anybody have a reliable bootleg stream link to share?
Of course my comcast won’t let me stream the regional Pac12 WA channel, and it appears this game is not on the main Pac12 station.
Yea that was a nice read, they were bringing the strong side safety and everything collapsed over and took d-lineman off their gaps. All it took was one woof and there was a lot of green for him to work with.
I know I’m getting ahead of myself, but what is the best possible bowl scenario for the Beavs, and what is considered the most likely if they win tonigh
excellent commentary by Wilson on the radio. ball should have been caught, but as a back shoulder throw it was too far in front of him. Points there would have made the Cougs feel some pressure
Ugh. Could have snapped it when they had 12 men on the field and gotten a free 5 yards to make it 4th and 2. Missed opportunity that was there for the taking. Seen that happen too frequently. Gotta be ready to quick snap in those situations
Bad 3rd down throw by Luton and another one of those 4th down calls by JS. Some recurring themes. Tough not being able to take advantage of the turnover.
PAC zebras once again call a penalty on a player not on the field, #2 for Beavs…………changed to 16 after a few minutes. A sign of improvement for the zebras??
yes. they will have little to play for next week if they lose tonight. Clinched northern division. No natty talk. they don’t care about the Civil War. good spot for OSU
The type of game Oregon should never have trailed in, but will come back to win in the end and somehow that will be evidence they belong in the playoffs. More convincing than a blowout win
Don’t be shocked if the quacks end the season on a 4 game losing streak. Will be deflated for the civil war / Utah will roll them / won’t care and get boat raced in their bowl game. I will be a beautiful thing to watch.
We’re not going to a bowl game still a good year.
Smith blowing games pisses me off most. Oregon might suck next week but my guess is they want to end our season and pad draft stats.
And it could have very well been 3. Can we move on from the last. It’s not like they were up on tree and gave it up at the end. The conference is crazy this year. Many close games. Hawaii is 7-4 so far. They beat us fair and square.
So the Coug player makes the hush gesture to the visiting section….. no penalty. Champ does a lay down to sleep gesture and gets a 15 yd penalty. None of the rules or refs make sense anymore.
I may be off, but all the guys on the top passing list are within the last 4-5 years.. is this more a product of teams not really playing defense/relying more on shootouts to win?
It’s due to targeting rules, emphasis on offense, and defense deemphasized. Is it just me, or I remember when 500 yards of offense was absolutely the outlier??? Now it’s the average.
As I understand, Nevada game last year. If I remember correctly, Smith ironically went conservative and relied on Choukair to win it instead of pushing for the TD.
Yup….too aggressive and/or wreckless. This one is ALL on the coaches. Thought the def did enough to get off the field, then the Offense sped up the plays and put the D right back out there — the D was obviously gassed and we have three timeouts available. Horrible coaching from top to bottom!!!!
Should have at least 7, probably 8.
Wonder if other coaches start to use this against the Beavs in recruiting…”why would you want to play for a coach who doesn’t put you in a position to win?”…thing is if Smith wins next week he could still win COY. So it’s only the astute who get this fine line.
Yeah. Gotta punt. Much tougher to go at least 80 yards in just over a min with no TOs left than to go 57 yards when they’ve been slicing us up all night.
Absolutely no pass rush
Lindseys dropped pass
Lutons poor clock management
At least 4 dropped passes
Questionable play calling
Smith going for it instead of pinning them deep
ALL + A LOSS
Of all the fucking dumb shit moves, this takes the cake. Kick and you play in some random bowl game and look like a hero. Probably win some coaching award for turning around a 1-11 team. But no. We try and get cute, and lose the game because it worked that one time. Fucking stupid stupid stupid.
Next week they will get blasted out of the stadium by a highly overrated ducks team.
Smith must have some high stress memory loss thing going on. Why on God’s green earth would you not kick it?
If we lost after a punt and the Cougs went 80+ for a win in 1 minute, I would have tipped my cap to the Cougs. But when the coach loses the game it’s hard to accept. Smith is a liability for the exact opposite reasons as Riley. https://twitter.com/angrybeavs/status/1198479889055150080
So who else should we hire as the coach? It sucks we lost. It turned out to be a bad gamble. I’ll support smith knowing he is loyal and is learning how to be a better head coach. You know he will not sleep good tonight. He is obviously a motivator. If it was up to many in this blog the team shoulda just quit and loaded the bus at the end of the third. The talent they have should not have equaled 5 wins. The qb that is so terrible made throws all
Over and had some lucky catches but also some bad drops. It’s easy to jump on someone when things don’t go the way we want it.
I’m predicting how many fans next year will complain that Luton isn’t back for a 7th year because he can put the ball in a catchable position. Watching Herbert today, it’s not a given to have a starting d-1 qb who can throw it accurately.
Some good and some bad this year. Let’s go get a win next weekend and throw a little salt on the ducky wound. Go Beavs
“…You know he will not sleep good tonight. He is obviously a motivator. If it was up to many in this blog the team shoulda just quit and loaded the bus at the end of the third. The talent they have should not have equaled 5 wins. The qb that is so terrible made throws all
Over and had some lucky catches but also some bad drops. It’s easy to jump on someone when things don’t go the way we want it…
Some good and some bad this year. Let’s go get a win next weekend and throw a little salt on the ducky wound. Go Beavs.”
This seems like a good summary in terms of general analysis & sentiment following this game, as well as the season overall imo.
1. On one hand, Smith should have punted on 4th down at the end there.
2. On the other hand, with the Beavers consistently rushing only four guys at most at the QB, I think Washington St probably would’ve won anyway. Should’ve sold out completely to sack him.
Now this Oregon team has no shot at the national championship and are already guaranteed a Pac-12 championship game berth, they have no reason to get up for this game. Plus, the Ducks don’t scare me whatsoever.
Did he injure it in the ASU game or at practice? Also, I was surprised at how good the WSU o-line was. Of course, they get a lot of reps at pass protection!
Like Yogi Roth said. You go for it on 4th down and if it doesn’t work, you’re giving them a chance.
And that was exactly what the Cougs needed. Short field with a short clock and a gunslinger quarterback, at home, on senior night? That’s the perfect recipe for a comeback.
Punt if and they’re at mid field with less than 20 seconds left.
Fucking stupid call.
And so many Beaver fans excusing it like “we wouldn’t be where we are without the gambler mentality!”
No, there’s gambling when you need to make something happen in your favor, and there’s just flat out making a stupid decision. Going for it was stupid.
Asinine decision to go for it, especially given WSU had no timeouts. Here’s the thing, if Smith is really a gambler then you call for play-action pass on second down on that last possession and go for the kill. They call two predictable run plays on 2nd and 3rd down that net zero yards. There’s smart aggressive and stupid aggressive, I’m counting more stupid aggressive than smart aggressive this year and it has cost some valuable practice time for a young team.
Actually, I suspect they are trying to catch the D by not using clock and having a more predictable snap time. Is that a plausible speculation of their rationale?
No timeouts and a lot has to go right to go 80 yards in 60 or 62 seconds. Beavs keep it in front if them and Wazzu would have had to make more dangerous throws or be lucky to get down to 15 yard line with more than 7 or 8 seconds left.
Much easier to defend a 2nd and 10 from 15 yard line with 4 seconds left than a 1st and 2 with 4 seconds left. Would have been very tough for WSU to do much better than that with no timeouts.
We can only hope this will be a lesson learned by our young, naive head coach. It’s too bad it had to come with such a high cost. No bowl game and no COY. Big gamble, big loss.
Now I’m feeling sorry for the kids. That’s a soul crusher of a loss, especially with what was on the line. It’s going to be tough to rally mentally in 7 days.
That the team has rallied after Utah (and OkieState) is a credit to Smith; but, it’s a taller task to respond from this close loss than those beat downs.
The bowl factor is probably the biggest thing. You got to figure the thought of a bowl game 2 years ago, even last year was mostly a pipe dream to the players. They held it in their hand about 30 minutes ago, only for it to slip away from stupidity.
Maybe they can rally around that? I won’t hold my breath.
@blackbandit-They rallied down 12 when they couldn’t stop wazzu and the offense had sputtered. I’m sure smith can motivate them to get ready to play their rival. If this team can’t rally they would have lacked it in after starting 1-2.
Some people go all crazy after a sporting event. Like these kids are use to competing and know wins and losses happen. Luckily they don’t flip out and think the world is over like some fans.
Agree, Beavs will be motivated, that’s the new “identity” of this team now that Anderpants (and Riley) are in the rearview mirror.
Smith said it best (paraphrased) ” Preparation and Execution are as, if not more, important than motivation “………….add in coaching decisions and I think you’ve got it.
I understand what your saying. But this is way bigger to them then you think. Winning is the goal, but bowl games are the prize for the years of hard work. They had the prize and then they didn’t.
The play call came down to simply, who has been better, the offense or defense. Clearly offense has been better and you take the chance to win. Hindsight is 20/20. Easily could have punted it, and they just march down and still score and everyone looking back and saying we should have played to win it and not lose it. Tough loss but too many things to point to one play or call
And again, it was not a great call for such a critical situation. They decided to throw a long-ish out to the second string TE there? Last week’s call was terrible also and only bailed out by the PI, which probably only gets called 20% of the time in that situation. There have to be better plays, they have quick receivers who should be able to get separation.
We were 1 for 3 on 4th down and 5 for 13 on 3rd down today. We weren’t converting very well at all. They had no timeouts with 1:14 on the clock. The smart thing was line up and try to draw them offsides. If that doesnt work you audible back like your going to shotgun snap it then quick kick it and try to pin them deep. No one would fault smith if he kicks it and then they march down and still win.
Man, so much to write about with this one, but unfortunately I don’t have the time. I’ll be gone all day tomorrow and most of next week doing renovations. Hopefully I’ll find a few hours. What a disaster. Not just the 4th down call, but Smith and Co. not challenging Hodgin’s clear catch. Other thing that killed us were drops, but that happens. These types of coaching errors should not.
COMPLETELY agree with not challenging what was a very clear catch, cost the Beavers and first down and sustaining a drive. I don’t know what the rules are on doing a replay, but if they’re not going to call a replay, challenge the damned call. As for going for it on 4th and 4, I don’t agree with that decision, but I do agree with the play selection. That’s a tough route to complete. I was expecting a drag route over the middle to Togaia (sp) as he’s been about as sure handed as we’ve had the past few weeks. This was another shoulda, coulda, woulda game that didn’t go the Beavs way this week but did last weekend vs. ASU. Tough pill to swallow but I really liked the way the Beavs played offensively. Defensively, WSU is just a tough out and I thought the Beavs played too soft at the LOS giving those receivers too much cushion especially on the next to last TD as the announcers mentioned.
I don’t give the Beavs much of a shot next weekend, but you never know. This team should really be at 7-4 but not to be. That said, I think the future looks very bright and the valuable experience that many of the younger players got this season will be a big plus for next season.
(I’m sure I am beating a dead horse)
What in the actual fuck is wrong with Smith? There is ballsy, and there is reckless. Reckless has cost us two games.
I have it at 4 games between reckless and personnel (seems to be getting at the latter, if for nor reason injuries forced his hand) and worse at the former.
The thing is I like Smith…except these major problems. Not sure what to do about it.
I just heard coach smith presser. He said he doesn’t care and will back to coach the team next weekend and next year. He did mention he appreciates your perfect coaching decision making and will keep reading AB for pointers.
