25.Oct.2014 Stanford Post-Game Thoughts

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It was fun reading the comments and seeing people raging at Riley and BDC. The thing is, didn’t those people see this coming? Stanford has been suffocating everyone, and OSU has only been able to score versus bad opponents. So obviously Stanford was going to win this game barring them handing it away or some other miracle.

Regarding Mike Riley, what can you say at this point that hasn’t been said? And that’s part of the problem. The Cassandras and Pollyannas have both said their piece. This conversation only becomes interesting if the Pollys begin to defect. We’re seeing it begin to happen (rumors PO is blowing up tonight, Mamma Machado getting testy on Twitter a few weeks ago, etc), but not yet en masse. For what are they waiting? Riley to pull his annual upset and add just enough confusion about his upper limit to silence everyone for a week? I don’t see that happening this year since the best opportunity for that was Utah. We see that type of game every year and know it means nothing more than a weird upset. An anomaly. It doesn’t mean he has suddenly “figured it out” or any other straw these people are grasping at. Hint: guys don’t figure things out when they’re 60. If anything the opposite happens.

Getting the bird’s eye view tonight, I saw just how bad Sean Mannion is. Yes, Riley is right some of that is Stanford being good, some of it is OSU’s offensive line, but most of it is Mannion. I saw a guy with plenty of time who failed to scan the field, failed to spot wide open WRs (yet we’re told the WRs can’t get open…interesting), and constantly threw the ball behind, over, and under WRs. When I watched the Chargers on Thursday night, they made the point Phillip Rivers throws under more duress than any QB. Yet, he has a 110 QB rating and 86 QBR. 20TDs and 5INTs, all while throwing behind a shaky offensive line. THAT is what great quarterbacks do. They transcend their cast. We see Tom Brady do this every week. I’m not saying Mannion should be either of those guys. But if people are going to say this guy is a 1st round draft pick and then completely blame the offensive line for his terrible play, then they also need to acknowledge what actually goes into great QB play. It is not a 6″5 frame or throwing a ball 80 yards from his knees. If it were, Browning Nagle would be in the Hall of Fame. Mannion has zero moxy, zero heart, zero leadership, and just doesn’t get what makes great QB play. Four years and it hasn’t clicked. That experiment, like the Riley experiment, should either (a) end entirely or (b) at least be called out for what it is. Need to start looking to next year and benching Mannion should not be out of the equation.

One last point: Hunter Jarmon makes the most explosive play of the game and Chris Brown plays well. Over and over I wrote Jarmon needed to be the guy who replaced Cooks. Over and over I wrote Brown is the best RB on the roster. Riley insists Bolden is Cook’s replacement and Woods/Ward is a legit Pac-12 backfield. It takes him 7 weeks to figure out maybe that isn’t correct? The guy is slower than whale shit. If it is not clock management it is personnel management.

A much shorter version of this post: it is inevitable that a coach wears out his welcome. That time is near.

A sign of a bull market’s end is when good news no longer propels the asset in question. We’ll see how fans react if Riley pulls off his yearly upset. If they forgive him then we’re still stuck with this, but this feels the closest I can remember to fans uniting in opinion. At this point, I don’t see anything but a victory in the Civil War cooling Riley’s hot seat.

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  • PoopyPantsRiley says:
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    Riley has only won 1 out of his last 9 Pac-12 games. Todd Graham has won 11 of his last 12 Pac-12 games and can make it 12 of 13 tonight on the road vs UW.

  • bendbeaver bendbeaver says:
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    Riley being on the hot seat may just be fan perception and not a reality. Even if he did get canned, is BDC going to cough up 2 to 3 mil and whatever the buyout would be to get someone better? No. I recommend just sitting back and watching fans fantasize about a better alternative until around Thursday evening or so when we start talking about the Beavs being able to beat Cal.

  • bigditch says:
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    Riley PLEASE move on …..

  • Timber2002 says:
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    The selection of John Garrett as o.c. appears to be a terrible decision as well. There’s a reason that guy never had an o.c. opportunity before.

  • Loyal to the school says:
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    Long-time lurker of OSU fan boards and this is my first comment.

    College football seems to build loyalty to a school first and to a coach second, and to individual players third since the players move on so quickly. We OSU fans are diehard to the school. Sadly, it looks like it is time for Riley to retire.

