is legit.
PAC has #18 (OSU), #15 (UO), #14 (Utah), #11 (UW), and #6 (USC) in preseason poll, each with compelling QBs, and its falling apart….what a failure of Commissioners and ADs…
UCLA is “others receiving votes” and #31…
“18. Oregon State (10-3)
Points: 365. Previous ranking: 17. Opens: Sept. 3 at San Jose State
The Beavers had their first 10-win campaign in 16 years and bring in Clemson transfer quarterback D.J. Uiagalelei to juice up an offense that was solid but not spectacular last season. Expect a big jump in production with a veteran offensive line able to protect Uiagalelei, and his running ability adding a boost to the ground attack that has sophomore Damien Martinez leading the way. The defense led the Pac-12 in yards allowed but returns several important pieces. If the group can maintain its high standards, don’t be surprised if Oregon State is pushing for a conference championship.”
“…but returns?”
https://www.usatoday.com/sports/ncaaf/polls/coaches-poll/2023-2024/2023-08-07/
This shit sucks.
Hi Angry. I am also angry today. Seen a lot of shit talking from people across the country today. My sentiments to everyone else today is the double deuce.
Yep we all feel like ponds in a rich man’s game.
Tamponds?
Hey there was a commitment tonight! WR out of Prineville, OR.
Tweeted by Oregon State associate men’s basketball coach Eric Reveno:
In the past five seasons, only four schools have played in the College World Series, reached the Elite Eight of the NCAA men’s basketball tournament and finished with a 10-win football season: Texas, Michigan, Auburn and Oregon State.
My earlier theory that Stanford & Cal would want to go high end academic association (ACC: Duke, UNC, UVA) seems to have been vindicated. One good thing with that: Trish Vandeveer will finally have to work for a title.
To parlay a theme that Angry and Jack have been touting (the demise of cable and the prospective value of the Apple deal long term): it would seem that few if any of the departing presidents eager for “linear exposure” (sidebar: where the hell did that phrase come from?) seem to realize that the current cable centric deals are dinosaurs–never to be replicated. If they spent more time reading the Wall Street Journal and less the Chronicle of Higher Education, they would know that cable is bleeding so much viewership that Disney is shopping ESPN. To make matters worse, Apple is the likeliest home for the death star of college football.
One thing I don’t want to hear any more from the pundit class and especially those clowns on GameDay when it starts up next month is their crocodile tear-like sentiments about how sad the fate of OSU and WSU is. It was their constant harping about the need to for a play off and then a bigger playoff that trip wired this whole dynamic.
Spot on!
What ever happened with Amazon’s negotiations?
It wasnt that long ago we were talking about Prime being the clubhouse leader to pick up the Pac12 media rights.
Now I never hear them mentioned.
both Apple and Amazon will get into college football when the next media deals are negotiated. SEC will cash in even more.
Apple’s deal to the PAC12 is what a rabid college football fan would want. There’s just not enough on the west coast.
Fuck those guys don’t let anything play out longer then 3 seasons before canceling it.
Have we ever had 2 threads hit 1000 plus posts in less than a week?
In 5 days no less!
Reliable info?
@jjfuller72
“Interesting post-mortem on the Pac-12 media deal saga by Ourand of SBJ
Summary of media offers from this & other sources:
1) Amazon:
“Never submitted a bid”
2) NBC:
“Never submitted a bid.” This despite the Pac-12 approaching them 3 different times per Ross Dellenger. Hey! “No means No,” right? ?
3) Fox:
$3.5-4M/team AAV for “13 B-package football games per yr” (likely late windows FS1 content)
4) CBS:
only recent offer was for 5 total Basketball games per year; no bid amount given.
5) ESPN:
-recent offer: “small bid for Pac-12 rights” (this has been widely rumored to be $9M/team AAV for the Tier 1 content)
-original ESPN offer, during the exclusive negotiating window over a yr ago, was a “significant package.” Others described this as “the same deal the Big12 later accepted”… I assume this is the ~$20M AAV/team that ESPN will paying the Big12. Fox would have likely paid for FB/BB content as well, but since their inventory is more BB-heavy, I doubt Fox would have paid the $11.7M AAV to the Pac-12 that they are paying the Big12 who offers better BB brands & more inventory. I’d assume any combined offer would have been around $27-8M/yr, but was Fox or the Pac-12 themselves not willing to “play ball” with one another from the start? Was the relationship too damaged due to Fox being viewed as complicit with the B1G’s poaching of USC/UCLA, and swooning over Ore/UW?
6) CW:
Not mentioned in article but had been in negotiations/discussions at least once. Unclear if they submitted a bid.
7) AppleTV+:
$23M/team AAV with all streaming content (no linear) but subscription incentives to boost payouts beyond that baseline
This last one was the best they could do, was presented to the presidents last week, and was the straw that finally broke the camel’s back.
Anything else I missed folks?”
According to the Brock Huard and Chris Petersen interview, the Pac12 showed a lot of “hubris” in negotiations with Fox and ESPN, so I have to assume it was the Pac12 that wouldn’t play ball. They shot themselves in the head.
Anyone know why there was a lack of interest from Amazon? Seems like with the new Thursday night football on Prime they would want to further expand viewership among football fans. Pac on Prime could’ve been a nice complimentary package for football fans who bought prime for Thursday night football. Also would help Amazon continue to experiment and develop their broadcasting teams and live analytic aspects of primes new live sports model they have been trying to capture. Seems like there should’ve at least been some major discussions. Like did we even approach them with a pitch?
My assessment:
PAC12 refused to poach or merge with Big12 as suggested by Fox/ESPN 2 years ago when Texas & Oklahoma departed for SEC.
ESPN and Fox then renegotiated a media deal with Big12 as a sweetheart upfront deal, with the full intention to shut out PAC12 in upcoming media rights negotiations.
Kliakoff wasn’t able to get traction and could not land another option in the existing cable tv model.
In addition, timing of the economic downturn squeezed any other media options and increased pressure.
Kliakoff was desperate behind the scenes and everyone knew it and as good negotiators do, they lowered their offers, which only compounded GK’s problems.
New tech and a line of hope in the form of Apple but too little too late and an overall lack of vision or trust doomed the conference leadership.
Once the PAC12 goose was cooked, ESPN/Fox added bounty money to go poach PAC12 teams to increase from 12 to 16.
It was always going to be either Big12 implodes or PAc12 implodes and it was planned to happen before the playoffs expanded to 12 by the power brokers of the blue blood programs and the media execs for easier control of the playoff cash machine.
Antitrust laws, media corporations running conferences and dictating terms of expansion seem very much outside of their world of business.
When STAN/CAL save the ACC it will leave OSU/WSU holding all of the PAC’s “assets” and then they can “merge” with B12 just like ESPN/FOX wanted.
If OSU and WSU are the final 2, whar happens to this “war chest” we’ve been hearing about when they also leave? Does Kliavkoff get it all?
Evil Genius!
Dividend to all former students? Lol.
Those idiots probably invested it all in FTX.
So…anything interesting happening in Fall camp…?
Daschel did have a positive comment about the passing game the other day, which seemed notable since he rarely goes out of his way to say something positive in that manner.
https://twitter.com/nickdaschel/status/1688402292519895041?t=mtWbBIZfRv7P4VaxY2pTSQ&s=19
Not too much. It’s still really early. But the few highlights so far.
DJU has been looking better and more comfortable than in the spring.
Pass rush continues to look much improved.
Chiles hasn’t looked as good as in the spring.
Ben threw a couple of picks in one of the practices.
Hodgins picked a screen pass that could’ve been a TD if it wasn’t blown dead.
Julian still isn’t completely cleared.
Sounds like Hodgins might be playing some fullback this year. Similar to his dad on the St Louis Rams back in the day.
His dad also played fullback at SJSU, so I’m somewhat expecting some talk on the broadcast about that connection when we play them in week 1
If it’s like every other year, probably something like this:
-Defense is ahead of the offense at this point
-An unexpected player on defense is looking good
-One player made a surprising position change
-We suffered a brutal season-ending injury that will require an untested player to step up
-Kicking game looks questionable
Pretty much nailed it. Might need to add “QB won’t be decided till the final week”
We’re ahead of schedule then with 2 season ending injuries to Thomas and Brewer. With no changes to the kicking game you can rest assured that’s its trash. Cord Shaw has been mentioned as someone who will either get run time at RB or is already 2 ways since he did play RB in high school. Not sure about the unexpected player on defense but Beav Blitz did mention that freshman Isaiah Chisom is easily able to play from a physical standpoint but whether that also means he’s been getting reps, I don’t recall them saying.
Life of a Duck?
https://www.si.com/fannation/college/cfb-hq/ncaa-football/oregon-chair-golf-course-big-ten-football-realignment-vote
So a lot of quality thought went into the decision. That’s comforting.
Talked with a neighbor last night who is pretty well politically coonected. He indicated that congress is starting to look at opening up an investigation into recinding the NCAA’s tax exempt status; people in high places aren’t happy about what is going on and many are alumni of the various uiniversities involved. However, one caveat, if congress does get involved, you can be sure that, whatever the solution, it is bound to be worse than the initial problem.
I wouldn’t mind dropping a Congress bomb on college football, right about now.
I’m sort of giggling at the possibilities.
The ncaa is clueless as to the goings on within the conferences by choice. I think they know if they start digging the SEC and Big10 could move forward without them.
Let them go.
We’ll all be better off for it.
If OSU/WSU are left holding all the assets, wouldn’t the Pac name, Pac network and bowl tie ins be assets to negotiate your way into a conference you want to be in? I mean if you want into the Big12, since ESPN is in control anyway and the Pac12 network going to an Apple is another risk to them, don’t you have some leverage for a full share, ESPN gets the network and Big 12 gets the bowl tie ins and the rights to the Pac 12 name? I don’t know what value those things have, but seems they have more negotiating power if just the two of them are in control of all those assets.
Perhaps the CFP expansion will take those assets away?
If not, i like the thinking there.
Don’t think it works like that as the Pac would cease to exist and thus nothing related to it moves to wherever the last Pac school ends up at. They would keep that stuff if they kept the Pac conference and added schools to it however, that doesn’t seem super viable as there’s likely exit fees to pay and to be honest, it’s a shit ton of schools you’d need to add either from mtn west, aac, etc. Also, there’s no way adding schools from those 2 conferences keeps that auto bid and what not as it wouldn’t be a power 5 conference anymore. It’s looking like the only legitimate shot for relevancy relies on the Big 12 and how much ESPN wants the media rights into west coast if it can’t get that via the ACC.
The network as an asset does not cease to exist, and a merger vs just adding the teams, would give the Big 12 the bowl contracts and use of the Pac name. Again the Big 12 may figure they can pick up the bowls they want anyway, and they may not care about the name, hence why I said I don’t know how much value the have. It seems the Pac network, including studios and such, would have value to Fox/ESPN if nothing else to keep others from buying it. Since they are the ones deciding who gets in anyway, that is where it becomes a bargaining chip.
That part is a huge grey area for me. Canzano had mentioned that the remaining 4 Power conferences could have a 3 out of 4 vote to basically tell the Pac they are no longer part of the Power conferences.
What kind of messed up system is that where the ones who stand to lose anything are also the ones who vote who gets to stay?
Of course they’re just going to keep reducing the number of total conferences by merging the haves and purging the have nots. There’s no way to prevent it from happening. You’ll get to the point where only 2 conferences exist because the majority voted the other ones out, so those 2 conferences will reap the vast majority of the bowl money benefits.
I believe there are already preliminary talks taking place on going from Auto 5 to Auto 4. Not sure what all that would require, perhaps just ESPN or Fox telling people what to do, but this might he out of our control even before the Pac does stay a name. This was to he expected though as there’s no way in hell a Pac 4 with 6-8 teams from the mountain west or AAC stays a power conference. As much as they should grandfather this based on the bullshit that’s taken place its not reality
Need four schools to keep the Pac together, in order to merge, restructure, or whatever and keep all transferrable assets intact, as I understand it. And then the NCAA mandates at least seven multi-sport D1 schools to make a viable conference.
And with the revenue requirements for three of the remaining four, it will likely take a hail mary to come out together.
I don’t know if he’s the right guy to ask or not. The message is right though.
https://www.al.com/sports/2023/08/dear-sen-tommy-tuberville-please-save-college-sports-from-the-real-goons.html?outputType=amp
College sports has turned into free-market capitalism. The NCAA was meant to regulate this shit, but they were never given enough power. I’m not sure there’s any way to reverse course now. College football is now a pro sport.
They lost the battle long ago, out of laziness and short term greed. Was easy to just get “rich.”
I think when you have an in-demand product (game), you have to own more of the transaction with the distributor (networks), not just give them all the power.
If it was a free market, everyone would be able to participate in it, if they wanted.
Cartelism is not a free market.
Apparently there was no vote on anything by the ACC meeting this morning. I guess that’s good? If it’s delayed or losing some steam perhaps that reignites the SDSU and OSU to Big 12. Perhaps ACC slow playing to do their due diligence however, these schools need to do something fast from a recruiting standpoint.
Hell, even OLive passes on the “Root for Oregon State” mantra as the counter to greed:
https://www.oregonlive.com/collegefootball/2023/08/pac-12-realignment-fallout-is-it-time-to-root-for-oregon-state-football-as-college-sports-hits-point-of-no-return-and-descends-into-soulless-spiral.html
OSU and JS. Counter-culture…ha! Love it.
You don’t have to be rude or obnoxious to be counter-culture to NCAA football, just have a plan, establish your own culture, and be good and competitive. The powers that be hate real and distributed competition, doesn’t fit their product narrative and audience footprint.
Smith had a plan and the discipline to follow it, too bad the PAC didn’t.
I hope the “Root for Oregon State” gets some legs and media attention. “ROS!”
You see this TCU lineman, Brione Ramsey-Brooks? 6’5, 455 pounds. That’s like two linemen in one. He’s probably going to die, unfortunately, in that Texas heat.
ESPN validates our underdoggedness. Hooray!
https://www.espn.com/chalk/story/_/id/38152934/college-football-betting-win-totals-picks-heisman-trophy-race-2023-24?platform=amp
This is sarcasm btw.
Is there any confirmation of this “inheriting the conference war chest” rumor, or is it just speculation?
I believe the 400+ million belongs to all the current conference members. I have seen where there is a 100 million “emergency” fund. I am guessing those dollars that will get split up by those who are left behind.
MHver3 is also reporting this morning that by next week they (whoever “they” is) will move to make the P5 the P4 for the college football playoff distribution. This gives the remaining PAC teams zero leverage to rebuild the conference. It’s time to call the lawyers and start suing the TV Networks, other conferences, other universities involved in this collision scheme.
That’s what I was mentioning above. From something that Canzano wrote, it sounds like the other 4 Power Conferences can simply for 3 out of 4 to have the Pac12 conference be stripped of it’s Power Conference status.
Such a fucked up system. Of course they will vote them out. It’s one less conference receiving automatic playoff spots. Why would they give any of that up?
So I wonder how long till it’s a 2 out of 3 vote to remove the ACC? I’d imagine it happens right around the time FSU/MIAMI/CLEMSON get their chance to escape to the SEC.
Guess what Big12…..your days are numbered.
When asked if he wd resign Kliadumkopf said no because he was “loyal to a fault.” I suspect his loyalty is with the 3.5 million/annum. His contract ends in 2 years. How does that work if there is no Pac anything?
Severance packages. That’s the beauty of upper, upper management. You can totally fuck up a business, ruin lives of thousands of people and yet walk away Scott free (pun intended) leaving yourself in a better financial situation than you came in. You though Larry Scott played the Pac? GK giving a master class. Really quite impressive.
He’s not the commissioner of anything though.
On a different note, I know there was a lot of talk about the DL xfer, Jacob Schuster, but j don’t think I’ve seen anything publicly that he joined. However, he’s at practice today so seems like a great addition. It’s taken some time but the d-line doesn’t appear to be the weak link anymore.
mind if i put your comment in the twitter feed? I’d just screenshot it so you’ll get credit
actually, looks like 247 has a post about him up already:
https://twitter.com/247SportsPortal/status/1688988131045871617
thanks for the heads up dude
Canzano has an article up about Chiles. I won’t post it but it sounds like he is committed to the beavs no matter where we land.
I’m worried that all the drama and uncertainty derails this season. Must be incredibly difficult for the players to stay focused in the midst of all this. Luck o’ da Beavs.
And also, how on earth is JS and staff keeping the ’24 draft class together??
We’re almost guaranteed a transfer portal bloodbath in December, right?
My only hope for a good landing spot for the Beavs is a LEGIT run this year. P12 champs, maybe playoff berth. Play so well that we can’t be ignored. We would be THE story of the season and very much in the public eye – Beavs are contenders and yet are poised to get kicked back to irrelevance.
At the very least it would put us on the national map, and put a spotlight on what the networks are doing to the sport.
Sadly, as I said above, I’m afraid that all this mess is a distraction that makes us underachieve this year.
How would that happen? All the deals will be final by then.
“final” is pretty relative in today’s world, haha. If we have a crappy $4M mtn west TV deal seems like the least we could do is negotiate a cheap/negligible buyout, right? Maybe that’s giving Barnes too much credit.
I disagree I don’t think it is as big of a distraction as it seems. We all knew something was going down after USC and UCLA announced. Udub and Ore have been hinting at trying to leave for months. I think everybody knew that kiavakoff didn’t have shit for a deal all along. Jonathan kept it together through all of that and not only that but he’s made the team stronger. I think he can handle whatever comes out of it.
Hope you’re right.
For sure, Smith is the best one for the job since the Pumpkin; still, gotta wonder how long he can hold the staff together if the Beavs are no longer P5.
SDSU tries to save the pac12 because the pac12 won’t save itself. Promptly fails.
https://247sports.com/Article/san-diego-state-attempt-to-build-power-five-conference-fails-per-report-213995323/amp/
MWC “showing unity”. That’s an interesting concept. I’d like to be a part of that.
Well thats what some said about the Pac too until they didn’t. If the Pac 4+ could find even 15k/team to create a best of the rest conference, the MW teams would be punching each other out to get an invite, they can say united because they don’t have a better offer. How many applied to the Pac 12 within the last year.
I assume you meant 15 million, not 15k per team. Go all in with Apple for football with the best group of teams you can get and hope it grows into something greater than linear tv. Maybe just do a football only conference and find a good conference fit for non football sports such as the WCC. Might as well go way outside the box with Apple and see if it can’t be something visionary that changes the course of where college football is headed.
Ha ha, yes obviously 15M.
It’s easier when you have to pay $35M to exit
I don’t understand the talk about A5 going to A4. With the 12 team playoff it doesn’t seem like there really is an A5… “the six highest-ranked conference championship will receive automatic bids”. The field will then be filled out with the six highest-ranked teams remaining. Basically no conference has a guaranteed spot (in theory) because the six highest-ranked conference champions could be from different conferences each year. That’s why I liked the idea of the Pac 4 plus best from AAC and MW, because even if not considered power 5 they would still most likely have a champion ranked within the six highest-ranked ranked conference champions. Where is the error in my logic.
If you don’t realize that they are trying to reduce the amount of eligible teams as much as possible by now then u might never understand it. The people in charge of the playoff want only top brands to be apart of it. They will NOT let MWC, AAC, or any other have nots compete in the playoff. The only reason they are putting up with the ACC and Big12 for now is so they don’t leave out the Clemsons, FSUs of the world and so the new media contracts they locked in before this playoff change will still allow fans of the big12 to think they have a shot at a championship. Once the next round of realignment starts they will poach the best 4-6 teams from the ACC and maybe a couple from the big12 over to the P2 conferences and those teams will be the only team eligible for future playoff bids.
We need to understand that these are moves to eventually get to a 40ish team running for the CFP with no outsiders included. They may even ban out of p2 nonconference games since those draw significantly less viewers.
what we’re seeing now is the reshaping of D1 college football. Eventually what we’ve considered the FBS will be D1a and D1b and they will not mix in terms of postseason play. Maybe they keep one rivalry from out of p2 but nothing more
Yes, there’s already talk of playing more conference games with how many teams are in each of these leagues, it could become all conference games at some point in the future with the major players.
Regarding playoffs, 6A Oregon High Schools are already structured for the top 16 seeds to play for the championship and the next 17-32 play for the Cascade Cup because the blowouts were ridiculous between the top seeds and bottom ones with the 1-32 system. Wouldn’t shock me if NCAA goes to a two-playoff system to appease the Group of Five at some point.
Bowl affilitations are changing too. Saw a report that bowls will start considering 2 teams from the same conference as long as they didnt match up in the regular season.
Best thing we can do is not watch any of those games. That and the Beavs need to find a way to keep winning so they can’t be ignored.
I guess you didn’t read the question. I get they are trying to limit access, but in the new playoff there are not automatic qualifying conferences, there is no A5 as keeps being referenced. The 6 highest ranked conferences champions get in. If my understanding of the new playoff is wrong, enlighten me, but from what i see, why the reference of going A5 to A4 when there isn’t an A5 in the new format.
They are renegotiating the CFP for 2024 and beyond. I’m assuming it will be 12 teams with two ACC, 2 big12, 4 big 10, 4 SEC. would definitely depend on rankings and schedules though. Eventually the big 10 and SEC will eat the other two conferences and there will be 6 from each of the two
I read this and I felt like that mini-sub story – spending days hoping they could be rescued when they were already dead.
I almost give all the other schools credit for holding off jumping for as long as they did.
https://awfulannouncing.com/college-football/pac-12-final-offers-cbs-espn-fox-apple.html
Angry’s crush, mama machado, with some nice walk around pics of reser today.
The bar on beaver street could be fire, and with opponents like the idaho vandals, lines may not be too long
In other conflict of interest news, ESPN licenses their name to Penn Gaming for ten years to create the ESPNBet brand. One entity with ties to both gambling and effective control of multiple sports properties…what could go wrong?
We’re months away from the announcement of the new ESPN Officiating Academy, I’m sure.
I have total faith in ESPN to serve the interests of fans and student athletes.
Can we send the pac 4 refs there to get skilled up?
https://twitter.com/HoffmanCorp/status/1686406802622021633
Love the new west side overall, but bothers me that the concrete pillars are bare and already look water stained?
Assumed they would get a paint job. Just gives off “unfinished” vibes for me.
Looks infinitely better. The pillars do stand out a bit, though.
Looking pretty good. Do something with the concrete like you said then replace the roof material on the end zone VFC(?) so it doesn’t look like a barn roof….
Here’s an interesting take. I’m not sure what to think about this.
https://www.sportskeeda.com/amp/college-football/news-aac-comes-rescue-pac-12-new-proposal-creative-scheduling-reopening-tv-contract-ambitions
They lost me right at the beginning…
“When the UCLA Bruins and USC Trojans announced their departure from the Big Ten last year, no one foresaw that as the first domino in the ending of an established Power Five conference.”
Wait…What? Nobody saw UCLA/USC leaving as a sign?
And they left the Big Ten already?? Journalism is hard.
The hacker dbag MHVER had an interesting thought regarding OSU/WSU.
Big12 doesnt have their own network. Pac12 does.
Currently, only 4 teams will hold the rights to that network as well as the emergency “war chest” funds.
Say the Big 12 or some other conference adds Stanford/Cal. That leaves OSU/WSU with shared possession of the remaining assets.
If the Big12 sees value in having their own network, OSU and WSU could sell the rights to the Pac12 network as well as negotiate a spot in that conference, while also maintining that shared pool of funds.
Just something outside the box that I hadnt seen talked about as a potential outcome.
I still dont love the idea of traveling to such far away schools regularly, bit at least WSU/Utah/Colorado/Arizonas would be familiar travel destinations.
And traveling further south sure beats a trip to the east coast once the weather starts shifting.
Of all of the ideas being thrown around, this would be the most attractive from a financial perspective at least. By a wide margin.
https://twitter.com/MHver3/status/1688731024887332864?t=vaepKrdmgUL5nRKxanpVfQ&s=19
I just assumed that pursuing some kind of super-merge with B12 is the preferred option for everyone except CAL/STAN who thumb their nose at anything other than getting a B1G invite.
I’m sure Kliavkoff won’t try some “wait-it-out” strategy in a last ditch effort to keep the Pac4 together and end up screwing OSU/WSU to the MWC.
He won’t…right?
List of schools who could also be summarily dismissed from the Playoff Premier League party:
Rutgers
Maryland
Minnesota
Indiana
Nebraska
Vanderbilt
South Carolina
Ole Miss
Miss St
Texas A&M
Kentucky
Iowa St
Kansas
Kansas St
Texas Tech
Oklahoma St
West Virginia
Arizona St
Arizona
Colorado
Duke
Virginia
Virginia Tech
North Carolina
Boston College
Syracuse
Only a handful: Duke, NC, Kentucky, Arizona, Syracuse, Virginia, Maryland, Texas Texh are at this point perennially good basketball programs, all have as little or less football successes than OSU.
All of these schools will be anxious when the tieto whittle the 70 schools to 55 or 40 happens around 2025 or so. Once the cable tv collapse is inevitable, they will madly pull strings to create a football oasis to maintain viewership, at all costs again and everyone else will experience what OSU is dealing with right now.
Big12 is a short term life preserver but certainly not any kind of long term stability like Colorado spouted.
Beavs need to win big this year, hold
Onto the roster for another year and watch as the realignment hits the fan again in 2025 and hopefully be better prepared than the groups of teams that will be excised from the “chosen elite league of ESPN champions”.
Barnes has his work cut out for him and JS will find out what kind of guys he truly has on the roster. I expect a few to depart but I’m hopeful that the vast majority stay and begin putting a beat down on all opponents even if it becomes MWC/AAC/ACC or whoever else.
Go back to no playoffs era mentality in the locker room, go undefeated and claim your own mythical National Championship like BYU and Colorado did and proclaim it across the nation. Let them dismiss but they refused to play you or let you into their game so theirs isn’t a true national championship either once they begin cutting teams out from competing for it.
A&M won’t be left behind. There’s a lot of money backing them.
It’s an interesting thought, who will own the PAC12 assets come next summer and if there is any value left there. But I doubt it’ll be worth anything to get an invite to another conference other than the MW. Best case, it gives Beavs some financial relief for a year or two.
But have to remember, PAC12 still owes Comcast money. They’ll definitely have priority over the remaining conf members.
I thought I had read that the teams leaving the Pac were still on the hook for their share of the Comcast money. I don’t think it’s a debt that just gets left behind with the remaining conference members.
It has to be paid back by the close of the contract, or Comcast will simply withhold the difference.
I’m somewhat amazed at the discussion RE the “war chest”. Does anyone seriously believe OSU and WSU will be divvying up $400 million in assets between themselves?
No chance
That money is for conference members. If you leave the conference, you forfeit the rights. That money is tied to the pac12 network for operation costs.
Without even having researched it, I would bet money that there are contingencies in the fine print. Beavs and Cougs didn’t just pull and epic Community Chest card in this game of Monopoly lol.
Canzano is the one who brought it into the conversation. Somebody should ask him to dig a little more on the topic so we can get some clarity.
It was really $450, the million part was poor editorial work.
I would think Klaivkoff knows the financial specifics, but I’m guessing he’s thinking now is not the time to discuss. I just can’t fathom any arrangement where the Beavs and Cougs walk away with a cool 200 million each.
Only if the four teams stay together.
Given revenue needs for Cal, I don’t see any way to stop a vote for dissolution of the conference.
Has anyone else seen this? “One Pac-12 president contacted a Big 12 counterpart and asked if the league “could take all of us, except for Oregon State and Washington State.” Wow! We really got screwed!
https://bleacherreport.com/articles/10085372-report-pac-12-pres-asked-if-big-12-could-take-all-of-us-except-oregon-st-wsu
I’m guessing it was ASU, Cal or Oregon. It should be made public and whoever proposed it should be publicly tarred and feathered, then carried outside of town on a rail…
OSU/WSU have been just good enough over the last 20 years to defeat front runner teams (USC, Oregon) with aspirations of national championships. And some schools (USC, Oregon) think they are much better than such conference bottom dwellers.
Such Hubris is rewarded with great opportunities for frequent flyer miles and hopefully late fall kickoffs in Wisconsin, Minnesota, Rutgers etc. I wonder if the Big10 rigs the schedule to favor USC with late season home games but early season road games.
https://youtube.com/shorts/JikgIL5IUsw?feature=share
I really don’t think it would be cal or ASU given ASUs comments recently and cal being in no position to make a statement like that. It had to have come from one of the schools that left. LA schools out for this, forgotten 4 out, no way Utah said that, ASU highly doubtful, Colorado left before that, so that leaves UA, whoregon, and UW. I’d honestly be shocked if whoregon or UW did it since they were eying big10 and am sure had little interest in big12 negotiations till they got an official no from big10. So that leaves the cats. Wouldn’t put it past whoregon or the fucksies tho with their snobbery
That’s old news, that was news Sunday.
Ya this was above.
I just got an alert from a UW site that claims Notre dame and Stanford to the big10. It’s behind a pay wall so no idea if it’s click bait.