Come on, that fake punt against Hawaii was definitely a WTF moment also. My criticism is that these “ballsy” decisions are not coming with great play calling either. If you are going to do these things, you better have some fucking outstanding plays ready to go.
So based on all the predictions from the prior thread and the betting lines OSU actually out coached WSU. That fact that the beavers had a chance to win by the offense converting a first down and that the defense also had a chance to win by getting a stop. It’s too simple minded to say we lose and it’s the coaches fault. Shoot maybe should have been a blow out without some good coaching moves
I support Smith’s decision to go for it on 4th down. Get a first down, win the game. Simple. I think people are overlooking how much time was left and how damn efficient WSU was at moving the ball down field. 20-25 more yards for them to cover with more than a minute left, not that much of a difference. Now, if there was 20 seconds, 30 seconds, 40 seconds, then punt it. The Cougs were going to move the ball down the field.
Who’s to say Rodriguez doesn’t get off a nice punt and Wazzu is pinned back inside the 10. They also committed four turnovers on offense, more snaps more possibilities. Instead of trying to stop them from the two-yard line, you’re defending against a 40 yard Hail Mary. I could understand the decision a little more if Wazzu had all of their timeouts.
But here’s the thing. If the plan is to play for a first down to seal the game – why have three straight run plays prior to that? Why does the clock matter at that point? Is that normally how you’d try and get first downs? Of course not you’d mix passes in. Instead of running four plays to get a first down, he ran three plays to run clock and one play to get a first down. Much lower odds of being successful when you let it ride on one play.
I mentioned above that a true “gambler” would have run a play-action on 2nd and 4 and gone for the win instead of allowing two predictable run plays that ended up creating the 4th and 4 and put Smith in the situation to make a dumb decision.
And to the asshole who down-votes all of my comments, no matter the content. please proceed.
Yours truly good ole PBH predicted this afternoon “Aunt Patty will find a way to steal a heartbreaking forth quarter win.” He didn’t have to steal it. It was delivered gift wrapped with a card: “Merry Christmas” from Jonathon.
Man I miss Anderpants! He was smart enough to lose every game well before the 4th quarter so there would never be the potential for stupid calls at the end to cost us the game. Oh for the glory days of Collins, Mitchell, Blount, Garretson, and McMaryion! I think that’s what really makes Luton look like a back-up QB, he has to follow in the shadow of all those greats.
Holy shit I can’t believe how these idiot coaches keep ruining games and my life! Players head and shoulders above everyone talent wise but coaches suck!!!
Hello people, they didn’t blow it against Stanford. Stanford almost blew it against us. Unfortunately teams grow throughout a season so you can’t say oh we should be playing like the present all year long and we would have this many wins.
Tough loss. We are trending the right direction and I expect that to continue. Overall I am pleased with the progress. My expectations have been exceeded for this year. If our defense gets a little better than maybe niner makes different choices during the game.
I’m in the same boat. Almost all the games under Smith have been entertaining to say the least. He’s proven he can coach and pick a good staffs. They game plan decently and motivation never seems to be a problem.
He plays alot of hero ball with decisions but I don’t see a better time .for him to get that experience than now. We will never expect less than a winning season again while he’s coach.
Considering the margin on Stanford, WSU and Hawai combined is 7 I think expecting mid teir conference play is a good one. Specially with how young our team is.
I like to look at competitive versus non-competitive games. I would say there have only been 2 non-competitive games this year and Okla St. was semi-competitive for awhile. That’s definite progress, although I hope there is not a slight regression next season with a new QB. Leach made a bowl game in his second season at Wazzu and then the third season they fell back to 3-9 before the program surged forward.
How many games did riley go by the book run run run punt only to have Banker roll out the prevent a win defense and also lose the game? I am glad JS is consistent and stays aggressive. If he doesn’t try the on-side kick, they aren’t even in the game at the end. That was aggressive and it worked.
Perhaps the learning curve for the coaches is getting to the right sequence and types of plays for these situations, but at least we are in these situations. I’ll repeat what I said after last week: It is nice to debate how it should be won, rather than get boat-raced by 40 every game.
JS will continue to mature as a Head Coach. He has coaches around him that are pretty intelligent and his philosophy tends toward Chip Kelly/Chris Petersen rather than Mike Riley. That should be applauded by all of us because the greatest fear from this hire was the Riley 2.0 effect, which was terrifying.
At this point, I don’t count the Beavs out of the CW. Herbert is pedestrian and makes some idiotic throws every game. The issue is going to be Ducks d-line and whether beavs can give Luton time. I think Beavs could win by 2 tds actually.
also agree. I find it ironic that on this blog, of all places, we have people lamenting a diversion away from the way Mike Riley would have handled that situation.
I think many forget about MR going for two against Missouri for the bowl win or trying to get two against the Huskies and failing. How about Jacquizz on the roll-out pass for a TD. Mike Riley would have punted in that situation and it would have been the correct decision.
Ham limited was super obvious. It’s like he has almost 90% of our sacks or something. Idk of Bradford would have made a big difference. It seemed like they made priorities of jj, hodgins and Noah. Champ had 100 yds so it’s not like the 2 and 3 were absent.
Champ looked like the fastest player on the field last night. They double and tripled covered Hodgins, so it was nice to see someone step up.
I’m not sure Ham should have even been out there, but it was admirable that he tried. I’m sure this won’t be popular, but I don’t think Tibesar came up with anything impressive in the game plan that confused Wazzu’s offense. Gordon made some stupid throws, but on key plays receivers were running wide open. I know it’s playing “what if”, but take away the turnovers and this game would not have been close. The Beavs lost with a +4 advantage!
Yeah, for that TO differential and that point margin, you’re right. But many here said they’d need TOs to win and that’s exactly what they did. I feel like Smith wasted a valiant effort. And I know it sound absurd to use the term “valiant” with that many yards and TDs given up.
McCant’s (sp?) INT exemplified effort and playing through to get the INT. Nobody blames him if he just bats it down, but he tracked it, twisted, maintained focus, and got the INT.
On the positive, the team is playing hard, not quitting, and they’ve been entertaining in most games.
Perhaps the challenge will be getting these “gambling/strategic” calls right so a pattern of disapointment doesn’t set in on the players and then they start quitting.
Even one of the many mediocre bowl games would have been a good reward for these players given what they’ve gone through.
They COULD beat UO, but just like when OSU had a shot at the Rose Bowl, UO likes to play spoiler and that’s the motivation. UO will get manhandled by Utah and wind up in San Antonio or something.
I’m down on Smith’s reckless decisions, but I appreciate the aggressiveness when it’s in a good situation. I doubt any of us thought that they would still have a chance for bowl eligibility going into the final game of the season. I am hoping, the Beavs are just setting us up for a perfect ending by beating the Quacks to get eligible. I too would love to see the Duckies fall to an average bowl game, of course their mascot will still be in every ESPN commercial.
I went back through the thread’s coverage of the last hour of real time to deconstruct the observations of several commentators in order to construct my morning-after sense of things:
All times PST:
8:37 Angry says we won’t go bowling but it was a good year nonetheless (concur)
8:38 ObjCritic says OSU needs to improve its run-blocking (this would prove prophetic on the last possession)
8:45 WFO writes that if O-line can run block there’s a chance (also prophetic)
8:50 Nuclear Beaver, discussing Smith’s decision to go for two, opines that with Smith you have to take the good with the bad (nuff said)
8:59 Jock Itch Observes that OSU is not milking the clock sufficiently (prophetic)
9:09 Angry observes OSU D can’t make a stop (prophetic)
9:20 Beavs4Ever notes that 13 seconds is on the clock when Luton calls the snap and OSU scores
9:32 Nuclear Beaver, after the ball is turned over on downs says “1:10 [clock time] is a shit load of time for WSU” (the point I kept trying to make in defense of going for it on 4th because WSU offense is so efficient, our D so gassed, that on D OSU would not put up much resistance) Actually it was 1:14
10:06 (after the game has ended) Mckalk criticizes the lack of innovation on the 2nd and 3rd down plays calls. (concur. It’s easy to criticize the 4th down call and its execution, but, and here’s the ironic thing, Smith was not a sufficient gambler on the 2nd and the 3rd down play calls.)
Summary: As Angry said an hour before the outcome was known and a Defeat likely, it HAS been a good season. Exceeded my expectations in wins (I had said 4 before the season began) and even more so in terms of overall competitiveness and entertainment. At the tactical level, everything that played out negatively in the end sequence (failure to convert a first down; failure to keep WSU out of the end zone) was predicted by commentators on this blog in the hour before it happened.. Also, I’m not buying the field position version of the transitive property that because WSU was on the OSU 2 with 4 seconds left, that if they had to start, most likely within a yard or two of their own 15 that they could not have been in a position to win it at the end. The penalties on the OSU D would have translated to more yardage if the field was longer, for one thing. Nor was there any indication in the last 5 minutes of the game that the OSU D had another “stop” in them. Conversely, WSU showed all night that it could Defend the run and on many occasions get the stop. WSU turnovers were the equalizers and in some respect their influence creates a misleading perception.
Final point: my great thanks to Angry for creating this forum. It’s so much fun conversing with the likes of BeeG and OoBie while the game is going on.
Agree if you are going to go for it on 4th needed to change the play calling, he tried to play both strategies, milk clock and be agressive. This is where a more mobile QB would have been nice, love to see a boot to the far side with a RPO on 3rd. Or if you are going to run change formation. I believe they were under center on 1-3rd down
Seattle Times calling out UW coaching staff after loss at CU.
“What took place at Folsom Field Saturday was not an anomaly for Washington this season. It was another shellacking at the hands of an otherwise inept opponent, where UW looked both outmatched and outwitted.”
Missed this game; I’ll spend some time this morning combing through everyone’s comments.
Just to preface — I got into watching Beavers football during the 28+ season < .500 drought. All the games I attended during that time were away games, many of which were the typical 40+ points – 7 deluges.
I'm sure I'm not the only visitor here who endured that experience.
What I can say. I am supportive of /this/ team, and where it has indicated it would like to go.
I have some measure of confidence it will get there.
How many of us can honestly say this? That is a good thing.
I'm already looking forward to next season already.
Such a large faction of Beaver fans and media online today saying the other portion of the fan base criticizing that 4th down call are being ignorant because “if i told you in the pre-season we would lose a heart-breaker to become almost become bowl eligible, you would have never believed it”
It’s that loser mentality that Beaver nation just can’t shake. Yes, very few people predicted a bowl season, and I think most can agree that knocking on that door is a sign of progress. But can we also agree that making a bad decision cost this team a chance to go bowling when they nearly had that outcome wrapped up?
The just be happy you are where you are crowd is the reason we get ourselves signed up for lifetime contracts because of 6 win seasons.
Don’t get me wrong, I’m pleased with the progress Smith and his staff have made in his short time here, and I look forward to watching them continue to grow. They’re an entertaining and hard working team and they are exactly the type of team that I like to root for. Underdogs who outwork the competition. I’m very pleased in this regard.
It’s the reckless decision making at a point in the game when the cost/benefit of that decision didn’t warrant it that has me disappointed, because of what could have been. Today, we should be arguing over which bowl game would select us.