  • beaverkman beaverkman says:
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    When you are having problems coaching the fundamentals that is a sign you have deteriorated. Clock management, open receivers, poor schemes, no adjustments, false starts, blown assignments, etc All these are the basics, and the team has failed at them time after time for the past 5 seasons +

    Angry the conditions must’ve as bad as they were up here because Kostol couldn’t kick worth crap today?

    • angry angry says:
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      The conditions were fine. There was rain early in the day, but only a couple very light sun showers during the game. From what I saw, Kostol simply hit the ball off the side of his foot.

    • tim318 says:
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      OSU one of the worst in FBS this season in penalties per game.

    • Mud&Sticks Mud&Sticks says:
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      @kman – FWIW I remember a major stink 2 or 3 years into Riley’s 2nd go around about the team never having tackling drills.

      As I recall one player was quoted as saying he’d hadn’t had tackling drills since high school so I’m not so sure Riley has ever emphasized the basic fundamentals.

  • RanYakumo says:
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    As I’ve said before, I don’t want any discussion of Riley going before we kick Bob DeCareless out the door first.

    I’ll give him credit for a good basketball hire in Tinkle, but I don’t want that man anywhere near the process of choosing another football coach. He’s the one that gave Riley that absurd contract, and he should be shown the door first and foremost.

  • beaverkman beaverkman says:
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    Here is my response to Mizel’s quote from Riley
    Check out @beaverkman’s Tweet: https://twitter.com/beaverkman/status/526161839848448000

  • GoBeavs90 says:
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    The Beavers are a bad team and aren’t worth getting upset about it. I didn’t watch the game today cause I just don’t care about the football program at this point. It’s the same every year. Nothing changes and Riley is going nowhere. I’m more interested in the basketball program even though they won’t be good this season. There’s something to look forward to there with who they got coming in next year. There’s never anything to look forward to under Riley. Mediocre to bad football is what you’ll see and there won’t be any changes.

  • GOBeavers GOBeavers says:
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    Maybe we can get Ben Howland to replace Riley?

    Seriously though, are there any coaches people think would be a good replacement? I just wanna have something to fantasize about.

    • jeff says:
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      My first call would be to Matt Wells, Utah State head coach.

      • Nak says:
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        Wells would be on the short list but I kinda like Baldwin from Eastern. They spanked us and I watched most of the game against UW earlier this year in which they took the Huskies to the wire. Vernon Adam is a bit Russel Wilson-like but the main deal is Baldwin has consistently assembled incredibly competitive, chip on their shoulder teams. He also plays an exciting type of football which we desperately need. I can’t be the only one falling asleep watching the Beavs.

        • jeff says:
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          No FBS experience and only every coaching in WA would keep him off my list personally. Now if we were talking about a potential OC he’d top the list. Maybe the Chip Kelly treatment. Riley stays as HC but turns the offense over to him and he takes over in 2-4 years. Of course the issue there is that Riley would stay on.
          I just think its too big of a jump to do without anything in between. I’d be hesitant. Its a bold thought though. I wouldn’t be entirely against it.
          Has anyone ever made the jump from FCS to AQ head coach without any FBS coaching experience at some point and been successful? I know Tressel went from Youngstown to Ohio State but he’d coached in FBS prior to going to Youngstown.

          • AnotherRileyLoss says:
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            Lost me at ‘Riley stays on’. Know you were hedging it with a coach in waiting thing but even one more year of Riley is too much. Fans are dropping fast and there are going to be a bunch of empty seats finishing out this year and even more so next year. Time to finally move beyond a failed Riley. What is left of the fanbase needs to let the last straws go.

          • jeff says:
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            I agree, that was the problem with him. I was simply responding. FCS to AQ with no FBS experience seems like too big of a jump. I prefer Wells with Riley gone.

          • mckalk says:
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            Brian Kelly and Urban Meyer were innovative “mid-major superstars” at one point. Wisconsin seems to be doing well with Gary Anderson, so Matt Wells might be someone to pursue. I would caution that our favored son Jerry Pettibone was from a mid-major and we know how that worked out!