Probably some “five years from now’ type of article. If that were actually true it would be all over.
Yeah I was digging around trying to find a secondary source. Zip.
And then there were three…
Stanford has powerful alumnae.
Holy jumping up and down Martha! We crushed 1000 posts and I didn’t even help!
There are a lot of wet, hot, sweaty beavers out there right now.
Few thoughts and predictions:
1. I think the chipster is on to something. The most logical solution to this football realignment issue would be to separate football from the rest of the athletic programs and have its own conference structure and separate tv deals. Could see that happening soon, maybe if this goes to the courts.
2. Decreased stadium capacity does hurt us. While in reality it’s a trivial issue, it’s something that people do use to compare programs from one another. We were already on the small end but really tanked going under 40k. That being said it’s a high quality stadium and obviously an upgrade from previous.
3. Not sure what happens to Pac12 network but that should be a major bargaining chip for the remaining schools to use to leverage their way into the big12. Apparently they have been exploring options for their own network and we would already have most of the infrastructure in place for a transfer. All they would need to do is rebrand and improve, which is much cheaper and quicker than starting from scratch.
4. There is a vendetta out for OSU and WSU. People want us to die. Really not sure the reasoning as nearly every other team that left the pac is landing big deals but the conference couldn’t get a deal for all including the remaining few? It doesn’t make sense. We don’t cost them that much money right? There’s gotta be something more going on behind the scenes. WSU for example had some of the highest TV ratings per game of all pac12 teams and is sitting with us. “It’s about branding” how come the Big10 included Rutgers and SEC included Vandy. I’m assuming this conference realignment thing was in the works by big10, SEC and the networks before these new deals were signed, so why did they include those schools in the deals if they’re trying to trim fat nationally? I really don’t think picking based off geography is going to affect ratings. People that don’t watch college football from LA are not going to start watching USC or UCLA now just because they are in the big10. If they didn’t care before why would they now?
It also seems funny how espn would not cover any of our big games last season, especially USC. We got banished to pac12 network with a lot of games after dark, then get blamed for poor tv ratings and it’s espn that ultimately decides if we survive or not. What are our ratings for a prime time game on national TV? Do we even have data on that? It seemed like we were intentionally shafted by espn and given poor scheduling. Was it to set up realignment by keeping us out of any national spotlight and forever known as a lowly program? Who knows but we were also given Florida as a bowl opponent who was not ranked, very beat up, and really not deserving of that bowl spot. This greatly killed our bowl ratings since it wasn’t an exciting match up and everyone knew half the Florida team was sitting out. What was the reasoning for us getting that matchup while whoregon got ranked UNC? We were ranked higher at the time too.
Okay I’ll take off my tin hat now
I think it really is as simple as how many eyeballs the program brings to the screen each week. Haven’t seen that WSU had high ratings, that would be surprising. You make a good point about the Rutgers’ of the world though. Even though they are in a massive market they have zero relevance there. So who really cares if they are in the NYC market if literally nobody there watches college football? lol. Maybe they still draw better than the Beavs just based on a smaller percentage of a much bigger population though. Who knows.
I broke it down about halfway up the page. I’ll repost because this is a big thread.
Average views per week in 2022 football only.
#10 ASU 316k national rank #71
#9 Colorado 352k. National rank #67
#8 Arizona 506k. National rank #62
#7 beavs 625k. National rank #57
#6 Stanford 846k National rank #47
#5 Cal 846k National rank #46
#4 WSU 906k. National rank #41
#3 Washington 1.15m. National rank #34
#2 Utah 1.16m National rank #33
#1 oregon 2.21m National rank #12
If you use the 5 Nationally televised games that have ACTUAL ratings announced, our average rating is 1.08M per game when on national TV. I hate that they take the entire season divided by the total number of viewers. This would be like adding up all the yardage for a RB for the season and dividing it by all the games, but the RB didn’t play in 7 of those games. So if the RB gets 1,000 yards rushing in 5 games played in the regular season, they should have 200 yards rushing per game. The way the average TV viewership translates to average yardage would be 83.3333 yards per game over 12 games. See the difference? It’s manipulated and bullshit.
Not to mention nobody tuned into UO’s first game last year to watch them.
“literally nobody there watches college football”…yet their average home game attendance is over 50k. They also have over 2x the number of alumni that OSU has. They “literally” do watch college football.
We’re talking TV, not seats in butts.
And to thank them, ESPN will make them all get up on a Saturday morning and drive to Piscataway for a 9 AM game.
I think there is something to this because you see it in other sports. In MLS, the league has long favored teams in LA and NYC, often changing the rules to benefit them. The commissioner has come out and said how it important it is for them to have strong franchises in those markets. Of course that means they want them to field consistent winners.
Who is making money off college football? AD’s and broadcasters. How do they make the most money? Milking the largest audiences and potential audiences. It would be hard to argue there is a big potential to draw in more fans to OSU and WSU to the extent they will generate revenue for AD’s and broadcasters.
The ultimate problem at the root of all this is the diehard fans who get their meaning in life from their team. They created the environment for Jerry Sandusky at PSU and they’re the fuel to the fire that’s consuming college football tradition now. “Touch some grass” as the kids say.
I have a theory about #4. Our stadium was under construction. Oregon State was unknown how good they really were. USC game would have been a big game had our stadium not been under construction. Everyone complained about the low TV angles. The only game out of 5 games on National TV minus Bowl game that had tv ratings below 1M was the Arizona game on ESPN2. When our games are on ESPN or ABC, they range from 1-3.5M viewers. Civil War got over 3M viewers on a Friday day game after Thanksgiving. That’s with having a 3 TD deficit in the 3rd quarter. The comeback most likely brought people back to the end of the game and that warranted more eyes on Oregon State and Oregon.
Look at our games thus far… CBS at 12:30 PT 3:30 ET on Sunday. PRIMETIME against a Mountain West team on the road! When was the last time Oregon State received a Prime Time game in its own time slot on the road against a MWC? I cannot remember a single instance this has happened. UC Davis is the final game of the day on Pac-12 Network. Makes sense, it’s UC Davis and it will probably end up similar to Montana last season. I expect all 3 QB’s to play in this game. The next game is FS1 at 12:30 PM against SDSU. Again, a day game against a MWC team on linear TV, grant it, you need a subscription, but still national TV. Then we have Utah on Friday Night on FS1. Then Final Civil War is on Friday at 5:30 PT 8:30 ET on FOX. I expect the ratings to be around 5M viewers.
We will be on more national TV and our ratings will go up because Big XII, Big Ten, ACC(barring Stanford and Cal go to this conference) will be tuning into their future teams. They will tune in knowing those teams will be coming into their conference. 1 Pac-12 game will be on P-12 Networks and I suspect it will be WSU or Colorado (their losing record will remove the “I gotta see if they can pull it off.” by casual fans by the time we play them.)
I don’t see us on Pac-12 Networks except twice this season due to “the number of non-conference home games = the minimum # of times on the Pac-12 Networks that season” Oregon State has 2 non-conference home games, so minimum of 2 games on Pac-12 Networks. Final thought, with a completed stadium they can show off on National TV, our new stadium, how good this team really is, and show how fun it is to watch Oregon State football. I do not see an announcement of which conference Oregon State will go to until the first week or two into the season.
Barnes: Reser ine of most “relevant” stadiums in country… hmm, as football is in brink of potential NCAA irrelevancy?
What i suggested sometime ago was some partnership w/NVIDA to make Beaver broadcasts and in-stadium video at Reser second to none…instead they talk about increased concessions…
https://www.oregonlive.com/beavers/2023/08/oregon-state-shows-off-reser-stadium-and-its-161-million-remodel-during-media-tour.html
Also noted an article where Ducks have stadium expansion “on their radar.”…
And a side note. Phil Knight is donating 5 million dollars so Oregon can add men’s soccer to their program to overshadow Oregon State’s recent success. Just being sarcastic, but it wouldn’t surprise me.
My Ideal Conference would be:
West:
OSU
WSU
CAL
BoiseSt
FresnoSt
Nevada
UNLV
SanDiegoSt
Utah St
East:
AirForce
Colo St
New Mexixco
Wyoming
SMU
Rice
Tulane
Tulsa
Memphis
Do as the Pac does now, and the conference title is best conference records, not division winners
Oh god. So gross. So unwatchable.
What choice do they have? Fly to the aac or just stop playing football and bulldoze the new stadium. We don’t have the athletics to go independent.
I’d rather go indie and take our chances than go WMC.
Me too.
Reach out to Beaver Alum/NVIDIA CEO, strike some deal with him and Apple, some NIL links?
His investment in MIL Bucks demonstrates a willingness to invest in small market teams….
OSU needs better and more creative leadership to go indy though…
Yeah we don’t have a good history of getting ahead of the curve and/or being creative, but now is the time. Necessity is the mother of invention.
We went Independent in 1959-1964 and created the Pac-8. Who’s to say it can’t happen again? Hell, last time we went Independent, the team became #2 in the nation and went on to play in the Liberty Bowl and had the first Heisman on the West Coast in Terry Baker! It’s history repeating itself all over again! We stay Independent for football and join the WAC or Big XII for all other sports. What if the 4 remaining Pac-4 teams went independent, but utilized the Pac-12 Networks by getting Apple or Amazon to pay for the rights and production to stream all 4 teams’ football games with an alliance?
I meant WCC to join Gonzaga, but their revenue is less than MWC. So MWC is most likely for all sports other than football.
Interesting flight out of Dallas Love airport today…Going to San Diego, then Scottsdale, then to SFO all today. Could Big XII Commissioner be traveling today to these 3 cities of SDSU, ASU, and Stanford and or CAL? I will have to keep an eye on this plane to see if it heads up north.
https://flightaware.com/live/flight/EJA104/history/20230809/1506Z/KDAL/KSAN
This is not good…..
https://thespun.com/more/top-stories/mountain-west-announces-decision-on-conference-amid-realignment
Take it with a grain of salt, but Canzano’s recently posted article seems to imply that the MWC is now looking at how to brand the expansion with I’m assuming what remains of any viable P-12 assets. That’s a least how I’m interpreting his comments.
I think the Beavs and Cougs to the MWC is a fait accompli, there do not seem to be any other options. Let the lawsuits begin so the Beavs can at least get some compensation for the royal screw over!
I was looking for something during this fiasco and came across something by the commissioner of the AAC, Aresco.
He lays out some thoughts on the G5 vs P5 and ,I think, worth a read. Puts a lot of things in perspective. Some I have considered and others not so much.
https://theamerican.org/news/2023/5/9/football-an-open-letter-on-power-5-group-of-5-branding.aspx
Man, sad to for any Maui Beavs. Seeing that fires have destroyed most of the front street area near Lahaina and are still burning.
Was just there recently, really sad to see and terrible for that community
Agreed. Was going to go this August but didn’t because of predictions RE increased hurricane threats this summer.
Went there years ago and enjoyed it. Sad to see.
Pretty much the entire town of Lahaina has burned now. It’s incredibly sad.
Ya it’s terrible Lahaina got destroyed. Lahaina had a lot of historical buildings there and the banyan tree and now all of that is gone. We were still recovering from Covid and now this. It’s just all unfortunate. A lot of people are going to be homeless and jobless. There is no power or phone service so things are chaotic and people can’t get in touch with their families. They’re basically telling tourists to just go home.
Awful. Was there a few months before Covid and that town had great character. Stay safe bleed et. Al.
What does this mean for baseball and basketball, btw?
Won’t the “second-level” sports inevitably start declining also with the decreased revenue (pending P-12 money or lawsuits)? MBB is a cluster anyway, maybe after Tinkle gets the axe Barnes finds a hungry, talented young coach who can get the program moving in the right direction against MWC competition (which isn’t a gimme). It’s depressing, I guess foremost football needs to dominate the MWC so that a least they are considered when the ACC implodes down the road and realignment starts again. But hell if a successful sports school like SDSU can’t get considered, I don’t know what the future holds for Corvallis.
Yeah I think those secondary sports will all decline, but I haven’t thought it through much, and that’s why I was asking below what people think. I don’t see how it doesn’t collapse all OSU sports.
They were screwed anyway because of NIL. This just accelerates it.
Beatdowns continue for basketball,
dominance begins for Baseball ?
But who would the baseball team play? MWC teams? Do they even have baseball programs?
Yes, here are the 2023 results and it’s a sad league. I think they would be better off joining the WCC or the Big West in baseball.
https://themw.com/standings.aspx?path=baseball
Awful. Going to get terrible baseball recruits, too. Nobody good will want to play in that conference. Is that the conference we’d play in basketball? Probably more our speed there…
A lot more schools in basketball. SDSU just played in the MBB championship game. Tinkle has routinely lost to MWC teams over the years like Nevada and Wyoming. I would argue that the MWC is above a “mid-major” designation in men’s hoops. No idea about WBB. Agreed, they cannot be in that baseball conference. I think Hawaii plays in the Big West.
Go Independent in Football and join the WAC for all other sports. It’s the only thing that makes sense! Allows for local travel for the olympic sports and allows the football team freedom to plan their own schedule. Heck, we can still play all the former Pac-12 schools if we wanted to do so. I like the idea of Independent more than going to the MWC or AAC tbh.
I agree. Independent. If you wind up scheduling 6 games some years because you can’t find opponents then so be it. But it’ll result in better games over the long-term than playing in the MWC.
Nevermind, the WCC doesn’t make enough. Their annual revenuie is $12.5M per year to be split between 17 teams with Gonzaga getting the biggest cut.
Joining MWC would be our only option for everything, but football.
We would be able to find opponents, especially if we play @ Hawaii as it gives us an extra game and we can have 7 home games and 6 away games. We have a visitor locker room and a stadium built completely from 2005 as the oldest addition. Teams will come. It all depends if our future Big XII and SEC home and home teams decide to cancel if we go to Independent. Also, going Independent allows us to be a free agent to join a conference later on.
There’s an article on ESPN (not gonna link it) with an interview with WSU president. He stated that they ans OSU are waiting out the ACC’s courtship of Stanford and Cal.
I think this is probably true. If Stanford and Cal go to ACC. Beavs and Wazzu hold the assets of the PAC and the BIG12 is looking for their own Network. PAC-12 network becomes BIG12 network and Beavs / Wazzu come along. MHver3 has been saying this the last couple of days. I still think Stanford and Cal going to the ACC is a long shot. It makes zero sense but then again a lot of this does not make sense other than TV$
I just read some shit where SMU is willing to join the ACC and not take distributions for the first few years just to get into a P-5 conference. Beavs can’t compete with that.
Wow. Just started catching up with all of this.
Sure picked a great time to stop following OSU and other college sports, I guess. RIP, was fun while it lasted.
WR Dunmore reportedly transferring to FCS Towson.
Seems odd, unless he needed to get closer to home. I thought by the end of last season he was starting to make progress.
Haven’t seen this mentioned yet, but saw an article (Daschel perhaps?) Regarding the new DL xfer boot clear if he can play this year or not as xfer happened outside of the open period. Interesting. Didn’t go into any more details so curious if there were some grades or something holding his xfer back. He’s practicing so not an injury thing where he was perhaps needing to sit out a year anyway. D Line seems to be a strength for us this year, at least compared to prior seasons, so perhaps not a huge issue if he can’t but surely would’ve helped.
Smith touched on it and said he’s allowed to practice, but he’s currently working on getting eligibile.
Often times a player can get a waiver when transferring closer to home if its for health or family reasons.
He “should” be given the waiver, but since he was outside the transfer window, its up to the ncaa review, which is never quick
Maybe he’ll get the “those poor bastards got left behind” waiver.
Kid grew up in Tumwater and is xfering from Minn.
We’ve got AB’s with links to both areas!
Smart guy, sedge reports he originally had offers from: Tree, Cal, Arizona, Duke, Michigan, WSU, and UofW.
Does he know Dave?
where is OSU’s Barnes here:
Denial, Anger, Bargaining, Depression, Acceptance, Guilt, Upward turn, and Reconstruction…
Anger and Bargaining….move to “accept and reconstruct! ”
NVIDIA is expected to grow SUBSTANTIALLY with AI (and surpass Apple in few-several years)…reach out to OSU alum there! The CEO and wife are fond of OSU in part because they met there…the supercomputer they’re donating/building at OSU should be a game changer (no pun intended)…build on the relationship…
Improve JS’s analytics with state-of-the-art AI : )
Improved analytics?……..Miiiitch is ALL IN!
Forget the drama — WHERE IS Barnes?
It’d be cool to have the supercomputer do AI play calling: “Of the replays that can be triangulated, the Beavs have been jobbed by the refs by an average of 0.46 yards vs. these Trojans…”
Here’s an article with Stanford HC saying they won’t go anywhere, but a P-5 conference. For them, it’s P-5 or bust.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/other/stanford-football-coach-announces-program-s-intention-moving-forward/ar-AA1f1sKk
Meanwhile, WSU president came out and said this today:
“As for what comes next for the Pac-12 holdovers, a resolution still remains unclear. The ACC is in early discussions to add Stanford and Cal, which would certainly be a stretch considering “Atlantic Coast” is in the name of the league. Schulz, meanwhile, divulged that both Washington State and Oregon State have been in contact with the Mountain West, though there would still need to be additional financial support in place to make such a move feasible.
“It may be the two of us accept an invitation to join [the Mountain West], and we rely on private dollars to make sure our budgets are at the top of the league,” Schulz said.”
https://www.si.com/college/2023/08/09/washington-state-president-blunt-admission-realignment-pac-12-mountain-west
Seems like the current reality for OSU/WSU. I wish all these talking heads on the internet would get an answer to what the P-12 remaining assets are going to be and what the remaining schools get in actual dollars. Schulz talking about private donors may imply that all the P-12 “leftover money” is not really a thing.
My guess would be that if the league totally implodes then no individual schools have rights to the money. It would be one thing if OSU, WSU, Stanford and Cal kept the Pac-12 alive and viable after adding new teams. Then all of them would absorb the remaining assets. But if the league folds as an entity entirely then it won’t just be the “last schools standing” that get to keep all the money. It would likely be distributed pro-rata to all of the schools that were in the league at the time that the surplus was built up.
If that pool of money is around 430, as has been reported, a Pac2 of WSU/OSU could pay the 34M buyout for 8 MW teams to come join the Pac conference and still have a shared $150M+ leftover to help cover deficits for a period of time.
Would still need to negotiate a TV deal, but you’d think Apple would still be a viable option on different terms.
Seems like a better option than just joining het existing MW and then losing that pool of funds entirely.
All hypothetical of course, since we dont know the contrainta around that money
This is my understanding.
Like all other votes, it will take a 75% vote to dissolve the conference. But that is a vote among all current members. If they can’t get that vote, the remaining schools retain the assets, but not all, if they can’t add another three schools. If they don’t have a viable conference, the NCAA will distribute March Madness units to the conferences which house the teams who earned them.
So if we would have been the first to leave for the Big 12, but a core four stuck together and ran off with the assets but didn’t start a viable conference (as easy as adding Davis, UCSD, Irvine and UCSB) then our new conference would get all the units we earned from our run. But if they did the easy thing, as outlined, we lose those units.
They’re small, in the grand scheme. But they all add up.
Also, without adding at least three football schools, the bowl contracts are rewritten. Though, I think theu may have a clause which kicks in when half a conference disappears. But maybe not. Maybe it’s just “have a viable conference committed for the next year on such and such date.”
They’re going to try to increase donations to cover the gap, but enthusiasm for donating is going to plummet once they aren’t playing major conference sports anymore.
Some financial things too chew on. https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/college/2023/06/14/sec-big-ten-2-billion-athletics-revenue-power-five/70313053007/
“The money has already been spent.”
What a disaster. These guys have no accountability.
I’m curious to hear people’s thoughts on what the endgame looks like for realignment. I’ve always thought that the networks were working towards a 40-48ish pool of teams to compete for the CFP with only two major conferences similar the AFC and NFC.
If this ends up being the vision, at what point are there more fans of left out programs than the ones in? Could we ever reach a point where there are more people interested in the 2nd tier schools in total over the 40 tier ones that remain?
Go back to multiple teams proclaiming themselves as national champs and say the blue bloods were cowards for blowing it all up.
30ish schools band together and leave the NCAA. They start their own professional D-League where the players aren’t students, just teams sponsored by schools. Everybody else goes back to amateur athletics.
The thought came to mind perusing viewership totals for several years: success of a program breeds viewership, and continued success breeds more. The monopolies (fitting, perhaps) want predictably successful teams playing at a high level for max revenue and have little need for the likes of USU or UCF (was that the team?) catching lightning in a bottle once a decade. So yeah, 40-48 teams sounds about right. Look at viewer gaps of OSU vs UO or UW vs WSU, as immaterial for the monopolies.
Once Notre Dame goes to the B1G it’s game over. 3 to 5 ACC teams will join the power 2 conferences and then everyone else will be locked out of the playoff. The Big 12 is done but they just don’t know it. They bought themselves time until Notre Dame makes a move. The ND tv deal is coming up for renewal. The current deal is less than $30M per year. For ND to get the money they want they may finally be forced to join the B1G and then the B1G and SEC can monopolize the playoff.
I heard ND has a full vote in the ACC and they are pushing HARD for ACC to accept Stanford and Cal to join the ACC. It’s a cold war with Florida State threatening to leave the ACC. Who blinks first and caves? Does ND keep their independence in football and Stanford and Cal join the ACC and FSU decides to act on them leaving the ACC over ND having all the power? OR Does ND join the ACC, gets Stanford and Cal to the ACC and by doing so, NBC and ESPN reopen the media deal since ND comes to the table as does their rival Stanford and it changes the amount of $$$ by a lot in regards to the conferences valuation and FSU stays in the conference.
I would say vote for ND, Stanford, and Cal, maybe SMU too, and everyone in the ACC becomes happier over the whole thing. The reason why….Oregon State and WSU will have the remaining assets to the Pac-12. This is the bargaining chip OSU and WSU need to join a Power 4 Conference through merger. This was the end game all along. There are a lot of options in this scenario:
1) Oregon State and WSU go to Big XII and take the Pac-12 Networks with them. This is announced before the season starts.
2) WSU goes to the MWC in basketball only and all other sports go to Big XII. Oregon State then goes to the Big XII with the Pac-12 Networks and Gonzaga gets added as a basketball team only.
3) Oregon State and WSU don’t announce where they are going until August 4th 2024 to get EVERYTHING from the Pac-12 assets. Both OSU and WSU sell the Pac-12 Network to the Big XII and then OSU and WSU go to the SEC in 2024 that appears at the 11th hour in 2024(I give this a chance of happening a 0.00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000001% chance of happening, but…..it’s still a possibility based on what Greg Sankey said that THIS Summer’s realignment they don’t want to add anyone. This is an audition for Oregon State in all sports to get to the SEC. Can they live up to the hype and have all eyes on them, will the fans respond, will the donors keep responding? Will the Basketball team improve? This 2023-2024 season in all sports is an audition. We were saved for last for a reason. What that reason is, I have no idea, but optics doesn’t make sense to shut us out unless we are truly tied to the hip with WSU.
Then, there’s the clear obvious of go to MWC and audition even more in a lower level league.
If cal and Stanford leave the first step is firing GK like the same hour the deal is officially agreed upon.
Then start shopping. Moos at WSU has some major pull around the country see if he could get us somewhere as a package deal.
I’m just spitballing here.
If the pac is no longer technically a conference does kliavkoff still have a job or did he go down with the ship (not including golden parachute)?
Ends officially in August of next year I believe.
Not a good plan to hitch your wagon to WSU leadership. Barnes should be much more
Proactive and not rely on a partnership with WSU at this point. They won’t be going anywhere good as a tandem.
Is Kliakoff alive still? Has he made any public statements regarding his own failures and the demise of his conference? I think Kliakoff was a plant by the insiders at the media groups to be the fall guy and sink the PAC intentionally.
The sequence of events and timing for this all happening before the playoff expand to 12 teams is too obvious to be coincidence.
Lawsuits are in order.
Kliakoff is away being loyal. Barnes is just away. Murthy is away being “serIous.”
I thought the year before the first playoff expansion the Big East was broken up, and this was not unexpected?
Look on the bright side. The longer this drags out the better conference deals Oregon State will get in the end. (Sarcasm)
Some satire for your consideration:
https://www.backingthepack.com/platform/amp/college-football-news/2023/8/9/23825859/smu-included-free-with-purchase-of-two-pac-12-schools
Pac-12’s echo fades,
Athletes’ spirit carried forth,
Mem’ries linger on.
MHver3 is now reporting BIG12 will finish the vetting of expansion candidates by tomorrow.
Mt West is not waiting on Stanford and Cal they are waiting to see if there are any teams available after Stanford and Cal go to the ACC. (OSU and WSU will they be available)
ND is pulling stings behind the scenes to get Stanford into the ACC. Did not mention Cal.
He has been implying for a couple of days that if it ends up being Wazzu and OSU are the last 2 standing in the PAC-12 BIG12 will swoop in to pick them up along with the assets of the PAC-12 network. BIG12 is the only conference out of the P4 that don’t they their own network. This fixes that problem.
Not sure if any of this will actually happen but it does seem to make a lot of sense.
The conference assets will be distributed back to the teams or the conferences they land in, if it becomes the Pac 3 or less.
This is the first time I have heard this. Do you have a source?
How do you distribute TV network assets to teams that don’t need them? OSU & Wazzu will also own the branding & licenses.
I know that the 450 Million thing is bogus BUT the remaining schools will get additional $ for their trouble.
MHver3 also says – The final years revenue distribution from the media deal and how much each schools get to keep will be up to the lawyers but I am hearing that the amount given to the teams that are left behind could be significant.
MHver3 on a live tweet stream or whatever it’s called
https://twitter.com/TheSpaceKnights/status/1689426471461232640
Link won’t work for me, hope someone posts any relevant info. Accurate or not, false hope is better than no home.
Sorry about the bad link.
He said he’s fairly confident that Cal and Stanford will get invited to the ACC and then once that happens Wazzu and us become attractive to the big 12. He described it as a merger between the remaining PAC 2 and the big 12. I guess as a merger they would acquire the PAC 12 assets. He also said the money would be there to get both schools very close to a full revenue share. Mentioned being able to use PAC 12 production studio to distribute content on Amazon.
I was able to listen for a few. The gist from MHver3 is that OSU/WSU should just wait for the smoke to clear and they will get a Big 12 invite because of all of the P-12 assets and the league needing a West Coast window. Also something about the 15 NCAA credits they will bring with them. Fox won’t pay the league any more money, but these credits and other things will make them close to whole.
I am listing and yes this is the info he is getting. He says 75% chance Stanford and Cal go to ACC. After that smoke clears BIG 12 will MERGE with the PAC 12 and acquire the network, licensing, branding, etc. They want the network to produce games for Amazon and get more evening west coast inventory. Wazzu and OSU are being vetted by the BIG12 as we speak and after Stanford and Cal is done then ESPN will give the go ahead to move forward with Beavs and Wazzu. He also said the NCAA credits will make up for the $ Fox will not put in. Not sure what the whole credit thing is but he says between the credits and ESPN money that would make Wazzu and OSU close to a full share.
Sounds like it’s far from a done deal but things are moving in the right direction. That would explain why there is not much movement with the Mt West and Barnes is so quiet. He is waiting for this to play out.
It sounds like the dude is UCF Golden Knights wanker and of course, he thinks they will do really well in the Big 12.
The guy running the chat was a UFC honk yes. MHver3 is a WV guy. He called the USC/UCLA move 2 months before it happened and he also called Colorado and Arizona months before it happened. He is obviously connected. If you read his twitter thread lots of accurate calls. A hell of a lot more credible than Canzono.
Gotcha, I heard a bunch of UFC blather and tuned out for a bit. Yeah, Canzano is a mess. Claims he’s so connected, yet the results show otherwise. I still used to read his substack stuff for shits and giggles, but now 90% of it is subscription. No thanks.
There’s definitely people that dog on the MHver3 guy but he has been as spot on as any of the “real” media folks over all this realignment stuff.
Canzono was a useful idiot to pump out propaganda for the people that were pro pac-12. I don’t doubt he believed what he was being told but as we know now he was a propaganda mouthpiece and nothing more.
His fixation with Larry Scott went on way too long. I actually think he was jealous of the Scott lifestyle. He gave Kliavkoff a lot of latitude just because he wasn’t Scott.
I want to believe. But I can’t.
Yep I feel the same way. Waiting for Lucy to pull out the football one more time.
Kind of feels like one LAST time at this point…
Now I am reading the ACC does not have the votes to add Stanford and Cal. God what a mess.
https://www.si.com/college/georgiatech/football/report-accs-pursuit-of-cal-and-stanford-has-hit-significant-roadblocks
Interesting comments from the Georgia tech guy about a “western presence”.
Bret McMurphy is saying they didn’t actually vote because they didn’t have enough support yet.
Pete Thamel saying the ACC met tonight but hit significant roadblocks. Dammit. Sounded like our best option at this point was to be the last 2.
If it means getting Notre Dame for football, they’ll eventually get it done. Notre Dame is way too valuable to pass up.
