youtube video on how to get stream2watch streams to work. Don’t know if this violates youtube’s terms of service nor do I care but if it does they will remove it. If someone wants to rob it and put it somewhere else where everyone here can access it, go for it
Mud and sticks if you want, make up a new yahoo or gmail account and post the address here and I will email you the link. This way its not a current personal email address being posted online.
I honestly think this is a must win for Andersen. It’s going to set the tone for the whole year.
And I have no idea what to expect on offense or defense. I’m guessing it will be run heavy since the reports are that the QBs aren’t great passers right now.
I had an interesting moment two nights ago. BTN is now showing tOSU crap almost contiously, like the other thirteen schools don’t exist. I happened to catch “The Journey” which was the episode documenting the B1G championship last season. It snapped me back to the truly unbelievable things that transpired last Dec. Watching GA talk and interact with Urban Meyer decked out in the hated Badger gear transported me back and I caught myself thinking……..I still can’t believe this really went down. He ditched Madison to coach the Beavs!
This season will probably have some serious struggles, but everyone should remember that feeling when his hiring was announced. Like a bolt from the blue, we had hope again. FWIW, Meyer was very complimentary about our new HC. Stay the course and I think he gets it done. Year three everything should be in place. Go Beavs!
One part I don’t like about the whole “college athletes being paid” thing is the real world application here. In the real world, most people work for a corporation/business of some kind. Whether you believe it or not, the employees help to generate millions and in some cases billions of dollars, so why don’t ALL employees get evenly compensated? Employees are paid hourly or a salary, while CEOs (bosses) make 6 and 7 figured salaries (and bonuses) while the worker bees make 30-80K maybe a bit more at most average careers, per year. In the real world, the top dogs (the smaller percentage of the population) take home a majority of the profits. Sorry, that’s just the way it works! And for us to send the message that these guys should share in the University’s profits just gives them the unrealistic notion that they’re going to be evenly compensated for the corporations/companies they’ll eventually work for. Doesn’t work that way! If they don’t like it, don’t play. Collegiate sports are a privilege not a right! Stop feeding the egos of these kids. They need some humble pie and to learn they’re not entitled royalty.
Go Beavs!
Hilarious. How can you not see the the contradiction? If you apply your logic to the entire program, you’ll see that ll student athletes are compensated the same despite some student athletes (football players) generating the majority of the revenue. That goes against the “real world” you claim to live in. A member of the soccer team is compensated the same as a member of the football team. If anything, it’s the other student athletes that are getting an equal share of the pie when they “didn’t work for it”.
Football coaches are compensated more heavily than coaches of other sports. Why is that? Football players are compensated at the same rate as a scholarship row team kid. Why is that?
Side not: It’s funny when angry resorts to name calling (PC Police, Fairness Police, etc.) instead of trying to make arguments. Guess you call yourself angry for a reason. You sound like Rush Limbaugh.
Potential workaround: How about instead of paying them, you put some money in a fund they can access after they leave the university? That way they are not rolling around campus in Hummers and making it rain at the library, but they still see something for their “work” that’s producing millions for the university.
There’s nothing hilarious about that post and in the world I live in (the real world), I don’t make near as much money as my boss, I don’t know about you?! People that are out on the workforce front everyday, help generate money for their employer, do they get a “fair” split of the money made by the corporation? The whole point is that one of the biggest arguments for paying players is that the universities make so much money off of them through bowl games and tv contracts….. well I hate to burst their bubble but get used to it. That is how the world works, hence why 1% of the population has a majority of the wealth, is that “fair”? How about instead of paying them, they accept the fact that they get a free education, which nowadays can be near 100K over 4 years and then they don’t have to pay off student loans for over a decade. The one bill that breaks my back every month is the $300+ monthly payment that I have been paying on for over a decade and will be for much longer. Until someone realizes what the real world is like with all of your bills and….student loans on top of that, they can’t appreciate not having to pay it.
If a student athlete doesn’t like that they don’t get compensated, don’t be a student athlete! Simple. What’s next? Paying high school players? I coached hs football for 8 years and I can tell you right now, that hs football is almost a year round deal. I read an article of a collegiate player talking about his daily schedule an how long it was, blah blah blah. Well guess what??? Most high school players have the same schedule (football players). Come into the weight room at 5:30am-6am and workout for about an hour, go to class all day, go to film and practice for 3+ hours then they are home around 8-9 pm. And in the off season, they’re in the weight room every morning or after school for an hour and then players are doing individual (rule of two) drills with their position coach. This crap about wanting to be paid is just flat out greed. And btw, HS coaches don’t make crap, especially when you try and account for all of your hours that are put in for the year. That’s reality brother! What world are you living in?
and in the real world an employer can say fuck you and your demands and kick your ass out the door. For whatever reason they wish. Did you consider this scenario? Ummm, Mr Quarterback, you suck at your job so we’re firing you. Sorry asshole, my contract is guaranteed so you’re gonna have to pay me my 10 million before you kick my ass out the door. That’s the contract. I just signed a contract to start a new job the day after labor day stating my salary. It also states I can quit or be let go at any time for any reason. No compensation other than a monthly salary, benefits, and some paid vacation. Could I have attempted to negotiate some money if they decided to fire me? Yes, but it would have been stupid to do so and they just would have offered the position to someone else. This is why comparing professional or even amateur athletes to being REAL world scenarios is fucking laughable. That isn’t real world shit and only a small percentage of people have the power to negotiate that way. To quote Denis Leary, “life sucks, get a fuckin helmet”
I see absolutely nothing stopping a college athlete from negotiating. They have the potential for all sorts of careers to compare to compensation as a student athlete. When my current employer has set my max on my compensation and I want more I have to look elsewhere. The examples of this are many, but don’t commonly happen. Kevin Rhoderick is now a golfer instead of a baseball player, Noah Happe left school early to make a career in football through the supplemental draft, Sabby Piscitelli is now a professional wrestler rather a football player, and not to forget all the many baseball players that leave after there junior year of college. The baseball players do this because of the increased compensation compared to school.
If players want to be treated like employees and get paid, then put them on a salary and do away with scholarships entirely – give them the money and have them pay tuition out of pocket. And if they aren’t performing up to expectations then we might have to let them go.
NCAA legislation specifically defines and categorizes different types of impermissible benefits (e.g., extra benefits, recruiting inducements, and preferential treatment). Regardless of the type of impermissible benefit, however, the prohibition is generally the same: under most circumstances, prospective and enrolled student-athletes (along with their friends and families) cannot receive goods or services based on their status as athletes. The following are categories of benefits that NCAA legislation prohibits boosters and other athletics stakeholders from providing to prospective and enrolled student-athletes:
Cash and cost-free goods and services;
Special discounts, payment arrangements, or credit options for products or services if the same are not available to all ASU students;
Preferential treatment, benefits, or services based on a student-athlete’s athletics reputation, skill, or pay-back potential as a future professional athlete;
Payment for work not performed or at unreasonable levels; and
The purchase of items or services from student-athletes or their relatives at inflated prices.
If it’s not available to all the students, then it’s a violation. Not to mention the entire title IX can of worms your solution would open
Last time I checked the “average student” is allowed to sign an agreement to be a spokesperson for a local car dealership or national brand and sell their autograph to anyone wiling to pay….
Thats just 2 examples, just because Billy doesn’t have those offers doesn’t mean he wouldn’t be allowed to do it. Its available to Billy and all other students with the exception of those playing NCAA sports.
A four year scholarship + room and board/food with a shot at the NFL is worth a lot more than being a spokesperson for a local car dealership. What exactly is the problem?
If they don’t like it, they can quit the football team and sign all the autographs they want. Oh wait…then nobody would want them. Yeah, they don’t need the university or anything…
Such a dumb argument. Nobody (literally nobody) is claiming they don’t need the university. Your debate skills are:
1) Insult those you disagree with
2) Make up things never said to tear done
Its pathetic.
The problem is quite clear, some (if not many) of these athletes are worth far more on the open market than the NCAA allows them to receive, the NCAA abuses this power by not only limiting their compensation from the schools but also preventing them from capitalizing off the field. You can argue other options should exist (a minor league) but in reality other options do not exist and even if its legal (I don’t think it is). It is absolutely 100% morally wrong to prevent a person from making money off the field.
I don’t know how anyone can think its okay to prevent someone who would be offered more money for additional work from taking that opportunity. And its wrong rather on scholarship or not. If a football at Harvard wants to sell his autograph he damn well should be allowed to.
and the average student isn’t going to get suspended for 1 class for jumping on a table in the middle of the MU quad and yelling “Fuck her right in the pussy” multiple times. You aren’t going to get an argument from me that the NCAA has awful rules and seems to enforce them on a case by case basis or when they see fit. But pay for play is not the answer. There needs to be a cap on donations made strictly to the athletic departments for specific sports (not sure if donors can specifically request that or not but I do believe they can specify donations go to something OTHER than athletics). There needs to be a cap on what you can pay your coaching staff (Nick Saban making 8 million a year (8 or 10, i don’t remember and I’m too lazy to look it up) is ridiculous and unnecessary. A limit on recruiting budgets, limit on what you may spend on facilities, etc. And finally a limit on the amount for television contracts. If that isn’t possible than a limit of what each school can spend from TV contract revenue. Anything left over is put into an academic fund for scholarships and academic facility improvements. Maybe then universities can rely less on donors. Is this the answer? I don’t know but to me it seems more a workable solution that is on the NCAA and the universities than paying players. This way ALL of the university and students benefit.
And about 6 universities playing in the major conferences would agree to any of the things you’re proposing (and the 6 number is generous)….
Look, I get it, many of you would love to see all these schools go Ivy League or you simply think paying for college is enough and the kid should just be happy but that isn’t the real world.
In the real world these colleges are making tons of money and although a scholarship is great compensation for many of the athletes on these teams more compensation is available. Sorry but I think its morally wrong to prevent a person from accepting that. Every person should be allowed to maximize their earnings, even ‘student athletes’
And they are now fighting better contracts. And I side with them because the contracts the NCAA requires schools to sign these ‘not employees despite signing a contract in exchange for their labor’ are morally (and very likely as we will soon find out legally) wrong.
You guys act like these kids have other options, the NCAA is taking advantage of their power and using it to force people without other options into poor deals.
Look, in theory I agree with you (on everything but off the field earnings, taking those away is just wrong) but in reality many of these players are worth more than just a scholarship and are prevented from getting it because of the NCAA and NFL. In my opinion those entities are far more in the wrong than the players who are simply looking to maximize their earnings.
Exactly. High school baseball players can jump right into the minor leagues. Ah but there’s the rub! Football players don’t have the minor leagues you say? Not having a football minor league system isn’t the NCAA’s problem nor should it be. College athletes have other options or choices instead of signing a LOI
They do have other options. Some hoops players play overseas and get paid instead of playing a year of college ball. There’s always the Canadian and Arena leagues for football. Need I go on?
Arena football isn’t football? Even though it’s played on a football field. Teams play offense, defense and special teams. Offenses score touchdowns and players tackle each other. So if it walks like a duck and talks like a duck it’s not a duck?
