12.Jan.2012 Basketball: Oregon State @ Arizona

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Jack:

The Beavs are looking to rebound from a tough loss at home by traveling to Tucson tonight to face an enigma of a Wildcats team. I look at the talent assembled on UA’s team, and I just wonder why they’re not doing better than they are.

There are two major reasons which jump to the forefront. First, they have no viable bigs. Second, their backcourt is young.

Senior swingman Jesse Perry (6’7″) and junior wing Solomon Hill (6’6″) are the leaders of this team. They use their athleticism to roam the mid-range in, and their hustle provides them with high percentage opportunities. Both will fight hard for a board or a loose ball, and both will step beyond the arc if left open… though Hill is the more effective perimeter player. Junior wing Kevin Parrom (6’6″) was supposed to add to this experience with hard-nosed defense and efficient offensive play. But an off-season shooting has made his season more one of rehab than the play he was hoping to contribute.

Senior guard Kyle Fogg (6’3″) leads the backcourt in experience. But that’s not saying much. Fogg is not a slasher, and he seems to be afraid of the lane, spotting up for treys more than anything. He still manages to get fouls called his way when he does try to move to the mid-range, so I wonder why he doesn’t do it more.

Frosh Nick Johnson (6’2″) and Josiah Turner (6’3″) round out the backcourt. Both have a lot of skill, but both also start making mistakes when their legs start to tire. With all due respect to Perry and Hill, I fear Johnson the most of anyone on this team. He is so well rounded that when he figures out this level of play he will be very hard to stop.

Soph guard Jordin Mayes (6’2″) was supposed to keep the frosh at bay for at least this year. He had a good showing late last year, and he was expected to make great strides headed into this season. But he first lost the starting nod to Turner then seemed to lose his swagger. He still logs plenty of minutes off the bench, but he has had a more than inconsistent handle and shot to date. And his defensive lapses have cost his team on more than one occasion. Still, look for him to be more comfortable in the confines of McKale. Coach Miller keeps putting him on the floor for a reason, and he could go off at any time.

In the meantime, senior guard Brendon Lavender (6’5″) does take advantage of his time on the floor by providing instant perimeter offense. He can rest some legs on the defensive end, but don’t expect much more than a couple stretches where he will come in and put some shots up.

You may have noticed by now that I haven’t yet listed any bigs. That’s because UA doesn’t really have any. Look for frosh Angelo Chol (6’9″) to come in to counter the Beavs size, maybe grabbing some boards and throwing down some dunks. But he is a liability in the offensive flow, providing poor spacing for the scorers on the team… and no passing. Junior Kyryl Natyazhko (6’11″) is still there, but he hasn’t seen the floor too much recently. And senior Alex Jacobson (7’0″) had back problems last year, but even a healthy Jacobson provided little more than five warm fouls.

So I have no clue how this game turns out. The Beavs have the overall advantage in size and experience. But Arizona is playing at McKale, where they are historically just tough to beat. And they have talent enough to face anyone despite their size. Whichever team starts well will likely have the advantage. If the Beavs jump out to any sort of control, look for them to make their major run in the second half, when UA seems to take their time finding a rhythm.

This should be a win for our boys. But I would liken it to the win we should have logged in Pullman. It’s a road game, and OSU needs to show that they can play on the road. Until that time, I have to call this for the home team.

Zonies 81 – Beavs 75

Angry

Must admit, I am starting to lose the faith (again). I see a lot of potential…the team is close, but they continue to mess up the little things. Worst of all is that they do it over and over, night after night. At first I thought the team needed a game to get adjusted to Pac-12 speed. Now I'm not so sure.

I don't have any good way of knowing if a guy (like Moreland) dropping a rebound is CR or the player. I mean, I think it's the player and his (lack of) coordination or focus. But, who knows. Either way, it's time to produce. Year four, CR has all his own players…it needs to start soon.

Isn't it fun being a Beaver fan?

