21.Nov.2011 Vandy @ Oregon State (East Rutherford)

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Jack

Vanderbilt started the year ranked in the top ten, but they never looked right in their first three games, losing to Cleveland State in a non-contest at home last Sunday. But they look like they’re turning their season around with a little time together on the floor.

Vandy runs a version of the backdoor offense which has the high post setting a lot of topside screens to free their scoring guards, junior John Jenkins (6’4″) and senior Brad Tinsley (6’3″). Jenkins was the scoring leader in the SEC last year with 19.4 ppg, and he hasn’t slowed down this year, averaging 23 ppg thus far.

Vandy is without defensive and board specialist Festus Ezeli, so they will present three active forwards in their front court. Senior Steve Tchiengang (6’9″) mans the middle with good length and solid play. He can step outside to sink the trey, but he is relied upon to do the yeoman’s work inside without Ezeli present. Senior Lance Goulbourne (6’8″) takes the PF minutes with great lateral quickness and a nose for boards. He can score when asked to do so, but he tallies his points by taking high percentage shots run through the offense and making his way to the line for the easy 15-footers. Senior Jeffery Taylor (6’7″) is the athletic forward relied upon by this Vandy team to produce their front court points.

I’ve read more than one preview of this game which suggests that Taylor will be tasked with defending Jared in tonight’s game. But I don’t see this as a possibility given Taylor’s bulk. He’s a tough, smart and athletic wing, but he doesn’t have the skills necessary to tag along with a guard as fast as Jared. I would say the match-up tonight will be Jared on Jenkins, yet another defensive challenge for him. If he can treat Jenkins like he did Mike Moore and J’Covan Brown, then he could be on his way to another big night.

While Vandy starts a lot of experience, they lack said experience on their bench. The frosh duo of Kedren Johnson (6’4″) and Dai-Jon Parker (6’3″) join soph Kyle Fuller (6’1″) in spelling Tinsley and Jenkins and pushing coach Kevin Stallings’ smaller sets at times. There’s more skill in these three than their production thus far would suggest. We can only hope none of them finds their game tonight, because they throw up a bunch of perimeter shots.

Soph F Rod Odom (6’9″) is the only real size coming off the bench, though frosh C Josh Henderson (6’11″) will likely be called upon to counter the Beavs size and depth. Odom is another wing with varying inside/outside skills. But he also has yet to find his comfort zone, relying on his athleticism instead of his head to get shots up.

With all the experience on Vandy’s starting line-up, they tend to control the pace of the game for their own needs. But they are unusually susceptible to turning the ball over this year, especially when hit with an aggressive defense. The frosh and sophs off the bench are actually more security-minded than the starters, but that may just be a function of the time spent on the floor. They also sorely lack an interior defensive presence without Ezeli. One can only assume they will be a different team when he returns.

They have the speed in the backcourt to defend in transition, but I don’t know if they have enough to do it all game long. And the Beavs will be looking to get it out often on this team. The faster Coach Rob forces Stallings to go to his bench, the more likely it is that OSU makes Vandy think itself out of this game.

Despite a late game run which made the score look a little prettier, Vandy did give up when faced with a pressure D in the form of Cleveland State. But, hearing what Stallings was shouting on the sideline, I don’t think they’re about to do the same for the rest of the season. The one thing their experience does do is make runs to end games. And if they are close or leading toward the end, then the Beavs need to work a little extra crunch time magic to seal the win.

This game will be about pace. The Beavs are scoring a bunch of points without production from some of their likely suspects. Vandy is doing the same without bench production. If anyone in the shadows steps up, they can be the difference on the scoring end. The Beavs size, speed, defense and pace all portend bad things for Vandy, but I wouldn’t discount their experience and skill just yet. Vandy has had their let-down game in the non-con schedule. The Beavs haven’t allowed themselves to have one yet. This could be an interesting battle of will versus skill… in either direction.

I honestly don’t know which will win out in this one. There’s a reason Vandy is ranked in the top 20. If the Beavs want to go there themselves, they need to win games like this. Will that pressure make our boys finally lose focus?

I don’t think so.

Beavs 78 – Dores 68


Angry

The Beavs' opponents have been getting progressively stronger. That has allowed their confidence to build slowly as they pass each gradual test. I thought they could play with Texas but not beat them. I've been forced to reassess my (negative) bias, which had carried over from last season. The team we've seen the first four game is the team we expected last year. We were a year early and too anxious. In other words, typical fans.

Now the question is do we buy in and accept the Beavers are this good?

Well, there are troubling aspects. A player like Devon Collier is excellent at creating second chances and getting to the line, but empirical evidence says he misses half those shots. Moreland has the same problem. So, the bigs who can play inside and draw the fouls are leaving double-digit points on the floor. Can they continue to do that and win games? When the opponent is bad or average, yes, but the Beavs (especially the aforementioned bigs) need to shoot 70%+ from the line to win tonight.

The most encouraging aspect thus far has been team chemistry. Guys know their roles and genuinely like one another. They're in it together. The big thing is to not let the success get to their collective heads, and to remain humble and unified.

Jack mentioned Vandy has some legit bigs…that makes me nervous. Beavs haven't gone up against any good centers thus far. The Beavs have an undersized front court. I see Collier and Moreland getting into foul trouble unless they can force the tempo and play a hectic game.

I'm a believer in this team, but I'm not yet a believer they're a top 20 team. No pick tonight because I can't gauge this team yet, but you can probably read between the lines and concluded I'd be (pleasantly) surprised if they win this game and ascend into the top 25. This is the most excited I've been about a hoops game since I began following the team. Beavs have an opportunity to enter the prime time.

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  • angry angry says:
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    I’d also like to add: been very pleased with Joe Burton’s progress. He’s given up on that horrible baseline move, improved passing touch, and hasn’t forced as many passes/turned the ball over as much. Hopefully I didn’t jinx him.

    • ean says:
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      I saw him try it once and he was quickly cut off. I am wondering if teams aren’t scouting him for that move… of course that is opening up the middle of the floor and the passing lanes. Teams might start leaving the baseline open for him again soon.

  • NCAA_viOlation NCAA_viOlation says:
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    Beavs havde been fun to watch so far this season. I really can’t ask for much more than that.

  • Warren says:
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    If we win this game, we could potentially win the rest of the non conference games and start 12-0. I don’t think people realize how big of a game this is for the program.

    • HopefulBeav says:
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      I made a similar comment on a different thread. The problem for the past few years has been losing should-be-wins in the non conference games and as a result our win totals weren’t good enough to get into either big tournament (NCAA or NIT). A win tonight will do wonders for our young team and hopefully keep them fired up to go into Pac 12 play (which looks to be wide open this year).

  • slamadam says:
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    took the words right out of my mouth angry, ive never been this excited about a non conference beaver basketball game. i worry that vandys guard play might be a bit much for nelson, starks and barton. (obviously not cunningham). a 4-0 start isn’t enough for me to expect wins against top 20 talent, free throws and defending the three point line need to get better from my stance

  • Gman says:
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    I agree, I’m undecided but this team has me excited. I won’t be surprised if they win or lose, but it definitely is a bigger game that against Texas.

  • JackBeav says:
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    I hope Vandy’s defense just is what it is… nonexistent. Taylor is their only good defender in the starting five, and Parker and Fuller off the bench are good but young. And Fuller just looks lost on offense when he’s out there.

    Vandy’s going to sit in a zone in this game and try to get us to throw up treys. If Ahmad, Berto and Angus are on, then it’s game over before it begins. There’s no way Vandy stays with us if we match their strength and pull them out of the zone. I just don’t think there’s a match-up they win except for Taylor on Collier… and that one might be fun to watch as well.

    Of course, Joe has been so good at the high post, that they won’t be able to just pack the lane and invite perimeter shooting. But they’re going to try.

    That being said, Vandy can score when they’re not giving the ball away. If we don’t take advantage of their poor defensive habits, we could be in for a long night.

    • helmsley says:
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      Jack,

      Any chance you’ll cover the women’s bb team even a little on Orange Express? I realize folks on this site aren’t that all interested, but Rueck et al. are doing a good job.

  • angry angry says:
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    The free throws have been killer…I feel like we’re leaving 20 points on the floor per night. (Too lazy to look that up).

    • JackBeav says:
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      31-43 against Texas… 18-29 in regulation.

      Vandy shot 63.6% against NC State, and they’re shooting 61.4% on the season. Their worst shooter from the line is their best player, Taylor.

      • angry angry says:
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        So 72%? That’s not bad. What was Collier? He must have been 50% at best, no? Cunningham probably averaged him out. Collier needs to step it up at the line. He has a nice stroke, so I don’t understand his struggles.

        • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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          Joe Burton is shooting 78% from the line so far. If he can shoot in the high 70’s anyone on this team can lol. Collier should improve. Collier and Moreland are really the only guys struggling at the line. They should both improve. They have good shots.