It’s football with some different rules sprinkled in. Just like the CFL
I understand what Arena Football is, its a form of football of course but its not even close to the game played in high school, college, or the NFL. The CFL is different but is much closer. Arena Football is a joke. And as I said I don’t even know if its an option, can you provide a link showing they sign people out of high school? I’m betting they don’t but couldn’t find it with a quick google search and don’t care enough to spend more time on it.
It’s your job to restrict how much colleges can make if they invest millions into a risky product (e.g. a football team in Corvallis or any small town USA)? So everyone is allowed to maximize their earnings except colleges? Is that right? Just trying to understand this massive cognitive dissonance.
Well shit, in that case the colleges should forum a union to protect themselves from the Warners of the world. Workers of the world unite! We have a Marxist among us, folks, and worse he’s is disguised as a Capitalist.
Anyway, what we have is a contract: University gives X, player gets Y, and both parties agree to the terms. And the problem is…??
Oh yeah, the fairness police want to meddle and tell people what they should be doing. As I said in a prior thread, if you’re telling people what they should be doing, you’re an asshole. No exceptions except Mike Riley, who couldn’t figure out how to put matching socks on. In that case you’re just being nice.
If I ever tell someone on this site what they should be doing or how they should be living, please remind me I’m being an asshole. I’ll thank you.
Colleges are maximizing their profits. I have never at anytime said “colleges must offer more”
Hell, they can offer nothing….My problem is with telling someone “you can come play football here for a college education but we also control your likeness and all profits that come from that for the next 5 years (and beyond) and owe you nothing for it”
That is a bullshit contract.
I am not telling anyone what they should be doing, I am saying its wrong to take a person’s ability to profit of themselves away….
It’s considered a great deal since thousands of players fight for it each year. The players know they have zero exposure otherwise.
It’s just like a record label. A band can try to get noticed on their own, but what they sacrifice by signing on with a label is that autonomy, and what they gain is exposure. Many contracts work this way and that’s part of the value of any deal. It’s amazing you can’t wrap your head around it.
Ah but there are many record companies that bands can negotiate with to get the best terms possible.
I can wrap my head around it…..
And even if you can screw someone over (as record labels often do) it doesn’t make it right.
Seriously, why the fuck do these kids have to give up their rights to sponsorships? Because you are nervous about a kid driving a hummer through campus?
Ah, but there are many football teams out there and many leagues. Heck, a person could even start their own NFL developmental league. Not to mention every other professional sport. Why, would you lament such a beneficial contract to a student athlete. You act like a student athlete has no options when in all actuality there has never been a better time for an athlete to negotiate.
The bottom line is do you want to be an amateur or professional athlete. Amateur athletes have and always will have different rules than professional athletes. Deal with it!
Because they aren’t and never have been amateur athletes. A scholarship is compensation, when you give someone compensation to play a sport they ain’t an amateur more more.
The whole amateur thing is PR, these kids are pros and have been for decades.
Why are those rules BS? What happens to sport once boosters promise PSAs certain amounts of money “for their autographs”?
There will be 10 or 20 teams soon because some idiots think athletes aren’t already immeasurably paid for what they do.
So, let’s talk about them as labor. How will you set up the draft? How many schools get to participate? How will P5 schools deal with the loss in revenues if all D1 schools get to participate in the draft?
Warner 28-
“In the real world these colleges are making tons of money and although a scholarship is great compensation for many of the athletes on these teams more compensation is available. Sorry but I think its morally wrong to prevent a person from accepting that. Every person should be allowed to maximize their earnings, even ‘student athletes’”.
So if “every person” should be able to get the max, why stop at paying college players. Hell, pay high school kids too (they’re part of everybody, right?)! This is nothing but greed. I agree that the NCAA is a big portion of that greed but people have lost the idea of not having to be compensated for every thing they do. They’re playing a game, that is a privilege, not a right. Do we fire (kick college players off of a team) because they under perform or go into a slump? I mean come on. This is everything wrong with our society!
If the local car dealership or Nike wants to sign a high school kid to an endorsement deal go for it.
Jesus fucking christ.
That is what I am fucking talking about, players should be allowed to sign deals with entities other than the college, they should retain rights to their likeness and be allowed to sell it. So should high school and pop warner kids.
Who cares if they are pro or amateur or some other definition
Was Russell Wilson a pro when he took Wisconsin to the Rose Bowl? He was a pro athlete by then by your definition. Should he have been ineligible or is it okay because for some reason the NCAA decided it was okay to be a pro baseball player and a student athlete in another sport?
Or how bout the Jeremy Bloom rule that allows an athlete to sign endorsement deals as long as they relate to another sport? A rule that only passed after Bloom was declared ineligibe for college football over endorsements he had to have in order to make the Olympics in skiing….How do we know the endorsement deal is only for that one sport? Amateur or pro?
Pretty much. You’d have a handful of schools getting the best players and the rest are fucked. An already less than competitive balance divides even further
There’s no such thing as “right” or “wrong”. Maybe you should read some philosophy after you finish the communist manifesto.
And this is why contracts come into play. To determine two parties idea of what’s fair. The only way you could claim abuse is if the contract is signed under duress, adhesion, or any of the other invalid contracts.
This is my last post on this subject. Part of the NCAA’s job (since psst, student athletes are amateur) is to maintain some type of competitive balance. I’d argue they are doing a shitty job at that already since pretty much no one outside of the power 5 football conferences and an Independent that I won’t name realistically have zero chance of getting into the college football playoff. And money and greed is the driving force behind this Model T bucket of shit. The players see how much money is being raked in and they want a piece of it. The NCAA says no you can’t because then you lose your amateur status and are ineligible to participate. Then there’s the other sports athletes saying we aren’t getting paid? And title IX issues that are just going to muddy the waters even more. IF the players do eventually wind up getting compensated somehow, then the entire system will collapse. Only a handful of schools would get the best players. There goes most of your TV contracts. Fewer TV contracts = less revenue. Fewer eyes want to pay to watch only a handful of teams dominate on a yearly basis except fans, alums and donors of those schools either in person or on TV. And don’t even get me started on how donors or companies could game the system (read Nike) and steer players to specific schools with endorsement deals. The NCAA and universities know this. Hell even an idiot like me can finger it out. Cap the spending and put the money back into the universities. But as was stated above not many schools in the power 5 conferences would agree to this model. If the alternative was presented as a likely result, some may change their minds. To others, they would just rather keep it as status quo. I don’t have the answer. I presented something I thought considered feasible. But pay for play is most certainly NOT the answer and would only continue what is already a declining model. But something is going to have to change. And soon. Likely you’ll see courts to continue to balk and everything stays status quo
Part of the NCAA’s job (since psst, student athletes are amateur) is to maintain some type of competitive balance
Is this actually part of their job? Do they have a written mandate?
Also, why are D3 schools prohibited from giving scholarships? I never understood this…is the idea that they don’t have the funds to consistently field teams each year?
I found the answer. Looks like the D3 schools freely choose not to offer scholarships, believing “athletes are theoretically less driven by money, media attention, and/or other outside influences.”
I might have to start watching D3 and Ivy League since D1 is becoming a cesspool.
You all are wrong. When they actually get paid wages, they become employees. They are not now because of the same SCOTUS ruling about graduate students and pay and such. You want to break down that argument first? I would be happy to see anyone do it.
But if they eventually do become employees, then there does either need to be a CBA or the NCAA members will move to protect themselves by instituting one for parity’s sake, which will force the players to form a CBU pretty quickly.
So now five star whatever position Johnny Doe doesn’t get to choose the school he goes to, the one he’s dreamed of attending for his whole childhood because that’s where his parents met and his uncle was a sports hero… or some equally heart-tugging neat deal. Instead of going to, say, Notre Dame, USC or Bama, Johnny has to go to Georgia State because they had the fourth pick in the draft and really needed someone at the whatever position Johnny plays. Endorsement deals will be fine. You just need to dal with player agents.
I don’t get why angry has been calling proponents of pay for play some fairness league or whatever, even bringing up communism. It’s precisely the opposite. It’s a free marketeer’s dream argument. The same one-third of the population who supports the argument are the same one-third of the population who scream about taxes and going back to the 50’s and whatever other half-cocked ideas their masters come up with to distract them. They’re gold-diggers or people who can see there is money for them to siphon off an otherwise simple system.
I don’t get why angry has been calling proponents of pay for play some fairness league or whatever, even bringing up communism
Oh, because he is portraying the university as the oppressor and is clearly pro labor.
The agents and guys behind the scene who have skin in the game are what you’re describing, and they’re confusing fans (like Warner) into believing pay for play is some kind of social justice.
“So now five star whatever position Johnny Doe doesn’t get to choose the school he goes to, the one he’s dreamed of attending for his whole childhood because that’s where his parents met and his uncle was a sports hero… or some equally heart-tugging neat deal. Instead of going to, say, Notre Dame, USC or Bama, Johnny has to go to Georgia State because they had the fourth pick in the draft and really needed someone at the whatever position Johnny plays.”
No he wouldn’t. He would just hold out and demand a trade to Alabama.
So you both don’t get the player AND make another team better in the process? Screw that. If Johnny don’t want to play, Johnny can just watch TV like the rest of us.
and in this case Nike or Buttfuckers Inc car dealerships would be deemed a booster of said school and then it becomes an improper benefit. I understand an average student not on athletic scholarship can get a job and receive income. But no one is going to sign average Joe student to an endorsement deal for anything
He’s trying to be LIbertarian and say everyone should have the right to xyz. The problem is he thinks that’s true of everyone except universities, so he’s just a hypocrite/Marxist asshole telling people what to do. It’s as bad as the NCAA telling people what to do. He’s just doing it with the University. Lame.
A real free market advocate would say let the college and player decide on their contract, and that’s what happened for years. Players and unis have decided schollies are a good deal for both parties. Until assholes get in their ear and tell them how they should be living.
What the fuck are you fucking talking about? I am talking about the fucking NCAA.
The NCAA prevents a free market from working, that is the whole fucking point. That is why its an antitrust lawsuit.
If every college were free to offer whatever the fuck they want (free market) than great but when a group gets together and agrees to limit that market (i.e. what the NCAA is doing) its a manipulation of the free market and is often times deemed ILLEGAL.
The universities are free to offer nothing or everything in my eyes, they just aren’t free to use their power to manipulate the market which is what they are doing.
I am not making any kind of libertarian argument, I am making an argument about antitrust law. The libertarian argument would be fine with the NCAA power. At least learn your politics before you make a stupid statement.
I have been quite clear, I think players should be allowed to earn money off the field.
I’ve supported nothing else beyond that at any point in this discussion. And had the NCAA allowed that decades ago they wouldn’t be getting sued right now.
Yep, and if you think its okay to take that ability away you are the asshole.
I am done
But I am curious (since you never answered) about you stance on guys like Russell Wilson (pro athlete in a different sport) and Jeremy Bloom (endorsements allowed to support athlete in a different sport) still being deemed eligible for college sports.
I prefer to give opinions, but I’d never intentionally tell someone how to live their life nor would I get involved in someone’s contract. If I do that on this blog, please, call me out and call me a major- fucking- Riley Reid -porn star- level- gaping asshole so it hits home (I ignore boring insults).