            I personally think that after 10 years if you as a head coach are no closer to winning championships then when you started it’s time to either resign or get fired. In the college football landscape is there really much difference between 7-5 and 5-7? After a certain amount of time, they are both inconsequential results. If you are out of any championship picture after six games your season doesn’t matter.

          • FedUpBeav says:
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            Agree with the bulk of this. This is Riley’s 14th season. That is already 40% longer than 10 years which alone seems like too long if as you say a coach is no closer to any goals then he was earlier.

            Factor in a horrendous 1 of 13 in last games vs ranked teams and 1 of 9 in last Pac-12 games. Then the fact that fans will likely start abandoning the program in the thousands with more losses this season and a bad next year when OSU could fall to last in conference. You arrive at a dismal place and an obvious picture where change is needed before it gets unbelievably ugly.

    • beavblazer beavblazer says:
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      Where’s June Jones these days? He made Hawaii into a winning program and even SMU. I think he retired this year for “personal reasons”. Maybe Pac-12 money would make his personal reasons go away. At least the run and shoot would be entertaining in the fast paced pac-12.

      • Nak says:
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        Personally don’t think JJ is the answer. Long in the tooth and most likely burned out imho. Need either an established coach like sweater vest Tressel or an up and comer like Wells or my personal favorite Baldwin. Cheney is a harder place to recruit than Corn Valley!

        • beavblazer beavblazer says:
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          Mostly kidding about Jones, although if we’re going to have a long in the toot, burned out coach, I’d take JJ and mouse Davis over Riley. At least it would be entertaining football.

          • beavblazer beavblazer says:
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            Hell, he got Hawaii of all schools to a BCS bowl. Got his ass kicked, but at least they were in the building.

      • mckalk says:
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        He “retired” two games into the season because HIS program at SMU was in free fall.

  • FatDog says:
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    The problem with Riley is not that he is 60 and can’t change because of his age. He won’t change because he is Riley. At his age, other men would able to lead in a way that brings in people who can advance the program. He has this stage of his career all wrong.

    • Nak says:
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      Fat Dog’s right. It’s not so much his age but his personality. Stubborn, egocentric, non-creative and moronic.. Spurrier, Snyder and Beamer are about the same age or older but they get it done. It’s not a good comparison though, all the aforementioned are soon to be College Hall of Famers. There was a reason why Riley failed so miserably in San Diego and it wasn’t so much Beathard and poor draft picks, the excuses we normally hear. Riley just doesn’t have it and is at best an assistant at the highest levels of football.

  • mckalk says:
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    Riley’s situation at Oregon St. is unique in the fact that he has been able to stay so long despite being very average because initial expectations were to get the program beyond “laughing stock” and he and Dennis Erickson were able to accomplish that mission.

    You take the “legacy” of 28 years of losing out of the equation and Riley’s ass would have been out the door three or four years ago. And really, I don’t get all of the Riley worship, he left for the NFL and he wasn’t even the one who took the program to it’s greatest heights (and I don’t care whether they were his players he wasn’t coaching them). It’s time for change.

  • Rileysucks says:
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    Riley won’t win more than 1 more this year. This is also the better scenario because of that dumbass BDC contract. Riley looks like he has lost the team and you can’t blame the players. Mannion is losing millions based on an unwise decision to return with Riley poorly leading the show. Next year OSU is more likely than not the bottom basement last place team in conference. Worse yet is the financial impact we will see down the losing stretch of this season and the next couple.

    Cal game in danger of very poor attendance and a loss will be incredibly bad in that one. Cal can score but can Riley? OSU can’t afford if attendance falls into the 20Ks next year as the Riley decline gets ugly and the losses pile up. Riley needs to recognize he is hurting the program if he stays past this year and should do the right thing and retire. BDC also should step down. If not the nightmare unraveling will continue and play itself out to a very ugly situation.

    OSU can’t afford 10-15K fans walking away in the primary breadbasket sport. A few more Riley losses and the trajectory is headed there quick. Go out and find a winner who wants to make a statement in a top conference. That will never be Riley again.

    • scotty says:
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      Worst-case scenario: We beat Cal and Wazzu (barely of course) and limp into another Podunk Bowl. Another year added to the contract, hip hip hooray!

  • angry angry says:
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    Mamma Machado is locking threads on Beaverblitz that call for Riley being fired. So pathetic.