          • angry angry says:
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            Burton’s shot looks much better. He’s even hitting outside shots (2-2 I think?)…he’s up as the most improved player.

  • angry angry says:
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    Rich Rodriquez to Arizona?

    • NCAA_viOlation NCAA_viOlation says:
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      Good, we won’t be the only Pac-12 team losing FCS non-conference games. Seems like a downgrade for Arizona, after seeing how Rodriguez tenure at Michigan turned out.

      • angry angry says:
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        No, it’s a definite upgrade. And an automatic loss for the Beavs since he runs an offense similar to Chip Kelly. Dislike this as a Beaver fan.

        • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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          No chance of it being an automatic loss for the Beavers for AT LEAST the next 3 years. That’s because the Beavers will play Arizona next year and they will be bad. Then the Beavers get to miss Rich Rod until 2015! I really like the scheduling lol

          • bleedsorange says:
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            Matt Scott is a pretty good QB, and he will fit in well with Rich Rod’s offensive scheme for a year giving Rich time to recruit an atheltic kid to run the offense in the future. Those who think this is a downgrade are forgetting how good those WVU teams were. Rich Rod can recruit speed if speed is around him to be recruited. He wasn’t able to find those kids out in Michigan, but there are plenty of them in California and Arizona…

          • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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            Is Matt Scott being redshirted? I know he’s a Senior. There was talk of him being redshirted. Not sure if it was decided he would redshirt.

          • bleedsorange says:
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            If he hasn’t played a snap then he can be redshirted…doesn’t matter if he suits up for every game.

          • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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            I know that already. I wasn’t sure if he played a snap. I don’t think he’s all that good though. Even though he’s a better fit in the Spread Option he seemed kind of average.

          • bleedsorange says:
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            Per the University of Arizona Athetic website, Matt Scott doesn’t have a pass attempt this season and he is listed as 3rd string behind another senior back up. This leads me to believe this will be his redshirt season and he will be back next year as a senior.

      • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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        Rich’s issues at Michigan were basically hiring a shitty defensive coordinator. If he hires a good defensive coordinator, in 3 years Zona will be really good. He will have a rough first year. He runs the Spread Option, however, Arizona doesn’t have a QB who fits into that on the team or committed. He’ll get that type of QB for the 2013 class. By 2014 Zona will be solid. Rich is a really good offensive coach. If he does indeed get a good defensive coordinator Zona will be a factor in the conference.

        • beaverkman beaverkman says:
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          I would say that it will be benefitical for us to play another spread option team. One of the reasons it’s so hard to prepare to UO is that they are one of the few teams in our league that runs, so the more we play or pratice against means the better we will get to defending it.

          • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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            I would agree. Defenses struggle against certain offenses cause they don’t see it a lot. The more the Beavers see the spread option the better they should get. Even Banker can better understand the Spread Option and find a way to slow it up a little. They also could fire Banker and hire a better defensive coordinator That works too.

    • osbeavs says:
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      I love this hire for Zona, hate it for us. They are bringing a legit coach who definitely can attack our weakness. Also, we will have to compete with him for those same athletic WR’s that we seem to land (only high star talent that we regularly land).

      Spot on by all who observe that Michigan had crappy D’s because his offense there was amazing. Denard Robinson was the best player in the country before he got hurt (in Rich Rod’s system). The difference for Rich Rod is that you don’t need a D in the Pac, just an explosive offense. On the upside he may be able to steal some recruits from UO as they will be competing for the same players.

      The downside when programs fire coaches, they have the potential to get better ones which leaves us in the dust.

      • mckalk says:
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        Here is a crazy thought. Any chance Arizona reaches out to Ryan Katz for a one and done? If he graduates, he would be eligible.

        • osbeavs says:
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          I don’t know if he is fast enough to fit in there system but he definitely would be servicable as he is much more accurate than other passers Rich Rod has had in the past.

          Isn’t the NCAA going to get rid of that rule that allows people to transfer as graduate students? IMO that is a wrong move, if a player graduates he/she should be rewarded by being able to transfer to a school of their choice.

          • mckalk says:
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            That’s what I was thinking, as a stop gap and someone who knows the league. I can’t really see him going to Portland State because they run the pistol, I wonder how well he knows Nigel Burton? I would think he would want to go where he has an extremely good chance of starting and can show off his arm one last time for the scouts.

  • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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    I like the Beavers tonight. Their quickness and athleticism will cause Vandy all kinds of problems. Jeffery Taylor is gonna be guarding Jared, I don’t think he will be able to stay with Jared. Cunningham will shoot a lot of free throws tonight. I think Vandy will also throw a zone at the Beavers. This is Joe Burton’s passing will cause problems for Vandy. He should be able to go hi low with Collier for easy buckets inside. I love the way the Beavers attack the zone defenses this year. If Nelson, Cunningham and Starks start hitting their threes consistently they will torch Vandy’s zone.

    Vandy’s John Jenkins and Jeffery Taylor are their key guys. Jenkins can stroke it from downtown. The Beavers have to got to run him off the three point line. Taylor is more of a guy who wants to get to the rim. Beavers will need to have terrific rotation D. He will have some success, but if the Beavers can have terrific rotation D then he will be limited. Boxing out is another key. The Beavers cannot allow offensive rebounds. With the way the Beavers can run, they need to get offensive rebounds and get out in the open court. Also, when the Beavers get to the foul line they need to make their free throws. Can’t let points get away from them.

    Vandy relies so much on threes. If the Beavers limit their threes then they’ll win this game. Hopefully the Beavers stay out of foul trouble. If they do, Brandt, Burton and Collier should all have nice games.

    Starks is a guy who has gotta make some threes. I think he will get some open looks against a zone. If he makes Vandy pay, they may have to come out of their zone and it will open things up for Jared even more.

    I like the Beavers tonight. It will be a back and forth game for about 32 minutes of the game, but then I think the Beavers take control and finish off the Commodores. I got the Beavers winning 84-72

    • angry angry says:
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      Do the Beavs have the D to stop Vandy’s 3s, though? Their interior D has been bad (not boxing out/giving penetration too easily), but their perimeter D isn’t great, either.

      • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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        I think the Beavers have the potential to have terrific perimeter defense. A lot of times guys like Starks are reaching too much, that allows guys to blow past him and get the defense out of position and allows guys to have some open looks. If the Beavers stop reaching so much they’ll be much better defensively. Sometimes the team takes too many risks defensively. I’m okay with taking risks, they just need to be calculated risks. Sometimes they have taken some bad risks and that have put the team in bad spots defensively. I think they’ll get better with that. I expect the defense to be much better tonight.

      • JackBeav says:
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        The stats don’t agree with your assessment of our D. Boxing out may be an issue, but it’s the guards who need to check their men once a shot goes up. Our bigs are pulling double duty when the opposition’s guards are crashing down.

        7 steals, 6 blocks, forcing 23 TO’s and a 15/23 A/TO against Texas… 5, 2 and 7/15 against Hofstra.

        Both teams came out hot in the first half, and the Beavs D shut them down in the second.

  • bleedsorange says:
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    I’m as excited as anyone about this Beaver team, but I’m not expecting a win like some of you are. We need to temper our excitement a little bit and not put too many expectations on this team yet. I still think we’ll end up losing 2-3 games in the nonconference. I know the schedule says we shouldn’t, but sometimes you just play a game where the ball doesn’t go in the hoop and you lose to a lesser team. I will be extremely pleased if we enter the conference slate at 9-3 with a win over Texas on our resume. The Pac-12 is weak this year and I think we can win 11-12 games. That would put us a record of about 20-10, plus another win/loss depending on how the Pac-12 Tourney goes. That will probably leave us on the outside looking in when it comes to th NCAA Tourney, but an NIT invite would definitely be in the realm of possibility. Those are just my expectations, and I’ll certainly be exstatic if the Beavs out do what I think they will do!

    • JackBeav says:
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      9-3 would be a disappointment at this point. I’m wary of Montana. Will Cherry is one helluva baller (another junior out of Oakland). But at least Qvale is gone. Still we played them pretty well last year on the road. Even a loss to them at home would be a disappointment.

      Any losses to anyone not named Vanderbilt will just be an embarrassment from here on out.

  • JackBeav says:
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    Texas and NC State are on in 10 minutes. Michigan handled Memphis in Maui earlier, and Tennessee was giving Duke fits until Rivers decided he was just going to start shooting over them.

  • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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    Link for tonight’s game http://www.firstrowsports.tv/watch/93594/1/watch-(20)-vanderbilt-vs-oregon-state.html

  • RipCity808 says:
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    Sure is nice to see the BEAVS appear in the AP Top 25 rankings, even if it’s in the “Others receiving votes” section. http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/rankings

    Vandy comes into the game not fully loaded with big man, and future NBA 1st rounder Festus Ezeli suspended for accepting illegal benefits, and then injuring his knee at practice. Obviously, we are catching them at the right time, because from watching Ezeli outmuscle SEC opponents last year he would’ve dominated the low block. I think a tremendous matchup will be Jared checking Jenkins, who’s averaging 23 points with 4.3 threes per game. Stallings will repeatedly get Tchiengang, Goulbourne, etc. to set high screens on Jared, so it is a necessity for our bigs to hedge out and chase Jenkins off the 3 point line. If not, we’re in for a long night.