If they want a “gambler” mentality coach, then go get a high school coach who onside kicks every time and never punts. If the Beavs had been 2-8, I would say go ahead and take the risk. When a bowl bid is on the line and the perks that go with it, you error on the side of being conservative. If Wazzu can drive 80 plus yards in a minute with no timeouts, then they earned it. This is not a “poor little Beavers team” they’ve played everyone tough except Utah, they deserve a bowl bid. Now the odds of that have decreased greatly. I think Smith has taken three crazy risks this season with the fake punt against Hawaii and the two fourth downs. They all failed in execution, one worked because of a penalty. He should be learning, he’s not so far. As I said earlier, I want smart aggression, not recklessness.
here’s the thing. Given how fast WSU scored on their previous possession, there’s no reason to think WSU couldn’t have gone 80 yards to win. I get a kick (no pun intended) out of how Smith’s critics all presume that a punt in that position was going to pin the Cougs inside the 5. Based upon my fifty years worth of experience watching football the attempt would have been, surely, to TRY to stick one inside the 5-10 but it’s fifty=fifty prop at best; that is, just as likely it goes into the end zone. Since we are going on each of our favorite premises, do any of the critics of Smith’s decision really think an extra 22 yards, with 74 seconds left, with our D gassed, was going to stop Gordon? Smith was right. With that much time, try to win the game. With that much time, with that offense and the way it was clicking, the number of timeouts WSU had remaining was irrelevant.
First, no reason to call timeout there without running the clock down as much as possible. Could have let it run nearly another 17 seconds. This brings 74 seconds down to less than 60 seconds. And WSU had no timeouts.
And, sure, keeping the punt in the 5-10 yard range is risky if the team returns it, which is why you kick it out of bounds.
Which would you rather face?
A. WSU has the ball at their own 23(or further back) with less than 1 minute on the clock and no timeouts?
Or
B. WSU has the ball at their own 43 with 74 seconds and no timeouts.
I don’t either, it’s sort of bizarro world. Most of the time (notice I did not say all of the time) a team is not going to go 80 plus yards in less than a minute without a timeout. The one play where the Beavs tackled Borghi after a short gain almost cost them 20 seconds. They had to spike the ball twice just in the 57 yards they had to go. Odds are you get a punt inside the 20 when you are kicking from the opponents 43. Look, it’s admirable Smith wants to be aggressive, just don’t be stupid.
I think most people are looking at the improvement from the last two seasons and are pleased with it. Not a losers mentality, just happy with the continual improvement. I would imagine after next year everyone will expect to go bowling every year and within two years after that bitching that it is not a New Years bowl game and talking about how we should be 11-1 and not 9-3 :)
The only weakness in your argument is you
Want a gambler mentality when it works (onside kick to get back into the game) but you don’t want one when it fails. This team doesn’t have the scheme or talent to beat wazzu straight up so smith had to compensate for that. We have to chance to win this game if we keep trying to trade scores.
I hope In the near future when we have more talent upfront on d he doesn’t have to take these risks.
Nice find and yes that PI call looked pretty suspect to me, not much outrage about it here. Interesting that the call was made by the same ref who called targeting when it wasn’t.
every ONE of you guys critical of Smith’s decision-making at the end of the WSU game (that includes you, Angry) should listen to what Scotty posted from the Husky Honks show. Contributors to this site will greatly enhance their perspective on coaching with an edge and motivating teams. Smith was right, and those critical of his going for it on 4th down are Riley revanchists. There, I said it.
Nah. It was a dumb call trying to reinvent the game and flat out gamble under the guise of “I’m aggressive”…time and place for that, but last night wasn’t it. Punts can be the winning play. A good compromise was have Luton go out there, fake going for it (might have worked since they went for it last week), draw them offsides…and if not Luton punts. Good balance of aggressive and conservative that gives you a shot (with an offsides) and gives you the option to kick. That’s the genius call. He made the worst call of his career, it likely cost us the post-season, and we’re all going to have to deal with it. I like Smith, but I don’t like the degenerate gambler mindset. That’s very popular in football right now…going for it on 4th used to be rare. Now every coach is gambling. It’s a poor trend, but they do it because people reward them “for being aggressive”…it’s all that Tony Robbins mumbo jumbo about how to win at life and it sounds good…until Borghi jams it down your throat with 1 second on the clock. Then the reality of being a degenerate gambler and Tony Robbins sucker sets in.
At first glance, I was with the crowd that thought going for it on fourth down was a boneheaded move, but now I am not so sure. Consider the following:
4th and 4 — I would say the chances of converting it last night was 1 in 3. Maybe a little higher, but I will go with that. If we convert, that’s a W for the Beavs.
If we fail, they have to go 57 yards to win. Let’s say they have a 75% chance of succeeding. I think that’s a little high, but we still have a 25% chance to win.
If you accept these numbers, our chances of winning if we go for it are almost exactly 50/50 (0.33 + (.25 * .67))
If we punt, there are a lot of things that can happen, but let’s say the average outcome is the 15 yard line. So, in this case, the question becomes is it a better than 50/50 shot that we stop them from 85 yards if we have a 25% shot of stopping them from 57? I think it’s a pretty close call either way.
We put the game on the offense who had converted on just 25% of 3rd and 4th downs all game. The numbers were way less then 1 in 3 chance. More like 1 in 8/9.
And if luton would have quick kicked your almost assured they would not have a returner back for fear of having 1 less defender against a passing attempt. Say we kick it and pin them around the 15. They have would have to go 85 yards in most likely under a minute, that alone is a huge task even though they are equipped to do it. And if they do, well that’s football but at least they gave themselves the best shot to win. Which was forcing the WSU to drive 85 yards in 58 seconds or so, they did 58 yards in 1:08.
I’m armchair quarterbacking, but after that nice first-down run to make it 2nd and 4, I would have loved to see Luton fake to the back, roll out and hit Togiai on that TE drag play. I have to think Wazzu would have been selling out on the run and it would have been open. If not Luton could have run for whatever was there, just keep the clock running. Try to avoid an incompletion.
Saw this posted on the O-live comments and thought it was actually genius. Typical Chip Kelly.
“No, we do what Chip Kelly did in an NFL game, and then some. Have every player on offense hold and tackle a defender on third down, run the ball back to inside the 5 yard line, take a knee for fourth down, clock keeps running, snap the ball out the back of the endzone, squib kick the kickoff. That would be so hilarious, and so many Cougar fans would be furious. We may even invoke the NCAA to make a rule change.”
Holy shit, that is good. I would have called smith a genius if that happend. Yet here we are. That 3rd down would need to be a keystone cops type of play though like run 15 to 20 seconds off. Give it to Champ and tell him to not get caught
On a serious note, I’m pinning this loss on the O line’s inability to run block vs one of the worst run Defenses in the Pac12. They had a chance to take over the game after the defense got turnovers. If they could have blocked consistently JJ could have piled up the yards and played keep away from WSU’s offense.
I’ll also add that that while you have to run on that final possession the play calling was bone headed. At least threaten to spread the field out, hit the outside, keeper, anything other than up the gut 3 times. Literally anything.
My two cents…
The whole game played out almost perfectly for us with the TO’s giving us a chance to steal this and JS blew it.
When things started going south in the second half, we did not shorten the game by running the clock down before snapping the ball.
The onside kick was a great call. D was gassed and that lead would not hold up. Logical aggression.
With about five minutes on the clock you want to score and BURN time off the clock. Jake gave up at least 30 seconds by snapping the ball too early.
Our last possession should have been about getting a first down and running out the clock. So agree with JS.
The problem was the play calling and strategy were in conflict. The first three calls were conservative run out the clock calls. So if that is the strategy, you punt and play D with as long a field as possible. If JS had planned on using four downs, he should have been aggressive on the first couple downs.
He’ll play TE for us. We have another TE in this class, Tommy Spencer, who they intend to use more as a bkocking TE/OL hybrid, sortof how Stanford does with their jumbo lines.
Picked a good night to go so see a movie, just in time to miss a commitment.
But you all knew this was commitment was coming back in early October because I predicted he would eventually be a Beav after the Utah game. ;)
By the way, Ford v. Ferarri was worth checking out.
Beaver great Dylan Wynn playing in the Grey Cup this afternoon for the Hamilton Tiger-Cats. He had an outstanding season, but his team is in trouble today. Down 21-6 in the 4th to Winnipeg. I was surprised to see that he is up to 290lbs now, but is still quick.
People on Twitter have made a good point (if true, I didn’t pay close attention to this) that Smith had Luton snapping the ball with 15 seconds left on the final TD drive. Can anyone confirm? Another major problem if it’s true.
He was definitely not running the play clock out. The “unpredictable snap timing” defense doesn’t hold water either since they were running the same predictable play 3 times.
Yea definitely. Been a problem all season in instances where they’ve had the clock available to use as leverage. By the time they had to decide to go for it on 4th or punt, there should have been about 30 seconds left. Changes the dynamics of that decision quite a bit.
Posted here at 9:35,
“Luton gave ’em 17 seconds on that 4th down play.”
And, after the penalty at 9:39, the clock stopped,
“With Luton’s 17 seconds on it.”
We can only hope the ducks are looking past us for the championship game against utah. It has all the hallmarks of a trap game, other then the in state rivalry part. We shall see, but my hopes are not up.
Go Beavs!
How did you post so fast? That was within seconds!
You’re supposed to be hangin’ drywall!
I’m done (for today) and on my 2nd drink. Well earned!
He has premature finger.
Should have tried for first and third.
Go beavs
https://twitter.com/Kdyn2Cadyn/status/1198335311807467521
Did Trump comment?
The jersey letters and numerals are almost as orange as the president.
Don’t wear orange: BE Orange!
That’s some serious Beaver love and respect there…
Don’t think we have enough defense in this one. 41-38 bad guys.
That’s what I worry about. Need some TO’s and sound, mistake free offense.
Chain saw sound?
There’s a TO for you!
Helluva pick by McCarten
Oregon is running the ball down asu’s throat
Spoke too soon. ;)
Go Beavs!
Why doesn’t the SEC just play high school teams this week?
They are.
They do every week despite the narrative.
It’s nice to schedule a bye week in late November.
No kidding
Let’s hope they have a few trick plays and game planned well for cold conditions. Go Beavs! 38-28 Beav win!
As I said in the earlier thread, Oregon looks like the worst 9-1 team I’ve ever seen. ASU looks better tonight. Let’s hope it holds.
The fact they’re even in the discussion (along with Utah) shows how much of a joke the entire process is.
1. Oregon’s best opponent? Auburn. Who beat them. And has 3 losses.
2. Utah’s best opponent? USC. Who beat them. And has 4 losses.
Both teams are not worthy and LSU or Ohio St would destroy them.
Grant due for another pick?….pick 6?
Cougs come close to blow-out at home, but Gebbia gets two TDs back in garbage time…..
48-35 Cougs
anybody have a reliable bootleg stream link to share?
Of course my comcast won’t let me stream the regional Pac12 WA channel, and it appears this game is not on the main Pac12 station.
FYI, found one. Seems to work without any popup ads. At least so far…
http://yuganet.us/ncaaf-streams/oregon-state-vs-washington-state/
https://sportsurge.net/
Site where all the reddit stream posters went
Line creeped up to 11. Looks like the heavy betting on the Beavs caused a small correction.
Just have to get off to a fast start or at least not be down too far in the first half.
this is the best uniform combination the Beavs have at present
Aydon has the Michael Bennett minimum shoulder pads look going
Nice pick!
Ooh baby!
Huge break. Gotta make em pay with a TD.
AP!
this is as good a start as you could hope for. a turnover on D and the start of a nice drive on O.
Look like a team on a mission.
that’s what I’m talking about!