I don’t know the Russell Wilson situation, which is why I didn’t comment. From what I remember, he went pro, then came back? Don’t know enough about it.
Okay, simple. Forget Russell Wilson because dozens (hundreds probably) have done it.
You are allowed to be a pro baseball player under contract with a professional baseball team while still playing college sports (other than baseball).
And, athletes can now get sponsorship deals to support a different sport (say they are an Olympic skier) without giving up their student athlete status.
So you can be both a pro athlete and a student athlete according to NCAA rules. Its right there and its allowed and done all the time.
Just explained them to you, that okay?
In my view it is because everyone should be allowed to sign sponsorship deals but it seems odd that exceptions get made for certain athletes.
Oh and just to add to the baseball thing. The baseball team pays your tuition as long as you are under contract with them. So you are playing college football on a pro baseball teams dime.
Seems like the exception is for certain sports (not playing the same one pro and amateur) not certain athletes. No clue it seems inconsistent for sure, but I haven’t read that exact bylaw or the justification for it. I guess the argument is he is pro in sport x but not in sport y, so he can play sport y as an amateur? On some level that makes sense — say you’re playing NFL football but want to play baseball as a hobby and have college eligibility. I’m thinking out loud as we go here, so yeah, I’m being inconsistent because I’m not sure and haven’t thought about it.
The NCAA is ridiculous. I have railed on them for years. I’m not going to support the NCAA. But I will support a player and university coming to an agreement both believe is fair. Whether you or I think it’s fair is not relevant, unless we want to be assholes (aka the fairness police) meddling in others’ affairs.
And I would totally agree with you if that contract being offered wasn’t being offered from a position where only 1 side (colleges) have negotiating power.
In my view the colleges (under the guise of NCAA rules) have abused their power.
Just because the player signs the deal (when he has no other options) doesn’t automatically mean they believe its a fair deal, the players simply don’t have any other legitimate options. Its sign or quit playing. That is not a legitimate option.
And frankly I have a huge problem with my college specifically making money on the likeness of a player without allowing the player to do the same. You said their is no right or wrong but I disagree, sometimes things are simply wrong.
I’ll agree to disagree and apologize for getting so heated about it, this one issue truly bothers me. The colleges have used the NCAA to take it too far.
Okay, well this is what the NCAA writes about their contracts:
Is a scholarship a binding contract between a student-athlete and a school?
No. The scholarship is an agreement between the school and the student-athlete with expectations on both sides, but the agreement is completely separate from transfer regulations. A student-athlete may choose to transfer at any time. With multi-year scholarships now available for Division I schools, those colleges and universities have the option to offer athletics financial aid for more than one year. Such an agreement requires the school to provide financial aid to the student-athlete in accordance with the terms and conditions of the agreement. However, the agreement does not bind the student-athlete to the institution any more than the current transfer rules – he or she may transfer during the term of the award.
If a student-athlete signs a National Letter of Intent, he or she cannot transfer during the initial year of competition without penalty.
And this is an adhesion contract:
A standard form contract drafted by one party (usually a business with stronger bargaining power) and signed by the weaker party (usually a consumer in need of goods or services), who must adhere to the contract and therefore does not have the power to negotiate or modify the terms of the contract. Adhesion contracts are commonly used for matters involving insurance, leases, deeds, mortgages, automobile purchases, and other forms of consumer credit. Also known as adhesive contract; adhesory contract; adhesionary contract; take-it-or-leave-it contract; leonine contract.
Courts carefully scrutinize adhesion contracts and sometimes void certain provisions because of the possibility of unequal bargaining power, unfairness, and unconscionability. Factoring into such decisions include the nature of the assent, the possibility of unfair surprise, lack of notice, unequal bargaining power, and substantive unfairness. Courts often use the “doctrine of reasonable expectations” as a justification for invalidating parts or all of an adhesion contract: the weaker party will not be held to adhere to contract terms that are beyond what the weaker party would have reasonably expected from the contract, even if what he or she reasonably expected was outside the strict letter of agreement.
So given the weaker party (I assume you think this is the player) can threaten to transfer and can choose between several hundred schools, they do have bargaining power. Can they demand more scholarship money? No. Not sure this would fit adhesion in courts. Are they even trying to make that argument? I’d actually be curious to see how that stands up in court.
The keyword in the adhesion contracts is “unconscionable”. It’s hard to imagine a court saying, “Yeah, giving him the option of 200 schools, an option to leave your school after 1 year, free room and board, food, and tuition is unconscionable.”
So I don’t think the LOI will be found adhesion.
They’ll probably have more luck with the antitrust meddling.
I can’t decide which is worse, the NCCA or Warner.
Both seem to lead to the same conclusion: college football in the shitter. Maybe it needs to go there for a while so it can come out of this current state cleansed.
no, more like this…………..Jack is going to show up, type some long response that is pretty much going to expose all of his personalities, state something about “idiot boy”, pretty much go into an irrelevant tangent that will lose everyone about 1/3 of the way thru. At which point everyone will stop reading it and go wtf man? That guy is nuttier than squirrel shit
I wasn’t thinking that, but it would make sense out of you thinking that you’re bashing a laissez argument by calling it Communist or Marxist or something weirdly opposite of what it is.
I was just confused as to why you would say that. Birchers would scream “Communist” at a forest because a bunch of trees seem to be up to something shady. So I guess that makes sense? And they sell the Manifesto more than anyone else. So bringing it up when Kapital speaks more clearly to the gleaning of profit off labor’s back would add to this hindsight
Yeah … I just tuned in, after going backpacking for most of a week, totally out of touch, and expected a hot discussion of the latesty in our good ‘ol Beavs headed for their first game under the new coach…. and……LOL!
Hey, its an unfair world out there! That’s the way its always been, and seems to me it aint about to change. A few have always held the power and wealth. Its the human way….
totally off topic. Kanye West announces at VMA’s tonight he will run for president in 2020.
I about fell out of my fucking chair with laughter after reading that. I can just see those presidential debates and him snatching the microphone out of another candidates hand to tell them “Ima let you finish” but someone is “is the greatest of all time”. This country really would go to shit (as if it hasn’t already) with Kanye for president
ah yes. the occupiers. What a waste of time that was. Most of us just went to work and laughed at those losers. can’t say I disagree with any of that. Just so tired of these people
He knows as well as anyone that the issue would never have existed if the “anti-SJW” crowd hadn’t first created it. I don’t think, angry, you want to associate yourself with this “PC backlash” crowd. The MO for them is to personally attack any slight they can manufacture (sound familiar?), to relentlessly harass the “entitled minority” to whom they attach the blame for their imagined slight (including doxxing and death threats), and to hide behind their false construct of a lack of journalistic integrity. That construct, btw, was created by them to cover for their blatant misogyny.
Note: I am not the one bringing it up since it is the thrust and foundation of gamergate.
So Jim and others co-opted the blatant misogyny they fomented and turned it into some upside down ethics complaint and then went all hipster-anti-SJW with it. Just like his “rant” against Occupy above, he has tried to change the narrative to encapsulate… well… everything he wants it to encapsulate… except for the one thing it really means… the same thing that gets him dismantled every so often because his immense ego doesn’t allow him to think anyone is smarter than he is.
But he and his crew (he’s posting under MisterMetokur) will continue to blame faggots, juggalos, mexicans, kikes and whores for everything that is wrong in this world. Yes, it’s a leftist conspiracy of black, gay, Jewish Hispanic women that makes you a dick, Jim. Wait, sorry… it’s a conspiracy of those who sleep with anything that moves and must be “stroking him” under the desk of whatever show she’s being interviewed on because she’s “co-opting” some issue (which you always gloss over, simplify or dismiss as if your straw man means it never existed in the first place) in order to say that you’re a part of some conspiracy against them… which you are, in the literal sense, doing.
I could be wrong, angry. Maybe you think the vilest of the vile trolls out there actually makes sense. Jim’s been around for a long time and has a long history of shitting himself repeatedly and soldiering on despite it being someone else’s fault because he is being oppressed… always.You essentially linked the 4chan equivalent of the Westboro Baptist Church and said, “right on!”
I’m not saying there aren’t people out there who don’t know what they’re talking about yet choose to get in your face anyway… in every single cause that exists. He talks about gamergate in the video (and just about every vid he uploads), so I don’t know why you would link content you don’t know.
I think the funniest thing about him and his posse is that they conflate the right to say something with an imagined right not to be criticized for what is actually said. The same is true of the games they play. It would be legitimate if they stuck to the premise that video games portraying minorities as criminals and women as sluts is a matter of free speech. You don’t want to play that game? Don’t. You want to say you’re disgusted by it? Fine… no biggie… except for these hypersensitive goons. And they take it as a license to make their online personas as vile as their gamer personas. Ethnics are conspiratorial thugs whose stereotypes are accentuated then ridiculed. Women are whores. Anyone who disagrees with them about their tactics is against freedom and some kind of ethics that allows doxxing and raids and coordinated bullying and death threats and lying about someone tagged as a SJW or SPJ. And they don’t hold back on any language you would think is a part of no decent conversation… slurs, explicit sexual references (any you can think of… and a lot you can’t), violence against conspiratorial minorities… all in the worst context you can imagine. Some of them try and excuse it as “dark humor.” But most don’t even bother to pretend.
I didn’t realize this guy was well known and had a posse. I didn’t know I needed to know the backstory of his video before posting it. Live and learn! I just like the idea of backlash against the hoards of annoying people (some of my friends even, like on FB) who have popped up over the last five to ten years, especially on the internet. I don’t run into people like this in real life, but they are everywhere online telling you what you should be doing, how you should be living, etc.
His topic has valid complaints. It’s that he does exactly as those he rants against and worse. I didn’t even really know or care about Ashley Madison until the dump happened. I still don’t really care since it’s not now or ever will be my problem and doesn’t affect me… and is a privacy thing, not public. But the level of masturbating schadenfreude he and all the /v/ and /pol/ gang have over it is just bizarre. Here he is trying to make public expression unaccountable in the name of free speech, yet he revels in a privacy dump with a lot of what he thinks is women and people who oppose his tactics. Even if it was (it isn’t), wouldn’t that be counter to his very argument to be what he says he’s against?
Yeah, as an equal parts Beavers and Utes fan, the Michigan game should be fascinating. Also, ASU v. Texas AM is a good statement opportunity for the conference.
Hey all.. back from a summer on the road excited and ready for an interesting year of football. Strap in.. it’s going to be a roller coaster ride with a lot of dips.
Now would be a good time to review and agree to the AB terms and conditions:
Please agree here ________ before continuing for the remainder of 2015/16.
I hereby agree that Jack is the AB resident genius and subject matter expert on the following topics. Any opinion I/we may have is stupid and subject to lengthy and boring rebutall by Jack.
Alcohol…… wine and micro-brews
Politics……. local, state and global
Football…… game strategy, recruiting, “ships”
Basketball….same as above
Baseball…… same as above
Economics… micro and macro
Investing…… better than Warren Buffet
Essential oils.. wtf
Fishing………. anything with gills
Cooking……… anything edible especially bbq, special emphasis on “rubs”
Urban planning… not limited to Eugene
Resturants……… not limited to Corvallis
Music……………. all generes especially esoteric guitar players
If I have forgotten any subjects they are incorporated by reference. JB
PS: BDC should get the game ball after the big win against Weber State. He found and scheduled a weak Big Sky team instead of a good one. A final parting gift from BDC.