    No doubt, this game will be a high scoring affair. This is the first time since 1990 that the BEAVS have scored at least 80 points in four consecutive games. Tonight will be the fifth.

    OSU 84
    Vandy 80

    • RipCity808 says:
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      According to draftexpress.com’s 2012 mock draft, Ezeli is projected to be the 16th pick, Taylor the 20th, and Jenkins the 28th. All 1st rounders. If I was an NBA GM, I would choose Taylor 1st. He’s got NBA size at 6-7, 225, a respectable outside shot, and can penetrate the lane, draw contact, and get to the line. nbadraft.net indicates Taylor is an “excellent perimeter defender with quick feet and good lateral movement.” This is true against guys his size and general quickness. But, he has yet to face Jared.

      Plain and simple. Flight is too explosive for Taylor. Jared is more than capable of taking him off the dribble. Chasing Jared all over the court will subsequently tire out Taylor, and ultimately adversely affect his offensive game.

  • JackBeav says:
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    Texas at the line with 3:20 left and up 38-28.

    NC State is having the same problems against Texas that we had boxing them out on the offensive boards, but they’re doing it big time against NCSU. And they’re also playing the same poor D on the high screen that they played against Vandy. But J’Covan Brown is just shredding them like they’re standing still.

    • NCAA_viOlation NCAA_viOlation says:
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      Seeing how easily Texas is handling NC State, and how NC State was within 2 pts with 1 minute to go vs Vanderbilt, I’m starting to get excited for tonight’s game and the rest of the preseason. 12-0 prior to Pac-12 play is looking all the more possible. Can’t believe i’m even thinking such a thing.

      • NCAA_viOlation NCAA_viOlation says:
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        and on cue, NC State goes on a 12-0 run, Brown fouls out for Texas, and NC State is right back in this thing. Texas needs to learn how to finish teams off.

      • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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        NC St is within 6 points now. 12-0 run.

        I felt before the year the Beavers had a really good shot at starting 12-0. Won’t be surprised if that’s what happens.

        • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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          Game is now tied at 66 with 5:57 left. NC St on a 19-1 run. Texas really choking this one away

          • JackBeav says:
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            Down 18 and NC State goes on a 32-11 run to end the game. It didn’t help that J’Covan Brown picked up his 4th and mouthed off to get his fifth. Yeah, the call was bogus, but you gotta keep our mouth shut sometimes. Then Holmes picks up his 4th soon after and sits for a long stretch.

            Texas just choked this one away. Credit NC State for taking advantage of it.

  • Beaver Byte says:
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    I see this as a very hard fought game. It would be a remarkable start for OSU to go 5-0 and come out as champions tonight. They have strong team chemistry and are playing with purpose so the Beavers should have their shot. I think this game will be lower scoring then some of our most recent contests. I say whoever is leading going into the final minute takes it around 78-72. Hopefully, after a total team effort the Beavers are the victors and equal a 25 year best start.

    Vandy vs. Oregon St. (Championship) Preview:
    http://beaverbyte.com

  • mckalk says:
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    Amazingly, the Beavs were even getting some love nationally on a SIRIUS sports channel I was listening to. Of course, one of the hosts was Bruce Pearl (that made me laugh). Anyway, they did not think Vandy had anyone who could guard Jared, so we shall see.

  • Ronix1080 Ronix1080 says:
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    I think the media will start showing Beavs hoops a lot of love if we are able to knock off Vandy. It’s a perfect feel good story that they will latch onto. Coach Rob being related to Obama, once proud program became a doormat and now is back, playing exciting basketball, etc etc… If I had one wish it would be for the Beavs to play well enough to host a Prime Time game that Brings Dicky V to town as an announcer.

  • ZackBeav says:
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    Off Topic: Arizona hires Rich Rod. Will be interesting to see him run Zona considering they already run some of the spread offense.

  • CraigBeav says:
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    Let’s go Beavs!!!

  • HopefulBeav says:
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    Wow there is like nobody in the crowd lol

  • CraigBeav says:
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    What’s up with the travelling?

  • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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    Starks needs to start making shots

  • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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    Burton and Brandt have been really bad early on

  • mckalk says:
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    Whittenberg is basically repeating everything he said last game, I guess he knows ESPN3 does not have that many viewers!

  • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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    Starks heating up from deep

  • VN:F [1.9.22_1171]
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    Love that Starks and Cunningham put those shots away and put the team back on track after the commercial break. The Beavs had been getting sloppy before that. Nice to see guys with ice in their veins.

  • angry angry says:
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    No complaints so far. Good start.

  • CraigBeav says:
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    Impressed that our boys are being parsimonious with their fouls.

    • mckalk says:
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      Kind of porous inside D, but I don’t mind letting the guy just dunk and get it over with, why compound by fouling?

  • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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    Gotta go with the 3 guard lineup, IMO. OSU’s big guys getting burned by Taylor

  • gotmilk says:
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    Starks scores 8 in the last two minutes and cr subs for him.. Goddamn that is f-ing dumb

  • angry angry says:
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    Beavs give up too many undefended drives down the lane…think that was on Brandt…

    • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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      That started on Brandt. He didn’t keep Taylor in front of him, then I think it was Burton who didn’t rotate and stop Taylor’s penetration.

  • beavers4life says:
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    Has there been 1 replay that involves OSU scoring or getting fouled?! This is sooo dumb!!! I want to see the LAST OSU play that was made not the LAST VANDY play!! GRRR

    • VN:F [1.9.22_1171]
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      I’m disappointed about that too. It’s not as though it’s a close game or anything.

      • beavers4life says:
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        lol nice sarcasm. Also, it’s not like OSU fans WON’T be watching their bball team that has FINALLY gone 4-0 for the first time in how many seasons?!

        • beavers4life says:
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          ya, they aren’t Vandy honks at all. I think everyone is Anti-Oregon State when it comes to ESPN.

  • beavers4life says:
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    Also, Why don’t the players follow their shots?! Cunningham is the ONLY one who follows the shots! So annoying!

  • VN:F [1.9.22_1171]
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    Huge improvement in the transition offense from last year for OSU. They’re good at getting the turnovers. With a little more polish on the finishing end, this game wouldn’t be nearly as close as it is.

  • angry angry says:
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    Beavs need to drive it more…too three point happy

  • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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    Man, these announcers are getting annoying. 30 ft? Yeah, okay.

  • OneEyedKing says:
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    This “Starks dribbles around for 25 seconds before jacking up a bad 3” offense is awesome.

    And every time we switch into the 1-3-1, we start giving up tons of points.

  • angry angry says:
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    Westchester County is nice.

  • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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    Starks needs to stop dribbling so much. He needs to start getting into the paint and setting up some teammates

  • OrangeExpress says:
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    8 OSU turnovers in 10 min – have to get that under control to have any chance

  • gotmilk says:
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    Starks misses two in a row since returning. Hey CR when you have a hot shooter feed him the ball not put him on the pines. All show no substance that is cr.

  • mckalk says:
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    This is a dumb lineup out there.

  • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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    McShane comes in and turns it over twice immediately. Why does he play more than 3 minutes a game again?

  • VN:F [1.9.22_1171]
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    McShane turns it over. (I actually had this comment ready in a second tab before the game started)

  • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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    These officials need to let the teams play. They’re calling the whistle WAY too much

  • beavers4life says:
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
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    Also, Why don’t the players follow their shots?! Cunningham is the ONLY one who follows the shots! So annoying!

  • OneEyedKing says:
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    Starks jacking up more dumb jumpers. Awesome.

    Run the damn offense through Cunningham, not Iverson 2.0

    • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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      The last three I had no issue with. He was open and has hit a couple threes. Just the fade away jumpers have bothered me. Those aren’t good shots. They need to get Jared more involved.

  • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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    These announcers are awful. At least they don’t get as homerish as announcers are for Duke, but they’re still pretty bad.

  • OneEyedKing says:
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    Luckily we’re trading turnovers. This looks like a really, really even game though.

  • mckalk says:
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    The Beavers are not playing very good, yet still led. Plus they look way more athletic than Vandy. They need a dagger three point shooter though, it’s time to give Murphy a couple of minutes.

  • NCAA_viOlation NCAA_viOlation says:
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    UCLA playing in the Maui invitational right now vs “Chaminade”? Never even heard of that team. ESPN doesn’t even have a page for them. Regardless, Chaminade is playing them even in the first 4 minutes. 4-4. Very ugly game so far.

    • VN:F [1.9.22_1171]
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      Chaminade is a high school here in St. Louis.