JJ baby
Luton just audibles into a 33 yard run.
That was nice.
Yea that was a nice read, they were bringing the strong side safety and everything collapsed over and took d-lineman off their gaps. All it took was one woof and there was a lot of green for him to work with.
99 yard drive
JJ.
Yeah baby
Team on a mission.
Wow, Wazzu’s D is terrible and our RB made them pay
Told you they do a lot of flailing.
I know I’m getting ahead of myself, but what is the best possible bowl scenario for the Beavs, and what is considered the most likely if they win tonigh
Hayes is fucking gold again.
Soap dish!
another turnover. right according to the script.
They clearly want to kill Borghi.
revenge for the maltreatment of Jacquizz back in Reser
Oooh baby.
Got away with a facemask.
Yep. Defense is swarming tho
Isaac Garcia is still a Beav??
That’s what I was thinking too. I havent heard that name in a long time.
Simi Kuli coming out on the next drive?
Defense should be stunting all game esp with a 4 man rush. Giving their QB fits early.
Nice fumble recovery. Again got to get a TD out of it.
that was a bad throw.
Oh oh bad Luton
excellent commentary by Wilson on the radio. ball should have been caught, but as a back shoulder throw it was too far in front of him. Points there would have made the Cougs feel some pressure
Tough drop by Hodgins.
Hodgins should have caught that.
He let it get into his body
Ugh. Could have snapped it when they had 12 men on the field and gotten a free 5 yards to make it 4th and 2. Missed opportunity that was there for the taking. Seen that happen too frequently. Gotta be ready to quick snap in those situations
That’s where Luton’s experience is supposed to be a positive factor…remember when that WSU QB did that to Banker’s un-set D in Corvallis? So easy..
yep, Luke Falk, as a freshman
Bad 3rd down throw by Luton and another one of those 4th down calls by JS. Some recurring themes. Tough not being able to take advantage of the turnover.
Pretty good time to go for it no FG kicker and punt nets 18 yards.
I agree, just sayin. Tough being in that kind of familiar situation right off the turnover.
Let’s see if wazzus come to Jesus meeting works. Tough drop by Hodgins. Work back a little more and that’s a completion.
Is Jamire Calvin still on the Coug squad. Remember when he flipped at the last minute in the early GA era?
Foot injury and he’s redshirting
Borghi was looking for the sideline there. could have had a few more
man. could ve had their third to. Wilson’s probably the weak link back there in many respects
That’s as bad as it gets.
Can’t drop a gift wrapped INT.
but as Jim Wilson implied on the radio, the offense’s failure to get a first down after the second turnover was a bigger setback
WTF
I saw that guy running across for 5 seconds before the pass how the hell did the defender just stand there.
Why isn’t hamilcar playing?
He’s going in a bit but he has a taped club on his hand.
Anyone know what happened?
Frick!
We should get good Luton versus this D. What the hell was that?
Shit
This game is frantic. We need to run more and gain control next possession. This frantic pace doesn’t help us.
Exactly
Lindgren is looking furiously through his “how do I calm him down?” play calls.
See if Luton goes cold now…
what was the over/under on this game?
Just turned it on to A Coug TD and a Luton pick. Turning it off now so I don’t jinx it
Thanks!
Can’t drop those and win, that’s two
that miss half-neutralizes the missed INT
D doing everything they can to win this game. Luton and co better start pulling their weight.
Hilarious I just said “he’s due for a miss “ to the lady
Callan says Hamilcar should be back in the game later. hurt his wrist
Nice D by that receiver to prevent the INT.
Nice catch by Taylor
Angry I have good news. Barnes is going to be on the halftime show. I’ll take notes for you.
shades of Chad Johnson
TD
Beautiful throw
One of the best he’s made all season
He learned how to throw a spiral last week. Only took 6 years. #peakingAtTheRightTime
Not gonna overturn that
Ducks are in a ball game.
Wouldn’t that be great
And a free 15 given after the TD. Come on man.
PAC zebras once again call a penalty on a player not on the field, #2 for Beavs…………changed to 16 after a few minutes. A sign of improvement for the zebras??
Luton got crushed on that throw.
Why the fuck was that unsportsmanlike? Seems like typical shit.
Herbert playing like shit. Just threw a pick
Why the fuck is Choikair kicking off? Pity?!?
We are punishing their receivers
D doing pretty well, should have another INT obviously but getting to ball so much quicker and tackling so much better than past several years.
man these guys are efficient in this system
Ducks gonna lose.
Mario fraud exposed.
Ducks are now officially in trouble: 21-7 with 12;43 LEFT
Herm gets that 2 pt conversion.
big fail there.
if the game is going to turn, it’s probably right here.
those are the kind of open field tackles that disappeared under GA
Herbert throws a beautiful pass right to the ASU defender
JIm Wilson chimes in big: it’s up to the OSU offense; have to step up.
That’s BIG JIM, to you!!
I stand corrected!
Missed sack…..huge gain
100% defensive breakdown. Great timing.
Gotta tackle
Well the good news is we can beat the Ducks.
They look like dog crap.
They’ve looked mediocre all year can’t believe their record.
yes. they will have little to play for next week if they lose tonight. Clinched northern division. No natty talk. they don’t care about the Civil War. good spot for OSU
And they’ll get bitch slapped by Utah in title game..
#6 got faked out bad…
Herbert imploding?
Oh yeah
First string center and a “premier” receiver out for second half.
Stay calm, Jefferson and Pierce on…O line needs to step up.
That was a nice throw and catch
ASU FG
Game. Set. Match.
what kind of call was that
Whoda thunk it? A screen for 17
It’s always uncatchable when the receiver is thrown out of bounds.
LOL
AP doing it.
Luton is definitely improved the past two weeks.
His throws looking much better….
That was a great play by Jake
Nice roll out to get out of a mess. Good throw on the run. Very good finish by Togia.
Nice throw to Musgrave, my preferred secret weapon drops it….Togiai comes through.
We need another turnover before the half.
You’re welcome
Lol
nice call bandit
DIdin’t you do that last week too?
Dux making a comeback? Gordon is a pick machine
Ooh baby.
Noah is looking like Jay Novachek out there tonight
C’mon Hayes
Big deal to score in last 2 min of half.
WSU can basically PI whenever they want apparently
Ugh terrible throw to wide open Togia.
Wright looked like a real P12 DB on that int.
meh I could’ve made that
that kick was almost perfect from nearly 50 yards out.
Why wasn’t Hayes our kicker earlier?
Better late than never
But seriously Smith should have to answer that question.
It is a good one.
Judging by Rodriguez reaction he was not confident lol
he wasn’t the kicker earlier because JS was still buying into the MR seniority system
I think so. Has Chouker ever made a 47+ yarder? Hayes seems fine on XP, too. I’m not seeing where chouker is better.
Kick off apparently
Nope, he has failed to kick out of endzone a few times when it was called for.
Can’t give up point with 26 seconds, we get the ball to start second. Given up point would kill momentum
THIS ^^^^^^^^
Hit Gordon
Cleanly and all, but sack him
Praise the Platinum loafer! Hayes with a huge make! Rodriguez looked shocked.
Anybody should be shocked the Beavers made a field goal…
But, #1 team in nation for TDs when in red zone I heard in pre game..
Big Dux rally.
They should drop in the polls at least, even if they win
What the hell happened? Lol
#3 for the quacks happened
Wow. Sparky let a guy run totally free for a TD
Goodnight, Duckies
The type of game Oregon should never have trailed in, but will come back to win in the end and somehow that will be evidence they belong in the playoffs. More convincing than a blowout win
Holy shit! Thank you baby Jesus! 81 yards for a TD on 3rd and long. Wow!
Holy fuck. Threw a prayer and it was answered
Lo fucking L ducks.
Ducks likely had that game until that play
I remember a time when ESPN was telling us Herbert was a shoe-in for Heisman and the #1 pick coming out a Jr.
Had he come out as a jr. Somebody would have likely bought that snake oil…
That celebration penalty was pretty good.
This Barnes guy sounds like he really knows what he is talking about. Glad he is our AD.
Crap
Wish he would have made that pick….
I didn’t notice the ASU cheerleaders, anyone else not notice?
Who called for an ASU win today? This guy…hope I’m right…
They are due for a loss, not as good as their record…
What about the cheerleaders
Don’t be shocked if the quacks end the season on a 4 game losing streak. Will be deflated for the civil war / Utah will roll them / won’t care and get boat raced in their bowl game. I will be a beautiful thing to watch.
But we’ll hear how Cristobal has them loaded for title runs…he can recruit so much better than he can coach..
Dux might still pull this out
One first down ends it.
Done!
You would think they would be keeping track of number3
what did I miss (or not) on the first Beav possession. I was watching the end of the Ducks game
uhhh luton actually pulled it on a read and ran for 2. lat pass for incom and a decent jermar set of runs I think.
No natty. So daddy
Dux lose!
ASU stormed the field. See it is catching
So saddy thanks a lot auto correct
Didn’t think sparky had it in him. Nice win for asu – they suck less than my predictions
Glad to be proven wrong.
Daniels going for 400 probs helped. That guy is danger.
He stood out first time I saw him, which I think was Michigan State. Going to be terrifying as a senior.
He will be one to watch. Great mobility, already throws a great pass…
it really is interesting that no Pac TWELVE team has ever gone undefeated in conference over what, 10 years now?
Its like playing more league games is hard
An “we-almost-came-back-and-won-and-kept-the-dream-alive-but-lost-anyway-and-have-a-late-flifght-home-to-dwell-on-it” is sweeter…
Flemings going big tonight, who would have thought.
Luton no
wow. back to back disasters on those plays. The one time Luton keeps on the RPO he gets blown up. Usually no one pays any attention to him
Second 4th down a receiver tried to body catch it
Too many beaver drops. Can’t win like that. Someone get the vaseline off their gloves
that’s a catch. a weird one, but a catch
Lindsey might have a (performance) anxiety disorder.
Maybe Lindsey Schnell can cure him..
whatever happened to Lindsay?
Lindsey with the huge drop
Huge talent weird anxiety problem. Needs a xanex pregame.
That Lindsey drop was a back breaker
no kidding. Both times OSU had a chance to put WSU under some real pressure they choked it away on their own.
ouch
Big Jim again on the radio, calling out the offense’s lack of production for the Beavs predicament, not the D
You are really missing out on the pac 12 announcers. They have weird words.
They are falling into the trap of getting into a passing contest with Leach.
Slow down, milk clock, and use your running backs.
Can’t just milk the clock, have to score.
Leach don’t care about TOP, they care about number of possessions and scoring quickly.
Well that didn’t take long…
RUN the ball, and not wide either.
EDIT/ADD: There ya go, 16yds on first down.
Yes Sir!
I think his foot hit the turf
Wtf, Hodgins had a foot for sure.
I think if the Beavs don’t stay calm and pull this one out, Oregon WILL have motivation next week: to keep Beavers out of a bowl game.
Hidgins rt foot was in!
How could they miss that?
Luton losing accuracy
Wow he was so in. Beavs staff major fail.
That was a big time fail, their booth guys should have called that down.
worst one since the CWS in 17
my fear is the Cougs pull away right here
Agree
This game is over
if the defense can’t make a stop on this drive, i agree.
One run and pass, pass, pass
Kinda defines Bull Shit.
Hodgins foots was in but he lost the ball on landing anyway
JJ and AP are both over 9 yards per carry. Why are we throwing at all?