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  • gobeavers92 says:
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    This team has quite a bit of talent (most talent we have had in many years) BUT this team does not play defense and does not rebound well at all. Throw in poor foul shooting and it equals POOR COACHING…… I understand this is a shocking revelation. The entire athletic department needs to be cleaned out and the 1st 3 to go need to be Riley, CR, and Bobby D. We need Dr Ray to grow and pair and start cleaning house! I understand I am just whistling through the wheat field but with what is going on 40 miles to the south this is embarrassing.

    • SeattleBeav says:
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      EXACTLY…poor defense (some of these guys look like they get lost out there), poor rebounding (Burton couldn’t fucking jump if he had a jetpack strapped to his large ass) and Jesus Holy Christ what’s up with free throws. Big guys have to hit their free throws. Ralph Miller would have had Burton sitting the pine until he could freakin’ hit a free throw.

  • Mud&Sticks Mud&Sticks says:
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    “…Isn’t it fun being a Beaver fan?…”

    Definition – Masochist: a person who is gratified by pain, degradation, etc., that is self-imposed or imposed by others.

  • Beaver Byte says:
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    I don’t have a great feeling about this one either. CR doesn’t have a real upset win in conference yet. Then you add in that we are having poorer starts to games then we sometimes did in the past when were getting upsets along the way. I see us with a modest deficit at the half that we won’t be able to close. 1-4 does not make anything of a good Pac-12 start. The NIT is not looking good unless this team finds its fire quick.

    Oregon St @ Arizona:
    http://beaverbyte.com

  • Mud&Sticks Mud&Sticks says:
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    Stream: http://www.firstrow.tv/watch/101704/1/watch-oregon-st.-vs-arizona.html

    Hopefully more streams to follow.

  • JD says:
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    I don’t have a good reason as to why but I think the Beavers win tonight.

  • GoBeavs90 says:
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    Beavers 72-70

  • slamadam says:
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    im already frustrated

  • angry angry says:
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    Four uncontested 3s by Arizona.

    This team only enjoys playing offense.

    • OneEyedKing says:
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      Maybe if Rob didn’t bust out the IDIOTIC 1-3-1 against a team that shoots really well, they wouldn’t have been uncontested.

      • slamadam says:
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        it wasnt the 131 they just weren’t matched up properly, it looked like they weren’t all sure what d they were supposed to be in. 131 is vulnerable to the corner three pointer, not from straight away

  • Gotmilk says:
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    Someone please tell me how this is different than street ball. And while you are at it why does Starks midget ass ever see the court.

    • OneEyedKing says:
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      Agreed for the most part. He’s a perfect 6th man; bring him off the bench where he can be the #1 option on offense. But he should not start; he kills so many possessions playing street ball while 3 much better players stand around and watch.

  • OneEyedKing says:
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    That’s 4 missed tips and 4 turnovers already. Huge swings.

    GREAT pass from Brandt.

  • slamadam says:
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    theyre doing a better job on the defensive glass tonight, other than that its been a pretty shitty ten minutes

  • OneEyedKing says:
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    “How many point-blank shots has Oregon State missed?”

    Exactly; this could be a 10-point lead if we just hit those tips and 6-foot shots.

    • slamadam says:
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      arizona probably feels like they should be up my a lot as well though

  • FedUpBeav says:
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    Burton! 🙁

  • CorVegasBeav says:
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    Such a sloppy game so far. Wish OSU could clean it up. Would be a very winnable game. I am hoping to snap out of my funk if OSU can just make it a little easier for us. Need this one! They just have to keep working extra hard at the defensive end, get some better shots and show more attitude and confidence out there.

  • slamadam says:
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    that was a huge 3

  • FedUpBeav says:
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    That 3 is exactly the kind of thing that could cost us the game. 5 seconds left in the half and Barton fell asleep. Having a 5 point halftime lead would have been big…

  • Jack says:
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    Zonies’ inexperience is starting to show. Watch for the Beavs to bust it open to start the second half. If they don’t come out with a frenzied pace, then UA will be allowed to stay in this game, which is never good for the away team.

  • GoBeavs90 says:
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    Beavers made their run with Roberto Nelson on the floor, not a coincidence. Roberto should be playing 30+ minutes a night. Also, Brandt wasn’t on the floor, neither was Starks. They were gonna shoot Oregon State out of the game. Moreland’s rebounding looks much, much better tonight. He’s really fighting for every single rebounding and not letting them slip out anymore.