    • GOBEAVS says:
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      chaminade is the college that hosts the maui invitational

    • mckalk says:
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      Chaminade, my man? Greatest upset in NCAA history when they beat #1 ranked Virginia and Ralph Sampson.

      • NCAA_viOlation NCAA_viOlation says:
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        I’m too new to college ball I guess. Anyway, they’re up on UCLA with 6 minutes to go in the 1st half. 28-25

      • JackBeav says:
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        I remember that game like it was yesterday. Chaminade had nobody taller than 6’4″ on that squad, and they just terrorized UVA’s backcourt all game long.

  • VN:F [1.9.22_1171]
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    OSU is playing really well on defense, apart from a couple of bad possessions. They need to move the ball around more on offense. Lots of good focus and hustle, which I love. Just need to play smarter on offense.

  • angry angry says:
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    Why is everyone ragging on the announcers? They’ve been very pro-Beav and kind. Seem fairly knowledgeable, too.

    • Gman says:
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      Yeah, I dunno

    • brownale9000 says:
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      Yeah, I’m fine with the announcing as well.

    • VN:F [1.9.22_1171]
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      I agree. The production was weird in the opening minutes, with so few replays of OSU plays or fouls OSU drew.

    • OneEyedKing says:
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      OSU is NOT an offense-based team; has he SEEN us run the Princeton? It’s ugly. Our defense has been much better than our offense, for quite a while.

      Andy Katz should have taken the night off, or at least quit drinking gravel before games.

  • mckalk says:
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    Burton get your GD head in the game. Anyone notice he tried the baseline move earlier and had to throw the ball of off the opponents leg? Joe is genetically programmed to do three stupid plays per game.

  • beavers4life says:
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    These announcers should stick to doing what they do best, calling a basketball game…not use football references. That was such a stupid foul! Also, CR needs to not take guys out when they’re hot! That’s what really killed the momentum.

  • Mud&Sticks Mud&Sticks says:
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    I think it’s good that the team is getting some early championship playoff experience.

    It looks to me like they’re tight because 1) they’re playing a good team and 2) because it is a championship game. Considering all of that I’m impressed with how well they’re doing.

  • brownale9000 says:
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    For the first time since 1990, we look like a tournament team.

  • OrangeExpress says:
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    from what i understand mcshane hustles in practice, and as an example of crediting a strong work ethic, coach rob gives him some minutes. as a result, mcshane will show his appreciation by giving back to coach rob some game losses

  • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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    Overall it was a good first half. Taylor and Jenkins played solid and the Beavers are tied with Vandy. Beavers have also turned it over a bunch and had some stagnant offensive possessions. Aside from a couple defensive breakdowns the Beavers have played well defensively. If the Beavers play like that defensively in the second half and stop turning it over they should pull away.

  • gotmilk says:
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    Wow what a genius move burton, stupid coach has stupid players.

    • brownale9000 says:
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      All teams and all players make mistakes. Dumb teams don’t start off 4-0 and play a ranked team to a standstill in the championship game of a tournament 3 timezones away.

      Realism is fine. Mindless negativity is silly and annoying.

  • slamadam says:
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    listening to andy katz is brutal right now. decent first half though. vanderbilt is a better team than texas. brandt needs to do a better job defending the baseline. it would be nice if someone besides starks could hit a three before the end of the night. (hes the only guy to make one in the first half unless im forgetting.)

  • OrangeExpress says:
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    is gotmilk a duck?

  • gotmilk says:
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
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    if mcshane plays only because he hustles what could the possible explanation be for playing those idiot seniors last year. cr cannot lower the boom when he has to, and it would have cost him his job at a real university

  • mckalk says:
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    Oregon St. is NOT an excellent outside shooting team yet, Mr.Whittenberg.

  • osbeavs says:
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    Starks is 2/5 on 3’s with 1 attempt by JC and two by Brandt

    • osbeavs says:
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      Overall, I would like to see someone else makes 3’s also but I think the offense needs to run less through Starks first. He is 2/9 on shots so far… That low shooting percentage is killing us, I believe everyone else is at least .333

  • mckalk says:
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    Shannon Dougherty must have blown through her money and apparently does not get much residuals from 90210!

  • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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    Brandt is so hesitant to do anything offensively

  • beavers4life says:
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    These refs SUCK!!!

  • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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    I’m losing patience with Brandt.

  • VN:F [1.9.22_1171]
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    Horrible call. I forget the OSU player but his feet were set and he was outside the circle.

  • angry angry says:
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    Vandy is the better team, they’ll win. Beavs have no inside game, relying way too much on perimeter shots (that they’re not making).

    • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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      Way too early to say who will win

    • beavers4life says:
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      Weren’t you and JackBeav saying that the game plan would be to shoot outside shots because we aren’t strong on the inside? Or did I misread your pre-game write-ups?

  • OneEyedKing says:
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    JOE!!!!!!!!!!!

    YOU FUCKING SUCK.

    Missed 2 shots, gives up 2 blocks. What garbage.

  • beavers4life says:
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    CR should call a TO soon to stop momentum of the Vandy team.

  • mckalk says:
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    Can’t they run something where Cunningham can post up? Standing out on the wing, is not getting anything.

  • Mud&Sticks Mud&Sticks says:
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    It seems like CR needs to tell Starks to quit casting off

    • OneEyedKing says:
      VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
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      Starks is Allen Iverson. Just jacks up shots, even if it hurts the team.

      Get the ball to Cunningham, our BEST OFFENSIVE PLAYER. And then tell him to go make some plays.

      Did I miss the gameplan of “Stand around and watch Starks jack up shots”? It seems like it.

      Also, on D we NEVER help when someone penetrates. Our post players are stuck to their men, I don’t get it.

  • BeaverBeliever21 says:
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
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    I think the Beavers have to go with a Starks-Cunningham-Nelson-Collier-Moreland lineup

    • Mud&Sticks Mud&Sticks says:
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      I think they’re better when Brandt is in there.

      • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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        No way. Brandt is turning it over constantly, not rotating well on defense and he’s so hesitant to do anything offensively. He seems to have his confidence go down as soon as he misses a couple shots and then will stop shooting

        • Mud&Sticks Mud&Sticks says:
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          I’d say we’re watching different games. Parallel universes perhaps?

  • GOBEAVS says:
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    welcome back 2010 beavs!

  • HopefulBeav says:
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    Can we please try to get Cunningham involved?

  • beavers4life says:
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    I think they’re in panic mode now and does any OSU team make halftime adjustments?!

    • HopefulBeav says:
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      Seriously.

    • brownale9000 says:
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      “does any OSU team make halftime adjustments?!”

      You mean like Oregon State hoops being down to Texas by 5 at the half and then winning by 5?

      Or like Oregon State football being up by 3 to Washington and winning by 17?

      I get it…watching sports is frustrating. But if you can’t keep perspective, maybe it’s not for you?

      • beavers4life says:
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        look at the losses,not the wins. That’s when the adjustments were not sound. Hence why they lost the game.

  • OneEyedKing says:
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    And again, nobody anywhere NEAR to help when they penetrate. What the hell is that?

  • brownale9000 says:
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    What’s with the NBA continuation?

  • OneEyedKing says:
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
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    Horrid D by Roberto.

  • BeaverFever says:
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    Clear block

  • VN:F [1.9.22_1171]
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    Ridiculous goaltending call. The ball wasn’t heading down.

  • BeaverFever says:
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    We would be getting taken apart if it wasn’t for collier

  • VN:F [1.9.22_1171]
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    Glad to see the Beavs are working to penetrate more.

  • mckalk says:
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    Beavs are not making that extra pass today…to use a playground phrase, Starks is kind of being a ball hog tonight.

  • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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    Beavers are chipping away.

  • OneEyedKing says:
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    This is what a real offense looks like, btw. Continual cuts and screens. They don’t just stand around the perimeter and hope someone gets open, they MAKE openings.

    God I hate Princeton.

  • BeaverBeliever21 says:
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
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    Collier really coming up big in the second half. If the Beavers can get some defensive stops and finish better inside they’ll be fine.

  • BeaverFever says:
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
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    Moreland aka the pentagon has got some passing ability. If he can develop anything offensively he will be dangerous.

  • mckalk says:
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    Moreland is a freshmen right? They called him a sophomore at the start. When is gets an offensive identity, he is going to be unbelievable.

  • HopefulBeav says:
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
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    On a positive note it’s nice that we are not just a one man show. Even without much contribution from Cunningham, Collier is keeping us in it.

  • BeaverFever says:
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
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    Can’t shoot a free throw for shit. They should go hack a shaq on us.

    • VN:F [1.9.22_1171]
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      OSU is shooting .750 so far this game.

      • BeaverFever says:
        VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
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        Damn, we can sure get our hands on the ball. If we could stop the penetration a little we could be a very strong defensive team.

      • brownale9000 says:
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        pfft…you can use statistics to prove anything even remotely true.

  • BeaverFever says:
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
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    Finally berto drives to the rack.