The thing I love hearing is OSU/WSU tale their stash of assets and an entire TV network to the Big12, and in exchange, we “might” get close to a full share?
Are you f**king serious?
Maybe they should also require us to fellate every other school president at least once per week, and then maybe we can get that full share.
I think they’d settle for a handie out in the parking lot before kickoff.
10-11 schools apparently are for adding Cal and Stanford with the possibility of SMU per this article:
https://www.si.com/college/2023/08/10/four-to-five-acc-programs-against-stanford-cal-smu-expansion-plan-per-report?utm_medium=push_notifications&utm_source=pushly&utm_campaign=3385505
IMO, ND is the reason realignments have happened. It was to force their hand to see what it would take to get them into a conference. Who is going to blink first? ND join the ACC to get Stanford and Cal into the conference? I actually find it laughable that FSU is the school strong-arming ND to “join a conference, and we’ll talk.”. Will ND view this as a “Who do you think you’re talking to?” or they die on this hill by coveting their independence rather than helping Stanford. I could also see it as a tactic to get ND to join the conference first and then discuss adding Stanford and Cal, but I could see this backfiring where at the last minute ND backs out or the conference backs out of the verbal agreement. Who trusts who here?
this is good news in my opinion, as I see it as the first step in the recovery of the conference. If Stanford and Cal can’t find a new home, why not just reconstitute a four team “Pacific Coast Conference?” This was the name, and if I’m not mistaken, the same size as the original conference created during WWI. They could patch together a minor media deal with Apple; or not, and in effect act as independents in terms of media revenue (a la carte, anyone) and just schedule each other in conference and aggressively out of conference for a year or two until they can reverse the flow and start poaching schools from other leagues. Stanford for example, would have the Cal game, ND and SC. With good team, that can generate significant interest with schedule, including a good team in Corvallis. OSU and WSU could hold up UO and UW for some significant conscience money to play them. WSU has already committed to doing that and Barnes is likely going to have to swallow hard and do the same. As soon as the MW exit fee gets reasonable, San Diego State would jump, and perhaps lure Colorado State and Air Force, which is the best of the rest. If the PCC can just buy time until the ACC folds, some of those teams might be lured into an”A and P Conference.” There used to be an Atlantic and Pacific grocery store chain, why not a football conference. Once the Big 10 and SEC put the squeeze on the Big 12, it might be possible to lure the Arizona schools back.
If I recall it was noted above….a minimum of six are required for a conference.
Even if this were the case, everyone would still need to schedule additional OOC games in short order for 2024.
Another problem with aggressive non-con scheduling is the larger conferences are moving towards adding an extra in conference game to their schedules.
So less total non-con opportunities will be available and an independent team will get squeezed out.
They’ll own the playoff spots, so the risk of losing 2 or 3 games to in conference opponents is no longer a death sentence
As I understand 12 out of 15 need to vote yes. I would think FSU is a big no. I’m not understanding why ND would be so gung-ho for Stanford/Cal to join. Will ND really join ACC as a full football member? What’s in it for them? ACC is going to die like the P-12 unless they can get up to 60 or 70 mil in payouts like the Big 10.
Touching on what i said above, Independent teams like Notre Dame are going to have a harder time scheduling teams. You’re going to see the SEC go from 8 to 9 cnoference games and the Big10/Big12/ACC go to 10 conference games as they grow in number of teams.
Teams aren’t going to want to schedule Notre Dame when they can backfill with G5 and FCS teams. There’s little upside to playing a Notre Dame anymore.
Pete Thamel talks about it here with Pat Mcafee
https://twitter.com/PatMcAfeeShow/status/1688594971316936705?t=A1loE1W0pDPMd2AY6ieRdQ&s=19
Notre Dame has an agreement with the ACC for like 4-6 games a year. Then they fill out the rest with the usual USC, Stanford, Navy games. The rest is regular non conf games like all other teams.
I think I read that ND is paying Tennessee State 1 million to play them in September. Nice bankroll for an FCS school.
I know Marshall isn’t FCS but it was nice seeing them get a win in South Bend last year while collecting a huge check.
The upside is money. You get a home and home with them or you get a nice payday from playing there.
I’m talking about a post re-alignment world, once teams add their extra in conference games.
https://www.cbssports.com/college-football/news/examining-the-secs-eight-or-nine-game-conference-schedule-conundrum-entering-this-weeks-spring-meetings/
https://spartanswire.usatoday.com/2023/08/07/rumor-big-ten-will-most-likely-move-to-10-game-conference-schedule-following-recent-expansion/
ND would get an extra non-ACC game if Stanford joins ACC. Also, Stanford would get their 3 OOC games back as well, since ND would be considered an ACC game. So this solidifies their Rivalry. The ACC is holding adding Stanford and others hostage right now to get ND to give into their demand of getting ND to join the conference as a full member.
Sedge up with interviews after practice today; 8 minutes with DJ and 4 with Jack Velling.
Both toe the company line re: conference stuff beyond their control…just focus on today.
If Velling has the kind of season some expect, it will be fun to see him become more comfortable in these interviews, ala DJ.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ydhTiZKlyJM
Oregonian reporting DJU is already pulling away from the competition. They have their first scrimmage Saturday so we’ll see if that holds up
Dude just needs to avoid the turnovers. If he’s going to throw an INT it better be 60 yards down field.
ESPN Bet – 2 billion – This is new or a reconfiguration?
The way I see things for Oregon State football moving forward is either they stay in the PAC-12, convince Stanford and Cal to stay? Add top MW teams and like 2-3 from AAC and renegotiate a deal with Apple if possible or the Beavers go independent and try and work out a package deal with Wazzu with ROOT Sports, who would love significant college football. Joining the AAC is a complete non-starter. Tv deal isn’t good overall and the travel expenses would make that a disaster. Joining the MW would cause a reopening of their media deal but without Stanford, I can’t see the deal getting all that better. Beavs would take a massive hit financially. Just doesn’t make sense as a deal. I can’t see the Big 12 happening at all. First two options seem like the only real possibilities. I think option #1 happens and we’ll get some news on that next week. PAC-12 will reunite after 2025 when UW and UO bail after they’re getting crushed financially with the travel expenses and aren’t winning enough. UW’s pockets aren’t as deep as they like to believe and they’ll be hurting.
That’s a lot optimistic, but it is one of the hail mary’s I’ve considered.
I don’t think there’s much hope for football. UO and UW have effectively damaged their own states’ economies so they can have leather lined lockers with gold inlay in their football facilities.
Another pie in the sky event could be the hope Notre Dame is now fed up with the ACC and joins the new Pac Whatever with these monied schools and the four out west… maybe add Uconn and Army, so they can play in NYC once a year and Navy so they can play in DC once every two. We all guarantee Notre Dame an unequal share and move forward.
Notre Dame now has two of their biggest rivals in conference and can be seen as a hero, on top of their already outsized legend.
That is never going to happen. ND will go B1G. ND will handpick teams they want from the leftovers of the ACC and take up Stanford. ND has te $$$ to threaten ACC to break their GOR and implode their conference. ND is offering the ACC a lifeline of future stability. Will the ACC take the lifeline from ND, or will ACC schools dig in and say ND needs to decide to join ACC, effectively calling ND’s bluff of getting out of their ACC GOR agreement.
My comment would be subsequent to the ACC denying the Bay Area schools, and Notre Dame being fed up with that situation.
If Notre Dame goes to the B1G, college football is dead on arrival.
Apparently, I’m not the only one thinking along these lines… and including the service academies, which I would be totally for.
https://twitter.com/andy_staples/status/1689634254878093312
Notre Dame is the real 800 pound gorilla in college football. Where they go, reporters and eyeballs follow. But it’s due to them actually being outsized, within the sport–not just a winning tradition that follows the money.
I think this site needs to develop several proposals and send them to OSU, WSU… i just don’t see creativity in Barnes.
https://youtu.be/sEXL7oPoor8
I still can’t believe this shit happened!
Absolute morons running the Pac 12…
I don’t think anyone was actually running it. It looks like USC led UCLA, CU, and UA actively kill the conference while having at least one foot out the door, and UO and UW seem to be indifferent to anything not them.
Don’t forget actively blocking expansion while also having that foot out the door.
UO played a huge role in killing the conference and the remark from their president today suggested their only worry’s were leaving cal and Stanford behind… they deserve blame. Check Nick Daschel Twitter for full quote
If you can’t follow, leap-frog. Here’s some sci-fi-pie-in-the-sky ideas:
Get a deal from Apple for pennies with the stipulation that they invest in research programs with the remaining Universities (all pretty good engineering schools). The schools will have a graduate program called “sports broadcasting technology.” The goal will be to develop a kick-ass streaming machine that the users have some control over what they see. Imagine being able to replay, focused on any player at any angle. Maybe even have proprietary hardware (Apple is good at that, those bastards) that is like a console control. That would seem to be pretty cool for a recruit. The tech intellectual property so others would have to pay through the nose to get it. The PAC-12 studios still exist and could be used. Even that could be run by grad students in a new “sports broadcasting” major.
I don’t know how you get enough money to whether the storm, but it you treat it like a startup, you may have a shot.
Yeah, I know….
That’s a cool idea. Make the majority of the functionality available through an app but the “pro” version run through a console for extra bells and whistles.
Three pods:
1. Notre Dame, Navy, Army, Uconn (football only), Loyola (Olympics), St Loius (Olympics)
2. SMU, Tulane, Rice, Tulsa, Wichita State (Olympics)
3. Stanford, Cal, OSU, Wazzu, Gonzaga (Olympics), University of Portland (Olympics)
People would go bonkers, and Notre Dame gets to take advantage of all this publicity by putting its foot down.
Not sure if Stanford would go with the Catholic play just to make Notre Dame happy, but we’re talking huge money backing a lot of these schools from every part of the economy, and having that association can’t hurt.
Could go with Loyola Marymount for Olympics, instead of Portland, but I was trying to tie in travel partners. It makes total sense for Wazzu and Zags to partner up on travel and hosting, so Portland would be the same. Maybe take LMU in a couple years when we add Hawai’i as football only and bring in SDSU.
Then the conference can always have a week zero game in Hawai’i where they promo the hell out of it and everything aloha.
These alignments also enhance recruiting.
Notre Dame is in Texas and California. Adding a UAB and USF when adding Hawai’i and SDSU puts them in more. CSU and AFA would fill in the central pod.
Oh… and Notre Dame would schedule a game in New Orleans in year one.
So much depends on the gold dome pharaoh
Glazed with rainwater
Playing hardball chicken
Is NVIDIA better for that than Apple? Or at least have a major role in it? Makes OSU broadcasts leading edge, appeal to recruits…VR applications….get IN the game…
Add cameras to the helmets for “in-the-game” replays. Would be cool to experience a spin move with arm tackles for a forty yard touchdown by a running back.
But probably no microphones haha.
WSU has a Board of Regents meeting scheduled for Friday August 11 at 7 am. They will go to Executive Session. So don’t expect much to come from this meeting, but all announcements of changing conferences have come on Fridays.
https://s3.wp.wsu.edu/uploads/sites/3087/2023/08/Special-Meeting-Notice-August-11-2023.pdf
Here’s the legal mumbo jumbo of what the meeting could entail:
https://app.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=42.30.110
The mention of litigation is the big takeaway here. Looks like they’re discussing a lawsuit.
That is my thought as well. I doubt it’s litigation to discuss the assets of the Pac-12 and how to dissolve the conference, but it could very well be that as well.
Rolo?
I doubt it’s related to Rolovich.
If I was Rolovich, I’d sue that fucker Inslee personally….but at any rate I don’t think Rolovich’s suit is quite ‘ripe’ yet; it will be at some point, however.
Does Oregon State have a Board of Regents?
I think they’re misspelling that word…
The CBS pickem pool is back. Is there interest in it this year?
I would lean towards not including of the Big10/SEC/Big12 games, simply because i dont want to encourage any eyeballs to follow those conferences
It should just be prop bets about how stupid college football can get
If the Beavs get marooned on an island, I like the OSU/WSU regional cable tie-in with Root Sports mentioned above. Heck, 20 years ago, the only place you could regularly watch OSU football was Fox Sports Northwest. Like the famous 98 Civil War. Only games like the 2000 Civil War ended up on national cable. When Fox sold off their regional sports channels to focus on FS 1 and 2 as national cable networks, FSNW was bought by the Mariners. In the fall they throw a few Big Sky games on their channel, so we know the underlying interest is there. The Kraken and Trailblazers are also on that channel now, so we know it’s growing. The downside is no national presence, but OSU doesn’t have a national following and my guess is that 95% of Beav fans live in OR, WA, ID, and Montana. People living farther afield, like Angry in Colorado, could probably stream it. I realize this won’t match the current revenue demand but it’s a lifeline that will mitigate what otherwise would be a 40% cut in the athletic budget.
All the more reason for OSU/WSU fans to cut cable and stop watching out of conference games on ESPN/FOX.
Dont watch college game day, dont watch those early morning Ohio State or Michigan games. Skip all of it.
https://twitter.com/ChrisVannini/status/1689444139069489152?t=LR9Uc4nuQaxUZPE0CrS7HA&s=19
Apparently we get to go to a game that allows us to come home and watch the late game… which is usually us.
Dont watch Nebraska lose games out of morbid curiousity.
Don’t watch Oregon, hoping to see an L
Don’t watch the SEC
Don’t feed the machine
BoycottPower4 = NOT WATCHING B1G, Big XII, ACC(if it survives), or SEC! I haven’t watched a National Championship football game in about 3-5 years now I think. I will watch games of those in my teams league, but I won’t watch outside of that. Except Oklahoma State I would generally tune in and watch, but not anymore.
If Oregon State goes to MWC/AAC/ or combo thereof, then you need to watch ONLY the G5 conference games. watch Hawaii vs Wyoming. Watch SJSU vs New Mexico. Watch UTSA vs Rice. Those are now the games I will be watching. I will not watch power conference football games this season outside of Oregon State.
Bingo. I ride my bike 65 miles on Saturdays, if I’m not watching the Beavs. Healthy instead of fat, and no money poured into the pockets of those destroying the game. Unless people do this en-masse they’ll continue to destroy the game even more. It’s all old, dinosaurs know how to do.
Nebraska fell so far so fast that I started to feel a little sorry for the team but of course not their delusional fan base! I used to turn on to see them lose, but the Riley years are getting pretty far in the rear view mirror now.
#BoycottPower4 should be trending on X, but it won’t. Not until they see how good Oregon State is and realize the ramifications of the Power 4’s actions this season. They believe they’re cutting out 4 teams’ viewers, but what they’re really doing is creating a league that will not be fun to watch. I watch college football and not the NFL. They go to an NFL model, guess what, I won’t watch it. I would rather watch Sac State versus Idaho State than Rutgers vs Kansas in the National Championship for football. Because the former is more likely to happen than the latter. It’s just DUMB how $$$, media, and elitist attitude has destroyed college football.
The ideas being spouted by TV exec about getting more casual fans if they somehow reconfigure TV deals are completely disingenuous. It’s not like it was hard to find marquee college football matchups on Saturdays before realignment and they’re solving some kind of problem. These are fake stories made up by people who just have to generate plausible-sounding ideas for their jobs and have no real skin in the game.
ex-PAC teams are getting added to conferences because they can offer late night content. Guess what: those teams are still going to play late night games half the time. They may get 1-2 more early slots per season by being in a different conference. Those programs won’t get any more fans or attention from that.
This is the most naive explanation I’ve read. If you can’t name one college football player then while in hell would you watch USC/Ohio State on a Saturday afternoon?? You know absolutely nothing about college football, so you don’t even know that’s a good game to watch! These guys are so screwed if that’s what they’re counting on.
It’s because they don’t actually believe it. These are upper management people who just need to come up with plausible-sounding ideas to justify their jobs. The networks know they’re trending down, so I’m sure they’re having “strategy” meetings where these ideas get thrown around.
I’d rather listen to the Beavs on radio
A couple different reports out there that NC State is now on board with Stanford and Cal joining the ACC. Just needing Va Tech to flip to a yes and the dominoes can’t start falling.
I’m amused by Jack’s dream that we will be bailed out by a principled Notre Dame who rescues all of the rejected little guys across the landscape of college football.
The truth probably lies closer to a monumental power play by Notre Dame to either pit ACC bs Big10 in a bidding war for the Fightin Irish, or they are looking for some good press and know that ultimately nothing can happen with the ACC GOR. Sure they are the only school with the deep pockets to buy themselves out of that contract but perhaps they are just pushing back at FSU and getting nice altruistic pr while FSU sounds like spoiled brats.
Any kind of coast to coast conglomerate that joins military academies, ND, unwanted PAC12 remnants is a pipe dream. Even if ND gets an outrageous cut of the pie, it won’t approach what they can get on their own or by joining the Big10. At least I highly doubt it.
ND
Air Force
Army
Navy
Stanford
Cal
WSU
OSU
SMU
SDSU
Might be interesting but I’d guess too many hurdles for it to happen and it all relies on Notre Dame being willing to fully join a newly formed and unproven conference.
About 2%-5% chance of it happening.
No way would ND do a home-and-home against anyone on the West Coast not named USC or Stanford.
Cal and Stanford to the ACC is official. So dumb. Boycott ncaa sports.
This is probably a better outcome for OSU. More PAC money and it seems to pave the way for a Big 12 move.
What are the odds attendance and ratings for ex-PAC programs plummets and they all look for a western solution in 5 years?
where are you seeing it’s official?
This is not being reported anywhere source?
If this is true, WSU will announce tomorrow to the Big XII and Oregon State will announce next week as the last Pac-12 team remaining they will be going to the Big XII.
still not giving a source… You sure you aren’t MHver3?
ESPN. A friend who watches that crap channel told me they reported it as official.
This is the only article on ESPN I could find on it: https://www.espn.com/college-sports/story/_/id/38164566/sources-cal-stanford-acc-hits-significant-roadblocks Aug 9, 2023, 09:55 PM ET
The ACC presidents had met Tuesday morning about Cal and Stanford, but sources said at the time that the league was “still evaluating” the potential additions, with no decisions expected imminently and another call of the athletic directors to further dig into the finances expected in the near future. The athletic directors had met Monday as part of the initial pair of exploratory calls.
The ACC’s deliberations on Cal and Stanford have come amid a fascinating moment, as multiple unhappy schools need to make a decision within the next week about whether they want to leave their league.
There is a deadline Tuesday for schools to notify the ACC if they want to leave and change conferences for the 2024 season, a date that has been highlighted because of Florida State’s vocal unhappiness about league revenues. (Also complicating matters was that seven schools — FSU, Clemson, Miami, NC State, North Carolina, Virginia and Virginia Tech — were communicating about options outside the ACC earlier this year.)
There’s a related story in today’s Wall Street Journal, headlined: “Disney Sets Big Price Boost in Streaming as Users Quit.” Excerpts: “The changes come as Disney struggles to pivot from its old model of distributing content in movie theaters, on network and cable television and through the sale of physical media to a streaming-first paradigm.” [Kliakoff was five years to early.]
Further on: “Since launching Disney+ in late 2019, the company has lost more than $10 billion in its direct to consumer segment, which also includes Hulu and ESPN+.”
“Disney’s troubled traditional television business continued its decline [in the most recent quarterly report]. The company’s so called linear TV segment, which includes sports network ESPN, . . . saw operating income fall 23% to $1.89 billion, or about $100 million less than what analysts expected. Once a reliable engine of profit for Disney, linear TV has seen its operating income plunge in recent years as more consumers cut the cable cord and switch to streaming video as their primary source of home entertainment.”
“Disney is exploring a menu of options for both ESPN and its other linear networks, . . . people familiar with the matter said. Those options could include selling some networks [to Apple; poor George] or bringing on equity partners or spinning some assets off into a new company.”
I’d argue that most of these streaming companies experiencing downturns are due to poor quality in their content rather than “streaming” being the issue. Disneys now full blown woke and cares more about playing identity politics in their movies and shows rather than giving people good, quality content. Look at the new Star Wars trilogy for example. They really didn’t plan those out and pissed off their huge Star Wars fan base. It’s not that people don’t like streaming it’s that they don’t like what Disney is streaming. Everyone loves football
What exactly does woke mean?
Coming from a big SW fan, I’d argue that episodes 1-3 are worse than the most recent 3 films. Andor, the Mandalorian, and Kenobi are some of best SW content in a long time. Ahsoka will be next. Disney is doing just fine with their SW content.
woke is the liberal agenda. Think Bud Light, Drag Queens reading books to kids at libraries & Children’s museums, Target selling LGBTQ garbage geared towards toddlers, etc. This is woke ideology.
You got that smooth brain eh?
LOL, “Woke is the liberal agenda”. I really hope your examples were sarcasm. Which is more dangerous, a drag queen reading books, or all the MAGAS running around with their guns off safety?
You know us libs are out to get you….close the drapes and activate SimpliSafe tonight.
For fucks sake, SMH
If I had money to buy ammo and guns, I would own thenm and those would be my SimpliSafe because my finger is the safety. Do you let a teenager get a license before a permit? nope. Do you let a teenager drive before they take a test or drivers ed or teach them how to drive? nope. Same with a firearm. You have to be taught how to handle a firearm before getting comfortable using a firearm. I have gone to multiple gun ranges, have fired multiple types of firearms. If I do not feel comfortable with a firearm while handling it, I will pass it correctly using firearm safety protocols to give it back to the owner or the one who handed it to me. I have done this with an AR. I could not figure out how to check to see if it was loaded, so I stopped, and handed it back to the owner. he then checked to see if it was loaded before placing it back in the safe. BTW, I saw him unload it in front of me, but I could not check it, and he still checked it knowing I didn’t load the AR. THAT is gun safety.
Oh god how do people like this exist in ‘merica.
woo hoo!
Bonkers for woo hoo!
Gotta talk about my insecurities and mumble stuff about guns, because this is what a responsible gun owner does.
I also like the morons who inventory their guns on social media sites, for every criminal in the country to see. What are these people thinking?
It is no surprise that studies have found that having a gun in the house greatly increases the risk of people in the house being killed.
Apparently you don’t have kids. I do not need my kids who are under 8 and still developing their minds to be confused about what they are seeing. As an adult, if you want to do that on your own time, fine, but leave kids out of it. They aren’t clowns or Santa Clause reading stories to kids, these are grown men who like to dress up as women. This isn’t Shakespeare plays.
Imagine kids being read Titus Andronicus.
It’s people reading books. People can wear what makes people comfortable. You make it sound like they’re dressed as inappropriately as a Wal Mart customer.
wHat iS wOKe?
FFS.
You’re gonna have to provide some sources for all of these “magas” whatever the fuck that’s supposed to be , “running around with guns”.
If it’s as common as you say it should be easy to post examples. It’s pretty easy to find examples of TQ+ groomer trannies doing children’s story hour or “family friendly” drag shows. It is odd that they never do a drag show at an old folks home, or a prison, or a construction site, or anywhere where the target audience is over the age of seven. Seems weird. Maybe it’s just me.
It probably is just you.
Anyone with expectations of people reading nursery rhymes to those groups of people really doesn’t have realistic expectations. It’s just people reading books. Don’t make it about projection.
Ahhhhh!
Run!
There are rainbows in the sky!
Ahhhhh!
The wussification of the right just accelerated, in recent years. Soon we’ll hear that it’s the woke’s fault that incels can’t get laid.
Check out what Magas and the party of jesus are up to now. They can’t live like Jesus taught them, so they’re trying to change what Jesus said.
https://www.newsweek.com/evangelicals-rejecting-jesus-teachings-liberal-talking-points-pastor-1818706?fbclid=IwAR3PNfB9oPDkf0GeISs5aSIqsZUE8MD3DOkJtCdHsYMIGZc4QTFfdE9jDsk
Kenobi was trash minus the end fight
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Woke
Andor was slow and boring.
Mando is cool.
Kenobi was decent.
What color is Wokenobi light saber?
I’m going with “flesh” color with a purple tip.
WSJ with another article: “Colleges Spend Like There’s No Tomorrow. ‘These Places Are Just Devouring Money.’
Students foot the bill for flagship state universities that pour money into new buildings and programs with little pushback”
https://www.wsj.com/articles/state-university-tuition-increase-spending-41a58100?st=p6inrhqd7bbf7et&reflink=desktopwebshare_permalink
Everything is an arms race. Universities feel pressure to constantly add new amenities to attract students. Students continue to pay the increased tuition so it’s a vicious cycle. The cycle may be in it’s final stages however, as students are becoming more savvy about not accumulating unsustainable student loan debt.
To be fair, some schools athletic depts don’t raid the academic side.
Some, not many
“Inflation-adjusted spending on athletic coaches rose by about half between 2010 and 2022 at the median flagship, the Journal’s analysis of data from the Knight-Newhouse College Athletics Database found. The Journal used data from the period with the most complete figures.
Though a handful of powerhouse sports departments pay for themselves, most can break even only with student fees and university subsidies.
Across all flagships with available data, that additional funding totaled $632 million in 2022. That’s a jump of 27% from 12 years prior.
The University of Connecticut won the national championship this spring in men’s basketball, and its women’s team has been a near-constant presence in the Final Four. Yet since 2016, Connecticut’s athletic department has received more than $35 million annually in student fees and university subsidies to stay afloat. In 2022, it took in $55 million in such funds, making up more than half its total athletics budget.
The school said more than $13 million of that subsidy covered a payout to a former men’s basketball coach as part of a legal settlement over his employment contract, and that it faces unique challenges in having to pay rent and other fees for basketball and hockey games, which are played off campus. “
Ugh!
Disney was first to market with dtc. They have been burning cash to make it work, and it will be profitable by the end of next year.
This is typical of start-ups. Others who have stared moving everything to streaming will sink more money into the infrastructure than they will receive in revenues. That’s just the way it is.
Disney also lost several million international subscribers who were only there to see the cricket league in India. When they lost those rights, they lost those customers. Thei actual subscription rate for domestic consumers is on a steady rise.
These are all anyone is writing about, so trying to spin it as some culture bullshit meant to divide is laughable, especially for an ostensibly financial rag.
Wonder if Reser tickets this year will be in extra high demand for the last season of the PAC? Maybe a season of conference fame sellouts? Or fans turned off by NCAA and media…
Holy smokes! How awesome would it be for the Pac-4 to vote to not allow the 8 schools who are leaving NOT to participate in the Pac-12 Championship games in ALL SPORTS!
https://www.union-bulletin.com/sports/college_sports/washington_state_university/mailbag-cash-available-for-pac-4-options-for-wsu-and-osu-and-more/article_2aa6f1fa-22a2-57ad-b96a-7103570d6779.html
“If desired, the four schools could attempt to play the hardest of hardball and declare the eight outgoing members ineligible for Pac-12 titles in 2023-24 — and thus any automatic bids to NCAA championships.
There is precedent for such action. In 2012, the Colonial Athletic Association declared its three departing members, VCU, George State and Old Dominion, ineligible for championships.
We’re skeptical Stanford, Cal, WSU and OSU would take that step.
But like everything else, it’s on the spectrum of possibilities during this tumultuous stretch.
What happens to the College Football Playoff and NCAA Tournament payouts if the Pac-12 is basically dissolved at the end of the year? Is there a difference if Oregon State and Washington State keep the name? — @UACatManDo
Our understanding is the CFP distributes revenue during the fiscal year that includes the competition season. So the Pac-12’s cash haul from the 2023-24 playoff will flow to the schools in the first six months of next year.
(Whether that is split 12 ways or four is, again, to be determined.)
The revenue from March Madness is distributed on a delayed basis. Any cash earned from the 2024 event would be disbursed in 2025. The outgoing schools would not be entitled to a dime.
If the conference dissolves, that could change. But only the four remaining schools have the power to shut everything down and turn out the lights.”
TAKE THAT STEP, TAKE THAT STEP.
I really hope they take the step to censure the 8 defectors. Oregon State vs Washington State in Football, Stanford, Oregon State, Washington State, and Cal for the Pac-12 Tourney to determine who gets the automatic bid for the NCAA March Madness Tourney, Oregon wouldn’t win any Pac-12 championships in Track and Field, Oregon State wins the Pac-12 Championship in Wrestling, Oregon State duels it out with Stanford for the Pac-12 Tourney.
I suspect the lawsuits would fly then!
I would sacrifice any Beaver MBB wins against potential tournament teams in this scenario. Give the top MBB programs as many wins as possible and then take their earnings.
Not that there’s much risk of OSU winning those games….
This is the atomic bomb we’ve been waiting for.
Wazzu seems a lot more pissed off than OSU. I like it, but wish the Beavs would elevate their anger and stop the typical head-in-the-sand attitude.
They should be. Once again, intrigue is circling around U of W being the Judas in a lot of what has transpired. They hide behind the old mantra of “we were just looking out for our own self interest”- I guess they told Chung one thing and did another last week and he is pissed. U of W tried to get the Beavs kicked out of the PAC 10 back in the early ’80’s as we just ‘weren’t competitive enough’ to their liking. The irony in all this is there is only one team I know that has gone 0-12 in a season and it ain’t the Beavs.