  • OneEyedKing says:
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    Back to that shit zone, and back to wide-open 3s. Fucking coach Rob.

  • OneEyedKing says:
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    So. Many. Freethrows.

  • OneEyedKing says:
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    Joe Burton does NOT shoot hookshots; he flings the ball up with one hand and hopes people CALL it a hook.

    Worst player in our rotation right now.

    • SeattleBeav says:
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      Agreed…can’t jump either and slower than shit.

  • helmsley says:
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    Why is everything so difficult for the Beavs? And now, here comes Burton. And why after a missed 2nd free throw attempt don’t the beavs ever get the rebound?

  • OneEyedKing says:
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    This is the absolute worst lineup I have EVER seen Rob put on the court. What the hell is he thinking? No Roberto, no Cunningham, no Brandt; wow.

    Absolute fucking garbage; this is all on Coach Rob for stupid subs.

    • OneEyedKing says:
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      Starks+Barton should NEVER be our backcourt. Never. Ever. Roberto or Jared must be on the court at all times.

  • Jack says:
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    13-14 minute mark… OSU needs to pick up the pace. This UA team will overpursue on defense and make mistakes early in the offensive set if we push them to the brink.

    This is where we need to make the run.

  • GoBeavs90 says:
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    Burton and Starks need to ride the bench the rest of the game. Tonight they’re completely useless on the floor. Barton needs to ride the bench as well. Nelson and Cunningham at the guards and Collier, Moreland, Brandt in the frontcourt. If Burton and Starks receive significant time the rest of the game the Beavers will lose.

  • Bkbeav says:
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    Do the beavers run an offense or just the high post. There’s no off the ball movement and they don’t creat good shots for themselves.

  • FedUpBeav says:
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    Beavs having a tough time getting over the hump and used to winning. I think part of the problem is the refs also are used to the Beavs not being among the better teams. In close games they want us to do more to get the benefit of the doubt or catch a break on a call. The culture change of treating us as the favorite in more games taking more time than we want. CR and OSU need wins like this if we want to shorten that window.

  • OneEyedKing says:
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    Who the FUCK jumped up for that pass instead of actually defending Lavander? Just wow. Such a stupid mistake. For the 4th time tonight.

  • GoBeavs90 says:
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    Craig deserves a lot of heat for playing Burton as much as he has. He’s a liability on the floor and has no idea what he’s doing. I’ve hardly seen another athlete with less basketball I.Q.

  • slamadam says:
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    awful shot from cunningham

  • Bkbeav says:
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    It’s getting sloppy and I’m not feeling good about the last 5 minutes.

  • Mud&Sticks Mud&Sticks says:
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    Fwiw –

    The AZ announcers aren’t as good as the Bay Area announcers (the AZ announcers whine too much) but they did just comment that the Beavs are picking up unnecessary fouls by trying to steal the ball too much which is the same observation that the Bay Area announcers made.

  • OneEyedKing says:
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    Moreland has been bad on man D several times on the perimeter now. Love his interior and help D, but Lavender has blown by him a few times now.

  • GoBeavs90 says:
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    It is getting to a point where the Beavers have to have a guy face guard Lavender. That is the only way they’ll actually keep an eye on him. They constantly forget about him even though he’s their best shooter.

  • angry angry says:
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    This feels like another close loss. Just don’t see them getting over the hump (again)…

    • slamadam says:
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      fair enough, but they’ve got a chance if lavender doesn’t get any more 3’s

  • angry angry says:
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    Well, they got over the hump. Expended a lot of energy doing it, which usually means they go back down. Let’s see if their defense can win a game here.

  • GoBeavs90 says:
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    Hated the final play

  • GoBeavs90 says:
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    I get Starks hit some step back J’s but I would’ve liked to have seen a timeout and give it to Jared to go 1 on 1.

  • angry angry says:
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    Before conference play began, I wrote “they’ll be in every game..whether then win them…”

    This is pretty much what I was talking about. Thought they’d win more than lose, but figured they’d be in every game. This is getting flat out frustrating. This team can’t play any D. They can’t get key stops or make key baskets.