  • VN:F [1.9.22_1171]
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    How many inside passes have been lost or almost lost? Need more touch on those.

  • OneEyedKing says:
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
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    Atrocious transition D, and Joe immediately comes in and turns the ball over(Way too hard a pass to Jared).

    But our D by itself gives us 4-6 point runs. Still think we’re an “Offense” team, announcers?

  • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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    Beavers only down 4 despite turnovers and some poor defense in the second half. Really like where things are at. If they can bear down on defense and stop allowing easy looks they should gain control.

  • mckalk says:
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    It’s kind of a statement game, I wish Cunningham was having a better game, but it’s also impressive that the Beavs are still in it.

  • VN:F [1.9.22_1171]
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    Moreland is on top of the second chances.

  • BeaverFever says:
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
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    Button is a waste of a big body

  • NCAA_viOlation NCAA_viOlation says:
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    intentional foul if i ever saw one. guy didn’t come close to making a play on the ball…

    • OneEyedKing says:
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      Definitely was. Do they have Clear Path Foul in college? Because he was definitely behind Jared.

  • OneEyedKing says:
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
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    Burton is playing like crap. His defense has ALWAYS been bad, but bad D+no rebounding+turnovers is just atrocious. Might as well just put McShane back in.

    • BeaverBeliever21 says:
      VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
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      I don’t care how bad things are. It is never to a point where bringing in McShane makes sense.

  • BeaverFever says:
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    Yeah, buy gold at its highest, damn I hate those commercials

  • osbeavs says:
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
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    Statistically, we are winning in every category (other than points with a slightly lower shooting percentage). We have less fouls and turnovers and more steals, assists and blocks. Virtually even on rebounds. They have just made more 3 pointers. The difference is some poor offensive execution and too many jacked up 3’s. This is a good basketball team win or lose.

    • VN:F [1.9.22_1171]
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      Vanderbilt is 7-18 from behind the arc, OSU is 2-12.

      • osbeavs says:
        VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
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        I think that is the most important stat of all of this too. IMO, 3’s are exceedingly difficult to make and nearly random as even great shooters go cold. The rest of the stats tell me that we are still a good basketball team, cut down on some mental errors and less shots by Starks and we win this game 70% of the time all other things being equal.

  • OneEyedKing says:
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    Barton is getting Roberto’s minutes. Interesting.

  • BeaverFever says:
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    A loss might be a good motivator at this point in the year

    • NCAA_viOlation NCAA_viOlation says:
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      Thanks for the loser’s mentality. A win would be an even bigger motivator.

  • OneEyedKing says:
    VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
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    Dear god, Joe is a waste of space.

  • BeaverFever says:
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    Your a tool, even the best teams lose games

    • NCAA_viOlation NCAA_viOlation says:
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      “my” a tool?

      • BeaverFever says:
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        WTF

        • BeaverFever says:
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          Sorry, you’re a fucking tool. My damn smartphone takes liberties for me mr winner’s mentality

          • BeaverFever says:
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            Did I forget to capitalize something now? Isn’t this a fan page? You probably correct the grammar on the bathroom walls.

          • NCAA_viOlation NCAA_viOlation says:
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            you’re not very nice. just trying to say how can we expect the team to not give up, when we as fans already are?

          • BeaverFever says:
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            Sorry, I’m a little fired up today. I know what you’re saying but I think their can be positive results despite who scores more points.

  • VN:F [1.9.22_1171]
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    Starks has gotten better over the course of the game.

  • OneEyedKing says:
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    And Starks jacks up the jumper. Again.

  • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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    Man, Joe Burton didn’t even try to get to the shooter

    • OneEyedKing says:
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      Or rebound, or play D. He does nothing. Except take UGLY 15 foot hook shots.

  • BeaverFever says:
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    Win or lose I am happy with the way this team fights. I’d rather have a loss now than in four months.

  • mckalk says:
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    Moreland and Collier are a nice frontline. Burton should take note, nice soft pass to Collier underneath. Moreland just plays smart.

  • Mud&Sticks Mud&Sticks says:
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    Thought I was watching a volleyball game there for a minute.

  • OneEyedKing says:
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    Joe gets the ball for 15 seconds, we don’t score that possession. Shocking. HE DOES NOTHIGN!!

  • Mud&Sticks Mud&Sticks says:
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    Oh shit they’re going back to clearing out the key and letting someone go one on one.

  • Mud&Sticks Mud&Sticks says:
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    Beavs are shooting like they’re running out of gas.

  • OneEyedKing says:
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    Moreland 0-2 on FTs, including an AIRBALL.

  • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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    I love Moreland as a player but you can’t have him on the floor right now. Really bad free throw shooter.

  • VN:F [1.9.22_1171]
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    I’m frustrated with Starks jacking up threes, but he played a solid game otherwise. He just needs to play smarter.

  • BeaverFever says:
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    What a shot. Don’t know why he faded away on spud web though.

  • OneEyedKing says:
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    Starks finally hits a jumper. He was 4-17 at one point. Just inexcusable.

  • mckalk says:
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    Would have to be the bastard from my wife’s hometown, LOL!

  • OneEyedKing says:
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    We call a TO and don’t get the ball at halfcourt? That is a horrid fucking rule.

  • BeaverFever says:
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    Nice no call on the final shot

    • OneEyedKing says:
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      Refs swallow their whistle at the wrong time. Notice we got into the penalty, and the fouls just dried up.

  • brownale9000 says:
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    Last year, we would have lost this game by 15-20 points.

    I stand by my assessment, this is a tournament team.

  • angry angry says:
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    Didn’t like that last play call. Beavs were respectable…played a heck of a game. I was thinking that Burton foul at the end of the first half (with .06) could come back to kill them…

    Beavs FT shooting did them in, too. That’s their biggest weakness, defensive rebounding/boxing out is fairly weak, too.

    Semi-heartbreaking loss, but I’m psyched to see the next game and a run through the rest of the OOC schedule.

    • slamadam says:
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      definitly had enough chances. remember moreland missed two that wouldve tied the game, plus vandy opened the second half on a 10-1 run. a game like this can be a good thing though.

  • Mud&Sticks Mud&Sticks says:
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    Still not convinced CR can coach. Recruit – Yes. Coach – ??

  • OneEyedKing says:
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    Our offense was just atrocious, almost all game. Seriously, giving the ball to Joe and letting him dribble around 5 feet behind the 3-point line is a shit system. Just shit.

    Jared was either not aggressive enough, or wasn’t involved enough. Hard to tell which. But it hurt our team a TON to rely on Starks creating offense.

    Our defense will keep us in games, but dear god, how do we score points?

  • presleydog says:
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    got hosed on that no call at the end.

  • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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    Positive signs even in the loss. Vandy played relatively well and needed a shot with under 5 seconds left to beat the Beavers. The Beavers nearly won the game on a night in which they went 2 of 2 of 13 from three and a night when Jared struggled all night. Beavers had the edge in turnovers but allowed too many uncontested shots. They’ll learn from this. Tough way to lose but they’ll get much better.

  • HopefulBeav says:
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    Angry called it. It came down to us missing clutch free throws.

  • ean says:
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    You just got to make shots.

  • OneEyedKing says:
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    Jared missed a few FTs, Moreland went 0-2 with about a minute left.

    Roberto didn’t play for about the last 10 minutes. Interesting decision.

    • JackBeav says:
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      Yeah, the FT’s were killer.

      • JackBeav says:
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        But some weird TO’s were also killer. Vandy got 70% of the calls tonight. That’s what a top 25 am gets I guess.

      • angry angry says:
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        What was with the final play call? An out of control desperation drive? I’d rather see them fly down the court, jack up a 3, and try for a tip in (if it missed). 4.5 seconds is probably just enough time to do that.

        • JackBeav says:
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          Yeah, or if someone trailed Jared’s drive and he dropped it off for an open look….

          These are things we get to learn to do against the top teams instead of doing the same against UIC two years ago… but dribbling the ball off a foot. There were questionable moments here and there, but those moments won’t likely be repeated.

  • JackBeav says:
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    Last year we would have lost this game by 40 to 50.

    That was a great game by any standard… except the “W” standard. Stallings pulled out all the defensive tricks in his bag to contain Cunningham all game, and Starks and Collier stepped up. I would have liked to see Angus on the perimeter more often. Was he hurt in the first half? He looked gimpy after one play, and his time was limited after that.

    Our team is for real people. They could have mailed it in and moved on to an easy remainder of a non-con schedule. But they fought back to give themselves a chance. It just didn’t go our way tonight. That game should give us some consideration from the pollsters next week. They’ve shown grit and determination in the face of adversity against two name schools in hoops.

    And we’re only going to get better as the season wears on.

    • HopefulBeav says:
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      Completely agree. It’s tough when you know you could have won but I’ll take that effort any day. I think we’ll make some serious noise in the Pac 12 this year especially with Arizona, UCLA, and Washington all looking very questionable.