And don’t forget baseball with Meggs on the selection committee and the Beavs not getting a bid in 2016 despite finishing third in the P-12.
I hope Barnes is spending his time actually figuring out a solution instead
That’s what he would like us to think. I don’t – not for a second.
Oh, now I get it, you were joking!
They should do that
Marty Maurer’s son has Beavs, WSU, Grand Canyon, BYU and New Mexico as his final 5. Would be awesome to see the Maurer name continue on in Beavs athletics but I don’t know why anyone interested in scoring points would come to play for Tinkle.
Wilner lays out the “war chest” thing.
https://www.seattletimes.com/sports/wsu-cougars/mailbag-cash-available-for-pac-4-options-for-wsu-and-osu-and-more/?amp=1
Thanks for posting, this one wasn’t behind a paywall.
Passing 1200 posts, nuc beav going bananas
Maybe I’m naive, but why the sense of urgency to join the MWC. I think they would love to have OSU and WSU at any time. Don’t know if it would change anything if the Beavs have a great season, but it can’t hurt their standing among peers.
I don’t think there is any urgency to join MW. The have to look at their options and that is one of them, but it has to be an absolute last resort. I agree, the MW would gladly take the at any time.
BIG12 is having a meeting tomorrow to discuss the members that have been vetted to become the 17th and 18th team in the BIG12.
MHver3 reported last night that Wazzu and OSU were being vetted by the BIG12 the past couple of days. SDSU & Cal as also rumored to be in the running for these spots.
“Best case” if we want to play by rules set by dinosaur cable companies is the Beavs go to the BIG12 and Cal/Stanford go to the ACC. I mean it’s completely absurd, but if people want to keep playing this game that’s what we’re looking at. I know I’d at least continue to watch the Beavs, whereas if they join the MWC I can’t say for sure I’d watch. Maybe, but probably not. There’s just zero intrigue.
It’s sounds like the BIG12 wants the PAC-12 network infrastructure so they can sell extra games to streaming. The BIG12 will still be the 3rd wheel but at least they have shown they have to leadership to survive and to also be forward thinking vs the 2 gorillas in the room (SEC and BIG10). Hitching our wagon to the BIG12 is probably OSUs best chance at survival in this current climate.
Big if true
Yeah where is NuclearBeav? Hanging out at his safe space “Benny’s House” hahaha. So sad.
Guess his efforts to shut down the site from the safe house didn’t work
MHver3 interview last night. Beaver Wazzu expansion talk starts at 43:35
https://open.spotify.com/episode/07XekFHuWx3sgOWxhVod0W
Beavs run game and Brays D are conference champ caliber, kicking game?……not so much.
From sedge:
Everett Hayes missed his only field goal attempt from 34 yards, banging it off the right upright. Despite the miss, Hayes said after practice he was feeling healthy and confident, more like his 2021 self. He did disclose that he wasn’t fully healthy last year, and that affected him mentally. Atticus Sappington nailed his only kick from 31 yards out.
I don’t think we’ll be attempting many FGs this season.
Oof if he can’t even make a 35 yarder consistently we’re in trouble.
Lame
Am I understanding the upcoming 12-team playoffs correctly? If there are only four P-5 conferences, two Go5 conference champions will get a bid now also? If that’s accurate, no wonder the big schools want changes.
If things don’t change I could see OSU being a regular in the playoffs which the powers that be will hate.
Nobody will want to read it, but Wilner’s opinion on WSU/OSU’s options moving forward arent very optimistic.
“There are only two paths forward for the Cougars and Beavers: Remain in the Pac-12 — if Stanford and Cal do the same — or enter the Mountain West.
The Big 12, Big Ten, ACC and SEC are simply not options. Realignment is unforgiving and based primarily on media valuation and, to a lesser extent, geography.”
I am somewhat skeptical that this Big 12 vetting is even happening for OSU/Wazzu. I guess this will be the test for MHver3 and his inside information.
If Stanford and Cal are going ACC, I fail to see how ESPN would even have a need for OSU/WSU for their late slot. Feels like this dude is just trying to secure a bigger following and dangling a carrot in front of OSU and WSU fans when the reality isn’t great. If Stanford and Cal go to the ACC, that will be a crushing blow for Oregon State. I think they need Stanford and Cal to be rejected by the ACC to be at all considered by the Big 12 or to rebuild the PAC-12. They can really only get a renegotiated with Apple with the Bay Area schools.
I’d rather quit than go the MWC route. We’d be destined for mediocrity as we lose coaches and players while figuring out how to maintain a program on that little budget. I have no interest in watching that play out.
His argument makes little sense. Geography isn’t entering the equation for the other ex-PAC team moves and OSU isn’t that different from many Big 12 or ACC teams in terms of TV ratings.
losing P5 status is a death sentence. That is all that matters as this point. Whatever discount or reduced share we have to agree to is worth keeping us in the game. Paying our own way for a couple years in the Big12 is a million times better than joining the Mtn West. We have to play this pac-12 thing to the end. If we go all season with no answers in hopes that we get a last second bail out, so be it. We can’t afford to settle for Mtn west bull shit. We will never recover from the demotion. This is a shitty game we are playing but we have to play it or we become portland state….
Or Peterson era Boise state.
If JS will stay, roll the dice….
I’m afraid it’s a different era.
Not sure if this was posted already but looks like Chance Nolan is no longer with TCU. Interesting. Academic issues? Perhaps some character issues? Too bad it’s not working out for him.
Maybe lingering injury issues?
One part of the vetting process I’m sure the networks will Push with Osu / Wazzu is keeping the civil war and apple cup Alive. Those are two additional marquee highly watched games to potentially bring under the big 12 and network umbrellas. Without us and the Cougs getting a P5 home they likely go away entirely.
That and the potential to absorb the PAC 12 network are 2 key selling points.
Connor LeTourneau, ex Oregonian writer now with SF gate in the Bay area, has an interesting piece up tonight worth reading. If I were more capable I would provide a link but I’m sure someone can provide it. Here’s the basics: now that Stanford and Cal have been stymied in moving to the ACC, they have renewed interest in rebuilding the Pac. Need 6 teams, as pointed out earlier, preferably 8 for scheduling purposes. The candidates are those I pointed out earlier this week: San Diego State, SMU, Rice and Tulane; that is, high end academic institutions that provide geographic diversity and a modicum of success in big time football at some point in their history.
Yes please…
Yuck. Big no to smu, Tulane, rice.
Why?
SMU and Tulane will spend money to become sustainable top level programs. They don’t quite have as much money as Stanford. But they, along with Rice, are on the short list for most monied schools in the country.
Rice may or may not just be another Stanford, in that they’ll spend a little bit on football. But most people go to see what the band is going to do at halftime. They do have an advantage, in that their stadium was built when they were a football powerhouse. So it’s one of the most beautiful stadiums in Texas, architecturally, even if it does need some updates.
Recruiting opportunities in Houston, Dallas, and New Orleans. Travel opportunities for us fans with easy destinations.
The NCAA mandates at least seven teams to make a viable conference, and having gobs of money within that group can’t hurt.
The recruiting geography is the most attractive part of adding SMU/RICE to the Pac.
I don’t like the travel distances for SMU/RICE/Tulane and I’m sure those program won’t enjoy coming up to Oregon/Washington either.
Still better than travel to the east coast, regardless.
Leaves room in a couple years to add on to alleviate said travel.
But at least they’re all hubs or destination cities, not hours away from one.
good points, Jack. This is one of the few times I haven’t agreed with Angry. (Smith on fourth down in Pullman a few years ago is another. what a quaint argument that was in retrospect.) Texas and Louisiana are recruiting hotbeds, arguably, easier to get to than a drive to Pullman! Who wants to go on bended knee to ask Fresno and Boise if we can join their league? Or, take less money than Boise, who gets a million more than anyone else in the MW. With time, I could see the “Pacific and Gulf Coast Conference” (I’ll call it) perhaps prying away two other schools from the MW: Air Force and Colorado State would be my choices.
Charley Crockett calls his music Gulf and Western, so I’m digging the Gulf reference.
This isn’t any better from a travel perspective than the Big 12 would be.
Would the Big 12 add four teams?
https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/ncaafb/can-cal-and-stanford-lead-effort-to-salvage-pac-12-time-is-running-out/ar-AA1f7jtj
Informative about situations, possibilities – coverage in Oregon is milquetoast, if at all.
thanks. this is the full LeTourneau article I referenced above. I had forgotten one other key element worth highlighting, adding Gonzaga as a basketball only school (and baseball too, I imagine.)
I was hoping for the first 2k. But the thread is getting a bit slow. Thoughts?
Still working fine for me; should keep it open until there’s a safe landing.
It’s our version of growing a beard until we get into a conference.
My vote is for a new thread. Cherry pick best posts that could use further discussion.
MHver3 reporting remaining PAC4 are going to sue Fox, Nike, Oregon, and UW. Also the last 3 Pac-12 meetings none of the school that are leaving have attended. The next meeting will discuss by-law review sounds like they may try to withhold $ from outgoing schools. Sounds like this is going to get very ugly. WSU is having an emergency BOR meeting as we speak.
To quote Emperor Palpatine: “let the hate flow through you”
They ended the meeting with no public comment given.
If I’m reading it right as soon as a school gives notice that it’s leaving the conference it no longer has a seat at the table. So they couldn’t attend the meetings if they wanted to.
Sounds like the perfect setup for the PAC4 to channel all possible revenue to themselves.
correct. By announcing you are leaving you forfeit your votes and meeting attendance. It would be like a CEO stepping down, but still having a full year of pay and being around the offices, but not having any say as to what goes in said meetings. They’re the Milton’s from Office Space. Getting paid, but fired at the same time. The Pac-4 are lining up to “Fix the glitch” when it comes to the B1G-4 and Big-IV.
Honestly, I do not expect any of the 4 teams to announce their new conference publicly until the end of the Baseball season. Why would they announce publicly and forfeit their rights as sole owners of the conference shares? The longer this drags on, the more exposure the Pac-4 get and the more the media talks about us. So ya, no reason to announce officially OSU & WSU are going to the Big XII and Stanford and Cal are most likely going to the ACC to stabilize their conference. Again, this is my opinion and is pure speculation.
Here’s an interesting article from Sports Illustrated. https://www.si.com/college/2023/06/07/pac-12-schools-verbally-agree-to-conference-wide-grant-of-rights
Basically, it states back in June, the Pac-12 had a verbal GOR agreement among all conference members. Looks like 8 of these schools forgot about that verbal agreement.
Not that I’m defending them in any way, shape, or form, but how would Nike be involved?
Rumor is that Phil Knight was pulling strings behind the scenes with the networks and B1G. I don’t know shit about it but that’s apparently anti trust things.
I recall reading that, as well
that Knight would be behind this doesn’t surprise me at all. I think a good case can be made that Fox colluded with UW and UO to defraud OSU and WSU
Hasn’t Knight donated small sums to OSU before? Time for someone in the Beavs camp to reach out to Knight and explain that more donations are going to be needed very soon as a “settlement” so to speak.
“Hasn’t Knight donated small sums to OSU before?”
No.
Opened tweets this morning:
1)clownzono…”The Pac-12 had an offer from ESPN of $30 million per school in the fall of 2022. The network wanted it all. But the presidents and chancellors wanted more.
“We said we want $50 million per school.”
ESPN’s response?
“Goodbye.”
2)Jermar Jefferson…Beav and bxii logos
3) MHver3 with the news posted above
Pac is just all over the place
So in a nutshell the P-12 higher-ups or as I like to call them “the numbnuts” thought they were worthy of SEC/Big 10 TV money instead of ACC/Big 12 dollars? Gross miscalculation!
FWIW that’s not Munch posting that.
Just saw another fun yet completely unsubstantiated twitter post-
Chris Petersen (a Fox employee) was at Oregon State football practice talking to Scott Barnes.
Could be bullshit, could be true.
Who cares? He knows JS. He’s still supposed to be reporting on college football. Oregon State plays college football.
Well, Daschel confirmed it on twixer FWIW. Not that it means much either way, but still interesting from a football standpoint.
I think someone posted this already but not sure: https://www.oregonlive.com/collegefootball/2023/08/pac-12-mailbag-cash-available-for-the-pac-4-rules-of-withdrawal-options-for-beavers-and-cougars.html
and:
https://www.johncanzano.com/p/canzano-an-empty-gun-the-downfall
Canzano also reports that Oliver Luck has been hired as a consultant/advisor by the P-4. Luck wouldn’t speak with Canzano, but supposedly has deep connections. Another source is saying that rebuilding the league is an option on the table.
hmmm. Luck. West Virginia guy, right? I wonder if he knows MVher3?
Is Stanford and Cal to the ACC still official, or has that changed again?
I never saw anything that said it was official.
angry was the only one that reported it
I think there was some erroneous intel going around yesterday afternoon from a couple of media sources. Even my wife who has zero interest in college football was telling me that Stanford/Cal were going to the ACC. I told her “Not yet”.
That what I figured. There’s been erroneous info going around for months.
and even that was a source at ESPN, Angry said. As if that mafia operation is disinterested in the matter.
Copied from KOMO 4 in Seattle FB page:
Hello Friends. For those of you around the world, what follows may or may not be interesting. It is about the collapse of an American football college conference that had existed for more than 100 years. But I suppose it’s also about the the state of the world in general, in some ways. I’m posting it here because I’m mad and disillusioned.
Post Mortem on the Pac
(An Angry Coug’s Thoughts on the Demise of the Pac-12)
By Eric Johnson
What strange bedfellows they make, the University of Washington and their hated rivals, the University of Oregon, now forever linked in history as the shrewd duo that burned the Pac-12 Conference to the ground. Or, at the very least, threw the last match on its smoldering remains.
A picture emerges of ambiguous behavior, of knowing winks and crossed fingers behind the back, fronted by promises and pledges and vows of solidarity. Backchannel deals in the night, fueled by the kind of all-consuming ambition that isn’t talked about in pep rallies and fight songs.
In December of 2022, once the shock wore off when USC and UCLA announced that they were leaving the Pac-12 and joining the Big 10, the question was obvious: what will Oregon and Washington do? That’s because of power and money and national visibility, things those institutions have earned over time (in Oregon’s case, thanks to a billion dollars from the founder of Nike).
For the longest time the silence from Montlake and Eugene was deafening. No announcements of solidarity. No “Circle the wagons” statements. At least not publicly.
Their silence was like chum into shark-infested waters.
And so we waited.
Make no mistake: the silence and the eventual abandonment of the Pac-12 was never about the well-being of student-athletes or academic considerations or the mission statements of institutions of higher learning. This was about something far more important. Money.
TV money.
Thursday, August 3. They had a deal. Ask WSU’s President Kirk Schulz. Ask Dr. Michael Crow, ASU’s longtime President. Or Oregon State’s Athletic Director Scott Barnes. Ask any of them. They had a deal.
They’d agreed in principle to a media rights package with Apple. Pac-9 games (Colorado, by this time, had also abandoned the Pac) would be carried on a subscription streaming-based model, which is where sports programing is headed anyway, right?
Arizona State president Dr. Michael Crow described it this way: “We were offered a media contract by the Apple corporation that was really a technological, 23rd century Star Trek thing of really unbelievable capability that we were really very interested in.”
Kirk Schulz, one of the longest tenured of any of the presidents involved, and who’d taken on a leadership role in negotiations, called it, “an innovative and forward-looking partnership proposal with Apple” that would “significantly grow the revenue coming into each school over the next several years.”
It was not a garbage deal. It was forward thinking. It was an attempt to preserve the past by boldly venturing into the future. Various reports indicate it would have guaranteed schools between $23-$25-million per year early on, and that by year three, the deal would have eclipsed what Big-12 and ACC teams are getting.
Was it as much money as a school might get by forsaking everything and selling itself to the highest bidder? No, it was not.
But it wasn’t garbage.
Schulz said, “We finished our board meeting on Thursday evening with a strong feeling of staying together, pursuing a new partnership with Apple, and moving forward with conference expansion.”
One imagines a sense of unity in that last meeting Thursday night, a kind of collegial camaraderie. Pushed to the brink, they were pushing back. It must have felt good. ASU President Crow says, “We were the stalwarts fighting for the Pac-12, til the last inch.”
Oregon State Athletic Director Scott Barnes put it this way: “(We were) literally hours away from a deal that everybody could embrace.”
That night, the chair of the WSU Board of Regents, Lisa Schauer got an encouraging update.
“On Thursday,” she says, “WSU President Kirk Schulz and Athletics Director Pat Chun presented to me an innovative media plan that would position the Pac-12 to lead the Power Five conferences into the future.”
But there was another meeting. It was a 10:30pm closed door emergency meeting of the UW Board of Regents.
Maybe it was interrupted by a phone call from the Big-10. Or maybe that call came the next morning.
The rest of the league presidents and chancellors slept well. Why wouldn’t they? They had banded together and saved the conference. Just a few signatures away…
John Canzano, a columnist and radio host in Portland who’s been on the front edge of reporting on the Pac-12 for many years, says, “After they broke the meeting, as they went to bed they believed they were on the same page.”
Canzano believes that it was early Friday morning that the Big-10 came calling. Again. It might have been as early as 5am.
They upped their offer. Washington and Oregon would get a 50% share of the Big-10 media rights deal with Fox/NBC/CBS for six years (about $35-million per year) and then when the NEXT deal came around, they would get full shares. Theoretically over $70-million per year.
What a grotesque Frankenstein monster we’ve created.
The Pac-12 (what was left of it) CEO group was scheduled to meet at 7am Friday morning to sign their deal with Apple.
Eight minutes before that meeting was scheduled to start, Kirk Schulz’s phone vibrated. UW President Ana Mari Cauce had sent him a text message. She told him that the Huskies were leaving the Pac for the Big-10. Thanks for the memories.
Minutes later Oregon President John Karl Scholz informed the conference that his school was leaving for the Big-10.
Schulz said he was, “shocked.”
“Stunned” was the word WSU Regents chair Lisa Schauer used.
Oregon State AD Scott Barnes said, “I’m furious.”
They really fooled ’em all, didn’t they? Snookered the whole lot. What a bunch of suckers.
Ana Mari Cauce got in front of a camera not long after. She pumped her fists when she talked about Washington’s “very real excitement at joining the Big-10 Conference.”
“This is a great move,” she said.
She said something else, too. “In the end we had to do what was right.”
And that was it.
Arizona and Arizona State were the next to fall, grudgingly. Together they’d pledged to stay in the Pac-12 unless the UW and Oregon bailed. They accepted an invitation to join the Big-12.
Utah left the same day.
Maybe I should grow up. Maybe I should have realized that the big guys always step on the little guys. That it’s ALWAYS about money, stupid. Always. It’s the way of the world.
See, my problem is I keep forgetting that the world works that way. Like a child, I keep believing in other things. Shame on me.
It’s possible that none of it ever really meant anything. The rivalries, the history, the 108 years. The road trips and the tailgates and the trash talk. All that hugging and backslapping in the grandstands, the singing of fight songs and the little tears that formed in the corner of our eyes when we charged onto the field and jumped up and down like fools.
Maybe it’s been a load of nonsense the whole time, all the way back to when my Dad drove me to Pullman to watch the great Jack Thompson slay giants. “The Cougs’ll find a way, Pal, you just watch and see,” he used to say.
Seems so silly now.
“It stinks,” John Canzano says. “They did what was best for them. They did not do what was best for athletes or fans or tradition or rivalry. They did what was best for themselves.”
UW President Cauce said something else the other day. She said with a straight face, “There is no question that the Apple Cup is a cherished tradition. And we want to continue our long history with the Cougars.”
How laughable. How rich.
Budgets will tighten in Pullman and Corvallis, and maybe at Cal and Stanford too. Athletes will leave, jobs will be cut, traditions will die. Lives will be changed.
In the end, the most infuriating thing for the Cougar faithful is that when all was said and done, after 108 years of scrapping and fighting and believing, of slapping Husky hands away when they tried to pat us on the head, after all that, in the end, WSU’s fate lay squarely in the hands of… the University of Washington.
But wait, that’s not entirely true. Not entirely. Because the more we learn about what happened during the death throes of the Pac-12, the more we realize that it was Oregon pulling the wagon the whole time, and that the University of Washington was just along for the ride.
Says Canzano, “This was 100% Oregon driven.” One principal player painted for him the metaphor of a bunch of cowboys at a table in a saloon, shaking hands with some of their guns drawn under the table. The biggest gun was green, not purple.
Canzano’s sources tell him that Washington was never going to go it alone. Oregon might have, and it would’ve taken guts. But not the Huskies. For all of their Bow Down bravado and disdain for all things green and yellow, they were going to do whatever Oregon did. Just follow along.
Strange bedfellows indeed.
A long time ago, when baseball owners were wrestling with the concept of revenue sharing, George Steinbrenner famously said, “I own the NY Yankees, not the Seattle Mariners.” In other words, to hell with the rest of them.
The University of Washington has certainly the right to say, “We’re the U-Dub, not WSU.” To hell with the rest of them.
But having the right is not the same as BEING right.
And what happened last week wasn’t right. It never will be.
They’ll make a lot of money. They’ll be rich!
But do you know what I think? I think every time they cash one of those fat network checks there will be a little voice in the back of their heads, nagging at them, softly at first and then louder and louder, about something they’d like to forget.
They destroyed a thing that was beautiful.
maybe UW should change the lyrics of their fight song to “Bow down, to Oregon.”
FUCK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Murthy just sent out an e-mail to ALL OSU and said they’re going to “stabilize” and “rebuild” the Pac-12. So now it will be the G6 and P4. We need real leaders at Oregon State. I am so pissed right now! So pissed. Here’s to losing ALL of our momentum we had building. I’m done. I am done with sports. Ridiculous.
please explain why you think this is a bad thing.
The only reason they would say to keep the pac-12 alive is to eventually merge with the Big XII after we add the teams BY wants, but doesn’t have the assets to get himself. So I could see us adding SDSU, Gonzaga, and any other teams and then merging with Big XII as we will pay for their GOR to be broken. It’s the only thing I can see that makes any sense.
I honestly see us going to Pac-7 to start.
Add these teams
Hawaii – Football only
Gonzaga – All sports
SDSU – All Sports
This takes us to 6 teams in each sport and allows the conference to be pseudo-independent and be able to bring in big-time opponents, which will allow flexible scheduling.
Gonzaga has football?
Angry, why the hell do you have to be right in that media is killing football? I say I’m done, but it’s like a train wreck. I want to see how Oregon State can even operate in a G6 conference. We might as well go to D-II and play Linfield if travel is such an issue. What a joke. Enjoy this season because I guarantee you, coaches will be leaving at the end of the year if not after the CFP Committee decides to go to 8 automatic bids for the P4 schools next year for those who make their conference championship, they are automatically in the CFP and then 4 top ranked G6 teams will be taken in the 12 team format. As it stood, it was 5 power conference champions and 7 at large bids. it will now for sure be diminished even more than that now.
The only “P4” option was Big 12, which is really improbable if Stanford and Cal don’t land somewhere else. Did you want to land in the MWC?
Sue the traitors and meddlers and use the money to rebuild the conference sounds like a decent plan.
Rebuilt PAC is better than MWC.
I tend to agree, especially if the implied strategy is rebuild the PAC by absorbing the best of the MW. I have the sense now that the MW might have overplayed its hand. really pissed off OSU and WSU
It’s the same thing, but a different conference name. taking the best G5 schools and making a hodge podge of teams is not going to get you into the SEC and B1G dance. ACC will suffer the same fate in 2031.
Pac-12 should add Gonzaga all sports, Hawaii football only, and SDSU and that’s it. This gets us to 6 teams as the minimum, we have travel to hawaii which gives teams who travel an extra game and then we can have 6 OOC games and be a pseudo independent at the same time. This makes sense to me. Go smaller conference and play the full 12 game schedule.
Wouldn’t Colorado State make more sense than Hawaii?
The predators aren’t circling CSU, right now.
We need to lock in value and media markets that are left.
I would think that if the P-4 rebuilds and is able to add the right teams, they have a strong argument for P-5 status. I was reading about how this P-5 and Go5 came about and I don’t think it’s set up with any legal standing. It’s actually time for the NCAA to grow some cajones, but I’m sure they are scared that the SEC and Big 10 will just say to hell with the NCAA if it gets nasty.
I say: dare the SEC, Big 10, Big 12, and ACC to vote the “Pacific Coast Conference” or “Pacific and Gulf Coast Conference” out of the CFP arrangement if they can get to six by next June. Dare ’em. Raises the stakes for damages in the incipient lawsuit.
now I see the Big 10 wants to alternate their conference title game between Vegas and Indy. They want to crush the Pac.
As of now the Beavers have 4 possible outcomes (starting with most desirable)
1. BIG12
2. Rebuilt PAC with original 4 plus best G5 brands
3. AAC
4. Mt West
3 and 4 are the final nail in the coffin.
MHver3 has said a couple of times he is being told if the PAC4 sue the networks will quietly find a home for the remaining 4 teams in the PAC in the P4. Today the PAC is saying we are going to sue the shit out of everyone involved and do everything we can to keep as much of the remaining TV $ as possible ($400 million). They are also publicly saying they are going to rebuild the PAC. They are saying loud and clear we are not going down without a fight. Now the networks, BIG12, UW & OU have a decision to make, do they want to fight this or make it go away? If they make it go away we end up in the BIG12 and get a stay if execution (for now). If the networks BIG10 and UW/UO fight this it will be horrible publicity and could drag on for years. Also we go ahead take every penny we can away from the other schools and build a decent conference with good brands from G5. Also Stanford has more than enough cash to fight this forever. My guess is at that point once we get 6-8 teams we go back to Apple and do a deal. Apple wants content and lots of it with College football. It could be argued option 2 is the best chance for the Beavers to thrive long team getting out front with streaming. This is a much better option than going to the AAC or MTwest with our tail between our legs. At least we are fighting.
concur. fight it out. battle on. Sue em and dare em to kill a conference in plain sight by excluding them from the CFP; worth 80 million per year to the new “Pacific and Gulf Coast Conference.” Even the tools on Gameday can be relied upon to rally to the new conference’s cause. And you know that ND will never vote for something that hurts Stanford. In fact, if ND wanted to do something noble, they should immediately announce a plan for home and homes in football in Corvallis, Pullman, and Berkeley. Doesn’t matter if it’s out five six years in the future. Just add OSU, WSU and Cal to the existing SC and Stanford rotation.
No, they join our conference and then I will think differently of ND and it will piss EVERYONE off.
I was thinking the same thing but I thought it might be seen as jumping the shark.
Deleted
She is not going to tip her hand about the BIG12. Best way to fight this is to publicly say we are rebuilding the conference and suing everyone that fucked us. This is the only way to get a home for all 4 teams in the P4. If the networks and BIG10 want to fight fine we will rebuild and dare them to fuck us again. The more I think about this it’s a good strategy under the current circumstances.
concur. The best way to proceed is to convey a confident stance, not pose as supplicants. It’s akin to the best defense is a good offense. Go on the freaking offense. Threaten legal action if it there isn’t any follow up for a while. Soften em them up. We know that UW and UO feel vulnerable now from a PR perspective. seize on that.
Interesting.
I wonder if they can free some cash up to buy out SDSU?
Then probably pitch some iteration of Jack’s Revenge of the Nerds conference.
SMU will volunteer the cash to buy out SD from the MW. They have almost as compelling a need to fight this out we and the Cougs do. It’s their last chance to get to a so called Power conference. SMU just gets the PGCC to 5. We need a sixth.
I think this would end up looking like this:
PAC buys out SDSU with some of the extra $
SMU pays whatever it takes buy out of AAC and join the PAC
Tulane & Rice
This keeps Stanford and Cal happy with high powered academic schools. Then the following year work on other opportunities.
I would also not be shocked if the remaining 4 schools tell everyone else you are not eligible for any conference championships or auto NCAA births this season. It feels like this is personal now and the remaining teams will find any way to stick it to these guys (especially USC, Hole, and UW)
Yes I believe that is exactly the plan.
I’m sure Stanford can help with getting teams from the MWC. Maybe we’ll be the ones to show the G5 how to fight back. Go smaller conferences with local reach. Elevate FCS schools around you and bring those teams into the FBS family. fight fire with fire.
C-Net (I think) since Messi to Miami – Apple MLS streaming – doubled subscriptions – Messi gets some of the money –
But I think the total subscriptions is not even 100,000 total.
It was almost 1 million, before Messi was announced.
by the way, dividing the CFP 80 million per conference by 6 or 8 yields a better return than dividing by 18. That’s a powerful incentive for trying to preserve the Pac’s seat at the CFP table rather than folding our tents and begging for a lifeline from the ACC or Big 12, respectively.
Stick it to the Big 10, I say, and teach UO and UW, and the sports world, a powerful lesson.
CFP is going to a per school model for the CFP payout instead of a per conference model, so each P5 team will get the same amount regardless of the number of members in the conference. This is because SEC with 14 members was getting less per school than Big 12 with 10 members. Now that it is per school, each power 5 school gets the same amount from the pool.