You forgot a lot of other subjects. But I might take a hint and monetize some of those subjects by way of creating a blog and/or in the form of employment. Thanks for the idea.
Question: Why do you say “I/we”? There are some smart people here who can speak for themselves. Do you have to be so pretentious that you would speak for them? I know it’s funny to ask a prestense not to be pretentious. But you just called everyone here stupid.
Sorry for the confusion. My post was not intended as a reply to your inquiry re Grimble. I was simply providing an FYI link. However, I, too, was curious about comments suggesting that he was “out.” The only reference to Grimble’s status that I’m aware of came from Gina in a recent report saying that he’s been lining up with the second string in practice.
GA is scheduled for a live PC on Pac 12 Network at approx. 12:15 today. Perhaps status updates will be provided then.
I go to the SJ – well b4 the Oregonian, if I have time to go there at all. Gina seems to have gone off the boil – mostly doing videos. Granted, there hasn’t been much radio time but not sure journalism is about waiting for the news to come to you.
This is more a question for the Oregonian – but I know someone on the AB site will have the answer. As I understand it, the OSU beat writers live in Portland?
I think the crux of the student athlete thing isn’t necessarily that they should be paid a salary, but:
-Their schedules shouldn’t be so filled that they can’t actually major in what they want to
-They should be allowed to make money off the field, since they aren’t allowed to hold jobs and thus it creates a class issue where a kid from a poorer background might not be able to afford a car for example.
-The scholarships should include full cost of attendance and include a bit more so they can fly home or have the same luxuries anyone else can get
-The NCAA doesn’t act in the best interests of the student, but rather the universities and that’s a problem. Huge penalties shouldn’t be levied for something out of a very young person’s control.
No one is putting a gun to anyone’s head like “play college sports or else”. There are pro leagues out there. But if the goal is to give kids a better chance for an education at least make it a little easier on them.
You need to advertise for walk-ons. Only the preferred walk-ons are invited to camp, and that’s a limited number. The ad is a show of good faith that the coaches aren’t making side deals with kids entitled in some way (coaches’ or boosters’ kids) or that they might be falsely promising an equivalent to the preferred status.
Interesting. I never saw anything like this during my time down there a few years ago. Just seems odd that it would be after the first week of the season rather than trying to find someone who’d stick earlier.
I don’t think you can fill out your roster of 105 total until school is in progress. So you’re left with 95 until that time. I’m sure there are some programs who game the system with a wink and a nod to some kids, making it all a foregone conclusion. I think some programs do the try-outs for spring camp, although, that might be just for the spring. Either way, the general student population is allowed the chance to “try out” for the last ten positions and deserves to know what parameters they must comply with before they can do so. http://www.thesundevils.com/ViewArticle.dbml?ATCLID=208593160
He was pretty well known when he decided to walk on. He had insane stats and basically over-achieved at everything he did… which sometime has to turn into regular old achievement since it appears to be the norm for him. I thought he was a preferred WO. I know he had D2 offers and maybe some 1AA.
It seems like the media is trying really hard to manufacture a rivalry with Utah. The schools need to dislike the other in order to have a rivalry. Just because we have some of their coaches and recruit some kids from Utah does not equal a rivalry. WSU is closer to a rivalry in my mind.
Anyone notice this? I’ve seen it written in a couple places lately.
I think WSU has more of a Brothers in Arms feel being that they are the smaller market team right next to one of the most annoying fan bases in the country, not unlike ourselves.
I personally kind of like the Utah rivalry. Recently we’ve matched up well and seem to play our most entertaining games of the year against them. I’ve sat next to some incredibly annoying Utah fans at the last couple home games. The kind that make your really want to beat them.
OT. Anybody got any great tailgating food ideas. Last year somebody brought up the Atomic Buffalo Turds that have become a staple. Need an idea for our TCU game with a Texas theme on Thursday.
Brisket is the main course. Go Rodents!
That sounds great, Jack. I’ll have to whip some of those up.
And yes, poppers. Apparently when you add a little smoky to the center of it, someone labeled them ATB’s…it’s easier than saying “bacon wrapped jalepeno popper with a little smoky in the middle.”
I’ve been making buffalo chicken dip and it’s always a hit. I smoke chicken thighs before shredding…other than that, it’s just the recipe you can find online.
You’re smoking a brisket…it doesn’t matter what your sides are at that point! I do love some smoked chicken wings for a tailgate too. Smoke for 3 hrs, then turn the heat up to 200 until they start to fall apart. Run them through a deep fryer for about 30 seconds then toss with your favorite sauce.
Some of that was play calling. He can’t throw a fade for shit, but it’s pretty clear he hasn’t been taught how to do it. That second pick was ridiculous and just a dumb play call.
There were quite a few dropped passes too.
All in all, he’s okay, but needs to get better. At least he starts, unlike Oregon’s top QB recruit.
I posted in the last thread, what is obvious is that he has a ton of upside both physically and mentally. His talents fit the spread offense. His running is better than his throwing right now.
Have to remember he’s not coming in next year and starting. If MM and SC hold the job until they are seniors, Moran would likely compete for the job in 2019 when he would be a redshirt JR. Project him there and not in the here and now.
I bet all of the guys on the depth chart will be getting a good amount of reps (at least on defense). Hollingsworth is a good player with interior and exterior DL experience, and he’s listed third behind Grimble(another guy that will get some good reps assuming he’s healthy?). Another guy from that DE/DT position that I think will be a stud this season is Baker Pritchard. We’re thin as paper at the LB positions but C Nolan-Lewis could fill in if needed on the outside (man this is where Nall could have been helpful as far as depth because he is buried every else he has been).
I trust this staff completely and just because someone’s listed as the starter doesn’t mean that they’ll be getting all of the reps. The 2nd and 3rd string guys will contribute quite a bit this season. That’s football. Next man up!
Warning. Do not have any liquids in your mouth while reading this quote.
BTN football show tonight talking about the new coaches. Host says, “Mike Riley left the comfort of Corvallis because he wanted the challenge of higher expectations.” LOL. You dope, he left because of higher expectations……….at OSU Talk about spin and revisionist history.
Enjoy the games while you can, because we maybe have 3-5 years of watchable college football left between ESPN, the NCAA, and the fairness police.
Yep, between those 3 and greed, no room for tradition. And when its gone, it wont come back.
Kinda looking forward to the extra free time
Me too.
youtube video on how to get stream2watch streams to work. Don’t know if this violates youtube’s terms of service nor do I care but if it does they will remove it. If someone wants to rob it and put it somewhere else where everyone here can access it, go for it
Don’t post that crap on AB, and anyone who followed my instructions on how to prevent ads shouldn’t have any problems.
This is how to browse the internet in peace: http://angrybeavs.com/media/10697
my apologies. feel free to delete the entire post then
Sorry you feel that way angry and thanks for trying Whiskey, greatly appreciated.
is there any way I can pm you the link?
I don’t want to deal with assholes sending me letters about links you guys post.
I made a post detailing how to use the internet properly and relinked it above ^.
There is nothing more that someone should need to get anything to work.
Mud and sticks if you want, make up a new yahoo or gmail account and post the address here and I will email you the link. This way its not a current personal email address being posted online.
Is that acceptable Angry?
I honestly think this is a must win for Andersen. It’s going to set the tone for the whole year.
And I have no idea what to expect on offense or defense. I’m guessing it will be run heavy since the reports are that the QBs aren’t great passers right now.
I had an interesting moment two nights ago. BTN is now showing tOSU crap almost contiously, like the other thirteen schools don’t exist. I happened to catch “The Journey” which was the episode documenting the B1G championship last season. It snapped me back to the truly unbelievable things that transpired last Dec. Watching GA talk and interact with Urban Meyer decked out in the hated Badger gear transported me back and I caught myself thinking……..I still can’t believe this really went down. He ditched Madison to coach the Beavs!
This season will probably have some serious struggles, but everyone should remember that feeling when his hiring was announced. Like a bolt from the blue, we had hope again. FWIW, Meyer was very complimentary about our new HC. Stay the course and I think he gets it done. Year three everything should be in place. Go Beavs!
Re: Official Visitors are coming!!! Players Make Plays Players Win Games – Players Need Snacks
Personally I’d prefer “Players Make Plays, TEAMS Win Games”.
Quote from previous thread.
Hilarious. How can you not see the the contradiction? If you apply your logic to the entire program, you’ll see that ll student athletes are compensated the same despite some student athletes (football players) generating the majority of the revenue. That goes against the “real world” you claim to live in. A member of the soccer team is compensated the same as a member of the football team. If anything, it’s the other student athletes that are getting an equal share of the pie when they “didn’t work for it”.
Football coaches are compensated more heavily than coaches of other sports. Why is that? Football players are compensated at the same rate as a scholarship row team kid. Why is that?
Side not: It’s funny when angry resorts to name calling (PC Police, Fairness Police, etc.) instead of trying to make arguments. Guess you call yourself angry for a reason. You sound like Rush Limbaugh.
Potential workaround: How about instead of paying them, you put some money in a fund they can access after they leave the university? That way they are not rolling around campus in Hummers and making it rain at the library, but they still see something for their “work” that’s producing millions for the university.
There’s nothing hilarious about that post and in the world I live in (the real world), I don’t make near as much money as my boss, I don’t know about you?! People that are out on the workforce front everyday, help generate money for their employer, do they get a “fair” split of the money made by the corporation? The whole point is that one of the biggest arguments for paying players is that the universities make so much money off of them through bowl games and tv contracts….. well I hate to burst their bubble but get used to it. That is how the world works, hence why 1% of the population has a majority of the wealth, is that “fair”? How about instead of paying them, they accept the fact that they get a free education, which nowadays can be near 100K over 4 years and then they don’t have to pay off student loans for over a decade. The one bill that breaks my back every month is the $300+ monthly payment that I have been paying on for over a decade and will be for much longer. Until someone realizes what the real world is like with all of your bills and….student loans on top of that, they can’t appreciate not having to pay it.
If a student athlete doesn’t like that they don’t get compensated, don’t be a student athlete! Simple. What’s next? Paying high school players? I coached hs football for 8 years and I can tell you right now, that hs football is almost a year round deal. I read an article of a collegiate player talking about his daily schedule an how long it was, blah blah blah. Well guess what??? Most high school players have the same schedule (football players). Come into the weight room at 5:30am-6am and workout for about an hour, go to class all day, go to film and practice for 3+ hours then they are home around 8-9 pm. And in the off season, they’re in the weight room every morning or after school for an hour and then players are doing individual (rule of two) drills with their position coach. This crap about wanting to be paid is just flat out greed. And btw, HS coaches don’t make crap, especially when you try and account for all of your hours that are put in for the year. That’s reality brother! What world are you living in?
Go Beavs!
In the “real world” the employee gets to negotiate for what they consider fair compensation for their labor. Sometimes with multiple companies.
The NCAA does not provide this “real world” experience at all.