  • FedUpBeav says:
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    Cunningham with poor D on UA’s last score. Starks would have made it if he got a few feet closer.

  • angry angry says:
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    Prediction: ‘Zona jumps out to a 5 point lead in OT. Beavs jack up some 3s to get within a possession…Beavs fumble easy rebounds. Give up a put back or two. Zona wins.

    (This is how things seem to go for the Beavs)…

  • slamadam says:
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    is it me or does CR never call timeouts?

  • slamadam says:
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    un fucking believable

  • angry angry says:
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    Team does not know how to close.

  • GoBeavs90 says:
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    Well, now they’re 1-4 in conference play once this one ends. Talk about underachieving.

  • FedUpBeav says:
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    OBVIOUS TECHNICAL ON ARIZONA!! CAME RIGHT IN AND SHOVED JARED ON A DEAD BALL!! SHAMEFUL REFEREEING!

  • GoBeavs90 says:
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    At least baseball season is only a month away.

  • beaverkman beaverkman says:
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    Pac12 teams are so even its comical. That shot at the end of reg was halfway down, and it just didn’t go in.

    This scuffle shows how intense its is.

    • helmsley says:
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      I swear, they’re jinxed. No matter the team, Jared Cunningham gets beat up. I have no idea how he bounces back.

  • Mud&Sticks Mud&Sticks says:
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    Hopefully they’ve called enough technicals so the the Beavs can tie it up.

  • OneEyedKing says:
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    The result of that skirmish was complete horseshit. 2 AU guys started it.

    And once again we lose a close game. Can’t close.

  • slamadam says:
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    the overtime offense was shameful

  • FedUpBeav says:
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    Nope. We got the raw end even though the experienced analyst said the most egregios part was Hill coming in late and OSU should be shooting a technical and getting the ball.

  • CorVegasBeav says:
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    That was the final straw for me. I want BDC the F*** out now! We need new urgency in the Athletic Department. Right now there is none. Bye bye Bobby D. We need a winner.

    • Mud&Sticks Mud&Sticks says:
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      I’ve just learned that Bobby D has recently signed a multi-year contract @ $500K per. Now I go and run my finger down my throat.

  • ean says:
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    Did the Beavs have a timeout to end regulation?

    Still think this team needs a real wing.

    • GoBeavs90 says:
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      Yes, they had 2 or 3 at the time. They needed to set up a little better play.

    • FedUpBeav says:
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      I don’t why we were walking it up the court with 11 seconds left and then having to take a long 3 as about our only option because we took so long. Should have had plenty of time. Then UA would have had to respected the other options much more. Starks was in rythym but he needed to work himself in a little closer so it was more like his other shots. He ended up shooting his longest one. I don’t understand how CR isn’t telling his players to hurry it up so they don’t have to take a forced shot and get a better look.

  • beav4ever says:
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    I think we have the talent to finish in the top 2 or 3 in this league, but we do not have the coach. Robinson might be a recruiter but he is not a game coach. I think coaching lost our last 2 games. Tonight we started off playing rat ball run and gun with no discipline at all. Our offense consists of 1 on 1 and throw up th 1st open 3 we can. CR doesn’t call TO’S because he has no idea what to say or draw up. Burton should maybe play 8 minutes a game and Roberto needs to play more.
    This team could be very good with a good coach but CR is clueless.

  • GoBeavs90 says:
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    Starting lineup going forward needs to be Nelson-Cunningham-Collier-Moreland-Brandt. No logical reason that shouldn’t be the starting lineup.

    • OneEyedKing says:
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      Agree 100%. Burton and Starks can run the Pick-and-roll off the bench.

    • ean says:
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      Personally I’d go with Starks/Barton, Nelson, Cunnigham, Collier and Moreland. This team could really benefit from a 3rd guy that can put the ball on the floor. I am hoping Reid and Morris-Walker can contribute right away next year.

  • Gotmilk says:
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    Ducks win beavers lose. What else is new?

    • beavergopher beavergopher says:
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      Getting old fast.