I think this is why the pac4 has to say they are rebuilding. If they are threatening to bring 8 new members to the power 5 then I assume that negatively affects payouts for all other power 5 schools. Same total pool divided by more school equals less per school. Basically saying they will rebuild gives all teams in all conferences a little extra incentive to find landing spots for them.
Also by suing Fox, this may give Fox some incentive to tell Big 12 they will pay for additional schools if they are Pac 4 school to help make it go away. This would help them get a full payout from Big 12.
Imagine if Fox agreed to give Calford a full Big10 payout to make the lawsuit go away so they get more $ than OR/WA. Not likely but it would be hilarious to see!
I’m thinking the lawyers have reviewed and there is truly some money to be had and some legal cards to play. The NCAA MBB basketball credits are a decent chunk of change also. Does the P-12 get next year’s March Madness credits also? If so, we should be rooting for UCLA or Arizona to go as far as they can.
My best case scenario for OSU
1. Never go to the mountain west, no matter what, once we admit we’re not power 5 we’ll never return. Pretend if we have to.
2. rebuild the PAC –
I suggest
WSU, Gonzaga (non football)
OSU, BSU
Stanford Cal
UNLV, SDSU
Rice, SMU
UTSA (11-3 last year), Tulane
12 team conference and 11 football members. It can be divided nicely into North and South in order to limit travel.
Gets you Spokane, Boise, Portland, Bay Area, San Diego, San Antonio, Dallas, Houston, and New Orleans.
SMU, Rice, and Tulane all former members of power conferences, with tons of money. They would be expected to follow TCU’s blue print. Invest in coaches and facilities, the wins will come.
Stanford Call wont like the MW schools added but maybe SMU, Tulane and RICE will make it easier to swallow as they have stellar academic reputations.
3. Fight like hell to keep the pac power 5.
4. Sue everybody and dont let the schools that left have dime from the pac coffers, keep it all to offset the loss of TV money.
5. Wait for the next round of realignment and hope you’re in a better position.
Agree and I think this is the play. Fight like hell and make it as uncomfortable as possible for everyone that is responsible for this mess. Who knows they might want to make this all go away and put OSU & WSU in the BIG12 and Stanford and Cal in the BIG10. The more I think about this with the possibilities with Apple maybe just planting a flag and fighting is the best move even over going to a P4 conference?
This is the outcome I would bet on. Stanford and Cal are such obvious fits for the Big 10’s western division. I’m actually shocked they didn’t go at the same time as UO and UW. WSU and OSU are also clear fits with the way the new Big 12 is coming together. The lawsuits are going to be absolutely massive so this is by far the easiest settlement. As the PGA Tour – LIV Golf litigation has proven, after enough pain has been brought to the table a settlement becomes inevitable.
To hell with the Big 10 and 12. Rebuild the conference and stay with that decision. I never thought I could despise the ducks more than I always have. I was wrong.
I’m sure SMU, Tulane and Rice are good schools but there is zero chance that Stanford and Cal view them as being in the same tier. And from an athletics perspective, their brands are sub-zero.
I agree but Stanford and Cal may not have any better options. They could do a whole lot worse.
US News Academic Rankings
Rice 15
SMU 44
Tulane 72
All the pac schools that left were 100+ except for UCLA, USC and Colorado.
If we can stay power 5, it wouldn’t be unreasonable to assume Beavs could be in the playoff every other year or every third year. That is what you’d sell recruits and use to keep young QB’s like Chiles around.
screw power conferences. #BoycottPower4 Watch them cancel all the P4 futures on their schedule and only schedule other G6 teams.
Pac-12 will be the fight for getting back to what football was really supposed to be about. I honestly am feeling more confident Oregon State doesn’t lose their coaching staff. We will rally the G6 conferences to show how to fight back by seriously cancelling ALL P4 future games AND excluding the other teams playing in OUR conference. They didn’t want to be a part of the future, fine, we’ll be here for those who care about STUDENT-athletes, not just Athletes and $. There will be 2 different leagues. The D-ICFP and the NCAA D-I.
MHver3 just posted that the BIG12 commissioner has recommended that IF Stanford and Cal leave the PAC12 they will offer a spot to Wazzu and OSU. If the the PAC12 stays together they will offer the spots to SDSU and UCONN.
I don’t quite understand adding SDSU they still have the 34 Million buyout so not sure how that gets handled?
This is where the networks need to make a decision, do they find a home for Stanford & Cal in the ACC or the BIG10 to make all this go away or do they do nothing and fight this out with the attorneys and negative PR? I am guessing we will find out in the coming days.
I was just going to say that MHver3 had been a little quiet today considering the B-12 supposedly had the vetting session yesterday if I’m following the chronology accurately. It would be surprising if the networks and “poachers” didn’t do their legal homework regarding the P-12 schools left behind. I guess they thought the OSU/Wazzu would whimper off into the Mountain West? There’s too much future money involved and a real negative impact.
Angry or Admins, delete my e-mail i posted above! Let’s not tip our hand! I am not logged in because this site won’t let me edit posts even if I’m logged in.
I’m not seeing your email posted above. Email me with the text in the post. Then I can search the page for it. Anyone logged in should be able to edit posts. Upper right “Edit” button next to the time stamp. Might be below your avatar on a phone.
http://angrybeavs.com/football/17006#comment-402937 it’s at the time stamp of 12:56
Okay. I think I deleted it.
The entire email is already out there bud.
https://centraloregondaily.com/pac-12-college-football-oregon-state-beaver-osu/
No secrets to be kept.
^ ^
||||||||||||
It’s deleted. I’m logged in now, but I don’t see the edit or delete options in my web browser.
Me neither (edit button)
One week after UO and UW panic and sign up for the dinosaur “linear tv” realm, the NFL, per today’s Wall Street Journal, “said it would offer its cable channels NFL Network and Red Zone directly to consumers via its NFL+ streaming service, and would raise its price significantly. . . . The price increases for NFL+ subsribers come one day [!] after Disney, one of the largest players in the streaming industry, said it would raise the cost of the ad-free versions of its . . .streaming services by more than 20% each. The beefing up of NFL+ represents the league’s latest push to embrace digital platforms when traditional broadcast and cable television viewing is waning.”
Now, it is true that the Pac 9 didn;t have Disney and NFL caliber heft, but it’s beginning to look like poor George was not several years too early, but one week!
As for the notion of what the future holds, the journal goes on to add “Amazon pays $1.2 billion annually for its [streaming] package, which is nearly double what the NFL received from Fox Corp. in its previous deal.”
It’s not like the Big 10 and SEC won’t be able to pivot to streaming as soon as that becomes more advantageous however. The entire ballgame here is about “brand alignment” and maintaining a seat at the table with the biggest power players. That’s why it is absolutely existential for OSU and WSU to retain their status in a “power conference”….whatever that will look like…..
Yes but they have sign contracts all ready. You really think if ESPN offered a streaming option that they would give them a cut of the subscriptions?
They won’t, because they don’t own any production capability.
ESPN will do so before any of their TV contracts are up. Fox is behind by a bit, but they are starting the same process of hiding stuff behind a streaming paywall.
If they rebuild the Pac, I’m thinking they have to get some kind of assurance from the powers that be that it will be designated P-5 with a playoff spot guaranteed. I don’t know how that happens or if the schools have any leverage, maybe Stanford more than the others? Seems like a tall-ish task unless the threat of litigation is enough. I guess another argument could be that the B-12 just took a bunch of Go5 schools, so why can’t the Pacific?
Agree, but you still need a semi lucrative media deal to make new conference viable.
I have to admit that the contributions to the discussion from all of the posters on angrybeavs is quite educational and informative. Far beyond anything that Canzano or Wilmer have written about the catastrophe.
This blog is my news real, sports update, source for rumors, brainstorm sessions regarding possible future outcomes for OSU, legal updates, and general entertainment surrounding inept conference leadership.
I am on the other side of the denial-anger-grief-numb cycle and have some hope regarding what may come of this betrayal.
Thank you angrybeavs for 2500 posts in a 10 day stretch with lots of point/counterpoint and good speculative info.
Pac-4 for two years unless ACC takes Stanford and CAL!!!
The Pac-4 CCG the next 2 years gets an automatic bid to the CFP.
https://web3.ncaa.org/lsdbi/reports/pdf/searchPdfView?id=115611&businessCode=BYLAW_SEARCH_VIEW
https://web3.ncaa.org/lsdbi/reports/pdf/searchPdfView?id=115612&businessCode=BYLAW_SEARCH_VIEW
https://web3.ncaa.org/lsdbi/reports/pdf/searchPdfView?id=115613&businessCode=BYLAW_SEARCH_VIEW
https://web3.ncaa.org/lsdbi/reports/pdf/searchPdfView?id=115614&businessCode=BYLAW_SEARCH_VIEW
https://web3.ncaa.org/lsdbi/reports/pdf/searchPdfView?id=116086&businessCode=BYLAW_SEARCH_VIEW
It almost seems too good to be true, that they could potentially play as the P-4 in 2024, still have a year to add members, and give all the other P-5 conferences a big FU while they add teams for the ’25 season and beyond.
Does anyone have Lucy on their radar? I’m skittish and it does sound too good to be true.
All but left for dead and backstabbed by long time rivals/conference members with seemingly nothing but MWC staring us down and yet here is the miracle to stay afloat/still build and fully compete with a real shot at blowing up the pans of all the networks and bluebloods.
If the vote goes through to cutoff money and championship game from the departed schools, OSU has a great shot to gain the conference winner automatic spot for the next 2 years. Insane opportunity and a real recruiting chip to hold on to this roster and even build with transfers who don’t want to be part of the insane travel for all of those schools.
They can use 2 years of playing various G5 teams for 2 years. with 4 teams with 9 OOC games each, thet’s 36 teams in 1 football season. So 72 different G5 teams essentially could audition against a Pac-4 school to try and get a spot in the conference. It’s open season at this point. This includes the best football, MBB, WBB, Wrestling, Track and field, BB, Softball, Soccer, etc. This also allows the 4 teams to mitigate their travels while also getting paychecks from G5 schools. We won’t schedule a P4 conference foe. We then control the G5 market in 2024 and 2025 as well. A G5 wants to join our league, then schedule a game with us. doesn’t have to be home and home either.
Just heard ACC took a vote this afternoon again to add Stanford and Cal 11 yes 4 no. They need 12 yes. Ugh
Someone is holding out for a bigger payoff for their yes vote. Classic political power play at this point.
I heard it was 10 yes 5 no. Time to drop off some gifts. You can now bride players. Might as well bribe presidents.
A nice cheese plate perhaps.
What I was seeing is that grace period hasn’t been passed, it’s been up for review but has been tabled. From what I read, that was most recently done in June 2023 in fact. Perhaps I’m wrong. Regardless, no tv deals, would be super hard to maintain viability with a 4 team conference for potentially 2 years with 0 revenue outside of home games and the fans. I’m not super stoked about trying to build a conference tbh. It won’t stay a power 5 and I don’t see where funds come from to finance any exit fees needed for these schools to come over. Plus, I can’t imagine a world where we even sniff $10 mill a year media deal with a duct tape mish mash of other bad news bears teams. Maybe Apple is still desperate enough to expand their sports streaming entries that they’d take a flyer on a non-P5 conference conference of mostly lower viewership but seems very speculative at best. I also don’t know if i trust any of the 4 institutions to find the right person to lead the conference. They’re all responsible for the shit show of LS and GK and even now, a full week later, still seem caught up in their own hubris and vanity. Perhaps Calford can afford to do that, but definitely don’t see that being the right mindset for WSU/OSU and I’m not sure tying ourselves to Calford to keep a Pac name even makes the most sense. Seems like those schools have less urgency since they know they have golden parachutes if they need to resort to that. Meanwhile, I feel like WSU/OSU would need to partner with PBS for annual fundraising marathons featuring Jerry Lewis reruns.
On a positive note, Joey Wong is back with B3avs Baseball. Haven’t seen any announcements of coaches leaving but curious what spot he’s taking over. Just said assistant coach in the release statement.
Kerry Eggers says Darwin Barney isn’t returning
Oh dam, that sucks. The commute must’ve been hell.
Beavs hired Joey Wong, so we’re good.
I find it hard to believe that Stanford and Cal are going to allow Hawaii or Fresno St into the PAC, they will want to try to stick to some “academic standards”. Boise St. could slide in because they have a national brand.
SMU, SDSU, Gonzaga and Tulane have to be the early top targets. They check a lot of boxes: academics, basketball prestige (2 annual Final 4 contenders), and (important for us) a pretty good baseball lineup (SMU would need to add baseball and softball).
Darkhorse candidates: Rice (academics, Houston region) UC Davis (has a strong academic reputation, but might be too close geographically for Cal/Stanford to sign off on.
None of these schools have wrestling. Several of them might be expected to add sports to keep up with the PAC 4’s expectations.
Pac-10’s rebirth dreams,
Renewed rivalries take flight,
Hope sparks in the West.
Stanford football hasn’t played Hawaii in 50 years and only twice in 75 years. They haven’t played Fresno St in 95 YEARS! They are picky A.F.
Army and Notre Dame? Then Air Force and Navy a year later?
It would be the master stroke for a renewed
PAC to include Notre Dame. Which means it won’t be happening lol.
If Notre Dame joined Stanford and created a western wall for PAC8 conference the network execs would lose their minds.
Imagine an Apple deal that included Notre Dame in the calcs as part of the deal?
West-
OSU
WSU
Cal
Stanford
East-
Notre Dame
SMU
Rice
Tulane
Shot out the departing schools from money and championship placement.
Keep it at 8 for max $$/school and roll the dice on a new deal with Apple/Amazon combining Notre Dame and PAC network assets for streaming production.
Downside is Notre Dame may get cold feet if they see OSU on their schedule. Too many beat downs from OSU already.
Problem for Notre Dame is that they will not make the CFP losing two or three games a year. They will get squeeze out of the TV market by the B1G and SEC.
Joining the PAC would guarantee their position even if they went 6-6.
It would also improve our situation of recruiting immensely. I could see it as a short term to help Stanford and get the Pac-12 back into the discussion of rejoining the Power conferences.
ND is obviously the golden goose, but even if only the service academies joined I don’t see how we’re not a P5 conference.
???
What’s wrong with Hawai’i and academics?
Are we talking about a Hawai’i I’m not familiar with?
And then we talk about Boise being in, even though Stanford would say no to them?
Daschel is calling out MH3ver. Telling Beav fans not to put a lot of stock in the brick cell phone guy regarding a B-12 invite.
MHver3 has been a lot more on target than Daschel.
None of these guys/gals have been 100% on point but I do find it a little funny when the “mainstream/established” media calls out the the independent person. A prudent person is taking everything anyone is saying with a grain of salt but that MHver3 account has been fairly spot on recently.
Yeah, that’s what I thought too. I don’t know if it’s his personality or just the way he writes, but Daschel comes off as smarmy and condescending a lot of the time.
Oh yeah, he definitely comes off like he’s the smartest guy in the room. Perhaps he is, don’t know him personally.
Has anyone checked in on Sid finch3 twitter?
No twitter acct here, and since it’s gone to “X” can’t even read tweets from Sid or coaches, etc.
He has said BIG12 officials were on campus today
Thanks
it’s true. Here’s the flight to prove it.
https://flightaware.com/live/flight/EJA387/history/20230812/0100Z/KCVO/KJVY
I’m seeing stuff on Twitter from a Sidd Finch, mostly just smartass comments. No scoops if that’s what you’re looking for.
Is he gonna be our Friday starter?
Oliver Luck hired by the PAC 4 as a consultant……..seems a positive that the 4 are together in this move.
Then again, it’s a clownzano “scoop”, FWIW
Included in this piece regarding a 4 team FBS conference: “An NCAA bylaw states a conference will still be considered part of the FBS for two years after it drops below the eight-team threshold.”
https://www.on3.com/news/remaining-pac-12-teams-hire-oliver-luck-consultant-next-steps-4-cal-stanford-oregon-state-washington-state-conference-realignment/
This does seem like a confidence move away from Kliakoff to some degree. Luck has been involved in a lot of NCAA situations and the direct tie to Andrew and Stanford has to help with loyalty/resolve for the benefit of the remaining group.
Is Luck viewed as a heavy hitter among these execs who commands some respect/attention? Is he the soft approach of acceptability before the lawsuits get filed?
PAC4 strategy is to send Luck into the viper’s nest to confirm they aren’t yielding, then send in the nuclear option of lawsuits and veto powers to cut them off from further conference dollars.
Latest from Daschel. He really seems to want the Beavs in the MWC. Not sure where he’s getting his numbers.
“That number gets negotiated up to $7-8M if OSU/WSU goes to MWC. Playing in the Big 12 will add $7-8M in travel costs. OSU would be an annual CFP contender in MWC. Longshot in Big 12.
The goal is to survive and advance to 5 years from now when there’s another round of negotiations”.
My money is that in five years there is one giant conference of the haves and then there’s the have nots. Maybe 30-40 programs. The ncaa will split the haves into conferences based on regions and we are back to regions and more equity.
Edit:50-60 teams.
Nick was a Riley fan who basically tells Beaver fans to never expect better than competing for a conference title other than a lucky year here or there. Who are the dominant programs in the Big 12 that Oregon State would have to compete with? They’d win the Big 12 if they were in the league this year. MW deal would absolutely blow and I doubt OSU will even seriously look at joining
Now, I’m starting to hope for a B-12 invite just to make Dashel look bad!
That sounds more like Ken Goe who was also into the ‘Corvallis doesn’t have an airport, and the rest of the Lindsay Schell rants.
I’m a little unclear about the whole power conference thing. What I have read is the top 6 ranked conference champions get in. It could be 2 P5 schools and 4 non power. But we all know that the rankings are skewed to the SEC and BIG. Are there any bowl games outside of the championship that are automatic qualifiers? Or are they all being rolled in to the championship? It looks to me that P5 and G5 mean not so much in current 12 team playoff. My other question is if the Beavs could actually get a high ranking to get into the playoffs beating New Mexico or San Jose State. Did Boise St. and Utah get high ranks for their MW victories or was it their OOC victories?
I thought that too, but found that last year CFP payout was 80M to each P5 and 100M to all G5 so about 20M per G5 conference so a pretty big difference. That money is expected to double with a 12 team playoff. Format for the payout will change to a per team amount instead of a per conference amount, but the amount for each P5 team will still be significantly more than each G4 team, assume still something like a 4:1 ratio.
with Stanford and Cal failing for a second time to gain entry to the ACC, you have to wonder how much and long they will continue to humiliate themselves trying to gain entry. What must really gall them is that UNC is in the “no” column twice now; as they would view that institution as one of their academic peers. (Duke would be high on that list too). This has to be pissing ND off too which I think is a good thing for college football.
I have zero confidence in our leadership and any of the other Pac 4 leadership in building anything even remotely resembling a conference or even picking leadership for the conference based on current and past track record. I’m also not sure Stanford will allow schools in that we would need to even make a conference. Not to mention, who the fuck is gonna pay for a Pac 4 or Pac 8 for a year or so with 0 idea of who would even come join the Pac? Do we honestly believe that something featuring the 4 of us left out schools (who have been left out due to lack of eye balls on tv) and a rag tag bunch of other G5 schools that filter in during a 2-3 year period are significantly better off than the Mtn West or AAC? We’re not staying a P5 conference with any stretch of the imagination. Bowls are already looking for different partners after next year. I just don’t get it. I understand needing to look at all options but this seems like the option to go to once all other options have been denied…ie no invite by Mtn West or other G5 conferences.
How is the MWC any better? The TV money is locked in and small and the team lineup is set.
Reforming the PAC, there’s at least a chance of better TV money and the ability to cherry pick programs that will make the average quality of teams in the conference better than the average quality of the MWC or AAC.
For marketing purposes, Apple or whoever else will be able to do a whole lot more with the Shiny New Conference angle than “the MWC you already knew just got bigger!”
The pac network should quit showing anything that doesn’t include the 4 remaining teams. I wouldn’t mind getting to watch some replays of last season to get ready for this one.
They should also use their network to promote the remaining schools and discredit the others. I know it’s not much but could try and help change the narrative.
Notre Dame may end up holding all of the aces though. They do have eyeballs and may become motivated to convince Stanford to relax their stance in order to push back at all of the converging factions.
If ND wants to blow off ACC they could buy their way out and also demand better deals from apple/Amazon if they joined PAC8.
It depends on who is aligning behind closed doors and whether ND is actually upset about the events of the last 2 weeks and the very real damage it has done to all college sports. I hope they are indeed on the mobile side and not just public relations gaming.
Wonder how all of this might affect the refs this year if at all. Normally usc and the sucks get the calls but this year they might’ve screwed them and cost them their jobs going forward so maybe we’ll see a change or at least unbiased refs.
Darwin Barney is gone and Joey Wong returns.
https://twitter.com/kerryeggers/status/1690130658084229122?s=20
Wonder what y’all think of this move?
Based only upon their approach as players it seems a very slight downgrade, but they both have grown and coached since playing.
We still see Miiiitch keeping it “in the family”. Not all good nor all bad.
Thoughts?
DB was still in Portland right? Will miss him for sure but can’t blame the guy for not wanting to commute all over the place for 0 money. Glad Joey is back though.
Now, if Corvallis only had an airport……….
Really good timeline on the fall of the Pac-12.
https://www.cbssports.com/college-football/news/pac-12-on-brink-of-collapse-how-college-footballs-premier-west-coast-conference-fell-behind-in-realignment/
To start, ESPN offered Texas an ungodly amount of money for a network that was a complete failure, just to keep them from going to the Pac 10. Texas was fine with the Pac 12 Network, because they had been seeking just such a plan with the Big 12.
This is interesting:
“Scott’s unwillingness to sweeten the pot for premier brands such as UCLA, USC and Texas can be identified as a perilous blunder in retrospect.”
So not guaranteeing your conference will fail sooner than later is seen as a perilous blunder. Good to know.
In 2018 and 2019, the league was looking for different sources of revenue, including selling the PTN to ESPN (a willing buyer), and going the PE route. While some schools would be highlighted as complicit in all things Larry Scott, ALL presidents voted to extend Larry Scott’s contract at that time. USC and UCLA nixed all financing plans. Then USC spent the next couple years threatening to leave.
“But because of the Pac-12 Network’s failure under his leadership….”
The Pac 12 Network didn’t fail. The PTN is making the conference money, even with the pathetic distribution it gets. The distribution attempts and failures are where he failed. This narrative that the PTN is a failure is 100% wrong. ESPN doesn’t have the production quality the PTN has.
“Speaking a couple of weeks after the chaos, Kliavkoff was cool on expansion, saying the league would not be “reactively poaching any schools.” ”
This we now know is because USC said no. But we also know USC was already in talks with the Big Ten, when they did say no.
“University leaders were lukewarm on the deal’s lack of linear exposure and subscription-based payout incentives.”
…because they’re idiots. But I simply restate the sentence.
“With a reported base payout of roughly $20 million annually per school, the deal would have left the Pac-12 significantly behind its Power Five peers.”
It was 23m as a base, which is only a million or so less than ESPN offered as a guarantee, previously. ESPN’s offer included us giving them the PTN and the top distributions would have been 30m each. Apple’s lowest benchmark to exceed Big 12 payouts was easily achievable, and the upside, while hard to imagine the conference attains it, was more than 50m.
“If Pac-12 leaders had been willing to bend a knee to Texas….”
Again, Texas was in, until ESPN gave them 15m a year to not be in.
Not sure what this means:
“Fed up, UCLA and USC departed as new commissioner George Kliavkoff struggled to land a competitive media rights deal without the Bruins and Trojans as part of the package.”
“Still, there were opportunities to expand or partner with other leagues that the Pac-12 opted not to pursue.”
Again… USC.
The article is at least a linear timeline, even if the conclusion mucks it all up. It lacks some very well known details now. And Scott’s salary and the league office lease are now quaint low-hanging fruit to complain about.
A lot (most?) of what has been written is already known, it is surprising to see other pac team rubber neckers and supposed beav fans feigning shock at the corruption or worse yet, deny it
What time is todays scrimmage? Is it open to the public?
Is the thread dead?
Everyone is exhausted. It was a rough week.
I overcame being born tired, but I’ve suffered a relapse.
every possible scenario has been discussed. there’s nothing left to talk about except actual on field football news
The only news I’m waiting for:
1)the pac4 vote to knock out defectors from any conference payouts or conference appearances,
2) multiple lawsuits properly filed,
3) PAC network programming to be changed
4) Notre Dame to join our conference of champions.
5) football camp updates
It has been a tough week.
Well, at least there isn’t any talk about the Beavs going to the Big Sky, which came up more than once on this site during the nadir of the Anderpants era! Got to be grateful for what I can at this point!
MHver3 is reporting Luck is working with AAC on possible merger if ACC stays firm on no Stanford / Cal. AAC would dump “dead weight” for probably a 12 team conference and leave room for top end MWC schools in a year. Also he is saying if Luck can save the PAC he would probably be in as commissioner and GK would be out. This also solves ESPNs after dark time slots. Still early but this is what he is working on.
Not sure if this prompts the BIG12 to pull the trigger on OSU / WSU now that there is another viable option being worked on. If OSU / WSU were to not be the last ones to leave stands to reason they would not bring the PAC-12 network and additional $ with them.
Barf. I don’t like the mountain west idea but a merger with the AAC is even worse.
12-15 million vs 5 million. You have to do the AAC. I don’t like either option either.
add travel expenses and it isn’t gonna be 12-15 million. Geography matters
How is taking a plane flight to Wyoming / Colorado/ New Mexico different than taking a plane flight to Texas / Louisiana?
That’s a nice cherry pick. You do realize Charlotte, East Carolina, South Florida and Florida Atlantic are in the AAC right?
And we are all saying have fun the the schools leaving the Pac due to increased travel.
This merger does the exact same thing. For a lot less money.
Why? This is a dumb idea.
This is just an example………granted this is UCLA and probably won’t be anywhere close to what an OSU budget would look like
“Kliavkoff also stated UCLA faces a minimum of a 100 percent increase in travel costs to play in the Big Ten (up to $16.2 million from $8.1 million) and the overall cost could rise to $31.1 million if the school relies solely on charter flights rather than commercial.”
Is it really financially worth it if that extra 7-10 million difference between the AAC merger and going MWC gets eaten up in the travel budget?
ALL things have to be considered here. That 12-15 mil ISN’T going to be the final number. In the end could an AAC merger make more sense financially? Of course. But until some numbers are crunched? This looks like a bad idea on paper and still puts the Beavs in the same G5 boat.
https://bleacherreport.com/articles/10049988-pac-12s-george-kliavkoff-has-significant-concerns-over-uclas-move-to-big-ten
Also media deal would be 12-15 million. Obviously not optimal.
I know nothing of Luck outside his son Andrew. Is this guy legit? Should we be happy his on our side?
Not sure good question.
His experience would seem to check all the right boxes. Honestly, I don’t love the idea of continuing on with the PAC whatever. Would prefer the big 12 because it would be in the best interest of our baseball program.
Yeah his experience looked pretty good but I wasn’t sure if was grifter type guy. I don’t like the idea of hiring some guy who knows everyone but leads the final four schools along for a few months then takes his money and disappears.
The AAC experience would also be good for bezbol.
Is he legit……seems so.
He got W.Virginia into the B12 when the BigEast fell apart, he has worked for the NCAA in charge of Regulatory Functions, amid other things.
Oh yeah, 3 of his 4 kids went to Stanford.
Should we be happy?……maybe. Maybe an indication that there is a desire to stay together since he was hired by the group of 4. Or maybe it’s COA due diligence by the Presidents as they look at the facets of going out of business.
He’s smart (as in Rhodes Scholar), does his view of the situation end up with a “hard truth” or a solid plan to stay together? And, still, there is that thing about the kids having gone to Stanford.
He’s very much legit. Well respected across the country. I think he’s gonna take over as the commish of the new PAC. He was brought in strictly to fix this mess and if anyone can do it, it’s him. Him being brought on makes it obvious there was never anything going on with the Big 12 even remotely. Expansion is going to be announced soon and we’ll probably see 4 teams added from the AAC and possibly SDSU
Smith after scrimmage today mentions field goal kicker made several…..didn’t specify which kicker.
https://oregonstate.rivals.com/news/watch-oregon-state-hc-jonathan-smith-talks-fall-camp-scrimmage
Conflicting reports on the tackling. Smith said it was “pretty good” but Kitan said otherwise.
BeaversEdge saying that DJ looked the best by far today and “totally different” from spring. No INT’s from any of the QB’s, front seven really got after the first offense, defense forced some fumbles.
Appreciate the updates
Yeah, that’s not very helpful. I think Atticus Sappington should finally get the nod this year just based on the best name in college football alone. He can get NIL money for a brand of British crumpets or tea.
Hayes missed at 35 but made the rest and sappington missed at 46 I think and made the rest.