  • waggle says:
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    Starks came out of that final timeout shaking his head and he did not look happy. And the final play was kind of sloppy. I do not get this crap of Burton dribbling around the top of the key- posting up at the top of key and looking for someone cutting to the basket is his game- poor coaching down the stretch IMHO.

    • OneEyedKing says:
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      I hope Starks was angry because his man hit the game-winning shot, NOT because he knew Jared was getting our last shot. But I don’t know, and that scares me a bit.

  • OrangeExpress says:
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    very realistic shot at an 11-1 record going into pac-12 play, i’ll take it.

  • osu2008 says:
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    To lose by two in a game that could have gone either way all night is tough, but this is a great start to the season and a refresher from the hell that the football program has put the fans through this year. Looking forward to watching them on Saturday on the Internet!

  • angry angry says:
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    Quote from Darius Powe:

    http://blog.oregonlive.com/beavers/2011/11/4-star_wr_talks_about_his_visi.html

    • BeaverFever says:
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      Liked OSU but not enough to commit. Like the ugly looking chick with great personality.

    • OneEyedKing says:
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      Because what we really need is another receiver, right? Right?

      I’m all for grabbing talent wherever you can, but we had like 5 WRs last class, and 2 more so far(one will probably play safety though). That’s a lot of talent in one place, especially when we don’t ever play 4 or 5 WR sets.

  • Warren says:
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    We need Vandy to dominate the rest of the year. if we are on the bubble come tourney selection time, a 2 point loss won’t look that bad to a team like Vandy especially if they win a lot of games.

  • mckalk says:
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    Angry has talked about coaching versus talent. Craig has an opportunity to figure out some half court sets that will be effective against tougher competition. I saw a lot of last year in the half court, granted with better talent.
    One example, I saw was that Cunningham had the ball on the wing with an open baseline to the basket and he didn’t even look for it, he just swung the ball back around to Burton at the top of the key as the shot clock ran down.
    Teams are going to play conservative because they know that they will lose an open court battle with this team, so the Beavs have to run effective sets and knock down enough threes to keep the defense honest.
    On the plus side, they didn’t even play that great of game and could have easily beaten a Top 25 team. There is a huge upside.

    • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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      Nelson attacked a couples times for easy scores in the same situation in which Cunningham passed. I felt Nelson was playing alright. Didn’t understand why he played so little tonight.

  • sparkyd73 says:
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    Good game. I would say this is the first game lost because of missed free throws. Nice game, who would have thought Jared scores so low and the team loses with 4.5 seconds. Tighten up a few things and this team is very good.

  • BeavMonkey says:
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    That game was close, and I see why a lot of people are optimistic.

    I think watching it made me high on our players, and not so high on our coach. Some poor player substitution calls.

    I am not convinced on the 11-1. I think you all are a bit optimistic. Our players played at their highest level today despite any difficulties. As we know is the case with beaver athletics, this is not something that can be counted on week after week.

    • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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      I’m a little annoyed at the thought that the Beavers players will have some sort of letdown cause other Beaver teams I have. This is a different team. I think they will go 11-1 in the nonconference. No team left has guys quite as good as Jeffery Taylor and John Jenkins in the nonconference slate. Also, rarely will Cunningham struggle like he did tonight.

    • JackBeav says:
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      That was not nearly the Beavs highest level. It’s not even the highest level they’ve played this year. There is so much talent on this team, but little of it has been realized as of yet. That they play so well together while so many pieces are missing is just amazing. Right now, the whole is greater than the sum of all the parts. If that remains constant over this season, then the whole will be pretty damn impressive at the end of the season.

  • Beavocalypse says:
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    Happy with the effort. Not happy with missed ft’s, sloppy d earlier in second half, and Starks doing his impression of Calvin Haynes. CR is average.

  • osu2008 says:
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    Might I add something about identity. From the looks of it, I can see that this team had an identity before the season even began, something the football team hasn’t been able to figure out yet. These guys are extremely close and get along with one another, which is something that I haven’t seen in 20+ years since I started following the program. It shows on the court with their unselfish play.

    I think Starks looked pissed because he let Tinsley score, not because Jared was going to get the last shot. Last year, we would have seen the Beavs get run out of the gym. Not having the four dimwits from Jay John’s era has been a big relief. I’m not worried about the chemistry. They just need to continue to work together, play hard, and go out with a mentality that they can beat anyone on any given night. As Jim Harbaugh, a coach that I admire very much would say, “Creulty with Character.”

  • beaverkman beaverkman says:
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    I was pleased with the effort, thought they showed good grit and played gutty and had a shot at the end to win. I was pleased with Collier and Moreland as they really fought for every possession. Obviously, Moreland’s two missed free throws were crucial, however Cunningham the most sure shooting free thrower missed two in the second half as well.

    I thought FT’s and turnovers cost us the game. Starks shows good glimpses, but he only looks to score he has to develop his passing game. He made a couple of big shots, but also missed some, I would say I would want him to not shoot unless he takes all the way to the rack, or gets a three within the movement of the offense.

    Love how Cunningham plays the passing lanes, he really needs a nickname since he’s going to break “the Gloves” steal record.

    The second unit needs to provide more of a spark, you would think Roberto would be a good fit there, and maybe its because he is not yet healthy? We could use a better 3 pointer production.

    Overall, I am excited about the the team, we shall see if they can avoid any letdowns like they have shown in the past. With a focused team they might pull off 11-1.

    • helmsley says:
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      I haven’t looked at play-by-play scoring, but it seemed that Vanderbilt kept hitting 3s and the Beavers were scoring 2s and missing lots of free throws and the Beavs still kept up. Gutsy!

  • beavers4life says:
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    Just purchased the Orange Pride pack for 5 games. You have to pick 2 non-con games so that’s fine i guess, but I’m going to the Jan 5th CAL game, Feb 12th Washington game, and the Feb 26th Civil War game. I’m excited! I’ve been wanting to get to a few games! πŸ™‚ Perhaps baseball too depending if I get a different job and my job situation as well. GO BEAVS!!!

  • beavers4life says:
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    So I’m watching the replay of the Washington vs. OSU game, and I got reminded of how I took my 19 year old cousin who has played football, basketball, and baseball in high school and he had never been to a college football game before, and it was against BYU he came and he had a really good time on his trip. He thought the first down “chant” was pretty cool, he liked the atmosphere and enjoyed the fan atmosphere. So really, the only thing that would make it better is to tear down the West side and mirror the East side, but then I remembered how poor we are because of how bad we are on the field. So it was a good thought until reality sunk into my head.

  • steveEbeaver says:
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    I didn’t tune in until there were 2 min left in the first half so I missed most of the 3 launch party which statistically didn’t go very well. I was concerned that Burton’s foul with 0.6 left in the half might come back to haunt them. Their 16 steals kept them in the game and their FT shooting lost it. CR said a couple of games back that he doesn’t understand their troubles at the line because they’re working on it in practice and they’re hitting them. After Vandy came out in the second half with the 8-0 run this team could’ve folded like last years team but they didn’t. I agree that this team looks like a real basketball team. Hallelujia, it’s been a long time.

  • Gman says:
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    Don’t worry about this loss, we are still young and it will be a good season. Just imagine next year as well πŸ™‚

  • osbeavs says:
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    I stand by my earlier comments that this is a pretty damn good basketball team. What I really like about this team is that they still have a lot of room to grow, we are not even close to our potential. We beat Vandy on turnovers, steals, blocks and assists while barely losing in rebounding. Unfortunately we were 2-14 while Vandy went 7-19 from behind the arc. That was honestly the difference in the game (besides the obvious FT misses). I personally feel that 3’s are inconsistent enough that this game goes our way 70% time.

    We will really find out about this teams grit if they go back to the grind stone and work on their deficiencies. Unfortunately, I think that Burton will continue to be up and down throughout the season, our team will just have to survive that. What we need is for the rest of the team to be able to pick up the slack when Cunningham has bad nights (3 of 9 tonight) or gets shut down. The only thing that cannot happen is for Starks to play like he did tonight. IMO he is the reason we lost (6-20, 2-9 on 3’s), the guy cannot keep jacking up shots, especially when they aren’t going in.

    • mckalk says:
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      Does anyone know why Murphy is not part of the rotation? A lot of talk leading up to this season pointed to him being a solid contributor. Is Barton getting his minutes, McShane? I’m not sure where he fits in, but he has a very nice stroke and I know he has tremendous athletic ability. The Beavs really need a “pure” spot up 3 point shooter to add to the mix, Murphy seems like he fits the bill. The only thing I can think of is that his defense is not where CR wants it.

      • osbeavs says:
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        I haven’t been on the CR bandwagon but this season may change my mind. My biggest criticism is his substitution pattern. I felt like he was way too quick to pull guys in the past (I much prefer the Phil Jackson method of letting guys play through their mistakes, at least for a bit). I think that PT for McShane and lack of PT for Murphy may be a part of the larger substitution pattern problem. He obviously has a great ability to recruit (spot talent and land it) but what he does with it is suspect.