    • Nak says:
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      Always does that even though another poster started a thread challenging the lock. Papa Machado is a negative about Riley and lately it must be having an impact on Mama. It’s starting to get ugly all over. The Pollys are as always a pitiful bunch.

  • rsteve503 rsteve503 says:
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    It is not “inevitable” that a coach wears out his welcome. Some coaches are successful up and including the year they retire and fans hate to see them go.

    Isnt Ralph Miller an example of that?

    What is absolutely needed, imo, is home games NOT SOLD OUT, and obvious empty seats. If that can even get started, I think football as the main athletic money maker will not be allowed to fall very far. Riley will be told he must retire. It will all look very civilized, as he got OSU to a numb er of bowl games and his career will be sufficient contrast with the long losing season string that he will be honored.

    DONT GO TO GAMES!

    • scotty says:
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      Don’t show up at the games? The offense is one step ahead of you 🙂

  • angry angry says:
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    It is not “inevitable” that a coach wears out his welcome

    True, but that is extremely rare. You’re basically talking the HOF/legend coaches.

    • mckalk says:
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      Like Riley, Ron McBride(Utah), Rick Minter (Cincinnati) and Jeff Bowers(So Miss) were also well liked and well regarded long tenured coaches who had success but were stuck in ruts of inconsistency.

      Unlike Riley, they had AD’s with balls who were willing to shake things up…..Cincy and Utah hit homeruns with Brian Kelly and Urban Meyer….So. Miss did not, but at some point an AD cannot tolerate stagnation. 10 years is enough…Riley has had his chance.

    • rsteve503 rsteve503 says:
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      No, that aint true…..unless you are thinking Riley is HOF caliber. I wont be surprised if Riley is allowed to stay until he decides to retire.

      And since coaches jump to better college jobs or to the pros fairly often, that adds a big number to the total of ones not wearing out their welcome. Just sayin…

  • Zeke says:
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    The situation is as bleak as the last days of Pettibone.

    Best case scenario – we tank this year and next, Ed Ray is forced to fire BDC, and Riley assumes interim Athletic director position vacating his head coaching duties.

    Worst case scenario – we continue the free fall and status quo. This is unfortunately the most likely scenario as well.

    • Nak says:
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      Sorry, I get the buyout is expensive but there’s NO WAY I want Riley as the AD. Thankfully we didn’t make Jimmy Anderson AD in the 90s… Tinks has the skillset to be an AD someday assuming he’ll have success at OSU, which I firmly believe he will.

    • VA:F [1.9.22_1171]
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      Thank you for the high praise. It’s nice to be remembered as a great coach.

      • mckalk says:
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        Jerry, too bad you couldn’t see the future with the spread option instead of your underperforming “flexbone”. Your ’94 and ’95 defenses played with their “hair on fire”, but 136 points from an offense is not going to get it done! Tim Alexander was your proto-type spread QB, but you wanted to be Air Force!

  • cj cj says:
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    I’m too disgusted for words. What a crappy showing.

  • mckalk says:
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    At some point, with most major college programs, you get fired if you can’t beat your rival…it’s just a matter of principle……unfortunately with the bizarro world that is OSU football under MR and BDC…there is no expectation to beat your rival so there is no accountability for the results in that game.

    I would love a job where I am fair to middling all of the time and then I screw up the big projects I get and THEN I still get a nice review and extension each year! Maybe Riley is crazy like a fox….nice work if you can get it!

    • helmsley says:
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      It has frequently occurred to me that Mike Riley knows exactly what he’s getting away with. That worked as long as everyone loved him despite the glaring deficiencies. Now, not so much. If he really cared, he’d gracefully bow out and wish the program well.

  • Zeke's says:
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    As was pointed out to me by a friend yesterday, the structure of Riley’s contract will straddle this program for many years to come. Every winning season tacks on an additional contract year because we had no money to retain Riley when he was being courted by USC. We backloaded it and in doing so EFF’d the whole program.

    To me, BDC is problem #1.

    • RileyFreefall says:
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      Riley when interviewed about his very long 10 year deal after the 2009 season was asked about the extension part for 6-6 and better years. He said it was his idea and added in near the end of discussions.