Because we got stuffed time and again in the first half and they were daring us to throw. Once we did we started scoring again.
Because we have the best QB in school history…or something…
just picking them apart.
What we all feared IS HERE.
this game is now over
D line gassed. Can’t get any pass rush.
Of course Omar Speights has a perfect read on the draw. That guys awesome
Seen this before
wow. three take=aways and the game is still getting out of hand
Most qb’s could throw for 400 yds if they have 5 – 10 seconds to throw
Everytime we blitz he reads it and hurts us.
We’re not going to a bowl game still a good year.
Smith blowing games pisses me off most. Oregon might suck next week but my guess is they want to end our season and pad draft stats.
beavs secondary is losing track of where the WSU receivers are on the field.
Well that should do it.
Another area Beavers need to improve is run blocking, to have the mindset of aggressive drive blocking for sustained periods.
They defer to passing and never seem to develop that aggressiveness.
having a tall QB seems to have a hypnotic effect on OSU coaching staffs: Riley, GA, Smith, doesn’t matter . call it the Jeff George effect
Big Jim: OSU having another one of those games where OSU’s offense just disappears for a half
Dbacks have nothing.
just gassed. Tibbs has to blitz from now on
….and introducing Mr. Hyde..?
5 wins likely now. UO will want to keep OSU from bowling.
Could very well have been 7 at this point.
And it could have very well been 3. Can we move on from the last. It’s not like they were up on tree and gave it up at the end. The conference is crazy this year. Many close games. Hawaii is 7-4 so far. They beat us fair and square.
Luton hates spiders…he just killed one from 35 yards, strike!
should have been a TD
Uffgghhh, Lindsay get those hands under control bruh!
Third and two as the fourth qtr opens, four down time ……..if necessary.
Luton draw?
JJ gave up some decent yards with missed cuts on his two runs.
22 yd AP draw
Puppies down 0-13 at Colorado at the half. Prep the Husky Honks!
https://www.iheart.com/live/sports-radio-kjr-2565/?autoplay=true&pname=15400&campid=header&cid=index.html
that might lighten the mood after this missed opportunity
4th quarter prediction: 45-41 beavs. Art breaks 100 on a long scamper.
If the O line can actually run block there’s a chance.
So the Coug player makes the hush gesture to the visiting section….. no penalty. Champ does a lay down to sleep gesture and gets a 15 yd penalty. None of the rules or refs make sense anymore.
I thought that TD was going to be an INT for sure!
TEAGAN YOU FUCKER HOLY SHIT!!!
I don’t understand and therefore don’t like going for 2 here
Wrong ^^^^
were 4 behind with a kick, 3 behind with a 2pt and 5 pts behind with a failure. If you don’t get the 2pt then you need a td no matter.
@angry, going for two on this is completely right. Good call by Smith
Who said it isn’t?
Just stating that Smith was making a good decision. Gotta mark the good and the bad.
I thought it was an obvious call in the 4th vs a team scoring all over you…
Didn’t think it was worth mentioning either way.
Right ^^^^^
That’s one of the worst TD passes I’ve ever seen.
Luton knew right where to throw it, hahahah
Lol
Or, glass half full, one of the best receiving jobs.
Or one of the worst triple coverages ever.
A Razorback CWS coverage.
yup
No shit. Threw into quadruple coverage!
He saw the Bermuda Triangle and went yes let’s go for it!!
I give that to Teagan 100%, that pass was terrible.
Yes it was
Basically a jump ball. Good thing Teagan is 7’8”.
Need a stop here in a bad way.
D looks shot.
Yup this game will be lost because Smith won’t trust the running game to weardown the clock. Not sure why he has gone so pass heavy.
I should clarify that it’s been hurryup heavy on passing…..should be milking every second off the clock.
Only a TO will stop them
I’m just glad this defensive performance isn’t an Every game thing like it was a few years ago.
just a machine
Zero pass rush. Is Hamilcar still out?
Hes been in and out
Sharpe needed hands up there. Tough okay to
Defend. If Herbert was throwing that it woulda been a short hop.
Out there on this 4th. He threw that in 1 second so i don’t think it mattered.
On 4th and 1 why would you play off the receiver 5 yds.
anyone seem to notice how well WSU is playing the last two weeks after their coach ripped them.
Gordon now holds the major passing records, but does anyone think this guy is the best PAC QB ever? Another example of misleading stats.
Herbert is the GOAT
I may be off, but all the guys on the top passing list are within the last 4-5 years.. is this more a product of teams not really playing defense/relying more on shootouts to win?
It’s due to targeting rules, emphasis on offense, and defense deemphasized. Is it just me, or I remember when 500 yards of offense was absolutely the outlier??? Now it’s the average.
D looks gasssed
Nine minutes to go, doesn’t require continual passing!
man, back to back miracle catches
Best receiver in the nation. Go vote!
Now if Beavs D can make a miracle catch we’ll be in business!
EDIT: Sp Tms miracle catch on the onsides will do!
Miracle tackle?
Good risky and not because it worked but because the D can’t get a stop.
Spot on ^^^^^^
Good risk too cause it was a squib and would have gone to like the 30 anyway
Time for another turnover. They’ll get one on this series.
I cant take credit for this one, I’m sure I posted after it happened. The next wsu series will be a turnover.
I love Smith the gambler. it reminds me of Dennis.
Coaching tree….some Ericjson gambler, some Petereen pragmatism and recruiting …his coaching tree is why I wanted him in the HC candidate pool.
Minus the whiskey breath.
Couldn’t agree more. Love the creativity. Love having a coach like that.
So Choukair has pinpoint accuracy if he’s trying to hit a player, but can’t get it in a 10 yard window for a FG?
What a stupid call and throw.
The touchdown?
Oooooh baby.
LMAO cougar fan flipping the bird in front of the camera – classy :D
Just saw that LOL
That was awesome!
This is a wild ass game.
A real gambler would go for a second onsides, at least Choker forced a touchback,.
Let’s go Deeeeeee!
Classy coug fan
O M A R !!!!!
Ohh my
Daniels sets ASU single game TD record and has 44 on season?!?
Choukair kick drilling that guy was redemption for the guy and now a pick
Yessss
Milk the clock!
Heavy run
Yes just keep running.
Maybe one play action
Tisebar turning the ship it appears…they are giving up points but not giving up.
Wow, this is nice.
I like AP over JJ in this spot.
13 seconds still on play clock when Luton snapped it
I know
Weeeeeeeeee!
Gotta say, I tihnk JJ hates losing.
This.
that was a helluva throw by Luton under pressure and with accuracy
It was…just the way they draw it up.
Take the skinheads bowling take them bowling!
Mario just took a backseat to JS tonight – drivers seat for COTY….?
When was the last time an OSU team got 5 turnovers in a game?
No idea and I’m not gonna look lol
make em earn it. no cheap gains.
Keep this bastages in bounds
One more turnover to cap off the night.
Too much to ask, will need one long drive.
Uhhhhh pass rush?
The way he stands up straight pisses me off for some reason.
Hamilcar?
Where’s the holding on Coug offensive line?
Recover the kick and a first down and we win
man, that two point conversion earlier looks pretty good right now. :)
Herm and the pirate are jealous
Herm got his today, fast learner?
Dang that was nice coverage
The Taco makes a play
Almost lost that.
OSU’s 4 on 6 isn’t getting any pressure.
Good job Taylor! Back from injury!
is this four down territory?
JJ running scary.
Crap, having deja vu about last week… get the freaking first down here!
Feels pretty important.
Fuck we needed a first on that 2nd down
Rhetorical question, looked like helmet-to-helmet on Taylor on kick coverage…
Thats a shit load of time for WSU…
Yuck
Time to step up, D!
That was dumb
no flag this week
QB kick after trying to draw offsides
WB quick kick?!?
My internet stream is lagging, hanging up…
Coug’d it
not yet!
Luton gave ’em 17 seconds on that 4th down play.
Oh no
Smiths stupidity evident this week because he wasn’t bailed out.
I’ll say it again…. why the fuck was the offense in hurryup earlier in the game leaving 20-30 secs on clock at a time.
Exactly
That play was nuts
The right call there was to line up like going for it, try to draw them offsides, then have Luton punt.
Yup. See it in the NFL constantly
What I called…
BAD BAD BAD loss.
shit, penalty stops the clock
With Luton’s 17 seconds on it.
The irony
So why wasn’t it targeting/penalty in kick coverage?!?
Fucking stupid call going for it.
I think my heart beat is about 150 bpm
Would be nice to have Whittley do one of those crazy snap explosion fall over things.
It would be nice to have a coach use some common sense on a 4th down with a gassed defense.
Put WR Hodgins in to rush the passer
Damn, Borghi will get a chance here to make good on his promise.
ughhhhh
Not PI.
That was great coverage.
I need a tums
I stopped watching. It helps some
Fuck.
Plenty of reasons for the result tonight, one of which is a 6th year senior QB giving away 17 seconds.
Broadway Borghi called it…
Smith’s 4th loss…
Punt you win.
After UH, Stanford, what was his third?
As I understand, Nevada game last year. If I remember correctly, Smith ironically went conservative and relied on Choukair to win it instead of pushing for the TD.
Yes
Last years Nevada game.
Yup….too aggressive and/or wreckless. This one is ALL on the coaches. Thought the def did enough to get off the field, then the Offense sped up the plays and put the D right back out there — the D was obviously gassed and we have three timeouts available. Horrible coaching from top to bottom!!!!
We Couged it
Defeat snatched from the jaws of victory.
Poor clock management…shoulda QB quick kicked in 4th
I don’t know if punting would have really stopped the Wazzu offense, but I sure would have liked to see them have to go the extra 40 yards…
possibly only an extra twenty yards. Smith made the right call. his defense was not going to stop WSU with that much time left.
Well, quick kick and maybe a WR ends up with the ball in a scrum…
Or Luton is “roughed” kicking and you get a flag.
If not, they farther to ho…
Well, quick kick and maybe a WR ends up with the ball in a scrum…
Or Luton is “roughed” kicking and you get a flag.
If not, they have farther to go..
When a gymnastics floor routine unsportsmanlike…
He did stick the landing.
This one was squarely the fault of our coaches.
I’m getting sick of Smith losing games under the lame guise of “I’m aggressive”
Leach: “We did everything to lose the game and then we found a way to win.”
Beavers should be at 8 wins now…
Should have at least 7, probably 8.
Wonder if other coaches start to use this against the Beavs in recruiting…”why would you want to play for a coach who doesn’t put you in a position to win?”…thing is if Smith wins next week he could still win COY. So it’s only the astute who get this fine line.
that was a heart breaker. needed just one first stupid first down.
JS should be bitch slapped for that.
Yeah. Gotta punt. Much tougher to go at least 80 yards in just over a min with no TOs left than to go 57 yards when they’ve been slicing us up all night.
Dogshit. Smith needs to own this one.
After the penalty, fair catch the kickoff and throw a Hail Mary if that is aloud.
I like the onside call. The coaches will learn from this one. Great job keeping the team engaged when a lot of commenters on here gave up.
He should have taken a knee. Give us a one shot at the end zone.
Absolutely no pass rush
Lindseys dropped pass
Lutons poor clock management
At least 4 dropped passes
Questionable play calling
Smith going for it instead of pinning them deep
ALL + A LOSS
Well fuck.