A possible merger with AAC…
Teams of AAC:
Tulane, Rice, SMU, Memphis, South Florida, Wichita St, Temple, Navy, East Carolina, UTSA, North Texas, Fla Atlantic, UAB, Tulsa, Charlotte
There are currently 14 members in AAC. It will be a lot of travel with a lot less budget. I’m not sure such a merger would be best unless they add more western schools from MWC too and have a national footprint.
If Stanford has a tough time accepting Fresno St, how do they join a conference with UTSA? I don’t know much about these schools but is it unlikely that they are all top notch academic leaders?
Pull the best funded and western most of the group and see what happens.
Rice
SMU
Memphis
Tulane
UTSA(?)
Navy
Add from MWC
SDSU
Boise St
Air Force
Colorado St
Add PAC4
OSU
WSU
Cal
Stanford
This is what’s interesting. If it’s about travel and the student athlete well being, half the AAC doesn’t make sense being on the east coast. Sure they can cut some schools I guess but I wonder how that sits with Stanford when the schools likely cut are also some of the better academic ones. South Florida and Temple both score higher in a 3 tier scholastic grade that I’ve seen being g floated by some news sources. Also, the best sports schools like Fresno State, Memphis and Boise State are actually the lowest scoring of all the Mtn West, AAC and Pac 4 schools. Seems like we’d really need Stanford to swallow their pride and make some concessions, which seems unlikely considering they apparently passed on B12 for what’s likely academic standards. Perhaps if they can get some Mtn West schools to actually create a West and East division of the Pac Whatever, then it seems somewhat viable. However, if they can’t make that happen we’re in a situation where we actually travel MORE than the clowns who left for the B10 and we’re also doing that for much, much less money. That would be par for the course with this leadership though. Get less money, travel more and very real possibility of losing that P5 status after the grace period. Financially worse than taking a spot in the Mtn West, worse for your student athlete experience. Let’s say all the stars align and we do get a West/East division, this is still a conference that wouldn’t be P5 worthy and I don’t see the powers that be allowing that autobid to continue with a bunch of G5 schools considering talks are already happening to change that process up.
Minimize travel by adding Olympic-only schools to fill in regions.
Football can pay for itself, if scheduled correctly.
^^^^THIS
An AAC merger would NOT net an extra 7-10 million. In fact it may wind up being less than what the Mountain West would net. AND still be in a conference that would be G5.
Would ANYONE other than the fans of the 2 schools have ANY interest in watching OSU vs Texas-San Antonio? UAB? East Carolina? Rice or SMU?
I’m excited for the San Jose State game. I think it’s going to be a great game for 3 quarters and, like the Fresno game last year, is going to make this team a hell of a lot better defending the pass.
Wtf? The pac is showing replays of games all from teams that left. They should quit showing any of those unless it includes a team still currently in the pac.
I’ll take their money.
What they do for the next year belongs to us.
If they want to see it or any of their history, they can apply for a license to use our material.
Given this relatively slow news day, here’s a couple of items to consider as we work toward 2k.
Today’s (Saturday) Wall Street Journal has a feature article on Stanford’s fate. The two most compelling figures mentioned are Condi Rice, who has just been appointed as a special advisor on athletics by Jerry Yang, founder of Yahoo, current board chairman. The other is Gloria Nevarez, MW commissioner, and, if I’m not mistaken, a former Stanford administrator. She’s quoted to this effect: “Stanford being one of the best athletic departments in the country two decades running and they’re left out? What does that say?” Though there’s a lot of speculation that Oliver Luck will be the new commissioner, it’s possible that Rice will be. Such a move would further the idea that I have promoted in this thread which is DARE the SEC (principally) to eliminate the Pac’s Automatic bid to the CFP. Having the first conference to be led by a woman, and an African American, axed from the football tournament by a bunch of guys might only add to the bad optics of such a move.
The WSJ has one other paragraph worth replicating: “Geographic convenience might mean sacrificing academic prowess. Stanford historically values its academic reputation and wants to be associated with like-minded institutions. That was often a sticking point in the last decade when the Pac-12 vetted expansion opportunities . . . .”
One final point: the story makes an inevitable allusion to Stanford’s analogue: ND, which gets $23 million from NBC plus $17.4 million from the ACC contract (a reduced share; minus football). In other words, ND’s media rights deals yields $41 million yet the presidents of the Pac sent poor George on a suicide mission to try to get $50 million each?
The Seattle Times published a blistering op-ed yesterday on WSU president Schultz yesterday, for his role in this fiasco. it’s worth checking out.
The ST isn’t biased… especially in an OP-ed.
Interesting to see what the solution will be.
Oh… and Notre Dame is about to negotiate their new deal, and they have openly said they expect to get Big Ten money.
So there’s that.
https://www.kerryeggers.com/stories/money-travel-and-family-force-barneys-departure-from-osu Kerry Eggers on why Darwin Barney won’t return to the coaching staff next year. Barnes won’t pay a third assistant despite the NCAA approving a change to allow it. This is a bad look for him. Can’t find a way to pay one of your most successful baseball players ever who wanted to stay on staff as an assistant. Sounds like Mitch was really unhappy about it, too.
The beginning of the fall out? I know that decision was made by Barnes before the transgressions of last week, but I’m sure part of the reason was the uncertainty looming.
All OSU sports are going to suffer going forward sadly. And paycheck games are going to become the norm.
Or Barnes is also a big idiot who doesn’t has misguided loyalties.He’d rather let Kliakoff and Oregon stiff the entire department than seek to keep one of the good guys for the National Championship program at OSU.
Barnes can get on a bus back to Pittsburgh and try his nonsense on the east coast, I’ve seen enough of his act.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HiB9L3dG-Aw
That’s a really bad look when the top program on the west coast won’t fund the 3rd assistant.
Eggers agrees.
Final point in the article:
“Wong will be an excellent coach at Oregon State, but the Beavers missed out on a chance to retain one of the all-time greats in Barney. Baseball is Oregon State’s marquee sport. No other sport comes close to the success built under Casey over the past two decades. Barnes should have done everything he could to keep the status quo intact.”
Found this interview with Luck from last year. Interesting read.
““I’ve been reading predictions,” Luck said. “I think the last one I read was from [athletic director] Jack Swarbrick over at Notre Dame. He predicted there’d be sort of two groups that engage in big-time college football — but under a different system. One would be sort of the schools that say no to all the money and say the traditional academic role of the student is important. There will be the ones that say we’re not going to change that. And you know what, we’re gonna go find schools that are thinking the same way. They’ll find other like-minded institutions, some of the other private schools that may not want to compete that way.”
http://wheelhousecreativellc.com/oliver-luck-on-the-state-of-college-athletics-theres-one-pillar-left-that-must-be-maintained/
thanks for the link, Jack. A very interesting read. What Luck attributes to Swarbrick is consistent with the path forward that I’ve been advocating (the Rice, SMU, Tulane recourse), but Swarbrick’s recent attempts to get Stanford and Cal into a league dominated by FSU and Clemson is inconsistent with the “different system” for big time (or semi big time) college football he talks about. UNLESS, Swarbrick sees FSU’s and Clemson’s departure from the “big money, non-student centric” ACC as inevitable and what’s left of the ACC is the start of the new model. If ND is a part of that scheme, that vision has potential. No doubt NC and South Carolina, and maybe NC State would jump to the Big 10 or the SEC (we should start mocking them by calling one the NFC and the other the AFC), when, sooner or later, Clemson and FSU depart, leaving BC, Syracuse, Pitt, UVA, Georgia Tech, ND, Stanford and Cal as Swarbrick’s long term plan. The thing is, a western analogue to this scheme is in the cards if some combination of Luck, Yang, Rice can pull it off: what I’ve called the Pacific and Gulf Coast Conference. Western division: Stanford, Cal, OSU, WSU; Eastern Division: SMU, Tulane, Rice Tech (maybe Tulsa or Navy). That gets us to 8. Add SD state and either Air Force or Colorado State when the MW exit fee is more manageable. I like the service academy option
MHver3 now saying unless Cal and Stanford go to the ACC, the Big 12 won’t be expanding. After saying ESPN needed content for late Saturday windows, which wouldn’t be changing. At this point he’s just throwing things against the wall and seeing if it will stick. A lot of people got their hopes up but an invite to the big 12 never felt realistic. Just hope we get some news about PAC expansion the next couple weeks
As in “shit” against the wall? I noticed MHver3 didn’t really follow up on all of his declarations about the B-12 vetting OrSt and Wazzu. I tend to think that never really happened in any official capacity.
Yup. I think they probably talked but more so Barnes called to see if they had interest and was told no. He phrases his “news” in a way that when it’s false he can later say “They vetted them but decided against moving forward with expansion to focus on ACC schools next summer.” Whole thing reeked of bullshit. It got the people going and allowed him to be wrong without having to admit to being wrong.
It was supposed to be contingent on the ACC decision. Calford lost the vote, so Big 12 couldn’t add OSU/WSU and the PAC assets.
Yep. This right here. Unless OSU and WSU are the last 2 standing in the PAC? It won’t happen.
The Big 12 knows this so they are playing the waiting game to see if Stanford and Cal will find a P5 home that isn’t with them.
I’m wondering if Notre Dame would align with Stanford and Cal in the new PAC.
Does Oliver Luck consider Notre Dame part of that fraternity of schools that see the financial problems and would align with PAC as a move of solidarity against the Big10 overlords?
Notre Dame leaving Big10/ACC country would inflict large financial pain to many of those schools at least in the scheduling for football.
However if ND joins out west, they could bring instant credibility (in east coast media perspective) to the new PAC, and likely force a stand down on the push to pull the automatic bid to playoffs for PAC.
I’m guessing that Luck and Kliakoff are in talks with NBC, Apple, Amazon, ND, SMU, Rice, Tulane, SDSU, Memphis, (maybe Colorado St and Boise St)
10 team conference with mix of Midwest, and West coast, major markets, Texas footprint, SoCal footprint and a heavyweight anchor school as big or bigger than USC.
This arrangement could demand at least as much per school as Big12 to start with Apple subs as the bonus to future growth.
I think it’s clear that Luck thinks ND and their swack and decision making is the last exit for college football before we get to the semi pro version of the AFC and NFC, dba the Big 10 and SEC. The question is tactical: in what direction does ND push–east, or west? As the only big time player in college football with even a theoretical interest in ethical values repudiating mammon (read: TV deals), the future of the sport is in their hands.
Murthy has an op-ed in today’s Oregonian. This line of text struck me as the seed of OSU’s legal claim: “The potential losses to Oregon State Univsity and to the communities it serves will far outweigh the financial advantage the University of Oregon stands to gain in a Big 10 media deal.” Notice also the tense construction of that statement, suggeting that this isnt’ a “done deal.” That might reflect conversations she’s had with state legislators. Is it true the speaker of the Oregon house represents the Corvallis area?
It’s True.
From the website of Dan Rayfield, Corvallis District Rep and current House Speaker:
‘His work as an attorney primarily involves fighting for individuals with consumer and civil rights cases against large corporations, insurance companies, and others.”
Eventhough he didn’t attend OSU, maybe he likes fighting for the underdog?
His email:
Rep.DanRayfield@oregonlegislature.gov
Nice to see DJU perform well in the scrimmage. 10-16 on throws 3TDs and no ints. That would be on par with his career avg completion rate. Being super critical, the goal for him should be a completion rate in the upper 60s. If he does that, the offense could and will need to be a top 25 team this year with the defense probably taking a step back.
They say he’s running away with the job. I don’t trust the Oregonian for analysis, but the stats suggest there’s at least something very positive happening there, and it’s probably true he will be the QB. This is what we need of course.
Orange colored glasses might say DJU has upside in this offense which would make the Beavs very scary.
Cynical view says, the defense will struggle this year vs the QB rich league if DJU is carving them up. Usually you’d like to see the defense ahead of the offense right now.
False Bill, usually the defense is ahead by week 1 and it was, now the offense is opening up the playbook.
Might be debatable as to exact timing on the D being ahead thing, but one thing about which there is little room for debate: It’s not smart to bet against Trent Bray!
No need to be cynical my man. Keep those glasses on. This team isn’t losing once. And it won’t be close. Beavers win every game by at least 21 points, including the CFP Championship where they destroy Georgia. Beavs aren’t scary. They’re terrifying. Those Mountain West schools better be careful what they wish for.
it was cute the first try.
now it’s just spam.
Well it’s not just the Oregonian saying it. Agree we need DJU to win it and run away with it. If he lives up to his potential a conference championship is very possible.
DJU with a great oline and great running backs and an experienced OC will be lethal.
Clemson Oline was horrid, OC was inexperienced and Shipley very overrated, (an east coast media recreation of what they imagine McCaffrey was at Stanford.) Since they never saw McCaffrey play. Clemson should have been playing their other running back most of the year instead but Dabo wouldn’t change. DJU was stuck in a blue blood of dysfunctional egos/injuries/new coaching staff at key spots and a change of scenery will be perfect for him. I’m sold on DJU as the leader and the last piece of the puzzle.
If the Dline is improved, the secondary will be just fine. We just need linebackers to be sure tacklers.
Everything I’ve read has said the D line has been disruptive. Getting in the backfield and getting sacks.
“… the secondary will be just fine” that’s not a given
I think the secondary starters will be fine. I’m more worried about the drop off in the case there’s an injury. Really need Julian back and healthy.
I’m not counting on Julian coming back if he’s sat out the first week of fall camp. If he’s been out for a year and a half I’m assuming his knee tear was career ending.
My understanding he’s been practicing fully with team, at least recent practices. Beav Blitz was saying he was seeing minimal reps early on based on coach’s decision to bring him along a bit slowly. He also commented on a Twitter post several weeks ago to the affect that he was 100% back for season.
Ya and a guy on here says he’s good friends with him and that it’s just precautionary fwiw.
Any notes on Newell’s play? Other backup RBs? Sounds like Raichlie did well?
No it sounds like Reichle took the majority of the carries. Probably want to get a fourth running back established.
In the current state of things Pac 12 with a lot of disrespect, I have a dream. Get into the playoffs and win it all. “You mean Oregon State, the team no conference wanted are the reining national champs”? I know, you need to throw in some Mega Millions 1.5B dreaming. I got 1 number out of 5 picks. I have heard it said the 2001 Beavers could have beat anyone. Why not the 2023 Beavers? We got so used to not being able to stop any offence, FCS included, that major success was unthinkable. I say National champs, until proven otherwise. The perfect “turd in the punchbowl” for the “elite” conferences, including the 8 that left.
I like it and it’s not at all far fetched. If DJU can live up to his potential the offense could be at the top of the pac 12. If we had him last year they would’ve won 2 more games at least. Couple that with the defense maintaining they’re level of play and there isn’t a team they can’t beat. I don’t see a drop off for the defense even tho there were key players lost. I watched some of the games last year and the 2 starting cornerbacks weren’t irreplaceable. The improved pass rush should really help them out and lead to more turnovers and plays behind the los.
“Why not the 2023 Beavers?” because Georgia.
Yeah Georgia a tough team for sure, but holy balls have you seen their utterly laughable schedule? If that were the Beavs schedule I would expect them to walk into the cfp every year too
65-7
09/02 TN Martin 6:00 pm Home
09/09 Ball State 12:00 pm Home
09/16 S Carolina 3:30 pm Home
09/23 UAB 12:00 pm Home
09/30 Auburn 12:00 pm Away
10/07 Kentucky 12:00 pm Home
10/14 Vanderbilt 12:00 pm Away
10/28 Florida 3:30 pm Neutral
11/04 Missouri 12:00 pm Home
11/11 Mississippi 12:00 pm Home
11/18 Tennessee 12:00 pm Away
11/25 GA Tech 12:00 pm Away
Top talent, a dozen scrimmages and then two games against better teams, bingo, cfp … “But SEC”
It doesn’t matter because they show up when the stakes are real.
Tennessee is their toughest game on that schedule. How many quarters will the starters play until they get pulled in 90% of those games?
Can we take this opportunity to change our fourth quarter song from acdc to something that can get the whole stadium involved?
I think we should go with Sinatra… High Hopes.
Even the opposing fans would want to sing along.
Last year they changed to a mix of songs. Still ACDC first but then followed by a series of songs. It was not a great attempt.
The song that somehow is still very popular at the stadium is party in the usa. mr. brightside is a very close second.
Last year there was a Toyota booth outside Gill where they had an acrylic box to take suggestions, supposedly for replacements…It did become comical when during one game they polled the crowd with three options:
1) Party in the USA,
2) Party in the USA, or
3) Party in the USA
WSU game. I was there, I chuckled a little.
At least they moved on from “Crank it like a chainsaw”. Holy shit, that was bad.
That song really showed how low Oregon State fell in Football. I knew GA was a bad hire, but everyone else seemed high on him. I viewed him as a Willie Taggart type coach where he was a used cars salesman.
ESPN showing the “junior Benny” during the 2017 beatdown at Arizona still haunts me
I remember that and was a troll move by ESPN.
This from the GT on Saturday’s scrimmage:
“Veteran offensive linemen Taliese Fuaga and Joshua Gray sat out the entire scrimmage and starting center Jake Levengood played a limited number of drives. “
Any concerns?
May just be resting them due to lack of quality depth. Hope so anyway. Levengood becoming one of my favorite players with his attitude on game days.
They do it a lot in preseason pro games…Watched preseason Raiders yesterday holy balls no pros ever play in those games, what a ripoff to fans that have to pay for that product.
JS told media they were just resting them and wanted to give a chance for other guys to get a lot of reps before they narrow things down heading into the rest of camp.
My guess is those linemen sat to allow their backups to show what they can do. Makes sense why the defense was able to get good pressure on the QB’s, but at the same time, the offense was able to still be productive as well. Hard to tell who is ahead: offense or defense. They seem about even? am I wrong?
Can an insider here talk to Beaver football and get a chant going with the fans.
How about a D (west side) J (south/north) and a U for the new side.
Be pretty cool to start the hype early. Let him feast.
nah, Aidan Chiles is the future, but we don’t want to be like Clemson and add pressure on him to perform.
Calling Chiles the future is pressure in itself.
This is not pressure. It’s excitement. Support.
Booing and negativity when underperforming would be pressure.
That’s Opies job to make those changes. I agree Chiles is legit. Give him a year to develop.
Let’s go D – J – U
Who is Opie? Are you a duck troll? Get out with that nonsense.
19 straight runs!
How is saying Chiles is the future added pressure? Saying he’s the next (insert Heisman QB) would be added pressure. Aidan is the best QB Oregon State has ever recruited out of high school. DJU is the best Transfer QB they have ever got let alone recruited. Saying Aidan will take us to the CFP Championship would be added pressure. I am saying Aidan is our “Franchise QB” so to speak as long as he is on the roster. Yes, he needs to develop and gain experience, no doubt. Once he has command and is comfortable with the offense, we have DJU who appears to be our best option at QB. When has Oregon State EVER chanted a person’s name in the last 20-25 years? Only name I can remember is Hooooooooousch when he was back returning punts and kickoffs. So maybe we should do the same thing with GOOOOOOOUUUULD this season? Singling out a player is like yelling out MAXIMUS! MAXIMUS! MAXIMUS! from Gladiator. Just don’t see it catching on. You’re more than welcome to try and get it going, but I doubt others will join you. Stick with the O-S-U stadium chant instead.
Does not have to be either/or. Can be and. I hear ya.
You don’t want to single out a player in a team sport that relies so much on all the other players to do their job.
Has anybody posted this? It’s an interesting idea if they can figure out the money situation.
https://twitter.com/ProjSports/status/1690100965414674433?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1690100965414674433%7Ctwgr%5E9e7c1cb64ef54f3a668c46efab0e60bbae3d59a1%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fd-265746799554276559.ampproject.net%2F2307272333000%2Fframe.html
I honestly like this option. Take out the bottom 2 of each tiers 1-4 and replace with top teams in the regional teams. I would actually watch the MAC, Sun Belt, AAC, and MWC games if they went to this model.
AP Top 25 came out and there’s not a lot of differences between AP and coaches poll.
https://apnews.com/hub/ap-top-25-college-football-poll
Ain’t it great how Notre Dame, Texas, Oklahoma and LSU always tend to make leaps up the polls during the months when no football is being played? Meanwhile OSU drops a spot because…..uh who knows
Kind of surprised they didn’t drop further in order support the narrative.
Don’t see this working. Most of the time for instance, a school in the Championship Div. Will have a season where everything comes together mostly because they’re senior laden, especially in key positions. (see OSU’s Fiesta Bowl season). They then get promoted and the following season with a younger inexperienced roster and become a punching bag for everyone in the Premiere division.
Fangraphs college baseball article. He thinks college baseball could end up like hockey where conference affiliations are totally different than football conference affiliation. Says Beavs could team up with Fullerton, Long Beach, UC Irvine
https://blogs.fangraphs.com/the-pac-12-is-dying-what-does-that-mean-for-college-baseball/
I think for baseball it might be best to go Big West instead of Mountain West or WCC
I honestly think each school’s sports should be able to choose their own conference. It would be a headache for the AD for scheduling, but it would make realignment for football easier because Oregon State and WSU football wouldn’t be left out in the cold, but our basketball program would be. TV deals can then be done separately for football and basketball. Will never happen, but it would be nice if it was done this way.
Media guy named Jim Williams is saying that Calford is trying to pull strings and get in the Big 10. I’m sure they’re exploring all avenues but it does feel like they are much more aggressive at seeking out ACC and Big 10 than the Beavs have been. Most certainly Beavs have made contact with other conferences but it is interesting how those “leaks” are almost only AAC and Mtn West. I guess Calford have the cards to play to try and make these conversations happen. It also kind of feels like the Pac rebuild is more OSU/WSU and that’s what scares me a bit about a rebuild. Calford definitely feel like keeping with the academic partnerships which really brings into question…can they put aside those feelings to allow the top sports schools into the Pac Whatever? I posted this same concern a few days ago and with this updated “scoop” about Calford trying for Big 10 doesn’t help my confidence in that whatsoever. If they block the top G5 schools from coming over due to athletics, the Pac won’t even be the top G5 conference which is definitely the worst case scenario the Beavs could have. No P5 status and you can’t even claim the top G5 conference status. Just awful and I’d assume the Beavs should just straight join AAC or Mtn West then.
Jon Wilner pointed out that if this happened 10 years ago then everybody would want Stanford in their conference. Now not so much
When I saw Stanford has also brought in Condi Rice to use her influence I figured it was only matter of time before Stanford (and by extension Cal) would land in the ACC or BIG10. This is why I have always considered this “Rebuild the PAC” talk as just a bargaining chip to get things moving for Stanford and Cal. The good news is this opens up OSU/WSU as the last 2 standing and then then they can take the PAC12 network & other PAC assets and “Merge” with the BIG12. I believe this has been the play all along. Antitrust lawsuits being brought by the PAC is not in the Networks & other conferences best interests.
The thing is that there is really no way to know which rumors and leaks are founded in any kind reality and which aren’t. There is obviously a lot of “behind-the-scenes” scheming and dealing happening on all fronts, including from OSU leadership.
Could Calford deal their way into the B1G or ACC triggering a domino effect that lands OSU/WSU in the B12? Yup.
Could Oliver Luck see a path to rebuilding the PAC by picking and choosing teams from the AAC and MWC and perhaps trying to poach other schools that are aligned with “traditionally academic conference values” (Army, Navy, Rice, Tulane) over the long term (5+ years)? Yup.
Could Cal or Ford decide to go Independent and ride out the re-alignment bubble for the long-term leaving OSU/WSU holding the P12 bag with the only option to “merge” with MWC in some kind of scheme to take the sting off of being relegated to the Group of 5? Yup.
I think the most challenging thing for the Beavs and fans is that we simply don’t have much leverage either way. OSU is a great university with an awesome fanbase a good-to-great teams/coaches that deserves to be in a Power 5 conference. But life ain’t fair. They don’t hold many cards. If they’re gonna influence anything they’ll have to be scrappy (unlikely).
If the best play is to get into the B12 in the short term, then do whatever you can to back-channel Calford into the ACC or B1G.
If joining the MWC outright is the only viable option, then call in all of the big donors that helped complete Reser and fund coaches/teams and NIL to retain as much of an advantage as possible.
If we’re gonna stick together and rebuild the PAC, put as much pressure on Calford as possible to drop their academic elitism (very highly improbable), as a west coast dominated conference with a core the likes of CAL, STAN, OSU, WSU, BSU, Fresno, and SDSU isn’t a total doomsday outcome, why not try to infuse those universities and athletic departments with resources and exposure and try to lift them up?
I just don’t have a lot of faith in Barnes, Murthy, and big-money OSU donors to be cut-throat and manipulative enough to be any kind of influential movers and shakers in a “behind-the-scenes” house of cards style game from a place of disadvantage. They’ll have to earn it.
I propose our 3 best position coaches are:
Coach M/ Oline
Coach Bray/ Linebackers
Coach Blue/ Secondary
Each of those units will be as good or better with these coaches.
Dline is already upgrading talent so no concerns for them.
Running backs are the best in the west.
Key questions are QB, kickers, WR/TE.
If DJU has a career revival year for OSU, that means the TE/WR are thriving and catching everything and we could win 11 or 12 games.
If DJU struggles worse than BG then we will limp along and likely win 8-9.
I like our schedule and I expect it to be an awesome year with the Beavs having a chip on the shoulder going into every game. Lots to prove and lots to achieve. JS has the locker-room character prepared and the team will be focused to search and destroy teams. I like it that all of this garbage happened before fall camp. Gives the team time to gel and focus on how disrespected they are across the country. It is actually shocking how dismissive talking heads are about OSU. Only way to change it is to win and win big. Go 15-0 for all the marbles and a bit of payback.
And start the lawsuits asap.
I love fall camp and Christmas because they’re the seasons of perpetual hope
What was the flight tracker/plane from the big12 thing that was reported a few days ago? People keep asking me and I have no idea what they are referring too.
This is what they’re referring to:
https://angrybeavs.com/football/17006#comment-403018
Hmm. So, untrue.
Untrue about what? The fact the plane left Dallas, TX to Austin, TX to Sacramento, CA then to Corvallis, OR then to Jacksonville, IN which is just over the border of Louisville, KY?
I didn’t see the Dallas flight. Was It confirmed anywhere that it was Big12 officials. Or are we just putting 2 and 2 together?
Outside the box disruption play:
Step 1)
Why if Oliver Luck approached Notre Dame and they tacitly agree to link with Stanford and Cal wherever they end up.
Step 2:
Approach several western most schools from the Big10 and see if they would be interested in jumping- Nebraska, Minnesota, Iowa to start
Step 3:
Approach western most SEC schools to see if they would be interested in jumping- Texas A&M, Missouri
Step 4:
Approach big moneyed schools from Midwest and see if they would be interested in jumping for a buy-in fee
SMU, Tulane,
Step 5:
Consider adding SDSU and Boise St
It is a long shot that Big10 or SEC teams would leave, but they are all getting clobbered each year and may like a different opportunity. At this point, Big10 and Big12 are inflicting damage and SEC is just waiting quietly on the sidelines for Clemson and FSU. I’d like to see the chaos begin to touch those 2 conferences at some point and maybe this is a way.
Consider the conference if these teams all jumped:
East:
Notre Dame
Texas A&M
Missouri
Nebraska
Minnesota
Iowa
Tulane
West:
OSU
WSU
Stanford
Cal
SDSU
Boise St
SMU
Would ESPN or Fox like this conference lineup better than Big12? And in the process it destabilizes the 2 power conferences.
Again an outside the box idea. Likely never happens but the idea of shaking up the Big10 and SEC is appealing.
What are the buyouts for the big10 and sec? If it’s like the ACC’s there’s no way we get anybody thats in a p5 to jump.
SEC is $30mil-$45 mil depending on timing. They added it last year after they lured Texas and Oklahoma. Likely they anticipated how it was going to upset the entire applecart and had enough leadership to plan accordingly. Would be nice to see such leadership west of the Rockies someday.
I can’t find anything on Big10 buyout/exit fees.
The other factor is how the networks inserted themselves with bounty $$ to “go get some more teams” as the uneven playing field we have been dealt.
Big 10 hasn’t officially signed their GOR, so grabbing from the B1G would be easy to do right now as they are sitting vulnerable. What if the AAC and MWC talk is cover for getting B1G and SEC teams like OhioBeav is suggesting? Maybe Luck was brought in to distract and deter people from looking into Kliavkoff? With the amount of undermining that went on for the larger known brand schools that are currently on top of the pecking order; it would make sense to poach from the bottom tiers of those conferences. Maybe even poach from the Big XII if they haven’t signed their GOR yet? They struck their deals, but have they touched Pen to Paper yet? This could be the hold up where the Pac-12 is vetting schools to join the Pac-12 like Iowa State, Nebraska, Iowa, Texas A&M, Missouri, etc. Schools that are Ag schools and by doing this, opens up spots for Stanford and Cal to go to the Big Ten. Might be a better deal all around where they keep the Power 5 automatic bids, but can you entice a Big Ten team away from the $70 million they’re getting to come to a conference that might not get such a deal? Time will tell.