      So in my mind both Riley and BDC have plenty of fault. Riley should have realized that was excessive and too low a bar. He had to figure he could hit that 70% of the time atleast. So he really thought he deserved 17 more years from showing up and playing poorly in El Paso?

      BDC more culpable because the idea is preposterous to begin with. Sun and Vegas bowls don’t mean much more than a very small step. Without that retarded extension part the deal was almost reasonable. Most fans could have tolerated the extension part if it was 8+ wins and an actual modest level of success was being reached. But to come off a 10 win season and say 6 wins was the gold standard that would be rewarded beyond an already decade long deal was just assinine.

      Without that you wouldn’t have fans preferring losses over more endless mediocrity because a stupid contract guarantees it for longer. The fanbase isn’t stupid and this contract tied OSU’s own hands in improving its program.

      If Riley wanted to save a world of pain and grief over the next couple years he would have it be rewritten. Higher pay, no extensions and not plan being coach 4 years from now. Even that much time is beyond what is best for OSU. He and BDC refuse to budge despite mounting losses and a plethora of poor management decisions. Thus to want this hairbrained situation to come to an end much sooner than their awful plan calls for is completely natural. Making it there would be a total nightmare. BDC shouldn’t have been looking much more than 5 years out and instead hastily agreed to a thrown in clause as Riley got greedy not even thinking what could go wrong. Within two years we we had a bad season and a piece of it was fans understanding quickly how wrong this deal was and voicing that recognition. Now if a season isn’t great there is a good portion of the base who feel it is better if we go 5-7 at best. All on BDC and to a slightly lesser extent Riley. It should have been clear that this was so unlikely to be in OSU’s best interests.

      When stocks are up they eventually come down. This was too easy to see. Hell, Riley only scored a field goal in that ugly Sun Bowl. BDC was was badly irresponsible with OSU’s future and it was grossly negligent to leave the university no good options because of it. Now the best option if either give a damn about the school and its remaining supporters is a somewhat graceful Riley retirement after this year or next. Too many signs point to his downtrend being sustained for awhile in a rising and adapting Pac-12. Attendance will suffer. It is going to get much uglier for atleast this season and next. Hope they are ready for their self created Category 5 shit storm about to make landfall as there appears to be no plan.

      • rsteve503 rsteve503 says:
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        Dude — RILEY should have realized it was excessive?!?!? You stack a contract as far in your favor as you can. And if the other side are morons, you end up with something like Riley got.

        The hometown boy made good, and with that contract he can be the Paterno of the west like he wants. The only thing that will get rid of him is what got rid of Craig Robinson….tanking attendance.

        The most unfortunate thing for us is not that Riley was never a great coach and now is either slipping or losing interest. Its that the AD is a melon head and contracted for mediocrity. So now we depend on a pollyanna fanbase to get enough dissatisfied to stop attending games. Hey, maybe it can happen…

        • Rileysucks says:
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          It is the length and ridiculously easy nature of the extensions and not the $$ that is the problem. Win a cakewalk nonconference and only 1/3 of Pac-12 games vs the weakest teams while losing the other 67% of conference games and you are rewarded???? Riley having any self-respect as a coach should have realized those are BAD years you are rewarding. Making this crap out as good is the problem.

          The extension thing was pointless when already looking out over a decade. At any point hopefully over 6 years through it you could add a year and another later when a few years left in there was any desire. The whole thing stunk and BDC should be fired for it.

          Riley isn’t the answer as he will continue to make same mistakes and is in a lasting decline. He isn’t relevant. Oregon State easily could be with the right coach but that isn’t Riley at this stage for sure.

          My hope is attendance drops a good amount, Riley continues to mount losses this year as I expect, and he also craps himself next year forcing a change. The cries to dump Riley will grow ever louder and very intense with every coming loss. Going to the complete cellar as he may next year is unacceptable and shows the game and ability to properly compete have passed him by. Lose to a pretty bad Cal team at home and Riley will see a ton of heat from fans and attendance for WSU could be close to only 30K. That’s pretty pathetic shit from Riley after 14 years. 1 of 10 in last Pac-12 games if he chokes. Terrible.

  • Jack says:
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    “When stocks are up they eventually come down.”

    Oh-key-doh-key.