    • Jack says:
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      If the Ducks didn’t win at ASU, then they should be firing Altman. I haven’t bothered to look at the score yet, but they should have won by 30-40. They were up 12 early in the first half when I turned that joke off.

  • GoBeavs90 says:
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    Potential Joe Burton suspension on Saturday may be the best thing to happen to the program all year. Forces a change in the starting lineup and probably more Roberto Nelson. Craig will finally see the team is better off with Joe receiving less minutes.

  • mckalk says:
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    Even Lamar Hurd kept pointing out all of the “standing around” on offense. I find it odd that when the game gets close this is the best offense CR can come up with. I don’t think the other three even know what to do when Cunningham and Starks play the two man game (which is really just a one man game).

  • OneEyedKing says:
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    What’s all this about Keith Haywood being poached by UW? It’s on message boards, which makes it more dubious, but still…

    Losing a bad secondary coach is a good thing, but losing a good SoCal recruiter is not. And Washington should be stealing OTHER conference’s assistants, not hurting everyone else.

  • beavergopher beavergopher says:
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    Ducks win. We lose. Can we ever cover guys at the arc. Way to many 3’s with open looks by our opponents. Did Decareless put something in CR’s contract that gives him monetary bonuses for how many unused timeouts he accrues?

    • rsteve503 rsteve503 says:
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      Ducks played ASU, a bad team, and we played UA, a good team. Quit worrying about what UO accomplishes. It has nothing to do with us.

  • mckalk says:
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    I am kind of tired of talking about old players, new players and the psychological make up of CR’s teams. If I’m reading Angry right, it’s time to shut up and win some games. I agree. Didn’t this team start off 2-0 last season? So, they have been 4-17 in their last 21 leagues games. I don’t care who’s on the roster, that’s ugly and inexcusable given the current state of P-12 hoops.

  • homefry homefry says:
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    and last night’s other topic was deleted? hmm…

    I’m no apologist, but if nothing else this team gives me a reason to even watch the games…the last 4-5 years were like pulling teeth.

    • beavergopher beavergopher says:
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      Pulling teeth is easy. Watching us give away games…………not so much.

  • Jack says:
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    Two things… Gary Crowton to Utah?

    And remember a couple days ago when I said Brett Venables would be looking for any open jobs now that he was forced to share his job with Nepotism Boy? Well, Brett Venables is looking for any open jobs, and he’s been linked to WVU and Clemson already.

  • helmsley says:
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    My concerns are for the players. They need to be coached. I can only go by what I read and hear via the media but it seems that CR is yet doing the touchy-feely bit instead of x’s and o’s. Contrast with Larry Krystowiak (Yes, I have bias) – (is it mckalk who also checks in with the Utes?) Insofar as I can tell, he’s teaching basketball technique. After one especially bad loss (Colorado?) it sounded as though LK really let loose – then the Utes defeated WSU. I will guarantee at least one OSU loss to Utah this season based upon coaching.

    I do want to give due credit to Devon Collier’s improved free throw percentage.

  • Mud&Sticks Mud&Sticks says:
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    I found this message on the AZ board (link above posted by Beaver in the desert).

    This poster sentiment about Kyryl is about like mine for Burton. Maybe not for 10 games but set him (Burton) for most of each of the 10 games.

    ————
    This Just In:

    The Pac12 offices just announced that they will not be suspending any players following last nights shoving match, saying that the “officials handled it well”.

    That doesn’t mean that coach Miller, or coach Robinson couldn’t sit a player if they so choose, just that the league office is not suspending anyone. I’m thinking that Kyryl should get a 10 game suspension at least. Please coach Miller, do the right thing, sit Kyryl… please?

  • rsteve503 rsteve503 says:
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    Rating: 0 (from 0 votes)

    I hear the frustration, and the conference results so far are disappointing in that we are competitive but have only won 1 of 5.

    But on the other hand, there has not been a game yet where we were totally out of a game, and just getting whipped. That is, of the 5 teams played so far, we could have beaten them all.

    Hopefully this bodes well for the future, and the players come to understand better what they need to do on the court, to get those close losses into wins. And that even supposed the coaching stays the same. The coaches might also learn something, and get better.

    Here’s hoping.

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