Of course its greed, in the same way its greed when I fight for a raise at my job. Thats the “real world”
and in the real world an employer can say fuck you and your demands and kick your ass out the door. For whatever reason they wish. Did you consider this scenario? Ummm, Mr Quarterback, you suck at your job so we’re firing you. Sorry asshole, my contract is guaranteed so you’re gonna have to pay me my 10 million before you kick my ass out the door. That’s the contract. I just signed a contract to start a new job the day after labor day stating my salary. It also states I can quit or be let go at any time for any reason. No compensation other than a monthly salary, benefits, and some paid vacation. Could I have attempted to negotiate some money if they decided to fire me? Yes, but it would have been stupid to do so and they just would have offered the position to someone else. This is why comparing professional or even amateur athletes to being REAL world scenarios is fucking laughable. That isn’t real world shit and only a small percentage of people have the power to negotiate that way. To quote Denis Leary, “life sucks, get a fuckin helmet”
I see absolutely nothing stopping a college athlete from negotiating. They have the potential for all sorts of careers to compare to compensation as a student athlete. When my current employer has set my max on my compensation and I want more I have to look elsewhere. The examples of this are many, but don’t commonly happen. Kevin Rhoderick is now a golfer instead of a baseball player, Noah Happe left school early to make a career in football through the supplemental draft, Sabby Piscitelli is now a professional wrestler rather a football player, and not to forget all the many baseball players that leave after there junior year of college. The baseball players do this because of the increased compensation compared to school.
If players want to be treated like employees and get paid, then put them on a salary and do away with scholarships entirely – give them the money and have them pay tuition out of pocket. And if they aren’t performing up to expectations then we might have to let them go.
NCAA legislation specifically defines and categorizes different types of impermissible benefits (e.g., extra benefits, recruiting inducements, and preferential treatment). Regardless of the type of impermissible benefit, however, the prohibition is generally the same: under most circumstances, prospective and enrolled student-athletes (along with their friends and families) cannot receive goods or services based on their status as athletes. The following are categories of benefits that NCAA legislation prohibits boosters and other athletics stakeholders from providing to prospective and enrolled student-athletes:
Cash and cost-free goods and services;
Special discounts, payment arrangements, or credit options for products or services if the same are not available to all ASU students;
Preferential treatment, benefits, or services based on a student-athlete’s athletics reputation, skill, or pay-back potential as a future professional athlete;
Payment for work not performed or at unreasonable levels; and
The purchase of items or services from student-athletes or their relatives at inflated prices.
If it’s not available to all the students, then it’s a violation. Not to mention the entire title IX can of worms your solution would open
He’s never going to get it. He’s the fairness police.
Angry….Pretty amazed you even bother with college sports, you clearly have an incredibly low opinion of the players.
I do?
You sure as fuck seem too.
Last time I checked the “average student” is allowed to sign an agreement to be a spokesperson for a local car dealership or national brand and sell their autograph to anyone wiling to pay….
Thats just 2 examples, just because Billy doesn’t have those offers doesn’t mean he wouldn’t be allowed to do it. Its available to Billy and all other students with the exception of those playing NCAA sports.
You see the NCAA rules are bullshit.
A four year scholarship + room and board/food with a shot at the NFL is worth a lot more than being a spokesperson for a local car dealership. What exactly is the problem?
If they don’t like it, they can quit the football team and sign all the autographs they want. Oh wait…then nobody would want them. Yeah, they don’t need the university or anything…
Such a dumb argument. Nobody (literally nobody) is claiming they don’t need the university. Your debate skills are:
1) Insult those you disagree with
2) Make up things never said to tear done
Its pathetic.
The problem is quite clear, some (if not many) of these athletes are worth far more on the open market than the NCAA allows them to receive, the NCAA abuses this power by not only limiting their compensation from the schools but also preventing them from capitalizing off the field. You can argue other options should exist (a minor league) but in reality other options do not exist and even if its legal (I don’t think it is). It is absolutely 100% morally wrong to prevent a person from making money off the field.
I don’t know how anyone can think its okay to prevent someone who would be offered more money for additional work from taking that opportunity. And its wrong rather on scholarship or not. If a football at Harvard wants to sell his autograph he damn well should be allowed to.
Big down vote. Stupid comment.
If someone is worth more on the open market then they should go to the open market. It is there for the taking for everyone.
and the average student isn’t going to get suspended for 1 class for jumping on a table in the middle of the MU quad and yelling “Fuck her right in the pussy” multiple times. You aren’t going to get an argument from me that the NCAA has awful rules and seems to enforce them on a case by case basis or when they see fit. But pay for play is not the answer. There needs to be a cap on donations made strictly to the athletic departments for specific sports (not sure if donors can specifically request that or not but I do believe they can specify donations go to something OTHER than athletics). There needs to be a cap on what you can pay your coaching staff (Nick Saban making 8 million a year (8 or 10, i don’t remember and I’m too lazy to look it up) is ridiculous and unnecessary. A limit on recruiting budgets, limit on what you may spend on facilities, etc. And finally a limit on the amount for television contracts. If that isn’t possible than a limit of what each school can spend from TV contract revenue. Anything left over is put into an academic fund for scholarships and academic facility improvements. Maybe then universities can rely less on donors. Is this the answer? I don’t know but to me it seems more a workable solution that is on the NCAA and the universities than paying players. This way ALL of the university and students benefit.
And about 6 universities playing in the major conferences would agree to any of the things you’re proposing (and the 6 number is generous)….
Look, I get it, many of you would love to see all these schools go Ivy League or you simply think paying for college is enough and the kid should just be happy but that isn’t the real world.
In the real world these colleges are making tons of money and although a scholarship is great compensation for many of the athletes on these teams more compensation is available. Sorry but I think its morally wrong to prevent a person from accepting that. Every person should be allowed to maximize their earnings, even ‘student athletes’
When a student-athlete signs a LOI they are signing a contract. Don’t like the contract? Don’t sign it. Seems pretty simple to me
Exactly.
And they are now fighting better contracts. And I side with them because the contracts the NCAA requires schools to sign these ‘not employees despite signing a contract in exchange for their labor’ are morally (and very likely as we will soon find out legally) wrong.
You guys act like these kids have other options, the NCAA is taking advantage of their power and using it to force people without other options into poor deals.
Look, in theory I agree with you (on everything but off the field earnings, taking those away is just wrong) but in reality many of these players are worth more than just a scholarship and are prevented from getting it because of the NCAA and NFL. In my opinion those entities are far more in the wrong than the players who are simply looking to maximize their earnings.
Everyone has other options, including the option to do nothing. Free will. Dur de der.
Ah, yeah….The good old “you’ll take it and like it” argument.
While, antitrust laws tend to disagree with this (luckily)
The good old “you’ll take it and like it” argument.
What?
No, the free will argument. They have other options, including doing nothing. That isn’t “take it and like it”. WTF are you talking about, Willis?
Depending on the sport (e.g. baseball, Olympic sports), they have arguably better options than college.
Exactly. High school baseball players can jump right into the minor leagues. Ah but there’s the rub! Football players don’t have the minor leagues you say? Not having a football minor league system isn’t the NCAA’s problem nor should it be. College athletes have other options or choices instead of signing a LOI
They do have other options. Some hoops players play overseas and get paid instead of playing a year of college ball. There’s always the Canadian and Arena leagues for football. Need I go on?
CFL doesn’t allow players right out of high school, have no clue about Arena football.
But to call Arena Football a real option is nonsense, its not even football, its a joke.
Arena football isn’t football? Even though it’s played on a football field. Teams play offense, defense and special teams. Offenses score touchdowns and players tackle each other. So if it walks like a duck and talks like a duck it’s not a duck?
It’s football with some different rules sprinkled in. Just like the CFL
I understand what Arena Football is, its a form of football of course but its not even close to the game played in high school, college, or the NFL. The CFL is different but is much closer. Arena Football is a joke. And as I said I don’t even know if its an option, can you provide a link showing they sign people out of high school? I’m betting they don’t but couldn’t find it with a quick google search and don’t care enough to spend more time on it.
It’s your job to restrict how much colleges can make if they invest millions into a risky product (e.g. a football team in Corvallis or any small town USA)? So everyone is allowed to maximize their earnings except colleges? Is that right? Just trying to understand this massive cognitive dissonance.
Well shit, in that case the colleges should forum a union to protect themselves from the Warners of the world. Workers of the world unite! We have a Marxist among us, folks, and worse he’s is disguised as a Capitalist.
Anyway, what we have is a contract: University gives X, player gets Y, and both parties agree to the terms. And the problem is…??
Oh yeah, the fairness police want to meddle and tell people what they should be doing. As I said in a prior thread, if you’re telling people what they should be doing, you’re an asshole. No exceptions except Mike Riley, who couldn’t figure out how to put matching socks on. In that case you’re just being nice.
If I ever tell someone on this site what they should be doing or how they should be living, please remind me I’m being an asshole. I’ll thank you.
What are you babbling about?
Colleges are maximizing their profits. I have never at anytime said “colleges must offer more”
Hell, they can offer nothing….My problem is with telling someone “you can come play football here for a college education but we also control your likeness and all profits that come from that for the next 5 years (and beyond) and owe you nothing for it”
That is a bullshit contract.
I am not telling anyone what they should be doing, I am saying its wrong to take a person’s ability to profit of themselves away….
That is a bullshit contract.
It’s considered a great deal since thousands of players fight for it each year. The players know they have zero exposure otherwise.
It’s just like a record label. A band can try to get noticed on their own, but what they sacrifice by signing on with a label is that autonomy, and what they gain is exposure. Many contracts work this way and that’s part of the value of any deal. It’s amazing you can’t wrap your head around it.
Ah but there are many record companies that bands can negotiate with to get the best terms possible.
I can wrap my head around it…..
And even if you can screw someone over (as record labels often do) it doesn’t make it right.
Seriously, why the fuck do these kids have to give up their rights to sponsorships? Because you are nervous about a kid driving a hummer through campus?
Ah, but there are many football teams out there and many leagues. Heck, a person could even start their own NFL developmental league. Not to mention every other professional sport. Why, would you lament such a beneficial contract to a student athlete. You act like a student athlete has no options when in all actuality there has never been a better time for an athlete to negotiate.
The bottom line is do you want to be an amateur or professional athlete. Amateur athletes have and always will have different rules than professional athletes. Deal with it!
Because they aren’t and never have been amateur athletes. A scholarship is compensation, when you give someone compensation to play a sport they ain’t an amateur more more.
The whole amateur thing is PR, these kids are pros and have been for decades.
Warner is an idiot. He thinks throwing gas on a fire puts out the fire.
Who said I am trying to put out the fire?
You could at least get a little more creative in your name calling.
Idiot? Weak sauce….I expect better….
Why are those rules BS? What happens to sport once boosters promise PSAs certain amounts of money “for their autographs”?
There will be 10 or 20 teams soon because some idiots think athletes aren’t already immeasurably paid for what they do.
So, let’s talk about them as labor. How will you set up the draft? How many schools get to participate? How will P5 schools deal with the loss in revenues if all D1 schools get to participate in the draft?
Warner 28-
“In the real world these colleges are making tons of money and although a scholarship is great compensation for many of the athletes on these teams more compensation is available. Sorry but I think its morally wrong to prevent a person from accepting that. Every person should be allowed to maximize their earnings, even ‘student athletes’”.