Of all the fucking dumb shit moves, this takes the cake. Kick and you play in some random bowl game and look like a hero. Probably win some coaching award for turning around a 1-11 team. But no. We try and get cute, and lose the game because it worked that one time. Fucking stupid stupid stupid.
Next week they will get blasted out of the stadium by a highly overrated ducks team.
Smith must have some high stress memory loss thing going on. Why on God’s green earth would you not kick it?
It was stupid last week, too, but it was covered up by “I’m aggressive” and a PI call.
ASU wasn’t marching on us like WSU was. Still the first one was unacceptable, and it was asinine to try again.
Cuz he thinks Teagan is 7’8” tall.
And he still couldn’t jump high enough.
It was pretty damn close though…arguably had his hands on it..
If we lost after a punt and the Cougs went 80+ for a win in 1 minute, I would have tipped my cap to the Cougs. But when the coach loses the game it’s hard to accept. Smith is a liability for the exact opposite reasons as Riley.
https://twitter.com/angrybeavs/status/1198479889055150080
So who else should we hire as the coach? It sucks we lost. It turned out to be a bad gamble. I’ll support smith knowing he is loyal and is learning how to be a better head coach. You know he will not sleep good tonight. He is obviously a motivator. If it was up to many in this blog the team shoulda just quit and loaded the bus at the end of the third. The talent they have should not have equaled 5 wins. The qb that is so terrible made throws all
Over and had some lucky catches but also some bad drops. It’s easy to jump on someone when things don’t go the way we want it.
I’m predicting how many fans next year will complain that Luton isn’t back for a 7th year because he can put the ball in a catchable position. Watching Herbert today, it’s not a given to have a starting d-1 qb who can throw it accurately.
Some good and some bad this year. Let’s go get a win next weekend and throw a little salt on the ducky wound. Go Beavs
“…You know he will not sleep good tonight. He is obviously a motivator. If it was up to many in this blog the team shoulda just quit and loaded the bus at the end of the third. The talent they have should not have equaled 5 wins. The qb that is so terrible made throws all
Over and had some lucky catches but also some bad drops. It’s easy to jump on someone when things don’t go the way we want it…
Some good and some bad this year. Let’s go get a win next weekend and throw a little salt on the ducky wound. Go Beavs.”
This seems like a good summary in terms of general analysis & sentiment following this game, as well as the season overall imo.
Note that Cristobal (2) Smith, Edwards all camp their teams 2-4 games…
Just two thoughts:
1. On one hand, Smith should have punted on 4th down at the end there.
2. On the other hand, with the Beavers consistently rushing only four guys at most at the QB, I think Washington St probably would’ve won anyway. Should’ve sold out completely to sack him.
At least Oregon looks beatable.
No way on earth is this team marching into Autzen and not getting their asses beat HARD
Now this Oregon team has no shot at the national championship and are already guaranteed a Pac-12 championship game berth, they have no reason to get up for this game. Plus, the Ducks don’t scare me whatsoever.
Their motivation is to end their rival’s season. Come on…
Fuck you coward.
Hamilcar, with bum hand, wasn’t much of a factor tonight. Hope he is healed by next week.
Did he injure it in the ASU game or at practice? Also, I was surprised at how good the WSU o-line was. Of course, they get a lot of reps at pass protection!
Mike Leach should send Jonathan Smith a thank you card.
Didnt like the call last week. Didnt like it tonight. Conventional wisdom says you punt it and make them go the length of the field with no timeouts.
JS probably cost his team a bowl game.
He definitely cost them a bowl game. At least 3 times this season alone.
Like Yogi Roth said. You go for it on 4th down and if it doesn’t work, you’re giving them a chance.
And that was exactly what the Cougs needed. Short field with a short clock and a gunslinger quarterback, at home, on senior night? That’s the perfect recipe for a comeback.
Punt if and they’re at mid field with less than 20 seconds left.
Fucking stupid call.
And so many Beaver fans excusing it like “we wouldn’t be where we are without the gambler mentality!”
No, there’s gambling when you need to make something happen in your favor, and there’s just flat out making a stupid decision. Going for it was stupid.
You play percentages for a reason.
What a kick in the nuts….by our own coach
Asinine decision to go for it, especially given WSU had no timeouts. Here’s the thing, if Smith is really a gambler then you call for play-action pass on second down on that last possession and go for the kill. They call two predictable run plays on 2nd and 3rd down that net zero yards. There’s smart aggressive and stupid aggressive, I’m counting more stupid aggressive than smart aggressive this year and it has cost some valuable practice time for a young team.
Perfectly said
Yes, Smith f’d up but Luton not letting the play clock run down all the way is just as bad. This is also on
Smith.
Jonathan “The Masturbator”Smith…
Loves to beat himself…
They snapped the ball on our last TD with 13 and 17 seconds on the play clock.
They meaning our 6th year sr. quarterback who should know better and our coach who
didn’t tell him to milk the clock.
His experience is the difference…
Actually, I suspect they are trying to catch the D by not using clock and having a more predictable snap time. Is that a plausible speculation of their rationale?
Not saying I agree with it…
I’d like somebody to ask Smith”What have you learned in year 2 as a HC? What will you do differently in the future?!!”
if he keeps doing this will he get a pass (no pun intended) because he’s an OSU guy?
A pass?……….He’s in the clear for at least two more years.
He’s already put up a better season than any of Anderpants’, so there’s that
No timeouts and a lot has to go right to go 80 yards in 60 or 62 seconds. Beavs keep it in front if them and Wazzu would have had to make more dangerous throws or be lucky to get down to 15 yard line with more than 7 or 8 seconds left.
Much easier to defend a 2nd and 10 from 15 yard line with 4 seconds left than a 1st and 2 with 4 seconds left. Would have been very tough for WSU to do much better than that with no timeouts.
We can only hope this will be a lesson learned by our young, naive head coach. It’s too bad it had to come with such a high cost. No bowl game and no COY. Big gamble, big loss.
Now I’m feeling sorry for the kids. That’s a soul crusher of a loss, especially with what was on the line. It’s going to be tough to rally mentally in 7 days.
That the team has rallied after Utah (and OkieState) is a credit to Smith; but, it’s a taller task to respond from this close loss than those beat downs.
On the plus side, quacks have pretty much nothing to play for next week.
They’ll still beat us by 30.
They’ll play to end our season.
They’re on a higher enough level as a program, unfortunately, I don’t think they really care
It’s in Autzen and their fans will make sure they care about ending the Beav’s season.
The bowl factor is probably the biggest thing. You got to figure the thought of a bowl game 2 years ago, even last year was mostly a pipe dream to the players. They held it in their hand about 30 minutes ago, only for it to slip away from stupidity.
Maybe they can rally around that? I won’t hold my breath.
@blackbandit-They rallied down 12 when they couldn’t stop wazzu and the offense had sputtered. I’m sure smith can motivate them to get ready to play their rival. If this team can’t rally they would have lacked it in after starting 1-2.
Some people go all crazy after a sporting event. Like these kids are use to competing and know wins and losses happen. Luckily they don’t flip out and think the world is over like some fans.
Agree, Beavs will be motivated, that’s the new “identity” of this team now that Anderpants (and Riley) are in the rearview mirror.
Smith said it best (paraphrased) ” Preparation and Execution are as, if not more, important than motivation “………….add in coaching decisions and I think you’ve got it.
I understand what your saying. But this is way bigger to them then you think. Winning is the goal, but bowl games are the prize for the years of hard work. They had the prize and then they didn’t.
Is would change the perception of the program. Correction, it would have.
The play call came down to simply, who has been better, the offense or defense. Clearly offense has been better and you take the chance to win. Hindsight is 20/20. Easily could have punted it, and they just march down and still score and everyone looking back and saying we should have played to win it and not lose it. Tough loss but too many things to point to one play or call
4th and one maybe. 4/4 was dumb.
And again, it was not a great call for such a critical situation. They decided to throw a long-ish out to the second string TE there? Last week’s call was terrible also and only bailed out by the PI, which probably only gets called 20% of the time in that situation. There have to be better plays, they have quick receivers who should be able to get separation.
We were 1 for 3 on 4th down and 5 for 13 on 3rd down today. We weren’t converting very well at all. They had no timeouts with 1:14 on the clock. The smart thing was line up and try to draw them offsides. If that doesnt work you audible back like your going to shotgun snap it then quick kick it and try to pin them deep. No one would fault smith if he kicks it and then they march down and still win.
Kicking it can be playing to win…
With a win tonight, Beavs would have been guaranteed to finish 2nd in the Pac12 North.
Is there a trophy for that? I’m hoping to watch a bowl game featuring the Beavs that’s all I care about.
Man, so much to write about with this one, but unfortunately I don’t have the time. I’ll be gone all day tomorrow and most of next week doing renovations. Hopefully I’ll find a few hours. What a disaster. Not just the 4th down call, but Smith and Co. not challenging Hodgin’s clear catch. Other thing that killed us were drops, but that happens. These types of coaching errors should not.
That wasn’t a catch the ball came loose when he hit the ground, yes the toe touched, but he didn’t maintain possession
That’s what I thought on that play, but the numbnut announcers didn’t really bring up that point. He lost the ball when he hit the ground.
I didn’t see that, but if it’s true then it makes sense.
COMPLETELY agree with not challenging what was a very clear catch, cost the Beavers and first down and sustaining a drive. I don’t know what the rules are on doing a replay, but if they’re not going to call a replay, challenge the damned call. As for going for it on 4th and 4, I don’t agree with that decision, but I do agree with the play selection. That’s a tough route to complete. I was expecting a drag route over the middle to Togaia (sp) as he’s been about as sure handed as we’ve had the past few weeks. This was another shoulda, coulda, woulda game that didn’t go the Beavs way this week but did last weekend vs. ASU. Tough pill to swallow but I really liked the way the Beavs played offensively. Defensively, WSU is just a tough out and I thought the Beavs played too soft at the LOS giving those receivers too much cushion especially on the next to last TD as the announcers mentioned.
I don’t give the Beavs much of a shot next weekend, but you never know. This team should really be at 7-4 but not to be. That said, I think the future looks very bright and the valuable experience that many of the younger players got this season will be a big plus for next season.
(I’m sure I am beating a dead horse)
What in the actual fuck is wrong with Smith? There is ballsy, and there is reckless. Reckless has cost us two games.
I have it at 4 games between reckless and personnel (seems to be getting at the latter, if for nor reason injuries forced his hand) and worse at the former.
The thing is I like Smith…except these major problems. Not sure what to do about it.
I just heard coach smith presser. He said he doesn’t care and will back to coach the team next weekend and next year. He did mention he appreciates your perfect coaching decision making and will keep reading AB for pointers.
But he has to be strategic. What he did on fourth down was not strategy, it was more like hope. Plus, to WSU it probably looked a lot like last week.
Beaved it in Pullman. Ouch.
Come on, that fake punt against Hawaii was definitely a WTF moment also. My criticism is that these “ballsy” decisions are not coming with great play calling either. If you are going to do these things, you better have some fucking outstanding plays ready to go.
CBS poll results this week show angry at one end of the spectrum, chuck at the other.
So based on all the predictions from the prior thread and the betting lines OSU actually out coached WSU. That fact that the beavers had a chance to win by the offense converting a first down and that the defense also had a chance to win by getting a stop. It’s too simple minded to say we lose and it’s the coaches fault. Shoot maybe should have been a blow out without some good coaching moves
That’s the Beaver spirit! Our coaches saved the team from getting blown out. Hip hip hooray, hip hip hooray, hip hip hooray!