It makes no sense to group schools for athletics by their academic focus or rankings. The only people arguing for this are being influenced by elitism at places like Stanford
Maybe they’d like to join the ivy
I think you missed my point. I’m saying if the Pac-12 can lure away the current bottom teams of the Big Ten because in 2024 and beyond, they are no longer using divisions and will be taking the top 2 teams in the B1G for their conference championship. In the last 10 years, with the best 2 teams model, it would have been these teams in the CCG for B1G:
2023: Michigan vs Ohio State
2022: Michigan vs Ohio State
2021: Michigan vs Ohio State
2020: Ohio State vs Indiana
2019: Ohio State vs Wisconsin*
2018: Ohio State vs Michigan
2017: Ohio State vs Wisconsin*
2016: Penn State vs Ohio State
2015: Iowa vs Michigan State*
2014: Ohio State vs Michigan State
2013:Michigan State vs Ohio State*
* = Divisions and the best 2 teams would have happened.
https://www.espn.com/college-football/standings/_/season/2022/group/5
B1G teams to try and get: Rutgers, Indiana, Northwestern, Nebraska, Illinois, Purdue, and/or Minnesota
Big XII teams to try and get: Texas Tech, West Virginia, Iowa State
ACC: Boston College, Wake Forest, Georgia Tech, Virginia, Virginia Tech, Pitt(?),
SEC: Texas A&M, Missouri, Vanderbilt(?)
The sell would be P4 status and ease of path to CFP.
I’m sure I’ll get down votes for this post, but I don’t care. We need to try and do something!
Updates from @MHver3:
“Hearing 4-Pac and Luck will be meeting with Aresco and some of the AAC presidents today to discuss various merger options. Hearing GK will not be present and may be done with his current job”
“Also hearing ESPN is open to the idea of cancelling the AAC contract and that Apple deal for a PAAC could be worth as much as $15m per school if the right schools are involved. (It’s basically the same $250m a year but split over more schools with further market reach)”
Oliver luck was at FAU today…their football program posted it. Perhaps he was already scheduled to be there for some prior speaking engagement but would seem to jive with the visits to the presidents of the AAC schools.
“Meeting” doesn’t always mean in-person. Most of these negotiations are happening on zoom calls.
Correct. I’m just relaying that his info does seem correct since Luck was at FAU who is a member of the AAC. Would be a rather unlikely coincidence that he was previously scheduled to speak at one of the member institutions on a day that he’s reported to be meeting with AAC schools.
Meckler called up to the Giants today, welcome to the show!
That’s an absolutely insane trajectory from draft to big leagues for any pick, let alone an 8th rounder. Unbelievable. What a beast.
Yeah go Giants, two Beavs in the same MLB lineup tonight!
Meckler batting 2nd playing centerfield.
Conforto batting 5th playing right field.
A couple more items on the realignment and media front:
(1) Trev Alberts, the Nebraska AD, (I always like him when he was a TV commentator; no-nonsense guy when ESPN had serious reporters unlike side-show Lee Corso and Pat McAfee) is suggesting that conference realignment is nowhere close to being finished. “. . . the next go-around . . . will be far more disruptive,” perhaps signaling to his fan base not to feel too smug about their current status.
(2) and the then the Wall Street Journal, almost on a daily basis now, chimes in again with a column by Andy Kessler, writing about Disney’s difficulties, as represented by their recent price hikes, which I previously relayed on this blog. Seizing on the ESPN part of the company’s problems: “The cable business may be worse–cord-cutters are killing it. Disney-owned ESPN has around 70 million paid subscribers, down from some 100 million 10 years ago. [PriceWaterhouse] [cpa firm/Wall Street consultant] thinks that number will drop to 50 million in 2027. One reason is constant prince increases. ESPN now costs $9.42 a month per subscriber for cable operators, vs. 49 cents for the average channel in the basic-cable bundle.”
After citing the allied difficulties of the Diamond Sports outfit that has defaulted on their payments to MLB teams like the Padres, Kessler returns to ESPN. To wit: “ESPN is in the same bind, holding rights deals with the NFL, NBA, MLB, NHL, tennis and golf associations, and Formula 1. [what, no mention of the SEC and Bigs?] How is it going to pay rights fees with dwindling subscribers? Doubling prices for streaming? Disney’s gambling deal with Penn National smells of desperation and will dilute ESPN’s brand.”
Again, I say, poor George was ahead of his time and reporting to a delusional set of presidents. The deal UO and UW jumped to is a dinosaur. Not to be replicated. The supposed life raft that the Big 12 represents is another delusion, certainly in the long term. If Alberts is right, they will be the next victim.
All of which is why I think the way to go is to resurrect the Pac and Apple deal with an eight team “Pacific and Gulf Coast Conference.” Get ahead of the curve before the NFC and AFC (err, the SEC and Big 10) carve everything up once again.
ESPN has way more assets to leverage to keep paying those deals than the regional networks did. Their rights portfolio is also more diversified, so they can not renew something that comes up for renewal along the way if they need to cut costs. Night and day difference.
Someone asked about Alton Julian further up the thread; the OSU Football Twitter page posted pictures from practice and Julian’s in one of them.
https://twitter.com/BeaverFootball/status/1691243412987817988?s=20
Check out Alton Julian’s latest Tweet. I can’t link it, but it says:
I’m good to go! Fully confident, ready to get it done. Just gotta wait I guess
Just noticed single game tix for conference games on sale, good seats on new side available, running about $90-110 for UW, a bit less for Utah…not as bad as I thought they’d be.
This thread has to be some kind of record right?
PFF tweeted out saying this year is the highest pre-season ranking for Oregon State since 2001. I hope we don’t have a 2001 like season….
Hope not, that was my freshman year and this is the most excited I’ve been for a start of season since then.
Me too! That season was a bummer
So apparently, there were presidents within the conference who were adamant about the Pac-12 worth being around the $50 million range and WSU president Schulz was one of those presidents. We don’t know who the other 1-2 presidents were, but I would assume the ones who got left behind are the ones who didn’t take the initial ESPN $31.7 million deal. We did this to ourselves folks.
https://www.seattletimes.com/sports/wsu-cougar-football/multiple-pac-12-presidents-declined-deal-from-espn-last-year-to-pursue-unrealistic-offer/
Given the huge egos of the first teams to leave, I have a hard time believing they weren’t pressing for more money.
Schulz wasn’t one of them.
do you even read the articles you post?
The article didn’t say that, it was the local radio on 1080 the fan this morning said Schulz was one of them. This was the only article I could find on the matter in a quick search.
That’s an Espn network affiliate of course. Was it part of an ESPN segment?
To me there is one narrative that is echoed around the internet, etc. Call it the Conzano narrative, say. The problem is some of his key sources aren’t named. They could all be Espn or Fox affiliated for all we know. Eg., GK’s media consultant was his law school buddy, and it stinks of nepotism, but *who’s* eyebrows did that raise? And what were his other options?
Not sure what share a school would get for getting $100 subscribers for the Apple deal, but if Oregon signed up 20% of their 2.2m weekly cfb viewers that’s $44m.
Schulz is talking about those Presidents in a tone that sounds like he thinks they were knuckleheads.
I find it hard to believe the WSU President was one of them. Every instinct I have tells me it was UO and UW. They had Big 10 money envy.
^this^
It’s pretty obvious USC and UCLA, maybe UW and Nike would be pushing for $50M because that’s what they assumed they could get if they jumped ship.
This article implies it was one of the remaining teams pressing for the 50$m
https://247sports.com/college/arizona/article/pac-12-propoganda-and-inside-story-failed-media-deal-214257173/
very interesting story. thanks for the link.
Nice revisionist article. So it really comes down to the schools left behind caused all of the problems? That’s pretty rich. Quite the blame shift in hindsight.
If Canzano was knowingly lying for a year he should be mocked out of journalism anyway, but to say it was WSU and OSU overvaluing the PAC10 and they caused these events is ridiculous. Absolve all other schools of back room agreements and hidden agendas that ultimately destroy 100 years of joint academic and athletic achievements.
It sounds like this guy is simply covering for UA brass and deflecting to schools that everyone is already piling on as worthless.
I don’t believe it at all.
Perhaps multiple school presidents were delusional, but he leaves out the prior phase of the saga when ESPN asked for the PAC to poach Big12 and get the media deal that Big12 got, and I bet someone at ESPN floated $50mil per school 3 years ago in those meetings. PAC refused to poach Big12 and ESPN shut them out from that point on.
The article doesn’t go back far enough.
I could see Stanford being a big reason for not raiding the Big XII. The Pac-12 had a mix of prestigious academic, sports traditions, Agriculture, and fine arts universities.
They didn’t get the chance, since USC shut that down.
I guess we’ll never know.
There is no mention of “$50m”, it was “
$41m, and the article clearly states “the deal was turned down by most”.
There’s no doubt that WSU is included in the “most”. I just wish someone would actually say which schools wanted to take the original deal with ESPN.
The obvious point is that “most” of the school presidents were confident that Kliavkoff could get them a better deal than what ESPN offered. But why did they think that? Did GK tell them he could? Or did he tell them they should take the ESPN deal, but they were just so ignorant of the college sports landscape that they thought the Pac12 was as valuable as the other P5s?
Does it make sense though that ‘2 of the teams looking for a home right now’ were driving the it’s not enough money bus? Really?
If WSU and OSU were on that wagon it was more than likely in a handshake agreement with UW and Hole for solidarity. No way either of those ADs straight faced thought they were worth $50M.
Are “most” of these schools subject to FOIA? Certainly they have meeting minutes.
Private schools, private meetings.
If any one of the “remaining teams” was pushing for more than $41M it was probably Cal with their mountain of debt.
From this same douche on the twitters…
First he trolls wazzu fan as crybaby then gets this response…
‘implying the last teams left were the teams demanding a better deal from networks is a strange claim, so there’s that’
His response ‘In the initial offer a year or so ago. It’s not strange at all.’
The original number from ESPN was 24.8 million, so I’m assuming this was all negotiation stuff, where the two expect to meet in the middle:
25 v 50
30 v 41
meet at about 35, and go have drinks.
Everyone turned down the 24.8 million.
Duh.
@MHver3:
“Hearing PAC has a commitment from 4 AAC schools to leave the conference and join theirs. This could possibly create leverage to get the AAC to vote to dissolve the conference and get the majority of the schools to merge with the PAC”
As Beavis and Butthead once liked to say: “Now we’re getting somewhere.”
Safe to assume this includes SMU. Who else?
Just hope this is the backup plan, and the real focus is getting actual P4 landing spots for all 4 teams.
D J Duncan on Deadspin has an article up this morning: “Don’t be Cowards, ND: Save the Pac 12. His thinking follows a line of thought that the Beav in Ohio and I have been propagating. key line: “ND is the only brand that can give any entity they join a boost.” His article also alludes to a piece by Andy Staples on ON3 that ND should take the lead in forming a conference made up by, among others, the service academies.
PS to Angry: I have been doing my best to get this blog thread to 2,000 posts but the bulk is beginning to make the site balky.
This talk about ND seems like pie in the sky. Also wouldn’t they have the same issues leaving the ACC as FSU. I know they don’t play football in the conference, but they still would have signed the GOR, right?
Notre Dame would have both money and leverage to wreck the GOR if they wanted to.
It does feel pie in the sky but I’ll hope there is something to it up until Barnes announces a move to the MWC…because that is the deathblow
ND doesn’t have to leave the ACC to save the Pac 12 (err, 4). They are already half way home trying to help Stanford and Cal. It’s simply a matter of the voting strength in the CFP world (more on that below) (equivalent to a conference unto themselves) and scheduling. The point the guy on Deadspin was trying to make is that all ND has to do is signal that they will adjust their schedule going forward to make room for Cal, OSU and WSU. This, instead of scheduling Marshall, Tenn. Tech, Central Michigan etc.
Ross Dellinger on Yahoo Sports says the CFP committee has a previously scheduled meeting on August 30th. Word is already out that the SEC wants to change the weighted voting so that the SEC and Big 10 get 50% of the voting strength of the AQ conferences just for themselves, with the current five sharing 80%. The smaller conferences have the other 20% The ACC and Big 12 would be crazy to go along with that. In fact, if they knew what was good for them, they’d vote to keep the Pac 4 as an AQ conference, at least in the short term.
“Previously scheduled meeting” for August 30 to consolidate power to 2 conferences;
That explains why all of this has been happening so quickly. BIg10 had a deadline to kill the PAC12.
Meanwhile, Big12 is delusional thinking they will get equal treatment.
ACC is a footnote as long as Clemson and FSU can’t leave.
That also explains why Finebaum has been banging the drum for fewer AQ conferences all summer.
Propaganda mouthpiece for the SEC.
Finebaum is the worst kind of vulture. works for ESPN, of course. I hope there are disparaging signs about their role in all this during college game day, plus whatever the Fox show is called.
Am seeing a post from Mitch Vingle (sports writer that used to cover West Virginia so has relatioship with Luck) on Twitter that Luck is consulting for OSU/WSU and not for Pac 4. Not sure if that’s been reported yet. Interesting
Well unless this is all for show, that would suck, because a Pac 2 – AAC merger is even more underwhelming than a Pac 4 – AAC merger.
Nobody would watch that. It would be the end of Beavs football.
Yep, some in the local media talk like they could land in AAC or MW and then dominate and move up next cycle, but how do you dominate when you lose all your resources. How do you move back up when no one is watching.
With better recruits, coaches and facilities. Making it to the playoffs.
yes, basically the Boise State strategy (with a new stadium to boot and no blue turf)
Eh, AAC has twice as much media money as the Mtn West. Still sucks but it is a lot better and competitiveness follows money.
Also, access to some solid recruiting areas (TX, FL). Mtn West schools (except for SD state) are a zero for recruiting footprint haha.
Yeah AAC merger isn’t optimal but it’s way better than MWC.
Both are equally horrible in terms of watchable football, and at the end of the day, that’s what matters.
that’s why keeping Stanford and Cal in tow is vital. That’s 3 traditional games (counting the Cougs) and with some aggressive non-conference scheduling (Utah, BYU, for example, or the best MW schools, two of which we play every year anyway) a compelling (watchable) slate could be created. I still the think that what OSU needs is a two year strategy (the legacy window that has been discussed before) including the seizure of assets and lawsuits. Just buy some time for things to sort out. There’s certainly no rush to join the MW. That will always be the final recourse and one easily secured.
How is Oregon State vs say Memphis or Oregon State vs Tulane any different than Oregon State vs. Boise State or Oregon State vs Fresno State? Yes, it would be a conference game vs an OOC. It’s not like say Oregon State vs SMU is the same as Oregon State vs Cal Poly or any other FCS school. G5 schools who are given more opportunities than they currently are given will elevate their recruiting and fan bases. I am actually for getting the top AAC schools as it will allow us to have a footprint in Texas, Louisiana, Tennessee, Florida which are recruiting areas for us. I could see adding Utah State to get Utah recruits, but it’s not a hotbed like Texas, Florida, and California. The only thing that matters is getting the final revenue $ to $30+ million which is doable if the Jon Wilner article is accurate about the NCAA units being left to the Pac-12 teams and the media deal is $14-18 million for the remaining Pac-12 teams.
Agreed.
For all the talk of building associations and elevating each other in a conference, hanging on to some sort of sports “eliteness” is just silly, especially given the state of the conference that touted it for 100 years.
The opportunity to build should be greeted with some angst, for sure. But it should also come with a fair degree of excitement. We don’t have Lucy holding the ball any more.
Not to mention, even more travel without the other two. I mean that they are tacking that much initiative though… silver lining I guess.
For those curious about the revenue assets of the Pac-12, look here at Jon Wilner’s Mailbag piece where he answers the NCAA Tournament shares. It would be $16.4 million for each of the remaining Pac-4 members over a 6 year peirod from 2024-2030. This could be decided to go to new members, pay for new members’ exit fees, or kept for themselves to offset the media rights deals in 5-6 years during the next media deal cycle. Keeping the money with the rumored $18 million a year with Apple TV+ streaming would give OSU, WSU, Stanford, and Cal $34 million annually. This doesn’t include future NCAA tournament appearances.
https://www.oregonlive.com/collegebasketball/2023/08/pac-12-finances-estimating-the-ncaa-tournament-cash-available-for-the-remaining-schools.html
You did the math wrong here. It says the conference will get 65.6 million over 6 years. So 10.9M per year. Divide that by 4 and you get 2.7 million per school per year (16.4 million in total over 6 years). Add in Apple’s pay and it comes to 20.7 million per year.
word problems are the worst
I do struggle with math word problems. Always have especially when they throw out numbers in different ways.
Why could he just say: 65.6 million over 6 years is $10.7 million a year divided by 4 is $2.6 million. Nope, he had to go and make the dang thing complicated. smh. Thanks for understanding and informing me I miscalculated.
We need to see proper lawsuits and demand to be brought into Big12.
I’m beginning to feel like these guys will squander whatever little leverage as time goes on. The landscape has changed and people will begin to just accept this new normal after a few games are played. OSU will be left wandering in the sports wilderness like SMU has for 40 years, only SMU cheated their way into that scenario, and has huge oil money backing them for a rise from the ashes.
Barnes should be reaching out to Nvidia owner and all other big money alums for some publicity and support. At this point, the only support I see for OSU is pretty limited, and will soon fade.
Not going to happen.
https://www.azcentral.com/story/sports/college/pac-12/2023/08/15/big-12-commissioner-no-more-additions-after-arizona-asu-colorado-utah/70592057007/
yep. That seems definitive. So much for the flight to Corvallis the other day. Besides, the less we have to do with the 4 corner traitors or those closer to home, the better. Building from the 4 we have is the best way to go, as difficult as that will be. Aresco (AAC) is a more sympathetic figure than Yormark, who has all the positives of a corporate raider.
I like OSU/WSU in the B12 in the short-term and think its a good academic/cultural fit when matched up with our friends Ariz, ASU, Utah, Colorado and maybe Texas Tech and TCU in a division. Problem is B12 is next on the chopping block when the Power 2 make their next move (also ACC). With the B12 sticking to a linear media model (dumb), and OSU/WSU likely coming in at a partial share in any scenario, it puts them as the first left out when the whole thing gets blown up and we’re going through it all over again.
It is foreseeable that a PAC4/AAC/MWC merger over the next few years, leaning into a fancy hi-tech streaming model with Apple as the “first out the door” could actually put them in a much better position (if it works), as ugly as that potential conference looks right now. I do see the “forward thinking” logic behind it if Calford actually sticks around. If they stay, B12 doesn’t want us (OSU/WSU) and Calford doesn’t want them (dumb). If they leave, it’s B12 or bust for the Beavs/Cougs. It’s sad, but any scenario in which OSU/WSU end up joining/merging with the AAC/MWC without Calford is relegated to the Group of 5/6 real fast and is left out of the conversation when it goes Power 2 in the near future. Just sucks.
It’s looking like the end of Beaver football. This is their final season to do anything meaningful. I’d imagine at the end of this season we see 75% of the team enter the transfer portal and Smith get bought out by a bigger school.
Going independent would be better than joining the MWC or AAC.
if it should come to that, going independent in football may be an option. the other sports, hoops, baseball, for example, need a conference tie in. It’s one thing to free lance a 12 game schedule; quite another to schedule 30 or 56. and why not different leagues for different sports. Baseball would be a good fit in that league Cal Irvine is a part of.
Going independent is a bad option financially. They aren’t like ND where they can sign their own rights deal for good money.
What, you’re not stoked for the annual North Texas-OSU rivalry?
All teams switched to a 12 game schedule in 2006, except the PAC10 continued with a 9 game conference schedule. In hindsight, this was the beginning of the narrative that PAC10 is a weak conference. SEC maintained 8 game conference schedule all along and reap the benefits.
They began by arguing how tough their particular conference teams were and they are due an “easy” game.
Simple math shows that over a 10 years period they will have 70 less conference losses, or 140 outcomes as a 14 team that would be 70 head to head matchups in conference and likely those 70 games are all wins as a result, in addition 70 winners/70 losers but drop that game from conference schedule and you instantly have 140 wins.
SEC has been gaming the system for a long time and no one cared. PAC10 should have followed suit and dropped a game in the same manner but instead PAC teams accrue 50 additional losses over a decade, 60 after expansion to 12 teams. Each conference loss looks worse because it becomes an argument for a weakened conference rather than a balanced conference. SEC propaganda has been subtle yet effective to deny PAC any opportunities over the past several years, and now is the death blow.
Angry pointed that out years ago, totally agree.
This season (and may be even last season too) with USC, UW, OSU, UO, and UT all in the top 20, if they had non-con cupcakes, 8 game conference schedule, and didn’t have a PAC championship, the conference could end up with multiple 1 or 2 loss teams and be looking great come bowl season. The PAC is rich in QBs this year, and should be a conference worth watching and a threat in major bowl games.
But noOOOOooooo…
I’ve been harping on that for years, that and the November patsy “Alabama bye week”.
If the big boys aren’t being penalized for it then it’s stupid not to copy it. Also need to stop scheduling Fresno State and Boise State. Line up the patsies and put em in the W column.
Im surprised this is the first time a game has been broadcastin spanish. Fresno is innovating the tv market.
https://athlonsports.com/college-football/mountain-west-conference-fresno-state-bulldogs-home-opener-will-make-college-football-history
The Beavs do or used to have spanish radio broadcasts.
Looking at Sagarin ratings from last year and the AAC actually ranked better than the ACC Coastal division. Not far behind the ACC as a whole.
Gross. U Nike doing a Bo Nix billboard in NY:
https://www.oregonlive.com/ducks/2023/08/oregon-ducks-qb-bo-nix-getting-new-york-billboard.html
Gross, for sure.
Nix has a new OC and a new Center…….I expect him to disappoint this year.
BTW, you can still get the Beavs AND 7.5 points in the CW
They did this in 2001 for Joey 5 picks and he ended up getting invited to NY for the heisman ceremony. They went 11-1 that year. Bo has just as much of a chance as DJU does IMO.
Watched JS post-practice interview today. Is that Daschell scowling?
https://oregonstate.rivals.com/news/watch-oregon-state-hc-jonathan-smith-talks-fall-camp-day-11
Ya, that’s just how Nick Daschel is. little to no emotion, smug and asks questions that show he doesn’t understand Smith’s fall camp is competition all the way to the end of fall camp every year. This will not change Daschel; so stop asking those questions! lol He’s better off asking questions on how the kicking game will improve this season or if there are any wrinkles they’re looking to implement on special teams. Better yet, how does the special teams look this year? Is Gould still as explosive as last season?
Spent the past couple of days in Glacier National Park.
Everybody thinks my orange and black OSU hat is for Oklahoma State. When I tell them it’s Oregon State, I’m always met with a confused “oh….?”
Nobody here knows who the Beavs are, other than one older guy from Texas who menitoned “you’re comferenceless…right?”
Speaking of, I have almost no internet most of the week. Has there been anything newsworthy regarding the Pac4’s future? Or still just a bunch of speculation?
Looks like B12 is no longer an option, so there’s that…
Everything is speculation. Even the plugged in people don’t know. They just throw out ideas.
In Nebraska, people know who Oregon State is, mainly thanks to Mike Riley coming to Nebraska from Oregon State and our baseball team getting 3 national championships and multiple trips to Omaha. If it weren’t for those 2 things, nobody would know about Oregon State.
Is it still too late to get Mike Hass a Times Square billboard?
Or Ken Simonton
No. But OSU doesn’t have the balls to do it. Too busy playing little brother victim to think outside the box and promote the program. A big reason why the train left the station without you.
No. But OSU doesn’t have the balls to do it. Too busy playing little brother victim to think outside the box and promote the program. A big reason why the train left the station without you.
How is not being vain acting like little brother?
Is every school in the world little brother, because they don’t do this?
Only the University of Phil is doing this… again.
If it’s the interlocking OS baseball cap, it is Okie State’s logo. We leased it.
This is dumb. Even the most casual of college sports fans would know who Oregon State is. There’s not a FCS team in the country that I’m not at least aware of, let alone a P5 team.
We’re not as invisible as certain OSU fans with an inferiority complex like to think.
You’re way off here. You must live in Oregon.
In the last decade, I’ve lived in Greenville, Houston, Philly, and Columbus. The vast majority of people in those places, all with pretty strong “casual college sports fan” bases, don’t know who Oregon State is.
Baseball fans know and that’s about it.
Meckler went 2-for-4 with a run scored in the Giants’ 7-0 win against Tampa tonight.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JbxuI56pULg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O8THht00knE
332 minor ABs, and he’s in the League.
Just amazing.
https://www.mlb.com/news/wade-meckler-gets-1st-2-major-league-hits
Why would a reportedly 4′ 10″ high school freshman even think about going out for the baseball team?
Cam Rising is still not fully cleared to practice at Utah. Does some drills but that’s it. Their backup QB got seriously hurt this week so they could be in a tough spot to start the season. Still I expect to see him starting vs the Beavs.
I think they’ll still beat Florida at home with a third string QB but this is a must-win game for the conference.
Florida and Utah match up pretty well.
It’s up to Utah’s interior D to stop the run, for it to be a win.
Sound like OSU may be facing a less than 100% Cam Rising i week 5. If he’s not practicing now. Chances are he doesn’t play first few games but who knows
They can set up a narrative that they “weren’t at full strength” for the noncon games, if needed. And they guarantee he won’t relapse or get hurt before conference play.
Or, he’s just taking longer to recover.
UW QBs and WRs playing well in oractice:
“Junior quarterback Dylan Morris excelled in UW’s 11th preseason practice Tuesday, particularly when targeting sophomore wide receiver Germie Bernard. The two linked up for touchdowns of 3 and 57 yards and additional receptions of 19, 47 and 50 yards as well.
It was a difficult day for the Husky secondary — and Morris and Bernard were far from the only culprits.
Standout quarterback Michael Penix Jr. — who took the vast majority of starting snaps — also looked left and floated a 53-yard touchdown to wide receiver Ja’Lynn Polk, who beat safety Dominique Hampton down the sideline. Redshirt freshman wideout Denzel Boston got in on the act as well, hauling in a deep ball from Morris (despite coverage from freshman corner Leroy Bryant) for a 57-yard score.
Penix, for one, showed no lingering effects after being recently limited with mild soreness in his throwing arm. The 6-foot-3, 213-pounder took a shotgun snap from his own 3-yard line, set and ripped an out route across the field to wide receiver Jalen McMillan for a 25-yard gain.
In all, McMillan, Polk and Rome Odunze have established themselves as UW’s starting wide receivers … but Bernard and Boston have repeatedly flashed in preseason practices as well. Expect all five to earn ample reps this fall”
I think v. UW will be the toughest game of the season. I just don’t think Nix is going to have as good a season as he did in ’22, and not impressed w/Lanning’s inconsistent results in D and ST yet.
https://www.seattletimes.com/sports/uw-husky-football/observations-from-uws-11th-practice-of-preseason-camp/
Looked up UW WR Bernard trying to see if he was any relation to former OSU RB Bernard…didn’t appear so, but noticed him making this interesting quote on his excitement of going back to Big10 (he’s a transfer to UW from MSU):
“I feel like the biggest thing for us is worrying about this season and what we’re going to do in the Pac 12 first and then we’ll worry about going to the Big Ten and doing what we have to do in the Big Ten.”
I hadn’t considered how the move to the B10 would be a big distraction too for teams leaving the PAC, compared to an OSU being extra motivated to beat those abandoning the PAC.
The CW could be OSU last PAC conference regular season game and should have important post season implications….though hopefully Beavs will play in the conference championship game against USC(?)…
I don’t see USC getting there.
Sadly, I think we get a replay of a previous match-up, if we make it.
Is it realistic to feel the Beavs coaching staff is better able than most to deal with a re-match?
Maybe?
What the players in the first loss learn is invaluable, though. The winning players seem to assume it’s going to be the same team doing the same things, in the rematch.
Probably can’t hurt that they had one of the worst secondaries in the conference last season…maybe just a sign of more of the same this year?
Hopefully!
https://youtube.com/clip/UgkxherR95YxwWYqd6I0yO2vG-kLg2YRUKrF
Just saying….
UW is by far the toughest game on the schedule.
I’d say odds are pretty good that Penix is hurt by the time we play them, Nix also. Neither will repeat their output from last year.
Penix or no Penix they’re still the worst matchup
Not if we have a QB who can pass, apparently.
Too bad DJ doesn’t play corner or free safety
For which team?
Sounds like their secondary is shit more than anything.
A little more fun with Sagarin ratings (based on last season):
-If you remove the bottom four AAC teams and add the 4-PAC, the conference is just as good as the ACC.
-The average AAC team is ranked the same as the 4 ex-PAC teams the Big 12 is adding. Arizona and ASU were roughly on par with the average AAC team last season.
Which are the bottom four AAC?
USF, Temple, Tulsa, Navy. Those were the only teams out of the 11 with losing records. Pretty big gap between Navy and the next lowest, ECU.
Different story with the new look AAC, though. They took a big step back adding Charlotte and UAB.