        Regarding that need for the pure shooter, you are spot on. Hopefully we can get that going.

      • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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        I hope Murphy plays more. McShane getting more time than him makes no sense. McShane is two inches taller but really adds nothing. He’s a bad passer, doesn’t really do a whole lot defensively, turnover machine and can’t shoot. He hustles and brings energy but that’s worth maybe 3 minutes a night. Murphy can help stretch the floor with his shooting. He also has the athletic ability to do a lot of damage on the offensive and defensive boards. I think he should get around 12-14 minutes a night. He could hit a couple triples and bring some energy and scoring off the bench. I would like to see a Nelson-Cunningham-Murphy-Collier-Moreland lineup at some point. With that lineup there would be solid defense, shooting, slashing ability and ability to score down low with Collier. I think there would be more ball movement. Nelson doesn’t pound the rock for 20 seconds of the shot clock like Starks has a tendency to do.

        I saw a much better Roberto Nelson last night. His ankle is not 100% by any means but he looked better. He was the only Beaver guard who was actually attacking Vandy’s defense and getting to the rim in the half court sets. I felt he should have played down the stretch. Nelson has also been making better decisions. His defense is just okay, that needs to be improved, but it wasn’t like Starks was playing shut down defense.

        I would like more Nelson and Murphy. Also, I would like Brandt to be consistent. He seems very shaky. His hesitance constantly is concerning.

        • angry angry says:
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          My only guess is Murphy is a defensive liability…nothing else makes sense. McShane is decent on the offensive glass and decent at D.

          • mckalk says:
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            That’s what I thought and it may be true, but I found a quote last night (and now can’t find the link) where CR was praising his ability as a defender. I think the penetration and dish out for the spot up three could really be deadly with Murphy because the speed of Cunningham and Starks.

  • RipCity808 says:
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    Proud of our boys for fighting til the end. This team personifies heart and hustle. Jared came within 1 steal of once again tying the OSU single game steals record of 8. Jenkins is one of the purest scorers in the nation and Jared completely shut him down. Once Jared subbed out, I remember Jenkins hitting two consecutive shots on Berto. Probably why Berto only played 14 minutes in what I thought was his most efficient game so far this season (2-3, 4 points, and ZERO to’s). I noticed in the 2nd half when none of our bigs could contain Taylor that Jared started guarding him. Although Taylor is a future NBA 1st round selection and has a huge size advantage on Jared, Flight took him out of game. Forced him into bad shots and stole the ball a couple of times. Hands down, Jared is one of the best defenders in the nation.

    Tough loss against a future tourney team. But, our players are scrappers. They fight til the end, and boy, are they fun to watch. Hopefully this game will be a tremendous learning experience, we stay grounded and hungry, and we only get stronger from here.

  • rsteve503 rsteve503 says:
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    I hear the criticisms, and some are surely valid.

    But the bottom line is, we came within a shot of beating Vandy, a top 25 team, and that effort on a difficult road trip. I expect some of the bad play was due to fatigue.

    I hope they continue to play hard even when behind. The scrappiness is an essential part of winning. Hell, if just a couple threes had dropped, its a win!

    • helmsley says:
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      Fatigue. Just thinking what these kids do is exhausting. I hope they’re eating well.

  • JackBeav says:
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    Things to remember about this team and this year…

    That two point loss was to a top 20 team. They’re a top five team with their C, and I think we still play them tough. Hell, if they’re full strength and we’re firing on half our cylinders we still give them this kind of run.

    Like I said before, this isn’t a two point loss to UIC after dribbling the ball out of bounds. This is two teams playing their fifth games in ten days (11 for Vandy) and away from home. If all you like is sport, then this was a helluva game. It wasn’t always pretty, but it wasn’t ugly ball either. You could see the underlying talent on both teams within the ebb and flow of the game.

    We just weren’t quite as polished as they were. They’re an old team who have been playing together forever. They’re where we will be next year and for the years after that. But we also showed that we’re “this close” to being there now.

    The shots will fall, and this team will take off. You’ve seen it happen with other teams. Don’t let the minutia of the moment obscure the big picture.

    Think of it this way. If our football team played as well as a team and had half the grit and determination our hoops team has, then I wouldn’t be apathetic toward them, win or lose. I would match their resolve as a fan.

    The shots going up were mostly good shots. The Beavs were taking shots they make with regularity in practice, and they mostly make against lesser teams.

    • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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      I agree a lot were good shots. Starks had at least 3 shots rattle in and out. It was just one of those nights where some shots just weren’t falling. I’m excited for the rest of the season. The squad will do some big things.

      • mckalk says:
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        There was a litle bit of layup missing also. A couple of Cunningham’s shots were WTF moments! I just point them out because damn this would have been a nice win. We are so starved for basketball success and it is so close. They just need to destroy Towson and give Murphy some minutes!

        • JackBeav says:
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          That’s the minutia I’m talking about though. This game was remarkable because we faced adversity off the bat due to Vandy’s defensive scheme. Fatigue was likely the biggest factor with the missed shots and slow reactions to underneath passes as well as some slow rotations on defense.

          Despite all the set backs we can point to here and there, this team had a good feel during the whole game. They were never out of reach, and they knew it. And, better than that, they were the ones to control crunch time. It was just too little to overcome the accumulated mistakes leading up to it. This is a Vandy team who closes games going away, and they barely kept us at bay… on an off night. Every time they put a dagger in our heart, our boys pulled it out and threw it back at them.

          That in itself is an exciting brand of ball. Now we just need to see them sustain that urgency from the tip to the final buzzer. It’s not an easy task, but we seem to be getting closer with every outing.

          • rsteve503 rsteve503 says:
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            Yep … well said! This is the kind of play that will make fans fill the seats, win or lose. This isnt losing to a no-name, this is almost beating a top 20 team on the road.

            WAY TO GO, BEAVERS!

        • JackBeav says:
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          Oh… and Berto is close to turning it on. That mid-range jumper he sank was a thing of beauty.

          • GOBEAVS says:
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            He always hits one of those in a game and i’m always screaming for him to do it again but for whatever reason he never does. He makes it look like a lay-up

          • mckalk says:
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            Hey, no minutia!

          • JackBeav says:
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            You can go for the minutia. Just don’t extrapolate it.

  • Gman says:
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    Was watching highlights from last years civil war and man, Katz really sucked… so many interceptions and scared pocket presence..

    • matt b says:
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      Try playing with a broken wrist and see how brave you would be.

      • JackBeav says:
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        Brave or stupid?

        • JackBeav says:
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          Though being in shock and being lucid are not compatible. We probably can’t chalk it up to stupidity or faux courage.

          • matt b says:
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            Actually being and shock and being lucid can be very compatible. Free speech is great. But trying to discredit any OSU athlete who tried/tries to serve honorably is disappointing.

          • JackBeav says:
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            Serve?

          • Gman says:
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            Discredit? An athlete will get credit when credit is deserved. It’s not just last years civil war in which he sucked, but most of the entire season. He was lucky he had James Rodgers the first half of the season to mask his lack of talent. He locked onto his primary receiver and either threw into coverage or when he wasn’t open pretty much just took the sack. He has great arm strength, bad procket presence (happy feet) and just an average to mediocre QB… Mannion has way more potential and is already succeeding Katz as an athlete.

    • BeavMonkey says:
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      They really should force athletes to come out of the game when they are hurt and it is affecting their performance. And if they don’t there should be penalties.

      Michael Vick recently royally sucked in a game in which he had broken 2 ribs and continued playing. While this would have been impressive in the military, the reality was that he cost his team a potential win.

      Playing a game with a broken wrist or ribs is likely to make a player more timid for good reason. Why not take out the cultural hint that it is manly or brave to play while not at 100%, and replace it with the truth, that they are hurting their team.

      • matt b says:
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        I do not want to speak for Jack because he does a much better job than I do. But I think that his point was that after the injury, Katz may have been in shock, and may have been playing with an impaired mindset. It is not always easy to tell the difference between an injury and playing hurt. Remember, a member of the training staff lost his job for several issues related to this topic. It is not that easy to know during the heat of battle. But to the larger question of “Katz sucked”, I disagree with the original post. The context at the time was poor play calling plus poor protection plus poor quarterback play equalled a loss. To imply that the Beavers lost because Katz sucks or sucked is a flawed conclusion.

        • JackBeav says:
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          Yeah, the adrenaline of being in k and playing in a game (and running for your life) can mask even the pain that he might have felt. It might not have been until after the game that he felt anything significant. Remember that it took a while before he was diagnosed with a fracture even after that. So it still might have hindered his ability to do some things, but he might also not have known it at the time, chalking it up to mental mistakes that he could correct.

        • Gman says:
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          I never said they lost because of Katz, don’t put words in my mouth. Katz is a mediocre QB which was overhyped by his arm strength. Mannion is a much better QB..