I support Smith’s decision to go for it on 4th down. Get a first down, win the game. Simple. I think people are overlooking how much time was left and how damn efficient WSU was at moving the ball down field. 20-25 more yards for them to cover with more than a minute left, not that much of a difference. Now, if there was 20 seconds, 30 seconds, 40 seconds, then punt it. The Cougs were going to move the ball down the field.
WSU got into the endzone with 2 seconds on the clock. You’re saying 24 more yds wouldn’t have mattered?
Who’s to say Rodriguez doesn’t get off a nice punt and Wazzu is pinned back inside the 10. They also committed four turnovers on offense, more snaps more possibilities. Instead of trying to stop them from the two-yard line, you’re defending against a 40 yard Hail Mary. I could understand the decision a little more if Wazzu had all of their timeouts.
It very well could have.
But here’s the thing. If the plan is to play for a first down to seal the game – why have three straight run plays prior to that? Why does the clock matter at that point? Is that normally how you’d try and get first downs? Of course not you’d mix passes in. Instead of running four plays to get a first down, he ran three plays to run clock and one play to get a first down. Much lower odds of being successful when you let it ride on one play.
I mentioned above that a true “gambler” would have run a play-action on 2nd and 4 and gone for the win instead of allowing two predictable run plays that ended up creating the 4th and 4 and put Smith in the situation to make a dumb decision.
And to the asshole who down-votes all of my comments, no matter the content. please proceed.
Yours truly good ole PBH predicted this afternoon “Aunt Patty will find a way to steal a heartbreaking forth quarter win.” He didn’t have to steal it. It was delivered gift wrapped with a card: “Merry Christmas” from Jonathon.
Man I miss Anderpants! He was smart enough to lose every game well before the 4th quarter so there would never be the potential for stupid calls at the end to cost us the game. Oh for the glory days of Collins, Mitchell, Blount, Garretson, and McMaryion! I think that’s what really makes Luton look like a back-up QB, he has to follow in the shadow of all those greats.
Anderpants was a whack job, but he managed to beat Oregon. That’s glory to me!
Yeah! Scoreboard bitches!
Also score with cheerleader bitches!
Holy shit I can’t believe how these idiot coaches keep ruining games and my life! Players head and shoulders above everyone talent wise but coaches suck!!!
So it wasn’t a bad dream.
Score 53 and still lose. Guess it’s good that I was not able to watch
Do you realize that if we hadn’t blown this and Stanford, the civil war would be for the north title
Hello people, they didn’t blow it against Stanford. Stanford almost blew it against us. Unfortunately teams grow throughout a season so you can’t say oh we should be playing like the present all year long and we would have this many wins.
Tough loss. We are trending the right direction and I expect that to continue. Overall I am pleased with the progress. My expectations have been exceeded for this year. If our defense gets a little better than maybe niner makes different choices during the game.
I’m in the same boat. Almost all the games under Smith have been entertaining to say the least. He’s proven he can coach and pick a good staffs. They game plan decently and motivation never seems to be a problem.
He plays alot of hero ball with decisions but I don’t see a better time .for him to get that experience than now. We will never expect less than a winning season again while he’s coach.
your last point is a very important one. Next year we can and should reasonably expect a 6-7 win season and more after that.
Considering the margin on Stanford, WSU and Hawai combined is 7 I think expecting mid teir conference play is a good one. Specially with how young our team is.
I like to look at competitive versus non-competitive games. I would say there have only been 2 non-competitive games this year and Okla St. was semi-competitive for awhile. That’s definite progress, although I hope there is not a slight regression next season with a new QB. Leach made a bowl game in his second season at Wazzu and then the third season they fell back to 3-9 before the program surged forward.
How many games did riley go by the book run run run punt only to have Banker roll out the prevent a win defense and also lose the game? I am glad JS is consistent and stays aggressive. If he doesn’t try the on-side kick, they aren’t even in the game at the end. That was aggressive and it worked.
Perhaps the learning curve for the coaches is getting to the right sequence and types of plays for these situations, but at least we are in these situations. I’ll repeat what I said after last week: It is nice to debate how it should be won, rather than get boat-raced by 40 every game.
JS will continue to mature as a Head Coach. He has coaches around him that are pretty intelligent and his philosophy tends toward Chip Kelly/Chris Petersen rather than Mike Riley. That should be applauded by all of us because the greatest fear from this hire was the Riley 2.0 effect, which was terrifying.
At this point, I don’t count the Beavs out of the CW. Herbert is pedestrian and makes some idiotic throws every game. The issue is going to be Ducks d-line and whether beavs can give Luton time. I think Beavs could win by 2 tds actually.
Totally agree with you, really good assessment
also agree. I find it ironic that on this blog, of all places, we have people lamenting a diversion away from the way Mike Riley would have handled that situation.
I think many forget about MR going for two against Missouri for the bowl win or trying to get two against the Huskies and failing. How about Jacquizz on the roll-out pass for a TD. Mike Riley would have punted in that situation and it would have been the correct decision.
Anyone think having Bradford in the game would have made a difference?
Anyone doubt a healthy Hamilcar would not?
Ham limited was super obvious. It’s like he has almost 90% of our sacks or something. Idk of Bradford would have made a big difference. It seemed like they made priorities of jj, hodgins and Noah. Champ had 100 yds so it’s not like the 2 and 3 were absent.
Champ looked like the fastest player on the field last night. They double and tripled covered Hodgins, so it was nice to see someone step up.
I’m not sure Ham should have even been out there, but it was admirable that he tried. I’m sure this won’t be popular, but I don’t think Tibesar came up with anything impressive in the game plan that confused Wazzu’s offense. Gordon made some stupid throws, but on key plays receivers were running wide open. I know it’s playing “what if”, but take away the turnovers and this game would not have been close. The Beavs lost with a +4 advantage!
And a dropped INT…
Yeah, for that TO differential and that point margin, you’re right. But many here said they’d need TOs to win and that’s exactly what they did. I feel like Smith wasted a valiant effort. And I know it sound absurd to use the term “valiant” with that many yards and TDs given up.
McCant’s (sp?) INT exemplified effort and playing through to get the INT. Nobody blames him if he just bats it down, but he tracked it, twisted, maintained focus, and got the INT.
Did Wazzu score a TD after the dropped interception? That was not a difficult chance, too bad.
Where was Riley Sharp? Did he not play, or just not show up in playmaking?
He had some big plays early but with ham out he was getting doubled.
On the positive, the team is playing hard, not quitting, and they’ve been entertaining in most games.
Perhaps the challenge will be getting these “gambling/strategic” calls right so a pattern of disapointment doesn’t set in on the players and then they start quitting.
Even one of the many mediocre bowl games would have been a good reward for these players given what they’ve gone through.
They COULD beat UO, but just like when OSU had a shot at the Rose Bowl, UO likes to play spoiler and that’s the motivation. UO will get manhandled by Utah and wind up in San Antonio or something.
I’m down on Smith’s reckless decisions, but I appreciate the aggressiveness when it’s in a good situation. I doubt any of us thought that they would still have a chance for bowl eligibility going into the final game of the season. I am hoping, the Beavs are just setting us up for a perfect ending by beating the Quacks to get eligible. I too would love to see the Duckies fall to an average bowl game, of course their mascot will still be in every ESPN commercial.
I went back through the thread’s coverage of the last hour of real time to deconstruct the observations of several commentators in order to construct my morning-after sense of things:
All times PST:
8:37 Angry says we won’t go bowling but it was a good year nonetheless (concur)
8:38 ObjCritic says OSU needs to improve its run-blocking (this would prove prophetic on the last possession)
8:45 WFO writes that if O-line can run block there’s a chance (also prophetic)
8:50 Nuclear Beaver, discussing Smith’s decision to go for two, opines that with Smith you have to take the good with the bad (nuff said)
8:59 Jock Itch Observes that OSU is not milking the clock sufficiently (prophetic)
9:09 Angry observes OSU D can’t make a stop (prophetic)
9:20 Beavs4Ever notes that 13 seconds is on the clock when Luton calls the snap and OSU scores
9:32 Nuclear Beaver, after the ball is turned over on downs says “1:10 [clock time] is a shit load of time for WSU” (the point I kept trying to make in defense of going for it on 4th because WSU offense is so efficient, our D so gassed, that on D OSU would not put up much resistance) Actually it was 1:14
10:06 (after the game has ended) Mckalk criticizes the lack of innovation on the 2nd and 3rd down plays calls. (concur. It’s easy to criticize the 4th down call and its execution, but, and here’s the ironic thing, Smith was not a sufficient gambler on the 2nd and the 3rd down play calls.)
Summary: As Angry said an hour before the outcome was known and a Defeat likely, it HAS been a good season. Exceeded my expectations in wins (I had said 4 before the season began) and even more so in terms of overall competitiveness and entertainment. At the tactical level, everything that played out negatively in the end sequence (failure to convert a first down; failure to keep WSU out of the end zone) was predicted by commentators on this blog in the hour before it happened.. Also, I’m not buying the field position version of the transitive property that because WSU was on the OSU 2 with 4 seconds left, that if they had to start, most likely within a yard or two of their own 15 that they could not have been in a position to win it at the end. The penalties on the OSU D would have translated to more yardage if the field was longer, for one thing. Nor was there any indication in the last 5 minutes of the game that the OSU D had another “stop” in them. Conversely, WSU showed all night that it could Defend the run and on many occasions get the stop. WSU turnovers were the equalizers and in some respect their influence creates a misleading perception.
Final point: my great thanks to Angry for creating this forum. It’s so much fun conversing with the likes of BeeG and OoBie while the game is going on.
Agree if you are going to go for it on 4th needed to change the play calling, he tried to play both strategies, milk clock and be agressive. This is where a more mobile QB would have been nice, love to see a boot to the far side with a RPO on 3rd. Or if you are going to run change formation. I believe they were under center on 1-3rd down
Seattle Times calling out UW coaching staff after loss at CU.
“What took place at Folsom Field Saturday was not an anomaly for Washington this season. It was another shellacking at the hands of an otherwise inept opponent, where UW looked both outmatched and outwitted.”
Except against OSU when the UW defense played out of their fucking minds. Truly Luck O’ the Beavs.
Thought Beav O lacked creativity too. That was a bizarre game….agreed.
Missed this game; I’ll spend some time this morning combing through everyone’s comments.
Just to preface — I got into watching Beavers football during the 28+ season < .500 drought. All the games I attended during that time were away games, many of which were the typical 40+ points – 7 deluges.
I'm sure I'm not the only visitor here who endured that experience.
What I can say. I am supportive of /this/ team, and where it has indicated it would like to go.
I have some measure of confidence it will get there.
How many of us can honestly say this? That is a good thing.
I'm already looking forward to next season already.
We win next week. The WSU RB foresees it.
Such a large faction of Beaver fans and media online today saying the other portion of the fan base criticizing that 4th down call are being ignorant because “if i told you in the pre-season we would lose a heart-breaker to become almost become bowl eligible, you would have never believed it”
It’s that loser mentality that Beaver nation just can’t shake. Yes, very few people predicted a bowl season, and I think most can agree that knocking on that door is a sign of progress. But can we also agree that making a bad decision cost this team a chance to go bowling when they nearly had that outcome wrapped up?
The just be happy you are where you are crowd is the reason we get ourselves signed up for lifetime contracts because of 6 win seasons.