So if “every person” should be able to get the max, why stop at paying college players. Hell, pay high school kids too (they’re part of everybody, right?)! This is nothing but greed. I agree that the NCAA is a big portion of that greed but people have lost the idea of not having to be compensated for every thing they do. They’re playing a game, that is a privilege, not a right. Do we fire (kick college players off of a team) because they under perform or go into a slump? I mean come on. This is everything wrong with our society!
Go Beavs!
Exactly right.
Why stop at high school? Pay the Pop Warner kid. Without him, the team wouldn’t be able to hire an ice cream cone man.
If the local car dealership or Nike wants to sign a high school kid to an endorsement deal go for it.
Jesus fucking christ.
That is what I am fucking talking about, players should be allowed to sign deals with entities other than the college, they should retain rights to their likeness and be allowed to sell it. So should high school and pop warner kids.
Then they’re professionals, not amateurs. Here we go again.
Who gives a fuck about some stupid fucking label?
What is this, golf in Scotland in 1892?
Who cares if they are pro or amateur or some other definition
Was Russell Wilson a pro when he took Wisconsin to the Rose Bowl? He was a pro athlete by then by your definition. Should he have been ineligible or is it okay because for some reason the NCAA decided it was okay to be a pro baseball player and a student athlete in another sport?
Or how bout the Jeremy Bloom rule that allows an athlete to sign endorsement deals as long as they relate to another sport? A rule that only passed after Bloom was declared ineligibe for college football over endorsements he had to have in order to make the Olympics in skiing….How do we know the endorsement deal is only for that one sport? Amateur or pro?
That wouldn’t give certain schools even more of a competitive advantage. If you can’t understand that I don’t know what to tell you
Never said it wouldn’t…The athletes ability to earn shouldn’t be hindered to protect your school.
Have fun watching that sport. It would be defunct quicker than the XFL.
Pretty much. You’d have a handful of schools getting the best players and the rest are fucked. An already less than competitive balance divides even further
You’d have a handful of schools getting the best players and the rest are fucked.
Which is why we’re on the same path either way.
I’m not making an argument for what is best for me the fan.
Allowing players the right to market themselves off the field is simply the right thing to do.
There’s no such thing as “right” or “wrong”. Maybe you should read some philosophy after you finish the communist manifesto.
And this is why contracts come into play. To determine two parties idea of what’s fair. The only way you could claim abuse is if the contract is signed under duress, adhesion, or any of the other invalid contracts.
Or the whole system is deemed in violation of antitrust laws.
Which is what is going to happen.
That might happen, and football will be defunct within 5 years of that.
I could care less — I’d have more time for more important things.
This is my last post on this subject. Part of the NCAA’s job (since psst, student athletes are amateur) is to maintain some type of competitive balance. I’d argue they are doing a shitty job at that already since pretty much no one outside of the power 5 football conferences and an Independent that I won’t name realistically have zero chance of getting into the college football playoff. And money and greed is the driving force behind this Model T bucket of shit. The players see how much money is being raked in and they want a piece of it. The NCAA says no you can’t because then you lose your amateur status and are ineligible to participate. Then there’s the other sports athletes saying we aren’t getting paid? And title IX issues that are just going to muddy the waters even more. IF the players do eventually wind up getting compensated somehow, then the entire system will collapse. Only a handful of schools would get the best players. There goes most of your TV contracts. Fewer TV contracts = less revenue. Fewer eyes want to pay to watch only a handful of teams dominate on a yearly basis except fans, alums and donors of those schools either in person or on TV. And don’t even get me started on how donors or companies could game the system (read Nike) and steer players to specific schools with endorsement deals. The NCAA and universities know this. Hell even an idiot like me can finger it out. Cap the spending and put the money back into the universities. But as was stated above not many schools in the power 5 conferences would agree to this model. If the alternative was presented as a likely result, some may change their minds. To others, they would just rather keep it as status quo. I don’t have the answer. I presented something I thought considered feasible. But pay for play is most certainly NOT the answer and would only continue what is already a declining model. But something is going to have to change. And soon. Likely you’ll see courts to continue to balk and everything stays status quo
Part of the NCAA’s job (since psst, student athletes are amateur) is to maintain some type of competitive balance
Is this actually part of their job? Do they have a written mandate?
Also, why are D3 schools prohibited from giving scholarships? I never understood this…is the idea that they don’t have the funds to consistently field teams each year?
I found the answer. Looks like the D3 schools freely choose not to offer scholarships, believing “athletes are theoretically less driven by money, media attention, and/or other outside influences.”
I might have to start watching D3 and Ivy League since D1 is becoming a cesspool.
You all are wrong. When they actually get paid wages, they become employees. They are not now because of the same SCOTUS ruling about graduate students and pay and such. You want to break down that argument first? I would be happy to see anyone do it.
But if they eventually do become employees, then there does either need to be a CBA or the NCAA members will move to protect themselves by instituting one for parity’s sake, which will force the players to form a CBU pretty quickly.
So now five star whatever position Johnny Doe doesn’t get to choose the school he goes to, the one he’s dreamed of attending for his whole childhood because that’s where his parents met and his uncle was a sports hero… or some equally heart-tugging neat deal. Instead of going to, say, Notre Dame, USC or Bama, Johnny has to go to Georgia State because they had the fourth pick in the draft and really needed someone at the whatever position Johnny plays. Endorsement deals will be fine. You just need to dal with player agents.
I don’t get why angry has been calling proponents of pay for play some fairness league or whatever, even bringing up communism. It’s precisely the opposite. It’s a free marketeer’s dream argument. The same one-third of the population who supports the argument are the same one-third of the population who scream about taxes and going back to the 50’s and whatever other half-cocked ideas their masters come up with to distract them. They’re gold-diggers or people who can see there is money for them to siphon off an otherwise simple system.
I don’t get why angry has been calling proponents of pay for play some fairness league or whatever, even bringing up communism
Oh, because he is portraying the university as the oppressor and is clearly pro labor.
The agents and guys behind the scene who have skin in the game are what you’re describing, and they’re confusing fans (like Warner) into believing pay for play is some kind of social justice.
“So now five star whatever position Johnny Doe doesn’t get to choose the school he goes to, the one he’s dreamed of attending for his whole childhood because that’s where his parents met and his uncle was a sports hero… or some equally heart-tugging neat deal. Instead of going to, say, Notre Dame, USC or Bama, Johnny has to go to Georgia State because they had the fourth pick in the draft and really needed someone at the whatever position Johnny plays.”
No he wouldn’t. He would just hold out and demand a trade to Alabama.
So you both don’t get the player AND make another team better in the process? Screw that. If Johnny don’t want to play, Johnny can just watch TV like the rest of us.
get unions and collective bargaining in place and then watch what happens
I’m getting dizzy here. Universities are the fascists?
It feels like we’re about two inches from someone yelling “FRANKFURT SCHOOL” and going off on that rant.
and in this case Nike or Buttfuckers Inc car dealerships would be deemed a booster of said school and then it becomes an improper benefit. I understand an average student not on athletic scholarship can get a job and receive income. But no one is going to sign average Joe student to an endorsement deal for anything
Is that dealership in San Francisco?
Regardless of the actual argument about play for pay, the Warner argument is a pusillanimous pedantic exercise of parsing words.
He’s trying to be LIbertarian and say everyone should have the right to xyz. The problem is he thinks that’s true of everyone except universities, so he’s just a hypocrite/Marxist asshole telling people what to do. It’s as bad as the NCAA telling people what to do. He’s just doing it with the University. Lame.
A real free market advocate would say let the college and player decide on their contract, and that’s what happened for years. Players and unis have decided schollies are a good deal for both parties. Until assholes get in their ear and tell them how they should be living.
What the fuck are you fucking talking about? I am talking about the fucking NCAA.
The NCAA prevents a free market from working, that is the whole fucking point. That is why its an antitrust lawsuit.
If every college were free to offer whatever the fuck they want (free market) than great but when a group gets together and agrees to limit that market (i.e. what the NCAA is doing) its a manipulation of the free market and is often times deemed ILLEGAL.
The universities are free to offer nothing or everything in my eyes, they just aren’t free to use their power to manipulate the market which is what they are doing.
I am not making any kind of libertarian argument, I am making an argument about antitrust law. The libertarian argument would be fine with the NCAA power. At least learn your politics before you make a stupid statement.
Right, which is why you’re a Marxist disguised, as I said.
Are the players free to manipulate the market? You seem to be pro unionization of players, for example.
College football fans: a spectre is haunting college football, the spectre of Warner and his band of fairness police!
Oh jesus,
I want players to have the right to market themselves off the field, basically the Olympic model.
Colleges can continue to only pay scholarships they just can’t tell Jimmy QB1 that he can’t make money off the field.
If that makes me a marxist so be it. Not sure how it could but I actually understand what marxism is not sure you do so whatever…..
I actually understand what marxism is
No you really don’t.
While than explain it to me Mr. Angry, I look forward to your knowledge…..
Just read the Communist Manifesto. It takes 10 minutes.
Done it, but apparently I read a different version than you.
I don’t recall anything in it about colleges taking a kids ability to earn money off the field being in it.
Yet you’re against universities wielding their ‘power’ to make the same said money. Boy does that sound familiar.
If it violates antitrust laws (like the judge says this one does) than damn right.
America has antitrust laws for a reason.
Ah yes, the government will save college football (and the athlete from himself). Lol
So, you are against antitrust laws?
Fair enough. I can’t argue against that. If you feel that antitrust laws shouldn’t exist than cool. At least you’re consistent if that is the case.
Yes, I hate all meddling.
I think you mean Das Kapital.
Who said anything about unions?
I have been quite clear, I think players should be allowed to earn money off the field.
I’ve supported nothing else beyond that at any point in this discussion. And had the NCAA allowed that decades ago they wouldn’t be getting sued right now.
Do you support the players at Northwestern attempt to unionize?
No
As I have said multiple times.
I support one thing: Players maintaining control of their likeness.
That is it, one thing, nothing more. Because its the right fucking thing to do.
“Right” according to an asshole who gets off telling others what is best for them. Got it.
Yep, and if you think its okay to take that ability away you are the asshole.
I am done
But I am curious (since you never answered) about you stance on guys like Russell Wilson (pro athlete in a different sport) and Jeremy Bloom (endorsements allowed to support athlete in a different sport) still being deemed eligible for college sports.
Are you okay with that? And if so why?
Honestly want to know.
I prefer to give opinions, but I’d never intentionally tell someone how to live their life nor would I get involved in someone’s contract. If I do that on this blog, please, call me out and call me a major- fucking- Riley Reid -porn star- level- gaping asshole so it hits home (I ignore boring insults).
I don’t know the Russell Wilson situation, which is why I didn’t comment. From what I remember, he went pro, then came back? Don’t know enough about it.
Okay, simple. Forget Russell Wilson because dozens (hundreds probably) have done it.
You are allowed to be a pro baseball player under contract with a professional baseball team while still playing college sports (other than baseball).
And, athletes can now get sponsorship deals to support a different sport (say they are an Olympic skier) without giving up their student athlete status.