    And I guess I need to stress the DOH!

    Can we at least get some coherent rants up in this place?

  • Retire Riley (Riley Sucks) says:
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    Changed my name from Riley Sucks to Retire Riley – That’s the only way he can go.

    Everyone who wants Riley out should change their mantra to “Retire Riley!”

    Saturday will be ugly – Beavs trending down + 7:30 kickoff = Low attendance. Low attendance x Beaver loss = status quo (meaning we still won’t see any changes in the coaching staff).

    Early score prediction for Saturday – Cal 45 Beavs 30

    Early false start prediction for Saturday – 4 (one on an important drive)

    • Jack says:
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      I like the new you. You’re starting to get it.

    • Beavers4life says:
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      My prediction for Saturdays loss is this, cal 50 OSU 10

      • Beavers4life says:
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        I’ll still be there and lose my voice for this team, but I’m hoping for a losing season…I just want the beavs to maintain enough credit to keep mediocre to average recruits to keep the program from falling to awful before Riley is let go. I love my beavs, but I’ve lost faith in Riley. If I had time and money, I’d buy season basketball tickets, but I don’t have either. Baseball is the other sport I love supporting too.

  • Retire Riley (Riley Sucks) says:
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    Also, for those users of twitter, start tweeting at Coach Riley (@Mike_Riley) and at Bob De Carolis (@bvrboss) and demanding action. Maybe use the hashtag #RetireRiley.

  • steveEbeaver says:
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    Remember last year all the stories about Riley’s grandson? Well it’s time for Mike to be a full time Grandpa.

  • Beavers4life says:
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    Riley’s contract could have worked out better if it was written like this:

    Win a top 3 pac-12 bowl game.
    Defeat your rival.
    Be a top 3 pac-12 team.

    If all 3 are met, you get a year added to your contract; if you don’t, you get 0 years added to your contract.

    • Jack says:
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      You’re expecting waaaaayyyy too much.

      • Beavers4life says:
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        Is it? His new contract came to be after the 2006 season here is the schedule and results of that season http://www.osubeavers.com/SportSelect.dbml?SPSID=750125&SPID=127145&DB_OEM_ID=30800&Q_SEASON=2006

        Here is the new contract from April 2007:
        http://www.osubeavers.com/ViewArticle.dbml?ATCLID=207855529

        Contract extended out to 2012 with an additional year added for every bowl game they make.

        If you look at the 2006 schedule, we beat our rival in Eugene, went on to beat Maryland in the emerald bowl in San francisco. Which made us the number 5 team in the pac 10 and finished with a 9-4 record. The following year, we beat our rival, went on to play in the sun bowl, #3 pac10 team…1 year contract extension was warranted under that season. Finished 10-4. So, it’s not asking for too much…if you look back when his contract extension terms were discussed.

        • Jack says:
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          I was trying my hand at being a Pollyanna.

          The next thing you know, OSU will have to win the Super Bowl and the Kentucky Derby in order for Riley to get an extended year. Why are you all so ridiculous with these demands?

  • corliss says:
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    Grant Bays not practicing with the ones. Lauina now at LG. Weinrich replacing Stanton.

    • Jack says:
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      Yeah.

      • Jack says:
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        Actually, Fred looked good in garbage time. He sealed off a whole inside tackle for Brown to run through on a mighty impressive … umm… what should have been off tackle run. And later he was on all fours five yards down field after a run over his side… after shoving the defender backward for a while.

        I’d have to watch again to pick him out. But I did notice him on a couple plays just for what he did.

        And Del Rio looked mighty good. If he was bad previously, he wasn’t on Saturday. He had a really quick release and a very very strong arm. There is not an arm in the Pac12 that comes close to his short flicks… that are actually 20 yards down field… but he can make on a three step drop and release… holy fucking crap.

        Sorry guys. If Riley doesn’t mediocre him to death, Del Rio is gonna be a gamer.

        • cj cj says:
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          I thought he made a nice escape when the defense broke through.

        • ObjCritic says:
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          Good to hear about Del Rio…

          What Beaver doesn’t like a river (rio)?!?

          I annoit him Castor Del Rio! (Beaver of the River).

          May he reign successfully for three years! Or sit if there’s a better player…

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