Simply grafting the 4-PAC onto the AAC doesn’t seem like a good solution. Hopefully Stanford or somebody pushes for a reformulated conference.
The bottom of the AAC for this year using 2022 #’s will be left behind.
7 teams on this list added to the BIG XII
“Bottom” ACC, Pac-12 teams, and soon to be BIG XII teams: #62 Syracuse, #68 Arizona, #69 CAL, #72 ASU, #87 Stanford, #112 Boston College, #143 Colorado
“Bottom” AAC members: 63 UTSA, 66 East Carolina, 74 Navy, 85 UAB, 92 Tulsa, 99 Florida Atlantic, 100 North Texas, 124 Temple, 129 South Florida, 144 Rice, 163 Charlotte
top 6 MWC teams: #36 Fresno State, #46 Air Force, #52 Boise State, #91 San Diego State, #102 Wyoming, #104 San Jose State
Sun Belt: #55 Troy, #60 James Madison, #70 Marshall, #76 Louisiana, #77 Appalachian State, #81 South Alabama
Independent: 73 Army West Point
MAC: 75 Ohio, 79 Toledo, 90 Eastern Michigan
7 Utah (Big XII)
12 Oregon State (Pac-4)*
13 Washington (B1G)
14 Clemson (ACC)
15 Oregon (B1G)
16 Florida State (ACC)
18 Southern California (B1G)
23 Louisville (ACC)
25 Tulane (AAC)*
28 UCLA (B1G)
34 Wake Forest (ACC)
43 Washington State (PAC-4)*
47 NC State (ACC)
48 Cincinnati (BIG XII)
51 Memphis (AAC)*
57 Central Florida(UCF) (BIG XII)
59 SMU (AAC)*
62 Syracuse (ACC)
63 UTSA (AAC)*
64 Houston (BIG XII)
66 East Carolina (AAC)*
68 Arizona (BIG XII)
69 California (PAC-4)*
72 Arizona State (BIG XII)
74 Navy (AAC)
85 UAB (AAC)
87 Stanford (PAC-4)*
92 Tulsa (AAC)
99 Florida Atlantic (AAC)*
100 North Texas (AAC)
112 Boston College (ACC)
124 Temple (AAC)
129 South Florida (AAC)
143 Colorado (BIG XII)
144 Rice (AAC)
163 Charlotte (AAC)
* = Teams being added to the PAc-12 or in the PAC-12.
If I had a say, I would form the conference with these teams as they are the highest ranking G5 in football per the Sagarin ratings. One could argue to add SDSU and App State to have 10 west coast and 10 East coast for a 20 team conference ranging across the two coastlines. This is regionally based, you could have no divisions, or you could split into 4 divisions of 5 teams if you go to 20.
West
Oregon State
Washington State
Stanford
Fresno State
Boise State
California
Air Force
SMU
UTSA
(SDSU)
East
Tulane
Louisiana
Memphis
Troy
East Carolina
Marshall
Navy
Army West Point
James Madison
(App State)
apparently Service Academies cannot be in a power 5 conference nor receive NIL money. So there goes the service academy schools.
Oregon State
Washington State
Cal
Stanford
Tulane
Memphis
SMU
Fresno State
Boise State
San Diego State
UTSA
ECU
North Texas
Rice
Temple
FAU
South Florida
Anyone of these fringe teams to get to 18:
Tulsa
UAB
Marshall
James Madison (Basketball mainly)
App State
Troy
Louisiana Ragin’ Cajuns
But are you including UCF, Cincinnati, and Houston who will all be playing in the Big 12 next year?
UCF, Cinci, and Houston are all in the B12 starting this current season.
The funny thing about USC, UCLA, UW and Ducks going to Big10 is how they have marketed the big matchups between Ohio St and USC as if it will be an every year event. The Big10 will have 18 teams next year and they will likely go to a 10 game conference schedule, keep the west coast pod as less travel and those 4 teams will always play each other, which means they will play 6/7 games against Big10 opponents. The selling point for these teams joining was to create big in conference matchups. Who is going to be interested in UW vs Rutgers in September? The logic is just bad but they have tv money swaying them at each turn. So none of these 4 teams could go through a ‘weak’ PAC12 without losing at least 1 game, yet they will play each other and 6-7 additional Big10 opponents and that gives them a better chance at a national title? They are all fools and traitors. I think none of them enjoyed playing in Martin Stadium or Reser Stadium because they knew it was never a gimme like they can count on at Maryland, Illinois, Rutgers, Indiana, Northwestern, Purdue, (all of which will be booted form the Big10 as dead weight once things settle down with realignment.)
I’d say UW, DUcks and USC all go into the Big10 next year with new qbs and will be lucky to go 6-6, Ducks may go 7-5, USC 8-4, UCLA 6-6 but none of them will go in and beat out Michigan or Ohio St like they think they will. It won’t be so simple, because the schedule dictates at least 3 losses just due their own matchups. Which is why OSU/Mich is always a big game as it is the only guaranteed tough matchup for both of them and it is always at the end of the year so they both go in ranked high and have no negative spin from the loss. Oregon will have to beat UW, UCLA, and USC in order to gain the opportunity to have a big10 matchup even matter.
My guess is they negotiated behind doors before they joined and part of the deal was that all PAC12 entries get softer BIG10 opponents for a few years to “look good” as they join. SO they likely create 1 marquee matchup for each mid season but then give them all of the bottom feeders for the rest of the games, kind of like the SEC does every year.
Short-sighted and all it did was wreck the PAC12.
UCLA has a brutal 2024 schedule: at Iowa, at LSU, at Rutgers, at Michigan, home vs Fresno, Ohio State and USC.
Wait until they correct it for Oregon and Washington to be in the mix.
that is solid analysis, OhioBeav. Especially that it’s a given that SC, UCLA, UW and UO will play each other every year to minimize travel/maximize late night TV, so that any one of the has to run that three game gauntlet in order to have a meaningful chance to get to the conference title game.
USC, Oregon, Washington, and UCLA have to play the other “Top 3” teams of the current Pac-12 and have to probably play at least one of these teams if not 2 of them or, not at all: Penn St, Ohio St, Michigan
UW and UO joined specifically for money. One of the most transparent cash grabs that I’ve seen for a minute. UW hasn’t been in a good financial spot for a while and UP undoubtedly knows Phil won’t be around much longer and likely won’t be seeing the same financial commitment coming in when he’s not around and wanted the big payday. This feels like they signed up for mediocrity but get to associate themselves with Ohio State and see it as the status they’ve craved. Winning will no longer be the most important thing. This will lead them being left out with the super conference that the SEC and Big Ten create and UW and UO fans will want sympathy when they only have themselves to blame.
I like the typo.
They shall now be called the University of Phil.
Go State! Beat Phil!
Asu prez talks about the Great Apple Caper they left on the table.
https://arizonasports.com/story/3531309/pac-12-great-offer-from-apple-asus-michael-crow/
Whoa!
50/50 split on anything above the guarantee?
The deal was way better than I thought it would be.
This was clearly a lot better deal than what was being reported. A key thing he mentioned was they weren’t at the mercy of tv networks in regards to scheduling games. I remember in the early 2000’s when the big games were at 12:30 PT. Nobody wants to have their games finishing at 11 pm. Better time slots instead of being buried at times when half the country is asleep would have been nice. Reporters are mouth pieces for networks and wanted the PAC to fold. It’s gonna be funny when the same thing happens to the Big 12 when the higher ups decide it’s their turn to be raided.
94Beav, up above, said:
“Too bad DJ doesn’t play corner or free safety”
Makes me wonder, because of his experience, leadership, and performance; is Kitan Oladapo the single most important player that needs to stay healthy for the team to succeed this season? Any other candidates?
Hodgins, Gould, Robinson too
“single most”……..still going with Oladapo, although Hodgins may fit too.
Agree on Oladapo.
Experience, leadership, performance, AND he’s anchoring a much-depleted unit that lost a lot of talent from last year. It’s our thinnest unit and the leadership here really matters to help with the young and inexperienced players.
Just got another “Go Pokes!”…..smh….
National branding really does matter and it’s always felt like it’s been a total afterthought or in the “well shucks what are you gonna do” category for OSU Athletics and the University as a whole. So many missed opportunities. Why wasn’t there big call out to donors for $ to run a national PR campaign when Smiley had em at 9+ wins and the baseball team won back-to-back national championships between 2006-2010?
It’s one of my biggest frustrations about the Smiley era (also probably because I was on campus for a good chunk of it), probably second only to time-out and in-game clock management (wtf!). Riley deserves a lot of credit for the program that he built at OSU and the success he had during those years. Why didn’t they push to capitalize on it and build the brand of the University and Athletics in any substantial way?
Playing in a more geographically dispersed conference could actually help with this. E.g. if you’re playing Memphis every year in every sport, more people in Memphis are going to know who Oregon State is.
Great point. Could help recruiting in those southern cities.
…time-out and in-game clock management
Thanks, killed my lunch appetite!
Shane Shoemaker on the “Clutch Points” site re: how the ACC, and FSU/Clemson in particular, are stuck in place: “the networks finally looked at their budgets and essentially realized they had reached the peak.” Like I’ve been saying: these vaunted “linear deals” (that enticed UO and UW to stab the conference in the back) are dinosaurs. The last of their kind. I suspect ND’s new deal will have a strong, if not predominant, streaming component.
Shoemaker makes another point, about a likely trend going forward: thedemise of the pro-rata division of revenue within conferences. The next wave is going to be “incentive based,” meaning, if you get to the conference championship game, CFP, (Omaha? that’s my add) you get a greater share of the revenue. In a way, Boise has a kind of built in incentive deal in the Mountain West, though it is based on a retrospective view of success, not forward looking.
And then, in a not entirely unrelated story, The Nation magazine has a story about the shift land-grant universities are undergoing: “convergence of several cultural and economic tectonic shifts”–demise of liberal arts majors, AI, etc.
Could also add “demise of a university degree” and the “disappearance of an affordable degree”
In a world of accelerating tuition costs and out of whack tv contracts, they all think they can keep making the money appear and no need for basic economics. Eventually the tv golden goose was going to be dinner and the students weren’t going to pay rising tuition forever…let’s see what Stanford will deem worthy of the $38 billion endowment, among others.
Barnes comments on the pac4 and moving forward. GK is not involved apparently. https://www.oregonlive.com/beavers/2023/08/oregon-state-may-be-days-from-a-decision-on-start-of-a-rebuilt-pac-12.html?outputType=amp
-OSU and WSU are waiting on Cal and Stanford, presumably because the remaining conference assets and having 4 schools to start from vs. 2 is a big deal.
-Looking at an 8-10 team league
-Seems unlikely Stanford will lower themselves to a plan like this, but if they do, let’s say they buy out one MWC member (SDSU? Boise St?) and take 5 from the AAC to make a 10-team league. That gives you something like:
OSU, WSU, Cal, Stanford, SDSU, Tulane, Memphis, SMU, UTSA, Rice
71.5 average Sagarin rating
That’s a pretty competitive league in good media markets.
Or if you can buy out a few desperate MWC teams that see the writing on the wall, you could go:
OSU, WSU, Cal, Stanford, SDSU, Boise St, Air Force, Fresno St
74 average Sagarin rating (on par with ACC)
Key takeaways from Daschel interview with Barnes:
“We can’t wait a month. I’m hopeful that it’s days,” Barnes said.
If Cal and Stanford join forces with Oregon State and Washington State, Barnes said “we build from there immediately.” Barnes declined to say the schools that a new Pac-12 would target. His vision of a rebuilt conference includes “eight to 10 schools to start with.” Barnes said the remaining schools would use the Pac-12 assets – existing media rights, emergency fund, NCAA men’s basketball shares, the Pac-12 Network – to “attract high caliber programs to build this back.”
Stanford thinks they can still get into the ACC. maybe by this week.
https://www.si.com/college/stanford/football/stanford-is-optimistic-they-can-get-the-votes-to-join-the-acc-as-soon-as-this-week
Barnes shouldn’t be planning on Stanford staying in the new PAC. They clearly don’t want to and will probably jump at the next chance to leave that comes their way. Plan around not having them and use it as potential upside if they do decide to join.
It seems more likely for Stanford to go independent route than stay with the other 3.
Cal has no other option if Stanford leaves them behind.
A PAC rebuild would be daunting in any case but would be sure to get voted out of auto bid playoff chances in short order.
However if Stanford departs, it opens up easier MWC additions and mixing in AAC 4 best would be ideal.
OSU
WSU
Cal
Boise St
Colorado St
Fresno St
SDSU
SMU
Tulane
Memphis
Would this conference be worthy of P5 status? Maybe/maybe not
If you add in Air Force you can probably convince Stanford to stay since the Air Force Academy is literally better than any Ivy League college today. Why wouldn’t we want to add them when they are CSU’s biggest rival, have won 10+ games three out of the last four years, and won 5 of their last 6 bowl games?
He’s leaving 2 spots open for them, otherwise he will have 2 teams vetted to fill their spots. We will go to 10-12 teams in this first round and then in 2 years they’ll go to 16-18 teams. I like this plan of rebuilding a conference with the best G5 teams in the Texas to Tennessee states aka Central to Southeastern parts of the states for recruiting purposes. Will open up the caliber of players we can recruit other than California.
The author, in a linked piece dtd 8/14, says Luck was hired by the “remaining four PAC12 programs”.
Up above Barnes comments include the same line.
Someone here had a source that claimed Luck was only working for two.
And so it goes.
Mitch Vingle is the reporter or one of the reporters stating Luck is only consulting OSU and Wazzu…
https://youtu.be/lL6GfpQyHNU
good catch, OOB
same guy (Kevin Borba) who wrote the linked article published another piece almost at the same time on “All Cardinal.” key point in his other piece: “while a program like Stanford is confident in their chances with the ACC, it would be foolish to count out Oliver Luck.” The Luck strategy, Borba asserts, is to add the four or five best AAC schools first, since that conference has a low buy-out fee, and then add the best of the MW in two years. His best five are SMU, USF< Memphis, Tulane and Rice. I've had three of those in my "Pacific and Gulf Coast Conference" line up for 10 days now.
This is the best approach.
Interesting article here, not sure if it has any legitimacy. https://www.sportskeeda.com/college-football/11-teams-will-likely-join-pac-12-expansion-dissolution-aac-hopes-paying-no-exit-fees-reports. This seems like the best opportunity for OSU outside of landing in a P4 conference.
This is an article based on a completely unsubstantiated X post.
Shoot….I was afraid of that. Somebody would have had to really work quickly! Yet, they’re still pushing it.
Even the SI article about Stanford and the ACC is just a bunch of words written about one guy’s tweet with no follow-up. The tweet doesn’t even say there are any sources, just that Stanford is optimistic. ?
1700!
2k or bust.
Does it count if Jack goes back 400 comments and starts responding to each one that rankles his idiosyncrasies?
We all need to be working along the honor system at this point and not simply post with an eye on the comment count.
If Barnes is saying we are weeks away from an agreement, he is trying to close the deal before football begins which would be good and make sense. Hopefully it is a strong enough play to back down all of the other conferences, at least for a few years and salvages the coaching staff/roster for the short term. It’s imperative to maintain the staff and this roster as JS has built it, just to see what kind of success they can achieve.
Do you have any hair left to be on fire?
right on cue, today’s Wall Street Journal with another probative piece:
Headline: “TV Makes up less than 50% of US Viewing for First Time.”
Key quotes: “The milestone is the latest sign of the rapid erosion of the cable-TV bundle, which has lost about a quarter of its subscribers over the last decade.”
“Cable television accounted for 29.6% of total U. S. viewing time in July, while broadcast attracted 20% . . . . Streaming services meanwhile captured 38.7% of Americans’ viewing time, while “other” [gaming, DVD playback] “counted for the remaining 11.6%.”
Other key points: “Peacock and Apple TV+ now carry a number of MLB games exclusively, while Amazon’s Prime Video has become the primary home of the NFL’s Thursday Night Football. Even companies that generate significant amounts of revenue offering live sports on their cable channels are exploring offering them on their streaming platforms, a balancing act as they look to build their streaming subscriber bases without cannibalizing their ailing TV-network businesses. Warner Bros. Discovery, home of the TNT, TBS, CNN cable networks . . . earlier this month said it is working on bringing news and live sports to its streaming offerings . . . . ” [I wonder of poor George knew about this?]
After describing Disney’s attempts to find a strategic partner for its streaming services, the article quotes Disney CEO Bob Iger: “Taking our ESPN flagship channels direct to consumer is not a matter of if, but when.”
Again: UW and UO signed up for the dinosaur package. Let’s hope Stanford doesn’t fall for the same thinking with its ACC dalliance.
It’s sad the presidents and ADs aren’t forward thinking enough to come to this conclusion. And yet I still see some articles about people leaving streaming services. I’m assuming those must be plants or are people honing in on more direct viewing and less Ala cart options?
What you are seeing are reports about streaming “churn.” Say that someone signed up to stream Yellowstone on Paramount. As soon as they see every show in that season, they quit, and sign up for Disney to watch, for example, Mandalorian. None of the streaming services, except for Netflix, which invented the paradigm, are making any money, yet.
None of them are making money, because they’re still investing in infrastructure. Disney was the first to flip to DTC, so they’ll be the first to make a profit, starting in Q3 or Q4 of 2024.
ESPN will lose money, when they move over, unless someone like apple helps them ease the transition by providing the platform, while they provide the content.
The nice thing about the Pac 12 is we have already spent on the infrastructure, and we’re just looking for a platform.
I’m curious why people on this thread believe the Big 10 and SEC won’t be able to capitalize on streaming as soon as it becomes most advantageous. ESPN already said they will be offering DTC option soon. Fox Sports could obviously do the same if they wanted. The end game here for College Football will be an AFC-NFC style super league that capitalizes on whatever the best option the market can provide them. It remains to be seen how many total schools will be included in the super league (IMO, probably about 60 schools would be the absolute max), but for long-term survival, it is absolutely imperative that OSU and WSU position themselves to have a seat at the table at the highest level. Seems like a very difficult task at the moment.
Those schools still have to transfer the product to the platform, and they don’t own the means of production. So they’ll have to pay an additional sum for the production side.
Some of the “Disney is failing” narrative is just baloney thrown out by soft-crotched males worried about their own feels. They lost four million subscribers in Q1, because Indians had to sign up for exclusive cricket content until ESPN no longer had those rights. While they were still making money, layoffs had to balance the losses to meet guidance, so their stock wouldn’t be affected to the downside.
Churn is also a thing, but losing cricket rights is the biggie.
It doesn’t matter what viewership is. They’re getting the money while they can.
They signed up for a dinosaur package for sure but it also keeps them alive
It’s pretty much a given the next media packages will be less. The ACC might end up lucking out when the BIG10 can’t get the same dollars in 5 years.
@bill Media packages might be less. But the Big 10 will sure as hell get more than the ACC. Explain to me how the schools in that conference will suddenly be more valuable than Ohio State, Michigan, Penn State, USC, Washington, Oregon, UCLA.
ACC gets 40M per year I think? BIG10 expires in 2030 and ACC 2036? ? By 2030, cord cutting should be the norm. Meaning every sports package will be ala carte. There’s a lot less money in that model. BIG10 might not be able to match $40 million in their new deal.
Apple’s model seems like a guide to what the future deals may look like. A base amount plus incentives based on subscriptions. Some schools will be fine and others not so much.
So ACC might have 6 years where they have locked in money while the other schools on the ala carte model will have to really work for additional dollars.
Just my guess. Remind me in 10 years.
The last four are easy, since they’ve relegated themselves to second class status in a foreign conference. Their values will decrease over time.
But you’re correct about the perceived value of the others that the newbies will be adding to.
What does Pat Casey say?
“Make it a professional business model,” he says. “The way things have changed, conferences are nonsense.”
As quoted by Eggers in a piece that includes comments from: Miiiitch, Smilin Mike, Darwin Barney, and others.
Seems Casey may be on the same page as Chip Kelly.
https://www.kerryeggers.com/stories/show-me-the-money-oregon-bites-oregon-state-bruised
Casey is the leader of a small group of leaders who did all they could to avoid this moment of reckoning for OSU. Dennis and Rueck would qualify as other members of the club. That’s about it. Actually, in way, Angry and this site qualify.
Huge rewrite of history for the big12/pac12 merger. Texas didn’t want to merge because it would have meant giving up the longhorn network. It was a cash cow for the them exclusively. They did not want to do revenue sharing with anyone. Texas A&M was going to come to the PAC12 too, but they ditched for the SEC because of Texas.
The Longhorn Network didn’t exist until it looked like Texas was going to the Pac 12, with our network.
ESPN couldn’t let that happen, so they offered an obscene amount of money for the failure that was the LHN.
Not sure why Chip Kelly keeps getting the mention for this idea, when Muffet McGraw said it first.
Come to find out, deeper into today’s WSJ is a relevant sometimes humorous column by Jason Gay. Titled “Why College Football Can’t Help Itself” it has some sarcastically funny quips, to wit: looking forward to “enjoying the pageantry of Oregon at Rutgers.” Or, questioning why FSU is voting against Stanford and Cal joining the ACC: “Don’t they want to play in a half-empty Pac 12 stadium before they rush out the door?”
In a more serious vein: “It has been amazing to see some college football surrogates tally up the aeronautical miles and claim it’s really not a big deal, it isn’t as much additional travel as you would think. Is that so? In a couple years, please hop on a call and explain this to a volleyball player cramming for two exams in six hours and is wedged in the middle seat of a transcontinental flight. Does anyone think the chaos ends here, that schools will stop lily-padding from conference to conference [that’s a great phrase] and deal to deal? Wait until TV contracts come up years from now, and networks start talking about programs that aren’t carrying their weight.” [This is a version of my dinosaur argument and what Albers from Nebraksa was indirectly alluding to; the pain of addition by subtraction]
Back to why this is happening, per Gay: ” Convinced they’re in an arms race with the competition, schools spend, spend, spend, . . . and if don’t do it
students will go somewhere else. Sound familiar? It’s the same pretzel logic of college athletics, a trap the schools created and now refuse to challenge.
‘We have to do it, because everyone else is doing it.’ Doesn’t every parent have at least one conversation with a child in which we admonish them against this type of thinking?”
In the end, Gay comes down on the Chip Kelly/Pat Casey exit strategy: just have college football do its own thing. Logical, he asserts, but why won’t it happen? “Colleges in the thriving conferences seem loath to break up the party. They’re too busy battling for NIL regulation and restricting use of the transfer portal. They’re freaked at the idea of collective bargaining and athlete revenue sharing. Easier to keep control of the status quo.”
Athletes as employees and collective bargaining in the revenue generating sports is basically a certainty at this point, and probably in the near future. What will happen to the non revenue sports is a big question since they are essentially totally reliant on Football and in some cases basketball to pay for them. What will the Title IX implications be? Sadly, many non-revenue sports are likely to be cut unless Schools and States come up with a different way to subsidize them.
I mostly checked out after NIL because I saw where this was going. I never had interest in the NFL compared to college athletics because of how 100% commercial it is. With both being completely and overtly commercial, especially now, my miniscule remaining interest is little more than morbid curiosity and pining for remnants of old times.
Someone online put it well when they said “CFB is basically trying to determine who the 33rd best team is now.” To me, CFB has become the NFL but with inferior players and more lopsided boring games.
I have frustrations and anger at this all going down, but maybe I’ll dump those thoughts out another time.
At least the NFL recognized the importance of maintaining some level of competitive parity in order to keep fan’s interest. Salary caps and the draft are critical aspects of maintaining that parity. College sports are completely unhinged right now with absolutely nothing resembling parity. It’s crazy how blind these colleges and conferences are to the fact they’re completely ruining the game for fans, the source of their revenue.
It’s possible that once they’ve whittled the conferences down to a manageable number of teams, then they’ll implement the needed regulations and governance to force some level of competitive parity. But it may be too late by then.
Yeah I actually think it’s worse than the NFL at this point. MLB using a rubber ball and Spider Tack…they’ve literally managed to ruin every sport.
In retrospect, Arena League football was simply ahead of its time.
It is ruining the game for fans who are attached to the smaller market teams. My guess is the Ohio State fans and even the USC fans think what is happening is all great.
My buddy is a Georgia fan/alum and said, “This is stupid, but I guess I have to keep watching it since we’re great now.”
Once they aren’t great, he might not watch. Deep down he knows it is shit. I think sports will ultimately only appeal to stupid people and low attention span people, which is why I said Arena League was ahead of its time. Since attention spans are in decline, it’s possible this works and the audience just changes from educated/attention fans to lower IQ/lower attention fans. I don’t think cable companies care how smart the people watching are.
Have you noticed how dumb telecasters have become? They just randomly scream about home runs like it’s still an exciting play, even though like every few ABs in a MLB there’s a rubber ball HR. Compare that to a Vin Skull broadcast. It’s amazing how stupid sports have become.
From John Canzano’s interview with Scott Barnes on his show and on podcast, I found these two bits of information interesting:
WSU and OSU are more aligned at the hip than Cal and Stanford are to the goal of rebuilding the Pac-12.
Second:
Scott Barnes feels comfortable with 8-10 teams to start when it comes to expanding.
This tells me he’s looking at adding the best AAC members now and then adding MWC teams in the next year or two once their buyout isn’t $34 million per team. I would imagine Apple deal will start out with a base of around $18 million per school or $23 million for the remaining Pac-4 teams and then a lowered rate for the AAC members coming into the conference. Then, after 2 years of the current deal, the reduced rate of about $12 million comes into play from Apple for teams from the MWC and the PAC-12 teams(2026 season) will get an increase or renegotiated rate based on subscriptions. Streaming is cyclical and I could see it have a clause where if goals are met by the conference, then their rates go up. I could also see Pac-12 affiliated bowl games would go to Apple TV when Pac-12 teams are the home teams of their bowl games. There are a lot of options where linear can come into play for the right added price. If they truly need to fill the night game slots, then they will certainly have to pay a hefty price for those games. Remember, ESPN also has access to MWC teams as well, so they aren’t entirely “Out” of content on the West coast.
Unwatchable.
This is the best path forward to possibly being relevant long term. If we somehow managed to get into the BIG12 (appears to be a longshot at this point) it would make us more stable now but I fear we would be in the same boat 5 years from now.
Unfortunately, this is true. San Diego State will likely opt for the Big 12 not the PAC when they get there chance to flee at a reduced buyout. It would be ideal to help with their buyout now and get them in for next season to avoid losing out on that market. If the media deal is anywhere close to $20M it would be a huge win considering the alternatives.
I was all about going to the Big12 to stay relevant. But I think rebuilding a PAC conference via Apple streaming might be the better long term play and could turn us from a small fish in the pond to the big fish in the pond. I think Smith is a forward thinker and would like being on the cutting edge of a new frontier. I’ve always said winning is key to it all. It unlocks more money, brings better coaches, and nets better recruits.
In the end I’m going to relish this season as the last season of its kind… the last PAC-12 season. With that I scream Go Beavs! Let’s go out with a bang! …. Or chainsaw thingy.
This is my prediction:
1. AAC or MWC
2. This results in (a) Smith leaving and (b) 75% of our current recruits entering the transfer protocol.
3. We are then stuck rebuilding the entire program with a new coach, maybe Riley, and waiting years for the team to get respectable again. In that time frame, we have a terrible record even in these inferior conferences.
4. While going through this transition, we have to watch foreign games with no ties like Tulane, which make the teams pretty much unwatchable.
So, this is the end of Beaver football. Die hard fans will sit around and waste their lives watching this total crap product, but a lot will tune out and do something better with their limited time on this amazing planet.
I’d watch if we went to the Big 12. That would be interesting and competitive games, and we’d keep our recruits and probably our coach intact. But the odds of that are under 5% I’d say. Short of that, it is the end.
Edit: Rebuilding the PAC if we could keep Cal and Stanford would be semi-watchable. Would have to add some intriguing schools like SDSU, Fresno, Nevada, BSU, Air Force, CSU…something like that is bad but just barely watchable. We’d still lose a lot of recruits and most likely lose Smith. Smith is only here for nostalgia. He is/was reliving his playing days. That’s why he’s a HC at Oregon State. To relive his glory vicariously through others. Now that that is gone and all the schools he competed against are gone, he will be gone.
We are better off going independent than doing all this. Then we can at least play in interesting games and probably get good recruits if they see a competitive schedule. I don’t think chasing TV money is wise since TV as we know it will be completely obsolete soon. There’s a 99.999% now that all of us will die never seeing the Beavs achieve greatness (Rose Bowl, Pac title, etc). We had a pretty good shot if we had stayed in the PAC, but of course we wasted so much time with Riley. Those wasted years where we accepted mediocrity lead to this result. We’re building into something respectable but ten years too late and just in time for the entire landscape to change on us. Once again, Lucy pulls the football on OSU.
It is this year or bust for OSU. Smith is likely hammering that home. It’s our last chance at something special in our lifetimes.
I put up a new thread. Going for 2k was exciting, but it’s getting super hard to follow any discussion.