So you can be both a pro athlete and a student athlete according to NCAA rules. Its right there and its allowed and done all the time.
Just explained them to you, that okay?
In my view it is because everyone should be allowed to sign sponsorship deals but it seems odd that exceptions get made for certain athletes.
Oh and just to add to the baseball thing. The baseball team pays your tuition as long as you are under contract with them. So you are playing college football on a pro baseball teams dime.
Seems like the exception is for certain sports (not playing the same one pro and amateur) not certain athletes. No clue it seems inconsistent for sure, but I haven’t read that exact bylaw or the justification for it. I guess the argument is he is pro in sport x but not in sport y, so he can play sport y as an amateur? On some level that makes sense — say you’re playing NFL football but want to play baseball as a hobby and have college eligibility. I’m thinking out loud as we go here, so yeah, I’m being inconsistent because I’m not sure and haven’t thought about it.
The NCAA is ridiculous. I have railed on them for years. I’m not going to support the NCAA. But I will support a player and university coming to an agreement both believe is fair. Whether you or I think it’s fair is not relevant, unless we want to be assholes (aka the fairness police) meddling in others’ affairs.
And I would totally agree with you if that contract being offered wasn’t being offered from a position where only 1 side (colleges) have negotiating power.
In my view the colleges (under the guise of NCAA rules) have abused their power.
Just because the player signs the deal (when he has no other options) doesn’t automatically mean they believe its a fair deal, the players simply don’t have any other legitimate options. Its sign or quit playing. That is not a legitimate option.
And frankly I have a huge problem with my college specifically making money on the likeness of a player without allowing the player to do the same. You said their is no right or wrong but I disagree, sometimes things are simply wrong.
I’ll agree to disagree and apologize for getting so heated about it, this one issue truly bothers me. The colleges have used the NCAA to take it too far.
And its obvious that many players don’t think its a fair deal which is why they are using the only leverage they have (antitrust laws).
So my comment above about adhesion contracts…you think a LOI is an adhesion contract?
Yes, absolutely
Okay, well this is what the NCAA writes about their contracts:
Is a scholarship a binding contract between a student-athlete and a school?
No. The scholarship is an agreement between the school and the student-athlete with expectations on both sides, but the agreement is completely separate from transfer regulations. A student-athlete may choose to transfer at any time. With multi-year scholarships now available for Division I schools, those colleges and universities have the option to offer athletics financial aid for more than one year. Such an agreement requires the school to provide financial aid to the student-athlete in accordance with the terms and conditions of the agreement. However, the agreement does not bind the student-athlete to the institution any more than the current transfer rules – he or she may transfer during the term of the award.
If a student-athlete signs a National Letter of Intent, he or she cannot transfer during the initial year of competition without penalty.
And this is an adhesion contract:
A standard form contract drafted by one party (usually a business with stronger bargaining power) and signed by the weaker party (usually a consumer in need of goods or services), who must adhere to the contract and therefore does not have the power to negotiate or modify the terms of the contract. Adhesion contracts are commonly used for matters involving insurance, leases, deeds, mortgages, automobile purchases, and other forms of consumer credit. Also known as adhesive contract; adhesory contract; adhesionary contract; take-it-or-leave-it contract; leonine contract.
Courts carefully scrutinize adhesion contracts and sometimes void certain provisions because of the possibility of unequal bargaining power, unfairness, and unconscionability. Factoring into such decisions include the nature of the assent, the possibility of unfair surprise, lack of notice, unequal bargaining power, and substantive unfairness. Courts often use the “doctrine of reasonable expectations” as a justification for invalidating parts or all of an adhesion contract: the weaker party will not be held to adhere to contract terms that are beyond what the weaker party would have reasonably expected from the contract, even if what he or she reasonably expected was outside the strict letter of agreement.
So given the weaker party (I assume you think this is the player) can threaten to transfer and can choose between several hundred schools, they do have bargaining power. Can they demand more scholarship money? No. Not sure this would fit adhesion in courts. Are they even trying to make that argument? I’d actually be curious to see how that stands up in court.
2012. I wonder if there’s anything more recent.
http://ctsportslaw.com/2012/01/31/is-the-national-letter-of-intent-legally-enforceable/
The keyword in the adhesion contracts is “unconscionable”. It’s hard to imagine a court saying, “Yeah, giving him the option of 200 schools, an option to leave your school after 1 year, free room and board, food, and tuition is unconscionable.”
So I don’t think the LOI will be found adhesion.
They’ll probably have more luck with the antitrust meddling.
I can’t decide which is worse, the NCCA or Warner.
Both seem to lead to the same conclusion: college football in the shitter. Maybe it needs to go there for a while so it can come out of this current state cleansed.
Jack is going to show up and know everything about this topic, and we’ll all walk away tails between legs.
no, more like this…………..Jack is going to show up, type some long response that is pretty much going to expose all of his personalities, state something about “idiot boy”, pretty much go into an irrelevant tangent that will lose everyone about 1/3 of the way thru. At which point everyone will stop reading it and go wtf man? That guy is nuttier than squirrel shit
You forgot “call Angry a Bircher”
I wasn’t thinking that, but it would make sense out of you thinking that you’re bashing a laissez argument by calling it Communist or Marxist or something weirdly opposite of what it is.
I was just confused as to why you would say that. Birchers would scream “Communist” at a forest because a bunch of trees seem to be up to something shady. So I guess that makes sense? And they sell the Manifesto more than anyone else. So bringing it up when Kapital speaks more clearly to the gleaning of profit off labor’s back would add to this hindsight
Amazing thread. I’m glad you weren’t all in the same room with deadly weapons.
Yeah … I just tuned in, after going backpacking for most of a week, totally out of touch, and expected a hot discussion of the latesty in our good ‘ol Beavs headed for their first game under the new coach…. and……LOL!
Hey, its an unfair world out there! That’s the way its always been, and seems to me it aint about to change. A few have always held the power and wealth. Its the human way….
totally off topic. Kanye West announces at VMA’s tonight he will run for president in 2020.
I about fell out of my fucking chair with laughter after reading that. I can just see those presidential debates and him snatching the microphone out of another candidates hand to tell them “Ima let you finish” but someone is “is the greatest of all time”. This country really would go to shit (as if it hasn’t already) with Kanye for president
Haven’t you seen the move “Idiocracy”? Donald Trump and Kanye, leading right down that path.
Pretty awesome video on social justice warriors. Kind of relevant to this thread. ;)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CvYSPxvrq5s#t=44
ah yes. the occupiers. What a waste of time that was. Most of us just went to work and laughed at those losers. can’t say I disagree with any of that. Just so tired of these people
This guy Warner seems like a social justice warrior. He’s fighting for the oppressed players’ rights. lol
I can’t speak for that since these are only our opinions on a blog.
While, angry seems to think he knows me based on 1 opinion about 1 situation on 1 blog so good for him.
Ahhh… Jim defends gamergate… yet again.
Irony.
He knows as well as anyone that the issue would never have existed if the “anti-SJW” crowd hadn’t first created it. I don’t think, angry, you want to associate yourself with this “PC backlash” crowd. The MO for them is to personally attack any slight they can manufacture (sound familiar?), to relentlessly harass the “entitled minority” to whom they attach the blame for their imagined slight (including doxxing and death threats), and to hide behind their false construct of a lack of journalistic integrity. That construct, btw, was created by them to cover for their blatant misogyny.
Note: I am not the one bringing it up since it is the thrust and foundation of gamergate.
So Jim and others co-opted the blatant misogyny they fomented and turned it into some upside down ethics complaint and then went all hipster-anti-SJW with it. Just like his “rant” against Occupy above, he has tried to change the narrative to encapsulate… well… everything he wants it to encapsulate… except for the one thing it really means… the same thing that gets him dismantled every so often because his immense ego doesn’t allow him to think anyone is smarter than he is.
But he and his crew (he’s posting under MisterMetokur) will continue to blame faggots, juggalos, mexicans, kikes and whores for everything that is wrong in this world. Yes, it’s a leftist conspiracy of black, gay, Jewish Hispanic women that makes you a dick, Jim. Wait, sorry… it’s a conspiracy of those who sleep with anything that moves and must be “stroking him” under the desk of whatever show she’s being interviewed on because she’s “co-opting” some issue (which you always gloss over, simplify or dismiss as if your straw man means it never existed in the first place) in order to say that you’re a part of some conspiracy against them… which you are, in the literal sense, doing.
I could be wrong, angry. Maybe you think the vilest of the vile trolls out there actually makes sense. Jim’s been around for a long time and has a long history of shitting himself repeatedly and soldiering on despite it being someone else’s fault because he is being oppressed… always.You essentially linked the 4chan equivalent of the Westboro Baptist Church and said, “right on!”
I don’t know who Jim is or what gamergate is, but I’ve run into these social justice types all over the internet, and they are REALLY annoying.
I’m not saying there aren’t people out there who don’t know what they’re talking about yet choose to get in your face anyway… in every single cause that exists. He talks about gamergate in the video (and just about every vid he uploads), so I don’t know why you would link content you don’t know.
I think the funniest thing about him and his posse is that they conflate the right to say something with an imagined right not to be criticized for what is actually said. The same is true of the games they play. It would be legitimate if they stuck to the premise that video games portraying minorities as criminals and women as sluts is a matter of free speech. You don’t want to play that game? Don’t. You want to say you’re disgusted by it? Fine… no biggie… except for these hypersensitive goons. And they take it as a license to make their online personas as vile as their gamer personas. Ethnics are conspiratorial thugs whose stereotypes are accentuated then ridiculed. Women are whores. Anyone who disagrees with them about their tactics is against freedom and some kind of ethics that allows doxxing and raids and coordinated bullying and death threats and lying about someone tagged as a SJW or SPJ. And they don’t hold back on any language you would think is a part of no decent conversation… slurs, explicit sexual references (any you can think of… and a lot you can’t), violence against conspiratorial minorities… all in the worst context you can imagine. Some of them try and excuse it as “dark humor.” But most don’t even bother to pretend.
I didn’t realize this guy was well known and had a posse. I didn’t know I needed to know the backstory of his video before posting it. Live and learn! I just like the idea of backlash against the hoards of annoying people (some of my friends even, like on FB) who have popped up over the last five to ten years, especially on the internet. I don’t run into people like this in real life, but they are everywhere online telling you what you should be doing, how you should be living, etc.
His topic has valid complaints. It’s that he does exactly as those he rants against and worse. I didn’t even really know or care about Ashley Madison until the dump happened. I still don’t really care since it’s not now or ever will be my problem and doesn’t affect me… and is a privacy thing, not public. But the level of masturbating schadenfreude he and all the /v/ and /pol/ gang have over it is just bizarre. Here he is trying to make public expression unaccountable in the name of free speech, yet he revels in a privacy dump with a lot of what he thinks is women and people who oppose his tactics. Even if it was (it isn’t), wouldn’t that be counter to his very argument to be what he says he’s against?
How did I not know there is a Wet Hot American Summer series??
See you next week. Something more important has come up.
where do we mail the kleenex and lotion to?
So back to football, while we still have it.
I’m looking forward to this Utah/Michigan game and Nebraska/BYU, too.