          • matt b says:
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            You said that he sucked and you said that he ran around scared implying that he was a coward. As for Mannion, we will see how far a second year freshman can go. He shows promise and has done well so far. But his lack of mobility is a concern and does not necessarily translate to the next level and to the next generation of Offense in football.

          • Gman says:
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            I know I said he sucked, and having “happy feet” doesn’t imply coward, it means he doesn’t make quick decisions in getting the ball away when pressure is coming which allows for him to be sacked a lot and that’s why he has has “happy feet”. And as for Mannion, we don’t utilize speed in QB’s in our offense, so that’s out of the question.

          • matt b says:
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            Speed has little to do with quarterback play in 2011. Tom Brady originally replaced Drew Bledsoe because he was mobile albeit slow. His major liability today as a30 plus quarterback is lack of mobility. Mike Nolan and Mike Singletary never understood that a major strength of Alex Smith is his mobility, not his arm strength. The trend is there in college as well. Mannion led all of football in interceptions. That is not a good sign.

          • Gman says:
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            But Mannion is also a freshman and as you can see later in this season he is maturing and a lot less interception are occurring, the last few haven’t even been his fault i.e. Wheaton not fighting for the ball and James’ fault on the last one too.

          • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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            Mannion will be fine. He’s had tough circumstances. He has a horrific offensive line and no running game. He’ll have a big sophomore season. He’s had a better first year as a starter than both Matt Moore and Sean Canfield and they had pretty good Senior seasons. He’s only gonna be sophomore next year and he was thrown into the fire with zero experience and with pressure to perform. That is really tough. He will do some GREAT things.

            Tom Brady did not replace Drew Bledsoe because of his ability. I don’t know where you would get information like that. Brady took over because Bledsoe had suffered a sheared blood vessel in his chest during week 2. He was forced to miss several weeks and by the time Bledsoe was 100% Brady had gotten the Patriots rolling. Bledsoe did lead them to a win in the AFC Championship game though.

            I understand why fans would want a QB who’s a little more mobile than Sean, but it isn’t something that is needed. Sure, a mobile QB is great when the pocket breaks down to take off and run. But, Sean doesn’t need to do that. He just needs to shift in the pocket and try and find his safety valves. He does this already, but he will get better at this. As long as he doesn’t take too many sacks and can get it to a back or a receiver for positive yards, then everything is fine. He’ll get even better at that.

          • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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            Should have said mobility and not ability about Brady-Bledsoe

  • brownale9000 says:
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    Malik Gilmore has cancelled his remaining official visits after his visit to OSU this weekend.

    Hopefully we get some news about Darius Powe soon.

    • Beaver Byte says:
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      Malik Gilmore: Locked-in with Oregon State
      http://beaverbyte.com

      • silverstream055 silverstream055 says:
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        Just back from a short vacation with my wife and kids, and very happy to see this news.

    • BeavMonkey says:
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      Gilmore looks like he can play the split end position and replace Markus Wheaton pretty well. So does Darius Powe.

      Does anyone know why we can,t recruit 4 star talent at anything other than the QB/WR positions?

      • matt b says:
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        Go to the Scout or Rivals sites and count the total number of 4-5 star prospects at each position. How many 4-5 star defensive tackles are listed and how many D1 teams are there? There is an inherent bias with the systems in creating more skill position prospects. There are more summer camps for skill players, more street agents pumping them up and they are easier to evaluate by the semi pro ratings agencies. For lineman, evaluation requires projecting a player’s physical growth/strength possibilities. There are few fully mature and fully grown linemen in high school.

        • JackBeav says:
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          semi pro?

          Feeling generous this holiday season?

          • BeavMonkey says:
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            There are approximately equal WRs as DE’s. More OL’s than WR’s, but I guess that makes sense because 5 of them play at the some time versus 2 or 3 for WR’s.

            Significantly less QB’s. And significantly less CB’s. Although a lot of them seem to be underrated. I mean Morris Claiborne a 3*…

            So I am still not sure why none of the other positions come to us as well as the WR’s?

          • matt b says:
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            I am probably a bit less stingy than Scott Rueck. His team doesn’t give away anything.

          • matt b says:
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            The lady Beavers are my idols. They fight hard to the end. Win or lose. And of course the coach is a no star coach because he came from the the dreaded lower division.

  • Gash says:
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    What’s the angry beaver line on the Rodriguez hire relative to Riley?

    I suggest the only way to improve on Riley is to bring in someone who quality athletes believe can get them to the pros, particularly quarterbacks, which probably means someone who has recently been in the pros, like the Erickson and 2nd Riley hires, and to a lesser extent the 1st Riley hire. A Leech hire (gimmick offense hire) makes us the Houston of the Pac-12 (or I suppose like the Kragthorpe Beavers of the Pac-12) but with 3 losses, and that 3-9 season still on the way.

  • OneEyedKing says:
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    RichRod to Arizona is pretty scary, to me. He had a sweet system at West Virginia, and Michigan didn’t really give him a chance.

    The good thing is, seeing his offense and UO’s most years might make us more prepared for option nonsense.

  • Gman says:
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    Wow, Cal trailing by 20 at half-time against Mizzou… Cal is overrated, Beavs out play them.

  • mckalk says:
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    Off Topic….this is from a UK site, speculation that Mr.Katz is headed to Lexington? Be interesting to hear what he or MR actually say next week.

    Ryan Katz is one of a number of Oregon State upperclassmen replaced by a freshman this season in an attempt by their coaching staff to speed up the rebuilding process. Katz started all 12 games for the Beavers last season, completing 60% of his passes for 2500 yards and I believe 22 touchdowns… but that may include rushing td’s also. He threw more than 150 passes at Oregon State before his first interception (the longest such streak last year in college football). Considered by many to have the strongest arm of any QB in college football not named Ryan Mallett in 2010.

    Katz has really been handed a raw deal at Oregon State. If he does end up transferring he will have two full years of eligibility. I don’t know all the details, but he has been in contact with Randy Sanders. Nothing has officially been released yet… So no need to search the internet for a story to back this up. I just received a tip from a very reliable source who knows the Katz family personally so I thought I’d see what you guys think about it. The kid is a very special talent on the field and in the classroom… and even more importantly in the community

    • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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      Katz a special talent on the field, what?! He has a strong arm and mobility but that is it. He doesn’t have a great pocket presence and doesn’t throw the deep ball all that well. Also, he didn’t get a raw deal. That is such a ridiculous statement. He didn’t progress, he regressed. It was his fourth year in the system and was the beginning of his 3rd year of playing experience and showed no real improvement. A lot of people fell in love with his arm and assumed he would be great because of that.

      I’m sure wherever Katz goes he will be solid, but he won’t be “special”. He’ll be just alright. That’s my opinion.

      • Mckalk says:
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        You have to keep in mind that UK football is a mess right now, their fan base is looking for any glimmer of hope they can find!

  • BeaverBeliever21 says:
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    I saw that Cal lost by 39 tonight to Missouri. They’re supposed to be the Pac-12 favorites. Honestly, the Beavers are much better than them, IMO. They looked terrible. UCLA looked bad again as they lost to Kansas and trailed by double digits for about 34 minutes or so of the game. The conference is a mess.

  • Fightingbeaver says:
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    This Beaver site just another example of how OSU fans turn their back on football and latch onto a more successful basketball program. Gee guys, this is the Civil War coming up. At least start a Civil War thread, bash the ducks a little, do something.

    It is also an example on how duck fans stick together more than Beaver fans. They wear more black than beavers now. They do anything they want and get away with it. Beaver fans don’t care and don’t say anything. Go figure.

    Fightingbeaver

    • mckalk says:
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      Do you read this blog with any frequency or understand how it flows? The football program has been discussed and debated until we are blue in the face. Tears, anger, confusion and a couple of brief periods of joy are the emotions from this season that you will find here from PASSIONATE but astute OSU fans.

      I’m sure Angry will put up a thread soon and you can give us your take. If you want amateur Duck bashing I would suggest Oregon Live as your venue.

      • Mud&Sticks Mud&Sticks says:
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        Well, as soon as I got to the “astute” part I had to give your post a thumbs up. Even though I knew you weren’t referring to me. πŸ™‚

        • mckalk says:
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          It was a little tongue in check, but you are definitely in the club!

  • JackBeav says:
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    Rugby:
    Beavs 115 – Ducks 0

    Volleyball:
    Beavs 3 – Ducks 0

    Civil War Blood Drive:
    Beavs 2,763 – Ducks 2,682

    RecycleMania Civil War:
    Beavs win handily

    Energy Civil War:
    Ducks 13,200 watt hours – Beavs 12,200 watt hours

    … so much for a perfect record…

    And of course…
    Civil War Brew-Off:
    Beavs win handily of course

    Now you can go ahead and talk about football if you want.

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    Every weekend i used to go to see this web page, for the reason that i wish for enjoyment,
    for the reason that this this website conations actually pleasant funny material too.

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