Don’t get me wrong, I’m pleased with the progress Smith and his staff have made in his short time here, and I look forward to watching them continue to grow. They’re an entertaining and hard working team and they are exactly the type of team that I like to root for. Underdogs who outwork the competition. I’m very pleased in this regard.
It’s the reckless decision making at a point in the game when the cost/benefit of that decision didn’t warrant it that has me disappointed, because of what could have been. Today, we should be arguing over which bowl game would select us.
If they want a “gambler” mentality coach, then go get a high school coach who onside kicks every time and never punts. If the Beavs had been 2-8, I would say go ahead and take the risk. When a bowl bid is on the line and the perks that go with it, you error on the side of being conservative. If Wazzu can drive 80 plus yards in a minute with no timeouts, then they earned it. This is not a “poor little Beavers team” they’ve played everyone tough except Utah, they deserve a bowl bid. Now the odds of that have decreased greatly. I think Smith has taken three crazy risks this season with the fake punt against Hawaii and the two fourth downs. They all failed in execution, one worked because of a penalty. He should be learning, he’s not so far. As I said earlier, I want smart aggression, not recklessness.
here’s the thing. Given how fast WSU scored on their previous possession, there’s no reason to think WSU couldn’t have gone 80 yards to win. I get a kick (no pun intended) out of how Smith’s critics all presume that a punt in that position was going to pin the Cougs inside the 5. Based upon my fifty years worth of experience watching football the attempt would have been, surely, to TRY to stick one inside the 5-10 but it’s fifty=fifty prop at best; that is, just as likely it goes into the end zone. Since we are going on each of our favorite premises, do any of the critics of Smith’s decision really think an extra 22 yards, with 74 seconds left, with our D gassed, was going to stop Gordon? Smith was right. With that much time, try to win the game. With that much time, with that offense and the way it was clicking, the number of timeouts WSU had remaining was irrelevant.
First, no reason to call timeout there without running the clock down as much as possible. Could have let it run nearly another 17 seconds. This brings 74 seconds down to less than 60 seconds. And WSU had no timeouts.
And, sure, keeping the punt in the 5-10 yard range is risky if the team returns it, which is why you kick it out of bounds.
Which would you rather face?
A. WSU has the ball at their own 23(or further back) with less than 1 minute on the clock and no timeouts?
Or
B. WSU has the ball at their own 43 with 74 seconds and no timeouts.
I don’t see how this is even a question.
I don’t either, it’s sort of bizarro world. Most of the time (notice I did not say all of the time) a team is not going to go 80 plus yards in less than a minute without a timeout. The one play where the Beavs tackled Borghi after a short gain almost cost them 20 seconds. They had to spike the ball twice just in the 57 yards they had to go. Odds are you get a punt inside the 20 when you are kicking from the opponents 43. Look, it’s admirable Smith wants to be aggressive, just don’t be stupid.
or would you make the field position for the Cougs irrelevant and simply get a first down for the win
I think most people are looking at the improvement from the last two seasons and are pleased with it. Not a losers mentality, just happy with the continual improvement. I would imagine after next year everyone will expect to go bowling every year and within two years after that bitching that it is not a New Years bowl game and talking about how we should be 11-1 and not 9-3 :)
The only weakness in your argument is you
Want a gambler mentality when it works (onside kick to get back into the game) but you don’t want one when it fails. This team doesn’t have the scheme or talent to beat wazzu straight up so smith had to compensate for that. We have to chance to win this game if we keep trying to trade scores.
I hope In the near future when we have more talent upfront on d he doesn’t have to take these risks.
An analysis of the game. I like this guy. He seems to be an objective writer.
http://theofficialcandyreport.com/2019/11/24/washington-state-and-oregon-state-gets-the-best-of-oregon-state/#more-3854
Nice find and yes that PI call looked pretty suspect to me, not much outrage about it here. Interesting that the call was made by the same ref who called targeting when it wasn’t.
And nothing will happen to that ref. Bad targeting call they aloud Washington state with no timeouts to get organized at a crucial point in the game.
Yeah, good point.
For those who would rather think about another team’s loss right now…
https://www.iheart.com/podcast/139-the-honks-27068091/
The audio starts at the 6:40 mark.
thanks.
every ONE of you guys critical of Smith’s decision-making at the end of the WSU game (that includes you, Angry) should listen to what Scotty posted from the Husky Honks show. Contributors to this site will greatly enhance their perspective on coaching with an edge and motivating teams. Smith was right, and those critical of his going for it on 4th down are Riley revanchists. There, I said it.
Nah. It was a dumb call trying to reinvent the game and flat out gamble under the guise of “I’m aggressive”…time and place for that, but last night wasn’t it. Punts can be the winning play. A good compromise was have Luton go out there, fake going for it (might have worked since they went for it last week), draw them offsides…and if not Luton punts. Good balance of aggressive and conservative that gives you a shot (with an offsides) and gives you the option to kick. That’s the genius call. He made the worst call of his career, it likely cost us the post-season, and we’re all going to have to deal with it. I like Smith, but I don’t like the degenerate gambler mindset. That’s very popular in football right now…going for it on 4th used to be rare. Now every coach is gambling. It’s a poor trend, but they do it because people reward them “for being aggressive”…it’s all that Tony Robbins mumbo jumbo about how to win at life and it sounds good…until Borghi jams it down your throat with 1 second on the clock. Then the reality of being a degenerate gambler and Tony Robbins sucker sets in.
Thx, definitely helps
This is pretty good https://mobile.twitter.com/FSUeyedoc/status/1198448789494870016
At first glance, I was with the crowd that thought going for it on fourth down was a boneheaded move, but now I am not so sure. Consider the following:
4th and 4 — I would say the chances of converting it last night was 1 in 3. Maybe a little higher, but I will go with that. If we convert, that’s a W for the Beavs.
If we fail, they have to go 57 yards to win. Let’s say they have a 75% chance of succeeding. I think that’s a little high, but we still have a 25% chance to win.
If you accept these numbers, our chances of winning if we go for it are almost exactly 50/50 (0.33 + (.25 * .67))
If we punt, there are a lot of things that can happen, but let’s say the average outcome is the 15 yard line. So, in this case, the question becomes is it a better than 50/50 shot that we stop them from 85 yards if we have a 25% shot of stopping them from 57? I think it’s a pretty close call either way.
We put the game on the offense who had converted on just 25% of 3rd and 4th downs all game. The numbers were way less then 1 in 3 chance. More like 1 in 8/9.
And if luton would have quick kicked your almost assured they would not have a returner back for fear of having 1 less defender against a passing attempt. Say we kick it and pin them around the 15. They have would have to go 85 yards in most likely under a minute, that alone is a huge task even though they are equipped to do it. And if they do, well that’s football but at least they gave themselves the best shot to win. Which was forcing the WSU to drive 85 yards in 58 seconds or so, they did 58 yards in 1:08.
33% conversion rate is actually pretty conservative with 4 yards to go. If there were ten or more yards to go, it might be closer to your 10%
I’m armchair quarterbacking, but after that nice first-down run to make it 2nd and 4, I would have loved to see Luton fake to the back, roll out and hit Togiai on that TE drag play. I have to think Wazzu would have been selling out on the run and it would have been open. If not Luton could have run for whatever was there, just keep the clock running. Try to avoid an incompletion.
Saw this posted on the O-live comments and thought it was actually genius. Typical Chip Kelly.
“No, we do what Chip Kelly did in an NFL game, and then some. Have every player on offense hold and tackle a defender on third down, run the ball back to inside the 5 yard line, take a knee for fourth down, clock keeps running, snap the ball out the back of the endzone, squib kick the kickoff. That would be so hilarious, and so many Cougar fans would be furious. We may even invoke the NCAA to make a rule change.”
Holy shit, that is good. I would have called smith a genius if that happend. Yet here we are. That 3rd down would need to be a keystone cops type of play though like run 15 to 20 seconds off. Give it to Champ and tell him to not get caught
Put it in JJ’s hands. He can stay on his feet in traffic. I love Champ but the guy can get knocked down by a stiff breeze.
They have to catch him first.
On a serious note, I’m pinning this loss on the O line’s inability to run block vs one of the worst run Defenses in the Pac12. They had a chance to take over the game after the defense got turnovers. If they could have blocked consistently JJ could have piled up the yards and played keep away from WSU’s offense.
I’ll also add that that while you have to run on that final possession the play calling was bone headed. At least threaten to spread the field out, hit the outside, keeper, anything other than up the gut 3 times. Literally anything.
Rushing for 200 yards is hardly a failure.
My two cents…
The whole game played out almost perfectly for us with the TO’s giving us a chance to steal this and JS blew it.
When things started going south in the second half, we did not shorten the game by running the clock down before snapping the ball.
The onside kick was a great call. D was gassed and that lead would not hold up. Logical aggression.
With about five minutes on the clock you want to score and BURN time off the clock. Jake gave up at least 30 seconds by snapping the ball too early.
Our last possession should have been about getting a first down and running out the clock. So agree with JS.
The problem was the play calling and strategy were in conflict. The first three calls were conservative run out the clock calls. So if that is the strategy, you punt and play D with as long a field as possible. If JS had planned on using four downs, he should have been aggressive on the first couple downs.
Sounds like Overman will be commiting
Good get
Is he going to play TE? We could use OL…
Pretty light for that
What I’m asking is do we intend to use him as a TE or beef him up for OL? Anyone know?
He’ll play TE for us. We have another TE in this class, Tommy Spencer, who they intend to use more as a bkocking TE/OL hybrid, sortof how Stanford does with their jumbo lines.
Picked a good night to go so see a movie, just in time to miss a commitment.
But you all knew this was commitment was coming back in early October because I predicted he would eventually be a Beav after the Utah game. ;)
By the way, Ford v. Ferarri was worth checking out.
Oregon favored by 21 in CW. Seems high.
Beaver great Dylan Wynn playing in the Grey Cup this afternoon for the Hamilton Tiger-Cats. He had an outstanding season, but his team is in trouble today. Down 21-6 in the 4th to Winnipeg. I was surprised to see that he is up to 290lbs now, but is still quick.
People on Twitter have made a good point (if true, I didn’t pay close attention to this) that Smith had Luton snapping the ball with 15 seconds left on the final TD drive. Can anyone confirm? Another major problem if it’s true.
He was definitely not running the play clock out. The “unpredictable snap timing” defense doesn’t hold water either since they were running the same predictable play 3 times.
Yea definitely. Been a problem all season in instances where they’ve had the clock available to use as leverage. By the time they had to decide to go for it on 4th or punt, there should have been about 30 seconds left. Changes the dynamics of that decision quite a bit.
I’ve noticed it in past games, but I wasn’t paying as much attention to that this weekend.
This guy brought it up and had, by your account, a great point. https://twitter.com/jmichaelmorelli/status/1198622027994648576
Posted here at 9:35,
“Luton gave ’em 17 seconds on that 4th down play.”
And, after the penalty at 9:39, the clock stopped,
“With Luton’s 17 seconds on it.”
And no, I’m not jmichaelmorelli !
Forecast for next Saturday in Eugene is pretty close to what the Beavs faced in Pullman last night. A small plus for Beavs?
We can only hope the ducks are looking past us for the championship game against utah. It has all the hallmarks of a trap game, other then the in state rivalry part. We shall see, but my hopes are not up.
New thread up with final thoughts on this fiasco and the Ducks.
A day after haiku…
Put on a brave face
We are a baseball school now
Just beat 0regon!