3 of their writers picked BYU:
http://www.dailynebraskan.com/sports/dn-sports-desk-nebraska-v-byu-score-predictions/article_3e3a1096-4f87-11e5-b708-db98089231a9.html
I’m thinking Utah and BYU both win
Yeah, as an equal parts Beavers and Utes fan, the Michigan game should be fascinating. Also, ASU v. Texas AM is a good statement opportunity for the conference.
http://www.sbnation.com/college-football/2015/7/15/8915161/texas-am-arizona-state-game-2015-preview
So you are a Beaute?
Sounds about right. Basically, an aficionado of mediocre education and sports. Not great at anything, but at least not the worst, either.
http://www.gazettetimes.com/sports/beavers-sports/football/osu-football-t-j-woods-lines-up-with-andersen/article_917f074d-6747-5c56-99ab-96c85476783c.html
Hey all.. back from a summer on the road excited and ready for an interesting year of football. Strap in.. it’s going to be a roller coaster ride with a lot of dips.
Now would be a good time to review and agree to the AB terms and conditions:
Please agree here ________ before continuing for the remainder of 2015/16.
I hereby agree that Jack is the AB resident genius and subject matter expert on the following topics. Any opinion I/we may have is stupid and subject to lengthy and boring rebutall by Jack.
Alcohol…… wine and micro-brews
Politics……. local, state and global
Football…… game strategy, recruiting, “ships”
Basketball….same as above
Baseball…… same as above
Economics… micro and macro
Investing…… better than Warren Buffet
Essential oils.. wtf
Fishing………. anything with gills
Cooking……… anything edible especially bbq, special emphasis on “rubs”
Urban planning… not limited to Eugene
Resturants……… not limited to Corvallis
Music……………. all generes especially esoteric guitar players
If I have forgotten any subjects they are incorporated by reference. JB
PS: BDC should get the game ball after the big win against Weber State. He found and scheduled a weak Big Sky team instead of a good one. A final parting gift from BDC.
Good to have you back, coach. Where did your travels take you during the offseason this year?
“essential oils..wtf” -good stuff
You forgot a lot of other subjects. But I might take a hint and monetize some of those subjects by way of creating a blog and/or in the form of employment. Thanks for the idea.
Question: Why do you say “I/we”? There are some smart people here who can speak for themselves. Do you have to be so pretentious that you would speak for them? I know it’s funny to ask a prestense not to be pretentious. But you just called everyone here stupid.
Sounds right. He does have the entire internets at his disposal.
Where is the link that Grimble is out??
http://www.statesmanjournal.com/story/sports/college/oregon-state/2015/08/30/beavers-overlooking-weber-state-season-opener/71440800/
? I didn’t see any mention of Grimble being out?
Sorry for the confusion. My post was not intended as a reply to your inquiry re Grimble. I was simply providing an FYI link. However, I, too, was curious about comments suggesting that he was “out.” The only reference to Grimble’s status that I’m aware of came from Gina in a recent report saying that he’s been lining up with the second string in practice.
GA is scheduled for a live PC on Pac 12 Network at approx. 12:15 today. Perhaps status updates will be provided then.
PC here (I think): http://pac-12.com/live/oregon-state-university-2
I go to the SJ – well b4 the Oregonian, if I have time to go there at all. Gina seems to have gone off the boil – mostly doing videos. Granted, there hasn’t been much radio time but not sure journalism is about waiting for the news to come to you.
This is more a question for the Oregonian – but I know someone on the AB site will have the answer. As I understand it, the OSU beat writers live in Portland?
Off topic:
Angry, Except for the hyphen, what’s the difference between the first two choices that are given to us when we post a message?
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I think the crux of the student athlete thing isn’t necessarily that they should be paid a salary, but:
-Their schedules shouldn’t be so filled that they can’t actually major in what they want to
-They should be allowed to make money off the field, since they aren’t allowed to hold jobs and thus it creates a class issue where a kid from a poorer background might not be able to afford a car for example.
-The scholarships should include full cost of attendance and include a bit more so they can fly home or have the same luxuries anyone else can get
-The NCAA doesn’t act in the best interests of the student, but rather the universities and that’s a problem. Huge penalties shouldn’t be levied for something out of a very young person’s control.
No one is putting a gun to anyone’s head like “play college sports or else”. There are pro leagues out there. But if the goal is to give kids a better chance for an education at least make it a little easier on them.
Football tryouts next Monday!
http://i.imgur.com/NiwpaqU.jpg
WTF… I mean I guess it doesn’t hurt to see if there’s someone out there that can help. But, man, that kinda screams of some desperation.
Lots of teams do this, nothing desperate about it at all. Its actually quite common and smart.
Except our tryouts are for QB.
You need to advertise for walk-ons. Only the preferred walk-ons are invited to camp, and that’s a limited number. The ad is a show of good faith that the coaches aren’t making side deals with kids entitled in some way (coaches’ or boosters’ kids) or that they might be falsely promising an equivalent to the preferred status.
Interesting. I never saw anything like this during my time down there a few years ago. Just seems odd that it would be after the first week of the season rather than trying to find someone who’d stick earlier.
You can only have so many players in fall camp. 105 I believe. Then the add they the other walk-ons and practice players.
I don’t think you can fill out your roster of 105 total until school is in progress. So you’re left with 95 until that time. I’m sure there are some programs who game the system with a wink and a nod to some kids, making it all a foregone conclusion. I think some programs do the try-outs for spring camp, although, that might be just for the spring. Either way, the general student population is allowed the chance to “try out” for the last ten positions and deserves to know what parameters they must comply with before they can do so.
http://www.thesundevils.com/ViewArticle.dbml?ATCLID=208593160
That’s how they found Inspector Clouseau
He was pretty well known when he decided to walk on. He had insane stats and basically over-achieved at everything he did… which sometime has to turn into regular old achievement since it appears to be the norm for him. I thought he was a preferred WO. I know he had D2 offers and maybe some 1AA.
No, he was a preferred walk on.
Though I’m sure I still have plenty of eligibility left, I am far too busy monetizing my likeness to try out.
It seems like the media is trying really hard to manufacture a rivalry with Utah. The schools need to dislike the other in order to have a rivalry. Just because we have some of their coaches and recruit some kids from Utah does not equal a rivalry. WSU is closer to a rivalry in my mind.
Anyone notice this? I’ve seen it written in a couple places lately.
I think WSU has more of a Brothers in Arms feel being that they are the smaller market team right next to one of the most annoying fan bases in the country, not unlike ourselves.
I personally kind of like the Utah rivalry. Recently we’ve matched up well and seem to play our most entertaining games of the year against them. I’ve sat next to some incredibly annoying Utah fans at the last couple home games. The kind that make your really want to beat them.
Angry,
Do we have an updated depth chart for the team yet?
I don’t think anyone knows it.
No depth..no chart. Simple…geez.
OT. Anybody got any great tailgating food ideas. Last year somebody brought up the Atomic Buffalo Turds that have become a staple. Need an idea for our TCU game with a Texas theme on Thursday.
Brisket is the main course. Go Rodents!
Love those ATB’s!
Was that you or Jason that brought those up?
Not sure…I remember talking about them on here…been making them for years. They are a hit every single time.
Do you add anything to the cream cheese? I like a small amount of onion and some paprika.
Chopped roasted red pepper, chives, scallion, and a little BBQ rub.
Are you guys talking about jalapeno poppers again?
Try mixing the cream cheese with smoked salmon and roasted garlic.
That sounds great, Jack. I’ll have to whip some of those up.
And yes, poppers. Apparently when you add a little smoky to the center of it, someone labeled them ATB’s…it’s easier than saying “bacon wrapped jalepeno popper with a little smoky in the middle.”
Jalapeno poppers are bacon wrapped. That’s redundant… unless you have an extra layer of bacon… nm… carry on.
And I almost wrote above…”I remember talking about them, and Jack correcting us by telling us they are jalepeno poppers….”
Your nothing if not consistent, my friend.
GWH
See above… ;)
I’ve been making buffalo chicken dip and it’s always a hit. I smoke chicken thighs before shredding…other than that, it’s just the recipe you can find online.
You’re smoking a brisket…it doesn’t matter what your sides are at that point! I do love some smoked chicken wings for a tailgate too. Smoke for 3 hrs, then turn the heat up to 200 until they start to fall apart. Run them through a deep fryer for about 30 seconds then toss with your favorite sauce.
Chicken wings! I thought about those last spring and then forgot them. Good call. Not for TCU, but maybe the Huskers.
I missed Moran running for 2 tds. How was he in the 2nd half overall? Any improvement passing?
He looked awful throwing the ball.
Some of that was play calling. He can’t throw a fade for shit, but it’s pretty clear he hasn’t been taught how to do it. That second pick was ridiculous and just a dumb play call.
There were quite a few dropped passes too.
All in all, he’s okay, but needs to get better. At least he starts, unlike Oregon’s top QB recruit.
I posted in the last thread, what is obvious is that he has a ton of upside both physically and mentally. His talents fit the spread offense. His running is better than his throwing right now.
Have to remember he’s not coming in next year and starting. If MM and SC hold the job until they are seniors, Moran would likely compete for the job in 2019 when he would be a redshirt JR. Project him there and not in the here and now.
GA press conference. It’s a half hour long
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xcFawof77do
Depth chart link:
http://twitter.com/ginamizell/status/638466947353411584
No Ryan Nall. Interesting!
Go Beavs!
Not a neat deal. Anybody have the story?
Arnold is a RS sophomore.
Article re depth chart from D. Moran:
http://www.oregonlive.com/beavers/index.ssf/2015/08/oregon_state_beavers_release_f.html
Deltron above Haskins on depth chart. Henry as #2 Stud LB.
Sweet. I’m not a big Haskins fan.
I bet all of the guys on the depth chart will be getting a good amount of reps (at least on defense). Hollingsworth is a good player with interior and exterior DL experience, and he’s listed third behind Grimble(another guy that will get some good reps assuming he’s healthy?). Another guy from that DE/DT position that I think will be a stud this season is Baker Pritchard. We’re thin as paper at the LB positions but C Nolan-Lewis could fill in if needed on the outside (man this is where Nall could have been helpful as far as depth because he is buried every else he has been).
I trust this staff completely and just because someone’s listed as the starter doesn’t mean that they’ll be getting all of the reps. The 2nd and 3rd string guys will contribute quite a bit this season. That’s football. Next man up!
Go Beavs!
I think even some 4th stringers will get in games. Like Haskins…I can see him getting junk time in the redzone.
I think we’ll see a lot more substitutions all around.
Tanner Sanders could have been helpful to linebacker depth as well. But it was not in the cards.
Lamone Williams not on the depth chart. Seems like he’d be a handful.
Paul Lucas behind Bolden and X Hawkins
Kyle Haley has grown a whole foot since last year. That’s amazing.
That’s what she said.
Warning. Do not have any liquids in your mouth while reading this quote.
BTN football show tonight talking about the new coaches. Host says, “Mike Riley left the comfort of Corvallis because he wanted the challenge of higher expectations.” LOL. You dope, he left because of higher expectations……….at OSU Talk about spin and revisionist history.
I puked a little in my mouth.